GOD

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Originally Posted by mont974x4

OK Flesh, for the sake of the discussion I will look at one of the New Testament references you posted in your quote by Sam.

When discussing punsihment by death he referenced Mark 7:9-13. While verse 10 does take us back to the Law that was given to Moses the reference is out of context. Going back to the beginning of the chapter we see the pharisees arrive. These were very religious and legalistic men. They honored tradition more than than the commandments of God. They added to the Law and treated these additions as binding as the Law. The issue they had was that the disciples had not washed their hands thoroughly as traditions dictated before they ate. Jesus corrected them. The passage that Sam used as "proof" had nothing to do with the actual subject.


I once heard someone say to read the Word with 20/20 vison. That is to help keep things in context, read 20 verses before and 20 verse after the verse you are studying.

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Nice :thumbsup: I like the 20/20 thing. That makes so much sense. The bible is like a bunch of riddles to me. I guess I just don't have a lot of patience for reading long text book style material. I need action! :pimp:

Eva

I looked up the Matt 5:18, 15:4-7, Luke 16:17, and 2 Tim 3:16 references he used. So out of context I don't even know where to start. LOL OK, I'll just point out the 2 Tim 3:16 ref...It speaks to the validity of the Bible.



Eva, plenty of action in the Bible. lol It can be hard to get into sometimes. Studying the geneolgy makes my eyes cross. lol but I know its important.

FLEASH:
Somewhere in the world a man has abducted a little girl. Soon he will rape, torture and kill her. If an atrocity of this kind is not occurring at precisely this moment, it will happen in a few hours, or days at most. Such is the confidence we can draw from the statistical laws that govern the lives of 6 billion human beings. The same statistics also suggest that this girl s parents believe at this very moment that an all-powerful and all-loving God is watching over them and their family. Are they right to believe this? Is it good that they believe this?

SISTAR: See this is where my beliefs get tricky for someone such as you. I beieve that we chart out our lives, and bad things either happen because they were supposed to, or because someone nasty just did it, because we still have free will. Our charts, I believe, also have alternatives. It has to, because of free will. The future is not written in stone.

Hard times are when we dig deep, and really grow. It sucks, but that is why I believe we are even here. We can't "learn" anything in a perfect enviroment such as gods. So we come here, like school. Go home, "grade" ourselves, and come back again to learn something else.

Again, these are my beliefs, I don't expect anyone here to agree with me. But please just don't tear them apart, or I will exit the conversation :)

I'll be back with more....

According the Bible trials happen for a reason. Sometimes its for us to grow. For me its usually to teach me to lean on Him. Sometimes its for someone else. I may endure a trial simply so I can help someone else later with compassion and understanding.
No where in the Bible does it tell us life will be all peachy just because we are saved. In fact, it tells us the opposite. We will have trials, as I just mentioned. We will also be attacked for what we believe. (Do you think the Muslim world hates us because we are a rich capitalist society or because they view us as Christian society?)

FLESH:The entirety of atheism is contained in this response. Atheism is not a philosophy; it is not even a view of the world; it is simply a refusal to deny the obvious. Unfortunately, we live in a world in which the obvious is overlooked as a matter of principle. The obvious must be observed and re-observed and argued for. This is a thankless job. It carries with it an aura of petulance and insensitivity. It is, moreover, a job that the atheist does not want.

SISTAR:I took the below from this link: http://www.carm.org/atheism/atheism.htm

The word â??atheismâ?? comes from the negative â??aâ?? which means â??noâ?? and â??theosâ?? which means â??god.â?? Hence, atheism in the most base terms means â??no god.â?? Basically, atheism is the lack of belief in a god and/or the belief that there is no god. By contrast, theism is the belief that there is a God and that He is knowable. I need to mention that most atheists do not consider themselves anti-theists. Most consider themselves as non-theists.
I've encountered many atheists who claim that atheism is not a belief system while others say it is. Since there is no official atheist organization, nailing down which definition of atheism to use can be difficult. Following are some definitions offered by atheists.

Finally, there is a group of atheists that I call militant atheists. They are, fortunately, few in number. They are usually highly insulting and profoundly terse in their comments to theists, particularly Christians. Iâ??ve encountered a few of them and they are vile, rude, and highly condescending. Their language is full of insults, profanity, and blasphemies. Basically, no meaningful conversation can be had with them at all.

FLESH: It is worth noting that no one ever needs to identify himself as a non-astrologer or a non-alchemist. Consequently, we do not have words for people who deny the validity of these pseudo-disciplines. Likewise, atheism is a term that should not even exist. Atheism is nothing more than the noises reasonable people make when in the presence of religious dogma. The atheist is merely a person who believes that the 260 million Americans (87% of the population) who claim to never doubt the existence of God should be obliged to present evidence for his existence and, indeed, for his benevolence, given the relentless destruction of innocent human beings we witness in the world each day.

SISTAR:Then your not a militant athiest? By this description, and the one I found. Just askind, correct me if I am wrong.

FLESH:We live in a world where all things, good and bad, are finally destroyed by change. Parents lose their children and children their parents. Husbands and wives are separated in an instant, never to meet again. Friends part company in haste, without knowing that it will be for the last time. This life, when surveyed with a broad glance, presents little more than a vast spectacle of loss. Most people in this world, however, imagine that there is a cure for this. If we live rightlyâ??not necessarily ethically, but within the framework of certain ancient beliefs and stereotyped behaviorsâ??we will get everything we want after we die. When our bodies finally fail us, we just shed our corporeal ballast and travel to a land where we are reunited with everyone we loved while alive. Of course, overly rational people and other rabble will be kept out of this happy place, and those who suspended their disbelief while alive will be free to enjoy themselves for all eternity.

SISTAR:This a very narrow-minded view of people who believe in GOD. To me death is just a transition. Death is advancment of ones soul. Funerals are for the living, and when your dead, you don't care how much money you made, or who you were mad at. And I don't believe anyone will keep you out of "heaven" but yourself, by not going. For whatever reason, being ashamed, Some people have horrible deaths, and don't know they are dead. Maybe a husband caught his wife cheating, killed her and the guy, then himself, and won't go to the white light because he is still stuck in this, I will go to hell now mind set. These earth bound spirits are called ghosts. I have seen them. Again, my beliefs, maybe controversial, but FLESH wanted them, so here they are......

FLESH:We live in a world of unimaginable surprises--from the fusion energy that lights the sun to the genetic and evolutionary consequences of this lights dancing for eons upon the Earth--and yet Paradise conforms to our most superficial concerns with all the fidelity of a Caribbean cruise. This is wondrously strange. If one didnâ??t know better, one would think that man, in his fear of losing all that he loves, had created heaven, along with its gatekeeper God, in his own image.

SISTAR:See, this is what happens when and finite mind starts a story explaining an infinite place. I don't call this place heaven, I call it the otherside (of the veil). And an infintite place can not be limited in any way shape or form. And giving it a landscape does just that.

FLESH:Consider the destruction that Hurricane Katrina leveled on New Orleans. More than a thousand people died, tens of thousands lost all their earthly possessions, and nearly a million were displaced. It is safe to say that almost every person living in New Orleans at the moment Katrina struck believed in an omnipotent, omniscient and compassionate God. But what was God doing while a hurricane laid waste to their city? Surely he heard the prayers of those elderly men and women who fled the rising waters for the safety of their attics, only to be slowly drowned there. These were people of faith. These were good men and women who had prayed throughout their lives. Only the atheist has the courage to admit the obvious: These poor people died talking to an imaginary friend.

SISTAR:Katrina set a stage, it opened peoples eyes to "our government". It was a huge wake up call, not onnly to how weak our government is, but how FUCKED up they are. Those people died for a reason. Also, New Orleans was like a bowl. They built damns to push the ocean back, to build! Mother nature, Father God (so to speak). This whole essay is based on the very "religion" I do not agree with. So we both agree that "religion" is screwed up. That isn't proof there is no god. It is just MORE proof that people are fucked up.

This is going to take forever......

From a biblical standpoint this life is temporary. The spiritual life is eternal. The horrible existence that it is was born of our own free will. When Adam and Eve disobeyed it brought sin into the world. All that is necessary to live in heaven forever is to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ. This salvation is something we receive not something we acheive. That being said, when entered into this relationship and we grow to be Christian (defined as Christ-like) we become less selfish and greedy and more loving, gracious, and merciful. This process is often refered to as sanctification. We don't do good to get to heaven we do good because we want to. When we talk about works it's a matter of the heart and your motivation.