The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
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Originally Posted by snowblind
In your eyes, in alot of peoples eyes americans are criminals.
yet again you miss the wood for the trees, being the big fucking irony in saying you can't have a gun because we think you are criminals.
It was your metaphor, I speak to you in your own language and you still miss it, The 190 nation UN "thinks" they are "criminals", I guess the whole world is wrong....wood for trees you said.
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yet why do criminals carry guns because cops carry guns and if your gonna go down you want to go down shooting.
No, criminals carry guns because they are criminals intend on doing bad things, just like Iran. Cops carry guns to protect them selves and the public at large.
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yet it is in your constitution as a right to bare arms. its no wonder that this is happening when the founding words of your country is based on people allowing to carry weapons.
Yes, unlike you I am a "citizen", not a "subject" but I don't think that explains (fully) why you insist on being an apologist for these evil people.
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
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Originally Posted by Ozarks
Yes, recognized by the UN who has already passed 2 rounds of sanctions and is currently debating a 3rd,they are world wide sponsors of terrorists, Hamas & Hesbol to name two.
For a long time there were the only democracy in the middle east, civilized society should be supported.
:D:D The 2 counties have been allies for over 50 years.
Standing up for what's right causes problems sometimes
Like defending themselves ? they built a wall so Palatines couldn't kill them, what happens, the Palations spend their time killing each other
Their kicking ass just fine on their own:thumbsup:
Treating their arab citizens like 2nd class citizens is civilized? Drawing their map to take all water sources from Palestine is civilized? Israel has no intention of making peace. Their goal is to get all arabs and Palestinians off their soil.
America comes first, not Israel. Too many domestic problems that need to be solved. America should not be responsible for administrating and monitoring republics. With all the economic turmoil, increasing inflation, do we really need to subsidize Israel's security situation, so they can have a pure jewish state?
Standing for what's right? So was going to war with Germany was wrong? Other than implementing the final solution, and taking over other countries, there is no difference between the situation in Germany and Israel.
If the jews want to create their own state, there's alot of land in the Antarctic. Until that day, they must do more to reach peace with their neighbors. Obviously, that's not their intention.
It's funny you say, they been doing fine on their "own." Let's see how they well they do without American aid?
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
It's pretty easy to criticize something, like Israeli politics, but criticism without any constructive suggestions on how to rectify the perceived problems is really just posturing. Reading many of the above posts, it would seem that some people have a problem with the very existence of Israel, as they have done nothing but condemn Israel; barely leaving the door open to any other solutions to their grievances other than that Israel should just disappear.
While I could spend hours typing criticism of Israeli politics, I would still defend their right to exist. It seems like much of the above debate is skirting that one basic issue; whether or not Israel has the right to exist. Those who question Israel's right to exist should have the courage to do so openly, and debate that issue instead of dancing around the subject.
To those who want to take the politically correct position of kissing muslim ass, I would say that, at this point in time, Islam has absolutely no defense for its existence. It is not acceptable for some members of a society (and Islam is a society) to turn a blind eye to the evil of another segment of their society, do nothing to stop the evil, and then claim that they are good people That's total bullshit. Until all muslims unite to stop the evil within their religion, they have no right to exist in even the quasi-civilized societies of the world. Islam brings with it barbaric seventh-century values that have no place in today's world. The fact that many muslims are good people does not give them the right to tacitly support a scourge upon the world. In that respect, almost all muslims are guilty of aiding and abetting the fanatics within their ranks.
JMO
PC :smokin:
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
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Originally Posted by PharmaCan
The fact that many muslims are good people does not give them the right to tacitly support a scourge upon the world. In that respect, almost all muslims are guilty of aiding and abetting the fanatics within their ranks.
You usually bring up good points, and a good argument, but on this statement you are so wrong it hurts. Evangelical Christianity is not much different. The real thing about Islam is that Islam is actually battling against itself. The Islamic Extremists wage war against the "fake muslims," because they believe that their version of Islam has become too westernized. So no, almost all muslims are not guilty of aiding and abetting the fanatics within their ranks. In fact, the extremist version of Islam is actually a minority among the rest. What you say is a baseless generalization which I'm sure you yourself can see.
Like I said, Islam mostly fights against itself. This is well-known.
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
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Originally Posted by mfqr
You usually bring up good points, and a good argument, but on this statement you are so wrong it hurts. Evangelical Christianity is not much different. The real thing about Islam is that Islam is actually battling against itself. The Islamic Extremists wage war against the "fake muslims," because they believe that their version of Islam has become too westernized. So no, all muslims are not guilty of aiding and abetting the fanatics within their ranks. That is a baseless generalization which I'm sure you yourself can see.
Like I said, Islam mostly fights against itself. This is well-known.
You are correct indeed, the Sunnis(majority) and the Shi`ites.
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert and Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas arrived in Washington for the Annapolis talks which was also attended by US intelligence; a intel officer who had for several years been giving the US intelligence of Iran's nuclear program. The next day after the Annapolis talks this intelligence officer immediately switched his tune to "IRAN HAS NO NUCLEAR PROGRAM". This intel officer changed his mind because of results he wanted were not obtained at the Annapolis conference.
So the person crying IRAN NUKE program for the past 4 or 5 years suddenly switches his statement 1 day after the talks when things didnt go his way.
It isnt Bush or the neo-cons doing this folks
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
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Originally Posted by thcbongman
America should not be responsible for administrating and monitoring republics.
Isreal is a sovereign State we don't"administrating and monitoring"
anything
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have a pure jewish state?
Are you also opposed to pure Arab States ?
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Standing for what's right? So was going to war with Germany was wrong? Other than implementing the final solution, and taking over other countries, there is no difference between the situation in Germany and Israel.
Is that all,:rolleyes: do you know what the word
"obtuse" means ?
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If the jews want to create their own state, there's alot of land in the Antarctic.
They already have state called Israel, created by the UN
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It's funny you say, they been doing fine on their "own." Let's see how they well they do without American aid?
America gives money to lots of countries, and Israel will continue to be one of them.
Do you realize what anti-semitic bigoted things you post ? or are you simple repeating things you have heard ?
If you wish to debate fine but, regardless of what we say 3 things are going to happen.
1 Iraq will be a free country with an elected Government.
2 Iran (like Syria) will not be allowed to create a nuclear weapon
3 Israel will make peace when,
A The majority of Palestinians (who want peace by the way) rise up and kick the murdering thugs (hamas & fatah) out
B Form a civilian authority, sit down and negotiate, then there will be a Palestine and a "chance" for peace.
Remember, you heard it here on Cannibus.com 1st :thumbsup:
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozarks
Isreal is a sovereign State we don't"administrating and monitoring"
anything
Are you also opposed to pure Arab States ?
Is that all,:rolleyes: do you know what the word
"obtuse" means ?
They already have state called Israel, created by the UN
America gives money to lots of countries, and Israel will continue to be one of them.
Do you realize what anti-semitic bigoted things you post ? or are you simple repeating things you have heard ?
If you wish to debate fine but, regardless of what we say 3 things are going to happen.
1 Iraq will be a free country with an elected Government.
2 Iran (like Syria) will not be allowed to create a nuclear weapon
3 Israel will make peace when,
A The majority of Palestinians (who want peace by the way) rise up and kick the murdering thugs (hamas & fatah) out
B Form a civilian authority, sit down and negotiate, then there will be a Palestine and a "chance" for peace.
Remember, you heard it here on Cannibus.com 1st :thumbsup:
Any argument that in opposition to the policies of Israel is "anti-semantic?" Grow the hell up. This issue is pretty personal because of your roots. Otherwise, you wouldn't throw something out there so slanderous and insulting.
If America does not administer and monitor the situation, why are we in the middle of this Israel-Palestinian conflict? Why is the USA involved in conflict resolution? So when you say "they don't monitor anything," it's a load of crap. America has spies in Israel and Israel has spies on them.
Arab areas in Israel are not developed properly, have faulty, unmaintained infrastructure, and access to water resources denied, schools underfunded In the Israeli city, their infrastructure and development is incredibly maintained, and jewish citizens have access to the best of the best. Obtuse? Think not.
It's funny how you throw all this insults. I did nothing to insult you, so stop with your emotional dramatic branding shit.
How Arabs fare as a whole society is an entirely different issue to the policies that Israel perpetuate. Just because they are wrong in many issues doesn't mean Israel is right in their justification to their actions. None of the Arab states were formed under the assumption that everyone must be an Arab. If arabs operate in the same lines of racism as Israel, they shouldn't get aid either.
Yes you are right, America gives plenty of money to different countries. One thing I don't agree with giving money to a society that segregates it's arab citizens, and treats them so poorly.
In my opinion, none of the countries in the middle east should be given aid other than Iraq, because we utterly destroyed that country and must help them rebuild.
1 will be true. US isn't leaving Iraq, mega-bases are established there for years to come. We will develop a strong economic partnership which will benefit both countries for years to come. While I do not agree on the moral reasons for war, I acknowledge the economic benefits of the Iraqi war.
2 will be true as well. The Iran threat has been exaggerated, while they are able to extract uranium, they aren't close to making a nuclear bomb. The situation should be dealt through multi-national combination of diplomacy, and sanctions. There is no need to throw threats until there is irrefutable proof that Iran is *this close* to a nuclear bomb.
3 will not happen until Israel starts treating it's arab citizens equally to their own. Palestinians will rise if they realize Israel isn't racist, and treat similar race equally, then this majority you speak up would have a reason to rise: for prosperity, for everyone to live in peace, and live a high-quality life.
There's a load of propaganda being perpetuated by Hamas and Fatah. The fact Hamas was elected by a majority is a reflection of how Israel is handling the situation. Not well I might add.
As for Pharmacam who believes I was skirting the issue of Israel's right to exist, I'll address it right now. I believe forming the state of Israel was a mistake. However, this mistake cannot be retracted, and they have a right to exist. Simply not to get subsidized security from the US. Which is simply my entire point.
As for your point in kissing Muslim ass, I don't take sides with either one. I agree with you the barbarism on their culture. However, before you accuse me of posturizing, and not offering solutions, I did. No aid for Israel. That's the solution to get America out of the Israel solution, and let them resolve their own situation with the arab world unless Israel's enacts policies that'll facilitate the curb of violence. So point out in my post where I said that Israel should not have a right to exist? Or is this a mere acknowledgment of how dependent Israel is on the US?
The US should do everything to minimize involvement in the middle east.
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by mfqr
You usually bring up good points, and a good argument, but on this statement you are so wrong it hurts. Evangelical Christianity is not much different. The real thing about Islam is that Islam is actually battling against itself. The Islamic Extremists wage war against the "fake muslims," because they believe that their version of Islam has become too westernized. So no, almost all muslims are not guilty of aiding and abetting the fanatics within their ranks. In fact, the extremist version of Islam is actually a minority among the rest. What you say is a baseless generalization which I'm sure you yourself can see.
Like I said, Islam mostly fights against itself. This is well-known.
mfgr - I truly believe that all religious societies have an obligation to "police" their members and clergy. The perpetration of evil, though, is not limited to muslims - they just happen to have been the topic of discussion here. Personally, I think that all religions are inherently evil.
PC :smokin:
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
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Originally Posted by thcbongman
While I do not agree on the moral reasons for war, I acknowledge the economic benefits of the Iraqi war.
ROFLMAO - Which economic benefits would those be? The $100/barrel oil or our trillion dollar debt?
PC :smokin:
