How do I get my plants to bud sooner?
Quote:
Originally Posted by spectrum balanced
^^^
...yeah unfortunately I live in TX. high quality bud is averages at about 60 an 1/8. I hate texas.
I just have to comment on this really quick. Are you kidding me? Where in TX, because it sure as *expletive* isn't that expensive in Midland, Austin, or College Station (for those unfamiliar, those three cities cut a roughly horizantle line through the middle of TX with the west end a little further north than the east end). Anyway, you should be able to get twice that for that price, at the very least. An ozzy of Kind in Midland is ~$120.
Anyway, don't fertilize while you're flowering! At least not after 3-4 weeks into flowering (or within 2 weeks of your projected harvest)! In fact anything that is added later in the flowering period is probably going to turn up in much higher quantities in the bud (which is bad, especially carbon as mentioned before, which means all sugars and other organic compounds). Fertilizers have a large percentage of "innert" ingredients that can get taken up by the root system and, while they don't hurt the plant, could very well make for a nasty smoke. Just a quick two cents from a biologist...
How do I get my plants to bud sooner?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Delta9Haze420
Anyway, don't fertilize while you're flowering! At least not after 3-4 weeks into flowering (or within 2 weeks of your projected harvest)! In fact anything that is added later in the flowering period is probably going to turn up in much higher quantities in the bud (which is bad, especially carbon as mentioned before, which means all sugars and other organic compounds). Fertilizers have a large percentage of "innert" ingredients that can get taken up by the root system and, while they don't hurt the plant, could very well make for a nasty smoke. Just a quick two cents from a biologist...
Just a quick two cents from a chemist.... This advice is misleading- AT BEST.
Are you seriously only running 5 week strains? Wow! That's pretty rare... :wtf: 35 days, eh? Got me there, I was not previously aware that a 35 day strain existed!
The ingerdients in a good fertilizer are chosen to provide both positive and negatively-charged ions that are BOTH valuable to the plant... such as Potassium sulfate or Calcium phosphate- The plants use both dissociated parts of the compound.
Furthermore, sugars may be applied right up to the end of flower with no negative effects on flavor.
lol @ carbon being bad! What do you think the resins are made of? (hint: it's found in sugar....)
The important element NOT to add in excess in flower is Nitrogen, as it is necessary to chlorophyll production, and chlorophyll is a primary cause of harsh smoke.
How do I get my plants to bud sooner?
just kidding ,but IR you got your mensies? looks like i somehow missed alot of this thread, time to go back and read. what is MENSA? i swear ill have some valuable input next time!lol
How do I get my plants to bud sooner?
Quote:
Originally Posted by stinkyattic
Just a quick two cents from a chemist.... This advice is misleading- AT BEST.
Are you seriously only running 5 week strains? Wow! That's pretty rare... :wtf: 35 days, eh? Got me there, I was not previously aware that a 35 day strain existed!
The ingerdients in a good fertilizer are chosen to provide both positive and negatively-charged ions that are BOTH valuable to the plant... such as Potassium sulfate or Calcium phosphate- The plants use both dissociated parts of the compound.
Furthermore, sugars may be applied right up to the end of flower with no negative effects on flavor.
lol @ carbon being bad! What do you think the resins are made of? (hint: it's found in sugar....)
The important element NOT to add in excess in flower is Nitrogen, as it is necessary to chlorophyll production, and chlorophyll is a primary cause of harsh smoke.
Chill out stinky. No need to get defensive. Check my profile - I am an organic chemist by profession (MS). My undergrad degree was in biology. Yeah, cations an anions can help the *plant*, but the innert ingredients don't. Do you think fertilizer is made up of *just* ionized compounds? surely you realize that many fertilizers have extensive quantities of filler material in them. They aren't pure NPK. I recognize you may be a professional, but that doesn't make me any less of one. Don't discount what I say just because I'm not a Moderator. My degrees are just as valid as any you may have.
In regard to sugars - I am talking about complex sugars, not the simple sugars produced by plants. Plants can not metabolize synthetic complex sugars and some types of sugars that a particular genus (or species) may be naive to.
And who said anything about 5 week strains?
It isn't a contest. At least try and respect the rest of us. You always have some sarcastic comment. I don't "lol" at anything you say, nor do I criticize your advice. It would be unprofessional...
Attached is an image of what my methods would produce. I would say it looks pretty healthy...
How do I get my plants to bud sooner?
Oh and stinky:
Potassium sulfate and Calcium phosphate are not ions, they are salts. Anything in phosphate, sulfate, bromide, hydrochloric, etc form is a salt. They don't ionize until after being mixed with water...
How do I get my plants to bud sooner?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Delta9Haze420
Oh and stinky:
Potassium sulfate and Calcium phosphate are not ions, they are salts. Anything in phosphate, sulfate, bromide, hydrochloric, etc form is a salt. They don't ionize until after being mixed with water...
Sorry to double post, I was editing and ran out of time to add the following:
Stinky is right about a lot of what she says (in just about everything I have read that she has written), but I still hold that in a controlled study, a plant that is only flushed with Di-H2O (Deionized water, or distilled water) for the last 2-4 weeks as opposed to being fertilized will be a much better product. I'm sure many experienced growers would attest to only flushing with pure water the last 2 weeks or so, anyone else care to comment on how they like to end their flowering cycle?
Stinky, I don't mean any hard feelings. As a fellow scientist, I'd love to know more about your experiences in chemistry. I always find it enlightening to discuss the life sciences with others who have studied in the field. Do I understand correctly you work in testing water? If so then you have a great advantage over most growers in that you know exactly what trace minerals and sediment is found in the local water. I have several colleagues who do soil analysis for a think tank nearby and I have collaborated with them extensively to find a great soil. I, personally, work in research (I have since grad school) - as an organic chemist for a pharmaceutical company.
How do I get my plants to bud sooner?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chandler044
I dont understand this whole twelve hours thing. Is there supposed to be a certain point in the year where there's exactly 12/12 and thats what triggers the buds to grow? (in nature) And also, why wouldn't my plants bud? Do they need to be a certain height or have certain style leaves?
I have seen plants about my height have buds and shit. I dont know what trichomes are either. Im willing to give that thing a shot if sumone could tell me what "panda is", and if sumone can also back up the extra potassium idea.
Thanks.
i believe that outdoor plants will naturally start to flower even if there is less than 12 hours of darkness, because around here plants start to flower around august, even though the atumnal equinox (the day when there is an equal amount of darkness as there is light) isn't until towards the end of september. if i'm wrong about this, feel free to shed some light.
How do I get my plants to bud sooner?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuggz420
i believe that outdoor plants will naturally start to flower even if there is less than 12 hours of darkness, because around here plants start to flower around august, even though the atumnal equinox (the day when there is an equal amount of darkness as there is light) isn't until towards the end of september. if i'm wrong about this, feel free to shed some light.
Your right about that Nuggz, Because plants really start flowering when light drops to 14Hrs a day. It drops to 14 about a month or so before its at 12. :rasta:
How do I get my plants to bud sooner?
I work in research supervising an organic chemistry lab at a university- specifically, PCBs in the tissues and blood of subsistence hunters and their prey. My degree is in fisheries management (Ichthyology side, rather than ecology) and I ended up running my lab through a strange turn of events that included time in Alaska at sea, and a couple years field sampling on an EPA grant... the lab we were sending samples to was understaffed, and the rest is history.
My irritation was primarily at your claim that fertilizing at all after week 2-3 of flower is bad- and the sugar thing- come on, we all use molasses, and right up to harvest too. I'm not sure what other sugars you were talking about that are bad for the plants... I certainly would not be feeding them lactose, for example... but that's not done anyway, so ???
Don't start with me on thinking I'm all that just because I'm a moderator. Seriously. I'm not like that, and turned down mod the first time it was offered- I've just been kicking around this site long enough to know that information presented incompletely is often misinterpreted by noobs and leads to confusion later on. Your original post implied that you would be feeding for less than HALF of the full time you need to be. Typical flower on an indoor grow is a full 8 weeks, meaning you should be feeding for a full 6 weeks.
I'm not trying to get in a big ol flame war here either, I just want to make certain that there is no confusion over fertilizing schedules. You simply do NOT flush for a month.
And I'm not trying to play semantics here either, but I never claimed that Calcium phosphate was an ion, I said that BOTH dissociated ions were valuable to the plant...
We can go on sniping at each other or not. I respect your background and degrees. Let's just leave it at that. Sorry for coming off so snarky to begin with.
How do I get my plants to bud sooner?
That really is quite an interesting way to end up where you are now. I would think the time in the field was probably very educational (I would have loved to have done some biology field work, but alas - fate has taken me elsewhere). Of course along with work in the field comes inevitable frustrations. Anywho... You are right about the incomplete way in which I presented my information. I assumed (rashly) that the correct interpretation could be extrapolated. As for the sugars, I took the opposite angle, and didn't assume that everyone knows the difference between sugars. I haven't heard of anyone feeding plants lactose, but you never know - I've heard of people attempting stranger things (someone once asked if they could use a dead animal burried in their soil as fertilizer). My apologies for taking aim at your position on the board. I am an assistant admin at a couple of boards (unrelated to this) where I've had a few bad experiences with mods turning into berserks after holding a mod position for awhile. You really do know what you're doing though, and always have great info, so I certainly applaud all you do in spreading the wealth of information. Thank you for your diplomacy and grace.
Not to stray from the topic, I have a question about what qualities you are looking for in your potency Chandler - are you looking for a cerebral or stoned effect? When it comes to harvesting (and identifying prime potency), the inevitable topic of heady/cerebral vs. stoney/body high comes up. As mentioned earlier, the timing of the harvest has a great impact (along with drying and curing) on the quality you get. I don't remember it being mentioned specifically, so I'll briefly discuss: Once trichomes begin to form, their clarity (or lack thereof) plays a crucial role in potency. Trichomes will develope clear, and begin to turn cloudy, milky, and fade to an amber and even brown if allowed to (the darkening indicates the deterioration of THC into other cannabinoids like CBN). A higher percentage of clear/cloudy trichomes gives a much more up/heady feeling than allowing many of them to turn amber, which causes more of the body stone (couchlock) and is used more commonly medicinally.
See Stinky's Guide (in her signature) for concise and well written info. I think that aside from some direct action to improve potency, caring well for a plant throughout it's entire life cycle is one of the best ways to improve overall quality.
Stinky - do you have any words on drying and curing? Post-harvest is really what I don't have much experience with. Allowing a long drying period (while preventing mold) and then curing properly usually incerases the quality, if not the potency directly. Exact methods of curing I am unsure of, although I know many people like to cure in sealed glass jars, burping them once a day (allowing fresh air in). I'm hesitant to elaborate any more though until I have seen for myself exactly what seems to work the best.
Chemistry stub: CBN is very similar in structure to THC (moreso than any other cannabinoid), in that it shares the parent structure of THC, but has 4 fewer hydrogens and a resulting two additional double bonds in one of the 6 carbon rings, making it aromatic. This similarity is due to the fact that CBN is actually an oxidation product of THC (which is the process by which THC "degrades" into CBN, which was once thought to be innert and non-psychoactive). It is now known that CBN is in fact psychoactive and has shown effectiveness as an anxiolytic (anti anxiety), and to a lesser extent (compared to Cannabidiol, aka CBD) as an analgesic (pain killer). As an anecdote, the IUPAC (International Union of Pure and Applied Chemistry) name (nomenclature) for delta-9-THC (THC) is the ungodly:
"(−)-(6aR,10aR)-6,6,9-trimethyl-3-pentyl-6a,7,8,10a-tetrahydro-6H-benzo[c]chromen-1-ol"
