If God is real, why are there atheists?

i am aware that it has been debated with religious folk. and some decent rebuttals have been given.


I don’t really consider these arguments to be against religion. I just like them for some philosophical fun. Well generally I speak to more fundamentalist believers as their though process’s just bug me, so I usually cant help but question their thoughts.

(and generally on here when you start talking about something more interesting, someone comes along and goes on about something I would consider fundamentalist and we start again)

With religion the scope is so large that if you are asking me for an argument right now against progressive believes, I probably couldn’t think of a particularly good one. But if you pick a topic I’d probably remember one. I generally like to come to the table without arguments and base mine on theirs. As they are the one proposing something (god).

I think using the bible as guidance is very reasonable. I truly believe that was it’s purpose, to guide people. It has lots of good ideas, but also some harmful ones. Using the bible to follow a more fulfilling live is great, I only have a problem with that when people follow it blindly( and don’t critically separate the good ideas from the outdated) and it starts to affect others (issues like gay marriage, evolution)

I also oppose the jump from a book filled with good ideas on how to live life. To “this book was written by god”. I oppose the notion of god in this book, although I do not oppose ideas on spiritual matters in general.

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Originally Posted by LIP

You cant, but you cant prove he does exsist. It's an individual's perception.

My view is he doesnt exsist, simple as, and i dont need to prove it to anyone, and your view may very well be that he does exsist, and you dont have to prove THAT to anyone, but if someone wants me to belive in God, i need 100% proof, not a book that isnt true. There's too many contradictions in it, and it's changed so much since it was "first" wrote.

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thats it, the argument should have just stopped there

lip you are now one of my role models
it could quite possibly be for any more than being high and saying something that makes sense, i dont know

my opinion
there is no god
beleiving in god gives you assurance and confidence, thus the illusion that someone above is helping you
as far as i'm concerned

i AM god:rastasmoke:

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Originally Posted by smoke it

why would god give us free will if he knew we would abuse it?

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Not only do we have free will, but we have a fucking brain AND the ability to learn from our mistakes. Someday we will learn, and that is why God gave us free will. He knows mankind needs to wade through a little shit so that we'll appreciate, and know that we're clean once we wise up.


~Junk~

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Originally Posted by harris7

i am aware that it has been debated with religious folk. and some decent rebuttals have been given.


I donâ??t really consider these arguments to be against religion. I just like them for some philosophical fun. Well generally I speak to more fundamentalist believers as their though processâ??s just bug me, so I usually cant help but question their thoughts.

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I guess my issue is that the philosophical issue has never been addressed. In the multiple incarnations of this thread which seem to haunt the spirituality section of these boards, it always turns into a slugfest between christians and atheists, both of whom spend most of their time defining their opponents views for them.


And MrD, I'd be interested in hearing how that went for you, or, did not went for you...

sorry I didnt read all of the comments, but I had to say this. Like someone said on the first page, one of the two things our minds cannot comprehend is infinite and all that is being argued over, going back and forth, new ideas, old ideas, is all part of infinite. Something our minds CANNOT comprehend, making all these ideas part of something, untill death(maybe), we cannot COMPREHEND! What Im saying is, if you all agree we cannot comprehend infinite, that this thread is getting no where to an answer, just expanding off of infinite ideas. :rasta:

I myself have been looking for proof my entire life trying every religion out there is and finding hypocrites in all of them.

At the same time I have climbed Mt. Baker and looked across the Cascades towards Canada, breathed the air. saw these colors and beauty that made you feel like there is a God. I don't know how to explain it but the feeling was there. It is there when you hold your baby for the 1st time too there is this connection you feel with everything.

There is also all this new God gene research. I find it amazing that people that pray have this area of their brain and a gene that other people either don't have or have not developed yet. Maybe they will prove someday that God is within ourselves that we have the ability to find him if we look.

Maybe I don't know that is why I am agnostic I am still looking but I don't ever plan on just giving up.

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Originally Posted by Polymirize

And MrD, I'd be interested in hearing how that went for you, or, did not went for you...

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It went pretty lousy actually, but I'm going to try again later. I made the mistake of deciding to take it after it was offered, but shortly before I took a hefty dose of Tramadol because my sciatic nerves were killing me. So all in all after making the mistake of "oh mixing them will be fine, they're nothing alike!", it was depressing and it felt like my IQ dropped to 50 for the duration. Plus I mixed it with weed, which I don't think helped but it's hard to say.

I really wish we could discuss other psychedelic substances on these boards still, the spiritual aspect of it has an incredible amount of information, uses, and lessons. I frequent some other boards that focus on entheogenic meditative exploration/ ceremonies (something I'm starting tomorrow with salvia now that my nose isn't killing me from the recent surgery), and the sheer amount of different uses and tools found in plants is incredibly vast.

I may start a discussion on the spiritual use of salvia tomorrow actually. Everybody here (myself included) has been far too wrapped up in this single argument about god's existence. I think we're all so stuck on this mindset in the last several months that we've forgotten the vast aray that exists in spirituality around the world and through history.

ok I'm getting off track, but I'm super high (just weed folks). For some reason mixing weed with tobacco today (which I only do on occasion) made the high way more uplifting and making me think about stuff. I would nicotine actually has its uses too in mind exploration, it's when it becomes a regular habbit that it, like any substance, is cheapened in a way.

this is just something that "irks" me
christianity is monotheistic, yet some christians claim that god is in us all, this is a contradiction because if god was within us all that would make it not only polytheistic, but really fucking arrogant for claiming that we are god. wouldnt that claim make christianity not a worship of any god, but just a worship of ourselfs?
bluecat remined me of this thought ive had in my mind for a while, thanks BC

Yes but I am not Christain...and yes I think they might discover God is in us all. It was buddist that they did the C scans on and found this thing they are calling the God gene it was also found in nuns. It seems to develop by praying.

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Originally Posted by Polymirize

I guess my issue is that the philosophical issue has never been addressed. In the multiple incarnations of this thread which seem to haunt the spirituality section of these boards, it always turns into a slugfest between christians and atheists, both of whom spend most of their time defining their opponents views for them.


And MrD, I'd be interested in hearing how that went for you, or, did not went for you...

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I started visiting the spirituality section of cannabis hoping to engage in some solid philosophical debate. But most people here donâ??t really understand philosophy, IMO.

The problem here, which seems to halt our progression is that everyone on here is only willing to argue from their own specific view point. So if one wants to engage another they must first understand their view then discuss. And the discussion really donâ??t involve anyone else, cuz everyoneâ??s got different beliefs.

Personally I can and will argue for anything, if asked. Its all philosophy to me.

The way I see it is that everyone here can philosophize only based on their own beliefs and their own assumptions.

I like to engage in philosophical debates based on my own beliefs or others or whatever. Its quite entertaining to structure arguments on other beliefs or against my own.

Basically on here I also always base my arguments on premiseâ?? that I believe. (unless rebutting). I just think a lot of people on here donâ??t like using assumptions that they donâ??t agree with.

Poly, I believe you have a further education in philosophy than I so Iâ??m sure you understand the enjoyment one can achieve through philosophy. To me itâ??s just like a sport.
Someone defines the specific rules, for God I guess one usually defines it as omni-benevolent, omniscient and omnipotent (as in a sport these should just be accepted during the argument). We all know the basic rules ie. Logic. And lets go. I hoped for this kind of debate but it seems people just donâ??t like to argue from any other view point than their own beliefs.

Man, Iâ??m totally down for going into some interesting philosophical shit Iâ??ve been thinking of. Iâ??m sure you understand that so much of it is very complex and I guess I doubt Iâ??d ever be able to properly explain it as any good debate on here keeps getting staled. But, if you wana start a thread Iâ??m down. Iâ??m sure a few other people are two.