Obama / McCain Presidential Debate from Mississippi - 9/26/08
I'm sure some of America's great presidents have never served in the military...though I don't know exactly who b/c I don't know American president's or American history so well...Judging by this what does it matter if one presidential candidate has more military experience than one who doesn't....doesn't a president have a highly qualified cabinet to help him with all issues...you can't expect a president to know everything...that's why he has experts helping him... while it does improve the image of a president to have served....it's little basis for really choosing anything.
The way I see it...nationalism, serving in the military, is a ruse of sorts...I believe that world leaders hold on to a different belief than nationalism and patriotism...the belief that by building a name for yourself you may get elected...than your name shall be in history forever...your accomplishments as well...A president must uphold the national impression to the bickering general public...shaking voters hands...standing for the pledge...I suspect it means nothing to them...that's how I view things at least
Obama / McCain Presidential Debate from Mississippi - 9/26/08
Quote:
Originally Posted by Billionfold
So wouldn't that make it just as much the senates and congresses fault?
Don't think I've ever solely blamed Bush for the war in Iraq.
I don't blame any of them myself...he needed to be removed.
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Originally Posted by Billionfold
You say McCain's military experience makes him qualified, but the way I see it he's just another republican with a gung-ho attitude. He's a self proclaimed maverick with something to prove, and I don't like him.
Likewise Obama is nothing but a slick Chicago politician and I don't like him for several reasons. Self proclaimed person of "change" coming out of one of the most crooked systems in the states with Rev. Wright and William Ayers helping him up the ladder. I'll take the Maverick with experience over that shit.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Billionfold
Just saying, if you don't have any military experience are you 'qualified' to talk about it? :stoned:
I've been watching politics and voting for 28 years, how about you? I've voted Republican, Independent and Democrat, once again, how about you? That's part of the beauty about this system, I can talk about people that should lead the people in uniform and you can talk about politics.
Fact is I was around during the Carter years and Obama has the same cluster fuck written all over him. In a way I kind of hope he wins. I have a degree and working on my second with graduation in the spring not to mention I'm a grower. I'll be fine with double digit unemployment, double digit inflation, and double digit interest rates. Come spring though I can also be self-employed so don't expect this ol' boy to be paying for everybody elses health care. I don't take Uncle Sams handouts and likewise he can keep his hands off my stash.:smokin:
Have a good one!:s4:
Obama / McCain Presidential Debate from Mississippi - 9/26/08
Quote:
Originally Posted by rebgirl420
McCain knows first hand what it is like to be a soldier. He knows what they need. Being a soldier he was taught military strategy.
just a side note, i have no intention of swaying away this debate, but regarding your point i respectfully ask u to go and research mccain+kerry's congressional work on POWs of vietnam... u will catch some stuff if u look @ it factually.
and no, this is not just what i heard around from an agenda, this is a true controversy shoved down the throat of silent history by lack of attention by the media and the nation... there are STILL some questions remaining regarding our POWs that he and his congressional mates concluded a "done job"
Obama & McCain are BOTH politicians, some of what they say is soft talk, including when mccain's voice would change... everytime a longtime politician changes his tone to make u feel he gets it... u should be even more alert on what he says and what he has actually done in the past.
anyways, just a suggestion:)
Obama / McCain Presidential Debate from Mississippi - 9/26/08
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Originally Posted by Reefer Rogue
Great debate, i was waiting for this thread actually, right on time. I thought both did well but i give it to Obama coz i don't believe Mccain a lot of what he claims obama is or does obama corrects him and actually says what he actually means. He also talks about more key issues for me like college affordabilty and healthcare and i wouldn't trust Mccain with the budget, i think there would be too much wastage.
And why do you think I should pay for your college and healthcare?????
Obama / McCain Presidential Debate from Mississippi - 9/26/08
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Originally Posted by McDanger
And why do you think I should pay for your college and healthcare?????
So he can become a more productive member of society, which would in turn allow him to make more money, paying more taxes, to go into government programs that benefit you or to put that money back into the economy, meaning more money to go around for everybody.
...
Anyway, about the military argument, George Bush pushed the idea of a war in iraq for his own agenda (who knows what that is). At the time, if you recall, 90% of people were saying "Let's go to Iraq!" and the other 10 were either thinking "This doesn't bode well with me but okay" or "We have no fucking business there!".
It wasn't his lack of experience, it was bad intelligence at the best, forgery of evidence at the worst.
Yeah, Barack Obama has no military experience. All he has to do militarily, though, is tell the generals what he wants done, and they'll take care of it.
Yeah, it'd be nice if we had a president who was a brilliant military strategist but, when you have a building full of them, it's not a crucial skill to have.
Oh, did I mention McCain graduated 4th from the bottom of his class at the naval academy? that means he passed by the skin of his teeth, probably. Not too impressive in my book.
Obama / McCain Presidential Debate from Mississippi - 9/26/08
I respect McCains military experience, but it's also one more reason I WONT vote for him. he literally hungers for war like a battle-frenzied berserker. The best soldier in the world is the one who does his best to make sure his job never has to get done. What is a soldiers job? To kill and destroy. Talks and diplomacy must ALWAYS be exhausted to their absolute maximum extent. People just dont wanna work at it, because war is so much easier, and profitable to boot.
Obama / McCain Presidential Debate from Mississippi - 9/26/08
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaBudhaStank
I respect McCains military experience, but it's also one more reason I WONT vote for him. he literally hungers for war like a battle-frenzied berserker. The best soldier in the world is the one who does his best to make sure his job never has to get done. What is a soldiers job? To kill and destroy. Talks and diplomacy must ALWAYS be exhausted to their absolute maximum extent. People just dont wanna work at it, because war is so much easier, and profitable to boot.
Very true, and some people the money and competition is worth the loss of life.
Not to mention we haven't been directly threatened by any other nation for about 100 years.
I say we put a shitload of money into missile defense, fortify the borders, set up ways of making sure the people we let into our country don't overstay their welcome, and basically tell the world "We're going to sit tight here because we aren't strong enough to police the world anymore. Sorry but you guys will have to deal with this shit yourselves."
Obama / McCain Presidential Debate from Mississippi - 9/26/08
Quote:
Originally Posted by JakeMartinez
So he can become a more productive member of society, which would in turn allow him to make more money, paying more taxes, to go into government programs that benefit you or to put that money back into the economy, meaning more money to go around for everybody.
I'm going to school again and paying for it MYSELF out of money that I EARNED! IF you want something bad enough you figure out a way to get it...ever here of working your way through school?
Quote:
Originally Posted by JakeMartinez
Anyway, about the military argument, George Bush pushed the idea of a war in iraq for his own agenda (who knows what that is). At the time, if you recall, 90% of people were saying "Let's go to Iraq!" and the other 10 were either thinking "This doesn't bode well with me but okay" or "We have no fucking business there!".
It wasn't his lack of experience, it was bad intelligence at the best, forgery of evidence at the worst.
"One way or the other, we are determined to deny Iraq the capacity to develop weapons of mass destruction and the missiles to deliver them. That is our bottom line."
--President Bill Clinton, Feb. 4, 1998
"If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction program."
--President Bill Clinton, Feb. 17, 1998
"Iraq is a long way from [here], but what happens there matters a great deal here. For the risks that the leaders of a rogue state will use nuclear, chemical or biological weapons against us or our allies is the greatest security threat we face."
--Madeline Albright, Feb 18, 1998
"He will use those weapons of mass destruction again, as he has ten times since 1983."
--Sandy Berger, Clinton National Security Adviser, Feb, 18, 1998
"[W]e urge you, after consulting with Congress, and consistent with the U.S. Constitution and laws, to take necessary actions (including, if appropriate, air and missile strikes on suspect Iraqi sites) to respond effectively to the threat posed by Iraq's refusal to end its weapons of mass destruction programs."
Letter to President Clinton, signed by:
-- Democratic Senators Carl Levin, Tom Daschle, John Kerry, and others, Oct. 9, 1998
"Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of weapons of mass destruction technology which is a threat to countries in the region and he has made a mockery of the weapons inspection process."
-Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D, CA), Dec. 16, 1998
"Hussein has ... chosen to spend his money on building weapons of mass destruction and palaces for his cronies."
-- Madeline Albright, Clinton Secretary of State, Nov. 10, 1999
"There is no doubt that ... Saddam Hussein has reinvigorated his weapons programs. Reports indicate that biological, chemical and nuclear programs continue apace and may be back to pre-Gulf War status. In addition, Saddam continues to redefine delivery systems and is doubtless using the cover of a licit missile program to develop longer-range missiles that will threaten the United States and our allies."
Letter to President Bush, Signed by:
-- Sen. Bob Graham (D, FL), and others, Dec 5, 2001
"We begin with the common belief that Saddam Hussein is a tyrant and a threat to the peace and stability of the region. He has ignored the mandate of the United Nations and is building weapons of mass destruction and th! e means of delivering them."
-- Sen. Carl Levin (D, MI), Sept. 19, 2002
"We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country."
-- Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002
"Iraq's search for weapons of mass destruction has proven impossible to deter and we should assume that it will continue for as long as Saddam is in power."
-- Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002
"We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction."
-- Sen. Ted Kennedy (D, MA), Sept. 27, 2002
"The last UN weapons inspectors left Iraq in October of 1998. We are confident that Saddam Hussein retains some stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons, and that he has since embarked on a crash course to build up his chemical and biological warfare capabilities. Intelligence reports indicate that he is seeking nuclear weapons..."
-- Sen. Robert Byrd (D, WV), Oct. 3, 2002
"I will be voting to give the President of the United States the authority to use force -- if necessary -- to disarm Saddam Hussein because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security."
-- Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Oct. 9, 2002
"There is unmistakable evidence that Saddam Hussein is working aggressively to develop nuclear weapons and will likely have nuclear weapons within the next five years ... We also should remember we have always underestimated the progress Saddam has made in development of weapons of mass destruction."
-- Sen. Jay Rockefeller (D, WV), Oct 10, 2002
"He has systematically violated, over the course of the past 11 years, every significant UN resolution that has demanded that he disarm and destroy his chemical and biological weapons, and any nuclear capacity. This he has refused to do"
-- Rep. Henry Waxman (D, CA), Oct. 10, 2002
"In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapons stock, his missile delivery capability, and his nuclear program. He has also given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists, including al Qaeda members ... It is clear, however, that if left unchecked, Saddam Hussein will continue to increase his capacity to wage biological and chemical warfare, and will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons."
-- Sen. Hillary Clinton (D, NY), Oct 10, 2002
"We are in possession of what I think to be compelling evidence that Saddam Hussein has, and has had for a number of years, a developing capacity for the production and storage of weapons of mass destruction."
-- Sen. Bob Graham (D, FL), Dec. 8, 2002
"Without question, we need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime ... He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation ... And now he is miscalculating America's response to his continued deceit and his consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction ... So the threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real..."
-- Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Jan. 23. 2003
Quote:
Originally Posted by JakeMartinez
Yeah, it'd be nice if we had a president who was a brilliant military strategist but, when you have a building full of them, it's not a crucial skill to have.
Oh, did I mention McCain graduated 4th from the bottom of his class at the naval academy? that means he passed by the skin of his teeth, probably. Not too impressive in my book.
Well, he still graduated and left the service one step behind a rear admiral. More than can be said about Obama who has stated that HE ALONE decides the mission.
Have a good one!:s4:
Obama / McCain Presidential Debate from Mississippi - 9/26/08
You guys know my stance to this political shit, but I do STRONGLY feel that it should be MANDATORY for every president to have done at LEAST one tour in the military...I will give McCain that...Granted he may not be a medal of honor hero storming beaches like someone said, but he served...He may think twice before sending our troops to do bullshit in other countries...you know, the "been there, done that" kinda deal. I did 9 years in the army, quite a few years in Bosnia and Afghanistan getting shot at in the late 90s....So yeah...a military man is WAY more qualified than someone who has never put on BDUs...
whiskeytango
Obama / McCain Presidential Debate from Mississippi - 9/26/08
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnSstealth
You guys know my stance to this political shit, but I do STRONGLY feel that it should be MANDATORY for every president to have done at LEAST one tour in the military...I will give McCain that...Granted he may not be a medal of honor hero storming beaches like someone said, but he served...He may think twice before sending our troops to do bullshit in other countries...you know, the "been there, done that" kinda deal. I did 9 years in the army, quite a few years in Bosnia and Afghanistan getting shot at in the late 90s....So yeah...a military man is WAY more qualified than someone who has never put on BDUs...
whiskeytango
See, this is why YOU would make a better commander-in-chief than McCain. The problem is he WONT think twice about sending troops. I question whether he would think at all to be honest. He usually seems almost eager to send troops to battle. I think being a POW pounded the ideas of Honor and Glory into his head a little too hard. Sometimes I wonder if he'd have preferred to be killed in battle.
