why do people like to be treated like shit?

There is the question of women who go for guys of questionable ethics, and principles. The guy can be a "dick" to everybody else, as long as he treats her nice. This type of thing is more common than the abusive husband problem, and frequently the "Type A" and other aggressive types of guys breed more, sometimes with a number of willing partners throughout their lives. They could be welfare cheats or corrupt CEOâ??s, depending on where they come from. This is not the same thing as being "strong".

I'd like to attempt to convey to the younger guys here not to cave-in and adapt to becoming the type of man that is the popular â??standardâ?� of positive feminine opinion. You have to be yourself. If they donâ??t accept this, then move on. Itâ??s going to be lonely and rough sometimes, but it beats the hell out of what a lot of guys become when theyâ??re stuck in the wrong relationship, or shacked up with someone thatâ??s impossible to get along with. Being alone is better. Eventually, if you play your cards right, you'll hook up with a good person.

BabyfacedAbortion has the answer... Guys give more love when women give less, and it works the same vice versa. But whenever a relationship is caught up in those kind of headgames... it's not a very healthy relationship at all.

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Originally Posted by Breukelen advocaat

They get away with it in America because we spoil them. Although the French are messed up in a lot of other ways, they don't tolerate this kind of shit from females. They train them in the correct behavior toward the opposite sex, when they're young. We've got a nation of pussy-whipped yes-men. I dropped the ones that were ballbusters.

How about YOU?

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Hahahahahahaha! Best post i've read all day, man. :thumbsup: Also, Friedrich Nietzsche is a genius.

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Originally Posted by slowlickitysplit

I can almost feel the shit storm falling down on me already but I have to say I disagree with you birdgirl. I think "Well adjusted" is code for refined. In a "well adjusted" relationship I don't get drunk, kick in the door and start calling her a whore, etc. Instead it is the little, refined fights. Even as simple as "Your not wearing that are you?".

I think it is in men's genetic makeup to procreate with many women and we therefore feel some resentment against the institution of monogomy and we tend to take out our frustrations on our women.
Women are not without fault though. I think women need, at thier core, to feel they are in a secure relationship with a strong (Emotionaly, mentaly, physicaly) man and they tend to test it by being bithes sometimes. Weather it is the loud mouthed putdown in the supermarket or a refined "dig" durring a candle light dinner.
Human nature is human nature. We can bemoan it and we can try to change it but we ignore it at our own perril.

- Slow -

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I think you must be reading through a filter from your own experiences, Slow. Which is fine. But by well-adjusted, I simply mean emotionally healthy, balanced, and with self-esteem enough to be attracted to someone who'll treat her decently. Refinement and/or civility is something else entirely.

I agree that women like to feel they're in a secure relationship with a strong man. But I believe that women who like themselves and truly like and respect their partners don't make little underhanded, passive-aggressive "digs," even under a "refined" guise. I know such behavior can occur because I've seen it myself. We have some friends, Jim and Joyce, who have a negative way of interacting. He openly puts her down at home (and often other places, too), and so she takes every opportunity to make not-so-hidden digs when they're in social situations with groups of friends. They're not direct enough with each other about whatever's bothering them to be able to work it out between the two of themselves in private, yet they're constantly angry at each other. And so that underhanded, dysfunctional dance goes on. Emotionally healthy, or well-adjusted, couples don't feel the need to behave either openly or passively aggressive with one another. The more I see of the marriages around me, the more I realize that the healthy ones are the exceptions. I thank goodness for my parents and my husband's parents, whom I think both had healthy, balanced relationships. We were lucky to have had that modeled for us.

I agree, by the way, that men are genetically and evolutionarily designed to want to procreate with more than one partner. Monogamy is not a natural state for guys, despite the fact that it's what's expected as the social norm. Although women are genetically/evolutionarily more suited for monogamy because it serves our child-rearing and security purposes better, I maintain that it's not an easy thing for us, either. Difficult or not, that doesn't mean I intend to cheat on my husband nor for him to cheat on me, either. But I do agree that that monogamy is challenging.

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Originally Posted by birdgirl73

I think you must be reading through a filter from your own experiences, Slow. Which is fine. But by well-adjusted, I simply mean emotionally healthy, balanced, and with self-esteem enough to be attracted to someone who'll treat her decently. Refinement and/or civility is something else entirely.

I agree that women like to feel they're in a secure relationship with a strong man. But I believe that women who like themselves and truly like and respect their partners don't make little underhanded, passive-aggressive "digs," even under a "refined" guise. I know such behavior can occur because I've seen it myself. We have some friends, Jim and Joyce, who have a negative way of interacting. He openly puts her down at home (and often other places, too), and so she takes every opportunity to make not-so-hidden digs when they're in social situations with groups of friends. They're not direct enough with each other about whatever's bothering them to be able to work it out between the two of themselves in private, yet they're constantly angry at each other. And so that underhanded, dysfunctional dance goes on. Emotionally healthy, or well-adjusted, couples don't feel the need to behave either openly or passively aggressive with one another. The more I see of the marriages around me, the more I realize that the healthy ones are the exceptions. I thank goodness for my parents and my husband's parents, whom I think both had healthy, balanced relationships. We were lucky to have had that modeled for us.

I agree, by the way, that men are genetically and evolutionarily designed to want to procreate with more than one partner. Monogamy is not a natural state for guys, despite the fact that it's what's expected as the social norm. Although women are genetically/evolutionarily more suited for monogamy because it serves our child-rearing and security purposes better, I maintain that it's not an easy thing for us, either. Difficult or not, that doesn't mean I intend to cheat on my husband nor for him to cheat on me, either. But I do agree that that monogamy is challenging.

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You may be right birdgirl, I may never have seen a healthy relationship as you describe it. I actually doubt it exists. Someone has to lead or you go nowhere. Most of what is in this thread regards controll issues. I think we should agree to disagree on this one as I suspect it is like the argument, can guys and girls be just friends. As you say, we are all shaped by our experiences.

- Slow -

I said it before and I'll probably have to say it again...
You get what you settle for.
Respect yourself and you'll be charismatic.

Healthy relationships exist. But they're rare as hen's teeth. Doesn't sound like y'all disagreed at all above, Slowlickity, despite what you said in your most recent post.

What's this about men and women not being able to be friends? You aren't friends with women you work with and know socially? That's a shame. It can be done and happens all the time in my crowd. I have women colleagues that I consider some of my most trusted personal friends, and they're both single and married. I even have a couple of women golfing buddies.

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Originally Posted by Dave Byrd

Healthy relationships exist. But they're rare as hen's teeth. Doesn't sound like y'all disagreed at all above, Slowlickity, despite what you said in your most recent post.

What's this about men and women not being able to be friends? You aren't friends with women you work with and know socially? That's a shame. It can be done and happens all the time in my crowd. I have women colleagues that I consider some of my most trusted personal friends, and they're both single and married. I even have a couple of women golfing buddies.

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Dave, I'll get back to the men/women friends thing as soon as I finish deciding the chicken vs. egg question.

- Slow -