The Definitive Green Dragon (Revised, Updated, Combined)

some of the cannaboids evaporate before reaching the 325 degrees.... so should i heat with less but for longer untill the decarboxydation occurs?

here is the list i got from a website:

This details the boiling points for the many cannabinoids in the marijuana, which all contribute to the "high".

Δ-9-tetrahydrocannabinol (THC)
Boiling point: 157*C / 314.6 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: Euphoriant, Analgesic, Antiinflammatory, Antioxidant, Antiemetic

cannabidiol (CBD)
Boiling point: 160-180*C / 320-356 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: Anxiolytic, Analgesic, Antipsychotic, Antiinflammatory, Antioxidant, Antispasmodic

Cannabinol (CBN)
Boiling point: 185*C / 365 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: Oxidation, breakdown, product, Sedative, Antibiotic

cannabichromene (CBC)
Boiling point: 220*C / 428 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: Antiinflammatory, Antibiotic, Antifungal

Δ-8-tetrahydrocannabinol (Δ-8-THC)
Boiling point: 175-178*C / 347-352.4 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: Resembles Δ-9-THC, Less psychoactive, More stable Antiemetic

tetrahydrocannabivarin (THCV)
Boiling point: < 220*C / <428 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: Analgesic, Euphoriant


Terpenoid essential oils, their boiling points, and properties

β-myrcene
Boiling point: 166-168*C / 330.8-334.4 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: Analgesic. Antiinflammatory, Antibiotic, Antimutagenic

β-caryophyllene
Boiling point: 119*C / 246.2 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: Antiinflammatory, Cytoprotective (gastric mucosa), Antimalarial

d-limonene
Boiling point: 177*C / 350.6 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: Cannabinoid agonist?, Immune potentiator, Antidepressant, Antimutagenic

linalool
Boiling point: 198*C / 388.4 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: Sedative, Antidepressant, Anxiolytic, Immune potentiator

pulegone
Boiling point: 224*C / 435.2 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: Memory booster?, AChE inhibitor, Sedative, Antipyretic

1,8-cineole (eucalyptol)
Boiling point: 176*C / 348.8 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: AChE inhibitor, Increases cerebral, blood flow, Stimulant, Antibiotic, Antiviral, Antiinflammatory, Antinociceptive

α-pinene
Boiling point: 156*C / 312.8 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: Antiinflammatory, Bronchodilator, Stimulant, Antibiotic, Antineoplastic, AChE inhibitorα-terpineol
Boiling point: 217-218*C / 422.6-424.4 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: Sedative, Antibiotic, AChE inhibitor, Antioxidant, Antimalarial

terpineol-4-ol
Boiling point: 209*C / 408.2 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: AChE inhibitor. Antibiotic

p-cymene
Boiling point: 177*C / 350.6 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: Antibiotic, Anticandidal, AChE inhibitor

borneol
Boiling point: 210*C / 410 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: Antibiotic, Δ-3-carene 0.004% 168 Antiinflammatory

Δ-3-carene
Boiling point: 168*C / 334.4 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: Anti-inflammatory


Flavonoid and phytosterol components, their boiling points, and properties

apigenin
Boiling point: 178*C / 352.4 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: Anxiolytic, Antiinflammatory, Estrogenic

quercetin
Boiling point: 250*C / 482 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: Antioxidant, Antimutagenic, Antiviral, Antineoplastic

cannflavin A
Boiling point: 182*C / 359.6 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: COX inhibitor, LO inhibitor

β-sitosterol
Boiling point: 134*C / 273.2 degree Fahrenheit
Properties: Antiinflammatory, 5-α-reductase, inhibitor

i did some more reading and I figuered out that if you "cure" your plants long enough you don't need to heat up your plants. it takes several weeks but i think it's worth it and maybe heating the plants is one of the reasons why some haven't had success with this recipe. poor quality marijuana and alcohol concentrations may affect potency as well

I have heard the same thing before about letting it cure long enough to be able to skip the decarb process. Has anyone here tried this and if so how were your results.

I have one question, the first step is to cut the herb up very fine. Second is to bake at 325? So why did you vaporize all the cannibinoids that vaporize before 325? Seems like a waste of some nice nugs........

Someone I know has experimented several times with Master Wu's most recent recommendations, and has never been disappointed. :hippy: In an attempt to arrive at an even more concentrated tincture requiring far fewer drops than the original formula, this aquaintance has had outstanding success with the following procedure:

Ingredients:

• 1 oz. High Quality Herb Tops. No stems, shake, or other extraneous crap.
• 8 oz. Everclear (190 Proof)

Process Summary:

1. Using a small electric coffee grinder, chop herb tops to a fine, uniform mix.
2. Pre-heat oven to exactly 325 degrees.
3. Uniformly spread chopped herb in flat/shallow, oven-proof utensil, and bake at 325 degrees for exactly 5 minutes. Remove from oven IMMEDIATELY! Odor will be strong, and some steaming will be noticeable.
4. Combine baked herb with 8 oz. Everclear in tight fitting jar. Store unrefrigerated in the dark for several weeks. Even though you can proceed immediately to Step 5., a long soaking period appears to be very desirable.
5. Prepare a shallow water bath (+/- 2 in. deep) by heating a medium size pot of water.
6. Pour herb/Everclear mixture into a Pyrex measuring cup (2 cup min. size). Stay away from stove while doing this!
7. Place a thermometer into the Pyrex cup, and then place the cup into the water bath. Simmer and attempt to maintain the temperature of the Everclear mixture at +/- 170 degrees, which is just below the boiling point of alcohol. The objective is to slowly reduce the volume at a high enough temperature without rapidly boiling away the alcohol.
8. Stir the mixture frequently throughout the process while reducing the liquid volume to approximately 2 oz. This may take an hour or more, so be patient and enjoy. At some point, you should interrupt the process and temporarly decant the liquid portion into another measuring cup in order to do a rough volume check before resuming to the 2 oz. endpoint back in the original container.
9. After reducing the liquid volume to approximately 2 oz., pour all contents of the beaker into a metal coffee filter, and press the liquid out of the solid mass. Discard solid mass.
10. Perform a final filtration by pouring the previously filtered liquid thru a paper coffee filter.
11. Store tincture out of light in a colored glass dropper bottle or small plastic, opaque eyedrop bottle (an excellent portable delivery device). Your freezer is an excellent long-term storage location.

Dosage:

Each batch is slightly different, so it is best to self-titrate. A moderately strong dose would be 15 drops in a half can of beer or other drink, so I'm told. The effects are first noticeable in approximately 30 minutes, and may last 5-7 hours. The effects are very favorably enhanced throughout the experience by the moderate consumption of alcohol.

I've been thinking about attempting this by setting up the water bath in a slow cooker for an extended period of time. Anyone tried this? Would the alcohol vaporate too quickly?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by seeit5

I've been thinking about attempting this by setting up the water bath in a slow cooker for an extended period of time. Anyone tried this? Would the alcohol vaporate too quickly?

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I've done it in a crock pot but not for an extended time. What I do is I have it in a small beaker with tin foil on the top. I push the foil down in the middle and have a digital meat thermometer in there. The evaporating alcohol seems to collect on the foil and drip back into the beaker and I lose very little alcohol in the process. There seems to be as much there as when I started. I then evaporate it all off in another larger container and smoke it instead of drinking it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by misslilly

I then evaporate it all off in another larger container and smoke it instead of drinking it.

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You're making hash oil, Misslilly, not tincture (which itself is nothing more than drinkable hash oil). Why not just make QWISO? Isopropyl alcohol is a hell of a lot cheaper than ethanol & (as far as I know) just as effective as a solvent. If you're going to evaporate all the solvent away, why use everclear?

There is TONS of info on making QWISO (quick wash isopropyl) hash oil on this & other forums.

It all started a few weeks ago when I first read about the GD, but first some background. I am in my twenties, weigh about 170, 5'10", exercise at least 4 days a week. I've been participating for the past six years and have been going through about 1/2oz a week ever since. I am not a chemistry student, took a bio/chem course once and sucked at every lab. I am a mediocre cook, not really my life's ambition. My friend is my assistant and has experience with keeping stable temperatures.

Back to the important story. Last week tried the GD with 3g of some decent 30's and about 1oz of Everclear. Decarboxlated at 200F for 22min. Once we started the water bath the alcohol began to burn off quickly, so we added about another 1oz of Everclear. After about 25 min (from when the alcohol/solid mixture first reached 170 degrees) we strained and garlic pressed the solids that were in a hosiery. We only had about 1/2 oz left, and we down it all. We felt it but was quick and sleepy. Our problems: (1) quality; (2) decarboxlyization time and temp; (3) temperature of alcohol mixture.

I believe it is important to note a variable that has been largely left out. The quality of the oven (most important) and range that are used in this process. An oven is a product that has low-grade, mid-grade, and high-grade levels. Amongst other factors that determine grade, the most important in this case is keeping a consistent temperature. We are trying to decarboxlyate various chemicals that have precise melting points with tools that could be very crude. In our trials we used an oven thermometer that was placed directly next to the aluminum foil tray with the substance thinly spread out. Our oven and range were very crude and found it difficult keeping a consistent temperature. Also, the temperature gauge on the oven did not match our thermometer, probably due to the sensor being located close to a wall or coil.

Our second trial: We came back the next day with a finer product and solutions to our previous problems. (1) We now had an 1/8 of some perfectly cured and dried product, around the triples level (2) decarboxlyate at 325 degrees for 5 minutes, wait for vapor and resist for a few seconds then take it out when we feel it is right (this is the general consensus I get for removing the tray). Take and place in 2oz. of alcohol in a 1 cup pyrex inside the water bath. The mixture cooked at 170 degrees for 24 minutes total. Now we used a cap to prevent the bottom of the pyrex from touching the bottom of the water pan, but we removed it halfway through for fear of the alcohol/solid mixture would tip over. Once we did that the alcohol boiled off very fast and we added another 1oz of alcohol. We removed and strained like before. This time we had 1 1/2 oz of GD, and after we placed it in a 1oz glass container it was the color of swamp water, brownish. Also, after a few minutes we were able to see settling of white particles.

Our experience: We each took 3mls in our beers on empty stomachs. We felt minor head effects and major body effects, after 30 min for about 2 hours. I took another 3ml about 3 hours after the first dose and had similar effects. One hour later I take another 3 mls and this time I barely feel anything after an hour or so. Upset I went back to the "old fashioned" way of ingesting.

Our problem: (1) When we decarboxlyated the product we didn't see a vapor until 5:02, we then took it out at about 5:07. This could be a potential problem since we were afraid to leave it in too long. Our thermometer read 310-320 for about the first 2 minutes then it rose to about 328 until we removed it. (2) Possibly the burning of alcohol and the bottom of the pyrex touching the bottom of the water bath pan could possibly be burning chemicals that we are trying to contain. (3) We removed the tray then dumped that in cold Everclear in the pyrex, we then put that in the water bath and it took a few minutes to rise to 170 and then we started the 20 minute timer.

I have read every post in this thread and have found these forums to be helpful in many other contexts. Please critique my process and offer me as many suggestions as you can. Also, I am specifically looking for a time that the tray is left in the oven after vapor begins.

Thank you for everything.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by grumio

You're making hash oil, Misslilly, not tincture (which itself is nothing more than drinkable hash oil). Why not just make QWISO? Isopropyl alcohol is a hell of a lot cheaper than ethanol & (as far as I know) just as effective as a solvent. If you're going to evaporate all the solvent away, why use everclear?

There is TONS of info on making QWISO (quick wash isopropyl) hash oil on this & other forums.

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I like the consistency of the "oil" that I get. I can roll it up in a ball and pull of a piece off to smoke. Something I can't do with oil. I don't use much alcohol so it does not cost much. With a $16 dollar bottle I can make at least 4 batches. And I can do it indoors safely. I do want to try ISO or butane in the future though and have looked into it.