Printable View
oh i see, im the nut, crazy, etc..., says the man claiming to be god.
they do control the media, they have ties. plenty of info out there, go look, im not going to be arsed to post any links cuz it will be pointless, all you will try to do is debunk it. so i shall not waste my time.
Big Business rules the world.
The tobacco industry, Haliburton, the medical industry, and the Bush family refineries in Texas.
Now here's the kicker: who would benefit most from a reconstruction effort and millions upon millions of dollars worth of crude oil?
It's easier to just deal with it when you understand there is no government, just Big Business, who only cares about shoving more and more money down its engorged mouth.
You learn to live with it.
true cuz people in the business world sooner or later get positions in the govt. i remember one dude on bushs staff worked for fuckin kellogs. fuckin cereal....
you guys have it all figured out here dont you.
I agree that Bush and his cronies unfairly took advantage of this tragedy, but that doesn't necessarily mean they actually orchestrated it. They're successful capitalists, which means they know how to think on their toes and take advantage of any opportunity to make money. And they're successful politicians, which means they also know how to take advantage of any opportunity to make more power. The people who are best at money-grubbing and power-grubbing end up with the most money and power. That's how the people at the top of the ladder got there. You can't seriously expect them to act otherwise once they've reached the top.Quote:
Originally Posted by graph
Do a little thought experiment: say Bush didn't orchestrate the 9/11 attacks. Assume for a moment that it was really Islamic fundamentalists behind it. What do you think Bush would have done differently? Would he not use it as an excuse to restrict civil liberties? Would he not try to scapegoat some oil-rich countries to invade them? Would he not try to maximize profits for Halliburton in his activities? The fact that he's taking advantage of the situation doesn't mean he's solely responsible for it. It just means he's a selfish opportunistic capitalist asshole.
so why is he bombing al-jazeeraQuote:
Originally Posted by God v2.0
look at wtc7, the building that was never hit by anything still collapsed, someone please explain that.....
people do anything for power and money these days, including killing the innocent...
just remember america runs out of oil in 2010...
If you want someone to explain that to you, I'm sure you can find your way over to the websites of people skeptical of whatever your explanation is. I'll help you:Quote:
Originally Posted by Yous
http://www.911myths.com/html/wtc7___silverstein.html
And how are Islamic fundamentalist terrorists any different in that regard?Quote:
people do anything for power and money these days, including killing the innocent...
Which is why Bush jumped on the opportunity to attack Iraq and Afghanistan...Quote:
just remember america runs out of oil in 2010...
For one thing, He wouldn't have told the clean-up workers at Ground Zero that the air they were breathing days/months after the collapse was pure. Now there are almost 2000 lawsuits against the city of NY, including firefighters, cops, workers that have strangely developed cases of leukemia, cancer, lung disease, and other rare diseases!Quote:
Originally Posted by Oneironaut
Second, he would have conducted a thorough investigation of 9/11... here's some figures for you: The investigations for clinton scandal, jfk shooting, and other things were started within a week after occuring, the 9/11 commision report was started 411 days AFTER 9/11 *:confused:*. Keeping on the subject of the investigation, there was 42 million dollars given to conduct the investigation on Clinton gettin a bj, but only 600,000 dollars was funded for the 9/11 commission report.
what do you have to say about that?
I have to say it's solid evidence that the government is full of incompetent bureaucrats, but it's not solid evidence of a conspiracy.
so along w/ not funding the 9/11 commision report (it was actually 3 million given, sry bout mis info, but columbia spacecraft incident was given 50 mil) and resisting giving memos and emails from clinton admin, along w/ their admin + not answering questions for the 9/11 commision ppl, you still believe it wasn't an inside job... this was as our Admin puts it themselves, the worst terror attack on US soil, but they won't help for the cause... yet they abuse the event by passing the Patriot Act which threw away 4-5 principles of the bill of rights, and ruining millions of lives in the Middle East.Quote:
Originally Posted by Oneironaut
Ok lets say the government did stage the attacks. I just want to know what their motive was if they did. What good reason would the government have for staging 9/11?
This answers your question too, PeteRock. However, before you read this, read my last posts for the "full story".Quote:
Originally Posted by Oneironaut
Bush didn't orchestrate the attacks. Someone much more powerful than Bush did? Much more powerful than Bush you say. Of course.
Just look at his face when he heard about the planes crashing into the building. It's like a monkey who just found out his favorite tree got knocked down. He's not smart enough to plan the attack, nor is he smart enough to cover it up. Somebody, somewhere, wanted something.
I get your point, really I do. For a while I tried to convince myself that it wasn't the government either, since it does seem really crazy to say it was. There's a lot of things more powerful than the government, though, which brings me back to Big Business. We haven't had another attack since then, even though we bombed the hell outta two countries, we've been kept in a state of constant fear with the terror alert system, our basic freedoms are being taken away by something labeled a "Patriot" Act, I mean the list just goes on and on. Sure, they could have seen 9/11 as an opportunity to take away our basic freedoms, but it's just more plausible to me that it was planned.
hmm.. motives... they as top officials have goals for our country... one major goal is to be a superpower, especially militarily. Their ideas aren't supported by all, so this is basically sythetic terrorism which caused fear upon the nation. with doing so, we will be more acceptable of their plans (stated in The Project for New American Century) and also pass stuff like the Patriot Act (gives them an enormous amount of power, and eliminates the checks and balance system we are based on, especially when dealing with persecuting detainees of wartime)Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete Rock
the link to new american century is in a post above
true. also you can tell a professional inside job bombing from an amateur bombing. amateur bombings always bomb something little like a bus and there is no evidence as opposed to a prof. inside bombing where the fbi always finds all these pieces of evidence. basically amateur bombings are always sloppy.Quote:
Originally Posted by graph
Maybe, just maybe, the force of the Twin Towers collapsing onto a concrete floor made the surrounding area shake just a little, so that surrounding buildings were damaged or destroyed?Quote:
Originally Posted by Yous
I really dont know what the fuss is about. Sure, the 9/11 and 7/7 bombings might be inside jobs, but will getting rid of the current government make all these problems disappear? For a few years, maybe. But then another government is gonna come into power, and someone inside will be corrupt, and the same things will happen again.
Just fuck it. If its gonna happen, its gonna happen, and theres not a damn thing we can do about it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Swizzy89304
owner of WTC7 admitted it was "pulled" on PBS or another station
by the way....great additude :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :error:
basically your saying to just bend over....:thumbsup:
g*d damnit everyone quit being so fucking retarded. The pointless shit thats being said from both sides of this debate is so g*ddamn ignorant i want to fucking kill myself.
As for people who think that the US Government wouldnt kill their own citizens for a political, economical or financial advantages get your fucking head out of your ass. This isnt a fucking disney movie for christ sakes. I would give some examples, but if your really disillusioned enough to think that our country is lead by morality instead of greed then theres no fucking point.
And as for all you people who watch "loose change" and think your an expert on 9/11, do your own g*ddamn research. holy fuck your no better than the people who blindly listen to the government. Ive seen alot of stupidass conspiracy theories which can easily be proven wrong.
OK FINE! steal beams melt at fuckedy-ass degrees, and jet fuel burns at a lower temperature. well did you ever think that a steal beam doesnt have to fucking melt in order for thousands of pounds of concrete to cause it to break? At jet fuel's max temp, a steal beam loses 70% of its integrity. Does that sound probable now?
sick of these clone threads..
Then go ahead and prove this entire theory wrong......more than just the "steal" beams and 70% stuff that you mentioned....Quote:
Originally Posted by Tmar.aLL.DaYmar
Or, maybe this isn't one of those "stupidass conspiracy" theories, after all. :rasta:
What is it about this thread that you hate so much? That the people referring to "Loose Change" pretend to be experts? Or that you just don't believe how strong steel is?
I admit, I think a lot of the conspiracies I've read are complete BS...but there are also some things that make you wonder. And, there are a lot of FACTS that these conspiracies are based on that have yet to be disputed. If everything happened like you think it did, why are there these holes?And if the government knows that all of these holes exist, why don't they fill in these holes and answer the questions that they know are being asked?
I, personally don't have any stance about this 9/11 stuff, but don't hate on these dudes for having theirs. That's the whole reason we're supposedly fighting this war, right? America would be a sh!tty place if everyone was lazy, didn't question anything, and simply said stuff like "fuck it, there's no point" or "if it's gonna happen, it's gonna happen."
Peace.
I guess you'd better go kill yourself because this debate aint going away, just like the debate about whether God exists and whether there was a big bang or evolution. Get over it! :thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by Tmar.aLL.DaYmar
The way you put it, does make it PROBABLE that the steal beam losess 70% of its intergrity but: if you watch the crashes, collapses you can barely see any fires, given there are alot of fires in the building but not as much to make it lose 70 % of its integrity.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tmar.aLL.DaYmar
Below is a picture that shows a building losing its integrity due to fire. The WTC only stood after impact for under 1hr 20 min :confused: The picture below is around 10 hours!
what's loose change?Quote:
Originally Posted by Tmar.aLL.DaYmar
Ya, what's Loose Change?:confused: Guess I can't claim I am an "expert" on 9/11.:(Quote:
Originally Posted by graph
Dang!!!:D
9/11 was Germany's Reichstag Fire. You think a dictatorship could never happen in Amerika? It happened in Germany when it was called the Weimar Republic, and their constitution much like ours told the government what it can and CANNOT do. The Nazis committed the act and blamed the communists. Then it was the Jews, liberals, homosexuals, etc who were targeted and persecuted. Hitler passed the Enabling Act which granted him total control and it was set to expire...much like our Patriot Act that Congress passed right after 9/11. Also, Bush trying to permantely ban homosexual marriage is a very Hitler like act, as Amerika is supposed to free right?? I smell fascism!!!
The oldest trick in the book is for nations to have their citizens surrender their rights in the name of security. It happened in Germany..it will happen in Amerika!
Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism, and exposing the country to greater danger.- Herman Goering
Diffuse flames burn cooler.
Oxygen-starved diffuse flames are cooler yet.
The fires in the towers were diffuse -- well below 800ºC.
Their dark smoke showed they were oxygen-starved
LOL....I was wondering how long this thread was going to survive in the lounge!
dear god i should have known that would be completely misunderstood.Quote:
Originally Posted by knocks
And let me start off by saying that YES, i beleive 9/11 was staged. I was the like the fourth fucking post in this thread and i said i beleived it was staged.
And i dont hate people debating 9/11, what i hate is uninformed people spouting off completely ignorant information for both sides. Just because a video online gives some reasons why 9/11 was staged, DOESNT mean that its not fucking lying.
Ive written numerous International Baccalaureate level papers on september eleventh. And ive done something called RESEARCH for PRIMARY SOURCES. ever heard of them? It means not going to google and typing in "9/11 conspiracies", it means interviews with Structural Engineers and other specialists. It means browsing government archives, and other CREDIBLE sources.
I was in lower NYC, not far from Ground Zero, on 9/11.
What do you think about my conversation with an architect that I met on the subway after leaving the area of the attack, before the towers fell, that described to me exactly what was going to happen?
There must be others like him that predicted the collapse, but I never hear about any. Since it happened so fast there probably wasn't time for postings to be placed on the internet.
Have you seen or heard of any documented cases of similar professional opinions posted, or otherwise offered, between the time the Towers were hit and their collapse?
What about that radio transmission of the firefighter saying that the fires were containable....If the fire was containable then it surely wouldnt be close to collapsing
Secondly didnt it seem like a LARGE portion of the fuel burnt outside of the building, its not like the whole plane got lodged in there, it blew right through it.
I have to agree that basing your opinion on that crazed fuck Alex Jones is stupid. All he does is throw these supposed "facts" at you and expects you to belive them. I would have had a easier time believing him if he gave something to back his facts up.
comment directed toward oneirnaut.
well thats what i did but opposite. i believed in the "official story" then i decided to step out of the box and look at the "conspiracy theories". it made a lot of sense to me...
I didn't like loose change. Way too much hearsay to be considered actual evidence. What I do like, though, is how it encourages others to start researching themselves, something most people never did before.Quote:
Originally Posted by C4nn4Bliss
Now you know, and knowing is half the battle.
for those that don't think the government controls the media:
Bush is straightening up the White House (ie. getting rid of some ppl).. guess who some of his candidates are: a Time Warner Inc. Chairman, and a Morgan Stanley Chief Exec
http://today.reuters.com/news/newsAr..._0_US-BUSH.xml
now stop fucking kidding yourselves
Again, I could care less about 9/11 conspiracies, so you probably can figure out that I haven't had the honor of doing research for Primary Sources nor written IB level papers on the subject. Congratulations on your accomplishments...Quote:
Originally Posted by Tmar.aLL.DaYmar
What my point is, is why don't you explain what some of the "ignorant information" that these guys are referring to? Especially since your credentials put in a position of doing just that....A lot of us ignorant posters on this forum don't have the time to go browsing through gov't archives, since that's not our area of work....maybe we'd just rather smoke some weed in our free time. A lot of us uninformed idiots rely on experts like you to do the research and post it online so we can read it, evaluate it, and figure out if we believe it. Just because it's on Google doesn't mean it's NOT true...
In my humble opinion, if I were the expert at something, I would share some of my expert knowledge with the less-enlightened masses, instead of sitting on my IB high horse and spew out stuff like "F this...F that....F you all...Get a F-ing clue."
Again...peace.
http://911research.wtc7.net/cache/wt...neverided.html
^^ is the source, not written by ppl on the site
anyway, it says 200 pieces of a body were linked to one person... can you say EXPLODED... only 300 bodies were found, i didnt realize how fire makes bones evaporate
I think they call it cremation.Quote:
Originally Posted by xblackdogx
yes, b/c EVERYONE that died were exposed to "fires" on the first, second, third, fourth, fifth, sixth, seventh, eighth etc floors..... or was it the collapse of the buildings that made the people on these lower floors evaporate?Quote:
Originally Posted by Psycho4Bud
How many tons of steel, concrete, etc...dropped on these poor souls? Drop a 100# weight on a grape and see whats left to identify.Quote:
Originally Posted by xblackdogx
ummm, have you picked dead bodies off collapsed buildings before... i'm basing my info on what actual firefighters from the scene said and um... there should have been bodies... flattened bodies if you will... but not dust
OK, this is hopefully going to end all you "i believe the gov't" conspiracists. Fuck outside sources. Here's the blueprints. Look at all of them and think about the 500,000t of steel that comprises the beams. Try to tell me it was a plane that knocked them down.
last picture is FEMA's version... they distorted it to make the beams look like they were independent, but they were all connected
Dickhead Cheney admits USAma had nothing to do with 911...
Q I want to be clear because I've heard you say this, and I've heard the President say it, but I want you to say it for my listeners, which is that the White House has never argued that Saddam was directly involved in September 11th, correct?
THE VICE PRESIDENT: That's correct. We had one report early on from another intelligence service that suggested that the lead hijacker, Mohamed Atta, had met with Iraqi intelligence officials in Prague, Czechoslovakia. And that reporting waxed and waned where the degree of confidence in it, and so forth, has been pretty well knocked down now at this stage, that that meeting ever took place.So we've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden [sic] was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming. But there -- that's a separate proposition from the question of whether or not there was some kind of a relationship between the Iraqi government, Iraqi intelligence services and the al Qaeda organization
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/relea...0060329-2.html
^^ Yea, then when Pres Bush gives a speech, most recently as yesterday they always intertwine the events with 9/11 and Iraq.
Check this photos out from AP... this is blatant proof about the Pentagon, and if this is an inside job, then the WTC have to be... they go hand in hand
the hole is roughly 3.5 times the size of the car in the picture :confused: