^^You're a wierdo
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^^You're a wierdo
Quote:
Originally Posted by kronick
I Love You.
(feels better doesnt it lol)
Quote:
Originally Posted by F L E S H
It believes everything. Everything Believes it.
were u stoned when u typed that?
Quote:
Originally Posted by kronick
lol no i'm just eve
you know
adam and eve
lol so this is only the beginning you will hear me on the news soon
oooh, i get it...you're just fucked up eh?
mentalist lol but hes cool
Stop trying to explain everything. everyone eventually becomes god, its just a matter of who does it in the phsical world, the mental, and who puts it together the fastest. lol you will get there faster though because you experienced drugs. physically that is. laughs. dont die. overcome it.Quote:
Originally Posted by F L E S H
anyways you gotta learn how to snap out of it. bla bla bla see i'm just a normal everyday stupid 8th grade chic rite? lol brb(goes and gets lipgloss)...
(here we go) can u prove that? or are u just guessing, cause thats what i think you're doing. if you read my previous posts ull kno what im trying to say.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kronick
the sooner you realise realisation the better you will get at putting yourself into my shoes.
See Feel.
see feel? what .. what the hell is that supposed to mean.....???. what? stop confusing me like this. yea............................................... ..i get it. i truly do. i know. i know i know. i know i know i know i know i know. Do you now?
Nope.
Am i>,fds
yea.
wait what...
what what
what what what
what whawt..rfjlLLLkfjdskkkkfdjsk88jfdsaj
Whats that mean. Explain.
EcXplInaLmn what?
What.
Whats whty.. huh.
Yep.
(yep>?FfdGeTGOD>>FDJ?????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ????????????????????????????????????/.fffff
you prolly think your smart shit eh? *coughbullshitcough*
Kronick, if we ignore it, hopefully it'll go away...
shhh... :D
Quote:
Originally Posted by kronick
nope i know it.
try to disprove me
try
you will find yourself only to make one huge mind circle...
love
'love'
love
"love"
love
'"love"'
"'lllllllllllllllllllllllloooooooooooooooooooooooo vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvveeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee'"
the word is flying
jackass
i am god
gods not the bible
neither was jesus
he just knew he was onto soemthing
he didnt know what yet
so he wrote a very convincing story
of which one half believed
the other half didnt
the other half doesnt know what to think
then theres me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by F L E S H
you cant ignore it
except when you are high
your just jealous
are you?
what
huh
you lost me.......
i know
ignore who? ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by F L E S H
pie?
what kinda pie?
apple pie?
in the grass?
in the sky?
i am high!
like a fly?
who might die?
in a apple pie! :D
this is an extract of a recent conversation between a friend and I:
Me: Jesus never really existed.
Him: Yes he did
Me: No, he didn't
Him: Yes he did
Me: No, he didn't
Him: Yes he did
Me: No, he didn't
Him: Yes he did
Me: No, he didn't
Him: Yes he did
Me: No, he didn't
**Joint break**
Him: Yes he did
Me: No, he didn't
Him: Yes he did
Me: No, he didn't
Him: Yes he did
Me: Yes, he did
Him: No, he didn't.
Me: Ahahahahahahah you lose!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
**
Thank you
did that really happen? or are u just messin'
GHoST, if there's a better way to resolve a debate, I can't think of one :D
he pretty much took the cake on that one
am surprised you have nt mentioned "holy blood holy grail" the work dan brown is supposed to have plagurised.if you perservere with this book you will be rewarded about the truth about the man from gallilee.that he did nt die on the cross
well honistly...im not gonna believe dan brown any more than ill believe the bible...whats makes dan brown more right than the bible?
Well, there are all sorts of theories about that too, sadly, none can be proven to be correct. I don't remember if I wrote it in the original post, but there was a bishop writing in the 2nd century who didn't believe Jesus dies on the cross. He said that Jesus went on to old age, got married, had kids, etc... Sort of like "last temptation of Christ" :DQuote:
Originally Posted by sundance
Dan Brown did not plagurise 'Holy Blood Holy Grail', he simply took the basic premis of the book and used it in his own work of fiction.
but whos to say which story is true? i dont think dan brown mad up the part of "a bishop writing in the 2nd century". he took a "rumor" and made it real in his book, with twists of his own but basic parts in the book are derived from real "rumors".
all I am saying is that if you want to know the TRUTH about Jesus then "Holy Blood Holy Grail" will solve any queries you may have on this subject .The research is impecable.I am intrigued by the Cathars and there religion and were they influenced by the blood line of Jesus Christ and Mary Magdalene!
however "impecable" the reascearch maybe...its not 100% so you cannot prove it no matter what you say.
The 'research' is totally flawed. They claim the PRiory of Sion is the keeper of this secret, when in actual fact Pierre Plantard forged documents and then got his colleges to 'find' them.. these documents claimed that the Priory of Sion was an ancient secret society and he was the Grand Master. Since the release of 'Holy Blood, Holy Grail', the author has admitted that these documents were forged and that the Priory is not who he claimed to be, even though they do exist to some extent.Quote:
Originally Posted by sundance
http://www.fiu.edu/~mizrachs/poseur3.html
http://priory-of-sion.com/
http://www.ordotempli.org/priory_of_sion.htm (this is an interesting read)
http://www.alpheus.org/html/articles...chardson1.html
I also read somewhere that the Priory, as it's described in the Da Vinci Code, for example, is bogus. It might exist somewhere, but they're probably not the keepers of the Holy Grail, whatever it may be.
This Holy Grail business is a puzzle that will likely never be solved, but I do believe that it is so much more than a simple cup. I also believe in the interpretation of 'sang raal' (royal blood) instead of 'san graal' (holy grail) but that's just me. These are the problems because people who wrote over a thousand years ago didn't put spaces or lowercase letters when they wrote.
where ever you got "sang raal" and "san graal" from was prolly translated from another language, which means the thing about no spaces 1000 years ago would not mean anything when talking about our alphabet and language.
I think you mean san grael or sangrael?
Anyway, F L E S H.. you're right.. The Priory as described in The Da Vinci Code and Holy Blood, Holy Grail is (from what I gather) a fallacy. I'm sure it it did exist to some extent - the real Priory of Sion was rumoured to be a Catholic monastic order. It has also been rumoured to be nothing more than an innocent group of friends who called themselves The Priory of Sion. Pierre Plantard used the name for his hoax, claiming he was the Grand Master of the Priory, and that the Priory was a secret society, which had links to the Knights Templar, the bloodline of Jesus Christ, and the Merovingian Kings.
What's interesting is how this false timeline incorperates both rumour and fact to give an impression of authenticity. When I first reads The Da Vinci Code, I totally believed it. Now, only a few months and a small amount of research later, I can see how well orchestrated the hoax was. Whether Dan Brown (author of The Da Vinci Code) actually believes it to be true is another question. Surely he would have heard that these documents were forged? And if so, why claim that all the documents he mentions in the text of his novel are accurate and true?
As you said, F L E S H, I also believe that there is more to the life of Jesus than we know. I believe he existed, but I believe he was nothing more than an enigmatic politician, who's legend has been used and twisted to further the control of certain people or groups of people. Who knows?
Kronick, FYI, 'our' alphabet and language comes from the Latin tradition, and 1,000 years ago everybody in Western Europe wrote in Latin, regardless of whether they were in Britain, France, Germany or Italy. All these monks also wrote completely in upper case letters, and with no spaces between words and no punctuation. Therefore, the question of whether it's really SAN GRAAL or SANG RAAL is of great importance and relevance.Quote:
Originally Posted by kronick
As for the Priory, you're right GHoST, And Brown's been asked about it many times. He's really funny, every time someone points out an inconsistency or a fallacy, he just goes "well, I'm a fiction writer, so I can take some liberties." That's all fine and good, but then don't go write in the forward of your books that everything is based on actual facts... lol
lol
I know this is pretty unrelated, but have either of you heard of the 'Kryptos' sculpture near the CIA building? Parts of it have been decrypted... I think there's a reward for anybody who can decrypt the entire sculpture, but there's probably no point in trying unless you have a university degree in cyrptology. Anyway, I found out about Kryptos when reading up about the Priory, the Knights Templar etc... I thought it was pretty interesting
http://www.cia.gov/cia/information/tour/krypt.html
http://elonka.com/kryptos/
http://elonka.com/kryptos/transcript.html (the complete transcript, for anybody who wants to try and figure it out lol)
and they prolly dont tell anything related on what your looking for, right? lol
oh well, ill give it a shot :P
will they even tell you what the other 3 mean?
well thats neat and creative, on the creators part.
does anyone have any revelant information regarding the Cathars who were the true Christians living in southern france
Here's the wikipedia article, it's quite accurate:Quote:
Originally Posted by sundance
Origins
The beliefs came originally from eastern Europe by way of trade routes. The name of Bulgarians (Bougres) was also applied to the Albigenses, and they maintained an association with the Bogomils of Thrace. Their doctrines have numerous resemblances to those of the Bogomils, and still more to those of the Paulicians, with whom they are also sometimes connected. It is difficult to form any precise idea of the Cathar doctrines, as all the existing knowledge of them is derived from their opponents, and the few texts from the Cathars (the Rituel cathare de Lyon and the Nouveau Testament en provencal) contain very little information concerning their beliefs and moral practices. What is certain is that they formed an anti-sacerdotal party in opposition to the Roman church, and raised a continued protest against the corruption of the clergy. The Cathar theologians, called Cathari or perfecti (in France bons hommes or bons chretiens) were few in number; the mass of believers (credentes) were not initiated into the doctrine at all - they were freed from all moral prohibition and all religious obligation, on condition that they promised by an act called convenenza to become "hereticized" by receiving the consolamentum, the baptism of the Spirit, before their death.
The first Cathars appeared in Limousin between 1012 and 1020. Several were discovered and put to death at Toulouse in 1022. The synods of Charroux (Vienne) (1028) and Toulouse (1056) condemned the growing sect. Preachers were summoned to the districts of the Agenais and the Toulousain to combat the heretical propaganda in the 1100s. The Cathars, however, gained ground in the south thanks to the protection given by William, Duke of Aquitaine, and that given by a significant proportion of the southern nobility. The people were impressed by the bons hommes, and the anti-sacerdotal preaching of Peter of Bruys and Henry of Lausanne in Perigord.
Beliefs
Catharism was based on the idea that the world was evil. This was a distinct feature of Gnosticism, Platonism-Neoplatonism, Manicheanism and the theology of the Bogomils. This idea may possibly also have been influenced by older Gnostic lines of thought. According to the Cathars, the world had been created by an evil deity known to the Gnostics as the Demiurge. The Cathars identified the Demiurge with the being the Christians called Satan. Earlier Gnostics, however, did not identify the Demiurge with Satan. This may be due to the fact that the concept of Satan was not "in fashion" in the 1st century, while the concept became increasingly popular in medieval times.
The Cathars also believed that souls would be reborn when they escaped the material world and succeeded to the immaterial heaven. The way to escape was to live an ascetic's life, and to be not corrupted by the world. Those that did live this life were called 'Perfects' (Parfaits). They had the power to wipe away a person's sins and connections to the material world, so that they would go to heaven when they died. The Perfects themselves lived lives of unimpeachable frugality, in stark contrast to that lived within the corrupt and opulent church of the time. Commonly, the wiping away of sin, called the consolamentum, was performed on someone about to die. After receiving this, the believer would sometimes stop eating, so that they could die faster, and with less taint from the world. The consulamentum was the only sacrament of the Cathar faith. They did not perform any rite of marriage, as procreation (bringing more souls into the world) was frowned upon. It was as a result of this particular belief that the term "buggery" was coined (after the 'Bulgars', or 'Bougres') since sex (using a loose definition) was perfectly all right as long as as no children resulted.
The Cathars also held many beliefs that were odious to the rest of medieval society. They believed that Jesus had been an apparition, a ghost, that showed the way to God. They refused to believe that the good God could or would come in material form, since all physical objects were tainted by sin. This specific belief is called docetism. Furthermore, they believed that the God of the Old Testament was the Devil, since he had created the world. They also did not believe in any sacrament except the consulamentum, which was another major heresy.
Women were treated as equals, because their physical form was irrelevant; their soul could have been a man's soul before, and it might once again become one.
They were also vegetarians.
One of their ideas most heretical to feudal Europe was the belief that oaths were a sin, because they attached you to the world. To call them a sin in this manner was very dangerous in a society where illiteracy was wide-spread and almost all business transactions and pledges of allegiance were based on oaths.
Suppression
In 1147, Pope Eugene III sent a legate to the affected district in order to arrest the progress of the Cathars. The few isolated successes of Bernard of Clairvaux could not obscure the poor results of this mission, and well shows the power of the sect in the south of France at that period. The missions of Cardinal Peter (of St Chrysogonus) to Toulouse and the Toulousain in 1178, and of Henry, cardinal-bishop of Albano, in 1180-1181, obtained merely momentary successes. Henry of Albano's armed expedition, where he took the stronghold at Lavaur, did not extinguish the movement.
The persistent decisions of the councils against the Cathars at this periodâ?? in particular, those of the Council of Tours (1163) and of the Third Council of the Lateran (1179)â?? had scarcely more effect. Pope Innocent III, however, when he came to power in 1198, resolved to suppress the Albigenses.
At first he tried pacific conversion, and sent a number of legates into the affected regions. They had to contend not only with the Cathars, the nobles who protected them, and the people who venerated them, but also with the bishops of the district, who rejected the extraordinary authority which the Pope had conferred upon his legates. In 1204 Innocent III suspended the authority of the bishops in the south of France. Papal legate Peter of Castelnau, known for recklessly excommunicating the noblemen who protected the Cathari, retaliated in 1207 by excommunicating the Count of Toulouse, as an abettor of heresy. He was murdered near Saint Gilles Abbey in 1208 on his way back to Rome, according to the Catholic Encyclopedia, "probably at the connivance of Raymond VI, count of Toulouse". As soon as he heard of the murder of Peter of Castelnau, the Pope ordered his legates to preach the Albigensian Crusade against the Cathars.
This implacable war threw the whole of the nobility of the north of France against that of the south, possibly instigated by a papal decree stating that all land owned by Cathars could be confiscated at will. This was practically an open invitation to wholesale theft with the blessings of the Church as the area was full of Cathar sympathisers. It is thus hardly surprising that the barons of the north flocked south to do battle for the Church.
In one famous incident in 1209, most of BĂ©ziers was slaughtered by the Catholic forces headed by the Papal legate. The Abbot of Citeaux was asked how to distinguish between the Catholic and Cathars, and he answered "kill them all, God will know his own." The Catholic Encyclopedia denies these words were ever spoken.
The war also involved Peter II, the king of Aragon, who owned fiefdoms and had vassals in the area. Peter died fighting against the crusade on September 12, 1213 at the Battle of Muret.
The war ended in the treaty of Paris (1229), by which the king of France dispossessed the house of Toulouse of the greater part of its fiefs, and that of Beziers of the whole of its fiefs. The independence of the princes of the south was at an end. But in spite of the wholesale massacre of Cathars during the war, Catharism was not extinguished.
The Inquisition was established in 1229 to root out the Cathars. Operating unremittingly in the south at Toulouse, Albi, Carcassonne and other towns during the whole of the 13th century and a great part of the 14th, it succeeded in crushing the movement. From May 1243 to March 1244, the Cathar citadel of Montségur was besieged by the troops of the seneschal of Carcassonne and the archbishop of Narbonne. On March 16, 1244 a large and symbolically important slaughter took place, where leaders of Catharism together with more than 200 heretics were thrown into an enormous fire at the 'prat des cramats' near the foot of the castle. Moreover, the church decreed severe chastisement against all laymen suspected of sympathy with Cathars (Council of Narbonne, 1235; Bull Ad extirpanda, 1252).
Hunted down by the Inquisition and abandoned by the nobles of the district, the Albigenses became more and more scattered, hiding in the forests and mountains, and only meeting surreptitiously. The people made some attempts to throw off the yoke of the Inquisition and the French, and insurrections broke out under the leadership of Bernard of Foix, Aimerv of Narbonne, and Bernard DĂ©licieux at the beginning of the 14th century. But at this point vast inquests were set on foot by the Inquisition, which terrorized the district. Precise indications of these are found in the registers of the Inquisitors, Bernard of Caux, Jean de St Pierre, Geoffroy d'Ablis, and others. The sect was exhausted and could find no more adepts and after 1330 the records of the Inquisition contain few proceedings against Catharists. The last Cathar Perfect died in the beginning of the 14th century. Sympathizers with the Cathars went underground and hid their faith for obvious reasons.
Influences
Christian Rosencreuz, according to some, may have been associated with an underground Cathar movement that hid from the Inquisition. However, this is highly unlikely because there is absolutely no evidence that the Cathar movement still existed by Rosencreuz' time, nor is there any concrete evidence that Rosencreuz existed at all.
The Holy Grail
It has been suggested in some modern fiction and non-fiction books that the Cathars could have been the protectors of the Holy Grail of Christian mythology, especially in the book Holy Blood, Holy Grail, although modern investigation into this book has largely discredited its findings.
thank you Flesh you have been most helpful.....Namaste
don't mention it :D
I think the history of the Cathars is very fascinating. If you're really interested, look for a book called, in English, "Montaillou: Promised land of Error" by Emmanuel Le Roy-Ladurie. This man is one of the most famous historians of France, and in the world, and the book itself was a best seller in France when it came uot in the 70s. It's a great book about a village in which most of the inhabitants were Cathars themselves, and about the subsequent Inquisition which rooted them out. Fascinating stuff :D
ALLRIGHT THATS IT IM COMING DOWN THERE..........