Violating Patient Rights

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Originally Posted by rudy2010

Clearly that document describes an over bearing emphasis on intimidating people who are legally acquiring their medicine.

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Actually their madness stems more from regulating the industry, that's their assigned duty.

Not to endorse the rule mongers, but I believe they actually only have a couple interests at hand:

1] Keeping all sales in the system, not pounds rolling out the back door.
2] Making sure taxes are paid on all sales.
3] Preventing fraud. IE a dispensary owner short on product, or over the 30% outside purchase allocation volume, from running around to dispensaries buying up 2oz at a time to fill their inventory.
4] Preventing distribution of product into the black market. If a card holder is running through multiple dispensaries they can sell a fairly large volume into the black market.
5] Managing patient assignments to centers so they can confirm MMC plant counts.
5] Something else that i can't remember right now...

Remember, just by parking in front of the dispensary you are telling more people than the DOR ever could :)

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Originally Posted by Colodonmed

c. A single fixed camera shall be placed above each point of sale location, allowing for the clear and certain identification of the transacting individual and related identification. A single fixed camera shall be placed above each point of sale location, allowing for the recording and recognition of any transacting individualâ??s identification and any medical marijuana removed from the premises. This will be accomplished by temporarily placing the authorized identification, and registry card in a 12â?� x 12â?� area on the counter top, where they will be captured from the above mounted camera.

Unless you got a super stealth card with no name, or any other info on it, you will be recorded and identified. And it will be kept for a minimum of I believe 20 days. No offense man, but maybe you should read a little more on the proposal because this is not good for you or I or any of the 100,000 plus registered patients

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I think it's 30 days but who can keep up and I agree 100% this is bad for patients!:(

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Originally Posted by DenverRelief

So long as they aren't requiring that patients lay out their card when the transaction is made, not much is going to change for patients that come to us.

Many patients have come to love and appreciate the retail atmosphere to purchase their medicine, and I don't see droves of them leaving. They already know we have cameras.

We have cameras in our retail location and have had them since we moved in. It's a reasonable protection for employee theft, liability, and they keep us safe by allowing us to aware of what is going on.

That the DOR which regulates us may have interest in the recordings to do their job does not trouble me.

Legalization is about getting everything above the table so that the public at large may see that nothing nefarious or shady is going on when a patient purchases marijuana and that it can be as common an act as going to the pharmacy, where people are also taped on security cameras.

And everyone please remember that this has not been decided yet and let your patients know as well.

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GM as well has had cameras from day one for security reasons they record the parking lot the entrance and the register pretty much like any pharmacy or store dealing in cash would. But recorded a face and name as they are proposing with your card is very invasive and seems a bit much.

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Originally Posted by GratefulMeds

I think it's 30 days but who can keep up and I agree 100% this is bad for patients!:(

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Proposed storage is 20 days on the local DVR system, then backed up to CD or DVD for another 20 days. So 40 days local storage total.

Thanks for the detailed response. It is clear why they want the cameras for the reasons you describe.

Do they have the same rules at liquor stores. How easy is it to by a keg and 12 cases of beer that you are obviously going to share with others. Possibly even alcoholics and minors.

My point is that they are not treating pot the same. Are we guilty just by association with pot of tax evasion and black market activity and trying to beat the system every chance we get. I say we are less harmful than any other liquor store or pharmacy who in my opinion are doing far more harm to society. There is certainly plenty of information to back up this opinion. What are the number of people who smoke pot vs the number who drink and get in deadly wrecks or beat their wives.

Sorry to ramble but these rules have no legitimate basis in society. I am sorry that you seem to be trying to justify them. This is just blatant discrimination.

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Originally Posted by rudy2010

Do they have the same rules at liquor stores?

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Somewhat for alcohol, but yes for allergy medicine. If you are not a bazillion years old you have to show your id to buy tequila, and I guarantee that you are on video at a liquor store. You have to enter your Id into a database and be videoed at the pharmacy every time you buy Claritin-D. It ~is~ somewhat the same. Also alcohol is not a Schedule 1 controlled substance. Not saying that it should be, just that it is. Get that piece changed, and everything changes.

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Originally Posted by rudy2010

Are we guilty just by association with pot of tax evasion and black market activity and trying to beat the system every chance we get.

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Of course you are, or so government [and LEOs] think. Remember that Marijuana is America's #1 cash crop. All of it, until just recently, was black market and untaxed. That's huge image to turn around. If there is marijuana around they assume something illegal is going on. It's wrong, but that's the way they think.

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Originally Posted by rudy2010

I say we are less harmful than any other liquor store or pharmacy who in my opinion are doing far more harm to society. There is certainly plenty of information to back up this opinion.

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I say that too, but what we say does not matter. What matters in the legal and regulatory realm is the Schedule 1 drug classification.

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Originally Posted by rudy2010

Sorry to ramble but these rules have no legitimate basis in society. I am sorry that you seem to be trying to justify them.

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Believe me, I dislike this crap much more than the average guy, just trying to be the Devil's advocate to point out the things we need to work on to get where we want to be.

Honestly, I believe that the DOR could care less about who the individual patients are. The want to leave that to the Health Department. The DOR's job is to oversee dispensary operations and keep things in line there. That is turning out to be an enormous task when you consider everything involved

This journalist sums it all up pretty good I think

John Colson: Hit and Run | AspenTimes.com...


sorry, forgot the link, lol

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Originally Posted by Colodonmed

This journalist sums it all up pretty good I think

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I agree, well written article. The only point I disagree with is the feds going after patients. In all of the CA raids, the never go after the patients.

The dispensary owners and growers are are always the ones that take the fall. Even in Colorado, take a look at the Bartkowitz case. As a caregiver, all of his patients were exposed to federal prosecutors, and 0 of those patients have been charged. The feds are not stupid enough to take the heat of dragging sick and dying patients through the courts.

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Originally Posted by SoCoMMJ

I agree, well written article. The only point I disagree with is the feds going after patients. In all of the CA raids, the never go after the patients.

The dispensary owners and growers are are always the ones that take the fall. Even in Colorado, take a look at the Bartkowitz case. As a caregiver, all of his patients were exposed to federal prosecutors, and 0 of those patients have been charged. The feds are not stupid enough to take the heat of dragging sick and dying patients through the courts.

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agreed and I really don't expect that aspect to change. Even with a new administration that would love to do it, I think the cat is out of the bag on the health benefits of cannabis. They will never be able to stuff it back in pandoras little box, as far as the individual legal patient is concerned.

That is why in my opinion it is so very important that you guys, the movers and shakers of the MMC world really need to lobby against the privacy violations of the patient. Yes, you guys are taking a major risk running the grow ops and centers, and yes you guys will reap the benefits of the industry if you protect your customer base, and that base is the individual patient.