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There is nothing I do not understand. Watt for watt, LEDs provide less light and more heat. Whether it's 6 watts or 600 watts makes no difference. Just because you choose not to believe the facts does not make them untrue.Quote:
Originally Posted by smoknjoe
bah, maybe you'll get it some day...
im done on this thread
LED = AWSOME
GL
Guys, please...
Look, BigBlock has his view, and other have theirs...
More friendly guys! If this guy bought the LED lights, lets see his grow... let's give it a chance...
If at the end BigBlock was right, well, good! If he was wrong, good as well!
The way I see it, the hobby is all about experimenting... Of course, you use the experience from others... but, I think experimentation is key.
Let's see how the LED grow goes!
<>>M><><>
Hey BigBlock,
You're a Lighting Engineer... right? Well, question: Why the hell can't lumens be added up?
From what I understand, if I have two 1000 lumens bulbs, I'll have... 1,000 lumens... not 2,000... no... 1,000.... why?
I'm pretty technically/chemically/physically/stonedlly inclined, so please feel free to use terms and concepts... but I still don't get it... why? 1 + 1 = 1?
They can. Two 1000 lumen bulbs = 2000 lumens. Light intensity is what cannot be added together, for example, two 125 watt HPS bulbs would not have nearly as much penetration as a single 250 watt bulb, because the light is coming from a larger area.Quote:
Originally Posted by turtle420
Well, if that doesn't work I can guarantee the sulphur microwave lamp will blow the doors off of HID and it won't produce much heat at all, like 100 degrees.
PAR ratings are off the scale too. They cost $1600 USD but there is no doubt it's better than HID lamps.
I'm willing to shell out the money for the sulphur microwave lamp... but, I think it's like 1,600 British pounds... isn't that like 2 times (or 1.8?) times the US dollar? Around $3,000 I think...Quote:
Originally Posted by newactivist
In addition, in the future, when/IF I buy it, I'll definitely be shipping to another state (a friend) then have him mail it to me... I see the market too small to buy that thing then post here that I bought it... dead giveaway...
One thing I need to see how it'll work out, is the RF interference... supposedly, it wreaks havok in electronic equipment nearby....
Yes, it does wreak havoc on the 802.11 standard, which is why it never took off. However, if you don't wireless network and you are away from hotspots there is no better light, LED or otherwise.
Oh, I believe the confusion is that both BIGBLOCK and smoknjoe are right. LED's are not as efficient as HID. However, HID's create too much light that plants can't use and this gives them a higher lumen and heat rating. The LED's used for plants only focus on the light temps that work for plants. Lumen's are for humans and PAR is for plants. Most of the LED systems light cannot be seen with the human eye but plants use it very efficiently without energy wasted on the plant useless spectrums.
I have been in personal touch with Island Systems and their price for us is in US funds. They will have some cannabis pics soon.
Peace.
US dollars? Damn... then, I'll be taking a definitely closer look... for real.Quote:
Originally Posted by newactivist
As to the cannabis pics, if that gets posted, it'll be a hit with no doubt.
But I'm wondering... they should do that shit very cleverly... I don't think it's a good idea to explicitly say your lights are great for growing cannabis.
But they can create an account (no connection to the Company) and post the pics... that'd be great!
Exactly, Turtle420. This light is amazing. I went through the research NASA did on it and I was extremely impressed. It has pretty much all the advantages you could want for a larger grow op. Anyone who uses lights at 1000 watt or over and wanted the best should take a look. It is more expensive but it saves on electricity and because there are no longer heat issues it may be a little more affordable than it looks.
I saw the post yesterday on the cannabis site that grew with the LED's. I'm going to check that out now. Amazing how fun this is! I don't even grow any more but I will as soon as this is a legal medical state.
Damn, they say they no longer sell the video. Seems the government came and arrested the producer. Sounds like the government believes they work just fine!
I call that an endorsement.
Does anyone have the DVD already? If so could you make a avi or divx of it to post on the file share programs?
Ok, never mind. I wrote them an email to see about getting a new video and this is the reply I got back.
"Yes, they are AWESOME! However, to replace 1 1000 HPS, it takes 20 Red and
10 Blue Lights which translates to around $3500! WHEW! It is good to make
the one time investment, but not for the faint in the pocketbook.
Thanks, I will let you know!"
That could still be affordable if you aren't going for the equivilent of 1000watt HPS. I guess for a small grower with a 250watt HPS it would make sense. Also, from what I read it seems these work best in conjunction with normal lights. I will keep pumping them for info.
Peace
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBlock
yea man.. u dont know what your talkin about and please do us all a favor and dont jump in to somthing that u havent done your research:twocents: . If you knew anything about HPS systems and how they work or the light coming from them you would know that only 25% of the light of a HPS system is usable plant spectrum lighting,and the rest is wasted heat energy.
Un like, "broad spectrum" plant grow lights in which u refer to your HPS example, which produce a lot of
light plants can't use efficiently, Led growbars delivers the colors of light
used by plants for efficient and healthy growth % .
By leaving out light plants don't need, you further provide more energy savings over conventional grow lighting.
o...and BTW a single bar can equal 125 watts hps.:thumbsup:
Crispyfried, did you ever get a chance to try out those Gro-bars?
This coming from somebody who can't even grasp the concept of the shift key. :rolleyes: Like I said before, I have a degree from a 4 year university that says I'm an expert. Do you?Quote:
Originally Posted by ledgrower
I notice Yeah crispyfried hasn't said a word since he said he would be posting "soon" a month and a half ago. Could it be that they don't work and he's embarrassed about how much money he wasted on this crap? ;)
I would hope embarrassment doesn't stop someone from posting their experiences - It could save someone from wasting a lot of money.
I think LEDs have a lot of potential for smaller spaces because of their low profile and the fact they do not require a ballast to drive them (which can generate a lot of excess heat on its own). Also, LED's don't have the same degree RF interference which may be beneficial in some situations.
As stated earlier, HID lights do generate a lot of IR which is not used in photosynthesis and translates to heat. They also generate a lot of green and yellow light which is simply reflected back by the plant pigments. According to data gathered from LI-COR Quantom meter and sensors, HPS bulbs emmitt 2/3 to 4/5 of unusable light/heat energy.
Very true.Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkeyRacket
Yeah I have my grow bars. Right now I'm only growing legal stuff due to a recent scare. I'm currently using my 200 watt CFL in order to keep my box warm, but I plan to start using the LEDs in about a month. I can't risk just using LEDs right now because I've got an expensive kratom plant cutting on like life support in my box that needs high temperatures. I did try the LEDs for a few days though so I can tell you a little about them. They do give off a slight amount of heat, maybe enough to raise the temperature of a small grow box with very little ventilation a few degrees. The bars seem to be of great quality, although the power adapters are a bit crappy. You can run up to eight bars off of one adapter. Alot of the light that they emit is not visible to the human eye so you won't get much light leakage out of grow areas, but the downside to this is that you'll probably want to have a cfl as well in order to see your plants adequately. Unless your house is well insulated and has good climate control you'll probably want to use LEDs during the warm months only, or use a heater or something to heat your grow area.
Cool, keep us posted.. what temperatures are you using for the kratom? I know that LEDs can degrade faster at higher temps but I'm not sure what those are... Maybe BigBlock can enlighten us. Cannabis only really needs 60-70F to do well depending on strain.
Have you noticed any increase in growth since using the LEDs? They're your plants but for experimental reasons you could try covering up the fluorescent a bit so it's still generating heat but not shining much on the plants.
Kratom needs at least 70 for decent growth, so I've got to keep it warm until it's well established. It grows too slow to tell if the LEDs did much. As soon as my temps get close to 80 I'm going to switch to the LEDs and one or two cheap CFLs. I'm going to put the CFLs on the sides of the box and see if the plants grow towards the CFLs or up to the LEDs. My array of led bars covers the entire growing area so this should be effective.
Cool, how many bars did you get? They are the pro model right?
I'm very skeptical about the Solaroasis claim that 1 Grobar is equivalent to 100-125 watts of HID lighting but I may consider picking up a bar to play around with - if it sucks I'll just grow lettuce under it or something. The penetration from an LED matrix isn't going to be that great but I suppose you could compensate by using side-lighting or utilizing a SCROG setup.
I've got two pro bars and two reg bars. I would recommend that you get a pro bar. I'm guessing that one pro bar combined with two or so cheap full spectrum CFLs should be great for one or two plants. I'm really getting so curious about the grow bars that I may have to switch over to them very soon, but I'll have to see what the temperature forecast is.
Yeah the pro bar is pretty new, I think it came out just this January. If start seeing some good reports or if my friend's experiment works out okay I will probably grab 6 pro bars and set them up in an experimental 4-5 sqft cab.
Six bars would be cool, especially if it really does equal over 600 watts of HID lighting. And you can't get more stealthy than LED.
Crispyfried: Could you post a detailed pic of the bulb area (for an LED count) or you could just coult them yourself and post them nm of th individual bulbs. I'm curious as to what they put in the probar. The patent isn't on the PO site yet as I don't think the probar patent has been accepted yet. Did they send you any information on what wavelengths the bar contians?
I'm pretty sure the above makes sense. Lets jus say, it's a good thing yall don't have to see my handwriting right now. To bed with me. Oh, thanks CF for posting about the bars I am very curious to see how well they work.
Fermentation
Seconded.Quote:
Originally Posted by FERMENTATION
Yeah, when possible, pictures. :) Please...
There are 38 LEDs per "bulb" on the pro bar, so 114 LEDs total. The bars come with a light spectrum graph for the ruby pro gro bar, it weakly covers from 400nm to 600nm, and strongly covers wavelenghts from about 630 to 700nm, and also from like 710 or 720 to maybe 760nm. The strongest coverage corresponds with the "chlorophyll A red absorption peak", and the second strongest peak corresponds with the "far-red flowering and budding" area, while the third peak corresponds with the "chlorophyll B blue absorption peak", and is near the "chlorophyll A blue absorption peak". These blue spectrum peaks are around 460nm, while the red peaks are from like 630 to 760nm. All of these peaks are outside of the wavelengths that are visible by the human eye, and the grow bars really hardly give off any visible light, so they are probably giving off the right wavelenghts. I had an LED flashlight with one LED bulb and that thing was super bright, so the grow bars must be giving off a huge amount of light that just isn't visible.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crispyfried
Hey Crispy.. I am so happy that you purchased the lights and are willinging to share your grow with us.. This will be very very interesting.
I eagerly await your GROW Journal..
PLease start it on a new thread..
: )
Happy KNOWM... who doesn't know shit about lights but can GROW like a yeast infection on a whore in a New Orleans SUMMER.
BIG BLOCK.. my friend... nobody said anything negatiove to you... JUST cause you "KNOW" and we don't, doesn't mean we are dissing you. We are very glad to have your educated opinion... We don't want to upset or disresept you and we are not meaning to offend you by questioniong your KNOWLEDGE.... A lot of information comes to this site.. and people take what is useful for THEM...
PLease stay around
: )
Yeah I found the pro chart and I believe they are using: 465nm, 612nm, 660nm, and 730nm.