obamaconomics

"if you had a blindfold"

- why would you assume a consumer is blindfolded? the free markets demand free information



"You do not see Chinese tobacco or alcohol commanding a heavy portion of US market share do you?"

- i see chinese lots-of-things commanding a heavy portion of the US market, including chinese hemp...thanks to the war on drugs, china and eastern europe are in a position to dominate the legal cannabis market...if obama legalized cannabis on january 21, vast segments of the brainwashed US population would be opposed to cannabis cultivation...canada 'legalized' medical marijuana and the only government sponsored grow operation was located in an abandoned mine deep underground...legalization doesn't mean true freedom - it means incorporation and government sponsored profit protection rackets

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by maladroit

why would you assume a consumer is blindfolded? the free markets demand free information

---

There is no need to beg the question, just answer it honestly.

Quote:

---

i see chinese lots-of-things commanding a heavy portion of the US market, including chinese hemp

---

But that was not my question...

Quote:

---

thanks to the war on drugs, china and eastern europe are in a position to dominate the legal cannabis market...

---

US productivity in farming trumps that of any nation, due to vast subsidies, available technology, and abundant capital. I have serious doubts about your previous comment.

Quote:

---

if obama legalized cannabis on january 21, vast segments of the brainwashed US population would be opposed to cannabis cultivation...

---

Vast segments meaning half??? There are vast segments opposed to an Obama Presidency. Opposed or not, legal cannabis in the US will generate tens of billions of dollars within a year. The segment of the population that is most troubled with the thought of legal cannabis are black market growers...

Quote:

---

canada 'legalized' medical marijuana and the only government sponsored grow operation was located in an abandoned mine deep underground...legalization doesn't mean true freedom - it means incorporation and government sponsored profit protection rackets

---

How does a government sponsored grow equate to freedom? Your problem lies with your government, as they are allowing a government sponsored monopoly...

"There is no need to beg the question, just answer it honestly."

- fair enough:
if i had a blindfold and were given two types of quality skunk (one from the US and one from China), i couldn't tell the difference, but i would still know the difference between domestic jobs and outsourced labour, and i would really care if it was of lower cost but grown with lead based fertilizer and melamine pesticides...i don't shop with a blindfold or blindly choose the cheapest thing...i read labels and try to buy canadian or washington produce that is grown nearby, instead of shipped over on a slow boat from china...honestly!



"US productivity in farming trumps that of any nation, due to vast subsidies, available technology, and abundant capital. I have serious doubts about your previous comment."

- perhaps that's because you are substituting your productivity premise for my psychology premise in my following sentence...productivity isn't everything

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by maladroit

"
if i had a blindfold and were given two types of quality skunk (one from the US and one from China), i couldn't tell the difference, but i would still know the difference between domestic jobs and outsourced labour, and i would really care if it was of lower cost but grown with lead based fertilizer and melamine pesticides...i don't shop with a blindfold or blindly choose the cheapest thing...i read labels and try to buy canadian or washington produce that is grown nearby, instead of shipped over on a slow boat from china...honestly!

---

Then domestic cannabis has nothing to worry about:jointsmile:

Quote:

---

perhaps that's because you are substituting your productivity premise for my psychology premise in my following sentence...productivity isn't everything

---

No... What would be the reason for outsourcing cannabis production to China unless US companies were going to try and market it there? Answer: Lower input cost!

Productivity is everything in the corporate world. A farmer who can produce 100 tons of high quality cannabis for $1,000,000 will destroy another farmer who produces 10 tons of high quality cannabis for $250,000. It is a simple concept really.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GoldenBoy812

How can you be sure it will create more jobs? Secondly, your premise is a tad flawed. In order to assume what you are stating is sound, it would have to be true that the only people who would consume cannabis are those who would work in mom and pop shops if they did exist and no other jobs would exist in cannabis cultivation if it is not mom and pop shops. The reality is that many people who work in other industries would purchase cannabis, and the big companies would need to hire people (jobs) in order to actually produce it. :jointsmile:

---

Flaw in your logic: Absolute dependence on currency.


my logic is based in that we do, not for payment, but for the sake of getting done [what needs to be done].


mom & pop shops are PEOPLE creating businesses, not businesses creating work. the more people who own businesses, the more people that will be working as a whole. the less monopoly on business, the more empty slots to be filled by PEOPLE making businesses.

instead of Mc Donnalds, we'd have 150 other different burger joints:::instead of all our money going to one corporation, it's being evenly spread about the community through mom & pop businesses.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Stoner Shadow Wolf

Flaw in your logic: Absolute dependence on currency.

---

What do you mean?

Quote:

---

my logic is based in that we do, not for payment, but for the sake of getting done [what needs to be done].

---

I can agree with that.

Quote:

---

mom & pop shops are PEOPLE creating businesses, not businesses creating work. the more people who own businesses, the more people that will be working as a whole. the less monopoly on business, the more empty slots to be filled by PEOPLE making businesses.

---

Perfect competition can exist after the creative destruction of blackmarket farming. Once this is achieved, there will be many many many entrepreneurs in the cannabis field. But, once they are forced to compete against eachother (its not personal, just business), the weaker firms will phase out as the stronger ones continue to grab more market share.

Quote:

---

instead of Mc Donnalds, we'd have 150 other different burger joints:::instead of all our money going to one corporation, it's being evenly spread about the community through mom & pop businesses.

---

McDonalds is not the only burger company, only the "largest large scale" burger company. Instead, there are now probably 10 different burger joints on a large scale. It would be impossible for there to be 150 large scale "burger joints" operating at once.

You do understand that there are literally hundreds of different burger joints in Chicago alone, they are only smaller. Also, McDonald's has open competition between themselves, although their primary goal is to gain market share over Wendy's and BK.

"Productivity is everything in the corporate world."

- it isn't everything...productivity doesn't create demand, and demand is everything in the corporate world *grin*

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by maladroit

"Productivity is everything in the corporate world."

- it isn't everything...productivity doesn't create demand, and demand is everything in the corporate world *grin*

---

Ok, than answer this...

Why is China's economy so much smaller than ours even though they have about 4 times the population?

ah easy question to answer :) democracy is a crappy form of government,,,,
it is just better than all others

oh and by the way...china's economy will be bigger than ours soon enough

You are absolutely correct:thumbsup: Most analysts project the the torch to be passed somewhere between 2015-2025 at the latest.

There are only two possible ways, one being to more than double their population, the other by merely improving their production efficiency by about 20%.

China has just unleashed a stimulus package, in terms of % of GDP, would be roughly equivalent to the initial US bailout package.

China: ($586 billion) / ($10.7 trillion) = approximately 5.5% of GDP

US: ($13.3 trillion) * (.055) = approximately $732 billion

What this suggest is that China, in the upcoming years, will greatly improve production efficiency, by upgrading their infrastructure, and providing more growth opportunities for their citizens with this stimulus.

in your responses goldenboy you seem to really think a lot about efficiency, total cost of material goods. It makes me want to tell you about my point of view in which efficiency is not such a good thing, where just because something can be made cheaper does not make it better. I really dont think mankind is alive on this planet to be slaves to material goods, in fact i dont think anyone will tell you they think they should be. It seems to me that is exactly where we are headed(some would say where we are). Economic models that dont take into account their impact on society have become the norm. Should people have to work so much? I often wonder how long it will take before efficiency is measured in how much time one man has to work at production to have a quality life.

If your rich or aspiring to be so, my words will sound like total retardation, if you are looking at spending the rest of your life working just to survive you might have a similar outlook. i know that my words were all over the place but you prolly have the basic idea of what i am saying. It would take hundreds of pages of text to explain everything that's in my head about this being that i have spent alot of my years thinking about this very thing. If someone wanted to pick apart my words and find holes ...well there is a lot of those i know :)

efficiency via automation doesn't just make things cheaper (while reducing employment), it makes retooling to adjust for product changes more expensive too...the benefits of efficiency on a production line are limited if they are making something that isn't in demand

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by maladroit

efficiency via automation doesn't just make things cheaper (while reducing employment), it makes retooling to adjust for product changes more expensive too...the benefits of efficiency on a production line are limited if they are making something that isn't in demand

---

That really is the trick you see. The demand of a product is essentially reliant on two factors. The first being the availability of the product (supply), and the second is price.

Say's Law: "Supply creates its own demand"

Regardless of whether it is a machine producing, or human labor producing; it is extremely inefficient to produce a good or service that lacks overall utility.

Take the auto industry for example:thumbsup:... Auto's are in demand, even though it is slumping at the moment. The only rational thing to do is lay off workers and curb production until real demand increases. Lowering the price would definitely increase the demand for any car or truck on the market.

us automakers have been handing out price incentives to the point of bankrupting themselves and they still haven't been able to reverse declining US auto sales since 2004...during the same period US and foreign built japanese car sales increased even though they're more expensive to buy...the higher price should dictate lower sales but the reverse is happening because japanese cars offer better quality, and better choices

GM, Ford fall; Asian sales rise | Autonet.ca

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by maladroit

us automakers have been handing out price incentives to the point of bankrupting themselves and they still haven't been able to reverse declining US auto sales since 2004...during the same period US and foreign built japanese car sales increased even though they're more expensive to buy...the higher price should dictate lower sales but the reverse is happening because japanese cars offer better quality, and better choices

---

That article is from 2005...

Something a little more recent:Thomas: Unions the reason Big 3 automakers teetering | CARS AND SOCIALISM