The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by snowblind
In your eyes, in alot of peoples eyes americans are criminals.
yet again you miss the wood for the trees, being the big fucking irony in saying you can't have a gun because we think you are criminals.
It was your metaphor, I speak to you in your own language and you still miss it, The 190 nation UN "thinks" they are "criminals", I guess the whole world is wrong....wood for trees you said.
Quote:
yet why do criminals carry guns because cops carry guns and if your gonna go down you want to go down shooting.
No, criminals carry guns because they are criminals intend on doing bad things, just like Iran. Cops carry guns to protect them selves and the public at large.
Quote:
yet it is in your constitution as a right to bare arms. its no wonder that this is happening when the founding words of your country is based on people allowing to carry weapons.
Yes, unlike you I am a "citizen", not a "subject" but I don't think that explains (fully) why you insist on being an apologist for these evil people.
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozarks
Yes, recognized by the UN who has already passed 2 rounds of sanctions and is currently debating a 3rd,they are world wide sponsors of terrorists, Hamas & Hesbol to name two.
For a long time there were the only democracy in the middle east, civilized society should be supported.
:D:D The 2 counties have been allies for over 50 years.
Standing up for what's right causes problems sometimes
Like defending themselves ? they built a wall so Palatines couldn't kill them, what happens, the Palations spend their time killing each other
Their kicking ass just fine on their own:thumbsup:
Treating their arab citizens like 2nd class citizens is civilized? Drawing their map to take all water sources from Palestine is civilized? Israel has no intention of making peace. Their goal is to get all arabs and Palestinians off their soil.
America comes first, not Israel. Too many domestic problems that need to be solved. America should not be responsible for administrating and monitoring republics. With all the economic turmoil, increasing inflation, do we really need to subsidize Israel's security situation, so they can have a pure jewish state?
Standing for what's right? So was going to war with Germany was wrong? Other than implementing the final solution, and taking over other countries, there is no difference between the situation in Germany and Israel.
If the jews want to create their own state, there's alot of land in the Antarctic. Until that day, they must do more to reach peace with their neighbors. Obviously, that's not their intention.
It's funny you say, they been doing fine on their "own." Let's see how they well they do without American aid?
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
It's pretty easy to criticize something, like Israeli politics, but criticism without any constructive suggestions on how to rectify the perceived problems is really just posturing. Reading many of the above posts, it would seem that some people have a problem with the very existence of Israel, as they have done nothing but condemn Israel; barely leaving the door open to any other solutions to their grievances other than that Israel should just disappear.
While I could spend hours typing criticism of Israeli politics, I would still defend their right to exist. It seems like much of the above debate is skirting that one basic issue; whether or not Israel has the right to exist. Those who question Israel's right to exist should have the courage to do so openly, and debate that issue instead of dancing around the subject.
To those who want to take the politically correct position of kissing muslim ass, I would say that, at this point in time, Islam has absolutely no defense for its existence. It is not acceptable for some members of a society (and Islam is a society) to turn a blind eye to the evil of another segment of their society, do nothing to stop the evil, and then claim that they are good people That's total bullshit. Until all muslims unite to stop the evil within their religion, they have no right to exist in even the quasi-civilized societies of the world. Islam brings with it barbaric seventh-century values that have no place in today's world. The fact that many muslims are good people does not give them the right to tacitly support a scourge upon the world. In that respect, almost all muslims are guilty of aiding and abetting the fanatics within their ranks.
JMO
PC :smokin:
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by PharmaCan
The fact that many muslims are good people does not give them the right to tacitly support a scourge upon the world. In that respect, almost all muslims are guilty of aiding and abetting the fanatics within their ranks.
You usually bring up good points, and a good argument, but on this statement you are so wrong it hurts. Evangelical Christianity is not much different. The real thing about Islam is that Islam is actually battling against itself. The Islamic Extremists wage war against the "fake muslims," because they believe that their version of Islam has become too westernized. So no, almost all muslims are not guilty of aiding and abetting the fanatics within their ranks. In fact, the extremist version of Islam is actually a minority among the rest. What you say is a baseless generalization which I'm sure you yourself can see.
Like I said, Islam mostly fights against itself. This is well-known.
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by mfqr
You usually bring up good points, and a good argument, but on this statement you are so wrong it hurts. Evangelical Christianity is not much different. The real thing about Islam is that Islam is actually battling against itself. The Islamic Extremists wage war against the "fake muslims," because they believe that their version of Islam has become too westernized. So no, all muslims are not guilty of aiding and abetting the fanatics within their ranks. That is a baseless generalization which I'm sure you yourself can see.
Like I said, Islam mostly fights against itself. This is well-known.
You are correct indeed, the Sunnis(majority) and the Shi`ites.
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert and Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas arrived in Washington for the Annapolis talks which was also attended by US intelligence; a intel officer who had for several years been giving the US intelligence of Iran's nuclear program. The next day after the Annapolis talks this intelligence officer immediately switched his tune to "IRAN HAS NO NUCLEAR PROGRAM". This intel officer changed his mind because of results he wanted were not obtained at the Annapolis conference.
So the person crying IRAN NUKE program for the past 4 or 5 years suddenly switches his statement 1 day after the talks when things didnt go his way.
It isnt Bush or the neo-cons doing this folks
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by thcbongman
America should not be responsible for administrating and monitoring republics.
Isreal is a sovereign State we don't"administrating and monitoring"
anything
Quote:
have a pure jewish state?
Are you also opposed to pure Arab States ?
Quote:
]
Standing for what's right? So was going to war with Germany was wrong? Other than implementing the final solution, and taking over other countries, there is no difference between the situation in Germany and Israel.
Is that all,:rolleyes: do you know what the word
"obtuse" means ?
Quote:
If the jews want to create their own state, there's alot of land in the Antarctic.
They already have state called Israel, created by the UN
Quote:
It's funny you say, they been doing fine on their "own." Let's see how they well they do without American aid?
America gives money to lots of countries, and Israel will continue to be one of them.
Do you realize what anti-semitic bigoted things you post ? or are you simple repeating things you have heard ?
If you wish to debate fine but, regardless of what we say 3 things are going to happen.
1 Iraq will be a free country with an elected Government.
2 Iran (like Syria) will not be allowed to create a nuclear weapon
3 Israel will make peace when,
A The majority of Palestinians (who want peace by the way) rise up and kick the murdering thugs (hamas & fatah) out
B Form a civilian authority, sit down and negotiate, then there will be a Palestine and a "chance" for peace.
Remember, you heard it here on Cannibus.com 1st :thumbsup:
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozarks
Isreal is a sovereign State we don't"administrating and monitoring"
anything
Are you also opposed to pure Arab States ?
Is that all,:rolleyes: do you know what the word
"obtuse" means ?
They already have state called Israel, created by the UN
America gives money to lots of countries, and Israel will continue to be one of them.
Do you realize what anti-semitic bigoted things you post ? or are you simple repeating things you have heard ?
If you wish to debate fine but, regardless of what we say 3 things are going to happen.
1 Iraq will be a free country with an elected Government.
2 Iran (like Syria) will not be allowed to create a nuclear weapon
3 Israel will make peace when,
A The majority of Palestinians (who want peace by the way) rise up and kick the murdering thugs (hamas & fatah) out
B Form a civilian authority, sit down and negotiate, then there will be a Palestine and a "chance" for peace.
Remember, you heard it here on Cannibus.com 1st :thumbsup:
Any argument that in opposition to the policies of Israel is "anti-semantic?" Grow the hell up. This issue is pretty personal because of your roots. Otherwise, you wouldn't throw something out there so slanderous and insulting.
If America does not administer and monitor the situation, why are we in the middle of this Israel-Palestinian conflict? Why is the USA involved in conflict resolution? So when you say "they don't monitor anything," it's a load of crap. America has spies in Israel and Israel has spies on them.
Arab areas in Israel are not developed properly, have faulty, unmaintained infrastructure, and access to water resources denied, schools underfunded In the Israeli city, their infrastructure and development is incredibly maintained, and jewish citizens have access to the best of the best. Obtuse? Think not.
It's funny how you throw all this insults. I did nothing to insult you, so stop with your emotional dramatic branding shit.
How Arabs fare as a whole society is an entirely different issue to the policies that Israel perpetuate. Just because they are wrong in many issues doesn't mean Israel is right in their justification to their actions. None of the Arab states were formed under the assumption that everyone must be an Arab. If arabs operate in the same lines of racism as Israel, they shouldn't get aid either.
Yes you are right, America gives plenty of money to different countries. One thing I don't agree with giving money to a society that segregates it's arab citizens, and treats them so poorly.
In my opinion, none of the countries in the middle east should be given aid other than Iraq, because we utterly destroyed that country and must help them rebuild.
1 will be true. US isn't leaving Iraq, mega-bases are established there for years to come. We will develop a strong economic partnership which will benefit both countries for years to come. While I do not agree on the moral reasons for war, I acknowledge the economic benefits of the Iraqi war.
2 will be true as well. The Iran threat has been exaggerated, while they are able to extract uranium, they aren't close to making a nuclear bomb. The situation should be dealt through multi-national combination of diplomacy, and sanctions. There is no need to throw threats until there is irrefutable proof that Iran is *this close* to a nuclear bomb.
3 will not happen until Israel starts treating it's arab citizens equally to their own. Palestinians will rise if they realize Israel isn't racist, and treat similar race equally, then this majority you speak up would have a reason to rise: for prosperity, for everyone to live in peace, and live a high-quality life.
There's a load of propaganda being perpetuated by Hamas and Fatah. The fact Hamas was elected by a majority is a reflection of how Israel is handling the situation. Not well I might add.
As for Pharmacam who believes I was skirting the issue of Israel's right to exist, I'll address it right now. I believe forming the state of Israel was a mistake. However, this mistake cannot be retracted, and they have a right to exist. Simply not to get subsidized security from the US. Which is simply my entire point.
As for your point in kissing Muslim ass, I don't take sides with either one. I agree with you the barbarism on their culture. However, before you accuse me of posturizing, and not offering solutions, I did. No aid for Israel. That's the solution to get America out of the Israel solution, and let them resolve their own situation with the arab world unless Israel's enacts policies that'll facilitate the curb of violence. So point out in my post where I said that Israel should not have a right to exist? Or is this a mere acknowledgment of how dependent Israel is on the US?
The US should do everything to minimize involvement in the middle east.
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by mfqr
You usually bring up good points, and a good argument, but on this statement you are so wrong it hurts. Evangelical Christianity is not much different. The real thing about Islam is that Islam is actually battling against itself. The Islamic Extremists wage war against the "fake muslims," because they believe that their version of Islam has become too westernized. So no, almost all muslims are not guilty of aiding and abetting the fanatics within their ranks. In fact, the extremist version of Islam is actually a minority among the rest. What you say is a baseless generalization which I'm sure you yourself can see.
Like I said, Islam mostly fights against itself. This is well-known.
mfgr - I truly believe that all religious societies have an obligation to "police" their members and clergy. The perpetration of evil, though, is not limited to muslims - they just happen to have been the topic of discussion here. Personally, I think that all religions are inherently evil.
PC :smokin:
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by thcbongman
While I do not agree on the moral reasons for war, I acknowledge the economic benefits of the Iraqi war.
ROFLMAO - Which economic benefits would those be? The $100/barrel oil or our trillion dollar debt?
PC :smokin:
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by thcbongman
Any argument that in opposition to the policies of Israel is "anti-semantic?" Grow the hell up. This issue is pretty personal because of your roots. Otherwise, you wouldn't throw something out there so slanderous and insulting.
So you don't really understand what you are saying, and you assume I'm a Jew:D
Quote:
If America does not administer and monitor the situation, why are we in the middle of this Israel-Palestinian conflict? Why is the USA involved in conflict resolution?
The US is trying to broker a peace deal to stop the killing, you are opposed to that too, I see.
Quote:
So when you say "they don't monitor anything," it's a load of crap. America has spies in Israel and Israel has spies on them.
Every country has spies,now who needs to "grow up"
Quote:
Arab areas in Israel are not developed properly, have faulty, unmaintained infrastructure, and access to water resources denied, schools underfunded In the Israeli city, their infrastructure and development is incredibly maintained, and jewish citizens have access to the best of the best. Obtuse? Think not.
It's called "corruption" within the PLO the world has given BILLIONS upon BILLIONS to the Palestinian Authority for roads,water, economic development etc.
So,you are simply repeating things you have been told. Even the Palestinian Authority acknowledges the corruption.
Quote:
It's funny how you throw all this insults. I did nothing to insult you, so stop with your emotional dramatic branding shit.
Anyone so obtuse to compare the murder of 6 million people by the nazis, to whats going on in Israel/Gaza Strip/west Bank today should be insulted, publicly and often.
Quote:
If arabs operate in the same lines of racism as Israel, they shouldn't get aid either.
They do, thats why jews don't live in arab countries, the arabs kill them.
Quote:
I acknowledge the economic benefits of the Iraqi war.
There are none.
Quote:
The situation should be dealt through multi-national combination of diplomacy, and sanctions.
That's whats happening.
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
TEHRAN (Reuters) - Iran will not halt uranium enrichment even with delivery of fuel from Russia for its first nuclear power plant, a senior Iranian official said on Monday, adding he could not yet confirm Iran had received the fuel.
"There is no talk of halting enrichment. Nothing is related to freezing enrichment. The delivery (of fuel) is not in the framework of the (U.N.) resolutions or the framework of talks," the senior official told Reuters.
Asked if Iran would halt enrichment under any condition, he said: "No, not at all."
front page drudge.....Im just saying
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
just read all this thread...quite interesting, but what i really don't understand, is why is iran a 'criminal'?
even if, and its a big if, they do have nuclear weapons, what are they gonna do with them?
they're not stupid, they know that if they used a nuclear weapon on anyone, then everyone would smack down hard on their candy asses. their country would be destroyed if they used one. they're not gonna use it even if they do have one.
which is why i don't get why the US feels it has to get involved when really its not a huge problem and not really much to do with them *coughs* Oil *cough*
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by greg420
just read all this thread...quite interesting, but what i really don't understand, is why is iran a 'criminal'?
even if, and its a big if, they do have nuclear weapons, what are they gonna do with them?
they're not stupid, they know that if they used a nuclear weapon on anyone, then everyone would smack down hard on their candy asses. their country would be destroyed if they used one. they're not gonna use it even if they do have one.
which is why i don't get why the US feels it has to get involved when really its not a huge problem and not really much to do with them *coughs* Oil *cough*
While the Iranian government is no good either, America is acting shameful and is acting the 'criminal' in this case. Meddling in the internal affairs of foreign nations and threatening World War! We continue to isolate ourselves and upset the world climate with neo-con rhetoric and threatening more war - this sequential war garbage. And the lie of century is perpetrated by the rogue criminals in our government. Iran's President Did Not Say "Israel must be wiped off the map". And yet the Bought and Paid for Media continue to spew these lies! And we all know Israel has enough nuclear capability to defend themselves and destroy half the globe. The US gets involved to secure power and the fuel of for our pretend prosperity, and, as the PNAC agenda itself states, spread peace through strength. Not to mention, the elitists agenda is only perpetrated by the strength of the American Empire.
RP08
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozarks
So you don't really understand what you are saying, and you assume I'm a Jew:D
The US is trying to broker a peace deal to stop the killing, you are opposed to that too, I see.
Every country has spies,now who needs to "grow up"
It's called "corruption" within the PLO the world has given BILLIONS upon BILLIONS to the Palestinian Authority for roads,water, economic development etc.
So,you are simply repeating things you have been told. Even the Palestinian Authority acknowledges the corruption.
Anyone so obtuse to compare the murder of 6 million people by the nazis, to whats going on in Israel/Gaza Strip/west Bank today should be insulted, publicly and often.
They do, thats why jews don't live in arab countries, the arabs kill them.
There are none.
That's whats happening.
I applaud you for your intellectual dishonesty. You would make an excellent politician.
You accuse me of hating jews because of the position I desire for the US to take on Israel, isolationism. This equates to hating jews? Can you point out where I wanted jews to die? Or discriminate against them?
That's like me saying your racist against muslims because of the positions you take. Not only is there no foundation, it's simply idiotic to play the "prejudice" card in a debate. Don't like their opinion? Smear them as a bigot. Classy.
I only assume you are a jew because you threw out such a slanderous term and you felt offended. Perhaps you used this word in too many debates that you lost sense of this powerful accusation. In fact, I remember pointing this out to you when you accused someone else of being anti-semantic. It's safe to say if I went through your history, you threw out this term plenty of times.
But you seem to not get my argument and go straight to the anti-semantic card. Let me boldface it for you. The US should not be involved with any country in the Middle East with the exception of Iraq and for trade. That includes being a major player in brokering peace deals. This does not equate me not wanting peace between Israel and Palestine. There are domestic issues in America that need to be solved, especially on the economic front. The UN should take a more active role in the negotiations, and another country that bears an attitude towards peace take over. US involvement is a little more than figurehead, considering the positions they take towards foreign policy. All the progress made under Clinton ceded when Bush came to office. US involvement is not the answer.
When you mention that all countries have spies, you contradict your initial point that the US takes no position in administering and monitoring other countries activities. Rather, you choose to further slander me with a direct personal attack. Do you usually lose track of your arguments? Just because they monitor other countries means I'm oppose to having intelligence agencies? Do you really see things so black-white?
Your point on your Palestinian Authority is invalid. I'm refering to Arab Israeli citizens, which the PLO has no authority over, Israel does. And boy do they mistreat them. Everyone knows the PLO is corrupt. You don't seem to recognize the corruption on Israel. Which only strengthens my position on why the US should not be involved with this mess.
You also don't seem to recognize the rampant racism in Israel. When I compared this racism to the nazis the comparison. I should specify the era before kristelnacht happened. The climate is no different, jews were denied access to infrastructure, and were treated like 2nd class citizens. Much of the policy of Israel was inspired upon the suffering they suffered in Nazi Germany. Violence committed against arabs in the Israeli population. I could predict what your next argument would be, "oh so you want the jews to be bombed by palestinians?" Absolutely not, but I simply don't condone these actions perpetuated by either side.
And to the point where some arabs are racism against jews, thanks captain obvious, tell me something I didn't know. So it goes back to the consistant point in my argument: we should not administer aid to any of these middle eastern countries except Iraq.
And you say the Iraqi war didn't bring any economic benefits? Damn you are sure naive. If this country had no oil, do you honesty think the US would come save the day? Look no further than a 7 year sample on the US economic data. Notice the downward trend from 2003 up until the precise moment Bush decided let's go into Iraq. Then notice it steadily climbing. Using war as a economic stimulus. Gosh, wouldn't that qualify as a economic benefit? Why were companies happy that we went into Iraq? Simply there is money to be made!! 2nd, America helped build a pipeline to get oil out of Iraq. I wonder why? Ah.....secure resources. Partnership with Iraq so we can have priority over the resources. Then when the violence in Iraq dies down: Reconstruction contracts, potential economic development in Iraq. Foreign investment. What a concept. There is plenty of cash to be made on Iraq. The downside to this of course is a weakening dollar, decreasing purchasing power. If Bush didn't go into Iraq, America was headed into a recession. He kept the economy afloat for a while longer.
To the point where "that's what they are already doing." Yes, but minus the US would be a lot cooler.
The alliance with Israel has caused nothing but trouble in bringing anti-American sentiment around the world. In Europe they report both sides of the crimes committed by both Palestine and Israel. And they stay out of it. That's what the US should do, and let someone else take over. There are bigger priorities the US should deal with, rather than give Aid to Israel.
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by thcbongman
I applaud you for your intellectual dishonesty. You would make an excellent politician.
You accuse me of hating jews because of the position I desire for the US to take on Israel, isolationism. This equates to hating jews? Can you point out where I wanted jews to die? Or discriminate against them?
That's like me saying your racist against muslims because of the positions you take. Not only is there no foundation, it's simply idiotic to play the "prejudice" card in a debate. Don't like their opinion? Smear them as a bigot. Classy.
I only assume you are a jew because you threw out such a slanderous term and you felt offended. Perhaps you used this word in too many debates that you lost sense of this powerful accusation. In fact, I remember pointing this out to you when you accused someone else of being anti-semantic. It's safe to say if I went through your history, you threw out this term plenty of times.
But you seem to not get my argument and go straight to the anti-semantic card. Let me boldface it for you. The US should not be involved with any country in the Middle East with the exception of Iraq and for trade. That includes being a major player in brokering peace deals. This does not equate me not wanting peace between Israel and Palestine. There are domestic issues in America that need to be solved, especially on the economic front. The UN should take a more active role in the negotiations, and another country that bears an attitude towards peace take over. US involvement is a little more than figurehead, considering the positions they take towards foreign policy. All the progress made under Clinton ceded when Bush came to office. US involvement is not the answer.
When you mention that all countries have spies, you contradict your initial point that the US takes no position in administering and monitoring other countries activities. Rather, you choose to further slander me with a direct personal attack. Do you usually lose track of your arguments? Just because they monitor other countries means I'm oppose to having intelligence agencies? Do you really see things so black-white?
Your point on your Palestinian Authority is invalid. I'm refering to Arab Israeli citizens, which the PLO has no authority over, Israel does. And boy do they mistreat them. Everyone knows the PLO is corrupt. You don't seem to recognize the corruption on Israel. Which only strengthens my position on why the US should not be involved with this mess.
You also don't seem to recognize the rampant racism in Israel. When I compared this racism to the nazis the comparison. I should specify the era before kristelnacht happened. The climate is no different, jews were denied access to infrastructure, and were treated like 2nd class citizens. Much of the policy of Israel was inspired upon the suffering they suffered in Nazi Germany. Violence committed against arabs in the Israeli population. I could predict what your next argument would be, "oh so you want the jews to be bombed by palestinians?" Absolutely not, but I simply don't condone these actions perpetuated by either side.
And to the point where some arabs are racism against jews, thanks captain obvious, tell me something I didn't know. So it goes back to the consistant point in my argument: we should not administer aid to any of these middle eastern countries except Iraq.
And you say the Iraqi war didn't bring any economic benefits? Damn you are sure naive. If this country had no oil, do you honesty think the US would come save the day? Look no further than a 7 year sample on the US economic data. Notice the downward trend from 2003 up until the precise moment Bush decided let's go into Iraq. Then notice it steadily climbing. Using war as a economic stimulus. Gosh, wouldn't that qualify as a economic benefit? Why were companies happy that we went into Iraq? Simply there is money to be made!! 2nd, America helped build a pipeline to get oil out of Iraq. I wonder why? Ah.....secure resources. Partnership with Iraq so we can have priority over the resources. Then when the violence in Iraq dies down: Reconstruction contracts, potential economic development in Iraq. Foreign investment. What a concept. There is plenty of cash to be made on Iraq. The downside to this of course is a weakening dollar, decreasing purchasing power. If Bush didn't go into Iraq, America was headed into a recession. He kept the economy afloat for a while longer.
To the point where "that's what they are already doing." Yes, but minus the US would be a lot cooler.
The alliance with Israel has caused nothing but trouble in bringing anti-American sentiment around the world. In Europe they report both sides of the crimes committed by both Palestine and Israel. And they stay out of it. That's what the US should do, and let someone else take over. There are bigger priorities the US should deal with, rather than give Aid to Israel.
QFT +rep
Are you in a debating team man?:jointsmile:
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by L Rag
QFT +rep
Are you in a debating team man?:jointsmile:
Nope, but thanks for the compliment! I just enjoying debating. Might be premature to compliment tho! I'm waiting for Ozark, this is only starting to heat up. :)
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by PharmaCan
mfgr - I truly believe that all religious societies have an obligation to "police" their members and clergy. The perpetration of evil, though, is not limited to muslims - they just happen to have been the topic of discussion here. Personally, I think that all religions are inherently evil.
PC :smokin:
And I would agree with you on that, except for the policing part... because I'm not exactly sure what you mean by that. I do agree with you on the part of all religions being inherently evil... at least that is how it is used. These Christian leaders, Muslim leaders, etc, are all taking advantage of people's ignorance. The only religion (and actually, some would say it's not a religion) I think is inherently good and peaceful would be Buddhism. The Buddhist monks in Tibet have never retaliated against China for its tyrannical reign over Tibet, mostly against the Buddhist monks. They always have remained peaceful.
I think Christianity and Islam actually oppresses the spiritual being (mostly Christianity, though, as I see it), as opposed to releasing it and letting it thrive. Buddhism, however, focuses on letting it thrive, to become enlightened.
The fundamentalist Christians are possibly the most ignorant people I've seen... it's a huge cult... they even brainwash their kids with this shit from the beginning. Complete indoctrination, to the point where the children cannot even begin to imagine a life without a higher being, and to the point where the child is completely ignorant about other views on life. Mental enslavement. That is how I see it.
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by thcbongman
I applaud you for your intellectual dishonesty. You would make an excellent politician.
You accuse me of hating jews because of the position I desire for the US to take on Israel, isolationism. This equates to hating jews? Can you point out where I wanted jews to die? Or discriminate against them?
I haven't "accused" you of anything, except not knowing the the difference between mass murder and self defense, and being a bigot.
Quote:
That's like me saying your racist against muslims because of the positions you take. Not only is there no foundation, it's simply idiotic to play the "prejudice" card in a debate. Don't like their opinion? Smear them as a bigot. Classy.
Quote:
If the jews want to create their own state, there's alot of land in the Antarctic.
^^^^
YOU
You are a bigot, look at your posts, take out the word jew and insert any other word, black, gay, disabled, take your pick.
Quote:
I only assume you are a jew because you threw out such a slanderous term and you felt offended. Perhaps you used this word in too many debates that you lost sense of this powerful accusation.
In fact, I remember pointing this out to you when you accused someone else of being anti-semantic. It's safe to say if I went through your history, you threw out this term plenty of times.
I call a spade a spade, and these people, like you don't like it.
Quote:
But you seem to not get my argument and go straight to the anti-semantic card. Let me boldface it for you. The US should not be involved with any country in the Middle East with the exception of Iraq and for trade. That includes being a major player in brokering peace deals. This does not equate me not wanting peace between Israel and Palestine.
I get it, I just think you are wrong, we are supporting a peace and democracy in the region.
Quote:
All the progress made under Clinton ceded when Bush came to office. US involvement is not the answer.
What progress ? Arafat WALK AWAY and refused to sign the deal
Quote:
When you mention that all countries have spies, you contradict your initial point that the US takes no position in administering and monitoring other countries activities.
Perhaps a dictionary would help, spying has nothing to do with "Administrating or monitoring".
Quote:
You also don't seem to recognize the rampant racism in Israel. When I compared this racism to the nazis the comparison. I should specify the era before kristelnacht happened. The climate is no different, jews were denied access to infrastructure, and were treated like 2nd class citizens. Much of the policy of Israel was inspired upon the suffering they suffered in Nazi Germany. Violence committed against arabs in the Israeli population. I could predict what your next argument would be, "oh so you want the jews to be bombed by palestinians?" Absolutely not, but I simply don't condone these actions perpetuated by either side.
There is difference here that you seem to miss, the jews didn't attack Germaney, Israels policies are based on security not racism
Quote:
And to the point where some arabs are racism against jews, thanks captain obvious, tell me something I didn't know.
Quote:
If arabs operate in the same lines of racism as Israel, they shouldn't get aid either.
^^^^^^^^
You Again
Quote:
And you say the Iraqi war didn't bring any economic benefits? Damn you are sure naive. If this country had no oil, do you honesty think the US would come save the day? Look no further than a 7 year sample on the US economic data. Notice the downward trend from 2003 up until the precise moment Bush decided let's go into Iraq. Then notice it steadily climbing. Using war as a economic stimulus. Gosh, wouldn't that qualify as a economic benefit? Why were companies happy that we went into Iraq? Simply there is money to be made!! 2nd, America helped build a pipeline to get oil out of Iraq. I wonder why?
The only country that Iran exports to is France, we build the pipeline because Iraq needs the money from the oil. 5,10 years from now, I hope you're right.
Right know we're losing money.
Quote:
The alliance with Israel has caused nothing but trouble in bringing anti-American sentiment around the world.
Doing the right thing and standing with our friends has made us stronger and more respected, I don't care if they like us or not, this isn't a popularity contest.
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozarks
You are a bigot, look at your posts, take out the word jew and insert any other word, black, gay, disabled, take your pick.
Is anyone else completely in the dark as to how he is a bigot? You took his sentence completely out of context.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozarks
I get it, I just think you are wrong, we are supporting a peace and democracy in the region.
I dont know how you can say America is supporting peace in the region with a straight face. :wtf:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozarks
Perhaps a dictionary would help, spying has nothing to do with "Administrating or monitoring".
Actually I'd say spying is very similar to monitoring.
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozarks
I haven't "accused" you of anything, except not knowing the the difference between mass murder and self defense, and being a bigot.
^^^^
YOU
You are a bigot, look at your posts, take out the word jew and insert any other word, black, gay, disabled, take your pick.
I call a spade a spade, and these people, like you don't like it.
I get it, I just think you are wrong, we are supporting a peace and democracy in the region.
What progress ? Arafat WALK AWAY and refused to sign the deal
Perhaps a dictionary would help, spying has nothing to do with "Administrating or monitoring".
There is difference here that you seem to miss, the jews didn't attack Germaney, Israels policies are based on security not racism
^^^^^^^^
You Again
The only country that Iran exports to is France, we build the pipeline because Iraq needs the money from the oil. 5,10 years from now, I hope you're right.
Right know we're losing money.
Doing the right thing and standing with our friends has made us stronger and more respected, I don't care if they like us or not, this isn't a popularity contest.
This reply is laughable. My first thought of coming back was you'd provide an eloquent argument on why America should support Israel.
Instead, you provide more ignorance and shit.
Your only evidence that I'm a bigot is based on a statement that if jews want their own country, there plenty of land in Antarctic. The creation of Israel was for these displaced jews. How does this make me a bigot? When the British drew the map of Palestine, it was a mistake. They failed to recognize the history of the region and the conflict. Solution? Move somewhere else. This is a bigot statement? This only confirms my initial thoughts, that you simply smear people you disagree with.
You claim you call a spade a spade. But you are unable to provide more ample evidence. Simply looking a sample of your posts, you swung this accusation on practically everybody that disagreed with you on your position on Israel.
The US is not capable of supporting peace and democracy in the middle east. 1. We are not a peaceful nation, we are aggressive, and 2. We are not a democracy. The only scent of democracy we have are at the local level, when the population votes on bonds and referendums. That's it. Otherwise we are a constitutional republic.
The progress you don't seem to recognize? That while there was violence there was far less than there is today. Plus relations between Israel and Palestine could not be more unstable.
You should really stop with this 1-line shit, and articulate your points. You are way too emotionally invested in this argument that you forgot to remember that monitoring is apart of spying. So is administrating since you have to use the intel to manage the situation. It's time for YOU to look at the dictionary, not I.
And to inform you because you seemed to miss the point on the climate before kristelnacht. Nazis as a state didn't attack jews before this occasion. Apparently your reading comprehension, or knowledge in history sucks. Either one, take your pick.
Didn't get the point this reply. You took two statements that did not relate to one another, and again, try to smear me as a hypocrite. You failed miserably. Since the Iranian President made statements wanting to nuke Israel, they shouldn't get aid. However, not all arab countries want to destroy Israel. Countries like the UAE, prosperous, and does not want to destroy Israel. Get that through your thick ass head.
Yes, the US government is losing money. However, I hold a portfolio of some of the companies that benefit from Iraq, and might I add, they performed real well. The reason? They are profiting from the situation. Sometimes to make money, you lose a little bit in the beginning. It's all about calculating risk.
And obviously, you'd rather be allied with a few, than get along with many. I don't see any countries that are respecting us, made us stronger. All I see is a weak dollar, and a military that is over stretching it's resources, has struggling to recruit. Is this what you call "stronger?"
Now, I will warn you now. If I see a reply like this again, without any scent of eloquence, I will not respond. I will not waste any more of my energy to debate a person who put in a quarter-ass effort in his reply, and made too many emotional errors. I know you are capable of more than 1-line bullshit.
The Iran Charade So They Lied Again
Well, this thread has crossed lines. Personal attacks are NOT permitted on the forums. Don't let the debate get the best of ya.
If a few of ya would like to continue this with cooler heads....start another thread.
Have a good one!:jointsmile:
