Feminism (male input welcomed)

I also wanted to say something to the men...

I sympathize with the ways you are mistreated just as much as I sympathize with anyone else. I realize that men have it really hard in a few ways, such as: being passed over for jobs that are specifically looking for ethnic women (to diversify their employees...this is happening with our police forces), not having people understand that men suffer from as much spousal abuse as women do, getting tougher jail sentences than women for certain offenses (such as sexual harrassment), etc.

These kind of things ARE recognized in feminism...femism is a discussion on ALL KINDS of injustice out there.

True that. In my women's studies class we talk about problems like this, and their causes. I think those issues you brought up are related to the high standards of beauty our society has today. Aside from the medias direct role in that, women are actually largely to blame for those kinds of things as well.

For example, eating disorders are commonly passed down from mother to daughter. A young girl will grow up listening to her mother's negative comments about her weight, and will end up criticizing her own body as well.

Perhaps there is a male root to this all (bear with me here boys), but women are often the ones doing the reinforcement which is the most significant thing imo, because if we keep on reinforcing shit like this it will never stop. One of the biggest thing women need to realize, is their own role in this sort of thing. Women oppress women all the time, without even realizing it. We perpetuate stereotypes on a daily basis, and there is even a large occurrance of violence done to women, by women (very common in the lesbian community). Women can be racist, classist, sexist...all of which contribute to the general oppression many groups face. It's a very complex issue.

I supposed I'd consider myself a feminist, but I really much prefer the term "humanist" instead. I believe in equal rights for all people, not just women. Sure, I believe we need equal pay for equal work. I believe women are intelligent, equal beings. I believe we deserve every consideration other groups get. If that makes me a feminist, then so be it. I'm sorry the concept of feminism ever grew to have a negative connotation, and I strongly disapprove of it as an excuse for male-bashing. Men are wonderful, as are women.

While we're on the subject, I'm a big believer in both femininity and in chivalry. There are black-and-white thinkers out there who might think those concepts can't be compatible with feminism, but I know they can.

By the way, this is the first time I've ever--EVER--seen feminism compared to masochism. That's absurd.

*machoism

I thought she mean masochism! I was reading too fast.

OK, not so absurd. I think I'm the one who qualifies as abusrd now!!

"Machoism" is a new one to me. I've always heard of "machismo," but not "machoism." Good word, though. At least when read correctly! My apologies, Sammie.

I dont find it that absurd, I guess what im trying to say is that sex, religion, and sexual preference should never play a role in your views of judging others or government, as they create a bias for how you should treat others and how others are treated.

If you think about it, if we were all a shemale, all one, there would be none of this unfair treatment of women because you could not compare one sex to another. I support the movement for all to be treated equal, but with the way the government is running, and the strong ties to religion within it (even though some say religion plays no part, it plays a huge part) I cant see these groups completely making a 360 turn on the way things run unless one of them can be elected president and fully correct our flaws in our government. While these groups are a worthwhile cause, My point is that these barriers we have to face shouldnt have been there in the first place, because there is no proof that one sex or race is better than another.

*everythings alright birdie

I know I have already typed a lot in the last hour or so, but I was thinking about Samwhore's usage of this word and I thought I would address it. First off, Sam, I am sure you didn't mean to use tolerance in a negative way- that's why I am going to discuss it.

Tolerance is NOT the answer to equality, or acceptance of people. Tolerance is simply the ability to brush off, or not let a certain thing bother you. You can tolerate homosexuals, for example, by ignoring them and pretending they aren't there and that they don't affect your life. I am sure a lot of homophobes do this. Tolerance does not bring understanding of different perspectives, if anything it just breeds ignorance. What's needed is understanding of different cultures, backgrounds, and identities- tolerance will never achieve this.


ps: Sam, I think we agree on pretty much this whole topic, we just have different views on what it is. You think feminism singles people out, and I think it attempts to bring everyone together....neither of us are right or wrong, many people hold either of those views.

note to self

I mean tolerance exactly by the way you defined it Dutch,


and wb greenjeans!

do u think tolerance is enough though?

ps: gotta go, continue on without me...lol! Im gonna go get high and watch 300!!!