would like opinions on seedling light schedule

roots do all the work and get no credit...:wtf:

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Originally Posted by bigsby

Only real difference being that with 18/6 plant will show their preflower / sex more quickly. In other words, they mature more quickly. That and your electric bills will be lower!

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Totally believable. My biggest plant I have is in 18/6, and just started to show pistils and alternating branches the other day. I bet in 24/0, I wouldnt see any for a long time. Maybe 24/0 would be good for mother plants..?

Im curious to hear more from 24/0 photoperiod growers as well. Id like to hear some stories. haha.

18/6.. Because you will setting yourself up for them to be root-bound before time.

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Originally Posted by GreenThumbDoc

There has been long debate on this issue and I personally think 18/6 is better then 24/0. The obvious reason, a savings in $$ on your electric bill. The other reason is after watching MJ grow indoors in my controlled environment for a very long time, you can observe very subtle but obvious behaviors of the plant. Roughly 2 hours before lights out, my plants start to droop in anticipation for the dark period. Roughly 2 hours before lights on, they perk back up in anticipation for the light period. The reason this happens, since the plant is not Photosynthesizing, it is taking all stored energy (sugars) from the day and moving them to the stem and down to the roots. Though roots grow 24/7, they do a majority of their growing in the dark. From my OWN experience, if you want a strong healthy plant with a strong rootball, a dark period is key. Of course, in 5 minutes somebody here will come along and totally disagree and give their own take. Here is a picture I took of a plant that was only in a 3 gallon container from a 16oz solo cup for SEVEN days. You tell me if this is healthy accelerated root growth or not? :thumbsup:

GTD

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Hello GreenThumbDoc,

I made a promise to myself not to get envolved with the 18/6 vs. 24/0 ever again. This subject used to get kicked around here every few months, now it's every few weeks if not days. IMHO the photoperiod used during vegative growth is more a personal matter, ie: what work's best for the grower in thier particular grow. Even Raphael Mechoulan, the grandfather of cannabinoid reseach, had to do experiments on this subject to prove to colleagues and critics, when they found him using 24/0 vegative growth in some of his studies. He did not show which was better but that 24/0 "did no harm" to the plant and it could go on to flower just like any other photoperiod plant.

But you have made some statement's that defy what I have learned, read in textbooks or scientific papers as to roots and to a plant's funtion.

About 4 years ago now, I enrolled in a local community college as a senior citizen to take a horticultural course, that led to a few more. I had a professor from Rutger's Univ. who I've quoted here before but will repeat now, he stated "While roots grow in the dark, they don't grow WHEN it is dark". In other words roots grow during photosysntheis not during the dark period. It is true that at the root cap, cell division continues during the dark phase, but it is making basically a lubricant (cell layers) for when the main or tap root goes back to growing.

If you would be so kind to steer me to or cite a source for your theroy that roots grow in the dark I would appreciate it, because I don't want to be the one to pass on bad information.

OM

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Originally Posted by oldmac

Hello GreenThumbDoc,

I made a promise to myself not to get envolved with the 18/6 vs. 24/0 ever again. This subject used to get kicked around here every few months, now it's every few weeks if not days. IMHO the photoperiod used during vegative growth is more a personal matter, ie: what work's best for the grower in thier particular grow. Even Raphael Mechoulan, the grandfather of cannabinoid reseach, had to do experiments on this subject to prove to colleagues and critics, when they found him using 24/0 vegative growth in some of his studies. He did not show which was better but that 24/0 "did no harm" to the plant and it could go on to flower just like any other photoperiod plant.

But you have made some statement's that defy what I have learned, read in textbooks or scientific papers as to roots and to a plant's funtion.

About 4 years ago now, I enrolled in a local community college as a senior citizen to take a horticultural course, that led to a few more. I had a professor from Rutger's Univ. who I've quoted here before but will repeat now, he stated "While roots grow in the dark, they don't grow WHEN it is dark". In other words roots grow during photosysntheis not during the dark period. It is true that at the root cap, cell division continues during the dark phase, but it is making basically a lubricant (cell layers) for when the main or tap root goes back to growing.

If you would be so kind to steer me to or cite a source for your theroy that roots grow in the dark I would appreciate it, because I don't want to be the one to pass on bad information.

OM

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Well I am not going to get into a pissing match with ya oldmac, or go into what credentials I have to of made my comment, because on the net, everyone is good looking and highly educated, remember? As for sources, I can simply cite one here on this own website.

Text

During the day, (Lights ON) the plant is collecting and storing light energy, and is using and storing raw materials. The plant is stockpiling raw material, and is charging itâ??s batteriesâ?¦ it is ALSO using raw materials and using the energy it is collecting. Itâ??s building itself, literally putting itself together.

During the day however, the plant is not as efficient at building itself, as it is at night (lights OFF.) It can build itself, but not as quickly.

While the lights are OFF, the plant is using energy and raw materials to build itselfâ?¦. the plant is more efficiently using the raw materials that it stored during the day. The plant is better at transporting and assembling the raw materials.


I didn't want to over complicate things or go into "Dark Reaction" but if you want more technical references, here is a good read:

PHOTOSYNTHESIS

GTD

Hey 'Doc,

I am/was not trying to get into a pissing match with you or asked you about your credentials to grow or make statements. I explained what I was taught and what I have read and I asked you nicely, I thought, to steer me to info on roots growing during the dark phase. I should have edited "or a plants function" cause as I was writing the post I had to re-read what you had written (at my age my reading comprehension is poor sometimes) and realized it was just an oversimplification I did not understand initially. That is way I did not ask you to cite a source for that. Tho you did anyway. :wtf:

The text that you linked, the second paragraph says and I quote;

Many times I've seen posts that "roots grow during the dark". If this was true, the 24/0 photoperiod would result in a plant with a tiny root structure if one at all! We know this is not the case-so how does it actually work?

I've used this same analogy, just recently on another thread. My contention was if roots grow in the dark, how do cuttings make roots, using the accepted 24/0 photoperiod for clonning?

[OK now get ready for my snarky comment]

I admit my reading comprehension is poor at times, but I got an excuse....I'm old. What's yours? :D

[that was just a joke, lighten up]

I look upon these forums as a place to exchange ideas. Ususally it winds up just answering some pretty dumb questions but many threads are actual intelligent conversations. Lately there have been fewer of those.
OM

GreenThumb....
If I were you I would consider myself very lucky to have not been hammered by OM. That was a pretty coarse statement on your part. He definately was not looking to get into a pissing match....but you might have started one. I hope not.

In this debate often there is merit on both sides of the 18/6 or 24hr light periord...

So I throw out the high & low and go with 20/4 from day one to bloom...

They also say plants do not grow in the dark and I'm not to sure about that either. I have two Males under 12/12, T-5's, 1" from the lights at night and every morning there into the lights. So if there not growing there stretching 1" every night, so somethings going on...

At the end of the day all three time sets work, MJ is very adaptable to there current environment...

Hey there WashougalWonder,

I guess I need to work on a more tacfull way of saying, your're wrong. :wtf:

The only reason I did not go off on GTD with his responce to me, was the vaporizer was loaded and on and within easy reach. :thumbsup: It would be nice if he showed up here again, and admit he was wrong about root growth. An apology is optional.

Just the other day I was reading a thread on another board when someone corrected the same misstatement, and least 5 jerks stepped up to say they KNEW roots grow in the dark, but the only reference they could cite was "I read it on/in a post...somewhere". I wasn't looking to start anything with GTD but I did not want to see more bad info spread around.

OM

Hello ZZTops,

That "growth" you see is not actually new vegatation, some of it is due to stalk or stem stretch after the lights go off. Plus plants during the dark phase up take a lot of water (and nutrients with it) that they store in thier leaves and stems for the next photoperiod this adds to stem stretch.

In farming it is refered to as the "corn" effect. Corn often is said to look like it has grown inches overnight, when in reality there was no new vegative growth, just those big stalks stretching and holding lots of water. :)

OM