Heavy fighting in South Ossetia
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dutch Pimp
Georgia doesn't have an Air Force. What were they thinking? The Russian Air Force can lay waste, to that place.....:Tomcat:
Georgia actually has a decent sized airforce along with 2 american f-16's. They also have 20+ Tam Su-25KM Skorpion's. They also have the russian Mil Mi-14 Haze helicopters which are used to destroy submarines. They also make good use of there Elbit Hermes 450's which are unmanned recon planes (UAV). Also have a good ammount of mi-24 Attack helicopters. All of which the russians have 5x the ammount of. Georgia also claims to have shot down 10 russian aircraft (totally plausible). Dutchpimp you are right the bottomline is Russias airforce is much larger and stronger, but Georgia does have a formidable airforce, also the majority trained by US airmen. Also note during the Georgia- Abkhazian civil war Abkhazians Airforce was annihilated by Georgia's until the soviets started flying sorties for them for which the soviet's were instructed to coverup the russian insignia on the planes tails and elsewhere.
Just wanted to note 1 more thing, if you watch the news as you watch the Russian planes attacking ground positions notice the incredible ammount of flares they are firing out the back of there aircraft. Georgia has an estimated 60 sites from which they can launch S-75 Dvina anti-aircraft missles, these are deadly to the russian SU-27's or any other russian plane. I said it before ill say it again, im pissed we are so spread thin because of Iraq, These people are our allies and need our help, I hope US Diplomacy prevails and we help these people out somehow even if its not militarily.
Heavy fighting in South Ossetia
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobPA
These people are our allies and need our help, I hope US Diplomacy prevails and we help these people out somehow even if its not militarily.
The last thing Georgia needs is US diplomacy. If there's anyone to blame here its that dipshit Saakashvili. Everything that's happened so far is his fault completely. I'm not biased though becasue I'm a Georgian, born in Tbilisi. I have family back in Tbilisi and around the country side, and the suffering Saakashvili has caused to our people is criminal. He sent in soldiers to slaughter the South Ossetian's, to gain back a territory that wishes to be free from Georgia. I've said it before and I'll say it again, Georgia needs closer ties with Russia and not the US. Russia is Georgia's sister and neighbor, and we've had this relationship for a long time, yet idiot politicians, especially on Georgia's behalf, prevent any peace from happening. Yes, Russia has taken it too far though, and it's really hurting my family, but it's all the fault of Saakashvili. People need to stop seeing the Russians as the "bad guys", just because Georgia is a close ally of the US. I hope someday my country gets a president who will make peace with Russia.
Heavy fighting in South Ossetia
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobthenuker
The last thing Georgia needs is US diplomacy. If there's anyone to blame here its that dipshit Saakashvili. Everything that's happened so far is his fault completely. I'm not biased though becasue I'm a Georgian, born in Tbilisi. I have family back in Tbilisi and around the country side, and the suffering Saakashvili has caused to our people is criminal. He sent in soldiers to slaughter the South Ossetian's, to gain back a territory that wishes to be free from Georgia. I've said it before and I'll say it again, Georgia needs closer ties with Russia and not the US. Russia is Georgia's sister and neighbor, and we've had this relationship for a long time, yet idiot politicians, especially on Georgia's behalf, prevent any peace from happening. Yes, Russia has taken it too far though, and it's really hurting my family, but it's all the fault of Saakashvili. People need to stop seeing the Russians as the "bad guys", just because Georgia is a close ally of the US. I hope someday my country gets a president who will make peace with Russia.
Sorry but the corrupt Government of Putin and all his EX-KGB cabinet are the bad guys, in my eyes. And as a true Georgian, with a population of 4.5mil over 60% of the population supposedly Supports that "dipshit" Saakashvili, it seems you dont share the views of the rest of your country? And the countless Georgians around the world calling for the US's help. Your country split from Russia for a reason. If the majority of your country wants closer relations to russia, why the big uproar when they are invading your country? Im sorry but your argument dosent have enough facts for me to change my mind about russia and the situation as a whole. Just my opinion though!
Heavy fighting in South Ossetia
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobPA
Sorry but the corrupt Government of Putin and all his EX-KGB cabinet are the bad guys, in my eyes. And as a true Georgian, with a population of 4.5mil over 60% of the population supposedly Supports that "dipshit" Saakashvili, it seems you dont share the views of the rest of your country? And the countless Georgians around the world calling for the US's help. Your country split from Russia for a reason. If the majority of your country wants closer relations to russia, why the big uproar when they are invading your country? Im sorry but your argument dosent have enough facts for me to change my mind about russia and the situation as a whole. Just my opinion though!
Yea man I dig what you're saying, Russia's government is no angel either. I think though that Saakashvili has successfully fucked my country by invading South Ossetia. He promised better relationship with Russia, and talked with Putin about removing the embargo, which all would have helped the economy greatly. Things were looking good, however Saakashvili started getting cocky with his support from the west, and started pushing to have control in South Ossetia. I curse the Russian government for taking things far passed South Ossetia like they're doing now. What's done is done, and cannot be undone. Georgia's in chaos, thousands of people are dead. The fact is NOW Georgia does need help, which is why most Georgian's are calling for the US to help, since all hell has broken loose. Georgia does have it's own identity, a fact all Georgians are proud of, but it can't turn it's back on Russia, much of the life there depends on good relations with Russia.
Heavy fighting in South Ossetia
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobthenuker
Yea man I dig what you're saying, Russia's government is no angel either. I think though that Saakashvili has successfully fucked my country by invading South Ossetia. He promised better relationship with Russia, and talked with Putin about removing the embargo, which all would have helped the economy greatly. Things were looking good, however Saakashvili started getting cocky with his support from the west, and started pushing to have control in South Ossetia. I curse the Russian government for taking things far passed South Ossetia like they're doing now. What's done is done, and cannot be undone. Georgia's in chaos, thousands of people are dead. The fact is NOW Georgia does need help, which is why most Georgian's are calling for the US to help, since all hell has broken loose. Georgia does have it's own identity, a fact all Georgians are proud of, but it can't turn it's back on Russia, much of the life there depends on good relations with Russia.
I have always been intrigued by "Georgia" even back as far as its Midevil History, which is why i have been following this story so closely. I have always seen Georgians as a people with a pair of brass balls because of how they always stood up for themselves against the russians. I hope that if Putin continues the invasion and comes at the country on both fronts SOMEONE will help the Georgians militarily. Heart is with you, your family and your country man..
Heavy fighting in South Ossetia
Isn't the situation a lot like when the southern states of America wanted to split with the north ?
If that's the case would it mean that Georgia is taking it's lead from them dang yankees ? :wtf:
Or like when them pesky Scots didn't want to be ruled by England , we got out the weapons and beat the crap out of them till they saw sense. :thumbsup:
To all the Jocks out there , please don't take offense , I am only joking.
Seriously though
I know Ossetia wants to be free of Georgia.
Georgia fired first .
Russia would appear to be preventing Georgia from depriving the Ossetians of want they want.
The west gets involved in to many battles that do not concern them. :mad:
Heavy fighting in South Ossetia
Quote:
Originally Posted by psychocat
Isn't the situation a lot like when the southern states of America wanted to split with the north ?
If that's the case would it mean that Georgia is taking it's lead from them dang yankees ? :wtf:
Or like when them pesky Scots didn't want to be ruled by England , we got out the weapons and beat the crap out of them till they saw sense. :thumbsup:
To all the Jocks out there , please don't take offense , I am only joking.
Seriously though
I know Ossetia wants to be free of Georgia.
Georgia fired first .
Russia would appear to be preventing Georgia from depriving the Ossetians of want they want.
The west gets involved in to many battles that do not concern them. :mad:
You know about the major pipeline that runs through Georgia right? A location that we get millions of barrels of oil from. If the pipelines hit, Oil will instantly skyrocket, that is guaranteed. And americans will continue to bitch about prices. The bottomline is we have a vested interest in that country, I cannot say the same for Iraq, they sell there oil to china anyway. For once this does concern us and people who wish to live in a free democracy unlike the corrupt Russians. Maybe it was wrong for Georgia to attack first, but its like being in the US as you said, and the south splitting, They need to become sovereign russian soil (obviously thats whats gonna happen if most of them are russian citizens anyway) Georgia was just trying to save there "union" just as we once were, although the situation is not NEARLY the same by principal.
Heavy fighting in South Ossetia
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobPA
You know about the major pipeline that runs through Georgia right? A location that we get millions of barrels of oil from. If the pipelines hit, Oil will instantly skyrocket, that is guaranteed. And americans will continue to bitch about prices. The bottomline is we have a vested interest in that country, I cannot say the same for Iraq, they sell there oil to china anyway. For once this does concern us and people who wish to live in a free democracy unlike the corrupt Russians. Maybe it was wrong for Georgia to attack first, but its like being in the US as you said, and the south splitting, They need to become sovereign russian soil (obviously thats whats gonna happen if most of them are russian citizens anyway) Georgia was just trying to save there "union" just as we once were, although the situation is not NEARLY the same by principal.
I think it's already been hit a couple of times but still running, but the point remains the same. Now that Russia has been given an excuse to attack, I fear that they will not stop. And the close ties between Georgia and the west amount to squat, because personally I don't think that America or the West will intervene militarily, seeing as how the Russians don't aim to stop. I hope I get proven wrong, but now that Russia is the one of the world's largest oil producer, if not the most (don't quote me on that, not too sure myself), they're quickly gaining power fast. And thanks man for the kind words, somehow though, I think this could have all been avoided :wtf:... You gotta understand though, from the point of view of a common Georgian living in Georgia, a good relationship between Georgia and Russia is much more important than that of Georgia and the west. Russia has too much influence in that area to be ignored, and it was a very delicate relationship hanging on by a thread after the cold war. Even though Georgia is rich in culture, most Georgians are simple people, that raise crops and drink excessively and whatnot. Most of them would not care if their country was in NATO or whatever. It's a beautiful peaceful land...but not anymore. It'll be interesting to see what'll it be like after all this will blow over.
Heavy fighting in South Ossetia
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobthenuker
I think it's already been hit a couple of times but still running, but the point remains the same. Now that Russia has been given an excuse to attack, I fear that they will not stop. And the close ties between Georgia and the west amount to squat, because personally I don't think that America or the West will intervene militarily, seeing as how the Russians don't aim to stop. I hope I get proven wrong, but now that Russia is the one of the world's largest oil producer, if not the most (don't quote me on that, not too sure myself), they're quickly gaining power fast. And thanks man for the kind words, somehow though, I think this could have all been avoided :wtf:... You gotta understand though, from the point of view of a common Georgian living in Georgia, a good relationship between Georgia and Russia is much more important than that of Georgia and the west. Russia has too much influence in that area to be ignored, and it was a very delicate relationship hanging on by a thread after the cold war. Even though Georgia is rich in culture, most Georgians are simple people, that raise crops and drink excessively and whatnot. Most of them would not care if their country was in NATO or whatever. It's a beautiful peaceful land...but not anymore. It'll be interesting to see what'll it be like after all this will blow over.
If we decide to help the georgians militarily, I would probably be the first to enlist(not joking in the least). Did you see the big rally on Fox news today? Thousands of Georgians showed up to rally for freedom, stop of the fighting etc etc, they even had american flags flying everywhere and a english translator.. But you are right, stepping back for a moment and looking at the situation, If georgia wasent ready for the Russians counterattack, they should have never messed with the breakaway Ossetia in the first place. Where I live in PHilly there is an EXTREMELY large russian/georgian population. I am going to take some pics later but you should see some of the things the Georgians are putting on there yards, decorating them with flags, there was a rally earlier today and the cops had to come stop the violence because a group of russians attacked GEorgian protestors. This is a really tough situation for me because I am a libertarian and believe strongly in a non-interventionalist foreign policy, but I believe more that we need to help the people who help us, they helped us in Iraq, even though it was only 2000 Soldiers its the principal that they stood by us so I fully believe that if Russia continues and Invades Georgia and tries to out its democracy that the PEOPLE of Georgia voted for, we should help them Militarily. However with the news posted above this post about us sending more to the persian gulf, its looking more and more of an unrealistic situation in terms of us helping Georgia militarily. Once again I wish your family and your people the best bob. And your right 1 of the pipelines has been hit but it was not the BP pipeline(the one where we get a lot of our oil from, I even have a BP credit card, lol).
Heavy fighting in South Ossetia
[YOUTUBE]UfA5XfxQOPw[/YOUTUBE]
Always good to get both sides of the story remember (something the media is incapable of)
