PANORAMA: Scientology

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Originally Posted by Staurm

I think there is a marked difference between scientology and falun gong though. Falun gong followers seem free (in spirit and mind anyway), perfectly harmless, pacifist, yet horrendously persecuted. Whereas scientologists -from what I can gather from a very limited knowledge of what really its about- on the other hand strike me as being a most oppressive and patriarchal organisation.

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That is certainly the image that Falun Gong wants you to see. And certainly the image that our anti-China media like to portray. But many cult experts disagree, as do most Chinese.

My Mother-In-Law, a Chinese citizen who still lives in China, got mixed up with the Falun Gong. She got pretty screwed up metally/emotionally, gave away a pretty large portion of the families saving to the Falun Gong, and had serious helth problems after being advised by the Falun Gong to stop taking her medications and let whatever it is they believe in take over. 5 years ago she would have sworn up and down that the Falun Gong was the greatest thing around but now she's happily spit on them if given the chance.

Li Hongzhi, the leader of the Falun Gong, lives a pretty lush life in New York with several houses there and in New Jersey. So, let's see...filthy rich leader, followed by folks who give up their lifes savings and ignore conventional wisdon like taking their medication because it is against their beliefs teachings. Hmmm, something smells a bit cultish to me.

Really? So who is kidnapping these people and torturing them, the Falun Gong or the Chinese Government, or is that their propaganda?

I've been to INdia so I learned to form a judgement on these things, I know the difference between Omkareshwar and Pune. The Chinese people I've seen leafletting seem harmless, as did the ones in the buddhist restaurant I used to eat in several years ago.

I don't think society likes odd behaviour anymore.

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Originally Posted by ukmonkey

OI LIP stop high jacking my thread.... pun not intended.

checkout the vid of the guy going apeshit when the reporter says "cult"... I thought that was the truly hilarious bit

YouTube - BBC Panorama: "Scientology and Me"

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Now i watched that video again, i have come to the conclusion i'd beat that moron down - "I cant be held responcible for my actions"

But the time he'd said that he'd be liquidised if i was there./

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Originally Posted by ukmonkey

Anyone watch it / following it in the news?

Thoughts?

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BBC standards are really slipping, what happened to objective journalism?

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Originally Posted by Staurm

Really? So who is kidnapping these people and torturing them, the Falun Gong or the Chinese Government, or is that their propaganda?

I've been to INdia so I learned to form a judgement on these things, I know the difference between Omkareshwar and Pune. The Chinese people I've seen leafletting seem harmless, as did the ones in the buddhist restaurant I used to eat in several years ago.

I don't think society likes odd behaviour anymore.

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For the most part the followers of the Falun Gong are harmless. But so are the followers of most cults. I think that, in most cases, "victims" might be a better desecription than "followers". Just good hearted people that become brainwashed. These people honestly believe what their "religion" teaches no matter how outlandish it may be. I really can't fault them for anything more than being weak minded. It's the leaders of these cults that are to blame.

As for the perscution of Falun Gong members, some is true and some is propoganda. China's stance on religion is that it is fine as long as it is a normally recognized religion, i.e a branch of Christianity, Buddhism, Hinduism, whatever. They do not tolerate cults, however. They do not want their own version of Jonestown or Waco. So, they tend to crack down on these types of cults.

Being a member of the Falun Gong is a crime. So, what the Falon Gong folks will call "kidnapping", the Chinese call "being arrested". Unfortunately this does often get out of hand. China is a big place with a pretty shaky infrastructure. Their are a lot of corrupt politicians, especially in the less developed provinces, who are power crazed "Boss Hog" types. Kind of like the sherriff if the first Rambo movie. Most of the more brutal prosecution of the Falun Gong happens at the hands of these guys. The Falun Gong has done an incredible job at publicizing these incidents but it is not as widespread as they would want you to believe. The entire time my Mother-in-law was mixed up with them she was never given any grief by the local authorities, nor was anyone else she knew.

In any case, harmless or not, the Falun Gong is definitely a cult. Personally, after seeing what has resulted from certain cults here in the U.S., I'm not so sure that making them illegal, like China does, is such a bad idea.

Making anything illegal is a bad idea. I'm not sure that I agree that even arresting someone and charging them for being a part of a cult is justified in any way. If they are plotting some terrosrist act, then it its justified, otherwise its an infringement of civil liberties, and China does not have a good record of upholding these. The current occupation of Tibet is perhaps the worst example of human rights abuses they are responsible for.

People are brainwashed in all sorts of ways. Most people are brainwashed by capitalism, or democracy.

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Originally Posted by amberler

BBC standards are really slipping, what happened to objective journalism?

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Obwhatsit journathingy?

Not that the BBC really has anywhere left to slip. Besides, I enjoyed this program. I already thought Scientologists were creepy fuckers, and this just backed it up.

P.S. They did actually show some of the Scientologist footage too, and did give them chances to come across as decent human beings. They just failed to take the opportunity.
Anyway, have you noticed how most Scientologists look quite vacant? Their minds have been stolen!

If it looks and smells like a cult, then it probably is...

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Originally Posted by Turtlepik

Obwhatsit journathingy?

Not that the BBC really has anywhere left to slip. Besides, I enjoyed this program. I already thought Scientologists were creepy fuckers, and this just backed it up.

P.S. They did actually show some of the Scientologist footage too, and did give them chances to come across as decent human beings. They just failed to take the opportunity.Anyway, have you noticed how most Scientologists look quite vacant? Their minds have been stolen!

If it looks and smells like a cult, then it probably is...

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It's because they're not decent humans LOL. Take that fuckers! - Ahh, that gave my an invigerating rush of youth.

Wow, I find what the two of you are talking about very interesting O_O While this group does seem kinda cult-ish, I wouldn't support banning them in the U.S. We've seen what making things illegal does to society *cough* and I wouldn't want to give the government the power to choose who is a cult and who is a religion.

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Originally Posted by Fengzi

Which is obvious by the incredible worldwide popularity of English food restaurants. LOL.

Ya do make some mighty good ale though :thumbsup:

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Ahh, but nothing comes close to fish and chips, or roast dinner.

Then you've got pie and mash -

But, we cant forget breakfast can we? A full English is the way to start a day.

Steak and kidney pie is another good one.

Englands got some damn nice food ya know - better that big macs anyhow. :cool: