Global warming

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Originally Posted by Bob the Awesome

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Don't get me wrong, I don't have an issue with avoiding harmful pesticides and other such things, but if you don't understand what genetic modification is you shouldn't be opposing it. Genetic modification has been practiced for centuries, starting with Mendel.

EDIT: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_Borlaug
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NO, did you hear that on a Monsanto ad? because thatâ??s their actual example.

Bob, I respect you and thatâ??s why Iâ??m going to take the time and break this down.

Mendel bred peas,. So what were really talking about is genetic engineering and selective breeding.

I will explain the difference. But I am going to assume some knowledge of evolution, sorry if it confuses.

Genetics info you need to know:
-Phenotype --- is what genes are expressed. Ie. What the organism looks like
-Genotype----- The genetic make up of an organism. Defined by the genes present.
-Gene--- a string of DNA that codes for a particular trait. EG. Eye or hair colour.
-Allele--- different possible options a gene can have.
EG. For the Gene â??eye colourâ?� the alleleâ??s are: brown, blue, green and so on
-for each gene there are two alleleâ??s, because we have two sets of each chromosome (one from your mom and the other from your dad. Well in some cases the second is from the mail man.)
-Mutations --- are the only known source of Alleleâ??s and genes. Mutations are accidents when transcribing or translating DNA or RNA.
Homozygous- the two alleleâ??s for a gene in an organism are the same
Heterozygous- the two alleleâ??s are different

Theory of plant breeding: (its simple)
-Lets say your goal is to grow nice big tomatoes
-You grow lots and lots of different plants
-look through them and find the ones producing the most desirable fruit.
-Take these two plants, force them to pollinate each other.
-Then you get the seeds from the plant. (it gets complex here)
-Since these seeds are from your two strongest (genetically) plants all the seeds will have a different mix of the plants.

-These seeds will come out in the ratio 1:2:1
1â??or 25% of the seeds will have a homozygous genotype for the desired trait, with the desired allele!
2---or 50% will have heterozygous genotype for trait, have both alleleâ??s
1â??25% will have homozygous, with two undesired alleleâ??s
(assuming each of the parents were heterozygote for the gene)

This is what Mendel Taught us.

I will continue. Please donâ??t comment yet.

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Originally Posted by MastaChronic

except one.......................................hemp.
hemp could completely replace petrol as an energy source.

for more information, read jack herer's book "the emperor wears no clothes"
found at jackherer.com
although i assume youve already read it, this fact just slipped your mind perhaps.

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great point man. i don't think harris7 has read that, although he definitely knows the benefits hemp has when it comes to energy. we were just discussing yesterday actually, how hemp can be used for everything from clothes and paper, to fuel. so in essence, hemp could actually be used as fuel for lots of things, and it's totally sustainable!!! it's awesome.:jointsmile:

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Originally Posted by Bob the Awesome

Second, the whole thing on Organic Foods... sorry people, but I won't take it. Organic growing takes up more space than genetically-modified foods, and from one estimate I heard, if we all grew organically the Earth could only support 4 billion people, food-wise. That's pretty bad, trying to get 1/3 of everyone to sacrifice themselves.

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Got a link? cause that is just plain made up

Now Genetic engineering.

This one is much easier and shorter

-A scientist wants to put a quality from one species into another.
-they locate the desired quality (gene) and literally cut it out.
-Then they place it in another organisms nucleolus by three means
-The gene gun- coat small pieces of gold with the gene and literally shoot the cell. Little pieces of gold will penetrate the nucleus… job done
-The most used means is virus’s and bacteria. Look up how a virus works.
-and the last is to place the target cell in a solution of the Gene and run an electric current through it. The electricity increases the permeability of the cell allowing the gene to enter.

Now I’ll highlight the difference:

GM—adding a new Gene

Breeding—is selecting the desired allele, no new gene’s

The most important thing is that a new gene is added. This is very dangerous. I don’t know your understanding of genetics but 1 gene does not code for one protein. In fact the human genome is only 30 000 genes and the human body has over 200 000 proteins. This relationship is only possible if genes interact to produce some proteins.
The unfortunate fact is that we cannot predict the effects of the gene interaction. The only effect we can predict (and the only thing they look for) is the desired trait.

You might be interested in the lack of testing done to these crops b4 they are allowed to be grown, sold and consumed. In the USA there is none! They are seen as “equivalent”

I am 110% opposed to GMO food crops! My opposition rests on their safety and their effect to biodiversity.

I will answer any questions you have. But I ask that you please start a thread.

listen to Harris, he really knows what he is talking about.

ps: he puts a SHITLOAD of effort into all his posts made on global warming and now this GMO/organic stuff. he has been working on these posts nonstop for around an hour now, and counting.

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Originally Posted by Bob the Awesome

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EDIT: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_Borlaug

I guess this guy is evil because he opposes widespread organic farming because he, too, feels it'd take up too much land area and cause deforestation. Remember, more crop land means less room for other things.

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You might be interested to see what this man said as he neared the end of his life.

Something about sinning against god by thinking he could improve god work and how he had failed.


I am now going to return to reading my book "the weather makers"

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Originally Posted by harris7

You might be interested to see what this man said as he neared the end of his life.

Something about sinning against god by thinking he could improve god work and how he had failed.


I am now going to return to reading my book "the weather makers"

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I am thinking of someone else, sorry

You might be interested in the lack of testing done to these crops b4 they are allowed to be grown, sold and consumed. In the USA there is none! They are seen as “equivalent”

Link?

You might be interested to see what this man said as he neared the end of his life.

Something about sinning against god by thinking he could improve god work and how he had failed.

Link?

And I fail to see how that man failed if he increased the crop yields of Pakistan and India that much... maybe he didn't do it everywhere but that's still monumental.

I saw "The Future of Food" and that movie mentioned the point about GMOs being seen as "equivalent". but i'm sure there is more info out there on the net about that.

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Originally Posted by Bob the Awesome

You might be interested in the lack of testing done to these crops b4 they are allowed to be grown, sold and consumed. In the USA there is none! They are seen as â??equivalentâ?�

Link?

You might be interested to see what this man said as he neared the end of his life.

Something about sinning against god by thinking he could improve god work and how he had failed.

Link?

And I fail to see how that man failed if he increased the crop yields of Pakistan and India that much... maybe he didn't do it everywhere but that's still monumental.

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Bob, as i said please start a thread i dont want to take this one over. Even thought it might be finished.

I began rebutting you on superficial levels and now it has receded to much higher level discussion of GMO. I will cite sources as i understand the importance of that. It is difficult for me as so many of them are in my books not on the NEt but i'm sure i can find them quickly. I will be back. and i'll meet you on a new thread.

PS- His purpose was to create a standardized approach at agriculture. To this he failed, but only because it is impossible. I dont mean he failed in his work or his life.