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So let me get this straight, you are righteous and God is evil right? This is another common trend with unbelievers. They feel that they are a "better person" than God. So tell me, why do you think women support the bible, including my wife? :wtf:Quote:
Originally Posted by mfqr
Dude.. I think you need to focus on your reading comprehension issues.. I never said I Believe in anything.. I Know the earth is Millions of years old. What my point was is that those that say the the Bible is THE Word Of God cannot then Interpret those words to fit the observed universe. In Genisis if you add up the who begot whos and how long they lived and so forth you end up with 6000 years.. ITS NOT ME saying such.. its those that BELIEVE that the bible IS the Word of God and since the genealogy Says that it all began 6000 years ago those that BELIEVE it is the Word of God Say It must be so. ANd in Fact if you do the maths in Genisis it does come to aproximatly 6000 years since Adam and Eve poped up from the dirt.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pass That Shit
If you say at any point the words in the Bible are the word of god then you MUST take every word at face value. If you say No "I can read it to mean" Then You and anyone can make it mean anything you like but ( Back to Logic) If you say you, just a man, can take its words to mean other than as written then It has to be either NOT the word of god or You are placing Your version of it Over Gods Word.
If you read the words" 7 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. " Then God looks like you and me if the bible is his word.. So you cant then now say well god is the unseen energy of the universe or some other version of what god is because it fits the known scientific dogma.
If you take it as the Word of God then God is a physical entity.. Theres many , many passages that say one thing and the Believers then interpret it to Mean something other than as written ..when you do that its logical to state its either Not the word of god or the person is over ruling gods word.
Last time I will address this also as to believe in anything is to throw logic to the wind.
As I said before if believing causes one to do good, help thy fellow man, love thy neighbor, in other words to act in Honor ( Honor is doing the right thing when no one is looking) then its great.. But History shows that most the time it ends in tragedy because men fall to the My Gods better than Your God mind set and people die in the millions..
Maybe Ignorance is Bliss....Quote:
Originally Posted by Pass That Shit
Most people don't follow it to the degree that the Bible implies. People just ignore, misinterpret, reinterpret the parts that they don't like, or rationalize the views saying "this was only for that period, it doesn't matter this day in age". Nobody lets their children die because their children have cursed them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pass That Shit
And yeah, I do believe I am more moral than the God that the Bible depicts.
This is just a bad as saying that you believe, in my opinion at least. Again, the cliche of a flat world shows that we only know as far as we can see. When new information comes, it changes what we "know".Quote:
Originally Posted by Quantummist
BIG difference.. I KNOW because we have massive volumes of Evidence that has been tested and proven over hundreds of years.. To Know and to believe are two totally different thingsQuote:
Originally Posted by Hardcore Newbie
The age of Adam and Eve and the age of the earth are two different conversations.Quote:
Originally Posted by Quantummist
You never mentioned Adam and Eve, you said the earth was 6000 years old.
It's clear that you can't back up your original comment so now you're jumping around to other things.
Even though the bible appears to contradict itself in just about every subject, it really doesn't. God is a Spirit. But we know that Jesus is the image of the invisible God. The Lord is that Spirit. Jesus is Lord. So God made man in his own image. Jesus created all things. Yes, God is a man. It's clear right from the creation in Genesis, that God spoke, so he has a mouth. God formed man of the dust of the ground, so he has hands and fingers. God has feelings so he has a heart. God can see with his eyes and hear with his ears. Yes, we were made in the image of God. God is a man. Jesus is God. Jesus is eternal. The Son of God is without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life. Jesus is God himself.
Doesn't every seed come from itself? Why is it logical to think that we are exempt from this law in nature? Why is it so hard to believe that we came from a man? Doesn't weed come from weed? Don't you need a Cannabis plant to get Cannabis seeds? What makes you think that we are any different? Every seed comes from itself, and we are not excluded from this. God is a man, that's why there is men on the earth. Plain and simple!
I hear people often say that life is the result of a miracle chance of one in a million. You would have to say that this one in a million chance took place in everything alive cause one thing did not come from the other. Another words, what does the Cannabis plant have to do with man being on the earth? We always debate about how man got here, but how did the plant get here? Was that a one in a million chance as well? We can go on and on about everything that exists and debate how it all got here. :jointsmile:
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Originally Posted by Hardcore Newbie
I won't even touch this one, that's on you!
Our words will either justify or condemn us!
SO ..you think the bible is Gods Nuanced Thought.. Not The Word of God.. If He made A & E on the 6th day.. (Ok.. 6000 years plus or minus 7 days) Now if you wana say oh heck ..Gods Days are 10,000 years in length then YOU are saying None of the bible can be taken as written.. kinda blasphemy don't ya think...Quote:
Originally Posted by Pass That Shit
It clear you didn't do the math.. Have you actually read the bible ? or just bits and pieces .. Its the Word Of God and ifn I Believed that, I would read every word 1000 times over .. I'm not gona go through each Begot and do the math for you.. I have by the way done just that in the past.. I backed up my comment clearly by pointing you to Genesis and telling you to READ it and do the Math and consider EACH WORD is Gods Word so you can't add your own interpretations ..if you do then YOU are superseding GODS WORD..Quote:
It's clear that you can't back up your original comment so now you're jumping around to other things.
So you say but cannot validate.....Quote:
Even though the bible appears to contradict itself in just about every subject, it really doesn't. God is a Spirit.
I say..No such thing as Spirits, ghost, goblin, and big foots... Well maybe bigfoot.. of them at least we have tracks...
No WE don't Know any such thingQuote:
But we know that Jesus is the image of the invisible God.
So you say but cannot validate.....Quote:
The Lord is that Spirit. Jesus is Lord.
So you say but cannot validate.....Quote:
So God made man in his own image.
And you asked earler WHY Unbelievers think believers are Illogical.. Well There ya go.... and by the way.. Feelings come from a organ a bit higher up.. The heart pumps blood..Quote:
Jesus created all things. Yes, God is a man. It's clear right from the creation in Genesis, that God spoke, so he has a mouth. God formed man of the dust of the ground, so he has hands and fingers. God has feelings so he has a heart.
So you say but cannot validate.....Quote:
God can see with his eyes and hear with his ears. Yes, we were made in the image of God. God is a man. Jesus is God. Jesus is eternal. The Son of God is without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life. Jesus is God himself.
uhhh... no.. I might just cross a Hops plant with a hemp plant then genetically mutate it with colcasine then let it grow wild for 1 billions years and it may very well become an Asexual propagating crawly thing with 10 eyes and a fussy tail...Quote:
Doesn't every seed come from itself?
Cause its not been upheld by the supreme court.. oh and because its NOT a law of Nature..Quote:
Why is it logical to think that we are exempt from this law in nature?
Its not... in a round about way.. through a woman...Quote:
Why is it so hard to believe that we came from a man?
Plain and simple my left testicle.. Thats about the most irrational construct I've heard in a while.. You really don't understand Logic in its construct form do you..Quote:
Doesn't weed come from weed? Don't you need a Cannabis plant to get Cannabis seeds? What makes you think that we are any different? Every seed comes from itself, and we are not excluded from this. God is a man, that's why there is men on the earth. Plain and simple!
Then those that you have heard say such a thing do not understand Odds very well.. one in a million is far from a miracle.. 1 in 500 Billion is Far,Far from a Miracle.. Thats such a small number in this Universe as to be a Has to happen eventQuote:
I hear people often say that life is the result of a miracle chance of one in a million.
Well ...Yes It Did.. All Life you see poking its head from the rocks, growing on the top of the mountain, walking down the street, swimming in the ocean, living in your belly ... came from the same micro organism .. That organism made all the Oxygen you are breathing right now. Well at least 98% of it.. A bit dropped in during the heavy bombardment period.. That organism became YOU , Me and the pot plant you just smoked...Quote:
You would have to say that this one in a million chance took place in everything alive cause one thing did not come from the other.
[QUOTE]Quote:
Another words, what does the Cannabis plant have to do with man being on the earth?
Because Your related to it...
They are both from the SAME Base organisim that branched into different life forms after 12 extinction events that re shuffled the DNA deck each timeQuote:
We always debate about how man got here, but how did the plant get here?
No more like 1 in 500 billion or so.. Hate to burst your bubble but thats a very, very small number as the Universe goes...Quote:
Was that a one in a million chance as well?
No Need to debate that which has a pretty good DNA trail that deleniates the variations that traces back to little simple 1 cell Things that were neither Plant nor Animal completely...Quote:
We can go on and on about everything that exists and debate how it all got here. :jointsmile:
I'll sum it up with this. You are denying that Jesus Christ died, was buried and rose again from the dead. He was seen after his resurrection by many. When you can prove to me that all the different witnesses that have left their testimony of what happened are liars, I'll consider your view. But since you don't have a single trace of evidence to prove that all the testimonies are lies, I'll choose to believe that they were honest men and spoke the truth.
Just about everything you said is because you believe it, not because you can prove any of it. It never comes down to logic or proof. It always comes down to faith. Science is just like religion, there are many branches and they all disagree with each other. If it were about logic and proof, everyone would agree!
And by the way, when you feel love or hate, it comes from your heart not your brain. :jointsmile:
And I'm not referring to the blood pumping organ!
But you're creating a false dilemma, that the witnesses are either liars or right. Everything seems to come down to that with you for some reason:wtf:.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pass That Shit
I'm not up to date on the thread so sorry if this has already been covered, but are there actually several witness tesimonies in multiple works of the resurrection, or are you're "multiple witnesses" really just multiple being in a single story? Because if it's just one story with many people, then the only actual witness is one person, not many.
erm.... Different branches of science tend not to disagree with each other because they're not even arguing with each other. A biologist and a rocket scientist aren't going to argue about the origin of life for instance.Quote:
It always comes down to faith. Science is just like religion, there are many branches and they all disagree with each other. If it were about logic and proof, everyone would agree!
Scientists in the same field will absolutely argue about some things, but definately not most things. This is why we have hypothesis, theory, established theory, and law. The first two are up for debate, established theory is seldom debated unless there's a major shakeup in the foundations of the field, and law is strait-up law. Regardless they are NOT matters of faith because the theories are based on observable, testable, and consistantly repeatable evidence. God is only a hypothesis, and the theory of evolution does not mean the "hypothesis of evolution" as many creationists seem to think. I would advise you not to make claims on the verifiable nature of science unless you actually understand it in-depth yourself.
In the real world of logic and science, love and hate are the products of seratonin, dopamine, endorphines, and norapinephrine which actually are created in the brain.Quote:
And by the way, when you feel love or hate, it comes from your heart not your brain.
Nope, never said I was more righteous than God, because of course, I don't believe in God; thus I cannot believe I am more righteous than something I don't believe in. :thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by Pass That Shit
I'll tell you why, because I don't think that a lot of women have actually read the entire bible (in fact, a lot of people havent, women and men). Either that, or they disregarded those parts. I guess it would make sense for a believer to disregard such insanity, because it would go against the core belief. Wait, does that make sense? Sounds like Christianity has gone off course...
The Bible is repulsive, sexist, and supports the use of slaves. Instead of dodging what I asked, maybe you can answer. Why do you believe in such a thing? Clearly God is not completely benevolent if he supports the murder of drunken adolescents, just because they are drunk. There are many other instances, too.
"For six days, work is to be done, but the seventh day is a Sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD. Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day must be put to death." - Exodus 31:15
For the first commandment, here is what it says to do if it is broken:
"Take the man or woman who has done this evil deed to your city gate and stone that person to death." - Deut 17:2-7
"...you must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock. Then you must pile all the plunder in the middle of the street and burn it." - Deut 13:13-19
So it looks like there was a reason for the crusades after all. Because the bible told them to do it!
"Anyone who blasphemes the name of the LORD must be put to death. The entire assembly must stone him." - Lev 24:16
So, anyone who believes in God must be put to death? Oh, right, but I'm sure you'd support that, wouldn't you?
"All who curse their father or mother must be put to death." - Leviticus 20:9
"If a man commits adultery with another man's wife - with the wife of his neighbor - both the adulterer and the adulteress must be put to death." - Leviticus 20:10
"If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death." - Leviticus 20:13
"If someone has a stubborn and rebellious son who will not obey his father and mother, who does not heed them when they discipline him, then his father and his mother shall ... say to the elders of his town, 'This son of ours is stubborn and rebellious. He will not obey us. He is a glutton and a drunkard.' Then all the men of the town shall stone him to death." - Deut 21
"If your hand or your foot causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life maimed or crippled than to have two hands or two feet and be thrown into eternal fire. And if your eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into the fire of hell." - Matthew 18:7-9
Women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the Law says. If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in the church." - 1 Corinthians 14
"Let a woman learn in silence with all submissiveness. I permit no woman to teach or to have authority over men; she is to keep silent." - 1 Tim 2
"Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. You may also buy some of the temporary residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property. You can will them to your children as inherited property and can make them slaves for life." - Leviticus 25:44
"If a man beats his male or female slave with a rod and the slave dies as a direct result, he must be punished, but he is not to be punished if the slave gets up after a day or two, since the slave is his property." - Exodus Chapter 21:20
"Bid slaves to be submissive to their masters and to give satisfaction in every respect; they are not to be refractory, nor to pilfer, but to show entire and true fidelity." - Titus 2:9
"Anyone who is captured will be run through with a sword. Their little children will be dashed to death right before their eyes." - Isaiah 13
"Samaria shall bear her guilt, because she has rebelled against her God; they shall fall by the sword, their little ones shall be dashed in pieces, and their pregnant women ripped open." - Hosea 13
"Now therefore, kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has known man by lying with him. But all the young girls who have not known man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves." - Numbers 31
This isn't all of it, there are tons more. Now tell me, why do you support this kind of thing? And if you don't, then you are not a true Christian. I think this is pretty good evidence that the Bible was not inspired by any God, but rather tyrants.
Totally repulsive. You cannot deny this. Look those up yourself.
Oh, and just to tell you... these aren't metaphors. They really mean what they say in it. It is quite obvious that these are to be taken literally.
Heres the thing.. I follow the scientific method when I address an concept and that requires following some rules.. Let me try to explain this to you a bit. First Proof has a specific meaning, Evidence has a specific meaning. And in the proving you never address the negative.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pass That Shit
What you have done is to take someone word as Proof. It would not matter if 100000000 people SAY they saw a space ship land in there back yard.. That does not constitute proof.. for something to be proven it must be reproducible and falsifiable. The human species is very poor at understanding what they see as you can never be sure what they say they say is what was really the event. That why ,in science, no ones witness of events are give more than a passing consideration
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No, thats just not true. I do Not Believe it. There is many aspects that have been Proven some parts are theoretical. Its you that do not know of or except those proofs and theory. As for Logic you have shown ,IMHO, that you have no idea what constitutes Proof nor do you understand Logic. You seem to think Logic is what ever makes sense to You.. Thats not it. Logic, Proof, Evidence, have specific meanings that are not left to the individual to make up as we go.Quote:
Just about everything you said is because you believe it, not because you can prove any of it. It never comes down to logic or proof.
In Religions it comes down to faith. And to some in science they do approach it like its religious dogma but If you understand the principles of scientific method then it never comes down to Believing in anything.Quote:
It always comes down to faith. Science is just like religion, there are many branches and they all disagree with each other. If it were about logic and proof, everyone would agree!
NO they would not.. because some people have no idea what constitutes Proof or Logic. If you have no idea what those terms really mean then you will always Believe in ghosties and goblins even when presented with logical argument against it.
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And by the way, when you feel love or hate, it comes from your heart not your brain. :jointsmile:
And I'm not referring to the blood pumping organ![/QUOTE]
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Can you show me this bodily organ on an X-ray.. When you feel hate or love, jealousy and greed, Hot and Cold it happens because your brain fires neurons which sends electrical signals to the synoptic connections between and causes a chemical to cross the synoptic gap firing the next neuron. When you smoke a bit of bud it locks a molecule of de-hydrated THC-9 to the receptor matching its surface chemistry causing those neurons to alter the firing sequence .. Biology class is not over... :beatdeadhorse:
Finally someone that Does understand the scientific method.. Well stated responce...... :thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by Gandalf_The_Grey
I know they are not metaphors. Neither is judgment day. I believe that God is righteous in his judgments. The lake of fire is also a reality, not a metaphor. Just for the record, I'm not saying that you're going there, cause I wouldn't know, just pointing out that the Lord is coming to judge the earth in righteousness! :jointsmile:Quote:
Originally Posted by mfqr
And by the way, you left out the biggest one of all. When God judged the earth with water, everyone perished except Noah and his family. Yes, I still feel he is a righteous judge.
Are you saying that the entire bible is one story with one witness? Cause there were many different men who testified of God from different generations and so there are MANY witnesses who say the same thing. Are they all lying? They're either telling the truth or they are telling lies. There is no gray area. Something is either true or it's not. God is true! :jointsmile:Quote:
Originally Posted by Gandalf_The_Grey
He made his point and you seem to agree.. You and your version of god are both psychopaths .. You think because god said so you should take babies and thrash them against a rock because their fathers don't believe in what you think they should. And you don't even understand that..Quote:
Originally Posted by Pass That Shit
You started this thread and to my humble mind have shown exactly why , to all that have followed this, that religion is irrational and in many cases dangerous to mankind. History is re pleat with Believers getting to the point that they elect themselves to take over if gods a bit slow at thrashing the infidels.
What you are writing is not much different than a Mulah teaching little Abdul to strap a bomb on his chest and blow up them damned infidels.
The sad thing is that you have no idea of what I and other have told you. You , in your head, cannot comprehend any of those that try to logically and rationally address the question that you started in this thread.
To this point your basic response to logic and evidence is "God Did It" and any explanation of the reality around you that does not fit that mental image is no more than gibberish to you.
With all the light and beauty in the universe you wish to see man killed, drowned, burned and mutilated .. might as well start chanting "Alla be Praised" over and over.. same difference...
sad...ver sad
You're stretching it quite a bit. What I believe, doesn't hurt anyone. I don't support the violence others do in the name of God. GOD IS NOT TELLING THEM TO ACT LIKE THAT. God is the judge. We are not. We need to do our part and he is the one who will judge everyone in righteousness! Just because I agree with his judgments, doesn't make me the same as the ones you bring up. If they were like me, they would follow Jesus, instead of trying to kill who they feel is the enemy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Quantummist
It's not that I don't hear or understand what you guys are saying, It's that I completely disagree with it. See, life forevermore is a blessing. It was commanded upon the mountains of Zion, so there's no way to stop eternal life from coming. And I'm very thankful for it! :pimp:
This thread is getting close to being closed. Remember to respect each other and not to attack each other.
Quantummist, I only have one contact in so I might be missing something but you are standing out so this is your warning. Watch what you say about other religions and other members here. You are new to the forum so I hope you have read Psycho4Bud's sticky on respect in this forum.
Don't make me have to come back in here.
Certainly not! The bible, if I remember correctly, is a collection of 40 stories and there's many beyond that in scriptures such as the dead sea scrolls. I was only questioning the number of witnesses in the one story of Jesus's resurrection, in response to your claim that it had multiple witnesses.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pass That Shit
Many different men did testify from many different generations. But these men all held a geographically and culturally similar belief in god. For instance there about 40-50 different authors who have written Star Wars novels (which I read as a teenager) that all tie into the same story line, all of which affect the other. I wouldn't say this affects the plausibility of Star Wars though.Quote:
Cause there were many different men who testified of God from different generations and so there are MANY witnesses who say the same thing.
Something is either true or not, you're absolutely right. But why must every truth or falsehood be from a lie or a truth? Consider the Hindu's who believe(d) in several dieties, the greeks who believed on Poseidon the god of the sea, the Viking's who believe in Thor the blacksmith of the gods. Where all these religions lying? Of course not, they were genuinly mistaken in some cases, and in other cases these mythologies have a long and complex process over which they develope.Quote:
Are they all lying?They're either telling the truth or they are telling lies. There is no gray area. Something is either true or it's not.
Many stories in the bible (if not all) have almost matching versions already existing in now-extinct ancient religions. It's more than plausible that these stories were believed by those who held them, altered them a bit to fit into the bible, and continued the tradition.
For you he undoubtedly is. But not for me, sorry.Quote:
God is true!
Ok.. i'm not too much for political correctness so I'll take my leave of the thread.. It was fun but note that Watching out what one says about religions is why some towers fell .. Too many so don't want to upset the apple cart until its too late and the wheels fall off.. It seems fine for religions to tell me and everyone else is gona die in a fires pit and wrath will befall all us heathens but when those views are responded too we must be tolerant..Quote:
Originally Posted by FakeBoobsRule
Guess we have to wait till the next 100,000 die until thats understood..
So folks have fun and enjoy..
I'm outa here...
I know God does not exist because for the past few years I considered myself a Christian, wasn't nutty or anything, just tried to be decent to others and all that jazz. After years of prayers not being answered, I've finally come to the realization that God only exists in our mind. It's given me a new look at religion, as a popular form of schizophrenia.
I know there are people out there that will defend their religion with everything they have, and the reason really just boils down to people not being able to accept death. It is very hard for humans to accept nothingness after they die, so as history has shown, humans have created fantastic stories about what happens after life, and religion is the guide on how to achieve that everlasting life. Of course religion can also be used to control people, after all, humans love to control others, but the primary drive to believe these fantastic stories that have absolutely no evidence of being true is from each person's inability to accept the nothing that comes after we die.
But what do I know, I'm just an atheist sinner that will burn forever right? lol I don't really care if that's what you believe, but every religious person should question their own beliefs more often. There are too many religious people that try so hard to push a religion they don't even really fully understand themselves onto others, it's ridiculous!
God bless you all! :)
Your entitled to your opinion, you own it! :jointsmile:Quote:
Originally Posted by Gandalf_The_Grey
Just curious, what's to fear if we're gonna fade into nothingness? If there's no pain afterwards, why would we fear death? No pain after death would still be better than the pain we suffer down here, so it would still be an upgrade in my opinion. Just sharing cause I don't believe out of fear of fading into nothingness. I believe cause I feel it's true. Peace! :jointsmile:Quote:
Originally Posted by Nailhead
Its not that people are afraid of it, it's that they can't comprehend non-existence. This is why throughout time humans have always created some sort of religion to deal with death. It's not so much that they are afraid of nothingness, but that their brain just cannot accept life to end for good when their heart stops beating. This is why so many people cling to the thought of an afterlife, they might not be involved with any particular religion, but they can't accept the thought of life, supernatural as well as physical, to come to an end.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pass That Shit
This is also why people talk about burning for all eternity when referencing hell, however even the bible doesn't talk about that. The bible clearly says that hell is where you go to die, it never says you have everlasting life in hell, but people add that because they can't accept an end to their life. Fear has nothing to do with it, it's just that the human mind has a hard time comprehending nothing.
It's very easy for us to comprehend nothing before we are alive, but after life gets going and our brain starts functioning, we have a very hard time understanding how all this can come to an end, so rather than accept truth, we make up fantastic stories that make us look at death as only dying in the physical state, but living on in a supernatural. However, I don't believe that is true at all, I don't believe their is any supernatural, no matter how much I want to because it makes for some really great movies, I just don't believe it.
I believe that we are spiritual beings inside an earthly body. I don't think we will reach our full potential until our change come!
I'm confident and believe whole heartily that there is life after death. Life goes on! :jointsmile:
That's why I say it always comes down to faith. One person will put his/her facts together and consider in their heart what he/she feels is true, and then the next person will come to a completely different conclusion. That's part of life, we are all individuals.
Like the stars of heaven, we all shine differently. Peace! ;)
Faith really means being ignorant, and I say this as a person who once had the blind faith that the bible teaches Christians to posses. Blind faith got me nothing but a load of bills I am now struggling to re-pay. Where is God now when I scrape for change to get something to eat? Where is God now when I can't see a doctor because I can't even afford the co-pay? Or even my medicine? Why won't he just cure me like he did to the people in the bible?
The problem with Christians, (I'm using Christians as an example because these are who I know most, though I'm sure the same can be said about many other religions), is that they love to talk about how God will help us if we only sacrifice our earthly possessions and what not, but when somebody goes and does as they tell us to, God is never around when you really need him. So with ignorance, or as some call it, faith, they continue to do as they do waiting for some sort of righteous return on their investment.
The dumbest thing I ever did in my life was having faith, and I feel like such a moron for being so blind! God was so powerful around the times the bible was written, that is, back when record keeping technology was nothing more than telling and re-telling the story to your grandkids, but now he seems to have taken a backseat while the world falls apart, why is that? Where was God and his oh so awesome power when those Korean Christians were captured by terrorists, killing two of them? If God had the power to protect them, why didn't he use it?
Doesn't it seem odd to you that the stories from the bible talk about great powers being done in front of a lot of people, but now, God seems to only be active in people's personal lives, rather than making his presence known like he did back in the day?
You need to ask yourself, did you really have faith?
He has made his presence known, and he will make his presence known! :jointsmile:
Isn't it easy to blame him for all the wrong in your life?
So, if you cursed at your mother or father for any reason, you think it would be righteous for you to be put to death over it? That's not righteousness, that's insanity, my friend. A benevolent, righteous God would not demand people to be put to death over such trivial and simple matters. It's completely ridiculous, and it's even harder for me to believe that you'd support such a thing than believing in a God. You must not be much of a moral christian...Quote:
Originally Posted by Pass That Shit
I find your mindset on this pretty strange. "Well, God said that is how it is to be, so it must be right, even if it means chopping people up into small pieces over things that can be solved in a non-violent way." Clearly, if God is so powerful, and has infinite intelligence, he should be able to come up with a plan other than killing innocent people. Sounds quite malevolent. But I guess religious people can't understand it. I've seen on youtube people posting a line something like "Those who do not believe in God will be blinded to the teachings of the Bible," or something like that. That's obviously just a self-defense of the Bible, to throw at non-believers, saying that they are blinded, and don't understand because they don't believe in it. Well, how I see it, it's quite the opposite. Those who believe in the Bible cannot see the completely ridiculous things in it, and the complete irrationality and repulsiveness of the bible. I mean no disrespect by saying this, I'm just saying it. I agree with Quantummist, religion is rather dangerous to mankind...
Also, I posted those quotes because you didn't believe that the bible was sexist, so I showed you. I didn't forget any important ones. I just wanted to show you that there are many, not to show all of them in a single post. That post would be very, very, very long. Well, now you know why your wife believes in the bible, even with its obvious sexism. It's either because she hasn't read those parts, or have done what you did, and justified the support of it with ludicrous things like "I believe that God is righteous in his judgements, even though it can involve the massacre of a whole town, or chopping up people into little pieces."
I agree with you, religion is VERY dangerous to mankind!Quote:
Originally Posted by mfqr
That's why I'm not part of any! :jointsmile:
Typical Christian response, you assume anyone that was once a fellow Christian to have fallen away to never have been a strong Christian to begin with. My friend, I have spent far more money on blind faith than most people do, Christian or not. Few Christians have the faith I had, how many times have you given money to someone even though you knew you really needed it, but did so because you knew they needed it too and you felt God would repay you?Quote:
Originally Posted by Pass That Shit
I also don't see how you accuse me of blaming the wrong in my life on God, that is, something I don't believe exists. I would be a hypocrite if I said I don't believe in God, but then blame the bad things in my life on God. I don't blame the problems in my life on anybody but myself. It was myself that was naive enough to believe in the fantasies taught by the Christian religion, and it was pure stupidity to hand over my future to a super-being that has never been proven to exist.
He has never made his presence known, you only believe he has because that is what the bible tells you has happened, however NOTHING has ever been documented to prove God exists, rather, as science and technology advance, and we understand more and more about our true origins, everything we have been taught must be re-examined and Christians are trying their best to figure out how to fit God in with the contradictions their religion is tied in with.
I have to admit this argument makes me laugh because not more than a few months ago I was making the exact same type of argument rebuttals when defending Christianity - that is, that anybody that doesn't see his presence just aren't religious enough, or that basic attitude that you really don't know how to respond so you just keep on talking about how much you believe.
It's ok, I don't mind it, I completely understand where you are coming from, and I just hope someday you will see the truth :)
That's a bit different than religion. While it's cool for people to be open-minded and have their own beliefs... religion is not your own belief. For anyone to believe that there is an invisible, almighty God, that has infinite power, and is omnipotent, it usually takes something called "indoctrination" (to put it nicely).Quote:
Originally Posted by Pass That Shit
Christians, and especially Evangelical christians, are indoctrinating children to their beliefs. It's all teached in a biased way, and another view is never given except it's because of "God." Now, if you consider how children generally are... they really have no idea or reference of any other belief. So if you give them this idea from a young age, before they start to form their own opinions etc., they almost have no choice but to accept that belief - since they don't have any other references of how the world is. It's all brainwashing. The Bible also fits the definition of "propaganda" perfectly.
wait, u had strong faith, but now there's no proof of god?Quote:
Originally Posted by Nailhead
GROWin GRACE
Quote:
Originally Posted by mfqr
I disagree, those people brought up from birth as a Christian usually are the weakest Christians of them all. They put on a good Christian face on sundays, but in their private time they rebel and do anything non-christian.
There are people that are fake Christians, and those that really do act as the bible teaches. Few people really act as Christians are taught to, few Christians even read the bible. I'd say maybe 1% or so of people that go to church are really a true Christian, maybe less than that. Most people do not follow any of the teachings at all, they just pick and choose a few things of what to follow, usually they just do what the preacher tells them to do, which in many cases is NOT what the bible teaches.
Main example, the entire Catholic religion. The bible clearly says not to call anyone other than God "father", the bible says not to lavish yourselves in riches, the pope does this, and of course....who the hell is the pope? Christians are supposed to worship God, nobody else, especially human! lol I mean seriously if you actually read through the bible it clearly teaches to do exactly what the Catholic religion does all the time! I have never understood this! Maybe somebody can try to explain it to me, I don't know any Catholics myself so I'm just an outsider peeking in, but Christians don't seem to ever care about being lumped in with Catholics and many their traditions and teachings have come from the Catholic church.
As I said earlier, I had blind faith, aka, ignorance. I didn't need proof of God to believe, I had my faith and that was enough. It was foolish and very dumb, but unfortunately that is how many people of religion believe, (not just Christianity).Quote:
Originally Posted by GROWin GRACE
I just want to add that I hope I'm not offending anybody here, I have many friends of all sorts of religions and I have no problem with their beliefs and I wouldn't talk about things like this unless they asked and wanted to participate in a discussion like this. If anybody is offended sorry, I haven't been offended by others either, but I think it's just because I'm usually medicated when visiting here :P hehe
We all have a right to believe what we want to believe, I would only have a serious issue with someone if they were trying to tell me how I live is somehow bad or immoral, but so far I feel this discussion has been going over pretty maturely and I'm enjoying it! I like talking about this stuff, hope you do too :)
I believe in God but could you tell me, in one sentence, why God does exist?
God is the imaginary friend for grown ups