A Question for the Christians

Im a half-christian myself, and have a question.
In this passage:

"For verily I say unto you, That whosoever shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith." Mark 11:23

Jesus doesnt say that we must ask God for throwing the mountain in the sea... it seems our faith alone is enough for doing it... also, there is some another passages like that... for example:

"And he said unto him, Arise, go thy way: thy faith hath made thee whole." Luke 17:19

"And he said unto her, Daughter, be of good comfort: thy faith hath made thee whole; go in peace." Luke 8:48

So... can i conclude that faith alone is enough for performing "miracles"?

The quote from Luke refers to the faith that the people had in Jesus that allowed them to be healed by him. Their faith allowed miracles to be worked on them, not because of them.

The quote from Mark is pretty ambiguous. Anyone who says that any geographical feature of Earth will change at some time in the future is correct. Maybe its a reference to the fact that everything changes and/or comes to an end. But at the same time I think there is more going on than just this.

yes Faith alone is all you need. What else do we have? Miracles you ask. Don't they happen every day? Look around you and then answer your own question.

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Originally Posted by twoguysupnorth

yes Faith alone is all you need.

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Well... its exactly what i think... but i would like to know what is the "official" christian opinion... cause i think my (and your) view are not exactly the same of the "official" chistianism...

Without faith, you're nothing.

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Originally Posted by Coelho

Well... its exactly what i think... but i would like to know what is the "official" christian opinion... cause i think my (and your) view are not exactly the same of the "official" chistianism...

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How does this "official christianity" work? In order to become a christian, you need to believe in Christ. That's official enough.

My father always tells me to "keep the faith", and, that's good advice for you.

Keep the faith.

Hahah I thought it said questions for christmas, Im so blazed right now..................haha

"everyone knows santa clause died for our presents" -420 24-7 (canna, homie)

Blahaha

lol @ christians

asking for the official christian stance is tough considering the faith has broken into literally hundreds of denominations over similar interpretations of scripture.

most would probably reply though that it is only through jesus that these things can be done as to keep him the focus of power and authority. the would point out that faith can only come through jesus giving it to you so you could not remove one from the other.

Faith without works is nothing....Just having faith alone is not enough.......you can be a firm strong believer in jesus,and be out there murdering people and raping and stuff,but just cause you believe in jesus....doesnt mean you'll go to heaven.

Yes, and this is why Muhamed had to go to the mountain instead of the other way around:

If the mountain won't come to Muhammad - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Jesus spoke alot of metaphors, and parables. I do believe faith is everything, even though it is a very hard thing to have at times. Faith was the healing of those people internally: what I think those verses mean, and in turn is a 'miracle' itself.

[quote=beachguy in thongs]Without faith, you're nothing.

well said, I owe you a rep, I am trying but it wants me to spread it around, ..............."I can never do nuthing" -gerorge lopez
QUOTE]

one thing to keep in some form of check with ANY spiritual teachings or history is that its not always a perfect documentary. plus, the books of the desciples were not written by the desciples themselves, but rather by thier followers, many years later, and then translated and interpreted many times to become the complete bible today.

over time, jesus wading acroos a small pond could be turned into walking on water...

either way, its more than hard facts, there is much interpretation that can, and must, be done

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Originally Posted by Coelho

Im a half-christian myself, and have a question.
In this passage:

"For verily I say unto you, That whosoever shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith." Mark 11:23

Jesus doesnt say that we must ask God for throwing the mountain in the sea... it seems our faith alone is enough for doing it... also, there is some another passages like that... for example:

"And he said unto him, Arise, go thy way: thy faith hath made thee whole." Luke 17:19

"And he said unto her, Daughter, be of good comfort: thy faith hath made thee whole; go in peace." Luke 8:48

So... can i conclude that faith alone is enough for performing "miracles"?

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it depends on what you put your faith in.

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Originally Posted by StickyfingahZ

Faith without works is nothing....Just having faith alone is not enough.......you can be a firm strong believer in jesus,and be out there murdering people and raping and stuff,but just cause you believe in jesus....doesnt mean you'll go to heaven.

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Yeah it does. There is ONLY, and I mean ONLY, one unforgivable sin. And that sin is blasphemy. You can rape, pillage, murder, steal, lie, cheat, and just be nasty all you want, as long as you repent in the name Jesus, and you don't blaspheme, you'll get into heaven (supposedly.)

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Originally Posted by klondike_bar

over time, jesus wading acroos a small pond could be turned into walking on water...

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When my father's car was on fire, one early morning, I ran out of the house to get his keys out, and, as I ran up to his door, a large frozen puddle was in front of it. I slipped, lost both of my feet, yet I was able to regain my balance.

I walked on water to get the keys from the fire.

Ah, here we go again... :)

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Originally Posted by beachguy in thongs

When my father's car was on fire, one early morning, I ran out of the house to get his keys out, and, as I ran up to his door, a large frozen puddle was in front of it. I slipped, lost both of my feet, yet I was able to regain my balance.

I walked on water to get the keys from the fire.

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Wow. Heheh.

I used to be a Christian, and the reason I am not is because I had faith in miracles, and they did not happen. If we just needed faith, and we could do greater works than Jesus, there would be no sick people in the world, because all the Christians would run around healing them. Think about this: Why has God never made an amputee's limb grow back?

Try and get your whole church to pray for an amputee's limb to grow back, and it won't work.

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Originally Posted by foodsy

Yeah it does. There is ONLY, and I mean ONLY, one unforgivable sin. And that sin is blasphemy. You can rape, pillage, murder, steal, lie, cheat, and just be nasty all you want, as long as you repent in the name Jesus, and you don't blaspheme, you'll get into heaven (supposedly.)

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Is sodomy with a goat forgivable?
Maybe there's hope for me after all...

first post... but maybe i can help clarify:

mountain = government and or religious hierarchy mountain (corruption)

sea = the people (us common folks)

so if you wanna see it removed or cast into the sea,
all you need is faith to set things straight ;)

I dont think Faith alone is all you need.
John 14:12
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater [works] than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.

He also goes on to say stuff like if you love me keep my commandments.

I aint a bible pro or anything,just my opinion,that in order to be like jesus(perform miracles ie move mountains) you have to Be like Jesus.
You know,maybe live your life in the service of others.

Wasn't the bible a rewrite?

So surely trying to take literal meaning from translations is....abit of a nut job pass time?

If anything, each man has his own idea of what the bible says. Don't fight about who's right and who's wrong, that's not very christian atall, and being that the truth really does have no name...why not strive to understand perspectives you find strange and sometimes, scary?

My own Buddhist perspective.

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Originally Posted by StickyfingahZ

I aint a bible pro or anything,just my opinion,that in order to be like jesus(perform miracles ie move mountains) you have to Be like Jesus.
You know,maybe live your life in the service of others.

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According to The History Channel, young Jesus used his powers for himself.

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Originally Posted by beachguy in thongs

According to The History Channel, young Jesus used his powers for himself.

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Yet, according to the Bible, Jesus refused to use His powers for himself, even being hungry after 40 days fasting in the desert.

And personally, i think a book written by people from His own time is more accurate than a documentary written by people 2000 years after Him.

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Originally Posted by Coelho

Yet, according to the Bible, Jesus refused to use His powers for himself, even being hungry after 40 days fasting in the desert.

And personally, i think a book written by people from His own time is more accurate than a documentary written by people 2000 years after Him.

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The stories are coming from the discovery, in the 1940's, of the Gospels found in a cave. Nag 'something'.

My head's been jumbled up since I read about it.

"But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed." Galatians 1:8

"The Gospel according to Mary" was one of those texts.

Or, was it "The Gospel of Mary"?

I remember them saying, "Now, why wasn't the Gospel of Mary included in the bible? If anyone would have been included, you'd think..."

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Originally Posted by Coelho

"But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed." Galatians 1:8

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You're scaring me with that quote!

I preach nothing! I only recall.

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Originally Posted by hazetwostep

asking for the official christian stance is tough considering the faith has broken into literally hundreds of denominations over similar interpretations of scripture.

most would probably reply though that it is only through jesus that these things can be done as to keep him the focus of power and authority. the would point out that faith can only come through jesus giving it to you so you could not remove one from the other.

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lol thats way off base seeing god gave us free will, meaning we choose to have faith.jesus don't give u faith u either believe or u don't.

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Originally Posted by angry nomad

Think about this: Why has God never made an amputee's limb grow back?

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Why does God allow suffering? Why does God allow sickness, and death, and misery? Why isn't Gods world - not ours - perfect?

Well, God allows these things because it allows us to rely more on Him, and less on ourselves. And in many cases, great suffering can bring a person closer to God and give them a better understanding of why they're in pain. In the beginning, things were perfect, but, if you believe in the Bible, then you also believe in the fall of Adam & Eve, which led to our cursed, sinful nature. Had the decision been made to never disobey the Lord, we'd have never known suffering and sin. (We were created in His image, after all.) But because of our nature, we must prove that we're deserving of eternal life by following (and believing) in Christ, and spreading His word to the anyone who will listen.

Faith may not be able to move mountains, but it can perform miracles... like saving us from our sins.

I would think that God does not allow suffering. We allow ourselves to suffer. Viruses attack us. We kill insects.

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Originally Posted by Mr. Clandestine

Why does God allow suffering? Why does God allow sickness, and death, and misery? Why isn't Gods world - not ours - perfect?

Well, God allows these things because it allows us to rely more on Him, and less on ourselves. And in many cases, great suffering can bring a person closer to God and give them a better understanding of why they're in pain.

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Sounds like sort of a Divine Munchausen by Proxy --- that can't be it.

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Originally Posted by dragonrider

Sounds like sort of a Divine Munchausen by Proxy --- that can't be it.

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Again, many Christians believe that if it weren't for the fall of Adam & Eve, this world would have remained perfect... and we'd have never felt suffering, pain, or death. In my opinion, it may just be God making the best of an already bad situation. Most of the suffering on this earth is caused by the acts of man, not God. Regardless, suffering still brings many people closer to God because it teaches us compassion for our fellow man. It teaches those of us who remain faithful how to minister to others who are suffering with compassion and conviction. God wants us to become living images of Himself, but we're not going to be forced to accept His divinity. Still, every time one of us is able to comfort another by helping them place their burdens in the hands of God, even during times of GREAT suffering, then we're being more like Him... or more precisely, like His Son. God suffered when He watched the world crucify Jesus, not because He was powerless to stop it, but because He knew it had to be done... and so did Jesus. In this case, immense suffering became the greatest act of love. He wasn't just doing it for the attention...

I'm not very well-versed in the Bible, and so can't quote any scriptures to back up what I'm trying to say. I can't claim to truly understand the meaning of suffering, but I can tell you to read the story of Job... maybe you'll get a better understanding of why we suffer.

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Originally Posted by Mr. Clandestine

Again, many Christians believe that if it weren't for the fall of Adam & Eve, this world would have remained perfect... and we'd have never felt suffering, pain, or death. In my opinion, it may just be God making the best of an already bad situation. Most of the suffering on this earth is caused by the acts of man, not God. Regardless, suffering still brings many people closer to God because it teaches us compassion for our fellow man.

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Some stories, such as Noah's ark, may have been parables. At their time, they didn't have The Weather Channel or The History Channel, explaining why the Earth was once covered with water. The lifeforms, that existed through it, passed down the information in their genes. It developed as a memory, until language was created and personified everything.

That sounds good. Some religious scholars believe that many of the Old Testament stories are parables, and, that God was created through the creation of language.

If fish could talk...

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Originally Posted by Mr. Clandestine

Why does God allow suffering? Why does God allow sickness, and death, and misery? Why isn't Gods world - not ours - perfect?

Well, God allows these things because it allows us to rely more on Him, and less on ourselves. And in many cases, great suffering can bring a person closer to God and give them a better understanding of why they're in pain. In the beginning, things were perfect, but, if you believe in the Bible, then you also believe in the fall of Adam & Eve, which led to our cursed, sinful nature. Had the decision been made to never disobey the Lord, we'd have never known suffering and sin. (We were created in His image, after all.) But because of our nature, we must prove that we're deserving of eternal life by following (and believing) in Christ, and spreading His word to the anyone who will listen.

Faith may not be able to move mountains, but it can perform miracles... like saving us from our sins.

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very well said!!!

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Originally Posted by beachguy in thongs

Some stories, such as Noah's ark, may have been parables. At their time, they didn't have The Weather Channel or The History Channel, explaining why the Earth was once covered with water. The lifeforms, that existed through it, passed down the information in their genes. It developed as a memory, until language was created and personified everything.

That sounds good. Some religious scholars believe that many of the Old Testament stories are parables, and, that God was created through the creation of language.

If fish could talk...

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lmao

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Originally Posted by Mr. Clandestine

Again, many Christians believe that if it weren't for the fall of Adam & Eve, this world would have remained perfect... and we'd have never felt suffering, pain, or death. In my opinion, it may just be God making the best of an already bad situation. Most of the suffering on this earth is caused by the acts of man, not God. Regardless, suffering still brings many people closer to God because it teaches us compassion for our fellow man. It teaches those of us who remain faithful how to minister to others who are suffering with compassion and conviction. God wants us to become living images of Himself, but we're not going to be forced to accept His divinity. Still, every time one of us is able to comfort another by helping them place their burdens in the hands of God, even during times of GREAT suffering, then we're being more like Him... or more precisely, like His Son. God suffered when He watched the world crucify Jesus, not because He was powerless to stop it, but because He knew it had to be done... and so did Jesus. In this case, immense suffering became the greatest act of love. He wasn't just doing it for the attention...

I'm not very well-versed in the Bible, and so can't quote any scriptures to back up what I'm trying to say. I can't claim to truly understand the meaning of suffering, but I can tell you to read the story of Job... maybe you'll get a better understanding of why we suffer.

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all i'll say is read samuel 8, 1-20 that should tell u everything u need to know. im guessing most people won't understand what it means but read it.oh and btw it's not often i see another on here with a good understanding on life and god. stay with what u believe ur on the right track

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Originally Posted by palerider7777

all i'll say is read samuel 8, 1-20 that should tell u everything u need to know. im guessing most people won't understand what it means but read it.oh and btw it's not often i see another on here with a good understanding on life and god. stay with what u believe ur on the right track

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Thanks for the kind words & recommendation, I'll be sure to read through Samuel again. To be honest, there are a lot of passages I need to reacquaint myself with. I couldn't win a game of "Name That Scripture" to save my life! ;)

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Originally Posted by Mr. Clandestine

Thanks for the kind words & recommendation, I'll be sure to read through Samuel again. To be honest, there are a lot of passages I need to reacquaint myself with. I couldn't win a game of "Name That Scripture" to save my life! ;)

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lol me either.