thought of a nother flaw related to sex-god

first i'll start with some points.
1. both genitals (male and female) are very sensitive (if not the most sensitive)(to pain and pleasure) in our bodies.
2. temptation almost always leads to doing the act rather than just leave it at tempted (doesn't apply to alot of things, but it applies to alot more then it doesn't)
3. it's human nature to have a sex-drive, more specificly, to WANT to have sex.
4. humans go through puberty, at an age that could be very dangerous to concieve a child, both to mom and the baby. (average age is like 10-13)

now onto my main point(s). (first i'll give the basic idea of what i'ms aying, then go back and explain how each fore-mentioned point is relevant.

ok, the bible says it's wrong ot have premarital sex, and that it's wrong to masturbate... many, many christians say, that our genitals were intended to procreate, opposed to using them for pleasure (one of the main arguments for how gay sex is morally wrong against god). so, if these parts were just intended to procreate and not for pleasure, why would god make them so that you receive pleasure from them? you can forget any arguments along hte lines of "because then there would be no point in it", because you dont' have to have pleasure to perform the acts god specifies. another one "so that it will stay erect" well, if god's almighty, then he could of came upw ith some other way to make it stay hard. then he took it one step further, and made it quite possibly the most pleasurable thing you'd experience in your entire life... does your god just love to tempt people, and watch them suffer as they do what he says of not using their genitals for self-gratification?

1 - these parts are intended for procreation and not for self gratification, so why put any feeling in it.
2 - putting temptation in humans (especailly over something like this) is like holding a steak above a neglected starving dog just out of his reach. it just doesn't work, sure a small percentage may be able to hold off and do what he says, but what about the other 98%? if he doesn't want us to use it for selfish purposes so bad, why even bother putting the temptation there?
3 - god controls everything, so he obviously controls the desire in us to have sex, before, durring and after marriage. humans have one of the highest sex drives of all animals. not to mention the fact that god made us put off these "magical scents" that make us want one another even more, than just physical attraction...
4 - this is the one i understand the least.... not in all cases, but in most, once a human goes through puberty, they then, begin to have desire for the opposite sex, up until that point, there's no major attraction between the two, sure you may think the 11 year old in the school desk infront of you is cute, but you dont' really have that burning desire to have sex with her, until you go through puberty. also, it's obvious the womans body is exactly at top notch between 10-13 to have a baby, so why start puberty then? why not have it start years after that, so that about the time you hit 20 or so (because her body is more well suited for it then, and is more likely to have both come out of it healthy) you then begin to get that burning desire?

with these facts present, it seems to me that god is trying to encourage people to have premarital sex and masturbate, for what reason i don't know... he could be trying to tempt you so you learn to not give into it, he could of put all this, this way, just because he knows you will fail.. who knows...

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Originally Posted by slipknotpsycho

first i'll start with some points.
1. both genitals (male and female) are very sensitive (if not the most sensitive)(to pain and pleasure) in our bodies.
2. temptation almost always leads to doing the act rather than just leave it at tempted (doesn't apply to alot of things, but it applies to alot more then it doesn't)
3. it's human nature to have a sex-drive, more specificly, to WANT to have sex.
4. humans go through puberty, at an age that could be very dangerous to concieve a child, both to mom and the baby. (average age is like 10-13)

now onto my main point(s). (first i'll give the basic idea of what i'ms aying, then go back and explain how each fore-mentioned point is relevant.

ok, the bible says it's wrong ot have premarital sex, and that it's wrong to masturbate... many, many christians say, that our genitals were intended to procreate, opposed to using them for pleasure (one of the main arguments for how gay sex is morally wrong against god). so, if these parts were just intended to procreate and not for pleasure, why would god make them so that you receive pleasure from them? you can forget any arguments along hte lines of "because then there would be no point in it", because you dont' have to have pleasure to perform the acts god specifies. another one "so that it will stay erect" well, if god's almighty, then he could of came upw ith some other way to make it stay hard. then he took it one step further, and made it quite possibly the most pleasurable thing you'd experience in your entire life... does your god just love to tempt people, and watch them suffer as they do what he says of not using their genitals for self-gratification?

1 - these parts are intended for procreation and not for self gratification, so why put any feeling in it.
2 - putting temptation in humans (especailly over something like this) is like holding a steak above a neglected starving dog just out of his reach. it just doesn't work, sure a small percentage may be able to hold off and do what he says, but what about the other 98%? if he doesn't want us to use it for selfish purposes so bad, why even bother putting the temptation there?
3 - god controls everything, so he obviously controls the desire in us to have sex, before, durring and after marriage. humans have one of the highest sex drives of all animals. not to mention the fact that god made us put off these "magical scents" that make us want one another even more, than just physical attraction...
4 - this is the one i understand the least.... not in all cases, but in most, once a human goes through puberty, they then, begin to have desire for the opposite sex, up until that point, there's no major attraction between the two, sure you may think the 11 year old in the school desk infront of you is cute, but you dont' really have that burning desire to have sex with her, until you go through puberty. also, it's obvious the womans body is exactly at top notch between 10-13 to have a baby, so why start puberty then? why not have it start years after that, so that about the time you hit 20 or so (because her body is more well suited for it then, and is more likely to have both come out of it healthy) you then begin to get that burning desire?

with these facts present, it seems to me that god is trying to encourage people to have premarital sex and masturbate, for what reason i don't know... he could be trying to tempt you so you learn to not give into it, he could of put all this, this way, just because he knows you will fail.. who knows...

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I'm sorry to sound mean (it is not my intention) but these ideas are not very stable. I'll have to start with where you first go wrong:

God has very specifically intended sex to be a gift for a husband and wife to share with eachother. I'm not sure what bible you've read, but it does NOT teach that sex was intended for procreation only, nor can I think of anywhere where this is even hinted. God has made it abundantly clear that sex, aside from pleasure and purpose, is the joining of man and woman (creating one "whole" entity-human beings are essentially very incomplete as individuals) in the flesh. That is why it is written "so a man will leave his father and mother and be united with his wife, and the two shall become one flesh".

The ONLY reason homosexuality is wrong in God's eyes is because it is the abuse of sex; the bending of a natural law to fit our corrupted desire. Sex between two men in no way SHOULD happen (nor would it in a perfect world), and yet it does because we give up the gifts of God (sex being one of the greatest gifts from God) for our own corrupted and evil desires. This just happens to be one of many examples of that fact. To be honest, our sex drive is no where near as flambouant in its natural state as ours has become. I garuntee you that indulging in a temptation like sex will only make your "sex drive" more savage...look at what happens to people that look at porn all the time-you slowly get bored of "real" sex, naturally, because like a fat person who eats all the time, the more of feed the habbit the larger it gets, and the more it seems to take to satisfy it. Also, masturbation? Hmm...I believe it's common sense. I try not to do it, but of course I do once in a while cave in (which is fair to our standards because we're "only human"), but you shouldn't go by what "christians" say, but rather what the "bible" says. Personally I have not read anything against masturbation in the bible, aside from what the bible has taught me about feeding habbits.

"2 - putting temptation in humans (especailly over something like this) is like holding a steak above a neglected starving dog just out of his reach. it just doesn't work, sure a small percentage may be able to hold off and do what he says, but what about the other 98%? if he doesn't want us to use it for selfish purposes so bad, why even bother putting the temptation there?"

-God does not tempt us. It is the absence of God (which is something you must learn is entirely OUR fault) that allows the sin to become attractive to us. When you are alive in the spirit of God, temptation is simply non-existent (keeping in mind the only one truly alive in the spirit was Jesus, the sacrifice from God). We, however, constantly refuse to hear God every day, therefore we are left to whatever will have us. (think about it this way...how often do you disobey your concious? Honestly?)


3 - god controls everything, so he obviously controls the desire in us to have sex, before, durring and after marriage. humans have one of the highest sex drives of all animals. not to mention the fact that god made us put off these "magical scents" that make us want one another even more, than just physical attraction...

God does not control our desire to have sex...in a sense he is willing to aid us if we ask him (and truly mean it). God will only give you control if you accept that you are not compatable for doing good things without his help to begin with. You can not hold God accountable for your own mistakes, because you are pointing the finger at one who has never wronged you.

first, i never said that the bible said it was intended for procreation only, i said many christians have said before (and will say it again) that they are not for pleasure, they are simply there to reproduce...

and that's all i can say in reply because you're entire post (almost) is based on stipulation, legend, and words put here by humans... if you don't have facts, i can't show you how you're wrong..

Guys..if sex didnt feel good we wouldnt be here think about it.

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Originally Posted by Pyramidsonmars

I'm sorry to sound mean (it is not my intention) but these ideas are not very stable. I'll have to start with where you first go wrong:

God has very specifically intended sex to be a gift for a husband and wife to share with eachother. I'm not sure what bible you've read, but it does NOT teach that sex was intended for procreation only, nor can I think of anywhere where this is even hinted. God has made it abundantly clear that sex, aside from pleasure and purpose, is the joining of man and woman (creating one "whole" entity-human beings are essentially very incomplete as individuals) in the flesh. That is why it is written "so a man will leave his father and mother and be united with his wife, and the two shall become one flesh".

The ONLY reason homosexuality is wrong in God's eyes is because it is the abuse of sex; the bending of a natural law to fit our corrupted desire. Sex between two men in no way SHOULD happen (nor would it in a perfect world), and yet it does because we give up the gifts of God (sex being one of the greatest gifts from God) for our own corrupted and evil desires. This just happens to be one of many examples of that fact. To be honest, our sex drive is no where near as flambouant in its natural state as ours has become. I garuntee you that indulging in a temptation like sex will only make your "sex drive" more savage...look at what happens to people that look at porn all the time-you slowly get bored of "real" sex, naturally, because like a fat person who eats all the time, the more of feed the habbit the larger it gets, and the more it seems to take to satisfy it. Also, masturbation? Hmm...I believe it's common sense. I try not to do it, but of course I do once in a while cave in (which is fair to our standards because we're "only human"), but you shouldn't go by what "christians" say, but rather what the "bible" says. Personally I have not read anything against masturbation in the bible, aside from what the bible has taught me about feeding habbits.

"2 - putting temptation in humans (especailly over something like this) is like holding a steak above a neglected starving dog just out of his reach. it just doesn't work, sure a small percentage may be able to hold off and do what he says, but what about the other 98%? if he doesn't want us to use it for selfish purposes so bad, why even bother putting the temptation there?"

-God does not tempt us. It is the absence of God (which is something you must learn is entirely OUR fault) that allows the sin to become attractive to us. When you are alive in the spirit of God, temptation is simply non-existent (keeping in mind the only one truly alive in the spirit was Jesus, the sacrifice from God). We, however, constantly refuse to hear God every day, therefore we are left to whatever will have us. (think about it this way...how often do you disobey your concious? Honestly?)


3 - god controls everything, so he obviously controls the desire in us to have sex, before, durring and after marriage. humans have one of the highest sex drives of all animals. not to mention the fact that god made us put off these "magical scents" that make us want one another even more, than just physical attraction...

God does not control our desire to have sex...in a sense he is willing to aid us if we ask him (and truly mean it). God will only give you control if you accept that you are not compatable for doing good things without his help to begin with. You can not hold God accountable for your own mistakes, because you are pointing the finger at one who has never wronged you.

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I love a good fairy tale....

Actually, Pyramid was speaking biblically...and he's pretty much on it.

ok you're wrong about one thing Pyramidsonmars. somewhere in the bible it says something to the effect of "you shall not spill your seed upon the ground" or some BS like that. and that is basicly saying your "seed" is only to go into a woman...hence the whole "for procreation only" argument slip pointed out.

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Originally Posted by mont974x4

Actually, Pyramid was speaking biblically...and he's pretty much on it.

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I was also speaking biblically... It's all a good fairy tale.

I don't think the Bible addresses masturbation itself as being wrong. The Bible does say that to even look upon a woman in lust is to commit adultery...which is a sin.

Sex itself was created by God to bring two people together as one in the amrriage bed. If you read Song of Solomon it is an erotic book written between two lovers. I don't rmemeber there ever being a limitation on that passion being limited to procreation.

The Bible talks a lot about sexual immoraility...no adultery, no homosexuality, no beastiality, no rape, no incest.

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Originally Posted by Pyramidsonmars

Sex between two men in no way SHOULD happen (nor would it in a perfect world), and yet it does because we give up the gifts of God (sex being one of the greatest gifts from God) for our own corrupted and evil desires.

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But it SHOULD between a woman and a woman :D

I fail to see how homosexuality is evil when its natural. It happens in the rest of the animal kingdom, how is it any diffrent when it comes to humans? I don't think penguins are "evil" in nature. And what about the Bonobos? (a species closely related to chimps) They have sex between females and females, males and males, and jack each other off all the time. They say "hello" with a quick fuck after all.