Rootbound, old nutes, overwatering or what? Pics incl. of roots

Hey all I have been having an issue with my plants for over a week now (about 10 days)

strain: 3xTrainwreck, 3xSourdiesel, 3x some kind of Sativa (i'm medicated and forgot the strain)
lighting type: 600xHPS, @500 w of T5 panels on the sides of the plants, T12 strips (on the bottoms of the pots) and cfls around the exterior tops (for complete side and underlighting)
lighting timing: aprox10/14
lighting height from plants: 13 inches HPS (the florescent are less than an inch)
vent method: box fan 3 feet away on high
grow method: soil 9 plants in a 4.5x4.5 home made black/white plastic poly tent
grow mode (sog, scrog, normal, etc): Normal
nute ___/fert __ brand: Advanced Hydroponics 3 part
nute /fert mix:2.5 tsp/gal grow, micro, and blook
nute/fert additives: Tiger Bloom
medium __ /soil __ type: Roots organics Formula 707
medium/soil quantity per plant:Soil in 3 gallon pots
water source: tap left out to evaporate flouride and chlorine
water quality: ok? always between 6.2-7.0
water amount per plant (soil/non hydro): frequency: maybe part of problem... water by weight, when plant needs it as per how it weighs
flushing interval: only once, last week
reservoir change interval(hydro):
plant age:approx vegged 10 weeks now at day 26 of 12/12
Ph fresh nutes/ferts: @6.8
PPM fresh nutes/ferts:dunno
Ph spent nutes/ferts**: dunno
PPM spent nutes/ferts**:dunno
Temp "day":never above 80
Temp "night":as low as 55 or 50
Relative humidity "day":* dunno but not dry, not wet either
Relative Humidity "night":* dunno,



My problem started a while back. I was growing (veg) my plants in my first home built grow cab. measuring 4'x2'x7', totally lined with mylar. Hanging above the plants was a home made cfl fixture out of PVC tuning and T adapters that held @ 400 watts CFL lights, on the back wall I had 2 T5 2' 4 bulb panels. on the front side I turned a roll around cart into a CFL clamp lamp stand that held 6 clamp lamps that held a y adapter and 2 CFL's each... I had approx 700-800 watts of total CFL/T5 lighting and all lights were right up to the plants if not touching them surrounding with light. An excellent build that many people on forums, and in real world complimented me on.

I have been using this cab now for 1.5 years and have had 5 really great harvests. The last harvest I got around 250 grams of great bud, the main colas were huge (14-20 grams each) and I was very happy.

So into this grow now... A friend gave me 9 clones, 3 sour diesel, 3 train wreck, and 3 of a sativa who's strain I have forgotten.

The plants were vegging real nice, bushed right up and turned into behemoths before I knew it, and before I was ready to expand my setup and get a HPS light. So I let them stay in my grow box, but took one of them out so I had 2 rows of 4 plants pretty squished in together. My plants were becoming very crowded and I had to wait to buy a 600w HPS light. by the time I had my HPS light the plants were all exhibiting signs of distress, lower leaves wilting and turning light green.

I was watering them ever 3 or 4 days as they felt like they needed it by weight, however I ran out of veg nutes right around when the serious overcrowding problem was at its peak. So when I was feeding them nutes I simply gave em a bit more micro and tigerbloom as it has some N in it.

in week 10 or 11 of veg I bought a 600w HPS light and built a 4.5x4.5x7 foot tent out of black/white plastic poly around a 2x4 frame screwed into my wall and ceiling.

I hung the HPS light overhead and attached mt T5 panels to the walls and clamped on all 6 of my clamp lamps. I now switched to 12/12 to star my flowering. I am in3 gallon pots, and plants are 2.5 feet tall.

I noticed I had a couple leaves that had a few insects on them, thought they were spider mites, so I got some pyrethrin spray and sprayed my plants. I sprayed once, waited a few days and sprayed again, and waited a week and spayed again. I burnt a few of the larger fan leaves, but not too badly. I haven't seen ANY insects on the leaves again since.

I put in my plants and was very happy with my setup. Everything was going on well, the platns started to stretch as they should in beginninjg flower stages, they grew 6-10 inches in a couple weeks. The plants had to start to get really light green undergrowth and all the lower 3rd leaves were wilting and still looking like they were stressed from overcrowding still. I ws only watering every 4 days or so as they felt light in weight and needed water. I would add nutes every other watering and only at a medium-medium high strength. My nutes were very light in N and I figured it was ok because they are in flower. I let things go by a couple weeks and all my trainwreck and sour diesel plants were getting really bad droopy, wilty leaves on the lower 3rd and lots of the leaves were falling and breaking off (like 20 leaves or more per day total)


I began to worry and try to troubleshoot possible issues.

My first trouble shooting was to give them a little more veg nutes I had stashed around from along time ago. This did nothing for my issue, the leaves still were going light green and falling off.

My next step was to flush my plants thinking I had some salt buildups. seeing that my HPS light only was penetrating about a foot into the canopy I also added some T12 strips to the lower level sitting on top of the pots to illuminate the lower part of the plants. This did nothing, the leaves are still going very light green and is progressing up further the plant.

I was worried that maybe I was over watering and feeding my plants so I have decided to let them drink all the water in the pots.

I also thought maybe I was having root rot issues so I pulled 4 of the worst looking plants out of their pots to inspect the roots.

The roots all look very bright white and no signs of root rot, or root bounding. I did see some very small white, almost impossible to see with the naked eye insects. Extremely small, and running around inside the soil around the roots. I did not see too many of them, only a few, but they are there. All the roots look very healthy (see photos).

So this is where I am at now.

over the past 24 hours the plants have consumed much more water out of the pots (last watering was a flush) and all the roots look very healthy, maybe a little root-bound, with a few very very small white insects running around. The flowers all have grown alot and added a 1/4 inch to the length.

The lower leaves are still very light green and some are still falling off (though not as much)

However they are still falling off.

I have been reading so much over the past few years, have searched and read thousands of threads but nothing I am doing is working. I sprayed for insects when I found them. I have added more, better lighting, tried to adjust the nute levels, flushed, inspected the roots, adjusted and increased my ventilation.

Please I know this is alot of info but can you help me troubleshoot or give me some advice on what to do now?

I have left my plants alone since my last flush 6 days ago.

What to do?

Plant photos: Heres the setup

here are the pics of the plants with problems...

more plant photos showing stress and light green issues...

and Last photos of the roots...

They look rootbound, overwatered, and looks like the ph is starting to drop.

2.5 foot plants in a 3 gallon sounds right, but they do look a tad rootbound. How long since the last transplant? If it's been more than 6-8 weeks, the buffering in your soil is likely fading. A transplant into a 5 gallon pot would help by adding some fresh buffering that should take you through harvest.

The 'quilted' leaf look tells me you are either overwatering them, or spraying them too much and too often. IMHO, rain is not something that cannabis plants anticipate, but it's more like they deal with it. Let the roots do what they do best (moisture and nutrient uptake) and let the leaves do what they do best. (photosynthesize, gas/air exchange...)

Old damage won't heal. (old leaves are old news)

Might be a good idea to find the identity of those bugs in the soil. Perhaps asking the employees from where you purchased the soil from would be wise.

Check online for weekly feeding instructions. With some nutrient companies, they label the individual bottles different than what they list online. Not sure if it's because they think you might be using it as a stand-alone nutrient, or what...but double-check dosages and frequencies just to be sure.

Not usually a good idea to mix additives and nutrients from different manufacturers. Redundancies and overdoing it is a real possibility. Tiger Bloom is a catalyst tea designed to compliment the FF line, but may be problematic with another brand. You're using the 3-part from AN, so the Tiger Bloom shouldn't be necessary anyway.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rusty Trichome

Not usually a good idea to mix additives and nutrients from different manufacturers. Redundancies and overdoing it is a real possibility. Tiger Bloom is a catalyst tea designed to compliment the FF line, but may be problematic with another brand. You're using the 3-part from AN, so the Tiger Bloom shouldn't be necessary anyway.

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...So I'm standing there going over some CanCom posts in my mind while feeding my flower shed, and remembered the above statement. I did so as I was adding some Big Bloom to the water, and realized I took a tangent. The Big Bloom is the catalyst tea, but the Fox Farms Grow Big and Tiger Bloom each contain the necessary micronutrients. Seems I was combining thoughts, but using the AN 3-part and adding the Tiger Bloom is redundant and potentially harmful.