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pisshead
03-15-2007, 05:34 AM
maybe the 9/11 mastermind who just confessed (what a joke, too many people must be questioning the freedom hating muslim conspiracy theory nowadays...) knows the answer to this...

maybe he can tell us how he brought down building 7 in such a beautiful controlled demolition...as well...


Is There A Secret To The 9/11 Insurance Battle?
Why is Allianz really holding out on paying Larry Silverstein?
Steve Watson
Infowars.net (http://infowars.net/index.html)
Wednesday, March 14, 2007


A major insurance company is holding back from paying Larry Silverstein insurance money he says he is still owed from the destruction of the World Trade Center complex, the question is why?


Reuters (http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,21372424-31037,00.html) is reporting:











Mr Silverstein, who leased the downtown site destroyed on September 11, 2001, claims Allianz still owes him $US553 million ($A708.57 million) and that a second insurer, Britain's Royal & Sun Alliance, owes him $US250 million ($A320.33 million). He said their reluctance had slowed rebuilding at the site.


Silverstein has been making a great deal of noise this week out on the streets of Manhattan with a crowd of about 200 cheering construction workers chanting "We're going to make you pay!''




Silverstein has also been comparing his case to that of Gulf Coast homeowners who are suing for claims from Hurricane Katrina in 2005. "You can count on some insurance companies to look for every way they can think of to avoid paying up,'' he is quoted as saying.




The payment dispute arose when Silverstein agreed with New York's Port Authority on terms for the reconstruction of the new Freedom tower in April last year. Under the deal, he was granted permission to build the Freedom Tower but is required to hand it back to the Port Authority after completion.




Silverstein later filed a lawsuit in June, claiming that seven insurers had refused to provide assurances that their obligations to pay were unaffected by the April agreement. Silverstein has claimed that it is this that is holding up redevelopment at ground zero.





Allianz is now the sole remaining insurance carrier that has not affirmed they will pay out The New York Times (http://www.silversteinproperties.com/news_content.aspx?news_id=22) reported at the time:













But a lawyer for Allianz, which owes a maximum of $552.5 million at ground zero, said yesterday that the lawsuit was unnecessary, because a legal proceeding was begun nearly five years ago to determine exactly how much money is owed at ground zero under the terms of the insurance policy. He said that Mr. Silverstein was merely seeking a different venue for one of many issues now being debated in federal court.


At the end of two trials in 2004, a federal court decided (http://prisonplanet.com/articles/december2004/071204silversteinwins.htm) that the insurers owed a maximum of $4.6 billion, more than the $3.5 billion term of the insurance policy. Silverstein had originally claimed $7 billion, attempting to prove that the crashing of the two planes into two towers constituted two separate events. The two sides have been locked in a grueling appraisal process to determine exactly how much of the $4.6 billion must be paid out.





A spokeswoman for Allianz has said that a mediation process between Mr Silverstein and the German insurer began yesterday. She said she had no further details. Reuters further reports:













The Allianz spokeswoman said the insurer had already paid almost $US2 billion ($A2.56 billion) in claims from the World Trade Center disaster, settling with all its policy holders except for Silverstein and the Port Authority.





Ms Schwarzer said Allianz has paid Mr Silverstein and the Port Authority almost $US550 million ($A704.72 million) and that the developer had more than enough money in the bank to begin construction at the lower Manhattan site.
Another spokeswoman for Allianz, Andreas Shell, head of the damages department, was quoted by the Financial Times (http://www.wtc.com/wtc_news_content.aspx?news_id=74) as saying "The reconstruction could start immediately. This is not down to the insurers,"







It now seems that Allianz is being forced to back down as Brooklyn-Queens Democratic Congressman Anthony Weiner has vowed to punish the insurers with fines or operating restrictions if they do not pay up.




Silverstein is determined to rake in every last penny possible from 9/11 and has already secured billions from other insurers without a blink of an eye over the fact that he leased the property just six weeks before the attacks and has since been caught in an admission that he ordered at least one of the buildings, WTC 7, "pulled" on 9/11.




Building 7 occupied a city block immediately north of the World Trade Center complex. Photos taken minutes before its collapse show small fires on two or three floors. Building 7 became only the third steel building in history before or since 9/11 to collapse from fire damage. The other two were the North and South towers of the World Trade Center.




We have thoroughly documented the mystery surrounding the collapse of building 7 (http://www.prisonplanet.com/011904wtc7.html), an issue which recently exploded back into the limelight with the revelations that the BBC reported that the building had collapsed (http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/february2007/280207timestamp.htm) up to an hour before it actually fell. Any building that was not owned by Silverstein Properties that day strangely remained upright, despite being a lot closer to the two towers that collapsed onto them.




Questions about the highly suspicious nature of the building's collapse remained comparatively muted until January 2004, when a PBS documentary, America Rebuilds, originally broadcast in September 2002, received attention across the Internet.




The documentary was made infamous for one comment made by Larry Silverstein on the subject of 9/11. Silverstein states, "I remember getting a call from the, er, fire department commander, telling me that they were not sure they were gonna be able to contain the fire, and I said, "We've had such terrible loss of life, maybe the smartest thing to do is pull it. And they made that decision to pull and we watched the building collapse."




Click here (http://infowars.com/Video/911/wtc7_pbs.WMV) to watch the clip.




We know that the term 'pull it' means to bring the building down by means of explosives because in the same documentary a cleanup worker (in December 2001) refers to the demolition of WTC Building 6 when he says, "...we're getting ready to pull the building six." The term is industry jargon for planned demolition.




Click here (http://www.prisonplanet.com/pullit2.mp3) to listen to the clip.




For the following year and a half the Internet and alternative talk radio was aflame with talk of Building 7 and Silverstein's apparent admission. For many it is now the central issue of 9/11.




In January last year we reported that the State Department, as part of its pathetic efforts to debunk 9/11 research, had posted a response from Silverstein's spokesperson Dara McQuillan to the "pull it" saga.




The statement read:






Seven World Trade Center collapsed at 5:20 p.m. on September 11, 2001, after burning for seven hours. There were no casualties, thanks to the heroism of the Fire Department and the work of Silverstein Properties employees who evacuated tenants from the building.





The Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) conducted a thorough investigation of the collapse of all the World Trade Center buildings. The FEMA report concluded that the collapse of Seven World Trade Center was a direct result of fires triggered by debris from the collapse of WTC Tower 1.



In the afternoon of September 11, Mr. Silverstein spoke to the Fire Department Commander on site at Seven World Trade Center. The Commander told Mr. Silverstein that there were several firefighters in the building working to contain the fires. Mr. Silverstein expressed his view that the most important thing was to protect the safety of those firefighters, including, if necessary, to have them withdraw from the building.


Later in the day, the Fire Commander ordered his firefighters out of the building and at 5:20 p.m. the building collapsed. No lives were lost at Seven World Trade Center on September 11, 2001.


As noted above, when Mr. Silverstein was recounting these events for a television documentary he stated, ??I said, you know, we've had such terrible loss of life. Maybe the smartest thing to do is to pull it.? Mr. McQuillan has stated that by ??it,? Mr. Silverstein meant the contingent of firefighters remaining in the building.The insurmountable problem with this explanation of Silverstein's statement is that there were no firefighters inside WTC 7.



Dr. Shyam Sunder, of the National Institutes of Standards and Technology (NIST), which investigated the collapse of WTC 7, is quoted in Popular Mechanics (9/11: Debunking the Myths (http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/defense/1227842.html?page=5&c=y), March, 2005) as saying: "There was no firefighting in WTC 7."
The FEMA report (http://www.fema.gov/library/wtcstudy.shtm) on the collapses, from May, 2002, also says about the WTC 7 collapse: "no manual firefighting operations were taken by FDNY."
And an article (http://thewebfairy.com/killtown/wtc7/archive/nytimes_112901.html) by James Glanz in the New York Times on November 29, 2001 says about WTC 7: "By 11:30 a.m., the fire commander in charge of that area, Assistant Chief Frank Fellini, ordered firefighters away from it for safety reasons."
Silverstein's explanation, after two years of stonewalling, that "pull it" meant to withdraw the firefighters is a lie. There were no firefighters in the building for hours before the building's collapse.
Furthermore, even if he did mean "pull the firefighters" then why did he say "pull it", with no reference to anything other than the building? Consider also the timing: "they made that decision to pull and then we watched the building collapse." Could it really be possible that some (nonexistent) fire brigade was removed from the building and just at that moment ("then") the building collapsed? Is there really any doubt here about what Silverstein meant?
The only reasonable conclusion is that Larry Silverstein's statement is an admission that WTC 7 was brought down by a controlled demolition, meaning that the official version of what happened to WTC 7 is false, and casting serious doubt on the official story that terrorists of a foreign origin destroyed the twin towers, as well as on the rest of the official account of 9/11. Note that this admission is a statement against Silverstein's own interests (putting him at odds with the official version of events and potentially jeopardizing his insurance claims). Such statements are given great weight as a matter of law.
In February of 2002 Silverstein Properties won $861 million from Industrial Risk Insurers to rebuild on the site of WTC 7. Silverstein Properties' estimated investment in WTC 7 was $386 million. This building's collapse alone resulted in a profit of about $500 million.
Since then a total of nine insurance companies have continued to pay Silverstein as the legal wrangle continues. The only ones who have resisted in any way have been Allianz.
Interesting it is then that Allianz are also the only insurance company involved to also refer to the Silverstein "pull it" saga.
In May 2005 we carried a report (http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/may2005/040505potentialfraud.htm)from press release website PR Web which highlighted a proposal by a small shareholder to withhold approval from the Board of Directors for failure to investigate signs of insurance fraud on 9/11 had been published on the website of the Allianz Group in preparation for its May 4th annual meeting.



The report stated:
Allianz Group published a shareholder proposal on April 20th faulting management for ignoring signs of insurance fraud on 9/11/2001. Allianz carried a significant portion of the insurance coverage on the WTC, and stands to pay a corresponding portion of the $3.5 billion payout currently being litigated in New York. In his proposal, shareholder John Leonard, a California native and a publisher of books on 9/11, pointed to reports that building WTC 7 apparently collapsed by demolition, and for no plausible reason related to the 9/11 attacks. Management replied that it relied on official US government reports which made no mention of such evidence.
The Allianz Group is incorporated in Germany and has approximately 570,000 shareholders. Under German Stock Companies law, publicly held companies are required to publish shareholder proposals that meet certain criteria. The full text of the proposal can be read at the bottom of our original posting of this report here (http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/may2005/040505potentialfraud.htm).
Is it possible that Allianz have indeed looked into these claims and are withholding any more pay outs partially due to these factors?
If so there may be a secret to this insurance battle that Silverstein properties and certainly the federal government would not want to expose. This is certainly an interesting possibility and a case we shall be keeping close watch on.

Breukelen advocaat
03-15-2007, 06:21 AM
Is it possible that Allianz have indeed looked into these claims and are withholding any more pay outs partially due to these factors?
If so there may be a secret to this insurance battle that Silverstein properties and certainly the federal government would not want to expose. This is certainly an interesting possibility and a case we shall be keeping close watch on.

Theres' no "secret" in this - if Allianz thought that 9/11 was a conspiracy, and not the sole work of Muslim terrorists, it would have been made public by now. They want to hold-off for as long as possible - everything is negotiable and they're probably looking to lower the payout amounts. The bottom line is that they will pay - even if some of the Allianz shareholders point to conspiracy theories in order to delay it.

Zimzum
03-15-2007, 12:38 PM
So your first link claims to be from Reuters.. Its almost the same, but its got a few differences from the original story here (http://today.reuters.com/news/articleinvesting.aspx?type=bondsnews&storyID=2007-03-12T192907Z_01_N12368014_RTRIDST_0_ALLIANZ-SILVERSTEIN.XML). Why tell us someone is saying something, yet take us to a different sight, what is to hide I wonder?



Your story says,

"Silverstein has been making a great deal of noise this week out on the streets of Manhattan with a crowd of about 200 cheering construction workers chanting "We're going to make you pay!'' "

Both Reuters and your first link say...

"We're going to make you pay!'' Larry Silverstein shouted in front of a crowd of about 200 cheering construction workers at a noon rally in midtown Manhattan."

So was it Mr. Silverstein doing the shouting like even your wrong link and the correct say? Or where 200 cheering construction works chanting?

Krogith
03-15-2007, 07:33 PM
So your first link claims to be from Reuters.. Its almost the same, but its got a few differences from the original story here (http://today.reuters.com/news/articleinvesting.aspx?type=bondsnews&storyID=2007-03-12T192907Z_01_N12368014_RTRIDST_0_ALLIANZ-SILVERSTEIN.XML). Why tell us someone is saying something, yet take us to a different sight, what is to hide I wonder?



Your story says,

"Silverstein has been making a great deal of noise this week out on the streets of Manhattan with a crowd of about 200 cheering construction workers chanting "We're going to make you pay!'' "

Both Reuters and your first link say...

"We're going to make you pay!'' Larry Silverstein shouted in front of a crowd of about 200 cheering construction workers at a noon rally in midtown Manhattan."

So was it Mr. Silverstein doing the shouting like even your wrong link and the correct say? Or where 200 cheering construction works chanting?

ROFL, wow you can't read or something? When I 1st Read this I thought it was just Silverstein makeing Noise.

"Silverstein has been making a great deal of noise this week out on the streets of Manhattan with a crowd of about 200 cheering construction workers chanting "We're going to make you pay!'' "

Does it say Silverstein or a group with Silverstein? Are you Really Confused?

Zimzum
03-15-2007, 08:39 PM
None the less, its not the link it should have come from to begin with. But he uses "with a crowd" and "chanting", implies that not just Mr. Silverstein was the one saying it. Are you an english professer? I'm not, so please prove me wrong.

Shouted - Adj. shouted - in a vehement outcry; "his shouted words of encouragement could be heard over the crowd noises"

Chanting - Noun chanting - the act of singing in a monotonous tone

Monotonous - adj.
1. Sounded or spoken in an unvarying tone.
2. Tediously repetitious or lacking in variety. See Synonyms at boring.

eg420ne
03-15-2007, 10:57 PM
Hey Zman wanta try a fact-finding mission on the goverment official theory,I double-dog dare you..and no a person who was torture is not reliable

Zimzum
03-15-2007, 11:21 PM
Hey Zman wanta try a fact-finding mission on the goverment official theory,I double-dog dare you..and no a person who was torture is not reliable

Sure, I'm going to Barns and Noble in a few anyways. 9/11 commission report is probably now in the bargen bin anyways.

eg420ne
03-15-2007, 11:26 PM
LoL 911 commission yeah that should do it, you mean omission. i have a copy of it as well it makes a good drink coaster

Zimzum
03-15-2007, 11:30 PM
Ok then, you tell me what document you consider the official report? Give me a name and I will read it.

eg420ne
03-16-2007, 01:00 AM
Hell i thought u would know! man it took me until the start of the Iraq and then reading PNAC(Rebuilding America's
Defenses) to even come to terms in thinking OUR government were fully involved in 911. at first i thought UnitedNations or something to that effect, but not my own government....but i saw the lies, coated all over the Bush Regime and if you cant see them lies then i dont know what to say....

Oh yeah "USAma Bin blamed" never took credit for 911, what do you have? voice overs and grainy videos to show forth. its like watching 1984 in real life

But read that 911 commission report, i still look though mine once in a while..but then after your done read David Ray Griffin’s The 9/11 Commission Report: Omissions & Distortions Book... it may help, maybe not, but its worth a try...

eg420ne
03-16-2007, 01:18 AM
Better yet, maybe everything is what it seems to be and GwBush is here to save america..from radical democrats, the evil UN, and cavemen with boxcutters....i still would rather fight them here then over there..we need a good fight here to release all this tension

VisionaryUrbanTactic
03-16-2007, 02:54 PM
Ok then, you tell me what document you consider the official report? Give me a name and I will read it.


here is some serious reading material for those interesting in understanding why this could not of happened the way it did.

The Behaviour of Multi-storey Composite Steel Framed Structures in Response to Compartment Fires. (http://911research.wtc7.net/mirrors/guardian2/fire/SLamont.htm)


this one is about the cardington fire tests, and why the fireproffing on the wtc did not matter one bit.

and this bottom link is a government guy getting cut up on his 9-11 story

The Collapse: An Engineer's Perspective. (http://911research.wtc7.net/mirrors/guardian2/wtc/nova.htm)


how many of you knew about the fire fighters oral history of 9-11?

it was left out of the commision report

Oral Histories From Sept. 11 Compiled by the New York Fire Department - The New York Times (http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/html/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/met_WTC_histories_full_01.html)

over 500 fire fighters/em's and first responders, most saying they heard 2nd(and 3rd) explosions.

everyone wants to take eyewitness reports, except for these that is.

Zimzum
03-17-2007, 12:09 AM
The Collapse: An Engineer's Perspective. (http://911research.wtc7.net/mirrors/guardian2/wtc/nova.htm)



Since you say you have facts would you mind telling me who wrote this up? And what is there education and experience? Its a debunking of NOVA and an engineer (Dr. Thomas Eagar).. yet they leave out who wrote that story.. was it debunked by Dr. Blockhead of Icecream University?



Give me time and Ill read up on more.

Zimzum
03-17-2007, 03:56 PM
The Behaviour of Multi-storey Composite Steel Framed Structures in Response to Compartment Fires. (http://911research.wtc7.net/mirrors/guardian2/fire/SLamont.htm)


this one is about the cardington fire tests, and why the fireproffing on the wtc did not matter one bit.


My question on this is, how is a doctor of philosophy an expert on "Behavior of Multi-story Composite Steel Framed Structures in Response to Compartment Fires"? What qualifies a philosopher to make such statements in a forensics field in which she has no education in?

VisionaryUrbanTactic
03-18-2007, 06:09 AM
My question on this is, how is a doctor of philosophy an expert on "Behavior of Multi-story Composite Steel Framed Structures in Response to Compartment Fires"? What qualifies a philosopher to make such statements in a forensics field in which she has no education in?

under the supervision of Dr A.S. Usmani, Prof. D.D. Drysdale, Dr B. Lane and Prof. J.M. Rotter.

Where other sources are quoted full references are given.

VisionaryUrbanTactic
03-18-2007, 06:22 AM
Dr A.S. Usmani


Dr ASIF USMANI

Reader in Structural Engineering

Alexander Graham Bell Bldg., Room 3.08

Telephone: +44 (0) 131 650 7161

Fax: +44 (0) 131 650 6781

email



Place of Birth:



Academic Qualifications: PhD, University of Wales, Swansea

MSc, Stanford University, California

BE, NED University of Eng & Tech, Karachi




Prof. D.D. Drysdale



Prof. D.D. Drysdale,
University of Edinburgh,
Fire Safety Engineering Group,
Institute for Infrastructure and Environment,
Crew Building,
The King's Buildings,
Edinburgh, Scotland, EH9 3JL,
UK,
E-mail: [email protected]

as for old jm rotter, you will find he is one of the worlds leading guys on this type of research, just google his name, or here is a link or two from his work

1 PARAMETRIC STUDY ON THE BUCKLING OF THIN STEEL CYLINDRICAL SHELLS UNDER ELEVATED LOCAL AXIAL COMPRESSION STRESSES ABSTRACT (http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:ZRJ6ryHvq3UJ:www.ce.washington.edu/em03/proceedings/papers/667.pdf+Prof.+J.M.+Rotter&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=10&gl=us)

here is the google link

Prof. J.M. Rotter - Google Search (http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rls=RNWE,RNWE:2006-27,RNWE:en&q=Prof%2e+J%2eM%2e+Rotter)

now since she was under the direct supervision of these people here, and add onto the fact that NO ONE in this field has said this research is flawed.

i'm happy with the results.

now take in mind the date of these tests, as the tests were not done to show anything about 9/11 or what happened that day, so lets not try and muddy the waters on that point.

VisionaryUrbanTactic
03-18-2007, 06:28 AM
Since you say you have facts would you mind telling me who wrote this up? And what is there education and experience? Its a debunking of NOVA and an engineer (Dr. Thomas Eagar).. yet they leave out who wrote that story.. was it debunked by Dr. Blockhead of Icecream University?



Give me time and Ill read up on more.


i think it was john bonham that wrote it.

point is, you can tell that the guy is right, and the government guy is strecthing the truth a bit much, dont you think?

will knowing who wrote the rebuttal make it suck any less for your side?

not really.

any person with common sense can read that nova story, and see homie is telling tall tales.

lets stop beating around the bush, is the guy telling the truth?

Zimzum
03-18-2007, 03:43 PM
i think it was john bonham that wrote it.

point is, you can tell that the guy is right, and the government guy is strecthing the truth a bit much, dont you think?

will knowing who wrote the rebuttal make it suck any less for your side?

not really.

any person with common sense can read that nova story, and see homie is telling tall tales.

lets stop beating around the bush, is the guy telling the truth?

Well for starters I hold no Ph.D, So I do not call myself an expert in any field. However I will believe a story more if the author has the credentials to back up his area of experience. Kinda like a lawyer telling me how to preform spinal surgery. To someone with no proper training on the subject you can't go on the fact of "Hey it shouldn't look like that", who made you an expert to make such a claim going only on what you think it should have looked like?

Once people where told thunder came from god/gods being pissed off, just for the fact people couldn't comprehend science or had little to no knowledge of it. Now we know the science behind thunder and even teach it to elementary school kids. So today when you hear thunder you know why it happens and are not down on your knees praying for forgiveness to whatever your god maybe every time it happens.

Now a building is downed in ways they never where before and people are screaming more or less "god was pissed off" without knowing any of the science behind it. After 9/11 it seems quite allot of people are now considering themselves "experts" in how a building should react when they themselves just don't have the slightest training in the field.