3rd Hydro Attempt - advice needed

[420kidder]

Ok so the past several hydro attempts have failed. We also tried growing in soil several times and have failed. :(

Each of the times we attempted to grow we put some old seeds into a wet paper towel and into a plastic ziploc and in the light a few times, and other times in the dark. The dark seemed to do better although I've read both ways of doing it so we tried both.

See our attached hydro system which includes a 430Watt San Agro lamp. I thought this was a good lamp but I guess it may not be?

All times we failed using hydro or soil, we've been using the same light which is our 430Watt San Agro. We are definitely beginers, but hoping to make this work sooner than later.

The first time in soil we didn't yet have our light and just used cool white 60 watt light bulbs :) The plants stretched, I guess is the term, meaning they grew long and stayed very thin days after coming out of the soil. Also we did not use fertilizer, and used some Walmart soil that was $0.60/bag and I found some hair in it.

The next time in soil, we had the light, and I used Scott's soil with added phosporous for root growth it says. The plants seemed to grow very slowly, although one of the 5 I tried to grow grew extremely quick at first. Then they slowly turned yellow each.

I don't know if the 6" pots are too big or what, but once again we didn't use fertilizer and by the time they got to 7 weeks old, they were only about 12 inches tall and only a few inches wide and mostly yellow. Also the lights may have been too close at first. At one time I had the light about 6 inches from the tops of the new plants because I was told to put the light right up to them. Eventually I moved the light a couple of feet away from the tops.

I always waited forever to water, but not too long. I would for the most part not water more than once within a 24 hour period.

The hydro attempt the first time failed I believe because we didn't have a timer to turn the water flow on or off so it was constantly on. I believe the roots got soggy or something. Now I have a timer that pumps water for 15 minutes every 2 hours.

Anyway this last time I transplanted the plants that were almost dead and yellow into the hydro system, and noticed they started to turn green and see a tiny bit of new green growth. It was definitely noticeable, but after about 4 or 5 days it seemed to stop and they seemed to continue to die. Perhaps it was a bad transfer from soil to hydro. Or perhaps water every 2 hours is too often. These are some questions I haven't found the answers to.

When I transplanted, the plants had a lot more roots than I thought they would. each one of the pots when I flipped the pot over to let the plant fall out, I could see roots all over the bottoms of each.

I use city water but it's possible the PH could be a factor. I thought I tested it and the strip pointed to around 5.5 but I could be mistaken. For hydroponics we use what came with the system which is some powder that we are supposed to put 1 scoop of each of them (one says grow, one says bloom) per gallon. So basically 2 different scoops per gallon, or 12 total scoops for the 6 gallons of water.

My girlfriend and I have some new seeds, but we don't want to mess this up for the millionth time. ;)

She wants to try using our hydro system now from start to finish. So I'm asking for some advice and last minute tips. I've pretty much mentioned everything that I know.

This time we have the new switch to control water flow, but I'm unsure whether or not we should decrease waterings, etc.

We are more than willing to purchase a new GROW bulb, but don't want to make the same mistake as with the San Agro. Before I bought the hydro kit with the San Agro, I did a little research on this site and thought I read that it was a great buy. Then after buying it and searching for it here I thought I read it's not so good.

We purchased a book, Marijuana Horticulture Indoor/Outdoor Medical Grower's Bible, by Jorge. It's very informative and has helped a lot already. I guess our biggest down fall may have been the lack of fertilizers.

Should I spend the extra money and buy some better nutrients than the grow and bloom that came with the hydro system? The granules don't disolve all too well.

For growth if we can spend the money, we should get a Metal Halide? I've read people say CFI or something like that and I'm not sure exactly what to be using. Please let me know your advice.

I'm sorry for all the questions, but after reading the forums, I feel I just don't have a solid understanding of everything yet.

Thanks for everyone's help.

[letsburn06]

Ok thats was alot to read so ill prolly forget he things im spose to answer so ill try my best here.The system you are using and the light aint the problem..trust me i got the same set up.By the sounds of it yes your problem with the soil attempts is you didnt fertilze..you should give it nutrients after about a week or 2 and walmart soil isnt really a factor cuz ive used walmart soil plenty of times,but now i use fox farm.Also when you were growing in soil you should water every other day but not a whole lot..or some ppl even only water when the top of the soil looks dry.As for the hydro grows..the nutrients aint the problem becuase i use them nutrients threw my whole grow.Your ph should be around 5.5 least thats what i keep mine at.And as for your light i keep mine 43 inches away from the top of the plant...i dont know if that is to far but it seems to work great for me.And watering them 15 minutes every 2 hours may be to much i run mine at 15 minutes ever 3 to 3 1/2 but remember that your roots dont stay wet for very long if your using your lil rock things they give u to grow with...not sure what they are called.And there is really no need to buy a mh light as for your question bout ppl talking about a cfi light....they are talking about cfl's wich are compact flourecent lights.I use the cfl's for veg stage becuase you can keep them 3 inches form the top of the plant at all times and they grow nice and good growth rate.Mh bulbs are better for veg stage becuase they will give off more lumens wich meens more and faster growth for your plant but cost more to run and are alot more expensive then say your 42 watt walmart cfl's.

Ill explain how i use my hydro kit.When i am germinating the seeds i use the rockwool cubes that i got with the kit and i put the seed in the rockwool and get it wet...not to the point where it is soaked but just wet.Then i put the cube in a ziploc bag to hold the moisture and put it in a dark warm place and check it every other day misting it if it gets to try.As soon as it sprouts i take the rockwool cube and i place it in the grow rocks in the hydro kit and put my cfl lights 3 inches from the top of the plant.The lights are on 18/6...18 hours light and 6 hours dark.I dont give the plants any nutrients during the first week to week and a half..just water with a ph of 5.5.After the plant gets out of the seedling stage n hits the veg stage wich is about a week to week and a half i start adding nutrients but not the full amount..only half the amount or sometimes even a quarter of the amount shown on the instructions on the labels.As the plant gets older i gradually increase the amount of nutrients it gets and by the end of the first month its at full nutes.I keep the plants in veg stage for 2 months wich is pretty much the standard veg cycle or untill i see signs of preflower.When i see the signs of preflower or when the 2 months is up i turn the lights off for 24 hours n then switch the light cycle to 12/12.The first week after switching the light cycle i still feed it the grow nutrients n then after that week i switch to the flowering nutrients wich is the bloom and micro.I also change the resevoir about every 2 weeks to keep the water fresh and the nutrients available to the plants at all times.Try to give the plant as little stress as possible to by making sure the ph is right and having nutrients for the plant n when the light is off...dont disturb it.Now flowering stage usually last 8 to 10 weeks depending on the strain but i usually go by the color of the trichomes.When 75% of the trichomes turn amber its ready to be harvested.Also before you harvest you have to flush the plants off all nutrients so 2 weeks before you harvest your plant change the resevoir and only give it ph correct water and change the resevoir 2 or 3 times...this gets all the nutrients out n doesnt give ur bud a bad taste n harsh smoke.

Im not sure if ive helped you out any as i may have confused you so if you have any questions or dont understand just ask ill be glad to help ya out...and no worries i killed like 8 plants before i finally figured it all out to..but we learn from our mistakes.

[letsburn06]

Haha sorry man i have poor spelling and typing skills so hope you can understand the words i messed up lol...sorry bro

[divestoned]

that answer was well worded ....i spent so much time reading i dont have the energy to respond.......but i tell you that letsburn06 nailed most of your issue's i bet. ahh one thing he didnt cover is the acidity of rockwool....it needs a good soak before applying seeds.

[letsburn06]

Haha o shit yea man i did forget that...great save man.

[letsburn06]

Also I was just wondering..what strain do you have to grow...becuase some strains are easier to gorw then others.

[latewood]

1st off the veg stage does not start at a week , week and a 1/2...

soak your rockwool over nite...shake out good. place seed, and put in a small netpot filled with hydroton...spritz 5-6 shots-2-3 times a day to keep moisture around. place net pot in bubbler under fluoros...use plain water with a ph of 5.8. 5.5 is too low except for 2-3 weeks in flower.

that's it.

a plant is seedling until 4-5 alternating nodes. not counting the cotyledon... Never give nutrients to seedlings. Never! then just go with veg nutes once rootzone establishes itself outside of netpot, and you have 4-5 nodes on the stem...add your veg nutes. Goodluck.

In the future you would be better off if you just described the problem you are having, or ask a question. I didn't read your story! I read the long response you got, and had to correct that response.

Hydro is simple. Keep it simple and be patient! Or you will Kill another batch...

If you have not gotten a plant to live in 4-5 tries...might consider giving up. lol

[letsburn06]

Well sorry but there wasnt really anything to correct...i add nutes at a week week and a half they grow perfectly fine.The only thing i really messed up on was forgetting to tell him to soak the rockwool cubes first.But o well thats your opinion on things n i have mine i was just explaining to him how i use my hydro kit and hasnt failed me yet.And about the veg thing wouldnt u think it would be part of the veg stage since its using the light to grow around a week week and a half...thats pretty much vegging to me.If its growing its vegging..my opinion...but i could be wrong who knows.

[manwithbike]

hey i got the same bubbler system and am about to start growing. just one question, what would you suggest i run the drip pump on...the directions say they are safe to run 24/7 without overwatering but that could be a bunch of horse shit, just wanted to know how you guys have successfully ran your pumps. any input would be appreciated.

[manwithbike]

i forgot to mention that i'm using the 8 gallon system from stealth hydro with some led grow lights and 2 cfl's. I plan on germinating a few of my female white widows within the next few days.

one more question, how many plants did you plant assuming you used the 8 gallon tub pictured in kidder's post. it has 6 net pots but i've heard that it could be too many plants for the kit.

any input will be appreciated so holla

[letsburn06]

Umm im not sure wat u meen by the drip pump becuase i have a pump that has hoses hooked up to the net pots n just runs water threw the pots..no dripping.But as for how many plants I have the 6 pot kit and i only planted 2 at a time.
But if wat u meen by the drip pump is that it just drips water constantly i think you would be safe to run that 24/7...i run my pump 15 mins every 3 hours.

[latewood]

Well sorry but there wasnt really anything to correct...i add nutes at a week week and a half they grow perfectly fine.The only thing i really messed up on was forgetting to tell him to soak the rockwool cubes first.But o well thats your opinion on things n i have mine i was just explaining to him how i use my hydro kit and hasnt failed me yet.And about the veg thing wouldnt u think it would be part of the veg stage since its using the light to grow around a week week and a half...thats pretty much vegging to me.If its growing its vegging..my opinion...but i could be wrong who knows.Well, you are wrong...You can grow your way, but you are not coming into our cultivation area and confusing new growers.

I told you the correct info in the 1st post. If you don't want to learn. Keep it to yourself.

p.s. anytime you have a pump hoole dup to water lines...going into netpots...That is drip.

[GodBud]

Dude, 6 plants in that container is not going to work. Your better off 2 at the most. I have one female in an 18 gal rez and she is going crazy! You will get more yield off 1 or 2 than you will 6 guarenteed.

Peace

[manwithbike]

thanks guys ill keep you updated as things get rolling

[Prunedale]

Haha sorry man i have poor spelling and typing skills so hope you can understand the words i messed up lol...sorry bro

No worries man, thanks for the input on his situation.
Thanks moderhaters for the fix up on his wrong post. Not everyones a genious grower and I don't wanna learn the wrong way. Thanks to all of you. Lets all smoke and be merry.

[CaliJay]

Well, you are wrong...You can grow your way, but you are not coming into our cultivation area and confusing new growers.

I told you the correct info in the 1st post. If you don't want to learn. Keep it to yourself.

p.s. anytime you have a pump hoole dup to water lines...going into netpots...That is drip.


Why can't you just be cool to the guy Latewood? He put a lot of time into that post and gave his experiences.

I am really not trying to be negative and I hope it doesn't come across that way. I was just wondering where you got this information about the veg stage starting at 1.5 weeks instead of 1 week. It doesn't seem that important to start a post with "first off". If mods would like people to be polite and civil then you could set the example.

Basicly why are you being so harsh?

-Cali

[420kidder]

Thanks guys. I appreciate all of the advice.

My girlfriend wants to get a new light tomorrow for the grow cycle, but we're not sure if we can get a decent one offline. ;) All we know is that the san agro 430, and a couple of cheap home depot floros didn't seem to do too much for the growth cycle. She also wats to get some nutrients, but we're going t research this all a bit more. Thanks again.

[latewood]

Why can't you just be cool to the guy Latewood? He put a lot of time into that post and gave his experiences.

I am really not trying to be negative and I hope it doesn't come across that way. I was just wondering where you got this information about the veg stage starting at 1.5 weeks instead of 1 week. It doesn't seem that important to start a post with "first off". If mods would like people to be polite and civil then you could set the example.

Basicly why are you being so harsh?

-Cali1st off, I wasn't addressing you. He made other statements besides his post that pissed me off. He was wrong on several points. I don't have time to kiss butt, and I won't. If you want to teach growing here, you better learn how-to yourself 1st!
2nd. Does that answer your question. If you knew how hard I work at this site and many others, you wouldn't aggrevate me. Peace

[latewood]

To calijay. p.s. veg doesn't start with a sprout because there are no roots, so no veg is taking place. when the plant roots and you need to start feeding it...that is the beginning of veg. Ask Zandor if you don't believe me!

gotta go...got 2 impacted teeth.

[sxgrower]

Here's my advice: throw the rockwook cubes in the garbage!

Go down to any hydro store and get grow plugs. There are a couple of different manufactures, but the plugs are spongy, brown, and kick ass all over rockwool.

Rockwool has PH issues, and tends to retain too much water, a lot of people have problems with them. Plugs don't have those problems.

[Cornelius]

Thanks guys. I appreciate all of the advice.

My girlfriend wants to get a new light tomorrow for the grow cycle, but we're not sure if we can get a decent one offline. ;) All we know is that the san agro 430, and a couple of cheap home depot floros didn't seem to do too much for the growth cycle. She also wats to get some nutrients, but we're going t research this all a bit more. Thanks again.

you don't need a new light, the one you got is fine. just make sure you keep it close enough to your plants (~a foot or so). However don't blast your seedlings with light, you can prob just use the fluoros for the first week or so.

for nutrients try a 3-part. General Hydroponics makes a good one, as does Advanced Nutrients. With this you can give your plants exactly what they need.

Finally, START LISTENING TO ZANDOR. He has a great podcast for growers, you can find it thru iTunes, it's called "The Grow Report" Also on Dopefiend.co.uk: The Web's Favourite Cannabis Podcast Network (http://www.dopefiend.co.uk). Start with the first episode and listen to all of them. Then you will know how to grow weed.

edit: i guess this site has a macro for dopefiend's site that puts in that crazy link, because i didn't haha

[Cornelius]

Here's my advice: throw the rockwook cubes in the garbage!

Go down to any hydro store and get grow plugs. There are a couple of different manufactures, but the plugs are spongy, brown, and kick ass all over rockwool.

Rockwool has PH issues, and tends to retain too much water, a lot of people have problems with them. Plugs don't have those problems.

meh, rockwool is ok, i used some little cubes to start my babies (who have now completely take over my cabinet). IF you make sure soak first, to pay attention to it, keep it moist, and use ph'd water you should be fine

[GodBud]

Ok so the past several hydro attempts have failed. We also tried growing in soil several times and have failed. :(




Perhaps this is a sign that you cant grow!

Peace