Plants flowering on 18/6 - any ideas?

[dubble-oh]

Hey there experts!
For some reason unknown to me the kids have started to flower even though they are still on 18/6.

The setup is a bubbler system with 4' fluorescent lights and cfl lights. The plants are two months old and for some reason they just decided this week to flower.

In the same room there are also tomato and pepper plants growing (soil and hydro) and they too have started to flower.

Now, the lighting cycle has never been changed from the 18/6 in the two months that the plants have been growing. There might have been the odd evening when the lights were off that the temps might have dipped a little below 70 degrees, but other than that, I have no clue as to why the plants would have decided to flower.
The current MJ grow is a bagweed test, and if it was only the MJ flowering I would be tempted to think that it was just genetics causing the early and unprovoked flowering cycle. But since I'm also seeing flowers on the tommies etc., I am inclined to think that there is some other issue at play here.
Is it possible that cool evenings could have inspired the plants to shift into the flower cycle?
I'm eager to hear any feedback as I'm just starting a new set of Bubblegum and I want to ensure that these ones grow to their full potential and don't flower until I want them to.
Thanks everyone. peace.
D-O

[xcrispi]

there are some strains that are auto-flowering / self sexing .
they'll preflower w/o any light cycle changes .
peace
crispi

[Gatekeeper777]

also some clone mothers that are NOT autoflowering strains flower even under 24/0 because the hormone that induces flowering gets built up in the plant.
are your girls clones of an older woman?

[JackdaWack]

um pre-flowers are not uncommon and it doesnt mean they are flowering. unless it is an auto-flower strain, it will not flower unless under 12/12 light. there is not a harmone that forces flower unless auto-flowering, ppl have moms that are 2 years old under veg lighting and show no signs of flowering.

[JackdaWack]

let me restate that, the harmone that flowers the plant does not act until proper lighting schedual. unless auto-flowering. ive seen preflowers as soon as 3 weeks after seed.

[Gatekeeper777]

um pre-flowers are not uncommon and it doesnt mean they are flowering. unless it is an auto-flower strain, it will not flower unless under 12/12 light. there is not a harmone that forces flower unless auto-flowering, ppl have moms that are 2 years old under veg lighting and show no signs of flowering.

ummmmmmmmmmmm, thats NOT what they say on HT. and if anyone would know it would be them.

[JackdaWack]

HT high times..? it would be who? what about us ppl in here who do this every day and for months on end... we might know better... then a magazine. I got 2 BB growing next to eachother, one has preflowers one doesnt, explain that, same seeds, same place. Dont be so sure what u read is true, and i speak from experience not reading it from some one. Unless it is an auto-flowering strain, it is not flowering until you force it to by changing to 12/12, just cause u get some pistals doesnt mean ur flowering, im still veggin my gurl with loads of pistals and she's not flowering, and its not an auto-flower strian and that is how i know. Also if your plant just flowers on its own, how are u going to have a mother, clones come from veggin moms not flowering ones.

[Gatekeeper777]

but they have been doing this for FAR FAR FAR longer then any of us.

[JackdaWack]

who? Hightimes? they dont do shit, ppl tell them what to write in there magazines they dont even grow. They get there info from other growers and most likely things get lost in translation. Im not sayin there wrong or morons, but if they said a plant shows pistals its flowering they may be on a different subject . Every experienced grower in here knows about preflowers and how wonderful they are becuase they let u know the sex of the plant way before you should know. Also it may be an indication they are mature enough to start flowering. as long as there kept on 18/6 they will vegg for a very long time, and at 2 months you shoul dbe seeing preflowers.

[Gatekeeper777]

if you want to rob a house do you ask burglers in jail or the one that never got caught.
the ones in jail will tell you about their technique.
but the one who never got caught will tell you how to do it right.

[Gatekeeper777]

dont get me wrong....... i have learned a shitload more here about differant techniques, and i am greatfull. you criminals have given me alot.lol

[JackdaWack]

i kinda laughed when u said this becuase your right, but hightimes takes very little part in what they publish. Everything they publish is secondhand. If you want advice first hand you will get it in here. My thoughts and posts are of my experience and threads of other experienced growers, so if you want to grow good bud, ask ppl who grow good bud... US. dubble-oh asked a question and i answered it, is it correct, i believe so, he didnt ask anything in complexity, this is a cut and paste topic.

I am not a criminal, by definition of our government i am, but that doesnt mean i am. My actions are of my own, and my actions effect no one else but myself, and by the definition of freedom our government has made, that makes me one legal ass motherfucker.

[Gatekeeper777]

roflmao.

[JackdaWack]

u guys should have searched and you would have found the asnwer very easily although i will give you credit for reading a searching already it always comes in handy i just did it to show u im not nuts and the only one in here with this conclusion.
http://boards.cannabis.com/indoor-growing/100823-rookie-needs-advice-mom-babies-flowering.html

[kdspecial]

if you want to rob a house do you ask burglers in jail or the one that never got caught.
the ones in jail will tell you about their technique.
but the one who never got caught will tell you how to do it right.

I think that this statment has to be the dumbest thing I have ever herd. If you never get caught chances are you have never told anyone your technique. Great magicians don't give away their tricks..

plus how do you become a great Robber anyways Its a lame and shameful crime.

just my 2 cents....

As far as everything I have ever read and experienced. plants don't build up a flowering hormone over time, and then flower without the proper light change to trigger it. Of course unless it a strain that autoflowers.

Mother nature don't fuk around. Unless we fuk with her too much....

kd

[JackdaWack]

his statement wasn't that far off, it was more of an anology then anything. It wasnt something to be taken literally, and it is a point, if you want to grow good bud, you ask ppl who grow good bud... His analogy could have been better worded, but it still has a point to it. He wasnt refering to getting cought, there is only one way to avoid that, dont tell ppl shyt. In here we are a number and a fake name. We are not magicians, and we are all willing to give out our well deserved recognized techniques.

[Gatekeeper777]

thanks jack.
as for me I consume information and only know what i read. You have stated what you think is one possibiblity either from reading or experiance, and I have done the same.
since i have kids and dont grow every day or have an elaborite setup i still consume information and take what i read elsewhere and sometimes apply what i have read and see if it works.

[DRSICE]

Hey all,

I have read this on numerous forums:

During veg, mj plants will produce preflowers when they become sexually mature.
Basically, it's like plant puberty.

I guess the question would be : does the peppers and tomatoes carry the same preflowers as they are annuals and after 2 months of veg maybe yhats the answer.

D-O have you grown peppers and tomatoes before? Have they vegged under the same cycle? How many plants are under this lighting and what is your wattage? maybe not enough light ( like moonlight ) on cold early fall evening

Bottom line is that you have a FEMALE MJ plant. woot for you. Your choice to continue to veg or switch to 12/12 and reap the reward ( BUD )

Regards,

DRSICE

Check out current grow log

http://boards.cannabis.com/hydroponi...blackjack.html

[FreeVenice]

I thought any night period could cause flowering if the plant is mature? I want to try a test with a 16/12 period under flo's. I want to see if it will compensate for not using CFL's.

[JackdaWack]

16/12 thats not mathmatically correct, i dont know how that would work out. Listen guys this has been resolved, i included a link in a previous post on this topic in a thread that already exists and gives a good explination.

[dubble-oh]

Hi everyone,

First off, thank you all for sounding in on the problem. Here's a bit more information for y'all to chaw on, although I have a hunch that it might not make things much clearer.

Initially, my thoughts were similar to those that a number of you suggested: that these were just pre-flowers and the kids were just indicating their gender early on. Unfortunately that is not the case. At least one of the boys has developed a fully functional set of reproductive organs that were indicated to me when I poked 'em and they went "puff" and a bit of pollen erupted (geez - sounds a little erotic, non?).

Anyway, prior to posting I had pretty much given up on the thought that I was looking at pre-flowers.

I hadn't realized though that there were strains of MJ that were autoflowering and self sexing. My initial reaction with no contrary indicators would certainly have been that I was growing that sort of strain, especially since this was a bag-seed grow and I don't know the strain at all except, the buds were good to smoke ;) The thing is that the autoflowering explanation doesn't really explain why all of the different plant species in the room decided to flower at the same time.

The major fly in the ointment here is that I have tomatoes and peppers growing under the same conditions and they have spontaneously decided to flower at the same time as the MJ even though the light cycle hasn't changed.
I think that it's a really strange coincidence that the tommies, peppers, and MJ would all decide to flower at EXACTLY the same time without being induced by a change in the light cycle...

To answer the questions posed by DRSICE:
Yes, I have grown tomatoes and peppers before - but only in dirt and the tomatoes I have only grown outdoors.

For the record, the tomatoes are well within an acceptable size range for them to start flowering so I was ready to let them flower as much as they want. The peppers on the other hand are a strain of japapeno (not an ornamentnal variety) and the plants are less than 8" high at this point and definitely Not large enough to support fruit.

The veg section of the room has the following light set up: 6 four foot fluorescent lights (half cool white, half warm white) at 32 watts each. In addition there is a CFL strip of 6 lights at 23 watts each (approx equivalent I believe to incandescents at 100 W per bulb). I don't think that the quantity or quality of lighting is a factor here, but thanks for enquiring.

That brings me around to my real suspicion of what has happened here. I *think* based upon all of the reading that I have done here on the board and elsewhere, that several cool nights in a row have caused the plants to think that autumn is approoaching so they're starting to flower.
The best support I have for this hunch is a paper I read here:
A thermosensory pathway controlling flowering time in Arabidopsis thaliana - Nature Genetics (http://www.nature.com/ng/journal/v33/n2/full/ng1085.html)

From previous experience I know that in a "typical" grow of MJ, the plants will continue to veg for as long as the light cycle stays constant at 18/6. And that is the mantra that everyone here has been echoing. The truth of the matter is that the light cycle has stayed constant and "correct" yet the kids are developing full-blown reproductive organs and I'm not just seeing pre-flowers or the onset of puberty (thanks for the suggestion DRSICE).

I'm sure, if you've bothered to read this far, and you're interested enough you'll want to see pictures. They're on their way!
I'll post some tonight showing the boys and the girls in all of their glory.

Hope you can wait that long. Thanks for all of the replies. This forum rocks!
peace,
D-O

[JackdaWack]

i will can say this it is not ordinary to find auto-flowering bag seed... but who is really to say, if the cold tempatures are the cause to the effect then it could be, the colder temps at a constant rate. I have no evidence or inquery to support this so i cant chime in. If all the plants are flowering, all strains and diferent species peppers and mj then there is something going on. Maybe there not full out flowering but showing signs that flowering conditions are there. For Mj to be ruled on any prior explinations, we take our notice to Mj grows under specific conditions. If your not having constant temps around 60 and 70 F then in reality your not really giving it the environment it needs so you may experience things out of the ordinary. but in the prime environment this should not happen.

Thats a good link and i dont really take tempatures into concern because im ussually above the avg. If you keep them at the temp they need they will vegg forever with 18+hoours of light.

[FreeVenice]

You don't think 16/12 will work? I know it's not a 24 hour day, but do the plants really know how long a day is. I got this timer that goes by the day and I could set it up for almost any time schedule. If you think it's a waist of my time though I won't bother. My room gets to hot for HPS, and my ventalation sucks, I got to cut some corners if you know what I mean.

[Gatekeeper777]

I am going 18/6 and i am having great results 2x a day water.they are starting to explode with growth. I dont think you can do better the seed may not know what a day is but it is still encoded genetically of what to expect.
and with out millioons of years to adapt you will either shock it and it will die, or more then likely it will morph into a hermie or eventually make a newer strain if she self polinated.

[FreeVenice]

awww, I don't want to grow a herm. . .

[JackdaWack]

yeah the genetics of a plant are 24 hours a day, with in the 24 hours u can do anythng, but just like having cold temps more then 24 hours is just not what a plant is genetically encoded to destiguish, it will probably be fine and grow but you will most likely run into a hermie or somethin. Im at 18/6 and it seems to be perfect, i find that anything more then 20 hours on is a waste of electricity, the roots grow on the dark periods the most.

[FreeVenice]

What kind of lights are you using? what about 16/8. I am only using flos and I want to get the most growth as possible.

[JackdaWack]

to much dark and it could slow down growth too. I veg with fluoro tubes, i would stick with 18/6 or 20/4 or in between. U could look to nutes for better growth aswell, additives, there so much to contribute other then light.

[Gatekeeper777]

What kind of lights are you using? what about 16/8. I am only using flos and I want to get the most growth as possible.
anything above 12 hours of light should keep her from flowering unless she is an auto flowering strain. from EVERYTHING I have read an 18/6 is the most benificial tot he plant.
some argue 24/0 is better but then that makes for good growth but poor root growth and that my friend can result in a lower yield due to the fact that less root=less nutes to the plant.
i grew under 24/0 and got an oz. now i expect several oz's.
let the girls sleep for no more then 8 and no less then 6 when you start to vary from what NATURE has encoded in its genetics you invite problems. and if a hermie pollin sac pops in your grow room it can infect your grow room for yesrs to come and getting rid of pollin in a room is a big pain in the ass.
leave the playing to the experts.
just grow and smoke.

[dubble-oh]

Hi folks,
Thanks again for all of your input - it has been most helpful.
Here's a couple of pix of the plants. There's one of some tomato flowers and one each of the boy and girl mj pre-flowers (the boys haven't yet opened up fully but I expect that they probably will in a couple of days).
peace,
D-O