decisions decisions

[timmywilson]

Anxious to begin out here. Growing in a hydrohut mini. If you are unfamiliar with this product, it is something like 3.25'x3.25'x6.5'. Anyway, I have everything that is needed except for lighting and ventilation and a couple other odds and ends. I am really anxious to begin this project and the only thing holding me back is the cost of ventilation and lighting. I initially planned on a 400w using conversion bulb to give me both metal halide and high pressure sodium spectrums, but I have been reading a bit more about CFL's.

I guess the first question is this: How much and of what type of CFL's would I need to match the power that the HID lighting would bring me ? Is it worth it in cost savings ?

The other question is ventilation and odor elimination. Is a dayton fan or something similar necessary for this size grow room ? Would this small area really require a carbon air filter or could I get by with a less expensive alternative ?

I am just anxious to get started as I have most of the components for this project but still need to buy the lighting and the ventilation and then I will be good to go.

[SeedlessOne]

Ok CFL lighting will never be equal to HID lighting. I have seen some people use CFLs with great results so dont get me wrong; but HID is going to give you more quanity and denser buds. A dayton fan would cool that Hut. As far as a scrubber only use one if you are consered about odor. And if you are but dont want to use a scrubber than get a strain that has low odor. Northern Lights has little to no odor at all. But if you need to mask odor than get a scrubber, but also i would suggest getting a inline fan instead of a dayton if using a scrubber. Does this answer your questions???

[timmywilson]

Yeah it does. I think I am just gonna hold out a lil while longer and get the goods. Thanks for your input.

[harris7]

Hps is the most efficient light known to man. so there is no savings on power

the only benefit to CFL's is that they give off little heat. so you can get a smaller vent system and you can get the lights closer to the plants.

think about this a 400W hps gives off 50 000lm's

you would need to buy 4 200W clf's (at 12 000 lm each).
So 800Watts of power. double. Not to mention that they are huge and would take up a large amount of space. AS well you will need to buy reflectors for each one, so thats like 20-30$ each.

hmm. They seem like a great idea for really small grows.

[timmywilson]

Seedless if you have time though, could you please explain to me why go with an inline fan instead of the Dayton if using a scrubber ? Just curious about why that is. Thanks again.

[harris7]

not to mention that the big ass CFL's arn't cheap. you'll be paying 80-100$ each.

so it's 2-3 times the initial investment too

[timmywilson]

So then Harris I guess all of the discussion and grow reports that I have seen here and elsewhere on CFL's are done by people who are just selling themselves short using the smaller CFL's ? Notably the sticky thread entitled "Compact Flourescent Light Discussion" started by BobBong ? I am with you though, I am gonna hold out a lil while longer to get the real deal. Might as well go full bore and maybe the yield will help pay for the light.

[harris7]

what do you mean? are bigger ones better than smaller.
i dont know.

If you buy the smaller ones your going to have to deal with buying a hell of alot of fixtures for them

the big (i think only) benifit is the lower heat

[ridethefire]

Hey guys just popped in and wanted to clear some things up...


not to mention that the big ass CFL's arn't cheap. you'll be paying 80-100$ each.

so it's 2-3 times the initial investment too

I bought 250watt CFLs -Huge bulbs- and they only cost me $20 each...


think about this a 400W hps gives off 50 000lm's

you would need to buy 4 200W clf's (at 12 000 lm each).
So 800Watts of power. double. Not to mention that they are huge and would take up a large amount of space. AS well you will need to buy reflectors for each one, so thats like 20-30$ each.

CFLs have two numbers- The wattage that the bulb uses, and the wattage the bulb emits. My CFLs emit 250 watts each but only use 85 watts-Which wont add up to 800+ watts...

Check out my grow (link on my sig), you can see the lights and the results I am getting from them...


Stay high! :rasta:

[Cornelius]

Ride, they are 85 watt bulbs. Powerful yes, but 250 no. They are as bright as a 250 watt incandescent bulb but use only 85 watts since they are more efficient. They are not however as efficient as HID lights like a high pressure sodium.

Timmy, do yourself a favor and get a High pressure sodium light. With some basic wiring you can make the ballast switchable so you can run a Metal Halide bulb as well for veg.

If things get hot buy/build a cooltube

Get an HID light and you will not be sorry

[timmywilson]

Yes Cornelius thank you for the advice. How much money can I save building my own ballast rather than purchasing a kit that is all set to go ?

[SeedlessOne]

Seedless if you have time though, could you please explain to me why go with an inline fan instead of the Dayton if using a scrubber ? Just curious about why that is. Thanks again.


When air has to be sucked through the scrubber, air flow is reduced. With that said dayton type fans loss air pressure fast; i.e any bends in your ducting will cause air flow loss. When using inline fans they are much better at not having reduced air flow. There is minimal CFM reduction with bends in ducting, using scrubbers, etc with these inline fans. So in short you can use a dayton type fan but make sure to get a bigger CFM than you need to make up for the lose in air flow due to the scrubber. Or you could just get a inline fan and really not have to worry about any CFM reduction. Plus inlines are very quite. Hope this helps as I am pretty stoned of my new bong i bought today. It is a PHX let be the first to say that they hit sooo damn hard....peace out man

[Volker]

the only benefit to CFL's is that they give off little heat.

...you would need to buy 4 200W clf's... So 800Watts of power....

hmm. They seem like a great idea for really small grows.hehehe... Exactly. I grow in an enclosed closet 18" x 36" x however high I need to. Currently I'm running 5 plants, but usual is 4. (they're small)

CFTs are available in a varity of spectra. My favorites are daylight (6500K) & warm white (2700K). Stark white (5500K) is also good. Cool white (4200K) is so-so.

I'm using 189W of CFT (7 x 27W CFT) which gives me 11620L for 4.5 ft².

At bud time, there are 126W more going in (3 x 42W CFT 2700K/2600L) bringing the total to 315W / ~ 19000L.

The L figures are deceptive: the plant tops are much closer to the bulb than the spec measurement distance, the bases of the plants are about 10" below the bulbs.

I could not run a 400W HPS in that closet without major ventilation modifications which would defeat the purpose of doing it in the closet. Nor could I place a running 400W HPS bulb 1" away from the plant.

If I was running an actual grow ROOM, I'd go w/400W HPS. But for small, enclosed grows, CFTS rule!

[harris7]

Hey guys just popped in and wanted to clear some things up...

I bought 250watt CFLs -Huge bulbs- and they only cost me $20 each...

CFLs have two numbers- The wattage that the bulb uses, and the wattage the bulb emits. My CFLs emit 250 watts each but only use 85 watts-Which wont add up to 800+ watts...



Your bulbs might have two wattages on them
The lower one is the wattage it uses. And the ligher one is a marketing ploy, demonstrating the effishency.

BTW bulbs dont put out watts, they put out lumens. The second number is the amount of watts you would need to pump through a incandecnt bulb to get the same lumen output.

So your first comment the 250W bulb for 20. Can i assume that 250W is the output, not the acctual wattage.

here are the bulbs i am talking about
http://www.1000bulbs.com/products.php?cat=200-Watt-Compact-Fluorescents

[harris7]

double post

[ridethefire]

Hello everyone...


BTW bulbs dont put out watts, they put out lumens.

Exactly right :thumbsup: ... Light Output is measured in lumens.


So your first comment the 250W bulb for 20. Can i assume that 250W is the output, not the acctual wattage.

Like you said earlier in your post:confused: , Light output is measured in lumens, not wattage. My bulbs for veg (now as side lighting) are 85W truetone 5000k bulbs that replace 250W incandescents. My "output" is 5000avg lumens.


here are the bulbs i am talking about
http://www.1000bulbs.com/products.ph...t-Fluorescents
HIGHMAX by Maxilte - 200 Watt - 5000 Kelvin - Compact Fluorescent - 200W/UT/MOG/50K - 277 Volt - Maxlite 35873 - $78.25

Manufactured By: Maxlite
Manufactures Part Number:35873
Manufacturers Description: SKO200EA250 8U 277V E39 HPF
Lumins: 12000:confused:
Scotopic Lumens: 23,520
Efficacy (LM/W) 60
Life Hours: 10,000
Width: 5.12 in.
Measure of Over All Length: 14in.
Approximate Incandescent Equivalent: 850 Watts
Save 650 Watts in Energy
Mogul Base
277 Volt
Color or Hue = Stark White, 5000 Kelvin
ENERGY STAR Rating Pending
Catalog Code: FC200/35873


Those are the specs of the bulbs you are talking about.

They produce 12,000 lumens-for $80
My bulbs produce 5000 lumens for $20

For $80 you could get 4 of mine- producing 20,000 lumens...

if cost is an issue...:thumbsup:

[Bree1978]

I've heard those big butt CFL's put off quite a bit of heat too....Isn't that true? So wouldn't you really want to go with like the 85w or less? Not only cheaper but less heat probs which is mainly why you are going with CFL's in the first place. S

[harris7]

I've heard those big butt CFL's put off quite a bit of heat too....Isn't that true? So wouldn't you really want to go with like the 85w or less? Not only cheaper but less heat probs which is mainly why you are going with CFL's in the first place. S

I donâ??t have any personal experience with large cflâ??s but I can safly say they will give off no where near the heat that a HPS or MH does

CFLâ??s work by putting an electrical arc through a gasâ?¦ not going to go into it
End result- electricity is turned into light. Heat is produced as by the inefficiency of the transition.

HPS and MH- work by using electricity to create heat (very efficient) then heat to light.
So the heat is purposely created. Thatâ??s why the lights get brighter as they heat up

And consider that if you buy small CFLâ??s you have to buy all the fixtures, reflectors, wiring etc. So that can add up.

Here are the prices and efficiencies from a few CFLâ??s

105Watt Compact Fluorescent
5000 and 4100 Kelvin None around 2500-3000 Kelvin
Equivalent 400Watts
Lumens 6900 or 65.7 LM/W
Cost 25$ Per Watt= 4.2 Watts/$

150Watt Compact Fluorescent
2700 Kelvin
Equivalent 650 Watts
Lumens 9200 or 61 LM/W ***
Cost 60$ Per Watt= 2.5 Watts/$

200Watt Compact Fluorescent
5000, 2700 Kelvin
Equivalent 850 Watts
Lumens 12000 or 60 LM/W for 2700 K
Cost 70$ Per Watt= 2.85 Watts/$

85Watt Compact Fluorescent (looking like best purchase)
3000, 6500, 5000 Kelvin
Equivalent 350 watts
Lumens: 4200 or 49.4 LM/W
Cost 20$ Per Watt= 4.25 Watts/$

65Watts Compact Fluorescent
3000, 6500 Kelvin
Equivalent 250 Watts
Lumens: 3400 or 52 LM/W
Cost 20$ Per Watt= 3.25 Watts/$

[Cornelius]

Yes Cornelius thank you for the advice. How much money can I save building my own ballast rather than purchasing a kit that is all set to go ?

yeah you can probably save money building your own, though i don't know how much.. and while you're building it you can mod it to make it switchable.

-p

[BlueBear]

400W HPS ballast $44 Lum 50000. Bulb, $60, cheaper at HD, but not as good. 1 bulb equals 15 ounces in a ebb and flow with CO2 by a fella named Sleepy on IC Mag and 3 QP's by father and law with no CO2 or hydro, just MG.
Adieu