voyager explores a new frontier: indoor growing

[VOYAGER]

Well i figured id get off my ass and get my grow up for everyone to see my first indoor grow. I usually grow outdoors cause i never could get my plants to live indoors. Bob's cfl grow was the very first thread i ever read on this site and he made it look easy enough for me to give it a shot again(thanks bob). I had all the fixtures, pots, fan. All i bought was the dirt, daylight bulbs, few cfls, thermometer, & timer. Only about $50-60 invested so far. I figured if it goes good this time i'd invest in better equip. for next.

I'd like both a mh and an hps for a full spec, run both at the same time. If anyone knows how big a bulb for each fixture to support about 6-10 females i only want to buy as much light as i need.

I usually get good green so i used some seeds i had. I started 1 seed at first, and after i seen that it was actually making it, i put a few more in. I had 1 poor excuse for a plant in a window, in a small pot, that could only support 2 sets of leaves at a time. Since i started this "so far sucessful" grow it has been doing much better, so a total of six so far, but 1 only plan to keep the best 3-4.
The first seed was germed in the dirt around Oct 1st. The rest about 3-4 weeks after, so my youngest is only 20 something days old from planting. Here is the progress so far....

[wesley willis]

that one plant, damn! looks real nice. that other one looks good too. not bad for a first try at all.

[VOYAGER]

thanks man, it makes me wish i started all the seeds at the same time. Oh well, next grow should be much better.

[whoreable]

Has the smaller plant stopped its wilting?

[VOYAGER]

just took a peek in there and yes she is looking perky today. I did do some re-arraging last night so, could the cfl's been too much? never thought that would be the case.

[whoreable]

Im not sure, I just started a Journal myself, my bigger plant started to wilt a little today too!

[VOYAGER]

Well guys and girls i spent a couple days researching hid lighting possiblities( I guess I felt like spending some money). As you can see i'm currently using fluro tubes, 3- 2bulb fixtures w/cfl sidelighting. I plan on adding another fixture in the next day or so totaling 4 fixtures & the cfls. I got on atlantis hydroponics website and they had lumen output for the different lights, which was nice so i could do some comparison and found some interesting numbers.
3 fixtures plus cfls i'm using 300w and 25,200 lumens and spent about $65
4 fix + cfls - 380w - 32,000 L - $75
1 250w hid - 20,000L - didn't price after i seen lumen output
1 400w hid - 50,000L - $300
1 600w hid - 86,000L - $360
1 1000w hid - 133,000(Sunmaster bulb) - $390

I only plan on having 6 plants at a time and probably only maturing 3-4, so price per lumen output seem to still be a better deal w/ the tubes i'm currently using. I don't have a heat issue yet and if i do i can always relocate the ballasts outside the box in a custom fan cooled box. I even looked into overdriving the tubes but at the moment space isn't an issue. These are still the cheap 2 bulb fixtures for $8 bucks and T12 bulbs. I realise the T8's are lower watts and higher output and the T5's are even better, but then you start to climb back into more expensive bulbs and fixtures. So thats just some food for thought, any comments are appreciated as my research my be completly wrong but, so far it seems that fluro's aren't as bad as people make them out to be.

[VOYAGER]

well i've added another fixture, up to 8 fluro tubes and 4 cfl's, also found female pre-flowers on three two are still undistinguishable, i guess i'll switch them to 12-12 for tonight, go ahead and let them finish on out. here's a few more updated pics

[VOYAGER]

sorry bout the blurry pics, i tried to get a good pic of the pistils pokin out, i'll get a better shot in soon

[Mr T]

wow..i cant believe u got those kinda results in the space of 2 months! " weeks in and ive got crest look alikes (tall, weak stems with 2 classics shaped leaves. whats ur secret? im followin all the rules but there are no way near as bulky as urs...lol.

[Mr T]

" weeks in was meant to be 2 weeks in...

[TheGreenFog]

Hey, Voyager. Thought I'd stop by your thread, since you were so kind to stop by mine. Your plants look nice.

I'm confused about this sentence:


...also found female pre-flowers on three two are still undistinguishable, i guess i'll switch them to 12-12 for tonight, go ahead and let them finish on out. here's a few more updated pics

Does that mean you are saying that just because they have pre-flowers that you should flip them? Are you gonna flip the small ones too? I'm sorry, maybe I'm missing something. I'll check back to see your progress. If you are flipping them now, then good luck flowering! Can't wait to see the pics.

That one big plant looks good. A little droopy...could it be rootbound? Maybe transplant into a bigger pot?

C ya round, Voyager. I hope I will be updating my thread today. :D

:rastasmoke:

TGF

[VOYAGER]

Fog, i thought long and hard about going to 12-12, hell before i ever wanted to put my grow on here i wanted to scrap the whole project and start over w/ about 10 plants to start w/ and hope for 4-6 females so all of them would hopefully be as bushy as the next. Lst'n is pretty cool so i'll try to get a big ass canopy goin. So I guess i will go ahead and see what happens, at least the biggest plant has been growing for damn there 2 month's who knows what i'll get out of it, i am growing w' fluro tubes and all, and i haven't read another grow around here w/ cheap tubes so i guess it was at least a good test run. Think of it the way i am, i'd have 6 bushes instead of this mix. But, if everyone seems to think otherwise i guess id trust someones judgement that has done this before. Also i counted 1 of the tops and it had 4 alternating nodes there were a bunch w three, i'll try to get some pictures in sometime today, me and the kids are gonna put the christmas tree up today but i should be on tonight to see what anyone has said about flowering. They haven't had their 12 period yet but they will tonight if i don't hear back from anyone, i still got my outdoor to burn so i should be alright till next go round if thats the case.

[VOYAGER]

Well i figured now would be a better time than any to update the grow. I also had a question or two that might get answered. I'll also be a little more specific on the growing conditions as well to help you answer the questions i have. I looked back to the records i kept on my comp. before i started this thread so i was off on dates on two plants, but that isn't really important being i got rid of most of them due to nutsacks. All the smaller ones didn't take too well to being force flowered and they were the ones that i got rid of. The two remaining females (one of them sprouted on the first of oct the other roughly 4 days after) were showing preflowers and alternating nodes so on the 1st or second of this month they went into 12-12, roughly a week later is when i noticed the males and dwindled everything down to the two that are left. I repotted at the time I switched 12-12 into 5 gallon buckets ( thoroughly cleaned). The soil is about 50% mushroom compost 30% perlite 20% peat moss. The water i use is usually about 6.7 ph, I mixed in some granulated bloom ferts with the soil at the time of repotting.

Now the questions i have are reguarding the red you can see in the pics, the red has been there for the entire life of the plants with no discoloration of the leaves desribed in any of the disorders i've read. (no yellowing spots, dying out of leaves wilting etc,etc...)
So could this just be because of the strain or what? I remember the tread in the plant prob sec, about always seeing red and Stinky was saying a possible lockout prob but if it was locking out something would i not see dying out of the leaves in the two and a half months these plants have been around?
But now over the past 3-4 days i have noticed on one plant the very tips started to fade out to a lighter shade of green and now to what you see now. I did mix ferts in with the soil, (roughly about half strength of what the bag said) so i'm not sure if it was too much, too little or what. So I could use some suggestions. In most cases i would care less, but now that i'm down to two plants i don't want to let anything get out of hand.
Hopefully i added enough info, if not just ask.

[Splifted]

YEah, as long as your plants aren't showing any signs of deficiency or anything, I wouldn't sweat the purple/red stems. It happens, they usually stop that once they get thicker. Plants look very happy, nice dark green foilage, Id say whatever you're doing, you're doing right

[kindprincess]

^^^like splifted said... my blueberrys all have red stems, have had red stems from week one.... but i've not had lockout probs... i wouldn't worry, they look great to me.:)

[stinkyattic]

The soil is about 50% mushroom compost 30% perlite 20% peat moss. The
ph,

.

There's a potential problem.
Peat moss= pH app. 4.5
You're going to need to start watering with high pH water soon.
Do a runoff test and see what's up.
Other than that, your plants look fantastic! I can't believe this is the first time indoors!

[Abattoir Dream]

yeh, that big plant has got blue leaves! lol

[VOYAGER]

Thanks everyone i'm feeling a little better about things, although the one plant that is getting the yellowing of the tips has spread a little further into the leaf, but it has gone through a major growth spurt in the past 2 days, growing 4 inches or so, both yesterday and today i woke to find it grew into the light. I'd hate to under or over feed it since it does seem to be going into a good phase of growth, but there definetly seems to be something going on being that i'm seeing a little more yellowing today.
Stinky i'll be watering tomorrow probably so i'll let you know what the runoff tests turn out like.
Again thanks everyone for the feedback, all the praise should go to everyone on this site for the info provided here, it is the only reason this grow has gone so well, like i said before i have made the attempt to grow indoors but never made it past the first couple weeks, so all the info definitely has been valuable

[VOYAGER]

Well that sucks, i offered to watch my niece and when my mom dropped her off she happened to stumble across my operation ( why do parents feel the need to be snoopy). Now i'm trying to gather all the info i can about the benefits of this herb to try to curb their judgement for the better, otherwise i guess i'll be either moving things somewhere else or scrapping it altogether. Damn, the thoughts of moving to the otherside of the states is looking pretty good again. I'm sure with my health problems it shouldn't be hard to be a legal patient, but i'd hate to pack up the faimly for a plant. I just wish the laws would change for the state i live in.
To add to the personal benifits i have recieved from this fine creation or God, everything that has been presribed to me has done nothing to help and everything to hurt, I have taken pills that have made me completly sick and feel like absolute shit, and the 13 or so years i have been self medicating myself it has always worked, What the hell do doctors know, mymoms studying medicine right now, should she not already know the medical breakthroughs that are being made these days.
Oh well i printed a bunch of info for her and gave her the Norml web address so hopefully we can start seeing eye to eye.

[stinkyattic]

I hope she is open to new ideas.
I can't believe how much it has done for my anxiety... I recently tried going off my 'regular' meds and with maybe smoking 4 days out of the week I STILL haven't had a panic attack since... still going to regular therapy though. THAT is important. But nature makes such good medicine!

[TheGreenFog]

Hey, VOYAGER. Glad to see you back. Nice looking plants for Flouros. VERY green and lush. I'm hoping good things happen with your buds...

That's a real bummer about your Mom, but hey, maybe she will take it better than you think. Laws do suck sometimes. :( I hope things go well for you, man.

I use cannabis to de-stress and mellow out my life, control my ADHD. It helps a great deal. I've been smoking this herb since I was a tot of only 11 years. Before that time, I had to be put on modified behavior schedules with little shiny stars and rewards for sitting still. Since MJ, I'm one of the most mellow people around. I got through high-school with flying colors. Graduated top in my class, all while smoking. After I grew older, I owned businesses and became more and more stressed, and drank lotsa alcohol, both of which gave me an ulcer. I've since taken life very lightly, while still remaining responsible and productive. I smoke cannabis everyday.

:rastasmoke:

TGF

[bud luv]

I'm sure with my health problems it shouldn't be hard to be a legal patient.

It's very easy.


And RE: HID lights vs CFL - It's my understanding that the lumens from HID lights penetrate further, i.e. they project lumens a greater distance. So while you may be able to get a comparable lumen output from your CFLs, they won't all be usable to your plants.

Another thing to consider is that at 380w and 32,000 lumens (your original stated wattage and output) you're getting 84.2 lumens per watt, but a 600w HPS puting out 86,000 lumens will get you about 130 lumens per watt. note = a ballast for a 600w light pulls about 660 watts i believe. 86,000 / 660 = 130.

regardless of how much it costs to buy a HID light though, it's worth it because you'll have huge, meaty buds. I'd go for the 1000w if i were you, only 30 bux more than the 600w.

I tried growing with CFLs a long time ago, it sucked, I'd never go back.

Best of luck with everything.

[VOYAGER]

Bud i get what your saying. I really would like to get a 1000w w/ switchable ballast and nothing less, but for the amount i have invested in what i got i am pleased so far. Maybe after i can budget some more money to my garden i'll step up, but I have so many hobbies i can't really have everything all at once, plus support a family of five. Besides the max height of my cab is 4' and 1' of which is container height. So all the light needs to do is penetrate 3 feet. Also the tubes are overhead w/ cfl dangling around penetrating the canopy from the sides.

[VOYAGER]

Maybe i was just being a worry wart. The one plant seems to not be getting any worse. Still getting good growth daily, and noticing some crystals forming(although i wasn't able to see them in my pics). Figured since moms found out about my little project i'd move everything out of the sketchy looking closet setup and move it into a well built cab. I still need to light proof it, buy some handles, and throw some paint on it for now. I put it together with scrap wood so no money spent, just time. I figure i'll get some nice finished 1x6's and some trim and make it more fancy looking in the future, but for now its an upgrade. The girls seem to be liking it so thats the important part. Oh well wifes home so i guess ill get off and spend the rest of the evening with her. put the pics up tomorrow.

[VOYAGER]

Heres the pics i was suppost to put up last night. Sorry about the delay for those who wanted to see.

[VOYAGER]

Whats up everyone, its been a while since i last put up an update so i figured i would. I figured since this is one of the few threads where fluros were used for the whole grow id show how its going still. For less than $75 bucks for fixtures and bulbs im satisfied. Don't get me wrong i have my eye on some way better lighting equip, i just have other hobbies,bills,kids that take money too, but i can see it in the near future. Anyhow heres a few pics. They are at 8 1/2 weeks into flower

[doco]

Looking great Voyager, nice grow. How long till harvest? Have you been looking at the trichomes? Great example of of a flouro grow.

BTW, how'd things go with your Mom finding it and all? Maybe I missed it in the thread?

[VOYAGER]

Thanks man, hopefully they'll be done soon, the trics seem to be all cloudy, the viewing area of this 60-100x mini scope is pretty small so there could be a few % still clear. there is also a decent amount of new pistils growing so who knows. Everything is cool with my mom too, hell im grown and out of her house so i guess it was more of shock to her than anything.

[Chronic Chrissy]

I was looking at your HID bulb prices and was outraged. I paid $220 CAN(your dollar is higher so it should be cheaper) for a 400w Balast bulb and reflector. $300 buck wow man.

But fuck your plants look great. I've been thinking of upgrading to two flower chambers one with my 400w HPS and the other with my 400w MH and making a veg room with CFLs or tubes and I think your results are slowly tipping the scale. But I'll have to start producing before I upgrade so it's a future project.

[VOYAGER]

maybe im too baked this morning Chrissy but are you saying the light prices are good or bad, the reason i priced at this store is because i can walk in and pay cash. I know i could build one but i dont really want the hassle. I'd rather just buy a kit and be done with it. Anyhow thanks for stopping by

[Chronic Chrissy]

Your price seems high for what I just paid for my setup fully assembled. I paid $220 cash, you said yours would cost $300. I have to remember that prices are different in dfferent places.

[VOYAGER]

I hear ya, i know i could probably find it cheaper if i wasn't so paranoid about buying stuff like this off the net, so i don't mind spending a little more for to be anonymous, besides i can play with my new toy same day no shipping.

[Chronic Chrissy]

lolwhen I got my new set up it had to sit in a box for a week while I finished the room. I had such an itch to turn it on and get it running I put every free moment into finishing the room. Then when it was done and turned on it hurt my eyes so bad to look in there that I had to wear sunglasses for a week.

[VOYAGER]

i guess thats an easy way to judge light intensity. i can look straight into my lights and its still tolerable.

[Chronic Chrissy]

I should have written that a little clearer. I had to wear the sunglasses to look in the room , not all the time, lol. Then after a week my eyes adjusted now I just sit and watch my plants grow....waiting....fuck I wish they would hurry up! We're dry right now and it sucks...but you can't rush nature now can you.