In the Beginning was THE WORD

[Budman37]

Hello.
I am 42 and was raised in a "religious" background...I have heard many people say that to believe in God you must be religious. That if you don't believe in Christ and are not born again you will burn in hell. Quite a scare tactic don't you think....I have been studying God's scriptures for the past 10 years fairly regularily.. The first few years I also listened to the Religious community and believed what They told me...As the years went on I prayed that God show me the Truth. I know that the things God has taught me in His Scriptures are Truth... So what's the difference, well it's both complicated and easy... Many claim that the new testament of the Bible is the only thing you need to know Just be saved is what many say and teach..This isn't what Christ taught when He was on this earth...You must remeber that when Christ was alive in the flesh there was no New Testament as a matter of fact Christ taught the Old Testament. He stated that no one should change a jot or tittle from the scriptures... For a person to fully understand the Bible they must go back and study the original Text in either hebrew for the old testament or Greek for the New testament..Why you may ask..Well alot has to do that when the scriptures are translated into another language it looses it's true meaning. In the original 1st edition of the King James Translation the scholars new this and included a warning to all who study to not just read it but Study( (this warning was taken out by the church)..The Bible also states this that one should Study to show themselves approved. It makes sense if you think about it...If someone wanteds to learn about any topic thy need to do more then just read a book. They need to study in order to understand....If you gave a first grader a college book on say Chemistry and said read this..Do you think they would understand fully all about Chemistry??This is how the Bible is theres more then just reading to fully understand..Unfortunetly many of the Churches don't teach God's Word they teach traditions of men..A thing Jesus said to never do...So why do they do this??because they think they know what there teaching but they are mearly just passing on what some man told them was the truth ,Not God...
I will give you an example: In the church and the english translation it states one must be born again to enter into the kingdom of God...John 3:3 So we get all these preachers doing altar calls telling everyone to just make a desision to be born again spiritually and you will go to heaven....However when you study the greek you will see that the correct translation is One must be Born from above Not again...Meaning that you must be born into the flesh to receive the ability to enter the kingdom of Heaven. Now that makes sense, and agrees with the old testament. In genesis chapter 6 it tells us that some of Gods children came from heaven to earth without being born of a women and did some bad things...These children cannot enter the kingdom of Heaven. I know this all seems kinda hard to swallow but it will make sense if you strart to study the entire Scriptures correctly dividing the word of God....I myself only know of one church to study the bible correctly..Heres the link www.shepherdschapel.com. Give it a try it might clear up some confusion for you....I'm just trying to point anyone who cares in the right direction..It's up to you to decide whats wrong or right..Thats why we are hear. To be born innocent of things that has happened and prepare us for the things that will happen...To believe and seek God can not be found in a tradition of man or a religion..It can only be found in God's Word and that's reality not religion...;)

[Hamlet]

An honest and straightforward approach for sure. At least you're trying to get at the truth of it all. But the problem lies in the assumption that the Old Testament is "God's Word". Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence as Carl Sagan once said...and all rationale points to other conclusions.

You're perfectly welcome to your beliefs in my book; just as long as they aren't forced on me through laws, Government or Education. Unfortunately we're ass deep in problems, prohibitions and wars because religious practitioners can't keep their practices to themselves.

[Budman37]

I would never force anyone to believe me.....It's your choice!!! I have studied enough to know the old Testament is true...Take the prophesies for one...If a person today could predict the future and be 25% right the world would go crazy over that person...The old testament prophecies are 100% true, some have not come to pass yet but they will... I mean think about it 66 books of the bible written over a large period of time and it all goes together Thats impossible with any man derived book...There will come a day when everyone will know the truth, up until then Good Luck trying to figure it out without Gods help....Everything we learn no matter what the topis is learned through a book and study...Doesn't it make sense God would give us the resources to learn about Him the same way.....The world seems to go crazy if one person says one thing and it comes to pass..why do you think that despite all the prophesies of just Christ birth alone that where fortold are dismissed???? Because there are spiritual forces downplaying Gods word so people dont even consider it....And even thats been written that it would be that way in the scriptures....This world is sooooo deceived but thats ok there will be a time when all will be able to learn the truth and it ain't to far away...
:thumbsup:

[kuulbns]

I was also raised in "The Church" and have studied hard to understand all I was taught. Pastor Arnold Murrey however, I have a difficult time with. He is judgemental and derisive. I much prefer Bishop T.D. Jakes and Joyce Meyers for practical daily teaching. Best to You, Kuu :)

[Hamlet]

hhhmm, yeah...prophesies. I haven't seen a good Prophet yet. Ever notice how prophecies are all 'and thus, verily verily, forsoothe the dragon shall raise its brow to the seven hills, etc, etc.. always mixed with vagueness and a threat and dare not to not believe it. I'm pretty sure there are very good reasons for that.

People are killing each other every day thinking they're fullfilling some prophesy. Maybe we're just scared shitless of an unknown future--I dunno; so we'll even accept the image of some gastly prophesy and do our damnest to fulfill it, rather than accepting the future for what it is--an unknown-and try to make the best of it.

I take it back...H.G. Wells was a pretty good prophet.

[Budman37]

Like I said its tough to know whose telling the truth these days..the good news is there will be a time for truth to be learned and everyone will have a fair chance ... It doesnt matter much...Remember some of this stuff and perhaps you'll find that good prophet your looking for..

[Budman37]

All men seem to judge..I like pastor murruys teaching its right on as far as scipture goes ..I now he tends to be judgemental especially when he talks against pot but putting that aside jakes and that lady also teach some pretty judgemental ideas and they aren't teachings solid scriptures just there ideas and how they interpret the bible...They teach of a rapture, thats a lie from the pit of hell. they also teach you decide if your going to heaven. Gods word teaches God alone decidesRemember the verse But Lord we taught in your name and healed in your name...God looks at them and says Get away from me You dont know me....Thats not something I want to here...It's best to study the word correctly after all isn't JHesus the word of God made flesh????
:thumbsup:

[kuulbns]

hmmmm,... well personally I believe in the rapture and tribulation. I guess we'll all find out the truth eventually. All I can do is try hard to be the best person I'm capable of, and I fail at that regularly.

[Hamlet]

Looking for? I'm avoiding them like the plague....lol

Go looking for a prophet and the next thing ya know you're drinking poison koolade in a compound somewhere.

[Oneironaut]

I would never force anyone to believe me.....It's your choice!!! I have studied enough to know the old Testament is true...
Hahahaha, the Old Testament is true? You mean, man was formed from dirt, woman was formed from man's rib, plants existed before the sun did, selling your daughter into slavery is A-OK, it is obligatory to stone homosexual men to death, and the reason we have different languages is because we tried to build a giant tower and God thought it was too close to comfort? What's your evidence that this is nothing but another one of the thousands of mythologies invented by pre-scientific tribes who didn't know better?

Take the prophesies for one...If a person today could predict the future and be 25% right the world would go crazy over that person...The old testament prophecies are 100% true, some have not come to pass yet but they will...
Hahaha, so-called "psychics" use the same trick buddy. They make a whole lot of predictions, and claim they are all true. If something in them has happened, whoopee, score one point for the psychic, but if one hasn't happened, oh that one will happen eventually but we all have to wait.

Sorry but that kind of reasoning proves nothing.

I mean think about it 66 books of the bible written over a large period of time and it all goes together Thats impossible with any man derived book...
Yeah, people couldn't possibly write stories that kind of deal with the same stuff. I mean, that's impossible. Only a divine being could have come up with such gems of wisdom as "slaughter animals so God can enjoy the pleasant odor", "wives should submit unquestioningly to their husbands", "stone to death anybody who works on the Sabbath" and "it's not okay to eat shellfish for some reason".

There will come a day when everyone will know the truth, up until then Good Luck trying to figure it out without Gods help....Everything we learn no matter what the topis is learned through a book and study...
Umm, no, the people who write those books have to learn their information somewhere. We learn things ultimately by experiencing reality and subjecting our observations to logical scrutiny and experimentation. If God wants me to believe in him and his infinite wisdom, he can give me some clearer evidence than some weird sexist pro-slavery documents written in Ancient Hebrew of which we don't have the original copies.

Doesn't it make sense God would give us the resources to learn about Him the same way.....The world seems to go crazy if one person says one thing and it comes to pass..why do you think that despite all the prophesies of just Christ birth alone that where fortold are dismissed???? Because there are spiritual forces downplaying Gods word so people dont even consider it....And even thats been written that it would be that way in the scriptures....This world is sooooo deceived but thats ok there will be a time when all will be able to learn the truth and it ain't to far away...
:thumbsup:
We can learn the truth now. We separate truths from falsities by applying logic and reason to our observations of reality. And when we apply basic logic and reason to our observations about God (namely the complete and total lack of any objective observations at all) we come to the unmistakable conclusion that there is exactly as much evidence for God as there is for the Tooth Fairy.

[Budman37]

I am saying that the word of God teaches us the Truth and not a tradition of man..thus who mock Gods word have never studied it there just saying shit they have heard or think they know but in the end we will all find out the truth until then Study to show thyself approved to God....Christ tells us to be careful of those that come in His name but are not of him... So whats that soppose to mean that everyone is right..i think not

[Budman37]

Hahahaha, the Old Testament is true? You mean, man was formed from dirt, woman was formed from man's rib, plants existed before the sun did, selling your daughter into slavery is A-OK, it is obligatory to stone homosexual men to death, and the reason we have different languages is because we tried to build a giant tower and God thought it was too close to comfort? What's your evidence that this is nothing but another one of the thousands of mythologies invented by pre-scientific tribes who didn't know better?

Hahaha, so-called "psychics" use the same trick buddy. They make a whole lot of predictions, and claim they are all true. If something in them has happened, whoopee, score one point for the psychic, but if one hasn't happened, oh that one will happen eventually but we all have to wait.

Sorry but that kind of reasoning proves nothing.

Yeah, people couldn't possibly write stories that kind of deal with the same stuff. I mean, that's impossible. Only a divine being could have come up with such gems of wisdom as "slaughter animals so God can enjoy the pleasant odor", "wives should submit unquestioningly to their husbands", "stone to death anybody who works on the Sabbath" and "it's not okay to eat shellfish for some reason".

Umm, no, the people who write those books have to learn their information somewhere. We learn things ultimately by experiencing reality and subjecting our observations to logical scrutiny and experimentation. If God wants me to believe in him and his infinite wisdom, he can give me some clearer evidence than some weird sexist pro-slavery documents written in Ancient Hebrew of which we don't have the original copies.

We can learn the truth now. We separate truths from falsities by applying logic and reason to our observations of reality. And when we apply basic logic and reason to our observations about God (namely the complete and total lack of any objective observations at all) we come to the unmistakable conclusion that there is exactly as much evidence for God as there is for the Tooth Fairy.


You are sooo confused your saying stuff that dont make any sense...Your saying what God and the tooth fairy are the same???? Hmmm well when your on your death bed or hurt or in pain i guess you dont cry out to God you cry out to the tooth fairy..well no wonder you have no answers......Funny thing is that despite your lack of respect for God..He still wants you to turn to Him....Tooth Fairy How stupid that sounds...Yopu have not study Gods word so why do you claim to know about Him....Your a goof ball thats been lied to by to many churches...study here for truth www.shepherdschapel.com

[Budman37]

Budman - I don't fully understand what you're saying.

Are you saying that by taking to Lord into our hearts and trying our best to live our life for him - we may still not get into the kingdom of heaven?

No i didnt say that.....I said the same thing the Bible says so if you dont believe in that then your on your own...Have you ever read that during the millenium many say to God but we worship you and healed in your name and He says to get away from me worker of iniquity you do not know me...Why do you think He says that they where obviously thought they where on the right page....

[weirdo79]

Hey bud what Oneiron said made perfect sense to me, try boning up on the reading comprehension. He parsed your stream of consciousness blathering rather well. Refuted the points you made and the best you can come up with is "your so confused your not making sense"....Actually just because you dont understand doesnt mean its not making any sense. Let me try a similar small analogy for you. Since there is as much evidence for say (another god) Zeus than by your logic he exists as well. (it even says in the bible that other gods exist...Christians always seem to gloss over this part.)

www.evilbible.com check it out everything Oneiron said is verified in the actual texts. It's amazing how religious people dont know their own books (they are a fantastic read if not completely contradictory fantasy novels though).

[Budman37]

See thats my point The Bible doesn't say other Gods exist.It says Man makes up other Gods and they are false Gods...Where do you think the Bible says that other gods do exist. I dont care what you guys think ..really, you can believe in the tooth fairy if you want or zues...For the other guy to say that others make up prophesies and then make you believe there true so thats the same as the prophesies in the Bible...Thats why i said the other guy didnt make sense....It is proven that the Bible prophesies are true and come to pass...It is also being proven that places and events the bible speak of did exist...As time goes on more things that in the Bible are proved to be true.....Just like the dead sea scrolls many of the texts of the old testament where in them. If you look you'll find that theres more proff of the Bible being true then just a myth...Why do you think that its 2006 AD why do we keep a timeline based on the appearence of Jesus if its only a myth??? You must remember that Satan is as real as God and his purpose is to try to abolish Gods word....He's doing a Good job trying to distort the truth He uses 4 ways to do that Politics,Education Economy and Religion. But just because Satan thinks he can win doesn't mean he will...I dont want to make any enemies just thought Id share some truth have a good day anyway...;)

[Budman37]

Oh and as far as the website link evilbible well what would you expect from a site called that..but why is it you choose to believe that and not the Bible????Man is pretty evil in himself murdering, raping, child molestation, abortions, and on and on The bible does talk about alot of bad things but in this world bad things a reality...Islam extremist hate the bible and believe in ther koran so they go out and blow themselves up and others and trully believe thats Good and god is happy with them and they get 7 virgins in heaven to fuck all the time ...but thats a better faith then the God of the Bible who says wipe those people out....I dont think so but thats just my opinion... If you base your faith on just a tradition of man you'll be deceived...I suggested a website where you can go and studty the bible in detail with understanding. If you like check it out...You dont have to we all have free will to make out own choices I just believe that i should at least share that the truth is out there and among the truth is alot of lies.....www.shepherdschapel.com

[CheebaHawk]

See thats my point The Bible doesn't say other Gods exist.It says Man makes up other Gods and they are false Gods...Where do you think the Bible says that other gods do exist. I dont care what you guys think ..really, you can believe in the tooth fairy if you want or zues...For the other guy to say that others make up prophesies and then make you believe there true so thats the same as the prophesies in the Bible...Thats why i said the other guy didnt make sense....It is proven that the Bible prophesies are true and come to pass...It is also being proven that places and events the bible speak of did exist...As time goes on more things that in the Bible are proved to be true.....Just like the dead sea scrolls many of the texts of the old testament where in them. If you look you'll find that theres more proff of the Bible being true then just a myth...Why do you think that its 2006 AD why do we keep a timeline based on the appearence of Jesus if its only a myth??? You must remember that Satan is as real as God and his purpose is to try to abolish Gods word....He's doing a Good job trying to distort the truth He uses 4 ways to do that Politics,Education Economy and Religion. But just because Satan thinks he can win doesn't mean he will...I dont want to make any enemies just thought Id share some truth have a good day anyway...;)

you have spoken well, me personally have never came across anything in the bible that made me feel that this is all a myth. for the most part it was just very hard to understand. but then again (and this is the truth) i'v bin stripped away from everything i loved, you name it, it was takin away. and what wasnt takin away truned against me. i thought i was answering for the wrongs i'v done, but it turns out that all this made me seek god intencely. in all truth it seemed to me ( and i could be wrong) that god was saying " you love those things more than you do me, now lets see what you do with out all that" maybey im wrong but the bible was more than words to me it was like a living person exposing my wrongs then corrected me and then directed me.

[Budman37]

Now that wisdom....

[afghooey]

"Oh and as far as the website link evilbible well what would you expect from a site called that..but why is it you choose to believe that and not the Bible????"

If you were paying attention you might have noticed that all the quotes on that page are from the bible. Double check with your own bible, or use one of the many bibles online if you don't believe it. The old testament openly condones pillaging, raping and murdering in the name of god.

[Budman37]

I know it does didnt say it didn't.....I suppose if someone read are history in say 3000 years they would think we are all barbarians too....are laws put criminals to death and people in jail because they deserve it...We kill millions of little babies by sticking scissors in there brains when they are being born and call it a good thing and a womens desision, who cares if they just throw the quivering little baby in a tin pan and throw it out in the trash. To me that sound barbarious but we as a nation just except it... The bibles a big book its not smart to take some verses out of it and then say see Gods evil and the bible is too,,,most dont have a clue what Gods plan is or what the bible teaches as a whole...They just try to take certain verses that prove there opinion and end up deceiving people and discredit Gods word....