Grow room questions

[televisor]

I've been actively reading as many threads and FAQ's as possible on building a growing room but I have a few specific concerns I'd like anyone to address, any input at this stage is very helpful.

I'll begin building a grow room within the next few days which also highlights the urgency of any and all responses (I'll be using my vacation time to do this project).

Anyway here's a summary: I'm going to build a small "Tool" / Storage closet in my basement, and have in the back of the closet a separate "closet" for the actual grow room. Presently there is just open space, so I will be framing these rooms myself. This is the first primary question... what size space should I have for my room? I will only be growing for a max of 3 years and hope to yield enough to keep me supplied for years to come. In other words my grow room setup will only last that lenght of time (3 years). The cieling is 8 feet tall, I've been debating on a size of 7x5 for the grow room?

I'd planned on insulating with r38 around the walls and then placing drywall up. Now, do I simply paint the drywall with flat white paint or invest in the sheets of steel I saw mentioned on here? Would there be any advantage to the steel? (or is it just a smell barrier?)

I've planned on an exhaust either out the back of the house or up through the roof (i havent figured out which is more convenient, yet), and planned on an intake from the neighboring tool closet front.

Next, as far as lighting goes I COULD afford a 400W fps, but I already have several regular light bulb balasts with circular reflectors and wall clips (the utility lights you can buy at wally world or wherever) In this case and for my limited grow time, would a few Compact Flourescent's be better?

Also, should I create an automatic / timer-ed watering system or would I be ok watering them myself?

I've purchased 2 high-end Panasonic Computer Fans, one I planned to use for the exhaust and one for the intake.

Finally, and most importantly, what type of door for this closet would you recommend? Smell is a serious concern although people will rarely ever be in my basement, I will inevitably have a family member who will want to see the front tool closet.

Please comment on this setup and ask any questions you like... I want to make this room as perfect as possible. THANKS!!!!

[stinkyattic]

. This is the first primary question... what size space should I have for my room? ....The cieling is 8 feet tall, I've been debating on a size of 7x5 for the grow room?
That'll be fine if you're not even considering getting more than a 400w light


. I will only be growing for a max of 3 years and hope to yield enough to keep me supplied for years to come.
Good luck preserving it for years to come.

.
. Now, do I simply paint the drywall with flat white paint or invest in the sheets of steel I saw mentioned on here?
It's not steel, it's mylar (like a cross between plastic and chrome- sort of.
Flat white is just fine.



. (or is it just a smell barrier?)
Nope. You're going to have to deal with that issue separately; see below.



. I've planned on an exhaust either out the back of the house or up through the roof (
Up through the roof is ideal. If you have an unused chimney, use it. The higher up the exhaust is, the more the wind disperses smell, the more stealth the whole thing is.



. Next, as far as lighting goes I COULD afford a 400W fps,
YES! Get one! [HPS you mean]



. but I already have several regular light bulb balasts with circular reflectors and wall clips (the utility lights you can buy at wally world or wherever)
NO! Those are useless for agricultural applications.



. In this case and for my limited grow time, would a few Compact Flourescent's be better?
If you insist on using clip lights, flouro's are better than incandescents.


. Also, should I create an automatic / timer-ed watering system or would I be ok watering them myself?
In dirt, you're well off to water them yourself because it forces you to pay more attention to your garden and you will see problems right away.



. I've purchased 2 high-end Panasonic Computer Fans, one I planned to use for the exhaust and one for the intake.
You'll want a bit more air flow than that. Ventilation is crucial. Have some other fans blowing gently around the room.



. Finally, and most importantly, what type of door for this closet would you recommend? Smell is a serious concern although people will rarely ever be in my basement, I will inevitably have a family member who will want to see the front tool closet.


It's the exhaust air you're going to have to deal with the most. search for 'carbon scrubber' or 'ozone generator'.

Good luck. Do your research.

[locomark]

Well,

To add a little more for you to think about. You want to grow for three years to last you for multi years. I would go for more bang for the buck. 1000 watts or more if you want more weed than you can consume in a month. Flourescent and computer fans are small time not enough to grow for years to come. You have to think big if you want to close down in three years. You will have to have great genetic like Bigbud which will give you more bang.

Look at like this a 400 watter will give you about eight or ten ounces per harvest. You need to grow for the long haul not just till you make the next harvest. I would go for two 1000 watters for flowering and a 400 watter for vegatation. You want to grow excess that you can smoke later so you have to grow BIG. Yes there are cost involved but you can swing it I'm sure.

Loco

[televisor]

You're right LOCO, that does make more sense, what kind of energy demands would a 1000W light bring?

The room is framed and insulated now, just need to finish installing the exhaust vent (which is going to be one serious bitch) and add drywall.

I;ll try to post some pics later.

[iwantFUEGO]

ive heard a single 1000w hps can raise your electricity bill by 40-60 dollars!

[stickyinsalem]

ok...if you are going to put a big amout of money into lighting..i would just suggest ebay.com...i've been looking on there all day and they have SHIT LOADS of CFL's on there that come in packages of like 30 and more...for less than 50$$...just a suggestion...but you sound as if your like me and good at building so...like i did...i put a shit load of light outlets in my box and used small lights to manuver them around where i need them...AT THE BASE of the plants...at the top...think about the future of the plants...and read some on what people have problems with in later stages of plant life...some cant get lighting under the top nodes...my problem with that is solved...although i may have spent more on buying lights seperate at lowes and walmart...(you can save on ebay)...i dont have one huge light at the top making it difficult to light the bottoms of the plants...as far as mylar and white paint...i used white paint...but i am thinking of getting mylar for my box...just for the fact that mylar reflects more...i have 8 lights total...with white paint im only getting another half light reflected...but with mylar...ill get about one more whole light bulb...freeeeee...and we all like frree shit...lol...
Just a suggestion...not a pro

[iwantFUEGO]

sticky can you post a pic of how your placed outlets all over your box?
Thanks :thumbsup:

[bongerstonerd00d]

I would avoid eBay even if I had to pay twice the price. I dont care to go to jail.

A 1000 watt light uses 1000 watts per hour, or 1KW unless using a digi ballast. They save about 15%. Look on your electric bill and it will tell you how much you pay per kW hour. Then do the multiplication.


b0nger

[stickyinsalem]

lol...so where you get your lights??? a grow site?...think about that one

[bob bobbinson]

no stickyissalem. ebay has been supposedly known to report people. so ive heard.

You can look in phone book for hydroponic shops in ur area. Thats what I did. And they had everything and more. I mean everything.

Or if ur just doing CFLs you can go to home depot or menards.

[latewood]

just go to bghydro.com(best customer service on the planet) and buy your lights...you can even by raw ballasts and build your own for 1/2 the price...I spent 210 bucks on 1000w hps hortilux and ballast assembly...bought one of their ballasts box and wired it...got about 250 in the one light itself...custom built by me!
Although you can grow nice plants with small lights...It takes alot of light and a very expensive exhaust system to keep the temps/humidity, down and there is no accounting how yield potential will be less than optimum due to pests/disease/You!/temps/humidity/mold...a ton of things...

you can grow alot of pot in 3 years, but I don't believe you can grow enough for Years to come, unless you use a bigger space , create a perpetual grow, and Trust me on this one...spend tons of cash.

I am not trying to discourage you, but you have 'Big Goals" and I feel you shouldn't be led down a Primrose path...

goodluck, Let us know what you decide. peace

[Dutch Pimp]

My last grow is stored in quart glass jars. I was under the impression, that if I kept them in a cool dark place, the bud would keep for years. This amount would last me 1-3 years. (One joint a day, sometimes only a half a J, it's that good!) Latewood- Do you know something, I don't about long term storage? Shelf life?

[televisor]

I'm going to have to rethink the lighting, I'm now torn between an HPS light or going with several CFL's. What's the heat difference between say a 400W HPS and 10 x 40 Watt CFL's ? I may do some combo of both? It would be nice to have a few CFL's that i could position as need be as the plant grows-

I agree I was probably reaching with the idea of growing enough for years to come in only 3 or so years, but I'll be happy growing whatever I can for the experience. As far as storage goes, I was thinking of vaccumm sealing it and then keeping it in a freezer. Anyone have any experience with keeping it that way and it working without any problems?

Still trying to get all the drywall worked up, I promise to have pics of the space this evening-

THANKS FOR ALL THE INPUT!!

[stinkyattic]

ive heard a single 1000w hps can raise your electricity bill by 40-60 dollars!
That's true- the light itself, plus with the venting that such a big hot lamp requires...

[stinkyattic]

I'm going to have to rethink the lighting, I'm now torn between an HPS light or going with several CFL's.

Both. Use the CFLs for vegging and the HPS for flowering.



What's the heat difference between say a 400W HPS and 10 x 40 Watt CFL's ?


I don't know exactly, but I think the HPS will be significantly warmer.
You will be able to get CFLs closer to the palnts for sure, but the CFL light is less what the plant needs in its late life stages.
You are going to have to ventilate either way.

[televisor]

Excellent info, Stinky, thanks as always. For ventilation I will have an intake from the neighboring room (just above the floor), and an exhaust with a homemade carbon scrubber in the ceiling (as long as I can figure out how to get the exhaust air to my hot water heater exhaust... they're only around 5 feet apart, but one of the floor joists between them has a circular HVAC vent running all the way through it... I'm debating using a flexible coil, i.e. a clothes dryer exhaust to manuver around the obstacle... any other thoughts?

[televisor]

I meant to also say that there will be a small oscillating fan in the room to move the air around as well.

[latewood]

Dutchy; Glass jars are the best way to store herbs, once they are completly dried. If there is still dampness then you must open jars for a few minuites everyday, until they are...Now longevity of potency starts to degrade at about a year, I believe...Haven't read up on that in a while, but I will be glad to re-research info for you when I get a couple minutes.
Now televisor mentioned the freezer. Well that just might work, but again all dampness needs to be drawn out of herbs until they are dry...I would use the same regimen as pollen storage...Jmo...Once herbs are completely dry...place loosely in paper bag in fridge to draw out whatever dampness is still in herbs...then place paper bags in freezer bags, or jars and freeze...Goodluck, I hope this helps.
p.s. I wouldn't know the math for 1 or 1/2 joint a day, I am probably at a 4-6 joint minimum my self...3lbs a year
and it is hard for me to sustain my stash through to the next cycle. peace

[Methyl3]

I would assume like most degredation processes in this world, the colder the temps the more the degredation process is impeded. The real questions relate to the physical state of the trichomes. What is the freezing point of the lipids that are retained within the trichomes? If anywhere near a freezer temp then will the transition from a liquid state to a solid state affect the retaining container (trichome). IMHO these are the questions I would be lloking into as we know that with less heat we get slower degredation.

For what its worth I and a few growers back in the day use to vacuum seal our stash in mason jars and store them in a cool, dark area. We smoked some samples that were about 1.5-2 years old and never noticed one bit of difference in strength. This was one hit pot so maybe there was significant degredation, but since the potency was so high to start with it was impossible to discern any differences. We had also froze some, but not for long term and they were in vacuumed sealed bags.

For what its worth, if you go to jarring and then freezing them, make sure to take the light out of the feezer. Light is definately a degredant stimulant and although it's not much, every little bit helps when your talking long term.

[stinkyattic]

Good points Methyl, and if your freezer has a self-defrost function, don't even bother. You'd want a chest freezer that doesn't go through those cycles.

Storing in a cool dark dry place such as a root cellar is what I would do if I had to.

Another thing to think of is that much chemical degradation is tied to the amount of oxygen present.

Have you guys ever seen those nitrogen things that you use to preserve wine after the bottle has been opened? It would make sense to either replace the air in the mason jar with N2, or to just use those food saver bags that you can suck all the air out of.

[Dutch Pimp]

Thanks, for the info-advice, guys.

[televisor]

I believe I'm going to build a small "light board" on a thin piece of wood, lined with 6-8 receptacles for CFL's for the lighting. Someone suggested a CFL setup for the VEG stage and then using an HPS light for the Flowering stage. My question is since I've been able to find high wattage 105w etc, CFL's in all light varieties, i.e. full spectrum, daylight, and warm... could i just use the light bar i'm building and just swap out the CFL's from the veg to flower stage? Or should I still invest in the HPS for the flower stage? All thoughts appreciated!


P.S. Anyone tried these? Could the air purification be significant enough to help a growroom? http://www.1000bulbs.com/products.php?cat=Air-Purifiers

[dion]

hps for flowering is inarguably better. but instead of cfls i prefer 4' flouro tubes.

btw flex hose to manuver around the duct is fine. im sure you know how to make an air tight seal. mind you that insulation is going to be key in your ability to control your environment and conserve your energy costs. if you make holes, make them airtight.

[BOYZNUS]

I'd planned on insulating with r38 around the walls and then placing drywall up.

Do you realize that R38 fiberglass is about 11" thick? Thats some pretty thick wall framing you have there. As an insulation contractor, I can tell you that R-11 is 3.5"(2x4 framing) and R-19 is 5.5" (2x6 framing). Even if ya cram it all in the framing,, you will only end up with R-11 or R-19.

good luck

[televisor]

Boyznus: Yeah, the R38 was between the ceiling of my grow room and the hardwood floor of my main floor. I only have R-13 in the walls. R-13 in the walls surrounding the actual grow room, and then R-13 in the walls surrounding the "tool shed" room front. As smell is the major concern, my only issue left is the exhaust, which helps now that I've confirmed that flex hosing is ok, (thanks Dion!) ... i'll likely do a home made carbon scrubber for the smell?

Another Q on the lighting, I see where Cool Cfl's are the way to go for Vegging stage.... so should I stack only cool CFLs in my light bar or is there a benefit to throwing some warm lights in there also?

Great help so far all, thanks a million!

[mobay]

http://greenmanspage.com/guides/growbox.html
hope this will help you on your project.