Plant Rescue! CFL lighting

[repherz]

pls keep in mind i am a first timer and am open to ANY suggestions:rasta:


ok, at a buddy of mines house on his back deck we started throwing seeds into these decent size clay pots that were about half way full with potting soil. we really had no intention of starting a garden but when we sprouted about twenty plants in the three pots we couldnt resist. my friends brother transplanted almost all of them into containers and brought them inside, they were leaving for talladega to see the race. i grabbed up the ones he didnt bring inside and brought them home, i sprouted a couple more at home in my window sill. they stayed there for a couple days, only getting sun for about half the time it was out, my apartment is in the back of the building on the top floor, so when the sun is above and on the other side of the building i get no direct light.
long story short(er) i have set up this:
i have a recessed linen closet in my bedroom with 3 shelves, the bottom one about 3 ft or so from the floor. the entire closet is already a matt white color. the colset has a folding door that is metal, the front was painted white but not the back. the shelves are wood painted white too, top and bottom. i left the bottom shelf on as to create a box at the bottom, but took off the top shelf and put it against the back of the door so all four sides inside are white. i have a lamp, and two lights with the clamps, all three have 100 watt CFL bulbs, cool white 100watt CFLs were on sale four for ten dollars at home depot. i lined the floor with plasic over the carpet to protect from water and reflect light.

i put them in this setup two days ago with two incadesent lights, it was all i had. i mixed the potting soil i had with some scotts potting mix and added some root stimulator and miracle grow (small amounts of both) to water and mixed up the soil. i have to get new pots so they all have their own home still.

they seem to have stopped growing since all this has happened. they were growing in the sunlight but ovbiously werent getting enough. i dont know if it is the light but i hope the CFLs i put in today will help. im starting them on 24 hr cycle to see how they will do.

suggestions? how often to water? miracle grow ok? lights ok? im brand new at this help me out. im gonna go take pics right now and post them in a few so everyone can see my setup so far, limited funds so its not much at all, im growing macguyver style and shit, lol stuff from the basement, at my parents house, lamp from the living room, moms containers, my plastic on the floor was actually already on the floor in my closet it had a comforter and a blanket in it. whatever works,.. anyws im gonna go take some pics be back soon

[repherz]

ok here are the pics:
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i have to get another fixture and get the lamp out of there obviously, im going to pu some foil on the back of the door too so its not obsorbing the light. i have a fan outside the door i keep it cracked so the air can move at least a little, i want to buy a small fan to put inside.

[repherz]

there is some pics of the little guys in there too, not much to look at now tho, wish i knew what strain they were, could be anything

[GrowinGreen23]

no more MG get more lights and transplant into seperate pots they'll never have enough room all together

[repherz]

yeah i want to put them in their own pots, im going out tomorrow to pick some up, is it ok to leave the little ones together you think? what about nutrition?

[repherz]

here is some more pics, apparently my links up there dont work (*stoner error:rasta: )

[repherz]

i went in and lowered one light right on the big pot, i can already see the plants move toward the light i know they have been waiting for some real light they can use

[9ski9]

Get the plants separated right away. As soon as the tap roots tangle, you'll hurt them trying to separate them. I'd take off the reflector on the one CFL. If it doesn't screw off, then remove the bulb and cut it off with metal shears---then put the bulb back on.

Then get the plants to within ONE INCH of the tops of the plants. Either lower the lights, or wrap books in foil---dull side showing---as booster seats to bring them up.

My first choice is to use mylar for reflection. I also wrap my pots in foil (I don't care if it's dull or shiny side out for the pots, but some people demand you put the dull side out).

After repotting in their own pots, I'd sprinkle a coating of white rocks on the soil surface. I use white marble or granite, since it doesn't absorb water. This reflects lights, wherin the dirt would be absorbing the light.

Don't feed them for two more weeks. They already have some Miracle Grow (which is frowned upon because it's time-released and you have no control), so you'll only nute burn seedlings.

Buy a little bottle of SuperThrive at a garden center. Add a few drop to every gallon of water and use it at every feeding for their entire life.

At three weeks, I'd start feeding with bat guano, which you can find online.

I'm guessing you don't know your tap water's PH? I'd really suggest using bottled water, with a 6.8PH. PH test kits can be found near the aquariums in a pet store for $5, or so.

I'd also be sure to have a small fan blowing on them 24/7. This will strengthen their main stems. This is a must. Fans are cheap.

You could have a nice stealth grow in your space. Every step you take to improve their home will really pay off.

[repherz]

i went in my lights are about two inches off the pots i raised them up and lowered the lights down. not sure on the ph but i have been letting water sit for about two days before i use it i read that somewhere. i have a fan outside the door wich is cracked but im going to get a small one to put in there with the plants on the floor or something.

btw thank you so much for the advice man its greatly appreciated

[9ski9]

No prob...BTW, I suggested you remove the reflector because it traps heat and you can't get it as close to the plant tops. And get the fan close enough so the leaves flutter; don't blow 'em down, but make it strong enough to show movement.

And if they are looking a little stretched and skinny when you are repotting them, don't hesitate to burry them a little. Meaning, add soil so less of the stem is showing. It'll firm them up for their new life next to the fan.

Good luck!

[repherz]

i took the reflector off, but i moved the light back up to about six inches off the top, my tallest plant, wich was about 2 in off the light when i moved it before, was noticibly turning yelllow in the short itme it was closer.
when i repot how should i do the soil? i have a bag of potting soil at my friends house, normal potting soilwith the little white balls, should i mix in the miracle grow? i have this old rooting solution i found in my dads garage, its a 4-10-3 mix it says root stimulator and plant starter solution, should i use it and how? and also, how often should i water? im concerned about their health since they are just now getting into good growing conditions (i hope! :) )

[repherz]

i will post new pics tomorrow after re-potting, since it will cange the look of my setup. the leaves that i had turning yellow already had yellow spots on them from their previous conditions. i removed them with an exacto

[repherz]

:rasta: ok its about time for my trip to the garden center, i need to get pots first of all, how big should i go? i also need to pick up soil,suggestions on mixtures? i have some root stimulator and some miracle grow, wich i have been reading bad things about, should i mix in some with the new soil or keep it clean? there is 8 plants going right now, diffentent ages and sizes. i want to get them into a good, permanent home. yeasterday i changed to cfl lighting from incandescent (i know, it was all i had, lol. bought the cfls as quick as i could) i want to keep making changes untill i get this right dammit:stoned:

[repherz]

ok i hit up the garden center i had 15 bucks. i bout a bag of ferti-lome potting mix, the guy said its what they use in their potted plants in their green house. out of all the bags of plant food they had i opted for epsoma tomato-tone. i read a 20-20-20 mix is best and this is 4-7-10, i couldnt find any others that were as evenly distributed i hope i made a good choice. i already had some ferti-lome root stimulator, 4-10-3, i used a little drop mixed with water in the cap in the holes i transplanted into. i mixed the potting mix with the tomato tone, it said one part food to 30 parts soil i hope i estimated right when i mixed it up. i only bought one new pot, they were cheab but i only had 15 bucks. i have 3 (2 3 inchers and a pretty seedling) in the big pot, 2 in the medium (tall seedlings) , and 1 in a 3x3 tupperware bowl and 2 in another tupp. same size (seedlings of course).

i tested my cfls, held my hand right under them for a minute to see how the heat was, i could actually hold my hand on the top of the buld without being burnt, these things arent very hot at all, i lowered them back to between 1 and 2 in.s off the tops.
i ran out of room on the floor, i'm gonna have to rearrange some stuff, the tupperware bowls are on the lamp right below the bulb, i have to get that lamp out of there and get another hanging one that thing takes up mass space and really isnt reflective. ill post some pics in a bit gotta take em. SUGGESTIONS?PLEASE any help is GREATLY appreciated, thanks to anyone who has given me pointers im trying to improve

[repherz]

thanks growinggreen and 9ski9 for the advice. i have stopped the mg like you said and 9ski9 i took the reflector off and lowered the lights. i read that my yellowing of leaves was probably a nitrogen diffeciency, not my lights. im going to get some white rocks and some superthrive like you suggested, the white rocks sound like such an obvious thing, thanx. you suggested bat guano for feeding. i bought some plant food(tomato-tone which has dried blood, bone meal and all kinds of other shit in it, they had fish emulsion wich i have read good things about. if the bat guano was readily available to me i think it would be a better idea (not saying it wouldnt work better though). im also going to pick up ph tester, is there any particular thing i should look for when buying one? i have also repositioned my fan to get more air flow. i still havent gotten a small one yet to go inside with them ( :( ) thanks again for your help

[repherz]

bump;:...:;qmud
:rasta:

[repherz]

apparently i am wasting my time chronicleing everything on here

151 reads, 1 worthwhile reply

fuck it, i guess since i am not growing some name brand weed with some crazy ass equiptment nobody cares bout to find a new board

[repherz]

:stoned: thanks 9ski9, peace

:mad:

[9ski9]

Ha, people get busy with other stuff...

Your girls are separated in their own pots and you've dropped the CFL's really close. Do you have the fan blowing on them gently? They don't need any food right now, but will eventually need something high in nitrogen, which is the first of the three numbers. I only use bat guano---mine is, I believe, is 10-1-0, but I also have some 5-1-1 fish emulsion. I just don't like to recommend specific things I don't also use.

Did you find the SuperThrive?

Post some pics.

[repherz]

no they didnt have it :( i was pissed, they did have fish emulsion, im obut to buy some, i am going today to get 4 more cfls, i have cool white im going to get warm white, last night they had been in light for 24hrs and started to droop bad, one smaller one almost shrivled up when i came home and checked on them, i cut the light off for 8 hours and this morning they look great. wierd. so when i get food i should only worry bout the N and forget about the other #s? they have stuff that is like yours, 10-1-1

[repherz]

im gonna take some pics when i get back with the lights, prob later this afternoon

[repherz]

oh and yes the fan is on them now its actually on a shelf above them in the closet but moves air abound in the whole closet

[9ski9]

The fan needs to be blowing on them. They need to flutter in the breeze, not just have air circulation. This will make them fight the gentle breeze and grow a strong main stem.

I've grown 18/6 and 24/0 during veg...a lot of people believe the 6 hours of darkness gives them a break. The goal is to have as little stress as possible. Many people believe stress can turn plants male. I agree, 'though I just did a 24/0 veg and have plants that are now crazy big for my space.

I buy my bat guano on eBay, btw.

Do you plan on doing a CFL grow from start to finish?

Also, I'd recommend picking up a misting bottle. If you want to use an empty bottle of spray cleaner, that's cool, too, but be sure to rinse it with super hot water. I mist whenever I check on my girls. They love the humidity.

[repherz]

im bout to get some pics taken later today, i have a q bout my lights...
i have 2 warm white cfls at the top of the box and one daylight cfl fight above each pot, the plant have started to droop (as noted above) in the light, i read the droop was from inefficien lighting, when i let them in 8 of dark they perked back up. i did just have the warm white cfls i bought 2 daylight ones yesterday when this happened hoping to counteract this, i also went from 3 bulbs to 4 now in my 1ft deep 2ft wide 3 ft hisgh space

is it the light thats doing this? or my soil? it hasnt been drying out very well but i have clay pots with big drain holes is that my prob?

[9ski9]

I've never had a problem with drooping plants because of CFL's. They should almost be growing before your eyes under those lights at this early stage. I suppose a pic would really help. Keeping CFL's about an inch about the plants, I've had to raise the lights 3 times some days. But even though they don't give off much heat, you still need a fan on your babies. Check the actual temp of where the plant top is...should be in the low 80's at most.

The "ferti-lome" soil you mentioned sounds like it has added ferts (the "ferti" part), which isn't exactly what you wanted, but keep them with what you have. No more screwing around with their roots.

Water them with room temp water so you don't shock them. Water until the soil is completely saturated, then wait until it's pretty dry before watering again. This will make the roots hunt for water and create a better root system.

But get some pics up and you'll get some feedback on how they are looking. If they only get droopy when the lights are on, then it's obviously a light/heat problem.

[repherz]

u got it on the pics, btw tho the cfls u were using, watts? lumens? etc... jus curious


thanks again

[9ski9]

I use the basic 26w that are 100w equivalent. I use 10, with a variety of lumens. I pretty much start out with 10 pots, each with it's own CFL. Then I'll kill one or two runts and double the light on my strongest seedlings.

It's sort of a crap shoot when it comes to which plants you give extra light and attention to...you never know if you're getting a girl, or not. And it sure sucks when it turns out bad. You just go into it believing every one is female until you see differently.

And you avoid stressing them.

[repherz]

same here, they only had either warm white or daylight at hd so i have 2 of each going, all the 100 watt equivilent. the daylights are 27 watts, warm white 23.

here are the droopers, the little one that i said dried up and came back to life has dried up again, but this time it did it during their dark cycle. dirt was still a little moist but it was hard so i squeezed the cup some to loosen it up. as soon as i saw this, the leaves looked dry i assumed the soil was to hard for the roots. after i loosened it i watered it pretty good, till it started draining pretty quick.

i think it needs to be in better dirt im about to put it with the others, their roots arent big enough yet (unfortunatly) for them to run out of space.

[repherz]

ok going clockwise starting with the first pic:
1: what i thought was the prettiest one has started to droop, still very green though, everywhere ( stem has some color)
2: prettiest little one has shriveled up on me, again. im gonna get in in the other soil. if i can get some free time its new pots and soil for all of them, i want my dirt to drain better.
3: this little guy has looked just like this for a while now. it had streched itself so when i repotted i put it down a little farther. seems healthy other than a slight yellow tint on the seed leaves.
4: this little bitch. developed a yellowish/green tint versus a darker green but other than that has looked exactly like this since i aquired her ( i hope her). the pic makes it look more yellow than it does in person. very shitty camera sorry guys.
5: tall and droopy from the other pic and her (hopefully) sister beside her. that plant (left) had two deformed leaves that were ripped by my friends bro, dont know how but it got kinda roughed up, i trimmed those ugly leaves because they never started to look healthy(droopy, dying) and since then this plant has showed the best health/potential

[repherz]

i learned today i may be getting some really nice clones. a good friend is friends with a fellow grower who has just taken MASS clones. i told his i would pay but he said his friend is gonna give us some, i said the more the marryer (however u spell that) bring em on.
now i really have to get this stuff down man i dont want to kill the new babies when they come, he has NL, BB, G-Star and some other shit i forget its name
cant wait!! i hope they come sooner than later but im as patient as i need to be for free clones of the fire, ill keep ya posted on when they come , start a new log, hopefully im experieced enough by then with help from the board and such to produce something worthwhile. well see what happens...

[9ski9]

You just can't grow more than one plant in a pot. Either carefully repot one, or kill the weakest. You can't hope roots develop, yet hope they don't interfere with each other at the same time.

I would imagine a seasoned grower would want to know what your PH is...it should be around 6.8.

When trying to figure out a problem, you have the eliminate what you know it isn't...like too high/low PH, or too much heat, or bad soil. If you have the basics down, then MJ plants wants to grow like crazy.

It shouldn't be a fight.

A good pot; decent soil without added ferts; a good light; a fan; some SuperThrive; low 80's temps; and PH6.8 water.

By the time you reach three weeks, you should have a little bush.

BTW, as long as you aren't adding extra ferts, Miracle Grow won't kill your plants. Some people actually like it. I've seen huge, beautiful plants grown with Miracle Grow.

[Swizzy89304]

Dont water as often. Let the soil dry out COMPLETELY - test this by prodding yer finger in gently about 1-2 inches. If its about 70/80% dry, then water again FROM THE TOP until you start getting a moderate runoff. Let the plants sit for 5 minutes so all the water drains through, then chuck the runoff water outside.
The droopiness is caused by the roots not getting enough oxygen. Could also be caused by ferts, but normally you start seeing blemishes on the leaves. Dont worry about a couple of small yellow spots, but if more than 20% of the plant starts turning yellow, then immediately flush the plants. You do this by using PLAIN - no ferts (bottled is best, dont get mineral water) water, and using 3 gallons of water per 1 gallon of pot. This is a general rule though, you wanna carry on pouring water through until it runs 100% clear. This gets rid of all the nutes. It will take a while for the soil to dry, but when it does, water again with a VERY weak nute solution. The soil is now totally nuteless because of the flushing so youll want to add some. Start with a quarter of what it says on the packet, that should be fine. They still may not survive IF this happens though, it depends how long you let the problem last.

[repherz]

when i bought my dirt i thought i had made a good choice but i now know i should get something else, it is potting mix for indoor plants, i read on the bag it retains water, the roots are probably lacking oxygen the plants havent been watered for a couple days and it is still moist at the top.

im thinking about starting over so the plants can grow from seed all in the same spot, no moving, and i can replace my soil. i started germinating some seeds in a towel today in a drawer.

im kinda glad you said that actually, bout the roots not getting enough oxygen because i noticed my soil was staying wet, and there are big drain holes in the pot, i read that that could occur but im not experienced to know for sure that it wasnt my lights or something else, not that im glad i got droopy plants lol just feel like im learning something ya know, im lucky to have you guys 4 advice

im gonna pick and choose in the morning, survival of the fittest i guess, see who lives and who gets flushed, sad to say :( but ya gotta do what ya gottta do i guess. whoever lives will get moved one last time into new dirt, plain ass old potting soil. if it lives it lives i guess, i just cant wait for these clones! if i end up getting them soon ill be killing off or giving away all these guys anyway to make way, hmm bagseed or BB and NL clones, tough choice, lol... when they do come in i feel like i have learned alot in the last week or so i feel more comfortable with what to do.
ill update tomorrow thanx guys for your help again

peace

[repherz]

oh, and ph yes i read about the ph should be approx 6.8 for most strains, havent got around to getting a ph tester yet, on the list though for sure