droopy leaves now crispy

[MaryjaneMenehune]

Hey all,
It looked as though one of my seedlings was getting a little too much water as the leaves were curling under, so I cut back on the watering.... well, i checked today and the leaves feel kind of crispy...is that normal?

ps, im in soil (perlite mixed with peat and potting mix)
leaves are about an inch in length and second set of new leaves is forming
under 4100k lights about an inch or two away running 24/0...can the light cycle have effect on leaves?
s/i mix,not sure what ratio.... about two weeks old

Give me some aid por favor,:)
mjm

pic is a few days old but helps visualize problem

[MaryjaneMenehune]

could somebody please lend me some help?
It's too bad I can't just borrow a really good grower for a few months and learn how they do it or something. I swear my thumb is the opposite of green, it is f'ing bloody murder red.....
.....I had bought a pH tester but it was defective.:mad: WTF.
... I have been giving these plants a little less than 1/3 dilluted (plant food by shultz)...all the ingredients are there, why won't they grow right?
im cutting back on watering (although i flushed one that looked like it was white and burnt from nutes)
tomorrow, I am going to try lowering pH to see if that does anything unless im told otherwise....
i think ill try orchid mix with perlite next time, i hear that is pretty good?

HOW can i get the leaves to shoot back up?

[justaseed]

if you are using a peat mixture you must use dolimitic lime to keep the ph from being too low. peat is naturally acidic. i use promix bx myself, which is peat based and when i mix up a batch of soil i add 2 tbsp of lime per gal of soil. the 1st time i used promix i didn't add lime and i lost 7 outta 10 seedlings! also that seedling looks way too young to be getting ferts.

[MaryjaneMenehune]

I wont be giving it any more ferts till they get a little light green and older. i did hear you can fert after third set of leaves lightly...the pic is old (camera went haywire) and the third set is starting to develop...anyways, i will just let it do it's thing till it is a "big girl". how long before the leaves start to perk back up?
Does anybody know a good digital pH tester that works for both soil and hydro?
(also, where are they available?)

[justaseed]

you could just go to the pet shop and get a chemical test for $5. i would repot with soil with lime added as soon as possible. once you test the ph of course!! although i'm sure peat without lime will have a way to low ph for mj. check 1st though, you never know. i just reread your 1st post and noticed you said the medium also had potting mix. i misread it before and thought it was just peat and perlite. i will still stick by the ph issue though. i have NEVER had any success without use of lime at 1-2 tbsp per gal.

[MaryjaneMenehune]

they should be perking up with a limited water supply, right? pH may be a little off still, im trying to ease it in to avoid any shock..
one other question...if too many nutes, is it better to flush completely and risk drowning and root rot, or do it gradually?

[Earthy Dank]

gradually... just water it and back off a bit, If its savable then it'll perk up. Give it a medium drink twice a day of good pH stable water.

[J DOG 6000]

Looks like over watering to me.

[Earthy Dank]

I think its a bit overwatered and overheated... Check your temp., IF your lights are a couple inches away and your using 4100k then i bet its way too hot. The target temp is around 75.

[MeanGreenEye420]

heres my shit

[MaryjaneMenehune]

heres my shit
what strain is that there?
and how many weeks in is that?
are the cotyledons supposed to turn yellow like in that one picture that early or is that typical?

[Earthy Dank]

I think it got alittle underfertilized, one way or another, Very fixable... much better than over fertilization. I'd say they look fairly healthy and have a bright future. Btw what kind of lights and nute/ferts are you using.

[J DOG 6000]

They look good.That one is still drooping a little but it will probably straighten itself out.

[MaryjaneMenehune]

As you can see, the plant still is a little droopy.... Why does she look so sad? I cut back on the water, maybe I need to cut back even more? I would be interested to know how to tranfer her into a hydro setup because it seems i have a better control on that besides the fact that the plant is growing about 1 and a half times faster in the hydro.
Any help would be most appreciated.
-mjm

[J DOG 6000]

If you dig it up real gently and rinse off the roots .It is possible, but it could die.But the way that plant has been growing that wouldn't be a huge loss.So I'd give it a try.
It still looks over watered but I don't think thats the prob., Might be genetics
:rasta:

[MaryjaneMenehune]

I've got same genetics in hydro right now, and after i gave it some co2 via dolomitic limestone and vinegar, it shot up amazingly quickly...It does have a slight issue of being a little droopy, but not nearly as much as this one... could a nute difficiency cause the plant to curl under like that? also, if i were going to transfer, should i wait a little bit longer till it gets a little bigger so the leaves will be able to substitute for poor rooting or should i do it now to avoid the plants death? Also, i heard that having a little bit of soil attached is alright when transfering into hydro because the roots have very tiny little roots that leach up the nutirents and you can shock the plant by removing the little root hairs. I'd prolly leave a little dirt, I dont think it could be too disasterous for the hydro system....good idea?

here is a pic of the hydro plant, its in vermiculite and perlite mix...its being fed by molasses, urine, and shultz plant food (im amazed too)...but im hoping to get it or a new seedling on the gh flora series soon.

[J DOG 6000]

Urine...hello ,acidic.Piss making your water too acidic and the plant is not takin up nutes...stop with the piss and go get some organic fert.

[MaryjaneMenehune]

Urine...hello ,acidic.Piss making your water too acidic and the plant is not takin up nutes...stop with the piss and go get some organic fert.
oh yeah, forgot to mention, i counteracted the acidity with some dolomitic lime... pH is right around 6
here is next day shot

[J DOG 6000]

lol....it looks better.Just keep doing what your doing.If your going to share that bud with anyone...make sure you tell them your piss as been inside them.Cause I wouldn't smoke it.

[justaseed]

lol....it looks better.Just keep doing what your doing.If your going to share that bud with anyone...make sure you tell them your piss as been inside them.Cause I wouldn't smoke it.


amen! there are better ways to give you plant nutes. but i'm not smokin' it so piss away.

[Earthy Dank]

piss is quite acidic. Don't piss on your plant. I know it seems like a good idea but all it will do its hurt it. Use organics like worm castings or fish emulsion. Use the best not that "piss" poor.... piss.

[MaryjaneMenehune]

piss is all natural, i mean, people smoke herb that sucked up fish shit...and its not like i'm doing keg stand till i have to piss like a racehorse and then unleashing on my plants... I simply put in about a cup or less into a 5 gallon resovoir...i know there is better stuff out there...obviously, but right now, i don't have a hundred dollars to dispense into quality nutrients...I would if they weren't growing, but they're growing pretty well for now...when i get my next paycheck and when i've done enough comparative shopping, i'll invest the money. As for growth, line up the next day shot, is that a good amount of growth for any kind of plant regardless of what it's being fed? It may not be the best, but it is noticeably bigger. I'm sure a chemist can back me up on this one that piss is just as good of a source of ammonion sulfate (something that turns into nitrogen given oxygen) than any other product, as long as the nutrient levels stay in a proper range, it doesn't matter if you use a special blend of vomit and blood or a mixture sold to you by a reputable company... although i wouldn't reccomend using blood and vomit, who knows, it might work.. as long as the plant is getting the right kinds of nutes. Obviously, the companies mixture is tried and true, and easier to work with, but im saying it can be done, and it looks to me like it is for now.

[Earthy Dank]

Thjats fine as long as you dulute the piss. I pictured you just pissing away on it and that is severly unhealthy. Yeah organics is alot worse than piss and comes out amazing so you do have a point. I'm just saying piss is risky business.

[MaryjaneMenehune]

would a supply of 15-30-15 nutrients be good for vegetative growth? if not, it is good for flowering though, right?

[J DOG 6000]

I think that is a flowering formula...I like 15-15-15 for veg....and more like 10-49-20 for flower.
But I use pre-mixed organic's myself.So thats what I liked when I used chem nutes.:stoned:

[Earthy Dank]

yeah doggs got it. Veg is something like 30-5-5 and flowering is like 5-50-15.

[CoyoteGrass]

dude....she needs water and its way too yung for ferts........shhe might die man.....wait for ne growth and trim off the bottom leaves.....the already dead and just waisting energy......keep her in the sun and she looks like indica cuz the droopiness but it doesnt look good my friend....if yer doin indoors the best thing to do is plant in a 3 gallone bucket from seed and avoid transplanting....after those second or third leaves come on the roots are too complex and pulling them up will just destroy yer babies.....try planting new ones thats all i can say but pray and care for her....shes looking good besides the twisted droopiness.....try diging around the plant and taking it ou and putting it in wet paper towels for a bit
she should perk up
then put her in all new soil......dirt from yer backyard where theres nice green grass is great....the stuff in the roots of grass is rich so take that.....organic is best

[MaryjaneMenehune]

Here is a shot of the hydro after how ever many days, shes getting a healthy new set of leaves every few days or so now. I transferred the dirt plant into the hydro next to the other...I figure either one will be male or ill just have to lst if both female...im willing to bend a few stalks if that means i have to yield more :D here are some pics... with any luck, the dirt transfer will develop its roots soon enough and leap up in growth, cross your fingers! ps. whats with that tiny brown freckle on the bigger of the two? also, ill be clipping the dying leaves shortly. should i give the little one a bunch of water as it looks a little dried out and its starting to yellow on the tips?

[Earthy Dank]

Your leaves are curling alittle bit. Probably normal but you can try adding just a tiny ammount of phosphurous. Can't hurt

[MaryjaneMenehune]

pretty much self explanatory...new pictures...one question about the second plant though, it looks like it is prdducing pistil hairs already...i may have accidentaly sent it into flowering...just a tad bit early by forgetting to remove it from window sill and putting it into a 12/12(ish) schedule with high levels of red light. I'm unsure if it will even bounce back, it was originally in soil...

so...
what can i do to insure it starts growing alright again?
and will it showing sex make any problems...i know it is stressful and may create hermies, but that's all, right????

help, save my dying plant!!!!!!!!!

[Earthy Dank]

Convert back to 24/0 if you can.. It should be fine... At least its female :)

[karmaxul]

Shes getting over feed with nutes. Flush her out good. I say this because
1 leaves are curling
2 tips look to be burning
3 algae grows on nitrogen and you got it on the top of your soil a bit much for a young seedling.
One love
c

[karmaxul]

At that age I would just feed with like olivias cloning solution.
c

[MaryjaneMenehune]

Shes getting over feed with nutes. Flush her out good. I say this because
1 leaves are curling
2 tips look to be burning
3 algae grows on nitrogen and you got it on the top of your soil a bit much for a young seedling.
One love
c
hey, i was wondering if the algae can have a negative effect on the plant or will it be fine? It seems that the larger plant with more algae growth is doing a lot better than the smaller one without any...so the conclusion i have arrived at is that the algae is eating up the nitrogen so the plant is not soaking up as much nitrogen as is present in the growing medium. I flushed the smaller plant and removed the mylar protecting the growing medium...maybe this will allow the algae to grow stronger and soak up more of the nitrogen. I'll keep you updated on any changes.
I figure the plant and the algae form a symbiotic relationship, but let me know if my hypothesis is completely off base.
peace
-mjm

[karmaxul]

There are different kinds of algae. I add spirulina to my plants as it is very beneficial. It is other wise known as blue green algae and is the healthest food in the world. The aztecs used to grow it at lake texicoco (sp?) which is know the location of mexico city. It contains caroteens (sp?) glysergic acid and crazy protein just to name a few. I add it in soil and have not tryed it on rockwool cubes but if any algae was going on them that is what I would have grow.
One love
c

[MaryjaneMenehune]

so here are a few more shots...as you can see, the larger plant is growing nicely, but the smaller one isn't really growing at all. (The lighter is a standard size) What should I do about the little one? I am just going to leave it until A. the leaves turn brown and I know it is dead for sure or B. it finally develops a root system and it starts growing....I wish I had some superthrive now, but I'm still waiting for it. Any other ways I can reduce stress and promote healthy growth? Maybe some voodoo ritual or something?
peace
-mjm
(sorry the little plant shot is out of focus, it's automatic)

[karmaxul]

I would flush it seeing how the tips are burning. Looks like lock up but she should be fine and looks still very heathly.
One love
c

[Earthy Dank]

Your biggest plant has a Phoshuros and potassium deficency. If you are going to flower soon try reducining nitrogen and replacing Phosphuros and potassium. This will help it switch to flowering mode meaning earlier harvest.

[MaryjaneMenehune]

Could you post a link to a page dedicated to defficiencies and pictures of each kind?...I think that would be super beneficial. And, to flush a net like that, do you just run it under distilled water till it runs clear or should I use a certain amount of water according to how big the pot is? Basically, what would be a good ratio of water to flush with compared to size of pot?
I won't be throwing it into flower anytime soon, but how tall should I let it get if i want to flower under hps? I want to wait till the smaller guy has a chance to grow a little... As for supercropping/scrog, when and how do you trim the plant to produce several good-sized bud sites?

[Earthy Dank]

http://www.weedfarmer.com/cannabis/nutrientdisorders_guide.php No pictures but it decribes it well enough. Just water it a couple cups of water a couple times a day if possible. Enough to saturate it completely but not enough to flood it. Don't fertilize it until it slows growing or you see clorosis(yellowing). And when you flower it depends on the size you want. Flowering right now would make them about 2 feet tall when they finish.

[Earthy Dank]

Whatkind of soil/medium are you using?

[karmaxul]

Just keep in mind plants use the most nitrogen then potassium then phosphorus. Plants also have the ability to store phosphorus at much much greater levels then the nitrogen or phosphorus.
One love
c

[karmaxul]

The hieght of flowering depends on the strain. Prohaps a sativa may be two feet but I would flower AK47 for instance at 5 inches and have it finsh at 12 inches with a solid nug the whole way up. 8 grams dry. I super crop though. The bottom of my stems are the size of my thumb. Only way to do hundreds of them
One love
c

[MaryjaneMenehune]

No more pics, sorry, camera died. I'll borrow a friends when it comes down to harvest or if I have any problems that I cannot identify... It is growing pretty well, except for a little stretching from when I went on vacation. I think I may start with an LST program to get some growth from the bottom branches (it sounds pretty easy so no questions for that...) , but I do have a question about cloning.

when can you start cloning and where on the plant should you take the clippings from?

i know lots of people use neoprene collars and such, but i was wondering where i could get those or what you can use as as alternative. I was just going to place wet tissues around the main stem so they dont fall down and then place above a bubbler with the bottom of the stem just touching the surface of the water. (I was prolly going to use rooting hormone too) then i was going to transfer to a perlite mix when roots develop.

I've read a little about supercropping, basically, you trim off the top of the plant or what?

[MaryjaneMenehune]

well, i answered my own question about cloning and everything so I should have a bubbler cloner going soon...
foliar feeding for clones, yay or nay?
im using perlite/vermiculite for medium, I don't know if that is classified as hydro or soil-less but it is working... :)
here's a link for cloning
http://boards.cannabis.com/showthread.php?t=25408

btw, thanks for all the postive responses

[MaryjaneMenehune]

It's funny reading some of my earlier posts... For those just starting out, take the time and do a little research: It will really help. Be a knowledge sponge, if you have any questions, go and ask them in the live chat. Someone will point you in the right direction.
I cloned my main plant and have it under 24 hours of cfl in bubble cloner. I'm thinking about putting it into soil when it starts to develop roots.
Where can you get promix soil?

I will probably lst the clone and scrog it in honor of justaseed. Wish me luck!

I currently have a few plants starting in peat pellets to see if that works... I hear they don't allow enough space for roots. eh, just bagseed, we'll see what happens. I had another question, but I can't think of it at the moment and I've got to get going...

[Jdog7000]

Right on MJM...I'm glad it finally worked out.It was a rough childhood but it should be fine!

[karmaxul]

Super cropping is more cracking the inner husk thickening the stems and giving a stouter growth. Twist slowly back and forth starting at the bottom.

[MaryjaneMenehune]

Super cropping is more cracking the inner husk thickening the stems and giving a stouter growth. Twist slowly back and forth starting at the bottom.

Could you send pics or something...I am kind of hesitant to start working in the lower part of the stem for fear of it falling over, but it wouldn't be the end of the world. I have read other posts on supprercropping and nowhere did I find anything on breaking the tissues on the lower husk. Are you sure this gives the desired results, a stout shrubby plant?

[karmaxul]

Thats what I did or you can flower little clones. I had alot to play with in terms of clones. You swell the inner husk and create scar tissue

[the image reaper]

nutrients for vegging have a high first number, flowering go to the bigger second number ... and stop pissing on your plants !!! no wonder its dying ....acid, and who knows what esle is in there ... ureic acid, for one thing ... :smokin:

[Garden Knowm]

nutrients for vegging have a high first number, flowering go to the bigger second number ... and stop pissing on your plants !!! no wonder its dying ....acid, and who knows what esle is in there ... ureic acid, for one thing ... :smokin:


yeah, what he said....

[MaryjaneMenehune]

It has been growing pretty well considering that for two months, it was being grown with plant food and trace amounts of urine... But, anyways, I went away for a week and came back to find this. It looks to me like a magnesium deficiency as the leaves are droopy and starting to yellow towards bottom of plant...(pic of detatched leave shows signs, but I took shot almost a whole day after clipping it from the plant)
I flushed the plant with mostly water and a weak nutrient solution to rid any toxins that may have been created as a result of the urine. I will prepare an epsom salt foliar feed and spray that on tonight to solve the mag. problem. It should do the trick, right? The clone is doing alright in the bubbler but the roots don't seem to be developing, it's been about 5 days and there are no signs of white bumps or any root growth at all... I don't get it, but they should be developing soon with any luck. (it seems to be growing still)
The plant has started asymmetrical internode growth, which is typical for a plant its age (and an exciting sign of maturity). I don't see any signs of preflower yet, but you can be the judge. (if anything, id lean towards identifying it as a male, but please tell me I'm wrong)
I don't know about lsting the plant at this age, any comments or cautions?
As to the foliar spray, any suggestions or is my diagnosis accurate?

[MaryjaneMenehune]

One more quick question, How detrimental is it to have a light that faces away from the plant on 24/7 even if it is a minimal amount (and it is cfl so I don't think it will be catching much light at all.) I have been running the cfl for the clone 24/7 and the light has a reflector that blocks out any direct light towards the "big guy", but there is still some that reflects off of two walls and onto the bigger one. Should I pull the clone out of the same room and let it root elsewhere?
I guess the big guy needs her rest, and any light during lights off could potentially stress her...

[Chris Seekins]

Should not matter if it is not in bud. I ran my mothers for years on 24 hour HID light and they were healthy as can be.

[mountainman]

Should not matter if it is not in bud. I ran my mothers for years on 24 hour HID light and they were healthy as can be.

What's up with the new username, Karmaxul?

[Chris Seekins]

I just want to kill the thought that some thing is going to happen to members from being on this site so I decided to use my real name.

[mountainman]

I just want to kill the thought that some thing is going to happen to members from being on this site so I decided to use my real name.

Cheers to you. You've got balls.

[MaryjaneMenehune]

I'm voting Chris Seekins for president! :D

[Chris Seekins]

Thanks

[MaryjaneMenehune]

Mas Problemas.
First shot is of one of the biggest "solar panels" that unfortunately got fucked over. There were a number of things that went wrong as far as I can tell. pH wasn't monitored for a while and it turns out it had dipped down into the 4.5 range...shit. Secondly, I think she was overfed (because someone thought she needed more nutrients to solve her slower growth). In case you were interested if there was a moral to this story, never let some idiot monitor your plants.
anyways, second shot is her after some pruning.
she looks like she might be lacking magnesium because she has the "praying" look, but I will wait to see if a change in nutrient levels straightens her out... (is that mag def?) What does a low ph do to the physical appearance of the plant? (also, what about a high ph so i know in the future...)
lastly, can anyone tell the sex yet?

[the image reaper]

re-pot it into a larger pot, with plain,simple potting soil ... do not feed it for two weeks, clear water only, NO piss ... let it dry out completely between waterings ... looks like Pythium Wilt damping-off damage to me ... run lights 18/6, and the dark hours mean dark hours ... the plant will try to grow by itself, stop trying to do so much with it ... like a lot of growers, you're overwatering, overfertilizing, ... just forget the nutes for awhile ... keep it SIMPLE ... :smokin:

[MaryjaneMenehune]

It is in hydro, I don't think I could safely move it to another pot without damaging a bunch of roots. I added another bubble stone so the plant would get more oxygen and this should solve the damp feet problem...if not, what else could i do?
i am running the lights 18/6 (the clone died, so I don't need to keep a light on it anymore)
I cut back the nutrients already. Ill update in a week or two hopefully with a progress report.
Thanks for the help image reaper.
(ps. I'm glad I have a growlog, because even if nobody else uses it for help, I sure will :) )