Shortages

[alfonso2002]

DOH is not doing the job tasked to them.

[radchit]

Time to grow own

[radchit]

Time to grow your own!!!!!
oops last post
need more non-profits

[CFO]

DOH is not doing the job tasked to them.

Though it is true, DOH has fallen down regarding supply and low-producing producers, there is medicine in Las Cruces.

[alfonso2002]

CFO whats your take on how to solve the problem. You say there are med.s down south? Have you asked yourself why. I live in the Albuquerque area and the producers that are producing quantity med.s run out the day that they release it.I think it is sold out before it is even released.I myself do not have to purchase much but I do like to try new strains.I do not know solid numbers on who is producing but I think some of the producers out there are wasting there license. Will be interesting what happens at licensing time.What is it this time around 20 or 30 ?

[CFO]

CFO whats your take on how to solve the problem. You say there are med.s down south? Have you asked yourself why. I live in the Albuquerque area and the producers that are producing quantity med.s run out the day that they release it.I think it is sold out before it is even released.I myself do not have to purchase much but I do like to try new strains.I do not know solid numbers on who is producing but I think some of the producers out there are wasting there license. Will be interesting what happens at licensing time.What is it this time around 20 or 30 ?

Hi Alfonso
I would say there is medicine in Las Cruces because the producer knows what they are doing combined with the fact that there is a smaller number of patients in Dona Ana County than the rest of the state. Since they cannot deliver North, East or West of Las Cruces (basically) their medicine is available to fewer patients so it lasts a little longer. I think too that patients that purchased Desert Creeper and were dissatisfied are missing out by not giving them another shot. Some strains have limited availability and have sold out quickly. Others have been popular and are repeated on a regular basis. I receive the newsletters from some of the other producers and know they run out on a regular basis so one has to act fast when meds are released. With most of the producers in the Santa Fe/Albuquerque area and most of the patients there too, those producers have got to produce as much as they possibly can. No holding back or keeping their plant numbers down. They have to produce at full capacity.

I agree, some of the producers are wasting their license. Heard there have been some crop failures at a few. Regardless....all but 4 of the producers will be paying the $20,000 license renewal fees. The other 4 will be paying $30,000. That is a lot of money.....especially with crop failures! Curious to see what DOH does with that money. Hopefully hire more people. $500,000 should hire more than 7 people! next year, if there are still only 23 producers, they will all be at $30,000 license renewal fees. That is $690,000!!! DOH needs to reduce those fees. That is money off the backs of us patients. If the producers didn't have to worry about those sky-high fees, they could probably lower the prices.

Blessed Be!:hippy:

[pinkcar]

So--what I'm getting is that after I get approved--I might not be able to purchace??--is this true??---all of the producers run out??

[alfonso2002]

So--what I'm getting is that after I get approved--I might not be able to purchace??--is this true??---all of the producers run out??

pinkcar most likley you will have problems getting your med.s. unless you live in Dona Ana County. The problem is that DOH. is not doing anything about it. The way the law is interpeted now the producers that are producing can not produce any MORE.The problem lies in the numbers.There are close to 7000 active patients in the program now and the same amount of producers that were producing when there were 3000.There are several ways DOH can fix the problem but they refuse to do anything. will finish later.

[pinkcar]

I live in Otero county--what choices will I have?--have delivered?

[alfonso2002]

I live in Otero county--what choices will I have?--have delivered?

pinkcar That might be an option for you I know one of the producers is working on a delivery system that includes any producerer that wants to join in to reach patients in all parts of the state. But getting back to the options that DOH has they can raise the plant counts,or they can add more producers.They know the problem but are not willing to act.All the employees at the department are great people but they get orders from the top down.Am thinking that a little pressure in the form of media coverage will be a good thing. If that don't work then maybe a lawsuit will get there attention. Something has to be done NOW because any fix will take time to start.The approval ultimately has to come from Martinez hoping that she has seen that the program is helping many patients in the program.This shortage thing has to be addressed soon.Patients will have to go to the black market for there meds real soon and that is so wrong of DOH making the patients in the program have to do that there safety is at risk every time they have to do that.

[alfonso2002]

CFO" No holding back or keeping their plant numbers down." Easy to say but not too easy to risk All the hard work.The rules are there so they just have to be changed.I think I know of one producer that is willing to be put under fire to do what is right for the patients. But the best would be for DOH to manup and do what is right for the program.THAT IS THERE JOB.

[DrBreeze]

I think I know of one producer that is willing to be put under fire to do what is right for the patients.

That is exactly the kind of risk taking that damages the legitimacy of legal grow operations. The best weapon against shortages is an educated self-grower. This way there are no hands in "the cookie jar" anywhere..The State or the"NON" profits...both are laughing all the way to the bank at the people that NEED the medication. :(

[alfonso2002]

That is exactly the kind of risk taking that damages the legitimacy of legal grow operations. The best weapon against shortages is an educated self-grower. This way there are no hands in "the cookie jar" anywhere..The State or the"NON" profits...both are laughing all the way to the bank at the people that NEED the medication. :(

Dr. Breeze now you got me started can you tell me what you mean " That is exactly the kind of risk taking that damages the legitimacy of legal grow operations"? then you say that self-grow is the way to go. Lets say there are 100 average patients that obtain a grow permit I would say 1/4 would be able to sustain a grow that would be enough for that patient. The cost of the equipment to be able to grow 4 plants and 12 veging plants is 1 1000 watt lamp 1 ballast 1 air cooled hood 1 inline fan 1 timer 3 wall mounted fans the more the better.then you need a setup to get your plants to veg. Thats just to start.Then electrical work to upgrade to 20 amp circuits. If you want to do 4 plants flowering $1500 at the least up to?????? for some start of the art equipment. Then you have the electrical bill every month.This medical grade is not the throw a few seeds and see what comes out thing.As for" This way there are no hands in "the cookie jar" anywhere " anywhere there is politics there will be hands in the jar. Then you are saying .".The State or the"NON" profits...both are laughing all the way to the bank" Well your half right the state has collected some real money in taxes and fees.But the state is letting down the patients in the program.There have been some real shortages in supply DOH is charged to run this program it is there problem so please contact Cabinet Secretary Catherine D. Torres and voice your complaints this has got to stop and DOH can fix the problem.

[DrBreeze]

Well since you went out of your way to quote and try to twist my words I will gladly oblige.:pimp: Im going to take a wild guess and start with the assumption that you are a producer. That is where I get most of this kind of flack from on the different forums on the internet.


can you tell me what you mean " That is exactly the kind of risk taking that damages the legitimacy of legal grow operations"?
I mean what I quoted, a producer willing to be put under fire...sounds like willing to break the law to me, just in fancier words.:wtf: That is seriously frowned upon. Many a producer and patient have gone under for actions like this up here is Denver. The conservatives love it too because it feeds their agenda, they hate nothing more than rule following liberals. :rasta:


then you say that self-grow is the way to go. Lets say there are 100 average patients that obtain a grow permit I would say 1/4 would be able to sustain a grow that would be enough for that patient.

You can quote me, I never said self grow was the "SOLUTION" for shortage, I said weapon, as in a valuable tool against. As in, the more you can make yourself the less you have to rely upon others for. The reason why patients fail is because they get mis-information and end up getting discouraged. If there were more honest people "HELPING" patients ,by education and guidance, there would be high success rates.


The cost of the equipment to be able to grow 4 plants and 12 veging plants is 1 1000 watt lamp 1 ballast 1 air cooled hood 1 inline fan 1 timer 3 wall mounted fans the more the better.then you need a setup to get your plants to veg. Thats just to start.Then electrical work to upgrade to 20 amp circuits. If you want to do 4 plants flowering $1500 at the least up to??????

Why do you need 20 amp circuit??? A damn microwave, toaster, electric heater, blow dryer are all 1500 watt and they still clear the 75% rule. A quick scan of one of my favorite stops in ABQ, All Seasons Gardening, has all of that and more that you listed for $650 , the cost of say...1.5 ounces of product from any given dispensary?



for some start of the art equipment. Then you have the electrical bill every month.

NM kwH prices are the same as here in Northern CO, 9-10 cents/kwh. 1000watt/9amps/18hour day $1.62 , 12hour day $1.08 , far cry from this fear mongering you are trying to employ. $30-40/ month MAX, most patients need 2 good plants, you are describing a 144 square foot grow quadrant, most just need a 400watt and some good guidance to net a good stash.:stoned:



This medical grade is not the throw a few seeds and see what comes out thing.

Well it isn't in California, or even Denver. But from the sounds of it, with as much crop failure you guys are having in NM, it sure sounds like "throw a few seeds and see". In the end I know of a few patients that have produced better product than "producers", so do not push the agenda that does not put the power in the hands of the patient. No matter what forum I bounce to I always get to ruffle a producers feather by trying to empower a PATIENT. Show me one business owning producer NOT driving a 2010 or newer car....tell me he is not "Writing off" and having a lavish lifestyle under the guise of "non- profit" POWER to the PEOPLE!!!!!!! :thumbsup:

[alfonso2002]

DrBreeze first off am not a producer but do have in site from a couple. My intension was not to twist your words but And I was not giving flack. I see you are not from these parts so the problem will not affect you but for the patients in N.M. it is a big problem.Growing medical grade is not an easy task. will finish response later.

[DrBreeze]

DrBreeze first off am not a producer but do have in site from a couple.
Sounds like a hand in the jar to me. You either Are or work for a producer, or a shady head shop. I have seen it before and I will see it again, but do not think everyone is an idiot. Nobody sticks up for producers like that because of their track record and donations.:jointsmile:


I see you are not from these parts so the problem will not affect you but for the patients in N.M. it is a big problem.
It is unfortunate that you were so quick to judge. I have a winter home in Santa Fe and my parents are both born and raised from there. They are both MM patients and I helped them get their paperwork over a year ago. So for you to jump to conclusions and tell me it will not affect me is blasphemy. This is why I check out all NM/CO forums across the internet. :mad:


Growing medical grade is not an easy task. will finish response later.
There goes the chasing rainbows mentality again. A proper education and a little guidance and ANYONE can grow. Do not dumb down patients, there are plenty of capable adults willing and able to learn. I believe in people with will, and an education. Please do not worry about finishing your response, you have made it clear. You are on "that" side of the counter when it comes to "medication".

Sorry if it seems a bit harsh, but I have seen this time and time again since this whole MM process started. Fear sells faster than anything else, it drives politics, and that includes Medical cannabis and it's patients. :hippy:

[alfonso2002]

Back to your response DrBreeze I don't want to scare anyone off.Growing there own med.s is the thing to do but what I am saying is that a lot of patients that try and grow there own will never get the hang of it. You want to make it sound so easy but in reality it is a lot of hard work and the costs are high. You want to question costs of the equipment so be it you can buy cheap stuff and for sure you are going to have problems sooner or later not that it won't happen with quality stuff but I just feel better knowing I got the best I can.You ask why the 20 amp circuit lamp inline fan. circulation fans and depending if you are doing hydro you would need even more power. Yea you can do it with a 15 amp circuit but I won't take the chance of a fire.now to elect. costs 30-40 a month. If that was it I would be real happy. Think more around 180.00 a month in winter months more like 240.00 in summer.Like I keep saying it is a job to keep plants at differant stages of growth. total watts in my system 2400 watts. But for the last 4 years have not had to buy a bud from anyone.That dose not mean that I have not tried from anyone just don't have to buy.Another thing about growing your own is the pride you can get from growing YOUR bud. 2 people can grow the same clone off a mother and come out with 2 differant looking plants. Yes the power should be with the people I don't have a problem with that. That is what I started this tread about That in this state the Department of Health was put in charge of running this program. It is failing to do what it was tasked to do> I see every day patients in the program not being able to get there medication. because there is not enough for all the patients in the program. THAT IS NMDOH's problem they have to make sure that there are enough med.s for all who need it.In a perfect world yes being able to grow your own would be the best.But there would still be those that for watever reason can't grow there own they need to be able to obtain there med.s in a safe manner and that is what the producers in N.M. do.

[alfonso2002]

Sounds like a hand in the jar to me. You either Are or work for a producer, or a shady head shop. I have seen it before and I will see it again, but do not think everyone is an idiot. Nobody sticks up for producers like that because of their track record and donations.:jointsmile:


It is unfortunate that you were so quick to judge. I have a winter home in Santa Fe and my parents are both born and raised from there. They are both MM patients and I helped them get their paperwork over a year ago. So for you to jump to conclusions and tell me it will not affect me is blasphemy. This is why I check out all NM/CO forums across the internet. :mad:


There goes the chasing rainbows mentality again. A proper education and a little guidance and ANYONE can grow. Do not dumb down patients, there are plenty of capable adults willing and able to learn. I believe in people with will, and an education. Please do not worry about finishing your response, you have made it clear. You are on "that" side of the counter when it comes to "medication".

Sorry if it seems a bit harsh, but I have seen this time and time again since this whole MM process started. Fear sells faster than anything else, it drives politics, and that includes Medical cannabis and it's patients. :hippy:

Dam DrBreeze not sure what your problems are but give me a break here. What I am saying is that the PATIENTS in New Mexicos Program are being let down by DOH. You say I am sticking up for producers. You can read it that way if you want but the reason I was even talking about producers is that they are the ones that supply patients in the program with there med.s. Now you want to talk about track records I am a part of the NMMCPA here in n.m. don't expect you to know about the alliance but will leave it at that."So for you to jump to conclusions and tell me it will not affect me is blasphemy. This is why I check out all NM/CO forums across the internet." Again give me a break. So if you are from n.m. Then you should know the problems here. What are your ideas for solving those problems?Paint me as you wiintension'sintensions are for the good of all patients in N.M. P.S. was missing that last part I am Not dummying down anyone . There are many patients in the program that are physically not able to do anything.What are they to do????

[Upp]

... NM/CO forums across the internet. :mad:
:hippy:

Moving to NM in August. I'd be interested in learning more about some good NM forums :cool:

[Michael Oliver]

GROW "OR" Get yourself and one trusted friend to take a little trip up to Garberville,CA. Make sure Your Transport vehicle is premium, with zero problems.
Bring 5 K! Go home with enough premium smoke to share with at least ten good friends!

[DrBreeze]

give me a break here. What I am saying is that the PATIENTS in New Mexicos Program are being let down by DOH.
Word is, that due to all of the crop FAILURES occurring, it looks like the producers are the ones letting "patients" down. No breaks here, just facts.:stoned:


You say I am sticking up for producers. You can read it that way if you want but the reason I was even talking about producers is that they are the ones that supply patients in the program with there med.s.
Yeah, because "patients" never got any "med" before or aside from the Medical program. This is New Mexico patients first try of this new medication..........Seriously, you are as brainwashed as I have seen in a while. Anyone that NEEDS the meds, has a supplier READILY available. Always has and always will. I know of 2 cancer patients that "score" on the side (legit NEEDS patients), let's not pretend here.



Now you want to talk about track records I am a part of the NMMCPA here in n.m. don't expect you to know about the alliance but will leave it at that.
Ok, so let me get this straight, your track record is based on being "part" of the NMMCPA....ok. Let me see what that is...

Domain Name:NM-MCPA.ORG
Created On:22-Dec-2011 19:22:21 UTC
Registrant Name:William Ford
Registrant Organization:Black Sheep Productions
Registrant Street1:2730 San Diego SE
Registrant City:Albuquerque
Registrant Postal Code:87106
Registrant Country:US
Registrant Phone:+1.5052565301
Registrant Email:[email protected]

After googling the public records for the domain, I can up with a tie to one of the producers on my parents list of producers. The owner of NMMCPA and RL Greenleaf are the same. I KNEW you were tied to a producer...if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it is a DUCK. I love when people put their own foot in their mouth. Your track record is based on an group of people that started a formal group 6 months ago, LMAO!:wtf:



What are your ideas for solving those problems?Paint me as you wiintension'sintensions are for the good of all patients in N.M. P.S. was missing that last part I am Not dummying down anyone . There are many patients in the program that are physically not able to do anything.What are they to do????

My idea, flood the state with educated and trustworthy Caregivers. Did you know that there can be caregivers to help the patients you describe. Simple solution, everyone grows and all they have to do is hire competent help.

[DrBreeze]

GROW "OR" Get yourself and one trusted friend to take a little trip up to Garberville,CA. Make sure Your Transport vehicle is premium, with zero problems.
Bring 5 K! Go home with enough premium smoke to share with at least ten good friends!

You got it, the risk outweighs the benefit in a delivery, but you are right. I wish we could outsource to Cali as they have the best MM I have ever had.

[DrBreeze]

Moving to NM in August. I'd be interested in learning more about some good NM forums :cool:

I will PM you a few, not very many as NM is still so new....they are mostly the same people, but the CO,CA,AZ forums have TONS of info that is pertinent.

[CFO]

Word is, that due to all of the crop FAILURES occurring, it looks like the producers are the ones letting "patients" down. No breaks here, just facts.:stoned:


Yeah, because "patients" never got any "med" before or aside from the Medical program. This is New Mexico patients first try of this new medication..........Seriously, you are as brainwashed as I have seen in a while. Anyone that NEEDS the meds, has a supplier READILY available. Always has and always will. I know of 2 cancer patients that "score" on the side (legit NEEDS patients), let's not pretend here.



Ok, so let me get this straight, your track record is based on being "part" of the NMMCPA....ok. Let me see what that is...

Domain Name:NM-MCPA.ORG
Created On:22-Dec-2011 19:22:21 UTC
Registrant Name:William Ford
Registrant Organization:Black Sheep Productions
Registrant Street1:2730 San Diego SE
Registrant City:Albuquerque
Registrant Postal Code:87106
Registrant Country:US
Registrant Phone:+1.5052565301
Registrant Email:[email protected]

After googling the public records for the domain, I can up with a tie to one of the producers on my parents list of producers. The owner of NMMCPA and RL Greenleaf are the same. I KNEW you were tied to a producer...if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it is a DUCK. I love when people put their own foot in their mouth. Your track record is based on an group of people that started a formal group 6 months ago, LMAO!:wtf:




My idea, flood the state with educated and trustworthy Caregivers. Did you know that there can be caregivers to help the patients you describe. Simple solution, everyone grows and all they have to do is hire competent help.

Maybe I shouldn't jump in here, but I am going to anyway. Alfonso doesn't need my assistance. But, let me inform YOU of a few things. Simply because William Ford owns the domain name for the patient alliance (and no, I am not a patient member as yet), does NOT mean that he has "ownership" in the alliance. Nor does it make Alfonso the LNPP known as R Greenleaf.

As far as the patients who NEED the medicine can "readily" find it .... I am a patient and until the program was legalized I did not partake in cannabis. I relied upon the narcotics prescribed by my physician. I didn't and still do not know any street dealers in NM. I had to rely on family in CA and CO to illegally bring me medicine. So, once again, your ASSUMTIONS and statements are incorrect. You make statements as fact, and then come back with comments regarding free speech and that your statements are just your opinion. You do not preface or word your statements as opinion, you word them as fact. Perhaps if you were to word your posts as such, people wouldn't be so put-out by your comments. Plus, if you didn't attack those that disagree with you the rest of us wouldn't feel a need to defend.

Your solution to the problem made me LMAO. You say the patients should "hire" qualified caregivers to help them with their personal grows. And just how much should these "caregivers" be compensated for their services? And where would this "flood" of caregivers come from? CA? CO? WA? You seem to think none of the producers in NM know what they are doing....bad assumption when you (your parents) have yet to purchase from ALL of the producers.

So sorry that you (or your parents) have had such poor luck with the northern producers. As their caregiver, my only assumption is that you are helping them grow so they don't have a need to purchase. Maybe I am incorrect. And, it appears your assumptions are based on your parents and/or TWO cancer patients. Wow, that's a lot of basis there! :wtf:

[alfonso2002]

Thank you CFO but some people"???" will never get it.

[CFO]

Back to the original topic. If your LNPP is out of medicine, consider making the trip south. There is legal, quality medicine available to registered patients. Due to the checkpoints, they cannot deliver to you. You must be willing to make the trip south and take the risk (although small) of taking your medicine back through the checkpoints. Many patients have come and gone back without incident (no seizure of medicine). If the LNPP knows you are traveling back through a checkpoint, they package your purchase to help avoid detection, but there are no guarantees. Unfortunately, the price is higher than some of the older producers up north. The positive news is that gasoline in Las Cruces is $2.97 at Sam's...not much higher at other stations. They are not a dispensary and work by appointments only. Contact them for more details. Email is preferred and you will find their information on the sheet received with your card.

[CFO]

Hey Alfonso
Can you tell me what the little green bars under "registered+" under your name mean? I don't have any :-(

[Burnt Toast]

Hey Alfonso
Can you tell me what the little green bars under "registered+" under your name mean? I don't have any :-( The green bars signify a members positive reputation.
More info: http://boards.cannabis.com/feedback-suggestions/109162-our-reputation-system-faq.html

Yours probably had never been enabled. To check, click on the "Settings" tab (UserCP) up top. Then to the left of the page, click on "General Settings". Select "show reputation"

[alfonso2002]

Thanks Burnt Toast

[CFO]

Thanks Burnt Toast! Have a wonderful weekend.


Kindness & Compassion mean everything to me.

[CFO]

Just wanting to pass along to any NM patients looking .... there is medicine available in Las Cruces.

[pinkcar]

Was at my local in Ruidoso today and there was not a shortage.In fact I am very impresed with selection --quality--and service. Sure we all want to grow our own, but it is nice to have a local run this way with product on hand.

[Michael Oliver]

TYPICAL Bro! You "shoulda" planted out there on The wide open spaces, N.M. has enough remote spaces to camouflage your outside grow. Better luck in 2013! Plenty of great research/how to on you-tube! Read (2012!) Greg Campbell's new work; "Pot,Inc", for some GREAT insight!

[thatguyjrod]

[quote=CFO]
DOH needs to reduce those fees. That is money off the backs of us patients. If the producers didn't have to worry about those sky-high fees, they could probably lower the prices.

So basically you're saying the fees associated with being a producer( the producer well informed of these fees prior to production) are what make meds expensive? Sorry that's bull, and any upstanding producer would NOT make their "customers" pay their electricity bill, water bill etc. if it is a true non profit then why the black market prices? After all the same medicine if sold illegally makes drug dealers profit. Logically that leads me to believe producers COULD lower prices if they were willing to. The money is going somewhere. If a patient used a gram of medicine a day it would cost them $15 a day, so $450 a month, think of the yearly cost to patients. This leads myself and I'm sure others to go without so how is it really helping the patient? My prescription meds were a fourth of that for the month. Do I start them back up and await the side effects or have no medicines to help me? The growers are getting there meds though, plenty of meds, i bet their ailments are minimal to say the least. These are valid concerns....

[alfonso2002]

thatguyjrod The Fees that are paid to DOH are part of the cost of what you are paying for your meds. "Sorry that's bull, and any upstanding producer would NOT make their "customers" pay their electricity bill, water bill etc. if it is a true non profit then why the black market prices? After all the same medicine if sold illegally makes drug dealers profit".Then can you tell me who is to pay these costs?You don't seem to get the picture here there is a difference in the medicine you get from a producer and what you get off the street.Most producers do a lot more than just grow medicine.The program here in N.M. is still fairly new but continues to grow. In a few years we will see where producers are headed. Have you thought about growing your own meds? If you do TRY you will find out real quick that it is not cheap even with only 4 flower plants.Lastly yes our meds are still too costly if only medicate would help.

[Cannabidiolator]

As to shortages,patients should be able to sell the excess from their PPL to other patients. This would add 2000 small producers at the community level. Most patients are chronically ill and destitute, and are unable to support producers becasuse they are so poor. If they had abillity to make $1000 a month that would change lives. It needs to be about what changes patients lives, not what increases the number or profitability of producers. PPLs also need to be able to possess more than 6ozs to be able to get their annual supply from a fall harvest.
It should be raised to at least a pound.

[alfonso2002]

Now your making sense cannabidiolator.

[thatguyjrod]

thatguyjrod The Fees that are paid to DOH are part of the cost of what you are paying for your meds. "Sorry that's bull, and any upstanding producer would NOT make their "customers" pay their electricity bill, water bill etc. if it is a true non profit then why the black market prices? After all the same medicine if sold illegally makes drug dealers profit".Then can you tell me who is to pay these costs?You don't seem to get the picture here there is a difference in the medicine you get from a producer and what you get off the street.Most producers do a lot more than just grow medicine.The program here in N.M. is still fairly new but continues to grow. In a few years we will see where producers are headed. Have you thought about growing your own meds? If you do TRY you will find out real quick that it is not cheap even with only 4 flower plants.Lastly yes our meds are still too costly if only medicate would help.

Well let's see
$100 grow tent
$188 cool tube both bulbs, ballast,
$80 for 4 clones
$20 fan
$110 or so for nutes
$400 household electricity for 3 months
So $900 or so, let's say the grow is medium in yield so an ounce a plant
4 x $400(average cost of medical grade ounce) =$1,600
I'm no rocket scientist but investing $900 or so, ten minutes a day to the garden to get even
An ounce a plant is a savings of $500 compared to buying from a grower/producer/dispensary
So again, why the high prices?

[thatguyjrod]

Btw, growers/producers don't use magic to create meds. The plant itself is medicinal, always has been. The only difference is a grower providing the optimum environment for it to flourish rather than some drug lord using workers in a field to grow brick pack crap. Let's be honest

[alfonso2002]

thatguyjrod you say "The only difference is a grower providing the optimum environment for it to flourish rather than some drug lord using workers in a field to grow brick pack crap". That PROVIDING THE OPTIMUM ENVIRONMENT is the key those are a huge cost the numbers you give are fine and dandy for a home grow but what if the producers were only producing lets say 4 oz.s a plant and you will have a hard time doing that with the equipment you mentioned above.The producers have to produce for at a min of 1000 patients all year long.The producers are running a business and there are many many things that have to be paid so they charge what they have to to make it work.

[thatguyjrod]

1st You asked if I had thought about growing my own meds, not had I thought of being a producer so I listed equiptment accordingly. 2nd exactly my point, it's a business, if others want to pay high prices to help their local lnpp pay for their start up costs fine but I'm not. It's rediculous, I see a need for patients who can't grow their own to have producers, but again I give you the example of the producer in cruces $15 a gram x 30 days=$450! At only 1 gram a day, very little for most patients, $450 x 12= $5,400 per year! How much money from patients will it take before prices drop? Btw you haven't explained the "illegal" legal prices...

[thatguyjrod]

Also, saying id have a hard time getting 4 oz off a plant with that equipment is telling me something I already know. You have no basis for your part of the discussion, I'd rather end my part here. Ive shown the figures and costs roughly to show why patients shouldn't go to a grower/producer if they have their ppl, how inflated the price of meds are, and as you've said it's a business with an obvious profit margin patients shouldn't toss their money into. There's my .02, good thing I don't charge like producers or it'd be my $20.02...truth hurts

[alfonso2002]

thatguyjrod The only thing I can tell you about growing your oun med.s is that in the last 4 years have not had to BUY one bud from anyone.So I have been doing my part in helping with the shorages.I agree that If you have a ppl you should be able to supply yourself.The differance of legal and Illegal is I think mandatory minimum of 10 years.

[CFO]

Well let's see
$100 grow tent
$188 cool tube both bulbs, ballast,
$80 for 4 clones
$20 fan
$110 or so for nutes
$400 household electricity for 3 months
So $900 or so, let's say the grow is medium in yield so an ounce a plant
4 x $400(average cost of medical grade ounce) =$1,600
I'm no rocket scientist but investing $900 or so, ten minutes a day to the garden to get even
An ounce a plant is a savings of $500 compared to buying from a grower/producer/dispensary
So again, why the high prices?

Now, multiply your numbers by at least 30 to arive at what it costs the producers to manage 150 plants in various stages. Also, don't forget to add security, payroll, rent, insurance, and the relicensing fee (and no, the fee did NOT exist when all of the current LNPs applied and were accepted; it was added in the rule changes in December 2010), charcoal filters, and a/c units just to name a few expenses the LNPs have that the patients with PPLs don't have. You listed clones, I assume you purchased those from one of the producers, but some of the producers are purchasing feminized seeds at a hefty price in order to produce the strains that have been bred for medicinal purposes. And there is a difference. There have also been crop failures and mite infestations. Individual patients do not have to worry about mites or growing organically, but the producers do and these issues create additional costs.

Just like organic produce at the market being more expensive than traditionally grown produce, so it goes for the NM LNPs. Your local producer charges $13.95/gr (the other $1.05 is sales tax imposed by the state) and only sells the best of the buds to the patients.

At post #34 you state the "growers are getting their meds...plenty of meds....ailments are minimal." Such a stupid assumption! I don't know about the patient board members of all the producers, but the patient board members of YOUR local producer have Cancer, Multiple Schlerosis, Eplilepsy, PTSD, Painful Peripheral Neuropathy, and chronic pain. Are these minimal ailments to you????Additionally, FYI, the patient board members receive what is left prior to making edibles and hash and sometimes go without so other patients can have the best of what is available. So, the "salad" available at other producers is not available in Las Cruces so that the patient board members have something rather than nothing.

Your statement is similar to another I read indicating that all the producers were driving brand new vehicles. People should take the time to have a discussion with their producer rather than make assumptions. You do know what they say about assuming, don't you?

Any patient who can grow their own, should do so.

[Nmnewbgrower]

My original question which has still been left unanswered, maybe if I ask more directly. Why does legal medicine cost the same as illegal? You can put all the figures out there on dues, equipment, whatever you wish but still doesn't add up to a real answer. If you wanted to say because that's the market price I could understand, disappointed but understandable. It was just a simple question. Never intended it to be such an issue.
As for post #34 I was referring to the point that the llnp growers get their meds at a much cheaper cost and that their ailments were being treated. I in no way meant that to disregard or downplay anyone's ailments. You took that wrong like many of my posts. I did try several times to talk to the llnp here but the individual who works the front office was always in a hurry. Once I even talked to a woman there and she laughingly said "yea he's always rushing, the more ppl he sees the more money he makes." Again not judging the ppl, I don't know them. How am I to feel as a patient/customer after that? Not to mention I spent a good amount of money there. I even offered to help free of charge several times.
In the end they banned me just like you said they would. No bad mouthing of the staff nor naming of names was done on my part. I had/have no intent on harming the name of the producer, grower or anyone. I guess I expected different practices concerning this medicine. I didn't expect business to be the driving factor. I expected a low cost highly effective alternative to pills but all in all it is what it is.

[CFO]

My original question which has still been left unanswered, maybe if I ask more directly. Why does legal medicine cost the same as illegal? You can put all the figures out there on dues, equipment, whatever you wish but still doesn't add up to a real answer. If you wanted to say because that's the market price I could understand, disappointed but understandable. It was just a simple question. Never intended it to be such an issue.
As for post #34 I was referring to the point that the llnp growers get their meds at a much cheaper cost and that their ailments were being treated. I in no way meant that to disregard or downplay anyone's ailments. You took that wrong like many of my posts. I did try several times to talk to the llnp here but the individual who works the front office was always in a hurry. Once I even talked to a woman there and she laughingly said "yea he's always rushing, the more ppl he sees the more money he makes." Again not judging the ppl, I don't know them. How am I to feel as a patient/customer after that? Not to mention I spent a good amount of money there. I even offered to help free of charge several times.
In the end they banned me just like you said they would. No bad mouthing of the staff nor naming of names was done on my part. I had/have no intent on harming the name of the producer, grower or anyone. I guess I expected different practices concerning this medicine. I didn't expect business to be the driving factor. I expected a low cost highly effective alternative to pills but all in all it is what it is.

Apparently you are "thatguyjrod"?

I can answer your question with another question....what did you expect to pay for organically grown, safe medicine accessed in a safe place? Or better yet...knowing all the costs involved, why would you "expect" a lower price for legal medicine as opposed to illegal medicine? Street dealers do not have the overhead and other costs that the legal producers have. They don't have to hire lawyers, accountants, patient consultants, etc., etc. They only have to buy their product from someone else (or grow it) and then sell it. The better question would be, why is illegal cannabis selling for more than legal cannabis. Why are their prices so high? I have been told that medical grade is selling for $20 on the streets of Las Cruces. Does that mean the patients are paying $15 and re-selling it for $20?

If you go back and look at some of the posts that have been critical of the LNPs, you will understand why some of us feel the need to defend their position.

You come back and say that your post at #34 means something other than what you wrote. Really? Even in your explanation you still make assumptions. Where do you get your information? Again, I will clarify...At your local producer, the board members pay the same price for their meds as you do. And if there isn't enough meds for the patients, the board members don't get their meds either. They have to purchase from other producers just like you do. Additionally, some of the patient board members have their own PPL and don't have to access the meds from the producer. What did I tell you before about assumptions? :)

And, your quote of what "a woman there" said to you ....really? Could be she made an assumption as well. The patient consultant at your local producer is NOT compensated based on the number of patients he sees. Appointments are made every 30 minutes, sometimes more, sometimes less. But as the patient numbers grow, the busier he will be. This is another reason patients must make appointments (which you criticized in one of your earlier posts). He is only one person and can see only so many people per day. People who show up without an appointment cannot be seen. There are only a few of the LNPs who submitted their proposals as "dispensaries", your LNP was not one of them.

Many patients have offered to volunteer with the LNPs. Think about the risk. What happens when someone gets pissed? How quickly do you think a disgruntled volunteer would go to the DEA or other federal entity if they felt slighted for some reason? Same for any patient. There is more risk for the producers than there is for any other entity. Their plant numbers are cummulative, not just at the time of a bust. The feds can seize their records and based on those records determine how many plants have been grown and how much medicine has been distributed by the producers. The greater number of plants, the higher the penalty. The people who run the LNPs are now all felons. I am sure they will be relieved to read that your intentions were not to harm them.

Your expectations obviously are not going to be met....at least not in the near future. When costs level out, I expect the prices will come down. You stated that you didn't think the patients should pay the start-up costs....why not? Are the producers supposed to be doing this out of the goodness of their hearts? I am sure many would IF they won the lottery or were otherwise independently wealthy. This is a business and needs to be conducted as such. A non-profit entity does not mean there is no profit, it means the State can have access to information that they would otherwise not be able to access. None of the LNPs are tax exempt (can you imagine the feds issuing tax exempt status to a federally illegal operation?). If there wasn't sales tax, the prices could come down at least a small amount. If there weren't these huge license renewal fees the prices could come down. What we, the patients, need to do is petition DOH to reduce the fees assessed to the LNPs and treat cannabis as other prescription medicine...tax exempt. After all, we are the ones actually paying for everything.

Perhaps if you contact the local producer and ask for an appointment you might be able to persuade them to reinstate you if you have been banned. I don't think you can have your cake and eat it too, however. If there is something that you feel you need to criticize, you should do so directly to them. If you were dissatisfied with your purchase, you should not have accepted it. You always have the right of refusal just as they have the right to refuse service.

Hope this helps.

[CFO]

With legalization now in WA and CO, check out this article on MSN.
9 problems pot dealers face- MSN Money (http://money.msn.com/investing/9-problems-pot-dealers-face)
This one operation in Denver spends nearly $60,000 per MONTH to provide medicine to about 600 patients.

[alfonso2002]

Looks like I'm back to this site. Had moved to the nmmcpa site and all was fine till they decided to "update" the site now it just don't work the way it used to so here I am.I see this site has been a little slow but at least postable.

[GATXBUCK]

I was gonna check it out but any site that requires you to register before you can look through the forum or anything else almost always proves to be a waste of time in my experience.So what does the situation currently look like,is there still a problem with shortages or have things picked up a bit?

[alfonso2002]

There are still shortages the producers have gotten better at producing flower bud but the number of patients is still growing but the number of producers are not.Have heard that that DOH is saying that there is no need for more producers because there so many ppls that are producing there own flower. That is not true yes there are a lot of ppls out there but I think if it is checked out that only a 1/4 of those ppls are really able to produce enough flower for themselves.What happens is that patients get the license thinking that they will grow there own meds but things go wrong which is not hard to do and then get discouraged and don't continue to try. I tell any one that asks that if they have never grown it will take at least 1 and 1/2 years to get the hang of it.

[GATXBUCK]

"Due to the checkpoints, they cannot deliver to you. You must be willing to make the trip south and take the risk (although small) of taking your medicine back through the checkpoints. Many patients have come and gone back without incident (no seizure of medicine)."

I recently moved to New Mexico and have a few questions about this.What are these "checkpoints"?If they find your medicine @ a checkpoint (a legal amount)do they only seize the meds or do they lock you up and charge you with something?How do find out where these checkpoints are or do they move em around?...thanx

[alfonso2002]

I think Greenleaf will deliver all the way to las cruches . They will deliver for any of the producers that are willing to send meds. As for check points I think you are talking about boarder checkpoints and they are federal so they will take your meds as far as I know they will not lock you up if you have your card.But it will not be fun.I don't think they move them around.

[CFO]

"Due to the checkpoints, they cannot deliver to you. You must be willing to make the trip south and take the risk (although small) of taking your medicine back through the checkpoints. Many patients have come and gone back without incident (no seizure of medicine)."

I recently moved to New Mexico and have a few questions about this.What are these "checkpoints"?If they find your medicine @ a checkpoint (a legal amount)do they only seize the meds or do they lock you up and charge you with something?How do find out where these checkpoints are or do they move em around?...thanx

There are four Homeland Security/Immigration checkpoints surrounding Dona Ana County. One on I-10 going west toward Deming. One on Hwy 70 going east toward Alamogordo. One on I-25 going north to Albuquerque. One on Hwy 85 toward Hatch. Those are the only roads out of Dona Ana County. The agents may or may not confiscate your meds. If you package it properly (seal A meal plastic and new glass jar), put it in the trunk, it may not be detected. Now, if you smoke in the vehicle, the dogs will scent and alert. You will be pulled over, questioned and searched. It is important to always carry your card. Your argument should be that this is your medicine. Would they take your Zoloft or blood pressure or cholesterol meds? Then please don't take my cannabis.

[StonerCasper]

hey Alfonso welcome back. i just recently returned also.

so with the shortages the company Brief Relief that helpS get Medical Cannabis Cards is helping patients with PPLs plan, purchase and set up there indoor grow. Even help in assisting in the growing process. they call it the "seed to Smoke" Program. They go to your house and do a bid just like any "construction" job for a minimal fee. So for those people that just get there PPL so that they can say that the got there PPL and can grow legally. So if you know any patients with PPLs that ant growing tell them about Brief Relief..

[alfonso2002]

Hey Stoner The NMMCPA is also coming back and I think that if any patient needs help with their grow they can find some help with them.It's patients helping patients they have monthly meetings at HDR last Sunday of the month at 3:30 pm.

[GATXBUCK]

"they have monthly meetings at HDR last Sunday of the month"....what is the HDR?

[alfonso2002]

they are one of the producers in albuquerque