just not sure ? [Archive] - Green Grass Forums

EZG

06-27-2011, 06:33 PM

hello

my bro gave me this plant about a week ago it was looking bad , but picked up .
now its looking worse , its had some growth and a has a broke branch iv only watered it slightly , im new to this , i thought it was over watered , but now im not sure , iv not given it any nuts yet , and was thinking seaweed extract?

pls take a look and offer any advice ,

H=Answer if you grow hydro or aero
C=Answer if you grow coco
S=Answer if you grow traditional soil
L=Answer if you grow soilless other than coco (Promix, Hyponex, SunshineMix)
R=Answer if you grow in RockWool
T=Answer if you grow in HydroTon
D=Answer if you run any type of automatic drip system, including into soil or soilless
E= EVERYONE needs to answer lol!

E-indoor or outdoor ..indoor
E-soil, soilless, coco, aero, or hydroponic.....soil
E-specific medium............potting compost
CSL-Soil type/brand
HCL-Hydro/aero/soilless system type
SCL-Anything you have added to the soil .....no
SCLR-Soil or slab runoff pH .....dont know
E-Water source.....tap water ..
E-Source water pH.....?
HRT-Source water EC (if hydro)
E-Age of plant.......... not sure 3 weeks maybe ?
E-Type of fertilizer.......none
E-Rate of application (if hydro, this is your PPM number, preferably after each component is added)
E-Lighting source and distance from plant 4 cfl 14w and 18w flortube , 3" from plant
E-Air temperature (both day and night if you are running a dark period) 21/23 degrees
HD-Reservoir temperature.....
E-Air % Relative humidity....
E-Lighting schedule....... 18 hours light , was about to go 24 hour ??
E-Type of ventilation your room has...small fan
TR-Did you pre-soak your media in pH corrected solution?.. no

Douglas1

06-27-2011, 06:41 PM

check temp, ph, and frequency of watering. not a defficiency.. If I were to guess, I'd say its too hot.. and your ph may be to high.

ConcaucsionS

06-28-2011, 12:24 AM

I see soooooo many problems comming from growers using CFL's. Make sure your bulbs are at least 8-12" away from the plant. 12 for now, maybe 8 when you perfect your technique and develop a good room humidity. I only use 2 and your using 4 which means your producing ALOT of heat and I imagine you got impatient so you probably moved the lights closer. Keep it on 18, thats perfect. They need the dark time for root growth which is essential with CFL grows. Set the timer to a time when you'll be less likely to poke your head in there the dark period is actually very important. Also if your using a fan make sure its not blowing on the plants directly as that will dry the leaves out and cause them to burn faster and easier. I take it your new to CFL's, the low down essentially is they cant flower for a shit but their AMAZING for veg. So, keep the lights at 18-6 for as long as you can, train the plant. Trim it up, grow it out not up. You can do this by trimming excess foliage and pinching the top of the plant, then. Once its the ideal size you kick it into flower. Its very important that the first day of its 12 hour cycle ( Flower cycle ) that you give it some kind of flower boost. Usually 1mil/ 5 litters. ONLY the first day. At this point the last thing you want to do is burn your plants and throw all the months of hard work your about to endure to shit. Hope this helps.

ConcaucsionS

06-28-2011, 12:28 AM

THREE INCHES FROM THE PLANT? Jesus man! Your going to fry them. 8 inches AT LEAST. And i'd only attempt that if my room humidity were perfect.

pushit

06-28-2011, 12:50 AM

I use 26w cfls for my veg and they are a couple in. away with no problems. I use 1 single T5 for the newly sprouts then they get blasted with cfls. EZG is only using 14w. I would have serious stretch if my bulbs were 8 in away. Thats way too far for cfls. Hell my HPS is only about 12in away. As long as you have proper air circulation and temps get those cfls as close as a couple inches away.
You really need to listen to Douglas1. You find out your temps and ph then go from there.

rattlingdags

06-28-2011, 07:11 AM

That little soul looks like its been through the wars but there's decent new growth coming on so your doing better with it than the last guy. I agree also with Douglas1 to keep a close eye on your temps (which are fine at the moment), your watering (loads of threads here if your unsure) and if you don't already have anything to check your PH then thats your next step. If you can't afford a meter (can be bought for around 20 dollars) then an aquarium kit with drops is a decent cheaper option. The kit can at least help you keep the ingoing PH to around 6.5 but won't be accurate to measure PH of runoff water which is coloured by the soil.

Your lights are in a perfectly fine position for low wattage CFL's just make sure there's no chance of them falling onto the plant - this happens more than you'd think lol and keep them just a few inches from the plant. There's a load of CFL grows in the growlog section if you want to check out how others use them. 18 hours lights on and 6 off is great for veging plants.
Like the others said, air circulation is very important. I aim my fans at the space between the light and the plant canopy. This moves the hot air away, and gives the girls a big of a wiggle to help keep the stems sturdy.

A few other things to consider is your soil. Is it a pre-fertilized type or light nutrients, how long has the plant been in it, is it free draining etc? Don't rush to flood your plant with food either way, the last thing it needs is to be cooked with rich food. Its just something to keep in the back of your mind.
If its in fresh pre-fertilized soil it will be fine for a month or so. If in light soil start dosing, when your ready, very lightly at a quarter of whats recommended and work up slowly.

Those old fan leaves won't heal so don't worry about them now. The plant will decide whether to keep them or drop them. Please don't be chopping into it and stripping leaves at this stage, it needs as little extra stress as possible, there's been enough of that for her (hopefully its a her :) ).
Happy growing!

EZG

06-28-2011, 04:00 PM

well all i can say to you lads is thank you , all of the reply's will help more then u think .

it is looking better new growth today :) iv droped the little girl another 3" away from the lights , i am worried about the heat/airflow . i am looking at a small PC fan ,

i have no idea what nuts if any where given and i would like to know when is the best time to train ? the little girl is under so much stress now , i dont think i have the skills yet to save ,

so i germinated 3 lemon haze seeds and will start fresh with them .

thank you all again ,

Purple Daddy

06-28-2011, 04:26 PM

I've had plants I was sure were about dead come back to life. I had one just go limp on me with the leaves dying off, I said fuck it and almost pulled it but filled up the container with water, shaved off all dead vegitation and within a week iw as growing again, gave it to a friend and I was shocked when I saw it. Had another blow over in its cup exposing the roots and bending right at the base, another goner I thought but I managed to nurse it back and gave to the same person and it's thriving again.

It's amazing how hearty yet fragile these plants can be. I've noticed when a plant has a near death experience then recovers it is one hearty MF'r.

EZG

06-28-2011, 10:27 PM

you know i cant beleave how well this is doing . the new growth looks very healthy . i tested the soil Ph 6.9 , iv not read up enough to fully understand this , from what iv looked up , it seems ok ?
im not even sure if this is a female plant ?. i will give it as mush love as i can and have named it " the Runt " .

my focus will be 90% on my babygirls . day 2 and already 2" , i took a good look at the heat issue and the temp is a constant 23 degrees 74 in US terms ? , again looks ok ? so my issue is with ventilation i think . so am gonna get a small fan and run it on timer with the lights ?
again tks for the help .

ConcaucsionS

06-29-2011, 03:50 AM

Three inches and your running serious risk even with proper air flow. You are right in what you say about stretching but thats why you pinch and trim. 8-12 inches is ideal for CFL's. I've developed a 3 month system with a really good yield. I tried the whole close as possible thing but found I just kept running into problems. The humidity in a room can drop completely in 3 minutes. Say your out for a few hours? One day you might regret being impatient and putting them as close as possible. I understand that it may sound absurd but they should not be any closer than 5 inches if you dont plan on not checking up on them every couple of hours. It could be very true that closer is better but most of the people saying that are probably extremely experienced growers. I wouldnt advise someone whose still asking questions and not completely comftorble to push their setup and plants to their limits.

EZG

06-30-2011, 02:55 PM

can someone point me to where i can readup on pinch and trim . iv been looking on the forums but cant find shit ,
the runt is still the same , i think she has decided to get rid of the damaged branches and leaves , ill not do anything to stress the little girl anymore ,
i gave it its first flush and tested the PH before and after the flush , 6.8 before and 6.5 after what do u guys think ?

Purple Daddy

06-30-2011, 03:09 PM

My experiences with runts is they aren't worth the trouble for the space they consume, I had two this year one was because of root rot the other was apparently just genetics, the root rot plant I saved finished but the yield may have been a 1/4 oz or less, the other natural runt produced good bud but maybe 1/2 an oz.

There are a lot of different opinions on pinching and trimming. I find that bending the tops down about 8-12 inches from the top will help you produce a new string of cola buds from the bend to the end of the tip and gives you a little more grow room. I'm stripping the bottom branches(about 18 inches from the soil) off of my plants even outside, from experience they seem like more hassle then they're worth and produce small clusters of loose buds with the theory being the plant isn't wasting energy growing those branches/buds out. Like I said there are a million theories on pruning, my advice is try bending it's interesting to see 4 new vertical cola buds growing.

polishpollack

06-30-2011, 04:29 PM

Don't bother pinching and trimming a runt. Only cut the tops if it looks like a plant is going to get taller than the grow space allows. I don't where concausions gets the idea that pinching and trimming is to deal with stretching. This person is putting out some bad ideas. Why experience is required with CFL bulbs at 5 inches or less is a bizarre thing to say. It's heat from the bulb that you're primarily concerned with. If you have any source of light very close to a plant, there are two things that happen - one is heat damage (but CFLs don't put out much heat), and the other is growth response, i.e., a plant will grow very short and bushy when a strong source of light is very close. I'm primarily talking about MH and HPS here. Close CFLs should be fine as mentioned by pushit. Keep lights close and see what happens. Flouro light isn't a strong source and they run cool, and I don't think there's much to worry about. As they grow, back the lights off some. It looks like some stem stretching has taken place already. Don't trim anything, just let them grow.

Purple Daddy

06-30-2011, 05:03 PM

FWIW I bent two plants about 12" from the top yesterday late afternoon, by this morning the horizontal branches along that 12" length had already began growing vertical. I'm going to have to probably bend them one more time at least.

EZG

06-30-2011, 09:32 PM

ty polish and Daddy , its straight answers like this that will prevent basic mistakes , my idea is to use the runt as a guide ,its stem has bulked up over the past 24 hours, i really wont to train my girls to be stunted my grow cab is 6ft high , i will tweak my light setup , i was thinking about a 250wtt purple CFL , i have a grow log and would like you guys to give me your opinions .

http://boards.cannabis.com/ireland/198043-dublin-indoor-first-timer.html#post2202381

EZG

07-02-2011, 08:36 PM

im not sure what to say about this plant , the runt has not given up yet ,
stem has bulked m new growth looks healthy , just tested the soil and the Ph is 6.6 , still have only flushed it yesterday for the first time , to me it looks healthy

ConcaucsionS

07-03-2011, 12:24 AM

I dont know what experience your speaking from but heres a photo of my youngest. Shes 1 and a half months into veg, theirs only an inch maybe even less between each node and new stalk so stretching is very minimal and the plant herself is maybe a foot a foot and a half tall... Dont take my advice and call my crazy but im doing the same thing I told you too and my results speak for themselves. From what you guys are saying and telling him it doesnt sound like you run 26 watt bulbs but probably 400-1000 so you shouldnt really be giving him advice at all. Yes the basic principles are the same but i`ve done both and their extremely different. I mean cmon with 1000 watts what you pull down in 3 months is nothing compared to what happens in 3 months under a CFL. Two different worlds bub.

pushit

07-03-2011, 12:44 AM

276820

Looks like im using 26w cfls to me. If you see the one thats topped, that had stretch to it. Maybe 6 in way from lights. I prefer mine dont get alot of stretch in veg. They get plenty of that when they go under the HPS. So I stand by my comments of having the cfls as close as you can without burning them. I had to pull the light bar out of the way so i could get a pic so they look further away. Maybe 2 inches away when its in position. Sorry EZG for putting this on your thread

I dont know what experience your speaking from but heres a photo of my youngest. Shes 1 and a half months into veg, theirs only an inch maybe even less between each node and new stalk so stretching is very minimal and the plant herself is maybe a foot a foot and a half tall... Dont take my advice and call my crazy but im doing the same thing I told you too and my results speak for themselves. From what you guys are saying and telling him it doesnt sound like you run 26 watt bulbs but probably 400-1000 so you shouldnt really be giving him advice at all. Yes the basic principles are the same but i`ve done both and their extremely different. I mean cmon with 1000 watts what you pull down in 3 months is nothing compared to what happens in 3 months under a CFL. Two different worlds bub.

ConcaucsionS

07-03-2011, 02:23 AM

Looking good, Nice and healthy. Although, I wasnt talking to you. You stated about 10-15 posts ago you were using CFL's. Your girls look to be around 3-4 weeks? May I ask why you havent trimmed any of your lower leaves that are being blocked of light by the canopy otherwise and absorbing more energy than its producing for the plants overall veg growth

ConcaucsionS

07-03-2011, 02:30 AM

I also noticed your only promoting growth to a single pistil? Is that your method or do you grow multiple tops later? Otherwise I cant imagine why you'd be wasting so much energy on having more plants instead of having less with a higher yield per plant. In 3-5 months depending on the strain I pull down anywhere between 1-3 ounces per plant. You also mentioned that you throw them under an HPS? Have you not firgured out how to flower under CFL's or do you find the HPS works better?

EZG

07-03-2011, 02:23 PM

you have have both got nice plants , and im sure i have a very sick plant , my experience ends there .
after i flushed it the Ph was 6.5 , what should i do ? i really wont to save this plant , just to learn from it , and not make simple mistakes with my 3 girls now 4 days old .
its all well and good telling a noob where the problem lies , it how to fix it that keeps the noob awake at night .
tks lads any and all help is appreciated

pushit

07-03-2011, 04:01 PM

The new growth looks good to me man. Polishpollak has you going in the right direction. You have already flushed so let it dry out before you water again and you should be fine. If you get that temp situation taken care of youll be off to the races. Concentrate on the new growth. Old growth is old news. Once again sorry for putting that crap on your thread. Got caught up in the moment. You can have it deleted.

EZG

07-04-2011, 03:25 PM

i learn from every word said , and i thank you for takeing the time to help me .
that said , i came home from work and found mt 3 girls dead :(

im not sure what i did wrong and im gutted that somehow iv killed my girls ,

so from 1 basket case to 4 , take a look , "sighs"

Purple Daddy

07-04-2011, 10:46 PM

What is in your soil? Seedlings can't take any kind of fertilizers until they are about a month old. Thats strange I've never seen seedlings all fall over like that, maybe one but if they are all doing it then there is obviously a common problem going on here.

I'd just start from scratch, use some generic potting soil and water with Superthrive added to your water about once a week, it's not a fertilizer and will promote root development.

EZG

07-05-2011, 06:33 PM

i didnt use any fertilizer or nutes , they look better today , gonna wait till the weekend to see because the runt has picked up ,
the new growth looks healthy , but what do i know , i thought my girls looked good and it seems my ignorance killed them :(

EZG

07-05-2011, 06:35 PM

here some more

pushit

07-05-2011, 06:51 PM

Just curious whats your watering schedule with the little ones? Im asking cause everytime i see a pic the soil looks wet. Make sure you are letting them dry out in between waterings. BTW the new growth is looking good. Great job:thumbsup:

EZG

07-05-2011, 10:46 PM

ty pushit , this is my biggest pain right now , i understand that the soil does need to dry out abit before watering . the soil drys out fast , its just potting soil , grdn center recommended it . i had to add more soil yesterday , did this as maybe the reason they all collapsed ? that and the soil dried out to fast on the sill .
im using a propagator and misting the underside of the lid i have a 15w fishtank floresent on 18 hours , its 4" above the girls .
they have picked up in the last few hours :thumbsup:

EZG

07-07-2011, 05:11 PM

the runt has got yellowing on the new growth , its been 3 days from last flush .the stem has bulked up .
have i over watered it and is the soil retaining to much moisture ? , iv not anything to the plant but give it light heat and air on a 18/6 rotation , im not even sure how old the plant is . anyway. the yellowing .

polishpollack

07-07-2011, 09:31 PM

If you want to spend a few Euros then you might try Canna Terra, which is designed for use in potting soil. Canna Terra Vega (1L) | Grow Lights, Hydroponics, Grow Tents - Bloom & Grow (http://www.bloomandgrow.ie/canna-terra-vega-1l)
Or you can get a cheaper fert at your local grow shop. You can get a chemical fert that is cheap at a hardware store. The plant is turning yellow because it's needs a micro nutrient, like boron, sulphur, etc. So you want to pick a fert that has all that stuff in it. I like to use Dyna-Gro 7-9-5 and it would be great if you could find it in your area but I don't know if it's sold in Ireland. Here's what it's like: Dyna-Gro (http://www.dyna-gro.com/) click on "products" then "complete plant nutrients." You want to find a fertilizer that is like this if you can because it provides everything plants need to grow. Alot of growers just walk into a shop and buy whatever looks good. That's how you get into trouble. Just follow the directions and don't over-do it.

EZG

07-08-2011, 05:46 PM

ur god dam hero Polish:thumbsup: my research was leading me to look at seaweed extract ? a new grow shop has opened close to me and i will be looking for that fert u recommended or at least as close to 7-9-5.
iv just flushed the runt , its looking alot better but more yellowing . ur not gonna beleave , i was offered 4 plants that are 6 weeks old grown out side , i beleave the runt cant from the same source , the plants will come with a 400w HPS lamp , all they have to be is finished , i will know more later ,
i was hoping to ease myself into this , gaining xp as i go , but with my seedlings almost dead , i now have an opportunity to flower 4 healthy unsexed plants , btw my mt8 said there no catches , if i get anything from them all he wont is a bit of smoke ,
some things are to good to be true ?

polishpollack

07-11-2011, 10:25 PM

EZG, it's not so much the 7-9-5 numbers that are important here, but those are good numbers to use. It's actually all the micronutes that come in with the NPK, the macronutrients. Some are needed in greater number and are called macros (meaning big), and many other nutes are needed in lesser number (micro, small).
Sounds like very good timing on those plants and a light to boot. HPS in particular is the light to use because you can use it all the way from veg to finish. Put a small fan on them to strengthen the stems. Just enough wind to jostle them a little, so later they won't fall over. You'll have to figure a way to keep the light kind of low when they're small and raise it as they grow.
Other ferts will work fine but DynaGro is a single kind of fert where pretty much everything plants need is in one container. Unfortuately, it doesn't have a very long shelf life. It might be good for about six months. If you can't find it, look for a fertilizer that is a chemical kind of fert, fast absorbing, and has as much of the 16 different nutes plants need for your money. Let me know what you get. You're having a deficiency there, so a small dose of a complete fert would help out. Follow the instructions on how to use it, usually located on the back of the container. Seaweed is fine but it's hormonal and small elements, and it's strong so don't use much of it.

EZG

07-12-2011, 06:19 PM

hey polish
well i got the new plants , 3 ladys as far as i can see :)
6 weeks old no1 is a fine plants stunted high ,but looks good to me . the other plants came in the same pot :(
anyway at this late stage i can separate them ? i have a bug problem , small black fuckers and bigger flying bastards . iv combing the plants with a tweezers , and iv put in some flypaper . they where veged outside in pots .i plan on futting them into flower within the next week ? but also thinking LST for 2 weeks and tie the main stem down ? or will i put straight in to flower ?
with that in mind , i made a call to my local grow shop and picked up some " Terra Flores " for the final cycle .
with the 600w HPS i know imma have problems with heat so my next step is venting so im looking at a total rebuild of my diy tent . and haveing a small sheet of perspex between the light and the tallest plant , what do u think of this polish ?
btw , after u looking out for me like this , imma send u some Irish beer ;)
ty

polishpollack

07-13-2011, 10:38 PM

Oy mate, me drinks Guiness!
Can't say much about your bugs but fuck the fuckers and bastards. Do what you can to get rid of them. There are bug sprays sold in grow shops but it's also toxic to people and I've even heard of a lady who died after too much contact, believe it or not. Try to get rid of them safely. If you have a dead animal in the area, flies will be attracted to the odor of decomposition, so check for a dead mouse or something if you have flies.

It looks like one thing to consider is to transplant into bigger pots. 5 gallon buckets (about 20 liters) do nicely for indoor grows and should be enough soil to last the duration. Check out potting soil at your grow shop and get something fairly standard. Get enough to fill larger containers, one bag might be enough, that is, if you want to transplant. I suspect it would be a good idea. I just Googled Terra Flores and see that it's Canna. I've never used it but it's made for soil use, hence the word "terra" and should be good. Just don't give too much. One difficulty with ferts like this is it's hard to tell how much to give. People follow nutrient schedules and some companies even put out schedules to follow, but you have to decided what to do. Better to under do it and let the plant tell you something is missing rather than over do it. If you've already given fert and you want to transplant, hold off on more fert after transplant until some time has passed before giving more fert.

EZG

07-14-2011, 08:03 PM

ty for the valuable advice mt8 , i really cant beleave my luck , nice plants and a good light , right after i killed my girls .
the only bugs in my setup came from the plants , i think iv killed all :) but im still looking very hard ,ill prob transplant saterday. when i have quite ,
temp of the setup is my biggest concern right now , it went from a steady 23cl to 29/31cl . i made a vent with some pvc flexi duct as close as i could to the lamp to vent some heat , the tower fan i angled toward the light , i think a 600w is to big for my setup , when im not there in useing my cfl/t5 tubes in total about 110w of flor, its the heat im worried about i need a proper tent .
anyway its still looking very good polish:jointsmile:

polishpollack

07-20-2011, 07:59 PM

Good airflow will help out. How are these looking so far? Transplant yet?

EZG

07-21-2011, 03:35 PM

hey mt8
yeh i transplanted them last sunday and they look fine . it seems, good advice and research has got my through that vital stage . iv started a grow log ,

http://boards.cannabis.com/grow-log/198460-first-grow-indoor.html

MEDEDCANNABIS

07-21-2011, 11:41 PM