Serious Seeds Chronic 1000W SOG DWC

[macnasty]

strain: Serious Seeds Chronic cloned from mother. Advertised at 56-63 days flowering cycle.

veg: about 2 weeks or less once initial roots have shown. Plants go into flowering at about 4" tall.

Lights: 90W UFO Chinese LED for cloning and vegging. 1000W HPS with cooltube and reflector for flowering

system: Bubbler using neoprene inserts for cloning and veg. DWC in 7 gallon Rubbermaid Roughneck. 8 sites using 3.75" netpots for flowering

medium: no medium for cloning and veg. Hydroton pellets for flowering

Nutes: AN Jumpstart as root starter. AN Piranha and Tarantula once initial roots show and for duration of veg cycle. 1/4-1/2 strength AN 3 part for veg cycle. Advanced Nutrients 3 Part for flowering. Hygrozyme @ 7 ml/g. Botanicaire Sweet @ 10 ml/g beginning week 5. Koolbloom powder beginning week 5. Calmag+ beginning week 3 of flowering.

water source:tap @ app. 200 ppm.

temps: not measured, but fluctuates between very cool to cool

ventilation: 650 CFM in line vortex

cycle: 18/6 during cloning and veg. 12/12 during flowering.

Pictures coming shortly. I'm going to try and keep this as detailed as possible. I'll update once a week with pictures of progressive growth.

Questions and comments welcome. Hope you enjoy. :D

-the em.

[bigsby]

I'll subscribe. I like the documentation so far. What is the size of the room?

[macnasty]

Welcome Bigsby, and thank you.

space: Flowering area is 2'x4'x8' tall.

I should add that I'm a novice grower. Not too many grows under my belt. I do not grow glorious and beautiful supermodel status ladies, as I run into a few problems that I have yet to overcome. Hopefully those stopping by might be able to give me some suggestions. But I know enough to make any visitors time worth while.

I'll post pics tonight.

[macnasty]

pic 1: group shot. 11 days into flower. noticeable deficiencies.

pic 2: group shot. 30 days into flower. Look healthier. sorry poor lighting seems hard to tell there are 8 plants here, as the back row seem to be hiding in the shadows. plants are about 8-12 inches tall. ill try to take better shots next round with some supplemental lighting.

pic 3: close up of one. some leaves twisting a bit. not sure why. any ideas? over fert?

pic 4: underside angle of one plant. during veg i cut the bottom nodes off to promote air circulation during flowering and minimal side branching. im aiming for one fat cola. i also nip the buds a little further up once i transplant to flowering tub, but leave the fan leaves in tact. i'm guessing this promotes photosynthesis while the plant has only a few nodes but eliminates further side branching and helps focus plants energy towards the main cola.

sorry i didn't post any pics of clones, or vegging. i thought it would be more interesting if i just got things moving along towards the middle stage of flowering, for eye candy. if anyone would like to see root structure etc or anything prior to the pics below just let me know.

more next week.

[bigsby]

Welcome Bigsby, and thank you.

space: Flowering area is 2'x4'x8' tall.

Nice tight setup. I'm wondering if those leaves are suffering from too much light / heat? How close is that blazing 1K light? What are the temps? If you put your hand just above the canopy is it reasonably comfortable? I'm sure you know this stuff but just throwing out a few suggestions.

That's a serious fan for 64 s/f. I'm curious, do you use a fan speed controller? What's the noise level? Are you cooling your light with it, just venting the room, or both?

[truepunk87]

Ill be watching. :jointsmile:j

[macnasty]

Hiya Truepunk and welcome.

distance from lights: between 2'-3' from light source, depending on position in tub.

temps: i don't measure them, but it's below freezing outside so there is a constant flow of cold air coming in. i'm guessing anywhere between 55-65 degrees fehrenheit. very cool nevertheless, and always cooler than room temp. no discomfort at all when placing my hand at the top of the canopy, plants are too far from the light for that.

air circulation: i forgot to mention that the in line vortex fan is acting just as an exhaust, sucking out all the heat from the bulb, and that the air intake of the closet is passive. both use 6" ducting.


That's a serious fan for 64 s/f. I'm curious, do you use a fan speed controller? What's the noise level? Are you cooling your light with it, just venting the room, or both?

while the flowering space is only 64 sqf the closet is larger. it's divided into 3 sections, one for a mother, one for clones and vegging, and one for flowering. unfortunately, the flowering space is far too small and the other two sections far too big. in any event the fan exhausts air from all three sections at once, which is 192 sqf, a size more suitable for a fan that powerful :D

[bigsby]

That's still a pretty big fan, depending on the length of duct, elbows, filters, desired rate of exchange, etc. My space is 220 s/f and I use a 400 CFM inline dialed back to about 2/3rds speed. It still sounds like a turbo prop though which pisses off the wife no end. I vent my mother / veg room into the flower room using a small duct booster fan.

Why separate mothers/veg sections or is that just how it turned out? I have mine in the same space. Anyway, looking forward to seeing this progress. Let us know when you figure out the leaf issue.

[macnasty]

astute observations bigsby. funny thing is i just got back from the hydro store and the guy said my leaf issue is probably the result of low temps locking out nute absorption (i made a post in the plant problems section of some issues i'm having in the later stage of flower). he says it could be a mag/cal deficiency caused by low temps. never thought that could be the case. i could a) throw a submersible turtle heater in the rez or b) do what you do and get a reducer to dial it back a bit. option b would be a bit of a pain, as i'd have to crawl up into the attic to tinker with the fan. not to mention that's a lot of work for just guesswork. on the plus side there is ZERO noise from the fan since it is on a completely different level from the grow room (my exhaust runs about 20 ft as well as the passive intake). the only sound i get are those made by the air pump, which is noticeable nevertheless.

in other news...

got some cal/mag from the store today. i'm going to begin using that. today is rez change and from now on I will be changing the rez each and every week, rather than every other week. hopefully these two changes from the program will resolve this annoying leaf browning issue. crossing fingers...

-the em

[macnasty]

Sorry! I've been busy and when I finally got around to updating, the forums were down! i took pics at day 37 though so here they are! some notes: the differences in plant height are very noticeable now. plants range from about 6 inches tall to 12 inches, so the canopy is definitely NOT even. the pics of single plants are always taken of the biggest one. the centre of this plant already has a thickness equal to my fist! this plant will probably produce 2+ ounces. others as little as 7 grams, and still others somewhere in between. i feel like rez changes every 7 days is too much, especially for such small plants, so i've been going every 10 days instead, filling 5 gallons each time and topping off accordingly. i think i'll start keeping the food levels slightly lower too, as i believe my plants are experiencing burn at the tips and very dark leaves. once last point; i'm beginning to see very small brown dots forming on some of the larger fan leaves, especially the ones found on the largest plant. nute burn? mag deficiency? i'm not sure, but i think it will get worse gah.

ec: 1.8-2.0
ph: 5.6-5.8
rez changes: every 10 days



pic 1: looks like some nute burn at tips. leaves are probably too dark too.

pic 2: pic of the largest plant. the width of the centre of this plant equals my fist, about 4 inches of bud.

pic 3: close up of the top with the HID on. curling leaves dont make me too happy. is that over fert?

pic 4: under shot of biggest plant.

comments, suggestions are welcome. more day 43ish...

[leadmagnet]

A 1000W HPS in a 2x4x8 space is A LOT of light but great if you can divert/control that heat. Your 650 cfm vortex should be plenty. I love those fans. In fact it sounded like overkill to me too like bigs mentioned. But if you are using it to vent out via a twenty foot run than it makes sense. Otherwise you could end up sucking your plants up out that sucker, lol.

If you were to shorten that run and add a potentiometer you would be adding some nice flexibility to your grow. You would then be able to possibly allow for a little more height in your girls rather than flowering so short.

Looks like youâ??re doing a great job though- newbie to newbie speakin!

Fun shit, huh?

[leadmagnet]

Oh, also if you're going to be crawling around re-wiring stuff I'd throw in a thermostat like one of these...

Greenhouse Controls - Thermostat Controllers from ACF Greenhouses (http://www.littlegreenhouse.com/accessory/controls4.shtml)

Not trying to advertise for that site- I'm sure a simple google search and you would find other vendors for those. They help to provide you with some great automatic temp control for your room with your exhaust fan.

[truepunk87]

Looking awesome MCnasty. Ill be starting chronic around the middle of February. This has been great insight. Just a few questions. First, how would u rate the odor legal? And second, how long did u veg before u flowered?

[macnasty]

You're right leadmagnet and I've been thinking of grabbing one of those potentiometres (cool name) ever since I got setup. The one they sell at the hydro store is only around $15 but the problem is it's designed to be attached ti the fan, and mine is in the attic! Consequently I have to run it 20 feet, but even at this distance the space gets a little too cold when the temps are really low outside. I understand that big gaps in temp make plants really stretch, which is an issue in my setup. Definitely gonna consider these thermostats when I get around to tweaking things.


truepunk87 Looking awesome MCnasty. Ill be starting chronic around the middle of February. This has been great insight. Just a few questions. First, how would u rate the odor legal? And second, how long did u veg before u flowered?

thank you.
Odor: minimal. That being said I am running a very powerful fan. With that fan going I can't smell much. Once you open the closet door though a light smell does permeate the room, but once again it's not very noticeable and goes away quickly if I shut the closet door. It's only when I tamper with the plants that a sweet aroma eminates from the plants. I would definitely describe it as sweet and not skunky at all.

veg time: it wouldn't be accurate if I gave you a time because I ran into some issues during cloning which delayed plant growth. I think my rooting medium (AN Jump Start) is expired and doesn't seem to work very well so I experienced yellowing leaves that often withered away. I base my decision on the LENGTH of the roots. Once the roots reach a length of about 6-8" then they are ready. From the time I take the cuts this usually takes about 3 weeks. Or to describe it differently, once I see initial roots firming, I give it another 10-14 days. I bet if I got another bottle of jumpstart I could reduce this time by a week. I'll take pictures of my new clones when they are ready to go to give you a visual. They should be ready in about 7-10 days.

Some other notes: I'm going to be lowering EC levels for the remainder of the run. The range will be 1.6-1.8 instead of the 1.8-2.0 I've been doing. My gut says those dark leaves and curling are the result of over feeding.

More pics coming soon...

[truepunk87]

Thank u nasty. That helps a lot. I've been wanting to grow chronic since I got my first high times, about 12 years ago :) standing by for pics. Your plants are beautiful by the way

[macnasty]

thanks punk. some things are definitely going well, others not so much, but mostly well :thumbsup: some of the larger fan leaves are showing signs of a) nute burn or b) nute def? or c) rust fungus?. i really don't know wish i could pin point the source. i'm going with burn and that's why i've lowered the food levels to an EC of 1.6-1.8, going from 12 ml/g of each of Grow Micro Bloom to about 8 ml/g of each. hopefully the yellowing/browning/crispiness of the leaves stops. keeping fingers crossed. the plants do not seem stressed out too much though, and they are growing well.

pic 1: shot of the largest plant of the 8.

pic 2: group photo with HID

pic 3: under canopy shot showing a pack of zig zags to get an idea of the size of the plants.

pic 4: the largest plant, already as wide as my fist.

pic 5: my plant problems. diagnosis?


more pictures day 50ish...

[macnasty]

pic 1: group photo. some plants are so small you can't see them really.

pic 2: not sure how much longer that twig is gonna hold up.

pic 3: close up of a top


what's up with my leaves :mad:

otherwise :pimp:

[truepunk87]

I just wanna say that I am now positive that because of your updates and pics I am 100% positive I made a good choice going with chronic. Is this your first run with chronic? Keep up the good work,and I hope you find out what the problem with the leaves are.:thumbsup:

[tikiroom]

The leaves look like nute burn to me.
What is your ec/ppm?

[macnasty]

I just wanna say that I am now positive that because of your updates and pics I am 100% positive I made a good choice going with chronic. Is this your first run with chronic? Keep up the good work,and I hope you find out what the problem with the leaves are.

thank you kindly punk.

I hope it's just nute burn and not something like the dreaded rust fungus. More and more I'm leaning towards nute burn myself. The plants are very leafy, the leaves are very dark, they curl inwards, tips turn brown early in flower and gradually spread to serrated edges of leaves, then yellow/brown dots appear around week 4 and it seems to be spreading.

ec levels: it comes in at 1.7, and appears to rise to 1.8-1.9 until I top off with water. This means the plants are drinking more water than nutes correct? I'm over feeding? What I don't understand is AN's suggested food levels. I'm using half of what they recommend and still get burn? What's with their feeding charts utterly useless to me I might as well experiment with my own levels. I keep the ec range at between 1.6-1.8.

Yes first time growing chronic. I think next run I'll lower nute levels to about 1.5 ec. Also, I don't think these plants are going to finish anywhere near the Serious Seeds estimate of 57-63 days. I blame myself more than SS's marketing because I think the stress of transplant and leaf damage is setting flowering time behind in a big way.

More pics day 63...

[Agoblue97]

I just went through a problem really similar. It turned out to be a Mg deficiency. Check out my thread in the Plant Problem section to compare pics. I finally got the problem under control, but the leaves that were affected by it all died off or got pruned.;)

By the way the thread title was Mg deficiency or Rust Fungi!!!

[macnasty]

Thanks Agoblue read your thread and I'm glad to hear you solved your problem. Two reasons why I don't think it's a mg deficiency. 1) I've been using cal-mag+ since about week 4 at 10 ml/g. And yet the problem seems to be getting worse. 2) your pics look different from mine. The tips of my leaves are crispy as well as the edges. On yours I didn't notice that. I'm not saying it isn't mg deficiency just yet, I just don't understand how it could be. Also, I'm using tap water which should have enough mg in it already.

[macnasty]

Looking awesome MCnasty. Ill be starting chronic around the middle of February. This has been great insight. Just a few questions. First, how would u rate the odor legal? And second, how long did u veg before u flowered?

As promised, attached is a pic of the general size I try to go for when it's ready to go into flower. To be perfectly honest though this rooted clone is a BIT bigger than I would prefer, and a plant this size once finished will give easily over an ounce. In a SOG this plant will likely hog up too much space given my setup, so I'd aim for something slightly smaller. The goal is 3/4 ounce per plant. Hope that helps.

[truepunk87]

Thank you. Much appreciated. My plan is to run a whole pack of chronic, under a 2' 6 bulb t5 . Ill keep one male to make seeds with,and hopefully get some clones rooted before we have to move. All the info you have given has been noted. Again, appreciate the info. The people on these forums are so much more helpful than that other forum...cough cough *RIU* cough :D

[macnasty]

Gah! Today's mood is glum. I have 2 pieces of news to give today.

#1) My hydro guy just dropped a knowledge bomb on my face today. He told me "everyone knows that when dealing with these companies, whatever they tell you to feed, cut that in half!" Apparantly everyone's known this but me :wtf: he said this is especially true with Advanced Nutrients. Soooo....although I started cutting down the 3 part formula by half for a while now, I've still been using all my additives at full strength (koolbloom, hygrozyme, cal-mag+, Sweet). And get this, I've been using Koolbloom (powder) since like week 4 or 5 of flower, and I'm told using this stuff earlier than 2 weeks before flushing can cause harm :( In short - I think I've botched this grow by overfeeding, feeding improper proportions of additives, and using additives at improper times. However, I'll finish what I started and continue writing this log.

#2) There is some good news! I've been experimenting with coco, using the same strain, and she keeps my self esteem afloat while I burn the plants in the DWC :D

day: Not sure what day of flower she's in. I will guess 28-32.

Nutes: House and Garden Coco A&B @ 12 ml/g each, cal-mag+ @ 10 ml/g, hygrozyme @ 5 ml/g,

I will continue to log her along with the DWC plants. I gotta give House and Garden props for suggesting food levels that are ACCURATE, unlike those money grubbing chumps at AN and GH grr.

more pics later tonight...

[macnasty]

pic 1: group shot

pic 2: bottom left plant with small bic lighter

pic 3: close up of bottom left plant

[CanGroIt]

Nice plants!

Are you still using tap water? Might be holding your yield back by using tap water. 200ppm is pretty high for water to use for hydro. Filtered water ranges from 6ppm - 20ppm depending on the bottling company. It would be beneficial for you and your plants to replace the unwanted ppm's with nutrient ppm's. Try it for a grow, wouldn't hurt....

If I were you I would veg longer and trim more. And what i mean by trim more is to leave like six to eight bud sites per plant when starting 12/12. You have the head room for it and the 1k watter can envelop the plants in the small space. I've done a similar grow in a 2'd x 3'w x 6'h with a 1k hps, 1 plant dwc/aero, veg 30 days, fl 60 days, yielded 3-4 oz. You can easily double or triple your yield by vegging a bit longer. Just my opinion though....

[macnasty]

been a while.

harvest time: 77 days. A lot longer than the 8-9 weeks estimated by Serious Seeds. But then again these plants have gone through significant stress, from the beginning of flower during transplant, and throughout flowering with nutrient burn. But finished at last.

Cangroit, thanks for the compliment. I did use tap throughout the grow, and I will consider your advice for a future grow. It does make sense that the 200 ppm in the water could go to better use.

pic 1: close up of cola.

pic 2: all 8 plants with their fan leaves trimmed. Next time I'll go for more uniformity in size.

pic 3: into the drying tub they go,with the lid closed and plenty of air holes for circulation.

I'll update the final harvest weight with pictures and a smoke report in about a month when they are done. Thanks for stopping by. :pimp:

- the em

[macnasty]

update from the coco plant.

day: 40 ish

pic 1: here she is. in all her glory.

pic 2: close up of her face

[macnasty]

Here she is from pics taken about 10 days after the last set. February 16.

[macnasty]

weight: 73 grams dried, or about 2 1/4 ounces. if i did it again though i could imagine easily getting double this weight with plants all under 16 inches. so that's 4 1/2 ounces in a 24" x 12" space, which is impressive yield.

taste: this isn't really fair since the plants were over fed. i think it's negatively affected the taste. it's tasteless lol. 5/10

smell: again, not very good. 5/10

strength: 7/10

From what's available on the world wide web of misinformation i was expecting a harsh smoke. it wasn't harsh AT ALL, and considering they were over fed and could be much smoother, this was a big surprise. the smoke is smooth and i don't cough at all when inhaling. the phenotype i got shows obvious signs of its sativa influences; it's not a couch lock buzz at all. i let these puppies flower for almost 13 weeks too, but the trichomes simply wouldnt turn amber. the high begins with a healthy mix of head/body rush, but gradually abandons the body buzz in favour of a continual head high. i find myself eagerly cleaning up after smoking this stuff, breakin dance moves and engaging in excited but not nervous conversation. i really do like the high, especially because most of the kush and other bud that is available in my area is designed to blast a shotgun to your face and leave you paralyzed on the couch - not my idea of a good buzz all the time. it was a pleasant change. the buds as you can see are big and fluffy and orange/brown in colour. it breaks up exactly how it looks, no surprises here. so aside from the sub par taste and smell, it's a good smoke. growing organically and not burning the plants will probably increase both these qualities in a big way.

next on the menu: Barney's Farm Violator Kush...stay tuned.

[truepunk87]

Beautiful man,just beautiful. Looks like the chronic does well in coco. Ill definitely look for a 8-9 week mother LOL. Don't got that kinda patience to wait almost 13 weeks
Great job nasty :)

[macnasty]

Hey truepunk glad to see youre still around. i'd suggest going fairly light on the nutes, it's not a heavy eater. using Advance Nutrients and with plants the size i was growing i'd aim for an EC of 1.3 at week 3+. ya the coco is lookin good. just started flushing her a few days ago, i'll take a pic of her before i chop her down soon. Unfortunately the yield is substantially less using coco and the House and Garden fertilizer, but the quality appears to be better so it's a reasonable trade off. That being said had I not stressed them out i bet they would taste and smell much better even with AN. Last thing, don't wait for the trichomes to go amber. she won't increase in size after week 10 and those trichomes won't change colour, so off with her head! at least that was my experience. well i'm off, thanks for stopping by. peace

- the em

[Shovelhandle]

thanks for following up with your findings. That information is great for the rest of us. You should be a few steps ahead next try.

[truepunk87]

Thank you very much. Going the all organic route, fox farm ocean forest,Indonesian guano,and Humboldt bloom natural and duece duece. I just went thru this post and wrote all the info u gave down so I wont forget LOL.

[azdesertdweller]

to bad ya didn't have more space...imagine those fuggers at 3 feet,be filling a whole lot more jars...finished product was lookin good...:thumbsup:

[macnasty]

here are some pics of the coco plant just before i chopped her down and after i trimmed her. i'll take some pics of some dried nugs soon and post them. hopefully they look better than her fluffier sisters. i'm much happier with the overall look of the coco plant though. no signs of stress she's beautiful, although i realize i should have flushed her a bit longer (only did 5 days).

[truepunk87]

Congrats on an awesome grow and a nice looking harvest :)

[macnasty]

she dried to 30 grams. so for anyone wondering, that picture of a clone i took earlier in this thread will give you a plant this size. this plant was about 3 feet away from the light though. she finished about 18 inches tall.

[truepunk87]

The 2nd pic is fucking beautiful man. :)