Care Giver Questions...

[davemw]

Hey Folks,
I've been doing a lot of reading and still have a lot of questions about being a care giver.

My situation: I have my own MMJ Lic. and I plan to grow for myself and others as a stated caregiver. However the laws \ 1284 doesn't explain clearly how many patients I can supply.

I'm wanting to set up a private hydro-grow in my home. I'd like to service 8 patients with 48 plants, but the way 1284 reads, it sounds like I can only service 5 patients and myself.

Can I grow for 8 patients legally?

Also, can I sell the excess product to local dispenserais?

And finally, I'm looking for patients. What is a good way to find folks who need MMJ? I'd prefer not to post an ad on CL asking for every weirdo out there to email me back :)


Thanks!

[SmokeyBandit]

From what I make of it the limit is 5 patients but you MUST apply for a license and register with the city and state.It's pretty much the same as if you where to open any other non mmj business zoning,rules,inspections,tax audits etc.Its no longer business as usual.I believe that we will see allot of takedowns and busts for anyone not within the rules in the near future.

[TheReleafCenter]

You can only serve up to 5 patients unless you want to get a MMC license and OPCL. Those might cost a lot of money.

You'll no longer be able to sell excess meds to MMC's. You can only charge patients the cost of growing, unless you offer wellness services. You can charge whatever you want for those.

[COzigzag]

From what I make of it the limit is 5 patients but you MUST apply for a license and register with the city and state.It's pretty much the same as if you where to open any other non mmj business zoning,rules,inspections,tax audits etc.Its no longer business as usual.I believe that we will see allot of takedowns and busts for anyone not within the rules in the near future.

This isn't the way I interpret the new law.

My interpretation: A caregiver can have 5 patients. You do not have to apply for any special license if you stay within your 5 patient limit. There are options in place to obtain more patients legally. The patient can write the DOR requesting you be their caregiver or you can allow the DOR to put you on a caregiver list for patients in your area. You have to jump through special DOR hoops though.

Anybody else have an interpretation?

[davemw]

Wow, that really sucks for the small guys. and how are the MMC's getting theirs now? growing it themselves?

WTF am i supposed to do with all the extra if i can't sell it to a despensery...

[davemw]

You can only serve up to 5 patients unless you want to get a MMC license and OPCL. Those might cost a lot of money.

You'll no longer be able to sell excess meds to MMC's. You can only charge patients the cost of growing, unless you offer wellness services. You can charge whatever you want for those.


This isn't the way I interpret the new law.

My interpretation: A caregiver can have 5 patients. You do not have to apply for any special license if you stay within your 5 patient limit. There are options in place to obtain more patients legally. The patient can write the DOR requesting you be their caregiver or you can allow the DOR to put you on a caregiver list for patients in your area. You have to jump through special DOR hoops though.

Anybody else have an interpretation?

Agreed.. My interpretation is the same as COzigzag. However I hate the fact that we have to interpret the laws. Let's just spell this isht out barney style!

[throatstick]

Agreed.. My interpretation is the same as COzigzag. However I hate the fact that we have to interpret the laws. Let's just spell this isht out barney style!

they want it that way so if you unknowingly go out side of it they can fuck you're world up.they made it so they can make money on both side of the issue...

[COzigzag]

Let's just spell this isht out barney style!

I'm with you! :thumbsup:

[davemw]

So what's going to happen to all the home growers out there if this gets signed? is everyone folding up shop and calling it done until someone can get the bill overturned.

I'd like to hear more about how the dispensaries will be getting their product. I guess a loop hole would be to grow at my location then have the dispensary pay me as an employee under the tile of "grow specialist" or something like that.

[TheReleafCenter]

So what's going to happen to all the home growers out there if this gets signed? is everyone folding up shop and calling it done until someone can get the bill overturned.

I'd like to hear more about how the dispensaries will be getting their product. I guess a loop hole would be to grow at my location then have the dispensary pay me as an employee under the tile of "grow specialist" or something like that.

Home grows won't be eligible for OPCL's, which are the only places MMC's can get their herb. Dispensaries are going to be required to grow 70% of their own, with 30% coming from other licensed grows.

I'm guessing a lot of home grows will go to the black market which is making a lot of leo's giddy.

[davemw]

Sounds like it will be a go big or go home type thing.

Either I trash the idea, or decide to ramp it up and get OPCL status.

[lampost]

OPCL?

Can someone clarify? Acronyms bug the shit out of me.... in other words ABTSOOM....

Laugh-Out-Loud!

[COzigzag]

OPCL?

Can someone clarify? Acronyms bug the shit out of me.... in other words ABTSOOM....

Laugh-Out-Loud!

Just a guess but I think it means "optional premises cultivation license."

[HighPopalorum]

WTF am i supposed to do with all the extra if i can't sell it to a despensery...

Send it my way and I'll smoke it for you.

[TheReleafCenter]

Just a guess but I think it means "optional premises cultivation license."

Nailed it. Sorry about the acronyms, I'm just sick of typing optional premises cultivation license.

[cowgirl1]

:mad: :mad::mad: Here is my understanding of the law after talking with a lawyer and my not so nice DEA uncle.

You are allowed 5 patients no more. The only way around 5 patients for a caregiver is to have your patient apply to the state to allow you to service them. The caregiver can then service an extra patient if approved by the state. " I think you will have a better chance of winning the lottery.

A caregiver is allowed 6 plants. 3 of those in flower and 3 in veg, clones etc. You can have a Doctor state that you need more then the above allowed plants "6". However, the loop whole to that is. If Law Enforcement comes knocking on your door and they want to be real jerks they can arrest you, then when you get to court you have to have your Doctor come to court and tell the judge why you need more then 6 plants. I would suspect getting your Doctor to come to court will not be cheap.

As a caregiver you are allowed to have 6 plants for each patients. Same rules apply 1/2 in flower 1/2 in veg, clones etc.

As to selling to dispencaries. If you are a caregiver and you sell to dispencaries you can be arrested. It is now against the law for caregivers to sell to dispencaries and both the caregiver and dispencary owner can be arrested.

Here is the real kicker. Lets say you have 5 patients and yourself. You are allowed to have in your possession "at home" two ounces of dried marijuana for yourself and two ounces for each patient. That comes to 12 ounces, when you harvest and dry your weed lets say it comes to 13 ounces or more. The extra has to be thrown away asap. If leo comes and you have 13 plus ounces you are in violation and can be arrested.

As you are leaving your house to drop off 2 ounces to your patient and you think, shoot maybe another patient or two will call while I am out. I better grab 10 ounces just in case " remember at home you are allowed the 10 ounces with 5 patients and yourself. However, you take off down the road and get stopped for speeding. The cops find your 10 ounces but you do not have all the paperwork for all your patients to cover the 10 ounces with you because you forgot it on the coffee table you just have the paperwork for the one person you are dropping off to. Guess what? you are now in violation of state law and subject for arrest.


As to everyone talking about the 100 limit to stay under radar of the DEA. Remember this if you have seeds around the DEA counts seeds too. One seed equals one plant. So, in other words if you have 90 plants and 11 awesome seeds tucked away under your bed that you are saving for a special season as far as the DEA feels you have 90 plants plus eleven seeds which equals 101 plants. Same as having 1 plant and 100 seeds, you know have 101 plants.


:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad: :mad::mad::mad::mad:

[TheReleafCenter]

Has the DEA uncle given any info about what to expect in terms of federal directives?

[throatstick]

:mad: :mad::mad: Here is my understanding of the law after talking with a lawyer and my not so nice DEA uncle.

You are allowed 5 patients no more. The only way around 5 patients for a caregiver is to have your patient apply to the state to allow you to service them. The caregiver can then service an extra patient if approved by the state. " I think you will have a better chance of winning the lottery.

A caregiver is allowed 6 plants. 3 of those in flower and 3 in veg, clones etc. You can have a Doctor state that you need more then the above allowed plants "6". However, the loop whole to that is. If Law Enforcement comes knocking on your door and they want to be real jerks they can arrest you, then when you get to court you have to have your Doctor come to court and tell the judge why you need more then 6 plants. I would suspect getting your Doctor to come to court will not be cheap.

As a caregiver you are allowed to have 6 plants for each patients. Same rules apply 1/2 in flower 1/2 in veg, clones etc.

As to selling to dispencaries. If you are a caregiver and you sell to dispencaries you can be arrested. It is now against the law for caregivers to sell to dispencaries and both the caregiver and dispencary owner can be arrested.

Here is the real kicker. Lets say you have 5 patients and yourself. You are allowed to have in your possession "at home" two ounces of dried marijuana for yourself and two ounces for each patient. That comes to 12 ounces, when you harvest and dry your weed lets say it comes to 13 ounces or more. The extra has to be thrown away asap. If leo comes and you have 13 plus ounces you are in violation and can be arrested.

As you are leaving your house to drop off 2 ounces to your patient and you think, shoot maybe another patient or two will call while I am out. I better grab 10 ounces just in case " remember at home you are allowed the 10 ounces with 5 patients and yourself. However, you take off down the road and get stopped for speeding. The cops find your 10 ounces but you do not have all the paperwork for all your patients to cover the 10 ounces with you because you forgot it on the coffee table you just have the paperwork for the one person you are dropping off to. Guess what? you are now in violation of state law and subject for arrest.


As to everyone talking about the 100 limit to stay under radar of the DEA. Remember this if you have seeds around the DEA counts seeds too. One seed equals one plant. So, in other words if you have 90 plants and 11 awesome seeds tucked away under your bed that you are saving for a special season as far as the DEA feels you have 90 plants plus eleven seeds which equals 101 plants. Same as having 1 plant and 100 seeds, you know have 101 plants.


:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad: :mad::mad::mad::mad:

never heard of them counting seeds thats way fucked up.

[cowgirl1]

Has the DEA uncle given any info about what to expect in terms of federal directives?

I did hear a little bird talking, that would suggest they will be keeping tabs and I would not want to be a large scale growing opereations

[cowgirl1]

never heard of them counting seeds thats way fucked up.

That is also how they did Mark Emery. He never sent a gram, pound, ounce nothing to the USA. They called him one of the top drug traffickers in the world. They figured he sent x amount of seeds and figured one seed equals one plant. That is why he was facing 20 to life unless he plead.

Should not be to hard for simple people that are staying under 5 patients to fly low you are just going to have to throw away extra if you want to stay legal.

Have you looked at craigslist lately? Tons of people have adds on the selling caregiver to caregiver. Caregiver are not allowed to deal with each other anymore. Even if your friend down the street has a kick ass kush plant and you as a caregiver go and get a clone from him you are breaking the law. Caregiver can only deal with there 5 patients and caregiver can not be listed as a patient with someone else.

Also on craigslist you see adds of people selling left over 1/4 pounds. Once again this is illegal.

I think once everything is signed off and you have a few bored drug cops running around there will be lots of trouble.

The only thing this bill did was help the big money backed dispencaries. I am just wondering how many senator and house rep got big money donate to there elections for signing off on it

[throatstick]

I did hear a little bird talking, that would suggest they will be keeping tabs and I would not want to be a large scale growing opereations

what would that little birdy call a large opereation? if 1 was to stick to the 5 + them thats 36 right there.what about the centers that pay the fee and are legal? it's ok if they have 500 plants?i mean they would have to just to keep up with demand since they have to do 70% in house.sounds like they will use this bill to start hitting the little guy hard....i see bad things headed to colorado.....:wtf::

[cowgirl1]

what would that little birdy call a large opereation? if 1 was to stick to the 5 + them thats 36 right there.what about the centers that pay the fee and are legal? it's ok if they have 500 plants?i mean they would have to just to keep up with demand since they have to do 70% in house.sounds like they will use this bill to start hitting the little guy hard....i see bad things headed to colorado.....:wtf::

No sure what they were calling a big operation. However, you have to remember one thing. The state of Colorado can tell you that you can grow one plant of 50 million plants. As to the DEA all marijuana is against the law. Right now with Obama in office the DEA is turning a blind eye to mom and pop. However, when the next pres comes into office that can change at a drop of the hat.

I am willing to bet the DEA will step in if for no other reason just to let people know who is really in control and they have the final say so. Look at CA after all these years DEA still pops in and arrest growers now and then

[throatstick]

No sure what they were calling a big operation. However, you have to remember one thing. The state of Colorado can tell you that you can grow one plant of 50 million plants. As to the DEA all marijuana is against the law. Right now with Obama in office the DEA is turning a blind eye to mom and pop. However, when the next pres comes into office that can change at a drop of the hat.

I am willing to bet the DEA will step in if for no other reason just to let people know who is really in control and they have the final say so. Look at CA after all these years DEA still pops in and arrest growers now and then

makes ya wonder how they are getting all this info on people when the registery does'nt give out the info???

[throatstick]

now they will have a good reason to start pulling people and if anyone mmj or not has any on them makes ya wonder if they will now start following people home???

[denverbear]

I am not a grower but what does not make sense to me is the rule that disp. must produce 70 pct of its medicine...but a care giver cannot sell to a disp. any left ovewr or extra so how is the disp. supposed to supplement the other 30 pct. ?

[throatstick]

I am not a grower but what does not make sense to me is the rule that disp. must produce 70 pct of its medicine...but a care giver cannot sell to a disp. any left ovewr or extra so how is the disp. supposed to supplement the other 30 pct. ?

i guess they want them to go on the street and buy it from an undercover leo....you know cause this bill is about the people that voted on mmj.all they wanted to do is put it back in our hands......wow this shit makes me sick...

[cowgirl1]

I am not a grower but what does not make sense to me is the rule that disp. must produce 70 pct of its medicine...but a care giver cannot sell to a disp. any left ovewr or extra so how is the disp. supposed to supplement the other 30 pct. ?

They are allowed to buy the remaining 30% from there competation "other dispencaries" Tell me that is no a freaking joke

[cowgirl1]

i guess they want them to go on the street and buy it from an undercover leo....you know cause this bill is about the people that voted on mmj.all they wanted to do is put it back in our hands......wow this shit makes me sick...

Your 100% this bill did not but hurt 99% of the people involved with Marijuana. It helped the gov and the big money backed dispencaries. It did nothing but hurt mom and pop, the caregivers and the patients and in the long run will cost the state millions in tax revenue

[TheReleafCenter]

I am not a grower but what does not make sense to me is the rule that disp. must produce 70 pct of its medicine...but a care giver cannot sell to a disp. any left ovewr or extra so how is the disp. supposed to supplement the other 30 pct. ?

The biggest issue is that patients need 100% of their medicine afforded to them by the constitution. This is like if you went to a pharmacy with a prescription for 100 valium, but they only gave you 80 because they had to sell the other 20 to another patient. Does not make sense.

[davemw]

Looks like my grow -op plans are canned then. I had hoped to be able to produce small quantities of high quality bud for up to 8 patients then sell the rest to the dispensaries. Being that it would be a home grow operation, I'm even more out.

Here's whats against me now:
Broomfield will not allow dispensaries. SO I assume if i try to get a Lic to grow in my home, it will be shot down for "good cause"
Even if I could grow, I now have nobody to sell my extra crop to.

I think of the mom and pop growers as micro brewers in beer. It's always better beer. The people care more about what they are making then the mass producers. Thats why I'm willing to pay a little more for a 6pack. Also with a micro brew, you sometimes have to look at a few different places to find it stocked.

The laws need to be written to allow "micro - growers" to produce and sell to dispensaries. Patients should be allowed to choose where their MMJ comes from and how it has been cultivated.


I think the smarter move here would have been to set up an organization to test MMJ and qualify a crop for Medicinal purposes. If the crop passes, it would then be weighed and taxed by crop yield. Not that i like the idea of taxing the shit out of us, but I can see that the State is trying to figure out how to make a buck here too.

[ThaiBuddhaMan]

....I think the smarter move here would have been to set up an organization to test MMJ and qualify a crop for Medicinal purposes. ....

The key word there "smarter" - we're talking about the government & politicians - don't think they're "smarter" than anyone

YouTube: The island of Guam tips over! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNZczIgVXjg)

[dedliug]

dave, you are in broomfield?

you know who jerry peters is dont you? North Metro Drug Task Force Commander and the guy busting more home grows in the metro area than any other.

not a good climate for any mmj biz in the north metro area

[Dorje113]

dave, you are in broomfield?

you know who jerry peters is dont you? North Metro Drug Task Force Commander and the guy busting more home grows in the metro area than any other.

not a good climate for any mmj biz in the north metro area

Agreed. I'm glad I didn't buy there last year. Be careful in Broomfield.

[davemw]

Actually, I talked with a neighbor who is part of the NMDTF. He explained that as long as I had Licenses to cover what I was growing, I'd be fine if they knocked on my door. I was also planning to set up a pretty sweet grow op with all work and electrical done to code. My goal WAS to have a 100% legit operation going. Well at the state level at least.

I have a feeling people getting busted are doing stupid shit to attract attention and not playing by the now obsolete laws...

6 plants per patient - 3 veg, 3 bloom with licenses to match should keep you clear. Good filters and not having people come to you house all times a day for their meds should keep you outta trouble.

[lampost]

Actually, I talked with a neighbor who is part of the NMDTF. He explained that as long as I had Licenses to cover what I was growing, I'd be fine if they knocked on my door. I was also planning to set up a pretty sweet grow op with all work and electrical done to code. My goal WAS to have a 100% legit operation going. Well at the state level at least.

I have a feeling people getting busted are doing stupid shit to attract attention and not playing by the now obsolete laws...

6 plants per patient - 3 veg, 3 bloom with licenses to match should keep you clear. Good filters and not having people come to you house all times a day for their meds should keep you outta trouble.

You've already broken rule #1 it sounds like! Be careful my man....

[throatstick]

You've already broken rule #1 it sounds like! Be careful my man....

i agree wow i would not grow.... no wait i would move......

[HighPopalorum]

Broomfield sucks. You don't want to LIVE there, no matter what you're thinking now. I'm sure Broomfield has charms that are not readily apparent, but I hate it there. Broomfield is a big, smelly, crowded strip mall.

[TheReleafCenter]

Actually, I talked with a neighbor who is part of the NMDTF. He explained that as long as I had Licenses to cover what I was growing, I'd be fine if they knocked on my door.

This is what I've heard consistently. People who are getting busted are playing outside the plant limits, thinking they're "close enough" or aren't going to get caught. I have little sympathy for those who can't grow in compliance with Amendment 20. It's so simple it's silly.

EDIT: LOL @ High. I lived in Arvada/Westminster the first five years I was out here. Now that I'm in the Highlands, I can't ever see going back.

[davemw]

anyway.... thanks for the opinions on where i bought my first home. I'll keep them in mind hahah

if you're following the laws, you should have nothing to hide. I'd rather hear it from the horses mouth the through the forums on the inter-googles.

[throatstick]

anyway.... thanks for the opinions on where i bought my first home. I'll keep them in mind hahah

if you're following the laws, you should have nothing to hide. I'd rather hear it from the horses mouth the through the forums on the inter-googles.

to bad the horses mouth is only 1 and is hardly someone i'd take for face value.the bad part is it won't be the forums or intergoogle that shows up at your door in the middle of the nite...

[TheReleafCenter]

anyway.... thanks for the opinions on where i bought my first home. I'll keep them in mind hahah

if you're following the laws, you should have nothing to hide. I'd rather hear it from the horses mouth the through the forums on the inter-googles.

If I could afford to buy a home, it definitely wouldn't be in the Highlands. ;) Good luck with your grow, it sounds like you're doing it right.

[telephone]

I'd rather hear it from the horses mouth the through the forums on the inter-googles.

lol. I think its called the "da interwebz" now. There in no fuvking horse's mouth anymore bty.

Let's all get on board with the semantics. :jointsmile:

[davemw]

to bad the horses mouth is only 1 and is hardly someone i'd take for face value.the bad part is it won't be the forums or intergoogle that shows up at your door in the middle of the nite...

Sounds like you've bee burnt before so i'm going to assume you're a little jaded. I frankly trust the guy, he's not just a guy I know, but someone who has a key to my place and I have a key to his. no need to knock, come on in and check the plant to license count.

[davemw]

lol. I think its called the "da interwebz" now. There in no fuvking horse's mouth anymore bty.

Let's all get on board with the semantics. :jointsmile:

No way! it's the intergoogles! I know it's true, I read it on urban dictionary!

Urban Dictionary: intergoogle (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=intergoogle)

haha I'm an IT guy so i have to keep up on this shit. :thumbsup:

[telephone]

Well then, I stand corrected.

I must be getting old.

lol :jointsmile:

However interwebz does have three more entries:

Urban Dictionary: interwebz (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=interwebz)