Dispensaries already lowballing growers

[ShadySadie]

I was asked by a dispensary that wants to team up with my grow operation if I would accept $140 and oz.!! He tried to convince me that the larger groups in this vertical structure will drive prices down real low.

Any other growers getting this kind of lowball offer for meds???

[Klonzinc]

I was asked by a dispensary that wants to team up with my grow operation if I would accept $140 and oz.!! He tried to convince me that the larger groups in this vertical structure will drive prices down real low.

Any other growers getting this kind of lowball offer for meds???

ALL GROWERS PLEASE;

It is time we tell them to f off, this is insane, 250.00 is a fair price for quality aA bud, anyone disagreeing with that can kiss my ass, most are now only paying 200, and that is a joke as they sell it for way more, and do not give me the overhead bullshit, we all have it and we all work hard, at a 140 oz I can not even grow.

GIVE IT BACK TO THE PEOPLE AND THE MOM AND POP SHOPS, SCREW THE BIG DISP. ROLE MODEL

[Colodonmed]

ALL GROWERS PLEASE;

It is time we tell them to f off, this is insane, 250.00 is a fair price for quality aA bud, anyone disagreeing with that can kiss my ass, most are now only paying 200, and that is a joke as they sell it for way more, and do not give me the overhead bullshit, we all have it and we all work hard, at a 140 oz I can not even grow.

GIVE IT BACK TO THE PEOPLE AND THE MOM AND POP SHOPS, SCREW THE BIG DISP. ROLE MODEL
I feel that this is just the beginning, I am not a grower, just a concerned patient that is worried that so many of us will not be able to afford our medicine. I wish you growers well in the coming times, but I think it will get quite a bit worse before/if it gets better. Thanks for your hard work and good luck

[Kartel]

I was asked by a dispensary that wants to team up with my grow operation if I would accept $140 and oz.!! He tried to convince me that the larger groups in this vertical structure will drive prices down real low.

Any other growers getting this kind of lowball offer for meds???

LOL who told you that??

Obviously a shop run by businessmen not growers...

so many of these shops, they lobbied for the bill, cause they think it is oh so easy to grow good meds.

No self-respecting grower will associate with a place that already assumes they know how this will all turn out in practice to such an extant they already want to rape their grower. And electricity prices go up next month.

Do you get a percentage of the dispensary? I might go 200$ if they kept legal with a %.

[cowgirl1]

Do NOT do it!! Part of this new bill that is killing the mom and pop places was back by big dispencaries and with big money backing trying to control and own the market "push mom and pop out". They are trying to do what wal-mart did to all the little people.

[GratefulMeds]

I feel that this is just the beginning, I am not a grower, just a concerned patient that is worried that so many of us will not be able to afford our medicine. I wish you growers well in the coming times, but I think it will get quite a bit worse before/if it gets better. Thanks for your hard work and good luck

You should be concerned because if this actually does go into effect that is exactly what will happen, the price of Medicine will skyrocket.:wtf:

[Klonzinc]

Do NOT do it!! Part of this new bill that is killing the mom and pop places was back by big dispencaries and with big money backing trying to control and own the market "push mom and pop out". They are trying to do what wal-mart did to all the little people.

I agree, if all growers and patients went back to the underground it would force changes, I would rather give my meds to patients for the wholesale price I give it to disp's. for, anyone wanting that feel free to hit me up just check the contact page at klonzinc.com, my site will only be there for 30 more days then I am going to be forced to shut down. I will not contribute my time, money, or meds to a government, only patients from now on!!!!!!!!!!!

[mouthmeetsoap]

I have a few friends who have been told that the going rate is no more than 200 dollars a zip here. This is a beautiful medication that takes time, money, and effort to make, not machine made SHIT that destroys your liver. I work at a hydroponics store, and this hobby has become unreal in popularity. Unfortunately, just like everything else, it is an industry. I hate to say it, but most of the people in this industry are money-driven. Where I grow 6 little gals in a tent as a hobby, they have warehouses full of plants to make money. With the rapid popularity jump in growing, I give it 5 years before wal-mart has their own section with ballasts, nutrients, and hoods. They know where the money is.
I know every node on my girls, and truly appreciate the plant. Must be hard to do with 100+ plants in a warehouse.
With a mass of plants it's also easier to sell it cheaper. This probably isn't going to change. Sell to your patients or friends and leave the dispensaries to mass-growers. Only way you'll make anything close to what you want.

[ThaiBuddhaMan]

...250.00 is a fair price for quality aA bud, anyone disagreeing with that can kiss my ass, most are now only paying 200, and that is a joke as they sell it for way more, and do not give me the overhead bullshit...

Guess I need to kiss your ass, I disagree...
250/oz might be ok for some people and for some strains but for sativas that seem to take like 6 months or more to finish (accounting for the cure time too) - 250 isn't even going to come close to covering my incurred cost & overhead!

[lampost]

.....takes time, money, and effort to make, not machine made SHIT that destroys your liver. ....Where I grow 6 little gals in a tent as a hobby, they have warehouses full of plants to make money.
I know every node on my girls, and truly appreciate the plant. Must be hard to do with 100+ plants in a warehouse.

So true. I've seen other say it but I think there is a curve of quantity grown vs. quality of herb. And at a certain point... when you get above a certain number of plants/size of operation the quality takes a hit. I think when you're growing a smaller number of plants you can really give the individual attention to each plant and get a better result.
I think this is misunderstood a lot. I even saw a dispensary post on here something about their excitement for the warehouse grows and the big money's ability to use new technology to create "high-tech" grows...:wtf: Herb has been growing for 1000s of years. High-tech?

[Adamkadmon]

Are you serious turn people into the DEA...You do know what that makes you? I mean those growers at those big warehouses have familys, why would you want to destroy anyone else's life..Those people will go to prison if/ when raids occur. Please calm down before you do anything this utterly stupid..

Oh yeah and for what it's worth, this bill puts me out of a job, and says that not of good moral character to be a caregiver( marijuana felony)..So I have every reason to be upset about it's passing.. Why doesn't everyone just grow their own( those that can) and you could really put a hurt on their pockets.. Give herb away for free, this plant responds to the energy it's given and if it's grown with $$ signs in mind, I think that the plants quality will suffer as a result..NOBODY wants mass produced commercial grade garbage, the people who can provide quality medicine @ a fair price will be all right ..:jointsmile:

I'm really looking forward to this bill being shutdown by the courts Funk. You deserve to be able to continue what you are doing. I think we can find a way to keep the fingers funky. I wish I could grow my own, just don't have the room. :jointsmile:

[Klonzinc]

Guess I need to kiss your ass, I disagree...
250/oz might be ok for some people and for some strains but for sativas that seem to take like 6 months or more to finish (accounting for the cure time too) - 250 isn't even going to come close to covering my incurred cost & overhead!

Exactly, did not think I needed to point out every small detail, just as good but hermied weed around 200.00 would be fair, I will make sure I include the complete breakdown of cost for each strain, my bad...............ROFLMA:rastasmoke:

[throatstick]

ALL GROWERS PLEASE;

It is time we tell them to f off, this is insane, 250.00 is a fair price for quality aA bud, anyone disagreeing with that can kiss my ass, most are now only paying 200, and that is a joke as they sell it for way more, and do not give me the overhead bullshit, we all have it and we all work hard, at a 140 oz I can not even grow.

GIVE IT BACK TO THE PEOPLE AND THE MOM AND POP SHOPS, SCREW THE BIG DISP. ROLE MODEL

agreed 110% i offer it to them for 250 to 275 per bottom line.if one offers below that i laugh at em.sounds like whoever told you that shady does'nt plan to stay around and is trying to low ball everywhere they can to get as much money as possible b4 they skip town....

[throatstick]

Guess I need to kiss your ass, I disagree...
250/oz might be ok for some people and for some strains but for sativas that seem to take like 6 months or more to finish (accounting for the cure time too) - 250 isn't even going to come close to covering my incurred cost & overhead!

this is true also i stick to mostly heavy inddy's or hybrid with inddy doms.but i do know what ya mean with the pure to heavy sats.

[throatstick]

So true. I've seen other say it but I think there is a curve of quantity grown vs. quality of herb. And at a certain point... when you get above a certain number of plants/size of operation the quality takes a hit. I think when you're growing a smaller number of plants you can really give the individual attention to each plant and get a better result.
I think this is misunderstood a lot. I even saw a dispensary post on here something about their excitement for the warehouse grows and the big money's ability to use new technology to create "high-tech" grows...:wtf: Herb has been growing for 1000s of years. High-tech?

i'd be happy with 32 plants total really.the 5 patient deal i don't mind all that much cause im happy with 30 or so plants the problem i do have is not allowing us to work together or atleast service each others patients as needed i e "between harvests"type of thing.the thing is i think they have us in a catch 22 cause they know a real grower that knows what they are doing is going to produce more than what 5 patients will use in a month.they know most are setup on an atleast 2 month cycle few people on a small scale have a 3 room setup to go to 1 month cycles,

so on a 2 month cycle to keep that cycle running on par you will have to cut all of your crop down sure you can let some go a week or more over but that stops new plants from going 12/12"plant count rules".so really if you go by the law that would mean you would be having to throw away alot of your harvest 5 x 2oz per= 10 oz at any given time here.but if we go by the law there would be no way to stay on track and stay within dry limits per patient.which would then leave your patients high and dry the next 2 months waiting on the crop again.see what they have done here???? bottom line there is no way to stay legal and keep your patients supplied with meds here.

being that the patient is only allowed to have 2 oz's at a time there is no way for them to be able to stock up meds in any way even if they wanted to by all you had for that crop.i believe they know this and leo is foaming at the mouth knowing this and knowing there is no way to keep a patient supplied with this bs law.think about it......

yes i know the whole leave the meds on the plant and chop as needed thing.but 1 you can only do that for so long b4 quality starts to suffer,2 you run it so long that at the end somewhere there will be a 2 month gap to thwere no one has any meds.

the only way i could see doing it would be a perpetual but alot of people don't have that kind of space for 1 and 2 it would be a pain in the ass to try to know exactly how many plants to do at a time to keep patients happy and to not waste any.it's like being handed a stick with crap at both ends here it's bs.

[funkfingers]

Pretty sure as soon as you chop it down it's then considered usable medicine..
So the real kicker is what defines usable, because I know when most grows get raided and they add up the #'s to get weight, they will weigh plants whole/wet/with rootballs/count leaves and stems as herb..Hey look another Grey area:thumbsup: I really worry for these large ops as they are opening themselves up for the dea to raid these 100+ plant grows (that they know exactly where they are BTW)

If something cannot be done to stop this bill in it's tracks, I'm all for some kind of a patient/caregiver network..Still trying to figure out what the hell you're supposed to do if you yield more than your allowed amount..throw it away? can it be donated to people who cannot afford their meds? I guess you could just turn it in super concentrates, man 2oz of oil would last me a long time..

In relation to what this thread is really about:D your herb is worth whatever someone will pay for it.end of story, just like any other goods. If it's worth what you think it is then someone will buy it..if not might want to think about repricing your goods. anywhere in the 225-250 range is fair for quality.. If you didn't take the time to dry/cure properly, please do not come and try to pass your laziness on to others..If your product is something that you would be happy to purchase yourself , you will have no problems whatsoever finding people, that are eager to take it off your hands
sorry for the long winded rant..

fUnK:rastasmoke:

[funkfingers]

Pretty sure if all the rumors of stanley are true he'll get his on his own..
Karma works in mysterious ways..


Might be time to hold on to your prized genetics folks..Last thing I want is these clowns flooding the market with watered down P.M. infested versions of strains, that many of us have risked our freedom to obtain, and maintain the genetics.

Many I know who are being forced to go back underground, are the ones who have the potential to do the most good..At least I won't ever have to step foot in one of these huge MMJ centers, I feel terrible for those that will have to.. God is it possible for our government to not fuck something up!! ( trick question at this day in age I know)

[Klonzinc]

Pretty sure as soon as you chop it down it's then considered usable medicine..
So the real kicker is what defines usable, because I know when most grows get raided and they add up the #'s to get weight, they will weigh plants whole/wet/with rootballs/count leaves and stems as herb..Hey look another Grey area:thumbsup: I really worry for these large ops as they are opening themselves up for the dea to raid these 100+ plant grows (that they know exactly where they are BTW)

If something cannot be done to stop this bill in it's tracks, I'm all for some kind of a patient/caregiver network..Still trying to figure out what the hell you're supposed to do if you yield more than your allowed amount..throw it away? can it be donated to people who cannot afford their meds? I guess you could just turn it in super concentrates, man 2oz of oil would last me a long time..

In relation to what this thread is really about:D your herb is worth whatever someone will pay for it.end of story, just like any other goods. If it's worth what you think it is then someone will buy it..if not might want to think about repricing your goods. anywhere in the 225-250 range is fair for quality.. If you didn't take the time to dry/cure properly, please do not come and try to pass your laziness on to others..If your product is something that you would be happy to purchase yourself , you will have no problems whatsoever finding people, that are eager to take it off your hands
sorry for the long winded rant..

fUnK:rastasmoke:

I was advised by our lawyer that we should only caregive for 5 or less, the thing here is we have additional plants for 3 of those 5, and according to him; under 5 patients and you will not be on radar, also if a patient has a reccomendation for more on the original app then grow those plus your normal 30, and trust me I have had tremndous response from other patients who have no caregiver and or removing thier caregiver and already looking for places other than dispensaries to buy, if we network together we can put all of this back into a lot of patients hands. We trade product list and possibly product for product to keep everyone in stock and happy. Just a thought, shit I remember getting my first license in 01 and had no trouble finding patients to sell to, lol, of course that was when overgrow.com was around and the board was a little easier to use with pm and all.

[throatstick]

I was advised by our lawyer that we should only caregive for 5 or less, the thing here is we have additional plants for 3 of those 5, and according to him; under 5 patients and you will not be on radar, also if a patient has a reccomendation for more on the original app then grow those plus your normal 30, and trust me I have had tremndous response from other patients who have no caregiver and or removing thier caregiver and already looking for places other than dispensaries to buy, if we network together we can put all of this back into a lot of patients hands. We trade product list and possibly product for product to keep everyone in stock and happy. Just a thought, shit I remember getting my first license in 01 and had no trouble finding patients to sell to, lol, of course that was when overgrow.com was around and the board was a little easier to use with pm and all.

yup but only thing is if we got caught working together what would we be looking at law wise? i would'nt doubt the leo's to send 1 of their own in to get a card only to pose as one of us.no need to think they would go by the law now cause they never have. thats the bad part is they are making us group into 5's and we cannot deal with anyone else that part is total bs.that would really leave alot of people left out there that will have no choice but to make the dispensaries their caregiver.what a racket they have created....

[starter09]

Just a thought, shit I remember getting my first license in 01 and had no trouble finding patients to sell to, lol, of course that was when overgrow.com was around and the board was a little easier to use with pm and all.

The reason I didn't get a card until last year was that I knew no caregivers knew no way to contact any. Now I'm scuffling trying to find space in my tiny apt to set up a mom/clone grow. It was hard enough finding room for my small tent, I'd planned on meeting my needs from clone grows. Now I feel totally screwed. We need some sort of contact method for caregivers/patients to hook up but they've made that illegal, haven't they?

[CovertCarpenter]

...is sometimes hard to take, but I'd rather the government-issued fig-leaf than no protection at all. I kind of look at my Health Canada card the same way that John Cleese in A Fish Called Wanda was instructed to look at the bobbies in the cell of his new client...

It's my "Pigs fuck off, please" card. I sorely wish that I didn't need such a thing.

I am a great believer in the Powers of the Free Market, though. Were it full and truly legalized, I know that in that free (or mostly free) market, there will be room for the w4ll-M4rtz, as well as the mom-n-pops who turn out connoisseur stuph (like mesef).

The Last Thing I want is MORE godd'mn gub'mint reg'lashion.

Some people are happy with Micky'Dees. Some want Filet Mignon.

And some sum'sabiches want FM @ Md's prices...

Sigh :) Let the Free Market sort it out.

[lampost]

And some sum'sabiches want FM @ Md's prices...

:detective1:

[ShadySadie]

Great idea, Klonzinc! Everybody seems to like Craig's list, but I fear it is too public. We need an underground website that can be found by word of mouth only.

Does the bill say anything about Caregivers being able to deliver? If not, then we can set up a bonded delivery service for Caregiver product to be delivered to patients.

I do know the bill prevents actual "co-ops". Two Caregivers cannot team up to share the same patients.

Any of you ever mail grows to patients?

[Psycho4Bud]

I just cleaned up some bullshit on the DEA here and let me inform ya all just once; ANY more comments about turning ANYBODY in will result in an immediate and possibly permanent ban!!! I just got done with my bullshit after being busted so these type of comments REALLY bite me in the ass right now.:mad:

Have a good one!:thumbsup:

[funkfingers]

I'm confused as to why my comment was mod'd ..:rastasmoke:

[TurboALLWD]

I'm confused as to why my comment was mod'd ..:rastasmoke:

Me too, my whole post was deleted. :rasta:

[Psycho4Bud]

I just cleaned up some bullshit on the DEA here and let me inform ya all just once; ANY more comments about turning ANYBODY in will result in an immediate and possibly permanent ban!!! I just got done with my bullshit after being busted so these type of comments REALLY bite me in the ass right now.:mad:

Have a good one!:thumbsup:


I'm confused as to why my comment was mod'd ..:rastasmoke:


Me too, my whole post was deleted. :rasta:

My position on the subject was made quite clear. I will say that both of your responses completely condemned such actions but there was still mention of the post besides links the post in question. Since I'm unable to edit posts, I did the next best thing.

I was busted do to an anonymous letter so I hope ya all understand; ANY mention of turning somebody or organization in for growing kind of burns my ass at this time and I'm sure that feeling won't fade anytime to soon.:mad:

Have a good one!:thumbsup:

[khyberkitsune]

Guess I need to kiss your ass, I disagree...
250/oz might be ok for some people and for some strains but for sativas that seem to take like 6 months or more to finish (accounting for the cure time too) - 250 isn't even going to come close to covering my incurred cost & overhead!

My grow totals down to about $20-30/oz of AA-quality, that's for most indica and sativa strains (that includes electricity for the air pump and air circulation and timers as well.) I'd have to wonder what equipment you're using.

[funkfingers]

I completely understand, I just to recently went through a bunch of bullshit, because of a narc...cowards.:rastasmoke:

[Dorje113]

My grow totals down to about $20-30/oz of AA-quality, that's for most indica and sativa strains (that includes electricity for the air pump and air circulation and timers as well.) I'd have to wonder what equipment you're using.

Def. depends on system and nutes, I've seen people spend incredible amounts of $$ on organic hydro systems and other odd growing methods.

I just put 'em in dirt, re-use the dirt (this is a secret to high quality and yields out of dirt), feed them guanos, worm castings and not so much on the expensive liquid nutes. I'm figuring around $10 / oz, NOT INCLUDING LABOR. Labor is a big part of it, and is worth far more than co2, electricity, and nutes combined.

Labor is a large expense, especially if you have a small system. Mine is tiny, just 3 plants, so labor for me comes out to maybe $75-$100 / oz if I want to be reasonably compensated. So, lets just call it $100/oz for parts and labor. Going by general rules of business, I need to double the cost of production, so I need at least $200 / oz wholesale.

$200 / oz wholesale is just my number, and I've been gardening since '94. I don't need to spend very much time or money relative to most growers with less experience and/or more complicated systems. So, those who think this is easy money need to think again. It's not as lucrative as some might think, and not everyone is capable of coming up with product worth selling for top dollar. This makes top end ganja more like fine wine, and we should expect to be paid more for it, but we do not. Certainly not in proportion to it's quality. I think there needs to be even more differential in price, I see a lot of lower quality stuff that should be a lot cheaper in dispensaries...

[ThaiBuddhaMan]

My grow totals down to about $20-30/oz of AA-quality, that's for most indica and sativa strains (that includes electricity for the air pump and air circulation and timers as well.) I'd have to wonder what equipment you're using.

My personal time is where the majority of the costs are incurred. I look at it as a part-time job, not just a hobby. My regular full-time job pays me a hourly wage and I use that hourly wage to calculate my labor costs, since I could choose to work more at my full-time job instead. Fertilizer, electricity, water, equipment and real property overhead are just the start of costs incurred. But you're right a hobbist should only be spending approximately what you posted.

[khyberkitsune]

My personal time is where the majority of the costs are incurred. I look at it as a part-time job, not just a hobby. My regular full-time job pays me a hourly wage and I use that hourly wage to calculate my labor costs, since I could choose to work more at my full-time job instead. Fertilizer, electricity, water, equipment and real property overhead are just the start of costs incurred. But you're right a hobbist should only be spending approximately what you posted.

Ah, but I'm not a hobbyist. Labor, etc included, I spend practically nil time on my systems. No automated stuff, just well-set systems that pretty much run themselves. The only times I need to pay attention are during my weekly res changes (some plants drink so slowly and eat so little that I go two weeks for those) where I check my airstones and then refill with nutes. Twenty minutes tops for 12 plants in varying stages.

But I do see what you mean by labor costs. Doing DWC means heavy lugging!

[pappabear]

Sorry to be the one to tell ya, but the price of medicine is dropping and will continue to drop. The more legal it becomes the lower the price becomes. Collectives alone do not set the price of marijuana. Collectives, Growers, Patients & the government set the price. You can complain all you want about businessman type collectives but growers are also trying to make a buck for themselves. If you want good quality low cost medicine, grow it yourself. Growers, you want a better price for your hard work, open up your own collective. :rasta:

[throatstick]

My personal time is where the majority of the costs are incurred. I look at it as a part-time job, not just a hobby. My regular full-time job pays me a hourly wage and I use that hourly wage to calculate my labor costs, since I could choose to work more at my full-time job instead. Fertilizer, electricity, water, equipment and real property overhead are just the start of costs incurred. But you're right a hobbist should only be spending approximately what you posted.

yea cfl style i could see it but not using 1k's,indoors that is. say you go small,2 1k setups,2 4ft t5's,bulbs,hps,mh,hoods,most people don't know shit about electric so to do it proper they would have to call someone in.timers,pumps,stones,nutes,hangers,clamps,panda film,maylar,ducting,fans,carbon filters,light controller,room or tent,sealing the room,on and on.

all the talk about i grow in soil so i have no costs is misleading at best,go try buying the soil it takes to grow it's not cheap either,then you still have to add diffrent nutes to that it's not just throw some seeds in soil walk away and months later there ya go.ya have bone/blood meal,fish,worm castings,guano's the list goes on far from free.and if you are indoors like most have to be the whole i grow in soil so i have very lil cost can take a hike.just for the basics i listed above start up cost if you do it at home and don't have to go somewhere else would be around 5 to 6 k.thats just to start up.

to me soil is more work and alot more of a mess to deal with.anyone that says other wise is crazy in their minds.having to tote soil back and forth tracking shit in and out so on. then lets not forget labor which i have to say thai that not to just base it off of your wage at work. cause as you should know or anyone that has been in the world at allyou know any high risk job pay quite a bit more than alot of wages out there.not only do we have the labor part but it is a very high risk.feds still have it out for us and robbers too both are equal in that dept of risk.


b4 i was hurt on my job "sub contractor" i was bringing home anywhere from 1500 to 2k per wk. im used to making close to 8k per month. that was a low to mid risk type of job.i did'nt risk getting robbed or my door knocked down by feds.

besides all that tho hey khyberkitsune i'll drop all im doing and make you my caregiver for 20 an oz of top aa buds.when can we meet up?i need around 4 to 6 oz per wk cause i only cook with it tho.im sure with how cheap you can grow it tho you should be able to supply that lil bit no prob right?let me know...:jointsmile:

[Dorje113]

around 5 to 6 k.thats just to start up.

to me soil is more work and alot more of a mess to deal with.anyone that says other wise is crazy in their minds.having to tote soil back and forth tracking shit in and out so on.

You can spend a lot more than $5-6k, too. I'd consider that a minimum.

My soil system is easier and less work, and less mess than any hydro. system I've ever seen. It also produces better quality and yields. Wow, better call my shrink. :(

Why do you "tote" soil anywhere? Once it's in place, leave it there. It only needs to be moved once and never again... Like a fine Port wine, it gets better with time... :)

[throatstick]

You can spend a lot more than $5-6k, too. I'd consider that a minimum.

My soil system is easier and less work, and less mess than any hydro. system I've ever seen. It also produces better quality and yields. Wow, better call my shrink. :(

Why do you "tote" soil anywhere? Once it's in place, leave it there. It only needs to be moved once and never again... Like a fine Port wine, it gets better with time... :)

well when you add on or add rooms you would need more.+ i don't care to keep compost in my room.sun is a good thing:thumbsup::thumbsup:

i still don't see how you could say it's alot cleaner than hydro? dirt cleaner than water? how?

[throatstick]

since people want to start hating on me for no reason then go ahead and hate on this...so anyways

alil side project,flipped to 12/12 2 weeks after clone.2 weeks into 12/12 now.alittle training too..done with the extra plants i had cause the way i grow they get big so i did'nt have enough room to run these so i did this instead to mess around.start the mumbo jumbo talk kk?:stoned:

gunna be nothing but solid bud throughout.nice tight packed noding going on...

[puntacometa]

since people want to start hating on me for no reason then go ahead and hate on this...so anyways

alil side project,flipped to 12/12 2 weeks after clone.2 weeks into 12/12 now.alittle training too..done with the extra plants i had cause the way i grow they get big so i did'nt have enough room to run these so i did this instead to mess around.start the mumbo jumbo talk kk?:stoned:

gunna be nothing but solid bud throughout.nice tight packed noding going on...

Beautiful.
:thumbsup:

[senorx12562]

I feel exactly the opposite. I will stay underground until weed is like tomatoes. One needs no fig leaf if one never leaves the basement. $250 per oz. for all my customers, regardless of quantity, or legality. I have "patients," but I'm ultimately out there on my own, and don't give a shit.

[throatstick]

I feel exactly the opposite. I will stay underground until weed is like tomatoes. One needs no fig leaf if one never leaves the basement. $250 per oz. for all my customers, regardless of quantity, or legality. I have "patients," but I'm ultimately out there on my own, and don't give a shit.

as popeye said im not a doctor but i sure am loosing me patients....:jointsmile:

[Dorje113]

since people want to start hating on me for no reason then go ahead and hate on this...so anyways



IDK what I was thinking. Dirt sucks and is too much work. ;)

[throatstick]

IDK what I was thinking. Dirt sucks and is too much work. ;)

thats nice too.was that with only 2 weeks veg from clone too? thats a nice plant either way tho.what strain? i'll post my real plants when they are close to being done.like i said these i posted was a quick just for fun throw some really young plants in the flower room last min type of thing.

[SmokeyBandit]

I feel exactly the opposite. I will stay underground until weed is like tomatoes. One needs no fig leaf if one never leaves the basement. $250 per oz. for all my customers, regardless of quantity, or legality. I have "patients," but I'm ultimately out there on my own, and don't give a shit.

After last week Im starting to no longer give a shit either Im so sick and tired of the bureaucratic bullshit.

[Dorje113]

Why was my post removed?

[throatstick]

Why was my post removed?

no worries the thread had to be cleaned alil.guess your post got mixed in somehow.but i don't think it was ment to be deleted tho.

[TheReleafCenter]

If you're curing for 6 months and trimming like you're OCD, sure, charge $250/$300/whatever you want! You're growing luxury buds, and I'm sure someone will want to pay that.

But you can grow medical grade buds for less. That's the challenge, in fact; maintain quality while increasing yields. Do it faster. Go, go, go!

While there is a demand for that "High-Times-centerfold" nug out there, there is a higher demand for lower cost meds. Seems like that's where patients are flocking, not to connoisseur growers.

[khyberkitsune]

"besides all that tho hey khyberkitsune i'll drop all im doing and make you my caregiver for 20 an oz of top aa buds.when can we meet up?i need around 4 to 6 oz per wk cause i only cook with it tho.im sure with how cheap you can grow it tho you should be able to supply that lil bit no prob right?let me know..."

Even better I'll show you how to roll an assembly-line SoG.

[TheReleafCenter]

SoG! :thumbsup::jointsmile:

[SmokeyBandit]

One other thing I was thinking about today is that High End Medicine will always be in demand and I really dont think it will really drop substantially in price.But regs will drop in price to about 20-30 1/8 in the near future.What leads me to believe this is the fact that it's already happening not in CO but CA I just spoke to a friend of mine in Lake County who agrees that there is a ton of outdoor medicine that still hasnt been unloaded from last year and it's down to 1500 p and no one wants it.Why because there are so many growers flooding the market with high quality indoor meds.Has this caused a substantial drop in dispensary prices?Not really 3.5 eights are still going for 50-60.



Smokey

[GratefulMeds]

One other thing I was thinking about today is that High End Medicine will always be in demand and I really dont think it will really drop substantially in price.But regs will drop in price to about 20-30 1/8 in the near future.What leads me to believe this is the fact that it's already happening not in CO but CA I just spoke to a friend of mine in Lake County who agrees that there is a ton of outdoor medicine that still hasnt been unloaded from last year and it's down to 1500 p and no one wants it.Why because there are so many growers flooding the market with high quality indoor meds.Has this caused a substantial drop in dispensary prices?Not really 3.5 eights are still going for 50-60.



Smokey

$60.00 for an 1/8, not fair to patients. when we start charging $500.00 or more an OZ. we are no better then Big Pharma ripping off Grandma!

[copobo]

prices will be going way up at the dispensaries, you wait and see!

and THAT is when the rest of the card holders will find out what's happened.

I am officially under my state limit (patients and plants) with the new regs. This shit will play out, but for now, I suggest everyone play it close and keep it safe.

[Colodonmed]

prices will be going way up at the dispensaries, you wait and see!

and THAT is when the rest of the card holders will find out what's happened.

I am officially under my state limit (patients and plants) with the new regs. This shit will play out, but for now, I suggest everyone play it close and keep it safe.
I hear that!

[TheReleafCenter]

I think prices are going to fall, and fast. There are a lot of places that will need to close out inventory they can't account for, so that'll go cheap. Then you have the fact that dispensaries are going to be growing however many plants they want, so there's going to be a huge influx of MMJ.

[SmokeyBandit]

prices will be going way up at the dispensaries, you wait and see!

and THAT is when the rest of the card holders will find out what's happened.

I am officially under my state limit (patients and plants) with the new regs. This shit will play out, but for now, I suggest everyone play it close and keep it safe.

Im not jacking up my prices or stopping freebies to my patients I have one more spot to fill and thats it.The one thing thats gonna suck is not having enough plant counts to still give away large amounts to people that need it but cant afford it for me thats what its about.

[puntacometa]

Guess I need to kiss your ass, I disagree...
250/oz might be ok for some people and for some strains but for sativas that seem to take like 6 months or more to finish (accounting for the cure time too) - 250 isn't even going to come close to covering my incurred cost & overhead!

:thumbsup:

[cowgirl1]

Sorry to be the one to tell ya, but the price of medicine is dropping and will continue to drop. The more legal it becomes the lower the price becomes. Collectives alone do not set the price of marijuana. Collectives, Growers, Patients & the government set the price. You can complain all you want about businessman type collectives but growers are also trying to make a buck for themselves. If you want good quality low cost medicine, grow it yourself. Growers, you want a better price for your hard work, open up your own collective. :rasta:


I agree when marijuana become more legal the price will drop. However, if you really think about it is becoming less legal. This new bill they claim will shut down 80% of the dispensaries, it will limit caregiver to 5 patients etc. To me that is not making it more legal it is making it more illegal in a round about way.

What will happen is they will shut down all the mom and pop places, then the big money backed dispensaries "you know the ones that put money into Romers elections pocket under the table" will take over like wal-mart did then all the smaller stores that are left and caregivers that are left will be pushed out.

You must be thinking, well they cannot push me out....Well as my grandfather use to say.....money talks and bullshit walks.

Once they take over the vast majority of it, then grease a few more hands some time down the road, they will pass another bill, it will say something like. If you are a grower/caregiver you have to apply for zone, have to pass fire safety inspections, health dept inspections $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Or you have to have some type of medical training "something simple" maybe a year or two course to be able to give out medication. Because if you really think about it, they are calling marijuana a medicine and we all know to get medicine that is prescribed by a DR you have to be a college grad with about 10 years of college under you belt.

So, yes with the right laws they could put all of us out of business with a stroke of a pen and never change the Constitution

[throatstick]

Sorry to be the one to tell ya, but the price of medicine is dropping and will continue to drop. The more legal it becomes the lower the price becomes. Collectives alone do not set the price of marijuana. Collectives, Growers, Patients & the government set the price. You can complain all you want about businessman type collectives but growers are also trying to make a buck for themselves. If you want good quality low cost medicine, grow it yourself. Growers, you want a better price for your hard work, open up your own collective. :rasta:

how much you think it will drop too?

[puntacometa]

[quote=Dorje113]
I just put 'em in dirt, re-use the dirt (this is a secret to high quality and yields out of dirt),

You reuse your dirt? My used dirt has plenty of salt residues. How do you amend it? I'm very curious about this.


feed them guanos, worm castings and not so much on the expensive liquid nutes. I'm figuring around $10 / oz, NOT INCLUDING LABOR. Labor is a big part of it, and is worth far more than co2, electricity, and nutes combined.

Labor is a large expense, especially if you have a small system. Mine is tiny, just 3 plants, so labor for me comes out to maybe $75-$100 / oz if I want to be reasonably compensated. So, lets just call it $100/oz for parts and labor. Going by general rules of business, I need to double the cost of production, so I need at least $200 / oz wholesale.

Try wrangling 60+ plants in a 400 sq ft. greenhouse/vegging room setup with 20 x 1000W HID's in the middle of a winter with snowdifts 10' high around your grow structure. Free File Hosting Made Simple - MediaFire (http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=a8afe5e99c9867b1ab1eab3e9fa335caa26c73d4 11b5badb)
;)


$200 / oz wholesale is just my number, and I've been gardening since '94. I don't need to spend very much time or money relative to most growers with less experience and/or more complicated systems. So, those who think this is easy money need to think again. It's not as lucrative as some might think,

Utility bills for my indoor grow were running around $1300.00 per month. Add labor (a full time situation with 60+ plants) and fertilizers to this and you've got a pretty hefty overhead.


and not everyone is capable of coming up with product worth selling for top dollar. This makes top end ganja more like fine wine, and we should expect to be paid more for it, but we do not. Certainly not in proportion to it's quality. I think there needs to be even more differential in price, I see a lot of lower quality stuff that should be a lot cheaper in dispensaries
:thumbsup:

[khyberkitsune]

"You reuse your dirt? My used dirt has plenty of salt residues. How do you amend it? I'm very curious about this."

Get a cheap soil testing kit that can tell you levels of NPK in your soil, and adjust from there. Cannabis is quite beneficial for most any soil it grows in. You can always flush out the salts from the soil as well before re-amending with whatever yhou choose.

[Dorje113]

"You reuse your dirt? My used dirt has plenty of salt residues. How do you amend it? I'm very curious about this."

Get a cheap soil testing kit that can tell you levels of NPK in your soil, and adjust from there. Cannabis is quite beneficial for most any soil it grows in. You can always flush out the salts from the soil as well before re-amending with whatever yhou choose.

Yes, it's all about keeping the soil balanced and happy. Most people do not, and by the end of the grow it's too far out of balance and they just chuck it and buy more. If you do it right, it never needs to be flushed either.

When you learn to take care of the dirt, all these ($$$) fungus and bacterial additives become pretty funny... not only do people spend cash on new dirt, which isn't nearly as good as old dirt, but they are throwing out all these beneficial microbes in the old dirt too, only to pay lots of $$$ on these additives to re-introduce them. In my experience, the first run on new dirt isn't as good as subsequent runs, whether you use these ammendments or not.

There is also no reason to spend lots of $$$ on "high end" nutes, although I do use liquid ferts in the water at every watering. In general, they are only used at fairly low levels to fine-tune things.

Feel free to pm me for more info....

[TheReleafCenter]

Once they take over the vast majority of it, then grease a few more hands some time down the road, they will pass another bill, it will say something like. If you are a grower/caregiver you have to apply for zone, have to pass fire safety inspections, health dept inspections $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

I'm going to go out on a limb and say I'm pro fire safety inspections. :jointsmile:

[pappabear]

It is not uncommon for collectives to pick up medicine from growers at $168oz. Just like real estate, your property or buds are worth what someone is willing to pay for it. Oh, and the medicine is AAA beautifully trimmed nugs. so why in the world would they pay much more.

If your thinking of getting into the "growing business", think twice and very carefully. there may not be as much $$ as you think. Growing is not cheap, growing takes a lot of time and it does not always turn out the way you thought it would.

Good advise, grow for yourself, don't quit your day job. you'll save money and smoke way better medicine than can be found in a collective. :rastasmoke:

[pappabear]

I agree when marijuana become more legal the price will drop. However, if you really think about it is becoming less legal. This new bill they claim will shut down 80% of the dispensaries, it will limit caregiver to 5 patients etc. To me that is not making it more legal it is making it more illegal in a round about way.

What will happen is they will shut down all the mom and pop places, then the big money backed dispensaries "you know the ones that put money into Romers elections pocket under the table" will take over like wal-mart did then all the smaller stores that are left and caregivers that are left will be pushed out.

You must be thinking, well they cannot push me out....Well as my grandfather use to say.....money talks and bullshit walks.

Once they take over the vast majority of it, then grease a few more hands some time down the road, they will pass another bill, it will say something like. If you are a grower/caregiver you have to apply for zone, have to pass fire safety inspections, health dept inspections $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Or you have to have some type of medical training "something simple" maybe a year or two course to be able to give out medication. Because if you really think about it, they are calling marijuana a medicine and we all know to get medicine that is prescribed by a DR you have to be a college grad with about 10 years of college under you belt.

So, yes with the right laws they could put all of us out of business with a stroke of a pen and never change the Constitution

You have a good point. It sounds like you follow the laws and ordinance. I live in SoCal/South Bay area. LA and LB have passed ordinances to limit and control MMJ dispensaries. This will have the following effect for the following reason:

60-75% of the collectives, if not more, will be forced to close.
Competition, which drives down the price (patient prices) of medicine will be cut
Collectives will be forced to grow their own medicine shutting out any and all other growers to this "market"
Collectives will charge more for the same medicine because their supply will be controlled, monitored and limited
the "street market" will absorb only so much of the left over medicine until the price of medicine is a joke.
remember, a boat load of people now grow with more and more new growers everyday. say, 90% of them quit growing because they can't get it. that means that there will be at least 10% more growers cranking out medicine than there are today with zero collectives being able to pick up from them.
result, the price of medicine, meaning the price that a grower can get (wholesale) for their medicine will continue to drop and then rebound somewhat.
just look at the last 3 years, the price of medicine has dropped. Great, and I mean GREAT!! OG cost only $40 an eighth.

Great time to be a collective in the right location with all the proper paperwork. Bad time to be a grower trying to make a living (but not for some):pimp:

[pappabear]

here's an idea, If a consortium of growers came together and started a collective they would be able to provide medicine to patients at a lower donation and pay their light bills, rent, and cost of all the equipment on time.

[throatstick]

I think prices are going to fall, and fast. There are a lot of places that will need to close out inventory they can't account for, so that'll go cheap. Then you have the fact that dispensaries are going to be growing however many plants they want, so there's going to be a huge influx of MMJ.

let me know when ya start the 50 an oz any strain.i'll be by..

[throatstick]

I'm going to go out on a limb and say I'm pro fire safety inspections. :jointsmile:

so you are for the gov walking into homes as they plz ?next thing ya know everyone knows where you are at and what you are doing?wow hummmm b4 it was abit foggy but the fog is clearing out.im starting to see clearly who is who in the zoo....sure if it was fed legal.sure if cops treated a break in at your house as fair as the rest instead of looking at you as an evil drug dealer..good luck with you're 500/1000 plants grows....

[TheReleafCenter]

so you are for the gov walking into homes as they plz ?next thing ya know everyone knows where you are at and what you are doing?wow hummmm b4 it was abit foggy but the fog is clearing out.im starting to see clearly who is who in the zoo....sure if it was fed legal.sure if cops treated a break in at your house as fair as the rest instead of looking at you as an evil drug dealer..good luck with you're 500/1000 plants grows....

Firemen do fire inspections. I'm not for the government walking into homes as they please.

[lampost]

NOBODY should be allowed to inspect your personal grow!

A 1000W only pulls 9.8 Amps (120V)!! That's less than my power-saw (12.8 Amps) and about the same as a clothes washer!

Personal grow are NOT a fire risk, even in an old house. As long as one does their research it's OK. The problem is we have idiots who don't. And we already know we can't go around protecting every idiot from themselves or we'd have laws regarding everything!

[Dorje113]

NOBODY should be allowed to inspect your personal grow!

A 1000W only pulls 9.8 Amps (120V)!! That's less than my power-saw (12.8 Amps) and about the same as a clothes washer!

Personal grow are NOT a fire risk, even in an old house. As long as one does their research it's OK. The problem is we have idiots who don't. And we already know we can't go around protecting every idiot from themselves or we'd have laws regarding everything!

It's true, and we already have laws defining what level of business is ok to run out of one's home. In most places, if the home is primarily being used as a residence and doesn't disturb the neighbors you'll be fine. I'm sure they'll define a square footage or plant count or both soon enough though.

I think there's definitely a problem with people blowing up a house and not even living there, but a family living in a house with 12 plants flowering in the basement shouldn't be an issue.

As far as people doing electric mods to their own house, it's not illegal, but it has to be done right or your insurance might not pay if you caused a fire. You could be sued if its a rental, I'd guess.

[throatstick]

Firemen do fire inspections. I'm not for the government walking into homes as they please.

wow someone lives in a dream world,you really think those firemen that are friends wil leo that are friends with dea won't say a thing?come on dude i know you have to be smarter than that...

[throatstick]

NOBODY should be allowed to inspect your personal grow!

A 1000W only pulls 9.8 Amps (120V)!! That's less than my power-saw (12.8 Amps) and about the same as a clothes washer!

Personal grow are NOT a fire risk, even in an old house. As long as one does their research it's OK. The problem is we have idiots who don't. And we already know we can't go around protecting every idiot from themselves or we'd have laws regarding everything!

yup the odd thing is you see these same people bitching about veggie growers that have been setting up hydro grows for along time now. now all of the sudden it's a big deal....i guess the "centers" won't be happy until all patients are forced to sign them as caregiver......

another thing thats funny is these same "center" owners/mgrs used to have to by from the dealer on the street way back when.never was a problem to them then....i call bs when i see it and the bullshit thats popping up on these boards is just that bs.the only 1 i have seen that seems to be true blue and what they really stand for and who they say they are is greatful meds.

[throatstick]

It's true, and we already have laws defining what level of business is ok to run out of one's home. In most places, if the home is primarily being used as a residence and doesn't disturb the neighbors you'll be fine. I'm sure they'll define a square footage or plant count or both soon enough though.

I think there's definitely a problem with people blowing up a house and not even living there, but a family living in a house with 12 plants flowering in the basement shouldn't be an issue.

As far as people doing electric mods to their own house, it's not illegal, but it has to be done right or your insurance might not pay if you caused a fire. You could be sued if its a rental, I'd guess.

yup and thats where the saying"knowledge is power" comes in.you should never jump into something if you have'nt done your research first.for those that don't that is their fault u or i should'nt have to suffer and be exposed for the ones that are dumb in the world...

[relaxalot]

It will be interesting to see how this all shakes out. I tend to think that the shops that do survive this mess will have trouble keeping up with demand. I suspect the ones that manage to stay afloat will produce less strain variety, and quality will suffer from the warehouse scale conditions. The stragglers will be out-competed and shut down by the big boys.

I also predict that A LOT of the extra meds from smaller-scale growers will end up back on the underground... I think it will be affordable, readily available to all, handcrafted, and varietal. I think that the amount available underground will, somehow, drive the development of some new mechanism by which caregivers get their overage into the hands of patients. Technically illegal, but effective. If patients want variety and quality, the underground may end up being a patient's most solid option. I see it generally decreasing patient census at dispensaries.

If this happens, I will feel bad for the local Colorado shop owners, while I will have no sympathy for the big box boys when their support of hb1284 eventually comes back to bite them on their collective asses.

It's just a speculative theory, but seems highly plausible to me.:rasta:

[cannamanibus]

I think you can look at my post when i joined and wanted to move to CO. asap and what-not. Also saying how that prices are going to drop b/c no matter what quality, some people aren't as greedy. I mean it sells illegally around the rest of this country for damn near the same price. It should sell for alot less, b/c i would be happy making $160 an o and runnin a grow, Still would be around 75% return. Compared to the old 300%.

[Dorje113]

I think you can look at my post when i joined and wanted to move to CO. asap and what-not. Also saying how that prices are going to drop b/c no matter what quality, some people aren't as greedy. I mean it sells illegally around the rest of this country for damn near the same price. It should sell for alot less, b/c i would be happy making $160 an o and runnin a grow, Still would be around 75% return. Compared to the old 300%.

True, but most products retail for 4-6x the cost of manufacture. I agree MMJ does not need to be one of them, especially if there is no middle-man. Dispensaries provide a nice, convenient service, but are charging a lot. I think the new bill, which allows dispensaries to grow as much as they want, may bring prices down. There are a lot of BIG grow ops going up right now as a result of the bill, way more than the dispensaries can sell collectively, I'd bet. I'd also bet a lot of disp. grown weed will hit the black market too.

[Adamkadmon]

True, but most products retail for 4-6x the cost of manufacture. I agree MMJ does not need to be one of them, especially if there is no middle-man. Dispensaries provide a nice, convenient service, but are charging a lot. I think the new bill, which allows dispensaries to grow as much as they want, may bring prices down. There are a lot of BIG grow ops going up right now as a result of the bill, way more than the dispensaries can sell collectively, I'd bet. I'd also bet a lot of disp. grown weed will hit the black market too.


So I'm guessing dispensaries won't care about caregiver rights once this goes into affect? If they can grow as much as they want why would they need caregiver rights?

[Dorje113]

So I'm guessing dispensaries won't care about caregiver rights once this goes into affect? If they can grow as much as they want why would they need caregiver rights?

I believe they still do, but it's not a problem to get as many patients as needed to grow as much as they want.

[TheReleafCenter]

So I'm guessing dispensaries won't care about caregiver rights once this goes into affect? If they can grow as much as they want why would they need caregiver rights?

You still have to be designated as a "primary center" in the bill, with your grows tied to that patient count. The question is how they will transfer primary caregivers to primary centers.

[Adamkadmon]

You still have to be designated as a "primary center" in the bill, with your grows tied to that patient count. The question is how they will transfer primary caregivers to primary centers.


Ok, I get it now...their is no upper limit on patients for centers, thus they can grow as much as they want..how is that different than before? So, is there no provision for automatic rollover from primary caregiver to primary center? Also, are patients forced to choose a "center" and visit only them or will it play out the same as before?

[TheReleafCenter]

Ok, I get it now...their is no upper limit on patients for centers, thus they can grow as much as they want..how is that different than before? So, is there no provision for automatic rollover from primary caregiver to primary center? Also, are patients forced to choose a "center" and visit only them or will it play out the same as before?

Is isn't much different on the dispensary side. There isn't a rollover provision yet, the Department of Revenue will have to tackle that. If you want to visit centers then you need to name a primary one, however, you can visit any center just like you can now.

[cowgirl1]

Ok, I get it now...their is no upper limit on patients for centers, thus they can grow as much as they want..how is that different than before? So, is there no provision for automatic rollover from primary caregiver to primary center? Also, are patients forced to choose a "center" and visit only them or will it play out the same as before?

Yes, the dispensary can grow as much as they want...So they think.

So, let me tell you what is going to happen and you can mark my words on this. This new bill will put a few dispensary out of business. Then the Wal-mart dispensary are going to take over and grow large amounts. The DEA is going to raid a few of them with large plants counts to make an example of them. The Dis will spend 50,000 to 100,000 on lawyers to help them in federal court. The growers will go to jail for 5 years, the owners will get fined and slapped on the wrist, put on probation. The gov will seize there stores, money and maybe there homes. The growers/dis will back their plant count down till things blow over.

Off and on during this time the price will go up and down.

The caregivers can only have 5 patients. The gives them 2 choices. Either throw away the dry materail that is above the amount allowed or sell it underground.

The bill has done nothing but hurt the caregiver and the patients at this point and time. Later on it will cost some of the dis money and problems also.

One other thing this bill has done, it will fuel the illegal marijuana trade which will hurt a lot of people and cost the state tax revenue.

[throatstick]

Yes, the dispensary can grow as much as they want...So they think.

So, let me tell you what is going to happen and you can mark my words on this. This new bill will put a few dispensary out of business. Then the Wal-mart dispensary are going to take over and grow large amounts. The DEA is going to raid a few of them with large plants counts to make an example of them. The Dis will spend 50,000 to 100,000 on lawyers to help them in federal court. The growers will go to jail for 5 years, the owners will get fined and slapped on the wrist, put on probation. The gov will seize there stores, money and maybe there homes. The growers/dis will back their plant count down till things blow over.

Off and on during this time the price will go up and down.

The caregivers can only have 5 patients. The gives them 2 choices. Either throw away the dry materail that is above the amount allowed or sell it underground.

The bill has done nothing but hurt the caregiver and the patients at this point and time. Later on it will cost some of the dis money and problems also.

One other thing this bill has done, it will fuel the illegal marijuana trade which will hurt a lot of people and cost the state tax revenue.

you know at the start of this i was for the dispensaries i was on their side.i thought this was going to hurt them and i felt bad for them.but over the last few days and with the help of the releafcenter im starting to see how and why this bill passed.they all sat on their hands hoping this would pass.everyone i called acted like it was no biggie now i see why.to them we are the middle man.they have effectively knocked the caregiver that really helps patients out of the loop.all the while acting as if they were upset when asked.the only one i have seen against this is mark.the rest of em sound like they would sell their soul to make a buck all the while acting as if they give a shit.i mean if you have to sit their and explain all the "compassion" you have as a shop then there is something wrong.

all i can say at this point is what goes around comes around.but this time it will be coming around via dea and patients seeing their true colors....so live it up while ya can

[TheReleafCenter]

you know at the start of this i was for the dispensaries i was on their side.i thought this was going to hurt them and i felt bad for them.but over the last few days and with the help of the releafcenter im starting to see how and why this bill passed.they all sat on their hands hoping this would pass.everyone i called acted like it was no biggie now i see why.to them we are the middle man.they have effectively knocked the caregiver that really helps patients out of the loop.all the while acting as if they were upset when asked.the only one i have seen against this is mark.the rest of em sound like they would sell their soul to make a buck all the while acting as if they give a shit.i mean if you have to sit their and explain all the "compassion" you have as a shop then there is something wrong.

all i can say at this point is what goes around comes around.but this time it will be coming around via dea and patients seeing their true colors....so live it up while ya can

We repeatedly asked our patients to contact their state officials and urge them to vote no on 1284.
We passed out slips to every patient who came in telling them how to contact the governor until it became obvious he was just going to sign it through.
We did blog entries and talked about it on radio spots.
We've gone out of our way to educate ourselves on this bill, where it can be challenged, and what it means for patients.
There have been four or five recent threads where we helped out people on this board answer their questions.
Do your homework on us before you start making scurrilous accusations, please.

[throatstick]

We repeatedly asked our patients to contact their state officials and urge them to vote no on 1284.
We passed out slips to every patient who came in telling them how to contact the governor until it became obvious he was just going to sign it through.
We did blog entries and talked about it on radio spots.
We've gone out of our way to educate ourselves on this bill, where it can be challenged, and what it means for patients.
There have been four or five recent threads where we helped out people on this board answer their questions.
Do your homework on us before you start making scurrilous accusations, please.

i remember when you were talking about it at first but now it seems like you are just fine with it and now going a step further adding even more things you would be "ok"with.what happened to all the stuff you were going to do with mark? all that just seems to have went to the way side cause i have'nt seen anything else about it?

[TheReleafCenter]

i remember when you were talking about it at first but now it seems like you are just fine with it and now going a step further adding even more things you would be "ok"with.what happened to all the stuff you were going to do with mark? all that just seems to have went to the way side cause i have'nt seen anything else about it?

What I've heard is that legal challenges to this bill are in motion. I'm going to have to file a civil suit that may not be resolved for years. This is what I've heard from Edson, The Corry's, CTI's panelists... and pretty conclusively. I'm still interested in what Mark has come up with to stay open, but from what I heard, it sounded like a home rule issue. Ned is a place where that could be really successful. In Denver? I don't know.

[lampost]

I've talked to most of the guys in ReLeaf at one point or another and they seem like good peeps! Don't hate on them for trying to get by and fighting for their investment. I know they started up with at least one grower on board and probably more, so they aren't one just one of these vendor-weed greed machines....

[hippichic420]

It will be interesting to see how this all shakes out. I tend to think that the shops that do survive this mess will have trouble keeping up with demand. I suspect the ones that manage to stay afloat will produce less strain variety, and quality will suffer from the warehouse scale conditions. The stragglers will be out-competed and shut down by the big boys.

I also predict that A LOT of the extra meds from smaller-scale growers will end up back on the underground... I think it will be affordable, readily available to all, handcrafted, and varietal. I think that the amount available underground will, somehow, drive the development of some new mechanism by which caregivers get their overage into the hands of patients. Technically illegal, but effective. If patients want variety and quality, the underground may end up being a patient's most solid option. I see it generally decreasing patient census at dispensaries.

If this happens, I will feel bad for the local Colorado shop owners, while I will have no sympathy for the big box boys when their support of hb1284 eventually comes back to bite them on their collective asses.

It's just a speculative theory, but seems highly plausible to me.:rasta:
I agree whole heartedly. All hail the return of the black market. The state is giving up billions in revenue from people MORE than willing to pay taxes, BEG to pay taxes, DREAM of paying taxes for what they love. There are VERY very few GOOD growers in this state... it takes YEARS to perfect the art YEARS and YEARS..... Patients will realize quality will prevail.
And I agree excess meds from small grows will leak into the underground market and patiens will eat it up. The novelty of going into a store and having 25 shitty strains to choose from that cost in some cases, three times more than what they have buying from the BM for decades. People are not dumb. Also a point I would like to make is that there are freaking 1000's of grows gong on with people wiht dollar signs in thier eyes, those people are already giving up cuz they will never make it. Warehouse grows will ALWAYS BE COMMERICAL. i have been to Amsterdam, I have seen it w my own eyes. There will always be a demand for quality and quality does not come from a 2000 plant grow. The thing with the BM is that only the true patrons who trully LOVE the plant where in the game, and making the game, ethicaly tolerable.

[hippichic420]

P.S i'm definately not for the return of the BM, would like all of us to operate legally, i'm just making observations.

[Dorje113]

I agree whole heartedly. All hail the return of the black market. The state is giving up billions in revenue from people MORE than willing to pay taxes, BEG to pay taxes, DREAM of paying taxes for what they love. There are VERY very few GOOD growers in this state... it takes YEARS to perfect the art YEARS and YEARS..... Patients will realize quality will prevail.
And I agree excess meds from small grows will leak into the underground market and patiens will eat it up. The novelty of going into a store and having 25 shitty strains to choose from that cost in some cases, three times more than what they have buying from the BM for decades. People are not dumb. Also a point I would like to make is that there are freaking 1000's of grows gong on with people wiht dollar signs in thier eyes, those people are already giving up cuz they will never make it. Warehouse grows will ALWAYS BE COMMERICAL. i have been to Amsterdam, I have seen it w my own eyes. There will always be a demand for quality and quality does not come from a 2000 plant grow. The thing with the BM is that only the true patrons who trully LOVE the plant where in the game, and making the game, ethicaly tolerable.

As a grower in CO since '93 I disagree a bit... mainly on the fact that dispensaries opening up has been a HUGE plus for patients. In the BM you know a guy that knows a few other guys and usually has a $hitty selection of weed that is sometimes good, sometimes bad. Now, there is more competition and prices are lower, patients are getting access to the strains they want and don't have to buy $hit weed because it's the only choice.

You say that "only the true patrons who trully LOVE the plant where in the game, and making the game, ethicaly tolerable." Thats not true at all either. I knew plenty of greedy as fcuk growers producing mediocre weed of $hitty NL and Big Bud, and bringing their $hit weed from CA that they can't sell there. Flooding the front range market with the $hit and selling more than any 10 dispensaries in town combined. When I asked "how can you do it?" all I get is ethically bankrupt excuses. These people will either have to grow good weed (and they probably couldn't even if they wanted to) or find a new occupation. Good Riddance to those a$$hats!!!

[hippichic420]

As a grower in Colorado since 95, I agree bro. Didn't mean to strike a cord just voicing my opinion. Thats why I don't usually post on these forums as I feel like people can just be SO mean with their responses.

With that being said, honey, my sister owns Herbal Connections. I'm not against the dispensaries its what I have worked for for 15 years! I just honestly thought it would be different, but I guess that's my ignorance. I did not forsee the demise of 20 plus of my family members existence, an existence they we have perfected for over a decade, as you have. That my friends will fall is what makes me sad. We should all have a fair shot in this game.... period. And the pro's would prevail be it CG or MMC
Your right as an end user you may get your meds from someone who got it from someone who got it from someone etc... and yes it may be crappy. But by golly gee... Colorado has some damn good DAMN GOOD (albeit few and far between) growers! ...and YES there are also money mongers who want to make money, grow shitty shit, drive to cali bring in crap. They look at a friend who grows and say 'wow i can do that'.... trust me i have seen it time and time and time and time again and let me tell you they never last long.....
I have taught MANY people to grow. MANY and maybe .5 percent kept with it. NOw we have EVERYONE who was to chicken shit to do when it was illegal are now doing it so there is now more shitty product around. My sister tells me she will get 27 vendors a day and 95% is crap! 95%!!!!!! All i'm saying is the BM weeds out the weasels a little. Are they still there yes !
And once again i'm wholeheartedly against the BM making a return. Just making an observation.

[TurboALLWD]

they all sat on their hands hoping this would pass.everyone i called acted like it was no biggie now i see why.to them we are the middle man.they have effectively knocked the caregiver that really helps patients out of the loop.all the while acting as if they were upset when asked.the only one i have seen against this is mark.the rest of em sound like they would sell their soul to make a buck all the while acting as if they give a shit.i mean if you have to sit their and explain all the "compassion" you have as a shop then there is something wrong.

all i can say at this point is what goes around comes around.but this time it will be coming around via dea and patients seeing their true colors....so live it up while ya can

You're not the only one that see's this for what it REALLY is. Almost all of the caregivers know, and it will sink into the patients once they loose their reasonably priced meds. Releaf center showed it's true colors refering to caregivers as delivering at their convenience and not having enough variety. Not all caregivers are bad, just like dispensaries. Once a patient finds a good strain that works, they want more of it, not a rainbow assortment of them to recreationally smoke. I guess one could say caregivers deal with a lot of the real patients and dispensaries deal with a lot of the recreational patients. :D Think about it, would a cancer patient that needs 3oz/mo rather pay a caregiver $200-250 an ounce or a dispensary $400? That's a no brainer, basically they can NOT compete with us so they found a way to shut us down almost all of the way.

The dispensaries are crazy to think patients that need a lot of medication are going to pay their ridiculous prices. I think most of the patients will buy it off the black market before reducing their amount of medication in half or more due to not being able to financially afford it. I willing to bet there will be a huge public outcry if truely sick patients are prosecuted for buying illegally.

I do believe the patients will be able to get away with it though! Theres simply too many of them to control each and every single one. And they most certainly deserve to get away with breaking this unjust law!!

[tutone]

High Country Caregiver has seen the prices in Breckenridge go down, dispensaries are selling for as low as $250 / oz to keep up with competition in slow season ie... no skiers.

Check out our site for all of the news and information in the High Country of Colorado for medicinal cannabis photos, surveys, news, and more. Jah Bless!

http;//www.highcountrycaregiver.com

[TurboALLWD]

High Country Caregiver has seen the prices in Breckenridge go down, dispensaries are selling for as low as $250 / oz to keep up with competition in slow season ie... no skiers.

Check out our site for all of the news and information in the High Country of Colorado for medicinal cannabis photos, surveys, news, and more. Jah Bless!

http;//www.highcountrycaregiver.com

Yeah theres several dispensaries in denver selling for $250 / oz if you like smoking schwag, probably the same stuff in Breckenridge.

[throatstick]

You're not the only one that see's this for what it REALLY is. Almost all of the caregivers know, and it will sink into the patients once they loose their reasonably priced meds. Releaf center showed it's true colors refering to caregivers as delivering at their convenience and not having enough variety. Not all caregivers are bad, just like dispensaries. Once a patient finds a good strain that works, they want more of it, not a rainbow assortment of them to recreationally smoke. I guess one could say caregivers deal with a lot of the real patients and dispensaries deal with a lot of the recreational patients. :D Think about it, would a cancer patient that needs 3oz/mo rather pay a caregiver $200-250 an ounce or a dispensary $400? That's a no brainer, basically they can NOT compete with us so they found a way to shut us down almost all of the way.

The dispensaries are crazy to think patients that need a lot of medication are going to pay their ridiculous prices. I think most of the patients will buy it off the black market before reducing their amount of medication in half or more due to not being able to financially afford it. I willing to bet there will be a huge public outcry if truely sick patients are prosecuted for buying illegally.

I do believe the patients will be able to get away with it though! Theres simply too many of them to control each and every single one. And they most certainly deserve to get away with breaking this unjust law!!

agreed,i also think the centers were up in arms when those high ass state fees were going around.now that it looks like it's alot less"no one knows yet" now they are like heck if the fees are right then this is great and it knocks out all the caregivers at the same time. i think the thing they had the problem the most with was the state fees and agents coming in with guns to ck their shit.the people this will hurt the most is the patients and the caregivers that help those patients.

[Adamkadmon]

The dispensaries are crazy to think patients that need a lot of medication are going to pay their ridiculous prices. I think most of the patients will buy it off the black market before reducing their amount of medication in half or more due to not being able to financially afford it. I willing to bet there will be a huge public outcry if truely sick patients are prosecuted for buying illegally.


:jointsmile::stoned::jointsmile::stoned: Agreed.

But there are good shops out there...:jointsmile: