why won't my cuttings root

[Slappy95633]

why won't my cuttings root i am using this as a clone box Technology Garden Tutorial - Building your own homemade aeroponic cloning machine | Technology Garden (http://www.technologygarden.net/index.php/diy-tutorials/tg-tutorial-building-your-own-homemade-aeroponic-cloning-machine/) and i am using this for my directions to take the cuttings http://boards.cannabis.com/basic-growing/142258-clone-log-cloning-pics-using-master-kush-mom.html and i am still managing to get a 0% success rate.... the first time the water was just 75F water with Olivia's cloning gel and the mothers are a white widow and AK47 i took ten all ten died it pretty much just looked like the part under the top rotted and didn't even try to root i let them stay in there for about a month just to see. and then this time i decided to use super thrive in the water with there rooting concentrate for delicate plants and then put the rooting gel on the cuttings and it has been a week or so now and the tops of the plants look better than the bottoms and it looks as is its doing the same thing agen

[headshake]

are you using a humidity dome? clones transpire water and have no way of getting it back (no roots) so you need a super high (above 90% is good) humidity. try that and see what happens.

-shake

[the image reaper]

IF using the SuperThrive crap (editorial opinion :D), only use ONE DROP per gallon ... no kidding, it IS that concentrated, more can kill your seedlings ... secondly, cut your lights back, in brightness, not hours ... just use a single cfl or something like that ... without bright light, the plant can focus on root-building ... when the roots start appearing, you can bring the lights back up ... this seed-starting log I made, is also beneficial to cloning, in some instances - http://boards.cannabis.com/basic-growing/168393-100-germination-every-time-easy.html#post1967488 ... I really like the Rapid-Rooter plugs, and my bubbler setup ... they are excellent for cloning :thumbsup: ... happy gardening :smokin:

[Slappy95633]

this is what they look like a week and 2 days after taking the cuttings and putting into the clone box system they get this weird gel on the stem and turn this brown color

[uncleweed]

is that the top or the bottop of the plug?

If it is the bottom, then I am pretty sure the roots have to be in it.

If it is the top, then I am pretty sure, you have to leave some leafs so that your plant can feed using them.

[Slappy95633]

that was the bottom of the plug and what do you mean the roots have to be in it?? if your cloning then you don't have any roots till they form and that's the problem there not rooting there rotting i guess

[frostedwonder]

You do not have to have the stem in water to root. Bubbles bursting at water surface is enough to wet the air and stem between water level and top of cloner. How much light were they under? The brown stuff is most likely algae.

[Slappy95633]

You do not have to have the stem in water to root. Bubbles bursting at water surface is enough to wet the air and stem between water level and top of cloner. How much light were they under? The brown stuff is most likely algae.

no there not in the water the tub and watering system was cleaned with bleach and then rinsed with bottled water and that is also the water i was using with the super thrive added in. and they were under two two foot 20w shop florescent tubes... but i am using two 40wat 4 foot ones to grow all my little plants and that works fine and i have used those two 20w ones to grow plants before too though

[Duke420]

don't use bleach to clean anything, it leaves a film behind. Use peroxide at 1ml per gallon of water to do your cleaning. then add aquashield. I ran into the same problem you're having and the bleach was the culprit.

keep at it.

[altaholic]

Got a picture of your cloner? Is it lightproof? If not at 75+degrees you got algae/funk. what ph is your water? I recommend 5.6-6, others might disagree. Pitch the olivias and get dip and grow and you want your humidity to be 80%. good luck

[Slappy95633]

Got a picture of your cloner? Is it lightproof? If not at 75+degrees you got algae/funk. what ph is your water? I recommend 5.6-6, others might disagree. Pitch the olivias and get dip and grow and you want your humidity to be 80%. good luck

yeah it is lightproof i don't know what the ph is of my water i a a new grower and haven't gotten into that hole seen yet. yeah i was kind of thinking that the olivias gel was not helping either i would like to know if any one has used that because it hasn't worked in the clone box or just sticking the cuttings in the dirt either

[Slappy95633]

ok so i have cleaned the box with peroxide water and then filled it (i am sadly still using the olivias gel...no money...)i am also using a dome over the top but i didn't reduce light besides the dome has a very slight blue tint and we shall see how it goes i only took 5 so...

[Slappy95633]

ok so i have cleaned the box with peroxide water and then filled it (i am sadly still using the olivias gel...no money...)i am also using a dome over the top but i didn't reduce light besides the dome has a very slight blue tint and we shall see how it goes i only took 5 so...

[EvilCartman]

ok so i have cleaned the box with peroxide water and then filled it (i am sadly still using the olivias gel...no money...)i am also using a dome over the top but i didn't reduce light besides the dome has a very slight blue tint and we shall see how it goes i only took 5 so...

I reckon I'll chime in with my .02. :)

From the pics, I'd suggest that light intensity is part of the problem. It looks awfully bright, and the untrimmed fans, combined with the light intensity may be what's causing problems.

Would like to know if you have taken temp readings inside the dome and inside the res?

Don't fret about the Olivias gel stuff, it works fine. :thumbsup: I've also used Clonex powder with 100% success. (the powder will just drop off and settle in the bottom of the res.) :( Either way, the roots have come out in less than a week. The biggest problem I've had is too much roots. :cool:

FWIW, I don't mist the clones themselves, just the inside of the dome.

My advice... *Less light*, trim fans, keep temps ~70F, plug it in... and wait.

As far as the whole cloning thing goes, I am a Newbie for sure! :D I've made 3 cloning runs through my lil' home built unit without a hitch, though. First run, I paid critical attention to pH, temp, and all that. Pfft! Now.. tap water, a drop of Superthrive, mist the dome and walk away. ;)

[uncleweed]

Cartman,

Can you explain why you don't mist the clones themselfs? I usually do. Is it because the light magnification by drops of water can burn the leafs or is there something else?

Thanks

[EvilCartman]

Can you explain why you don't mist the clones themselfs? I usually do. Is it because the light magnification by drops of water can burn the leafs or is there something else?

No real reason. I just wasn't seeing any droopiness or yellowing, at all. The cuts stayed firm and green without any signs of needing it. I always used to give cuts a squirt when rooting in a peat-puck or soil. So far, the bubbler has kept 'em standing tall. :)

[Felixthecat]

this forum is from grasscity by a username "prayn4magnesium"

After years of my tried and true method I decided to hope on the band wagon and pick up an ez cloner 60 & 30 (both for testing, and shits and giggles). Unaware of exactly what the magic formula for success was I started to play. I tried so many traditional techniques and a few off the wall techniques too. I'm far from amateur and started to doubt my problem solving skills when the nut was finally cracked.

The system is releasing a fine mist into the chamber creating a rich air/water ratio. This is the cloners greatest strenght. Any gels or dips are limiting this rich ratio from entering the cut stem which delays results. So drop the dips and gels. Instead pick up some Root Excelurator (Not cheap but works great, saves time). Add .3 ml per liter of fresh clean water (pH before adding root excel to 6.3). People are gonna fight me on the pH range. it's true hydro/aero pH is best between 5.5-5.8 but thru trial an error I found 6.3 pH pops out roots 3-4 days faster.

Stick a temp probe inside one of the foam disc a few inches deep to get an acurate root zone temp. Keep temp of water at 71.6 for best results.

The ez cloner system is notorious for heating the reservior water above optimal levels. Once the water tempt starts to climb above 75 degrees the terrain becomes primed for bad bacteria to colonize. I found hydrogen peroxide sanitization limits the root excel compounds results pretty significantly. The best solution is to drop temp if getting too high with a timer. The best recycle time is 15 min on 15 min off. Lights should be 18 inches away. Clones need vary little light, less is more here.

Notes:

Tried several root compounds; Jump start, Olivia's, Clonex, Super Thrive, root tonics, root excelulator, and so many others. Root Excelulator by far works the best!

[Slappy95633]

thanks every one for the input i will say this that the cuttings already look better than they would they have not drooped at all and normally the stem in the box would have started to slightly turn brown but i will keep updating as it goes on.

[Slappy95633]

OK so the reading in the dome were 77F and 70% humidity which humidity is higher than the room that's for sure and i removed one of the two bulbs which was above it.

[headshake]

you need to keep humidity between 90-95%. the clones are transpiring water and have no way to replenish it (aka no roots). you temp at 77F is good. don't worry about the gel or powders or any of that stuff. i can clone just fine (100% success rate) with jiffy pellets. i just take the cut, pot it into a moistened pellet, put in a little rubbermaid box with saran wrap over the top. just try to keep it simple.

also, they definitely don't need all that light. they will do fine under a single CFL at a foot or so away. they aren't worried about growing foliage, they need to concentrate on roots. it normally takes a plant a little bit of time to start producing undifferientiated cells that turn into roots. don't fret.

also, like someone above recommended, cut the fan leaves in half. this helps with transpiratiion.


-shake

[Slappy95633]

OK well as of right know nothing has changed at all they still pretty much look like they did the day i took them so i don't know yet.... and i also cut the fan leaves on a couple to see if that would help in comparison to the not cut ones.

[Slappy95633]

OK so as of tonight it will be the end of the 9th day sens i took the cuttings and still nothing different from day one besides the leaves look a little droopy but not really

[stra8outtaWeed]

:jointsmile:do your self a favor and just get rapid rooters in a 1020 tray with a dome.

one thing i found in getting good success regardless of the method is to cut the stem under water with a clean razor! air bubbles happen on the end of the cutting not allowing it to take any moisture to form roots! that may be the problem!:smokin:

[DogtowN]

OK so as of tonight it will be the end of the 9th day sens i took the cuttings and still nothing different from day one besides the leaves look a little droopy but not really


They look good but I have a couple suggestions. It looks like you're using one of those cheap _X-MAS Totes_ They are not very good at blocking out light. It looks like there is a lot of light intensity too. Put those two things together and it might be whats holding them back. If you have not added something under the red cover to help block out the light then I guarantee that it's pretty bright inside. You don't need that much light to root them.

;)

[headshake]

:jointsmile:do your self a favor and just get rapid rooters in a 1020 tray with a dome.

one thing i found in getting good success regardless of the method is to cut the stem under water with a clean razor! air bubbles happen on the end of the cutting not allowing it to take any moisture to form roots! that may be the problem!:smokin:

or you can just cut it at a 45 degree angle.

-shake

[headshake]

my bad, too late to edit. what i meant to say is that cutting at a 45 degree angle helps eliminate embolisms.

-shake

[Slappy95633]

yeah i just peeked under the top and it is kind of bright in there so what should i do just spray paint the out side or something?

[headshake]

anything that will keep the light out. but it's unlikely that this is majorly impacting the rooting of your clones. what the light will do is increase the chances of getting algae in your res.

-shake

[maro69camaro]

Got a picture of your cloner? Is it lightproof? If not at 75+degrees you got algae/funk. what ph is your water? I recommend 5.6-6, others might disagree. Pitch the olivias and get dip and grow and you want your humidity to be 80%. good luck im glad i ran across this. i also built a very simaler setup but havent used it yet, but it is dark green and i thought ya no light will get in. after reading this i went and put my phone in video mode and put it in, closed it all up and just ran it under a 400hps and i must say wow. way to much light, the light just burns right thru and im sure it will discourage rooting. im going to fix this problem before i use it for sure.:thumbsup:

[Slappy95633]

yea ok so i don't have the time and money to continue to keep fucking with this clone box and the clones did not root. So i got some of those rock wool cubes and a tray with a humidity dome which is the way my buddy dose it and it works great so i guess we shall see how it goes. thanks for all of the advice and when i do get the money and try it again i will post new info.

[ShastaCoMan]

just box that cloner up and send it to me..,......ill show ya how to make it work right!

[NorCalShooter]

ShastaCoMan got banned because he got ripped off by the 'sponsor" seed company here, and when he spoke out about it, he got canned for knocking the sponsor........

you know what i find completely hilarious though?


the f*cking stupid ass mod who banned him (me) thought "oh, ill get him" , but he was to f*cking stupid to realize that he (me) had already created like 15 accounts on here from different email addresses and IP addresses, and he (me) can get on here and read and post whenever he likes....DOH!

he also didnt realize that he (me) was serious when he said he would hit every single solitary weed site he could and tell everyone what big pieces of shit that specific seed company (sponsor here) is.........

im sure as soon as he reads this, he will ban this username and email, BUT as i said, he (me) isnt really worried about that at all. i just posted this to let him know that no matter how hard he tries, he isnt going to get rid of me and everyone he (i) comes in contact with is going to know about that specific seed company. he (i) even went as far as to print over 400 fliers he (i) made and handed them out at 2 different 420 events sofar, plus everythings ready to hand them out to the one comming to the red bluff ca area this month.

now, wouldnt it have been SOOOO much easier dude just to get ahold of the admin and the seed company like he (i) asked? i wonder how much money and business ive costed them sofar. quite a bit i bet. they wuld have been well off to actually send his (my) shit out to him (me).