DWC setup help

[Kronz]

Just went and purchased two 14 gallon containers to start a dwc. This will be my first time growing hydro. I have been reading threads of how many plants i should put in each container but everyone has a different numbers.. I am going to use a 600watt hps system. I was thinking of 3 plants in each container, so 6 in all. how many plants can I fit under a 600hps? I am going to setup it up tomrrow and will add some pictures. But any help would be great.

[LOC NAR on probation]

We run 6 three inch netpots in a ten gallon tub. It really depends on how big they can get. Remember if you start at one foot they will end up two to three feet. A 600 watt light will cover a 5 x 5 area. If you go too tall then you will need side lighting to get under the canopy.

OH, and welcome. Come on in the water is FINE.

[SpaceNeedle]

We run 6 three inch netpots in a ten gallon tub. It really depends on how big they can get. Remember if you start at one foot they will end up two to three feet. A 600 watt light will cover a 5 x 5 area. If you go too tall then you will need side lighting to get under the canopy.

OH, and welcome. Come on in the water is FINE.

I would say a 600W light covers more like 3 x 3, and no more than 4 x 4
sn

[Kronz]

heres a couple pics. I just made 2 of these containers. 4 plants in each. I glued the airstones down with silicone, now just ready for some plants. I am not sure how much nutrients i need. Ive read over and over about nutrients but cant figure out how much i should put in. Im going to be using the General Hydroponics Flora series. So I change the water and nutrients every week is that correct? I mainly need to just figure out the nutrient info. How much ? and how often ?. I will be using tap water and using PH up/down to balance it out. So anyone with Nutrient info please help me. Thanks

[dejayou30]

I think you are definitely going to want more air stones, and make sure you have plenty of air moving through them, ie. nothing less than an industrial sized air pump, no Wal Mart fishtank air pumps, etc. You really need to churn the water in bins that big to avoid stagnant areas and rotten roots as a result of the stagnation. As for nutes, not so sure on GH Flora because I use organics. As for the number of plants per bulb, I've found it much easier to grow one big one under one bulb. Good luck! :thumbsup:

[Mother]

Hi Kronz,

Your pictures are a bit dark, but it looks like you have two airstones per bucket. I'd recommend four per bucket. Also, GOOD air pumps are a must! Like dejayou30 said, no Walmart junk. Go to an aquarium store and get some good dual output pumps, two per bucket. (That's one dual output pump running two airstones, so one airstone per output.) I like two dual pumps better than one quad because if one fails, you'll have some time to realize it before your plants' roots suffocate.

As for nutes, follow the directions on the label, only start at HALF strength and you can work up from there. A PPM/pH meter will be invaluable for this, so if you don't already have one, get one, period.

Yes, change your water once a week. You may be OK with tap water, or you may not be. The more chlorine in your tap water, the less likely it will work for you, but that's not the only nasty chemical they put in tap water, either. You'll find out pretty fast (a few days) if your tap water is suitable. If your temps are ok (65-75 F) and your pH and PPM are OK and you get root rot anyway (a slimy film that collects on the roots) then your water is bad.

DWC is really easy once you get the hang of it, like riding a bike. It seems really overwhelming at first, but once you catch on it's a breeze.

[Kronz]

thanks for the replies... Ya I am going to have to get better airstones. I went to Petsmart and picked those up. I also picked up airpumps, here is a picture of my airpump. should I get a better one? I also just picked up a hanna 3 in 1 tester..

[tinytoon]

GH makes an airpump that they advertise as the only one on the market made for Hydro. has 4 adjustable outlets that can run 3 stones per outlet for a total of 12. Pump is suppose to be extremely quiet and runs around $70. as for nutes read Latewood's Legacy which is a sticky in Hydro section. According to the Hydro shop I go to the regular GH 3-part is best for Hydro and the flora nova series is best for soil, atleast that is what I was told :thumbsup:

[dejayou30]

I have never seen those, but since it says "up to 40 gallon", I am assuming its talking about fish tanks. My opinion is that a fish tank air pump is not going to cut it in a bin that big.

I run something like this: http://www.hydroponicgardensupplyonline.com/wp-content/plugins/wp-shopping-cart/product_images/PU45L.jpg

Its not that big, but moves a ton of air. I have a 19W and a 36W one. The 19W one supports 6 air stones and the 36W does 10. The 36W one is a bit overkill for my setup, but its better to have more air than you need than not enough. The 19W one was like $40 and the 36W was around $70. Your air supply to the roots is the most important element in DWC, so don't slack on it. :thumbsup:

[disrupt86]

GH makes an airpump that they advertise as the only one on the market made for Hydro. has 4 adjustable outlets that can run 3 stones per outlet for a total of 12. Pump is suppose to be extremely quiet and runs around $70. :thumbsup:
i have this is pump,its the quad manifold.i wish i would have spent my 70 bones on 7 dual outlet pumps.oh yeah i had to any ways.:D

[disrupt86]

what i have done in the past worked really well it requires,2 dual outlet pumps per dwc container.i ran 12 inch strips at the bottom like u have done,and at the verry top of the container have drilled 2 1/ inch holes in between the net pots.picked up some of the smaller one inch true blue air stones,those sit about 6 inches deep from the lid down.that way u have the 2 at the verry bottom keeping the water moving and 2 that are pretty much your main source of oxygen for your plants.

[Kronz]

hey guys. so today went to the hydro store and picked some stuff up. A new air pump and new air stones along with a new hps. Friend came over and we built a pretty cool growbox 5x3x8 i think thats how u say 8 anyway its pretty big. I will take some pics tomorrow when there is light. I need some input on a few things. but here are a few pictures. I am going to have 3 airstones in each container, should this be enough? also should I redo the tops of my bucket ? the pots seem close together. Should I spread them apart more? I have a 14 gallon container with four 5" inch pots

[Kronz]

and should I use hydroton clay pebbles? lava rock or coco?

[Kronz]

Just finished my grow setup today, here are a few pics of it. Its 8 ft tall so there is lots of room for growing. Going with the clay pebbles I guess. Just waiting on another airstone from the hydro store to go inside my bucket. hey only had 5 at the time and i'm going with 3 in each container. I will be making a log of my grow because im going to need some help from you guys, since this is my first hydro grow.. Just still worried about the whole nutrient thing.

[tinytoon]

keep in mind you cant use all 8 ft of vertical space, your light can only go so high.

[Kronz]

I am aware of that... I was just saying my room is 8ft tall. There isnt too much help on these boards like back in the day.. Where did everyone go? GC.com? I have been looking through the threads and I think I should have gone with individual buckets instead of a rubbermaid container. Guess ill just wait till next grow...

[Kronz]

also anyway I can make a resevoir connecting to my two 14 gallon containers? if so how big should it be and how do I set it up. PLease anyone with info help me out. thanks

[MMJLabRat]

I think the tubs you made are great. 14 is a bit large cuz you have to figure out how much water you will actually need to hit the baskets and then add nutes accordingly to that much water. i have STORE bought tubs with 4 pots and they are 5 gallon serilite tubs. You should see the White Widow!.

Oh i use fish tank air pumps and ( Ill match smoke ANYTIME WIT ANYONE)
but then too i have a coffee can DWC system with net pots in gallon cans, and one air pump per can on them.

Hydroton good I use it too, you can reclaim most of it after each grow. just bleach them out and rinse very well ( i soak mine a few days in ozone enriched water)

[disrupt86]

hey small piece of advice,keep your air pumps above your containers if your not going to use check valves,if the power goes out or for some odd reason the pump starts struggling 2 keep up "like u get a smal hole on the inside diaphram" then the water will back feed and destroy your pump. thats just not good for anybody :)

[disrupt86]

also anyway I can make a resevoir connecting to my two 14 gallon containers? if so how big should it be and how do I set it up. PLease anyone with info help me out. thanks
if u would like to turn your system into a verry simple recirculating system with a rez i can help u with that,it allows u to keep the exact ppms in both containers and a fresh supply of water"so its not just sitting there in its own container. i did have a link some were for a self topping rez but i cant seem to find it in my favs.ill keep looking. u could also look into buying one from general hydro,i dont think there 2 expensive,and the plumping on them i belive is simple,just one bucket on top of the next with a float.when the bottom bucket"wich is linked 2 the rest of your system gets 2 low the float trips and more water is relased into the system,once the float valve has the right amount of water to keep it raised then the top controller will close.it works just like a toilet does.honestly though with only 2 container's its just going to cause more problems than taking the time to swap out your 2 reservoirs.i do think that a recirculating system would be beneficial 2 your grow.

[Kronz]

ya if u could help me out with a recirculating system that would be so great. and thanks for the heads up on the air pump.

[smokeOnE702]

u should try the EBB n FLOW system. is eazy to build and is cost only 20 dollar to do the whole set up. go to wal mart get 2, 10 gallon tubba wear, then go to the hydro store and get the Flood n Drain tube $5, sub pump that goes into the water 12.99 dont for get the tube for this and 6 , 5ich net pot 1each. and your good to go. start building. put all the net pot in to the tubba wear and u will see 2 open spot in the middle of them, to drill to put the flood n drain tube. then sit in on the of the other tubba wear which is going to b your reservoir . is pretty ez and u dont have to do shit but watch your tomato grow. i think is better then DWC because the PH keep changing fast . and the water alway get eatten up quick to. faster then the ebb and flow or grow.

[disrupt86]

the most important thing about this is that all of your containers are leverl with each other,other wise some buckets will be higher than the rest and it wont work right,basically your going to flood your shit.its verry simple though and this is a list of things your going to need.
1.another container exactley like the 2 that u have now.
2.a small water pump like the active aqua 160 gph"for a 15 gallon rez"
3.lets say 15 ft of vinyl 1/2 tubing "get the stuff from the hydro store its super flexable and wont leak,its abou 25 cents a foot.
4.about 20 ft of 1/4 vinyl flexable tubing also at the hydro store.
5. 2 half inch t fittings
6. 2 half inch on off valves
7.4 half inch grommets for the t fittings and on-off valves also at the hydro store.
8.a drip manifold,since u have only 2 buckets u can pick up the 4 head for a couple of bucks at home depot.
---------------
--------------- now on the 2 containers that u have, drill a half inch hole out of the center on both at the bottom of the container.u want the valve to almost be at ground level.install the 2 gromets"use spit to slip them in".
--put the 2 T fittings into the container
--.make sure your containers are spread apart the length that u want them.this will be the length of your tubing your going to cut and attach the 2 together.u should now have one exposed end on each of your t fittings.
-----now with your new container drill 2 half inch holes side by side about 2-3 inches apart,these also need to be drilled near the bottom portion of the container,u want your holes 2 be the same heighth as on your 2 first buckets.
---install the 2 gromets and the 2 on off valves.
---take your remaining 1/2 inch tubing and cut it in half.
---attach your tubing,from one on/off valve to the first t fitting,the buckets have allready been attached 2 each other in the first step.
----take the second piece of tubing and attach it to the last on/off valve.
----connect this hose to the only t fitting left.
----if u did this right,u have 3 containers linked together by tubing forming a circle.
----now put your water pump into the new bucket
----attach your drip manifold,
----attach your 1/4 drip tubing to the manifold
----cut a verry small hole into the lid of the new container"big enough for your 2 1/4 lines to poke through.
---- pull the lines through the lid and put one into each container.
----make sure that the water pump is close to the on/off valves.it will help draw the water from the other 2 buckets.
----start filling the new container with water,all of your buckets should keep the same water level because they are all conected.if there not your system is not level.u need to fix this before u turn it on or your going to flood.
----turn the pump on and watch it for about 20 min,looking for any leaks and to make sure that the water levels are not getting any higher than the new controller bucket....one thing i would do is keep the controller bucket outside of the grow room.if u would like 2 make sure its working right u can add food coloring 2 both of the grow containers and see if it ends up in the rez"this will also allow u to tell how long it takes to refresh your buckets with recirculated fresh water..... im sorry if this is really jumbled up but i hope it helps and isnt to hard to follow.my speach and people skills are kinda funky ohh and one last thing,keep the manifold in the bucket,incase it leakes"they all do"this way your leak is contained inside the controller....welllllll good luck.this shouldnt take more than a half hour to assemble.hope it works out for u .

[Kronz]

thank you so much disrupt. Do you have skype or yahoo? I wanna make sure i do this right.. Its my birthday today so I will be doing all this tomorrow... Your directions sound pretty simple. And thanks again man. Also Do I still use my airpump with the airstones in the containers?

[Kronz]

nevermind...about the question above, i figure the airstones stay in the containers.

[disrupt86]

oh,no worries.but nope i dont have any of those,if u run into trouble just ask here,im pretty much lurking around here a couple of hours a day.couple of other thing's i forgot to mention. it really wouldnt hurt to throw an extra air stone in the rez and also whal your at the hydro store picking up the fittings and tubing u might want to get an extra number of ft of the 1/2. it can some times be difficult to change your water with out having to disconnet every thing,so what u can do when u want to drain your system,take the drip system manifold off of the water pump and stick your half inch onto it.u can lead it to a bath tub or a drain,hell even a bucket just so u can drain your system once a week for nutrient changes and what not,it just really really helps and its so simple,u really dont need to do anything when it comes time to change out the water cuz the pump did all the work.i was going to piece together a old 6 bucket system for u and take pics but i dont have a camera anymore.sorry about that.

[Kronz]

so in your instructions u say "-----now with your new container drill 2 half inch holes side by side about 2-3 inches apart,these also need to be drilled near the bottom portion of the container,u want your holes 2 be the same heighth as on your 2 first buckets."

Do I drill the 2 half inch holes on the bottom of the container or on the side towards the bottom?

I want my two holes to be the same height as on my first 2 buckets? I dont get it. If the holes are on the bottom how can the be at the same height? Do I drill holes on the side of the bucket towards the bottom? is that what you mean?

sorry just a little confused.

[disrupt86]

oh sorry about that,u want all of your holes to be on the side of the container near the bottom.i think the bbest reference picture i can think of for u would be....... the water farm 8 pack. look up that system and look at how the plumbing is set up.this is exactley how yours should be,with the exception that your 1/2 makes a complete return and does not just stop at the last bucket like is pictured.that is y u have 2 on off valves at your rez "the last container u would have bought to make this work.the half inch is only used to return the water to the rez.the reason it needs to be a complete loop is because your only running 2 grow containers and if its hooked up in a straight line of buckets u will always be pulling more off of the first one and your levels will never be the same heighth.i hope this helps

[Kronz]

Your the man! I'm going to be setting it all up tomorrow. I will take some pictures.

[Kronz]

I submerge the drip manifold in my resevoir water? and also the air pump goes inside my resevoir too?? both submerged in water? and is there only 4-head drip manifolds? not any 2 headed? Will that be a problem if I only use 2 heads out of the 4?

[Kronz]

I made a quick little drawing of what I think it should look like. one question. The drip manifold tubing comes out the top of my rez and goes in to my other 2 containers. Do i need to make holes in these 2 containers or does it just go through my pots through the top?

[disrupt86]

yes the drip manifold and water pump should stay in your rez.because they have a tendency to leak,and if it does its only leaking into the rez and not on the floor.i would drill 1/4 holes instead of going through the pots.u can add air stones to the rez just like the 2 containers holding your plants. your pic looks about right.as for the dripper manifolds. they come in all sizes i think the biggest one is 8.they come with caps so if u dont need 2 use them they will be capped off.u might want 2 buy a larger one just incase one 1/4 tube per container isnt enough u could always add another 1/4 line per bucket should that problem come up.

[altaholic]

Not sure if anyone addressed this but those rubbermaid roughneck containers( and all others out there Im pretty sure) aint light proof. Your going to need to address this or you will get algae. you can paint em black and then white over it, but to my expereince the paint can just chip off when your dealing with plastic. I would put my tub over a light and spray it with black paint(for plastic) till I couldnt see the light, then for the lid use black white poly or mylar of something! Good luck

[Kronz]

Not sure if anyone addressed this but those rubbermaid roughneck containers( and all others out there Im pretty sure) aint light proof. Your going to need to address this or you will get algae. you can paint em black and then white over it, but to my expereince the paint can just chip off when your dealing with plastic. I would put my tub over a light and spray it with black paint(for plastic) till I couldnt see the light, then for the lid use black white poly or mylar of something! Good luck

Have you ever grown with this color rubbermaid? Im pretty sure its dark enough.

[Kronz]

Also I cant get my airstones to stick at the bottom of the bucket. I used silicone but its not strong at all. Should I not worry about gluing them?

[tinytoon]

I have the flat kinda long type airstones, about 6" in length, and I used velcro to hold them to bottom :thumbsup:

[Kronz]

I was thinking about that.. Just thought the water would make them not sticky. I do have some heavy duty velcro so Ill give it a try. Thanks man.

[tinytoon]

just make sure surface is clean and dry and the Velcro strips will stick right to the res and as long as airstone has a plastic bottom to it (like ones in fish dept at Wally World where mine came from) they will stick there also :thumbsup:

[disrupt86]

soooo have u tried out the new system yet? ohhhh buddy no power cords on the floor,water below the waist, electrical above.nothing fun about being electricuted.ive been shocked by shit more times,than i can count

[Kronz]

I put water in it yesterday and let it cycle through the buckets. Had a problem when I tried taking the water out. There was about an inch of water in each bucket after I tried draining it. I will redo the electrical and put it above my waist.. I'm picking up some clones tonight. I will add some pictures tomorrow. If I have three 14 gallon buckets how many gallons of water am I going to use? About 30? That's a lot of water.

[Kronz]

Okay, got it going. only thing is my measurements are off I think....

My container farthest away has a PH of 5.4 and PPM at 98.....

Container next to the Rez has a PH of 4.8 and PPM at 112......

My Rez has a PH of 4.8 and PPM at 98.......

*PH Solution 7.0 has a PH of 7.2

*My R/O water has a PH at 6.7 and PPM at 27

What do I have to do? I am using the Flora series nutrients. Using the Lucas Formula.

[disrupt86]

yup 30 sounds about right,buy a 5 gallon bucket and mix the exact same amount of nutrient solution in each, now for your ppm and ph flux in each container,this will even out and they should all be the same after a couple of hours.its auctually the whole reason for using a recirculating system,to combat your left over water, first,pump out as much as u can with your water pump,member i sed it was a good idea to get xxx amount of feet for the half inch to do this,second.raise your 2 main growing chambers up off the ground using milk crates "anything will work".this will drain all the remaining water from the grow chambers to the rez via a gravity feed.third,this is were the 2 on/off valve on the rez come into play once the grow chambers are empty and the rez is now holding the remaining water kick your pump back on.dump what little bit of water u have left into the 5 gallon bucket your going to buy to mix your nutes with, take it 2 the sink.clean it out and add your new solution.this should be done every 7 days.

[Kronz]

having some trouble with a couple....but got everything up and running

[Kronz]

here is some homegrown from a buddy of mine...soo dank

[disrupt86]

i would deff hand water for the next week to help the root mass start growing.

[Kronz]

Im still having trouble with these two plants... one of them look like they are doing a little better. Those are the two bubba kush plants the other two in the container are a different strand then the container with all the same plants look like they are doing good. The two bubba kush plants were in soil first and I had to transplant them into the hydroton. Thats what the problem probbaly is.

[Kronz]

some more....

[disrupt86]

check your ph and tds right now. what nutrients are u using? if u dont act with the quickness those bubba kush cuttings are going to die.it looks like they are suffering from a major nitro def and your others are soon to follow. it looks like there are several problems.i think the main reason behind all of it is ph. also check your tds strait from the tap,with no nutes no nothing and post the number.

[Kronz]

my PH level is at 5.48 right now and my PPM is at 1120.
Im using GH 3 part Micro, Grow, Bloom. I also have CalMag. I am using R/O water

[disrupt86]

whoa sweet jesus,ok u need to drain your system right now.drop your tds down to a i would say 450 -600 max.what is the tds of your reverse os water before anything is applied? .

[Kronz]

ill be back in 10 and let you know. You think I should just drain some out and add just plain R/O water?

[disrupt86]

i would drain as much out of the system as possible,just to be on the safe side. A general guideline for TDS levels : seedlings = 50-150 ppm; unrooted clones = 100-350 ppm; small plants = 400-800 ppm; large plants = 900-1800 ppm; last week of flowering = taper off to plain water. remember u need to subtract the ppm's of your tap water from your nutrients.if your bottle ses 600 and u have 200 to start with.your overal number is now 800 ppm and not the 600 most people think is there.

[Kronz]

my PPM without any nutrients is 8

[Kronz]

okay just did a semi water change. My PPM is at 224 now and my PH is at 6.14

Im going to wait for about a half hour or so and check on it to see where the PPM and PH is at.

[disrupt86]

your lucky thats the lowest ppm num i have ever seen. based on your plants age,use the scale of ppm numbers i posted for you.auctually copy and paste that to your computer it will save u tons of trouble in the future i promise.with your system full of water and calmag only,start adding small amounts of nutes.test your water.then in 2 hours go back and check again.because u are doing a recir system u need 2 give it time to even out.after 2 hours check again if your numbers are low add a little more nutrients.basically it just takes time even your system out and mix every thing up..for the next 24 hours go in and randomly test your water through out your day/night.numbers change and especially right now u need to be on top of it. i would try and stick to the lighter side of nutrients for the first little bit.all of the plants have stress from transoprt and setting up a new home"it happends to every one" and then start upping your solution.as a personal note i do need to say that bubba is a light feeder during veg.so keep it simple and try and find a good number that both strains like.

[Kronz]

PPM at 780
PH at 5.4

Bought a couple waterfarm buckets yesterday. Going to use them next time around. Got another nice size clone and replaced it with the one that was dying.

[LisaDouglas]

This is another great thread for DWC. Thank you Disrupt86 for the info sharing and thanks to Kronz for all the great questions and photos.