black leafs.. not lookin good

[TheMidnighter]

I have a plant that's showing a very bad case of this, I don't know what it is. It's leafs are turning black, and it's drooping like hell. Leafs feel healthy aside from the look.. A few others are starting to show black on their leafs ... getting worried :(

[headshake]

I have a plant that's showing a very bad case of this, I don't know what it is. It's leafs are turning black, and it's drooping like hell. Leafs feel healthy aside from the look.. A few others are starting to show black on their leafs ... getting worried :(

fill out the troubleshooting form in my sig.

-shake

[TheMidnighter]

What is your experience level? (first timer, novice, experienced...)
this is my second time

Your Equipment:
.1) Type and wattage of lights. 12 hour; 1000w HPS, 12 hour; 2 20w flourescent
.2) Distance from tops? 1000whps; 5 feet, others; 3 ft
.3) Reflector type? enclosed reflector,
.4) Is there a consistent fresh air supply? yes, air conditioner + fan
.5) Do you have an exhaust fan and a circulation fan? with the air conditioner
.6) What are the bulb wattages, kelvin ratings, and schedule? 12 hour; 1000w HPS, 12 hour; 2 20w flourescent. 3200k kelvin I believe for the hps

Your medium:
.7) Specific brand and type of soil; coco soik, using their nutrients as well, not mixing anything with the soil
.8) Size of container; 1 gallon
.9) Did you use peat pucks (or similar) to root clones or germinate seedlings?; tried it, have had better success with soil

Your nutrients and water:
10) Source of water? (tap, bottled or filtered) What's it's ph before adjusting?; tap, un filtered. PH before adjusting is low, I cannot recall right now.. 4.7 I believe
11) Method of checking water ph. (ph pen, test strips, aquarium test kit...); test strips
12) Method of adjusting water ph. (phosphoric acid, white vinegar, hydrated lime, PH Up...); PHup, the chemical
13) Specific brand and N-P-K ratio for each bottle. List dosages (quantity per gallon) and current feeding schedule. "Coca 'A'", "Coco 'B'", "Coco Canazym", "Coco PK-14".

N-P-K
Coco A: 4 0 1
Coco B: 1 4 2
Canazym: .01 0 0 (it's a plant extract)
PK 14: 0 13 14
The PK 14 only goes in during a certain cycle.. this is not this plants cycle.

Values are 6ml of each per galon. I use 2 liters water, dosages scaled back, each diluted before mixing the next


14) How often are you watering between feedings, and how much per watering? I wait until the soil is dry down about 2-3 inches
15) Any additives or tea's? (Superthrive, CalMag, molasses, Mother's Earth...); No
16) Are your ph levels stable, or do they fluctuate? they're stable, I have phUP to fix that
17) What is your ingoing water's ph? ...your runoff ph? in going aims for 6.9-7.1, really never tested run off.. I will though
18) Do you foliar feed? If so, with what, how often, and at what time do you spray? I do, just with water. I do it maybe 3-4 times a day when the leaves are dry

Your growroom:
19) Indoors or outdoors? in doors
20) What size of closet, room or hut? 12x18x12
21) What are the temps and humidity levels while lights are on? ...With lights off? temp on; 80, humidity 46% temp off, 72, humidty 40%
22) Have you seen signs of insects in the growroom? no, I keep a close eye

Your strain:
23) What strain are you growing? (Indica dominate or Sativa dom?) Purple Haze
24) From seeds or clones? This particular is from seed, but it is infecting one from clone
25) Is this an autoflower strain? no

[headshake]

you got any pics?

why the HPS 12 hours and the two CFLs for 12? are you trying to flower the plant or what?

why do you have the HPS five feet away?

why are you using coco nutes for a soil grow?


-shake

[TheMidnighter]

you got any pics?

no, sadly. I will be able to provide some tomorrow.

why the HPS 12 hours and the two CFLs for 12? are you trying to flower the plant or what?

No I'm not, it's only 17 inches high

why do you have the HPS five feet away?

The bulb is warm as sin, 5 feet seems to be a good spot

why are you using coco nutes for a soil grow?

"coco" is the brand name of the soil and nutrients. I don't know why I wouldn't use it, there's books of using them together?

[headshake]

is this what you are using (plus the others)?

-shake

[TheMidnighter]

is this what you are using (plus the others)?

-shake

yes that's it.
it's spread to the mother and the second plant is looking worse than it did when I first posted that message =(

[carinia]

Is it fuzzy or just wilted dark black spots?
Im sure your poor girls arent getting much light with that thing 5 feet away! Shake was more asking why arent you running the hps all day or at least 18/6. Are you splitting up the cfl time and the hps time, or do both of those run at the same time? Sorry, Im a bit confused about your lighting scheme as well.

How old are the plants? And you said they are 17 inches? Where on the plant is affected? (old leaves, new leaves)? and runoff ph?

Also, why are you foliar feeding water? That can actually leach nutes out of your plants and can DEFINITELY help mold growth get started! You said its infecting the clone? How many plants is this affecting and how?

[headshake]

yes that's it.
it's spread to the mother and the second plant is looking worse than it did when I first posted that message =(

you are aware that those notes are for coco coir, right?

could be contributing to your problem.

you need to invest in adequate cooling or the 1000W is basically a waste.


-shake

[TheMidnighter]

>>>Is it fuzzy or just wilted dark black spots?

Just wilted dark black spots, I got the feeling it was mold unfortunately, as it was spreading so fast I had to chop down 2 plants and trim the mother.

>>>Im sure your poor girls arent getting much light with that thing 5 feet away!

No light 5 feet away from a 1000w HPS bulb? They're getting more light then they know what to do with I'm sure, most people use a 400w around here. Could you explain a bit more?

>>>Shake was more asking why arent you running the hps all day or at least 18/6. Are you splitting up the cfl time and the hps time, or do both of those run at the same time?

Unfortunately I only have one HPS bulb right now, so I'm flowering a few plants with it and moving the other ones to cfl for the remaining 12 hours.


>>> How old are the plants? And you said they are 17 inches? Where on the plant is affected? (old leaves, new leaves)? and runoff ph?

Plants are about 6 weeks old. Old leaves and new leaves are affected, runoff PH will be tested tonight or tomorrow.

>>> Also, why are you foliar feeding water? That can actually leach nutes out of your plants and can DEFINITELY help mold growth get started!

Are you serious? I had no idea about this to tell you the truth, I've always misted the plants, I heard they loved it.

>>> You said its infecting the clone? How many plants is this affecting and how?

It started really bad with one plant, spread to a second very quickly.
It's turning the leaves black, and wilting them badly. They are also drooping down to the stalk.


@shake:

>>>you are aware that those notes are for coco coir, right?

Are you saying I shouldn't be using any Nutrients? This soil comes with ZERO additives. That was the selling point, the soil starts at Neutral.

>>>you need to invest in adequate cooling or the 1000W is basically a waste.

I've got air conditioning and fans with an intake and exhaust, keeps the temperature perfect. I do want to switch to 2 400w bulbs, one for 18/6 and one for 12/12.. just gotta get the $$$ flowin first.

[carinia]

If it looks like its just powerdered on there, it probably is mold. A fan will help you with that, as well as not misting!

Plants 5 feet away from a 1000 w light recieve less light actually than a plant 1 ft away from a 400 w! It looks bright, sure, but the usable amount of light for plants drops drastically the farther away you get. For a 1000w at five feet, your plants are receiving less than 1200 lumens per foot! Your absolute minimum should be 2000 lumens per foot for growth. Right out of the bulb (less than one foot away) The same light has over 9000 lumens. Read up on some of the lighting threads to get a better understanding of how to make your light work with your plants. Heres a good one: http://boards.cannabis.com/indoor-lighting/140735-answers-about-cfl-hps-how-much-light.html
Just lower the light to about 2 feet from the tops and check your canopy temp. Do you have a reflector or hood for it?

Yeah being serious about the misting. Your humidity is ok so I wouldnt worry to much about misting them everyday. Clones might need it, seedlings if it is super dry maybe, but not vegging or flowering plants.


Coco is a different growing medium, so the nutrients have a different chemical composition to react best with Coco coir. A new fert. for soil is going to be needed sometime to make sure you avoid lock ups and other issues.

[TheMidnighter]

I will lower the light, and I do indeed have a reflector hood for the light.
I will also stop misting, I'll miss that.. they smell so beautiful when they're wet... Hahaha, so do many things.

Do you have any recommendations for soil and nuts then? Unfortunately the only store that is really within distance only sells Coco. I may have to resort to ordering online.

Thanks very much for everyone's help.

[headshake]

here is a good way to set a distance for your light from the tops of your plants. put your hand under it, at the plant canopy. you should be able to hold it there for 5 seconds before you have to move it because it gets too hot, then back it off just a bit.

ok, so you are actually using coco coir!? i must have missed that the first go round. my bad. the nutes are perfect then, exactly what they were made for.

on another note though, i think the pH might be high. i've never used coco, but i think i remember reading that 5.4-6.2 is a good range, with under six being better.

you should be using calmag+ (or molasses) to supplement.

you can mist, but once a day AT THE MOST! and never mist/foliar feed plants that are more than 3-4 weeks into flowring as this can lead to bud rot or mold.


-shake

[TheMidnighter]

>> ok, so you are actually using coco coir!?

I am using Canna Coco Soil, not the coir. I will switch if you believe it will be better for the plants.

>>>on another note though, i think the pH might be high. i've never used coco, but i think i remember reading that 5.4-6.2 is a good range, with under six being better.

I had actually heard the same about hydro based systems, but soil based I hear between 6.5-7.5 is perfect.. This is only my third crop, so I am still new and am playing around with levels a little bit.

>> you should be using calmag+ (or molasses) to supplement.

Supplement what, exactly? I haven't heard of that yet. Especially molasses, as delicious as it is!

>>> you can mist, but once a day AT THE MOST! and never mist/foliar feed plants that are more than 3-4 weeks into flowring as this can lead to bud rot or mold.

Once a day at most, gotcha. I will not water any flowering plants either.

Thanks again!

[headshake]

you're welcome.

i'm not sure about your canna coco soil. never heard of it actually. canna is usually good stuff so keep using it by all means (unless someone with experience tells you otherwise.) is it to be treated as a soil? if it is then you want to am for 6.3-6.8.

again, not sure if you need the calmag+ (or molasses, molasses just has a bunch of micro nutes including calcium and magnesium!). you have to use one of the either when using coco coir as the coir lacks the cal and mag (or in amounts that aren't close to enough).

i'm gonna check out that soil you've got.


-shake

[TheMidnighter]

>>> is it to be treated as a soil?

Yes, it is to be treated as soil. As far as I know it is soil, just soil without any NPK.

I have another problem that I'd like to ask you about actually, I've had this going for a year and I've only gotten one crop - Do you know why things are going so slowly? Is it mainly because my light is so far away?

You really can't imagine my appreciation for this help.

[headshake]

could be. are you growing from seeds or clones?

move your light closer and see what happens!

agian, your welcome. once you learn, repay the favor. that's what keeps the boards going!


-shake

[TheMidnighter]

>>> are you growing from seeds or clones?

Clones mainly, but I do have a few seeds.

>> move your light closer and see what happens!

I'll be doing this tonight for sure.

>>> once you learn, repay the favor. that's what keeps the boards going!

Without a doubt :)

[headshake]

okay, sounds good. drop your pH to around 6.3. since you are using test strips adjust to ~6.8 when you are feeding and then add your nutes. nutes are usually around netural and will cause your pH to drop. the pH should fall right where we want it to be.

when only watering shoot for 6.3.

do this, and drop that light. then see how your plants respond. they should love it.

are you making sure that your flowering ladies are getting 12 hours of UNINTERUPTED darkness?


-shake

[TheMidnighter]

>>> are you making sure that your flowering ladies are getting 12 hours of UNINTERUPTED darkness?

Indeed, complete darkness.
I will make sure the PH is set properly, I'll leave it around 6.3