Canoeing leaves, light burn and lower leaf problem

[BetterThanBeer]

I have a couple issues going on with my girls. I had to leave on a trip for 5 days and did what I could for them before I left. They seemed to due fine on water (a little dry when I came back but nothing major), however they do have a few issues other than being thirsty.

First, I raised the lights hoping they would be ok until I got back. They decided to instead stretch (alot) and one grew right into the light burning the top coala. They were nice and bushy before I left. I raised the lights 6-7 inches above the plants before leaving hoping to leave room for the stretch but I guess I didn't leave enough. They are in their 3rd week of flowering so the burn hopefully wont stress her into something awful. Question here is, will new growth just stop on top and transfer to the sides or have I ruined her?

My other question is the canoeing leaves. I am assuming a ph issue. Any ideas on how to correct this? I am using Fox Farm nutes tiger, grow and big (per FF schedule) and adjust ph before watering the plants. I adjust after I add the tiger bloom as it brings the ph way down on me. I put in at around 6.8-7 but cannot check ph runoff because the water comes out colored from the soil and throws off the ph color chart. Any ideas on fixing ph without knowing runoff? I am guessing it is low in the soil, but not sure. They are also losing leaves on the bottom (attached pics) which I thought was ok as they don't get as much light, but it could all be related to something else.

Sorry for long post and thank you for any info. Here is the trouble shooting form from what I can remember without going and getting it.

Indoor
CFLs (mostly red, little blue spec. enough lumens per sf)
Soil (peat moss based soil (80% of soil) and blacks gold (20% of soil) mixed with with lots of perlite (30% of total mixture)
3rd week of flower, 12/12
3 gallon pots (hoping not root bound. plant is 2.5-3 feet tall so I was hoping this would do. they were put into 3 gallon right before flower)
Temps range from 82-84F (day) and make their way down to 75F (night)
Tap Water (open 24 hours to lose chlorine, adjusted ph roughly 6.8)
Fox Farm nutes (tiger bloom, grow big, big bloom) (Per FF Sched., every other watering, roughly once per week) (also using unsulf. molasses on no nute day)

[phatsesh101]

whats the ph after the nutes mix and b4 you adjust?

do you check your molasses water ph?

try to keep it a lil lower 6.4-6.7

[BetterThanBeer]

The ph out of my tap is between 7.5-8 (end of color chart so not sure exactly). After I add the tiger bloom it goes down to 6.0 or lower. I bring it back up to as close to 7 as I can get thinking that the soil will bring it back down to the mid 6s or so.

I thought that molasses did not affect the ph so I have not checked. I will do so if I can. The water looks like ice tea after I add the dark molasses so it may be difficult. Maybe I was wrong about it not changing the ph when added to the water (1 tbl sp. per gallon). I will look into that.

I take it by your response that you are leaning towards a ph issue?

[Rusty Trichome]

If your ph's are accurate, I'd try splitting nutrients in half and watering twice a week. That way you are adjusting ph with half as much Tiger Bloom. (I've been fertilizing this way for many years using Fox Farms) :thumbsup:

But if using a color-coded test kit, after you add the nutes (if they are tinted) it throw's off your color coded results, so doubtful you are really bringing ph down that far.

Temperature also affects ph readings. (regardless if using test kits or ph pens...) I try and ph in the mornings before my water get's too hot. Consistency is important. Summer temperature ph readings are .6 ph different than winter ph according to my ph pen. My calibrating solution comes with a handy temp : ph conversion table...but it only goes to 78 degrees f. or so.

Most commercial peat-based potting mixes are buffered already, but the buffering only lasts about 4 months in my growroom, before I notice a ph drop. (measured from last trransplant) Unless you are using a mushroom compost or similar where it's ph is in the low 6's...your runoff should be ok.

If making changes all the time to accomodate the tinted and tainted ph test results, try not ph'ing the runoff, lol. :thumbsup:
(this does not apply to those with ph pens)

[BetterThanBeer]

Thank you Rusty.

The peat moss soil (at least the latest transplant) is only about a month old so I guess I can hope that the buffer agent is still active and will also hope that ph is ok since it is going in at the correct level.

Do you have any other ideas on why the plants look sad? I will switch up the water/fert schedule to half strength twice per week and see if that helps. They could be root bound again I guess. Is transplanting now a bad idea? They have about 4-5 weeks left of flower (estimate). They are in 3 gallon now and all under 3 feet so I figured they would make it ok. Is it ok to let them get root bound now or will it still affect yield and growth. When do roots slow down to concentrate on bud growth?

Are the bottom leave problems due to just being on the bottom and not really having an effect on the plant. Possibly just low light down there and old leaves moving on?

[Rusty Trichome]

... They could be root bound again I guess. Is transplanting now a bad idea? They have about 4-5 weeks left of flower (estimate). Is it ok to let them get root bound now or will it still affect yield and growth.
If care is taken, you can get away with transplanting if need be. Wait till your next watering (when the rootball is sorta dry) and slip her out of the pot to check the roots. Then, since you have it out that far...transplant. Don't 'excite' the roots, they'll know what to do from there. :thumbsup:
Expect a little stress and slowed growth followed by the likelyhood of minor stretch as she celebrates her new rootspace. Do you have enough headroom for a slightly taller lady?


When do roots slow down to concentrate on bud growth? They don't. If roots stop working, the plant dies a slow death.


Are the bottom leave problems due to just being on the bottom and not really having an effect on the plant. Possibly just low light down there and old leaves moving on? Could very well be. Could aslo be due to the inability to uptake enough nutrients, and is feeding herself from her reserves. Could be a combination of the two. Might need/want supplimental side-lighting since the CFL effective range is very limited. Are you using the WalMart 23w CFL's?

[BetterThanBeer]

I will check the roots just before watering to see how they look. I have roughly 5 more inches of grow space for them (vertically). I can tie them down if needed I guess because I would venture to guess that the small growth you speak of after transplanting will be more than the space I have remaining in the cab.

The light bulbs are from Walmart yes. They are 27w though, not 23w. I have a couple side lights in there, though they only hit portions of the plants. I have roughly 4000 more lumens than needed by the 5000 lumens per sf that you told me I should have in a previous post.

I guess I will have to let the plants do what they do until I can find out if they are root bound in a day or so. If its not that then it must be ph or a missing nute so I will run through the site and compare symptoms with what I see wrong with my girls.

Maybe that way I can find something more definitive to ask you so that we can narrow down the issue. Thank you for your help so far.

[BetterThanBeer]

Quick correction.

HeadShake told me about the lumens psf that I mentioned above.

You brought my potential fire hazard to my attention. After watching the girls grow and seeing how water really does have a tendency to get places that you never expected I am glad that you did. :)