Al Qaida works for US intelligence

[kathaksung]

Al Qaida (or most other terrrorist group) exists where US intelligence dominates. Al Qaida in US when Bush needs excuse to activate Mid-east war. That is 911 attack. Al Qaida is everywhere in Iraq now to bomb innocent civilians when US occupies Iraq. Strange to say, under the Saddam regime, there was no Al Qaida. Al Qaida seems only exist where the regime being controlled by US. So we see no Al qaida in Syria and Iran. But they appears to attack ordinary people when the government either is controlled by US intelligence or supported by US intelligence. That's why you see Al Qaida attacks in US, in Afghanistan, in Pakistan, in Iraq (after it is occupied by US). Because where they are protected by the intelligence, worked as a whip to beat people. When government want money and power, they beat the people with this whip (Al Qaida terror attack) People feel hurt then give up their civil rights and money to the government. DOJ got the Patriot Act and Pentagon got budget and Mid-east war.

[MaryJaneMonkey]

Take the anger you feel, multiply it by 10 and you will feel what a dusgruntal Marine feels like after being deployed to Iraq.
It amazes me how a country like America functions when 98.6% of people dont agree with the direction we are headed.

Of and FUCK THE VA!!!!!!
throwing poisonous pill after poisonous pill down the throats of people who thought they were doing something to help the cause.

In fact, Al queda is no terrorist group in my eyes. THey do not have billion dollar bombers to fight with and pay for by the us taxpayer money so they use home made bombs. Yeah it sucked having to see young girls get blown up by "terrorist" or freedom fighters, but I see where they are coming from.

I realized the error in my ways, hopefully America will do the same.

I appologize to the people of Iraq, even though I was very respectful of their customs when I was there, tried to get as many of them help as I could.
Shit, bough them soap and shampoo with the majority of my check.

People are people, everyone wants the same thing, a job, a family, some peace and quiet. We are a lot less different than we assume.

It just amazes me that we have control of Afghanistan, 90% of heroin comes there, and when Marines wanted to burn opium fields, higher ups said no.

[kathaksung]

Al Qaida is created by Pentagon and US Intelligence as a false flag target with which they squeeze money and power from people.

Quote, "Al Qaeda does not exist and never has
8/19/2004

The basic truth is that Al Qaeda does not exist and never has. Al Qaeda is a manufactured enemy who was created by the Bush Administration in order to have an excuse to wage a war for the control of the world's oil resources.

Did an American even hear the words "Al Qaeda" before 9-11? Or were we told that its alleged leader Osama Bin Laden has family who themselves have personal business relationships with George W. Bush's family and that both families had financially profited conside

Al Qaeda does not exist and never has - Pravda.Ru (http://english.pravda.ru/mailbox/22/101/397/13821_AlQaeda.html)

[Delta9 UK]

"Al Qaeda" is actually "the base" - referring to the Database of Mujahideen fighters setup by the CIA to fight the Russian invasion of Afghanistan.

Robin Cook wrote about this in the Guardian shortly before his death:
Robin Cook: The struggle against terrorism cannot be won by military means | UK news | The Guardian (http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2005/jul/08/july7.development)

From the same article:
"Bin Laden was, though, a product of a monumental miscalculation by western security agencies. Throughout the 80s he was armed by the CIA and funded by the Saudis to wage jihad against the Russian occupation of Afghanistan. Al-Qaida, literally "the database", was originally the computer file of the thousands of mujahideen who were recruited and trained with help from the CIA to defeat the Russians. Inexplicably, and with disastrous consequences, it never appears to have occurred to Washington that once Russia was out of the way, Bin Laden's organisation would turn its attention to the west."

Just throwing in some facts - make of it what you will.

[Breukelen advocaat]

"Al Qaeda" is actually "the base" - referring to the Database of Mujahideen fighters setup by the CIA to fight the Russian invasion of Afghanistan.

Robin Cook wrote about this in the Guardian shortly before his death:
Robin Cook: The struggle against terrorism cannot be won by military means | UK news | The Guardian (http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2005/jul/08/july7.development)

From the same article:
"Bin Laden was, though, a product of a monumental miscalculation by western security agencies. Throughout the 80s he was armed by the CIA and funded by the Saudis to wage jihad against the Russian occupation of Afghanistan. Al-Qaida, literally "the database", was originally the computer file of the thousands of mujahideen who were recruited and trained with help from the CIA to defeat the Russians. Inexplicably, and with disastrous consequences, it never appears to have occurred to Washington that once Russia was out of the way, Bin Laden's organisation would turn its attention to the west."

Just throwing in some facts - make of it what you will.
For something to be a "fact", it generally has to be regarded as true. Bin laden never worked for the CIA, and was never funded by them. This story is a myth.

[Delta9 UK]

For something to be a "fact", it generally has to be regarded as true. Bin laden never worked for the CIA, and was never funded by them. This story is a myth.

How can you be sure? I think Robin Cook (as Secretary of State) had a higher security clearance than either of us ;)

[Breukelen advocaat]

How can you be sure? I think Robin Cook (as Secretary of State) had a higher security clearance than either of us ;)Using that logic, then you'd have to agree that anything George W. Bush, former president of the U.S., says has "higher security clearance" than Cook. :jointsmile:

Seriously, there's no evidence to support the claim that bin Laden was CIA trained and supported.

[Delta9 UK]

Using that logic, then you'd have to agree that anything George W. Bush, former president of the U.S., says has "higher clearance" than Cook. :jointsmile:

LOL - you got me there BA :thumbsup:

The CIA did supply the moojies in Afghanistan though, without that support they wouldn't have been able to lure the Soviets in - which is exactly what they did. The Russians fell for the trap and had it handed to 'em - that I'm sure we can agree on.

Who else handed them those 'handy' Stinger missiles that started swatting down Soviet Hind Gunships and Hip transports?

[Breukelen advocaat]

LOL - you got me there BA :thumbsup:

The CIA did supply the moojies in Afghanistan though, without that support they wouldn't have been able to lure the Soviets in - which is exactly what they did. The Russians fell for the trap and had it handed to 'em - that I'm sure we can agree on.

Who else handed them those 'handy' Stinger missiles that started swatting down Soviet Hind Gunships and Hip transports?
It was Jimmy Carter that first started supporting them ("moojies"). The Soviets were not military "invaders" in the general sense, they were invited in by the legitimately elected government of Afghanistan. The reforms put forth by the (Marxist) Democratic Republic of Afghanistan, in the 1980â??s, were disliked by Muslims. These included outlawing on beards on men, banning burqas on women, and mosques were off-limits. At least they got that right.

[killerweed420]

Not much doubt that CIA's fingerprints are all over Afghanistan and Pakistan. They have involved themselves in a lot of shady deals for decades.

[yokinazu]

well i have to say thatfrom where i sit and see things thru the fog, it seems to me that it wasnt carter or reagen or bush or clinton admins. but it goes back to just after WW2 when isreal and other mid east countrys were created. i do beleive that for decades we have been funding the ( pick one please: freedom fighters, terrorist, arab patriots, etc. etc.) but we fund them for our own interests. there is absolutly nothing at all wrong with hired help. but when that hired help is no longer useful or goes against what your ideas and beliefs are thats when you have to do something about them. think about this when russia was fighting in afghanastan they were fighting the "freedom fighters" now that we are fighting them we are fighting the "terrorists". same group of people just depends on wich side of the coin your lookin at.

the hero the patriot and the terrorist are all the same person it just depends on weather or not you agree with them. if me as an american was to fly a plane into a sky scraper in iraq (if there is one) id be a hero here, but to them i would be a terrorist.

[Doobee]

Is it any wonder why so many have a strong negative bias against cannabis???:wtf:

Pure crap like this makes fools out of all who smoke, toke and ingest the weed.

Of all the medical value of MJ it is pretty much known that no matter how great the bud...cannabis cannot make a wise person out of a total idiot.

I don't ever recall seeing so much stupid in one place before.

Well ok...the DNC Convention.:D


Al Qaida (or most other terrrorist group) exists where US intelligence dominates. Al Qaida in US when Bush needs excuse to activate Mid-east war. That is 911 attack. Al Qaida is everywhere in Iraq now to bomb innocent civilians when US occupies Iraq. Strange to say, under the Saddam regime, there was no Al Qaida. Al Qaida seems only exist where the regime being controlled by US. So we see no Al qaida in Syria and Iran. But they appears to attack ordinary people when the government either is controlled by US intelligence or supported by US intelligence. That's why you see Al Qaida attacks in US, in Afghanistan, in Pakistan, in Iraq (after it is occupied by US). Because where they are protected by the intelligence, worked as a whip to beat people. When government want money and power, they beat the people with this whip (Al Qaida terror attack) People feel hurt then give up their civil rights and money to the government. DOJ got the Patriot Act and Pentagon got budget and Mid-east war.

[denialisback]

Al Qaeda is in fact a label created by the FBI under the CIA's advice, in order for any prosecution for 9/11 to be valid. Seemingly in US law a registered/associated entity is required to prosecute and organisation such as "Al Qaeda"

This was supposedly mainly because the entity had no legally identifyable name.. so they gave it one. And a name for people to associate terror with heh...

Perhaps you mean the terrorists we call Al Qaeda because the FBI make up organisational names to prosecute unorganised criminals, which perhaps, work for the government, cough do, cough halliburton..
heheheh


peace,
Denial

[denialisback]

For something to be a "fact", it generally has to be regarded as true. Bin laden never worked for the CIA, and was never funded by them. This story is a myth.

Yes, but what isn't a myth is that George bush has been in business with Bin Laden for quite some time.

Also, what isn't a myth that George Bush Snr.'s company was closed down due to the fact that a court of law found it was funded by Nazi money. When they refused to close it the government liquidated it instead and this is how the bush million$ fortune began, from the liquidation lol, surprise!

If only more people stated facts instead of accusations, then we could be shocked about them, letting the truth speak its own story.

To summarise.. some facts arouse suspicion yes.. but assumptions without fact create outright paranoia!

Peace,
denial

[CanGro]

There is some intelligence here in a lot of these post's, but there is a lot of stupidity as well......

Ok lets get one thing straight - US Goverment = Terorist Organisation

FACT: CIA rely on inteligence from terrorist organisations and terrorist cells in order to make their decision on which group they intend on attacking.

FACT: 9/11 was known through CIA inteligence as going to happen and that a terrorist cell was operating and preparing on US soil, but did nothing about it.

FACT: US Geverment used the 9/11 incident as a point to attack the Taliban, not Al Qaeda.

FACT: Al Qaeda was created by the US Goverment as a gorilla group (can't quite remember for which war)

FACT: US Goverment put Sadam in power.

I could keep going in what involvement the US Goverment had in the way some countrys have Hitler Regimes. You can garuntee that anyone the US goes against, at some point in the past they have put them in power.

Take a look at the Al Qaeda, they where created and funded by the US Goverment to fight the Russan occupancy and then turned on them once Russia left and paid for another side to fight Al Qaeda.

Now I'm not saying that the rest of the goverments in the world don't play there part in it, cause they do. But at the fore front of it all everytime is the US Goverment, Al Qaeda in my eyes is retribution against US Goverment for what they did to them but I don't condone what they do ether.

Now lets come away from the economics of war and look at the current financial crisis in the world, which country is at the fore front of the biggest financial crisis in this world. Non other than America and the US Goverment yet again did nothing about this and was warned in the early 90's that if they continued to allow the way finace is run over there that this would happen.

I'm a big firm belever in that the goverments of the world, all grew a back bone and said to the US Goverment enough is enough. But guess what they won't and you know whay that is, because they own most of the worlds goverment in one way or another.

Now I have nothing against the American people, or America itself. But I don't like the fact that if the US Goverment shout jump, everyone else asks how high. What has to happen before people realise the shit they cause and stopped it.

[psychocat]

Interference in other countries politics was always going to come back to bite the west in the arse.

[Doobee]

Stupid monkey says as stupid monkey hears....

Maybe inbred stupidity runs in the family of POHMs?

Dunno...maybe change your meds?

[Breukelen advocaat]

There is some intelligence here in a lot of these post's, but there is a lot of stupidity as well......Ok lets get one thing straight - US Goverment = Terorist Organisation
FACT: Al Qaeda was created by the US Goverment as a gorilla group (can't quite remember for which war)

It was a war against those red, banana-stealing orangutans!

[CanGro]

It was a war against those red, banana-stealing orangutans!
Typical yank that hides behind hysteria and doesn't see the truth, learn right history for once and not what you see on tv.

I hope that Obama does what he promises and show himself to be a true leader and not hide be hind congress and war.


Interference in other countries politics was always going to come back to bite the west in the arse.

Correct, we rebuke what we create.

[Breukelen advocaat]

There is some intelligence here in a lot of these post's, but there is a lot of stupidity as well......Ok lets get one thing straight - US Goverment = Terorist Organisation
FACT: Al Qaeda was created by the US Goverment as a gorilla group (can't quite remember for which war)


Typical yank that hides behind hysteria and doesn't see the truth, learn right history for once and not what you see on tv.

:jointsmile::D:thumbsup:;)

Keep 'em coming, you're doing great. Gorillas are our friends, lol.

[overgrowthegovt]

The Al-Qa'aeda aren't nearly as dangerous as the U.S. government...who has bigger bombs, more money, slicker rhetoric, and who's killed more people? I await the volley of shouts about how the Al-Qa'aeda are monsters who blow up innocents...just how guilty do you think your average two-year-old blown to bits by the U.S. Marines is?

I see it as two rival factions, nothing more. Both are brutal and commit unspeakable acts, and both have some legitimate grievances as well as a lot of bullshit they need to let go.

[Breukelen advocaat]

The Al-Qa'aeda aren't nearly as dangerous as the U.S. government...who has bigger bombs, more money, slicker rhetoric, and who's killed more people? I await the volley of shouts about how the Al-Qa'aeda are monsters who blow up innocents...just how guilty do you think your average two-year-old blown to bits by the U.S. Marines is?

I see it as two rival factions, nothing more. Both are brutal and commit unspeakable acts, and both have some legitimate grievances as well as a lot of bullshit they need to let go.
Typical relativism is not applicable in the case of Islamofascism, for many reasons.

For instance, if a child is killed by U.S. military, it's usually an accident and those responsible consider it a tragedy. If it is suspected to be a deliberate act, the suspects will be court marshalled and tried. The Islamic terrorists not only kill anybody they want, they actually recruit and use children to perform jihad - which is about the most cowardly act an adult can commit for a cause.

Kidnapping innocent people, and beheading them, is another favorite of their's.

The belief system of Islam is insane, and as dangerous, sick and degenerate Christianity is, it's not nearly as deadly and backwards in this day and age as Islam.

[CanGro]

The belief system of Islam is insane, and as dangerous, sick and degenerate Christianity is, it's not nearly as deadly and backwards in this day and age as Islam.
Relgion is the route of all evil, storys made up by man to control man.

Wait most war has the same path as above..............

[psychocat]

Typical relativism is not applicable in the case of Islamofascism, for many reasons.

For instance, if a child is killed by U.S. military, it's usually an accident and those responsible consider it a tragedy. If it is suspected to be a deliberate act, the suspects will be court marshalled and tried. The Islamic terrorists not only kill anybody they want, they actually recruit and use children to perform jihad - which is about the most cowardly act an adult can commit for a cause.

Kidnapping innocent people, and beheading them, is another favorite of their's.

The belief system of Islam is insane, and as dangerous, sick and degenerate Christianity is, it's not nearly as deadly and backwards in this day and age as Islam.

If the truth be told then they are more likely to be considered as collateral damage and acceptable losses.. ;)

[psychocat]

Relgion is the route of all evil, storys made up by man to control man.

Wait most war has the same path as above..............

I'm more inclined to go with greed , religion is simply a tool used by those who seek power , just like politics.

[overgrowthegovt]

Typical relativism is not applicable in the case of Islamofascism, for many reasons.

For instance, if a child is killed by U.S. military, it's usually an accident and those responsible consider it a tragedy. If it is suspected to be a deliberate act, the suspects will be court marshalled and tried. The Islamic terrorists not only kill anybody they want, they actually recruit and use children to perform jihad - which is about the most cowardly act an adult can commit for a cause.

Kidnapping innocent people, and beheading them, is another favorite of their's.

The belief system of Islam is insane, and as dangerous, sick and degenerate Christianity is, it's not nearly as deadly and backwards in this day and age as Islam.

Psychocat has a point...you're right about how it's probably usually an accident, and it may even be viewed as a tragedy, but not ENOUGH of a tragedy. The children seem to just get shrugged off as collateral damage. And regardless of whether or not the killing is intentional, the point is that far too many innocent people die because of the fighting. Just how many of the Muslims who die do you think are bloodthirsty terrorists, and how many do you think are just people wanting to living a quiet life with their family? It's probably a pretty unbalanced ratio.

I agree with you that, with the present arrangement, Islam is the more irrational faith (by a hair). But let's say it was the other way around, that the Muslims kept Christian lands in a vice grip and have for the last 60 or so years? You'd see some Christian terrorist organizations, that's for sure, striking the foreign oppressors in the name of God.

[epxroot]

When a bomb is dropped, or a missile is launched at targets, all deaths are intentional. Bombs and missiles do just what they were created to do..kill. Labeling the killing of children and innocent civilians something other than murder, is just a way to make it seem like an accident, or "collateral damage", is just part of the game. Anyway you look at it, it boils down to murder, and nothing more. Wars do nothing but breed hate and lead to other problems down the road.

I am amazed at how people look at the world today, truly amazed. Somebody always finds some kind of excuse to justify the murder, raping and pillaging of another country, state, home, and person. These are people who have just as much right to live than you or I do, no matter what they believe. That's the gift of being free. Now when your thoughts turn into actions that cause another one loss or hurt, then you should be held accountable for your actions.

This whole preemptive war idea is just mind blowing. I mean I could have the same mentality and just attack anyone in public who I see as a threat to my well being. Does that sound like a good idea? Of course it don't, because it is insane to think that way. If I were deliberately attacked then that is a different story. Even if I was attacked by someone, I sure wouldn't go after his neighbor for it. I would handle it with the same man, or woman who attacked me.

Anyway, back on the subject of the thread. It is true the intermingling by the US in other countries has bred a lot of hate towards the US. The US is not innocent and has it's hands in a lot of dirty laundry. When a country is led by people who live in a life of blackmail, greed, and lies, how do you think that country is going to be ran?

[Breukelen advocaat]

Psychocat has a point...you're right about how it's probably usually an accident, and it may even be viewed as a tragedy, but not ENOUGH of a tragedy. The children seem to just get shrugged off as collateral damage. And regardless of whether or not the killing is intentional, the point is that far too many innocent people die because of the fighting. Just how many of the Muslims who die do you think are bloodthirsty terrorists, and how many do you think are just people wanting to living a quiet life with their family? It's probably a pretty unbalanced ratio.

I agree with you that, with the present arrangement, Islam is the more irrational faith (by a hair). But let's say it was the other way around, that the Muslims kept Christian lands in a vice grip and have for the last 60 or so years? You'd see some Christian terrorist organizations, that's for sure, striking the foreign oppressors in the name of God.
Deliberately attacking from where there are children and non-combatants placed, knowing full well that their enemy will look like murderers when they retaliate, is another common earmark of Islamic warfare. War is hell, but those who wage it in this fashion are beyond despicable.

How much more "irrational" Islam is compared to Christianity isn't the central issue - it's their actions that people notice. What is boils down to is why this little strip of sand in the desert, called Gaza, has to threaten the peace and well-being of the entire world. If it wasn't that, would it be something similar? If a civiliztion does not move forward, it goes backwards - and trys to take everyone else with it.

Despite, or because of, the Iraq war, the extremist rhetoric and terrorist actions seem to be less pronounced lately. Let's hope this is a signal of better days to come, but it's hard to say. There's some intelligent ex-Muslims out there who are speaking up, but not enough at this point.

[psychocat]

You're allowing yourself to be sidelined by tags,Islam, Christian, it's all just bullshit.
There is no reason for the wests attempts to control the politics and policies of other countries, the simple fact is that it is never in the best interests of the country involved.
The west is guilty of some of the dirtiest games ever played and thier attempts to place puppet goverments , the continued double standards, the disregard for anything short of complete dominance and simple greed have created the modern day "terrorist".
It's easy to label them as religious fanatics and show video of a few nutters but the truth goes so much deeper than that.

[CanGro]

You're allowing yourself to be sidelined by tags,Islam, Christian, it's all just bullshit.
There is no reason for the wests attempts to control the politics and policies of other countries, the simple fact is that it is never in the best interests of the country involved.
The west is guilty of some of the dirtiest games ever played and thier attempts to place puppet goverments , the continued double standards, the disregard for anything short of complete dominance and simple greed have created the modern day "terrorist".
It's easy to label them as religious fanatics and show video of a few nutters but the truth goes so much deeper than that.
I totaly agree with you, though most people seem to forget about history and go on whats going on the world now.

War on Iraq is a prime example of pupet goverment - Sadam was put into place to protect the oil fileds, this is the only reason we went to war against him - WMD's where never found.

[kathaksung]

Al Qaida is only heard after 911. It is created to take the responsibility of 911. Before 911, Al Qaida was only a data base in internet to represent Mujahideen. Why created a new term? Because everybody knows that Mujahideen was supported and trained by CIA. To prevent people to link 911 to US intelligence they created a fictional Al Qaida.

Quote, "A norwegian professor believes al-Qaida is a Pentagon-fiction:

Feilmelding (http://www.aftenposten.no/nyheter/uriks/article.jhtml?articleID=396241)

Al Qaida exists where US intelligence dominate. Al Qaida in US when Bush need excuse to activate Mid-east war. That is 911 attack. Al Qaida is everywhere in Iraq now to bomb innocent civilians when US occupies Iraq. Strange to say, under the Saddam regime, there is no Al Qaida. Al Qaida seems only exist where the regime being controlled by US. So we see no Al qaida in Syria and Iran. No wonder Assad doubt it:

Syrias president questions the existence of al-Qaida:

May 26, 2003
«Syria Denies Existence of Al Qaeda»

«KUWAIT CITY (Talon News) -- Syrian President Bashar Assad revealed in a newspaper interview on Sunday that he does not believe there is a terrorist group called al Qaeda, the organization widely believed to be the perpetrators of the hijackings on September 11, 2001 as well as the recent attacks in Saudi Arabia and Morocco.»

«"Is there really an entity called al Qaeda? It was in Afghanistan, but is it there anymore?" Assad asked.»

«Assad speculated about the existence of al Qaeda and its notorious leader Usama bin Laden in a Kuwaiti newspaper called Al-Anba. »

«Nevertheless, questioning the existence of the al Qaeda terrorist network is very popular in Arab countries. Many people in these countries believe that the United States has hyperbolized the danger of al Qaeda as a means for portraying Muslims as violent and dangerous.»

GOPUSA -- File Not Found (http://www.gopusa.com/news/2003/may/0526_assad_denial.shtml)

[overgrowthegovt]

Deliberately attacking from where there are children and non-combatants placed, knowing full well that their enemy will look like murderers when they retaliate, is another common earmark of Islamic warfare. War is hell, but those who wage it in this fashion are beyond despicable.

How much more "irrational" Islam is compared to Christianity isn't the central issue - it's their actions that people notice. What is boils down to is why this little strip of sand in the desert, called Gaza, has to threaten the peace and well-being of the entire world. If it wasn't that, would it be something similar? If a civiliztion does not move forward, it goes backwards - and trys to take everyone else with it.

Despite, or because of, the Iraq war, the extremist rhetoric and terrorist actions seem to be less pronounced lately. Let's hope this is a signal of better days to come, but it's hard to say. There's some intelligent ex-Muslims out there who are speaking up, but not enough at this point.

You didn't acknowledge the key point I made...that a reversal of the status quo would most likely result in Christian terrorism. The U.S. does not engage in guerilla-level terrorism because it does not need to, sucking as hungrily as it does at the teat of world power. Instead, its government strong-arms any divergent nation. The terrorists are no more amoral than Congress--they're both deadly groups of self-servers. Actually, what the terrorists want is freedom from Western/Christian paternalistic handling of their affairs, and all Congress wants is, as Tony Soprano would say, "motherfucking, cocksucking money." The former strikes me as a touch more admirable goal.

[yokinazu]

ok again i will say this

the difference between a patriot and a terrorist is simpley POINT OF VEIW.

dont you think that when Sherman made his march to the sea, burning Atlanta on the way he was labeled a terrorist by the people living in the south?

[delusionsofNORMALity]

..... what the terrorists want is freedom from Western/Christian paternalistic handling of their affairs, and all Congress wants is, as Tony Soprano would say, "motherfucking, cocksucking money." The former strikes me as a touch more admirable goal.as is usually the case, you seem to miss the point entirely. when you couch a group's aims in the most extreme terms, any goal can be made to seem honorable or evil. these disparate groups are really after the same thing - POWER. the ends being equal, it is the means by which we should judge which is the more admirable cause. each side is fighting to gain control over a wider swath of the population, one through the use of economic and political power and the other by the indiscriminate use of explosives. now tell us again how you can see any cause to admire a group that advocates strapping on an explosive vest and wandering into a crowded marketplace.

the west may have a grand love affair with the underdog, but that doesn't make the cowardly actions of the little guy any more admirable. can you honestly say that hiding behind children and women's skirts while lobbing bombs at noncombatants is any more honorable than the horrors of collateral damage?

[Weedhound]

"your deeds show your character".......StinkyAttic.

[Breukelen advocaat]

Actually, what the terrorists want is freedom from Western/Christian paternalistic handling of their affairs, and all Congress wants is, as Tony Soprano would say, "motherfucking, cocksucking money." The former strikes me as a touch more admirable goal.
I wouldn't be so quick to think that I know what Islamofascist terrorists really want.

Fuck "Tony Soprano". Organized criminals are sociopathic, degenerate subhumans - but not even close to being the lowlife scum as Islamofascists are.

[psychocat]

How long did the affleunt west believe it could manipulate the politics of other countries before the whole shit pile blew up in thier faces ?
Dirty games using underhand tactics lead to explosive situations.

It all comes down to greed and the hunger for power.

[delusionsofNORMALity]

How long did the affluent west believe it could manipulate the politics of other countries before the whole shit pile blew up in their faces ?
Dirty games using underhand tactics lead to explosive situations.so manipulation warrants murder? the return on investing billions in building infrastructures around the world and actually having the audacity to expect a return on that investment is suicide bombers and decapitations?

for that matter, how are we assessing affluence? are we taking into account the fortunes in oil revenues flooding into so many of these countries? fortunes squandered on disproportionately large militaries and luxuries for the few while the masses are kept in ignorance.

and just how far back are we going with this? are we counting europe's colonial period, where those nations spread disease and war around the globe? are we taking into account the centuries of aggression surrounding most every civilization, next to which our present sins seem downright peaceful? or are we just blaming those evil americans today, for attempting to spread their ideology around the world through economic leverage and political maneuvering?

[psychocat]

so manipulation warrants murder
The support of Pinochet caused thousands of deaths and yet you forget it was US "manipulation" that allowed him to sieze power
In the US you have the right to shoot invaders of your home. isn't that something the inhabitants of other countries should also have a right to ?


the return on investing billions in building infrastructures around the world and actually having the audacity to expect a return on that investment is suicide bombers and decapitations?

Investing in US companies to rebuild what they destroyed.
Isn't that a bit like me knocking down my neighbours house for no good reason then offering to rebuild it for him, as long as he pays of course. :D


for that matter, how are we assessing affluence? are we taking into account the fortunes in oil revenues flooding into so many of these countries? fortunes squandered on disproportionately large militaries and luxuries for the few while the masses are kept in ignorance.

The attempts to control the fortunes of countries outside our own are what allow the corrupt regimes to continue to thrive.
What has it to do with us how another man spends his money ?
Is our society any different when the majority serve an elite minority.
Do you truly believe that the wests idea of democracy is any less corrupt than those you rail against.


and just how far back are we going with this? are we counting europe's colonial period, where those nations spread disease and war around the globe? are we taking into account the centuries of aggression surrounding most every civilization, next to which our present sins seem downright peaceful? or are we just blaming those evil americans today, for attempting to spread their ideology around the world through economic leverage and political maneuvering?

Since America and Britain helped to create so many puppet goverments it falls to them to carry the can for the consequences of thier actions.
Also , I don't know if you realise but the question of the OP directly adresses the issue of the US and the existence of Al Quiada.

No country has the right to impose it's will upon another.

As for history and conflict , it just goes to show how stupid the human race really is

[kathaksung]

Al Qaeda is More of a U.S. Propaganda Campaign than a Real Organization
12/24/08
Former British Foreign Secretary Robin Cook wrote:

Al-Qaida, literally "the database", was originally the computer file of the thousands of mujahideen who were recruited and trained with help from the CIA to defeat the Russians.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2005/jul/08/july7.development:

Former National Security Adviser Zbigniew Brzezinski told the Senate that the war on terror is "a mythical historical narrative"
www.senate.gov - This page cannot be found. (http://www.senate.gov/%7Eforeign/testimony/2007/BrzezinskiTestimony070201.pdf).

And see this Los Angeles Times Article, reviewing a BBC documentary entitled "The Power of Nightmares" <http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/video1037.htm>, which shows that the threat from Al Qaeda has been vastly overblown (and see this article <http://www.commondreams.org/views04/1207-26.htm> on the people within the U.S. who are behind the hype).
Is Al Qaeda Just a Bush Boogeyman? (http://www.commondreams.org/views05/0111-31.htm)

Not only has the U.S. government hyped Al Qaeda, but it has issued numerous fake terror alerts <http://georgewashington.blogspot.com/2007/02/everyone-knows-bush-has-issued-fake.html> to scare people.

George Washington's Blog: Al Qaeda is More of a U.S. Propaganda Campaign than a Real Organization (http://georgewashington2.blogspot.com/2008/12/former-british-foreign-secretary-al.html)

[overgrowthegovt]

as is usually the case, you seem to miss the point entirely. when you couch a group's aims in the most extreme terms, any goal can be made to seem honorable or evil. these disparate groups are really after the same thing - POWER. the ends being equal, it is the means by which we should judge which is the more admirable cause. each side is fighting to gain control over a wider swath of the population, one through the use of economic and political power and the other by the indiscriminate use of explosives. now tell us again how you can see any cause to admire a group that advocates strapping on an explosive vest and wandering into a crowded marketplace.

the west may have a grand love affair with the underdog, but that doesn't make the cowardly actions of the little guy any more admirable. can you honestly say that hiding behind children and women's skirts while lobbing bombs at noncombatants is any more honorable than the horrors of collateral damage?

I was expressing it in the most extreme terms, as you say. You're right--it really comes down to power and the struggle of two factions over it. I'm saying that neither side is moral or amoral because they both want power at the expense of the other side's life/dignity/etc., and use violent and often horrific means to achieve it. I made the point that I did because it is too often assumed on these boards, even by those who oppose the wars, that the West are the good guys and the insurgents are villains. I was trying to show that that isn't the case by pointing out that at least the insurgents are fighting for power they have been deprived of, whereas the U.S./West, etc. are just trying to keep everyone else's balls on the mantlepiece. I'm not saying the insurgents are honourable--neither side is--just that they are the freedom-starved underdogs.

[kathaksung]

Al Qaida's resource

Any resistence needs resource. From money to ammunition. Vietcon had the support from two big powers - Soviet and China.

Where did the support of Al Qaida come from? Not from Saddam's Iraq, Syria, Iran. If there was, US already beat the drum to invade. Al Qaida only prosperous in Iraq after it is occupied by US army. Because they are supported by pentagon and intelligence. Bin Laden's resistence is known as Mujahiddem before 911. Everybody knows it was trained and supported by CIA. Al Qaida was only a data base in communication for Mujahiddem before 911. After 911, to prevent people to link CIA from Mujahiddem, they created Al Qaida and since blame everything on it.

But where did Al Qaida get the resource from? No nation dare to offend US - a super power. So the support must be from either from Alladin's magic Lantern or US secret budget.

Quote, The head of Pakistan’s ISI, General Mahmud Ahmed, had ordered to wire $100,000 to the leader of 911 attack, Mohammed Atta through the hand of Omar Sheikh. This has been confirmed by the director of the FBI’s financial crimes unit, Dennis Lormel.

Quote, " Musharraf names 9/11 suspect as possible British asset
Fails to mention links to 9/11, ISI, CIA
By Devlin Buckley
© Copyright 2006,

Musharraf names 9/11 suspect as possible British asset (http://fromthewilderness.com/members/102506_possible_names.php)

[kathaksung]

Who supplies weapon to Al Qaida?

What excuse the Neocon uses to have US troops staying in Iraq? Insurgence and riot. Although some people said Iraq war is like Vietnam war, it is not. There were two big countries: Soviet Union and China behind the Vietnam. It was their support of weapons and economic aids which helped North Vietnam to win the war. There was none such support for Iraq. Iran and Syria, are much weaker and smaller than Soviet Union and China then. They themselves know they are the next target of the Neocon. They dare not to offend US by supporting the Iraq insurgence. To stay in Iraq, Neocon try to make a mess in Iraq - they need a civil war of Iraq. "

Then who support the insurgence and militias and Al Qaida the weapon they need? To my analysis, there is only one suspect: US. which has motives and ability.
The following news proved it's no others than US supplied weapon to the Iraqi insurgence and militias and Al Qaida, though media use the word "missing".

Quote, "ABC News: 190,000 AK-47s Sent to Iraq Are Missing

A young boy aims an AK-47 assault rifle during clashes between ... The Pentagon cannot account for 190,000 AK-47 rifles and pistols given to Iraqi ...

ABC News - ABC News (http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=3450946)

Do you have the conception how many is 190,000? It can arm a force bigger than the whole US occupation troop in Iraq. (170,000 after surge) Whom do you think are the receipants of these "missing" weapons?

[McDanger]

did that abc news piece say where the US got the ak's from, since those weapons are not US made.

[kathaksung]

did that abc news piece say where the US got the ak's from, since those weapons are not US made.

1. The AK-47 was from US supply. That's abc news proved.

2. The common practise is to trade with East European country, a big source is from Albania. "The kla: gangsters, terrorists, and the CIA
Drug money was also laundered in the Albanian pyramids (ponzi schemes) which mushroomed ... of Northern Albania with the support of Western banking interests. ... largely small arms including Kalashnikov AK-47 rifles, RPK and PPK machine-guns, ... The proceeds of the narcotics trade has enabled the KLA to rapidly "

3. Why did they supply AK-47 not US ammunition to Iraqis? Because AK-47 is cheaper? Or they knew the weapon would go to the hands of Al Qaida and some one like you would ask this kind of question?

[GoldenBoy812]

1. The AK-47 was from US supply. That's abc news proved.

2. The common practise is to trade with East European country, a big source is from Albania. "The kla: gangsters, terrorists, and the CIA
Drug money was also laundered in the Albanian pyramids (ponzi schemes) which mushroomed ... of Northern Albania with the support of Western banking interests. ... largely small arms including Kalashnikov AK-47 rifles, RPK and PPK machine-guns, ... The proceeds of the narcotics trade has enabled the KLA to rapidly "

3. Why did they supply AK-47 not US ammunition to Iraqis? Because AK-47 is cheaper? Or they knew the weapon would go to the hands of Al Qaida and some one like you would ask this kind of question?

:apachecopter::rambo::Tomcat:

Seriously, this is conspiracy theory BS.

[higher4hockey]

Al Qaida (or most other terrrorist group) exists where US intelligence dominates. Al Qaida in US when Bush needs excuse to activate Mid-east war. That is 911 attack. Al Qaida is everywhere in Iraq now to bomb innocent civilians when US occupies Iraq. Strange to say, under the Saddam regime, there was no Al Qaida. Al Qaida seems only exist where the regime being controlled by US. So we see no Al qaida in Syria and Iran. But they appears to attack ordinary people when the government either is controlled by US intelligence or supported by US intelligence. That's why you see Al Qaida attacks in US, in Afghanistan, in Pakistan, in Iraq (after it is occupied by US). Because where they are protected by the intelligence, worked as a whip to beat people. When government want money and power, they beat the people with this whip (Al Qaida terror attack) People feel hurt then give up their civil rights and money to the government. DOJ got the Patriot Act and Pentagon got budget and Mid-east war.


im sorry, but what is the source behind your rant?

[headshake]

3. Why did they supply AK-47 not US ammunition to Iraqis? Because AK-47 is cheaper? Or they knew the weapon would go to the hands of Al Qaida and some one like you would ask this kind of question?

because the ak-47 is a much better gun than the m-16!!!

and an ak-47 is a gun, not a type of ammunition. it shoots a 7.62mm round as opposed to a 5.56mm round that the m-16 shoots.


i must go back and read this entire thread before i comment further.



-shake

[kathaksung]

im sorry, but what is the source behind your rant?

Source? All are truths. If there was a news of suicde bomber killed 56 civilians in market or Mosque, then it must have happened in US occupied Iraq not under Saddam's regime. If there was a news of terror attack, it must have been in Pakistan, Afghanistan or US occupied Iraq not in Syria or Iran or Saddam's regime because Al Qaida only survives in country where US intelligence dominated. They are supported and protected by US intelligence and its ally. That's why Bin Laden can never been caught.

Al Qaida (or most other terrrorist group) exists where US intelligence dominates. Al Qaida in US when Bush needs excuse to activate Mid-east war. That was 911 attack. Al Qaida is everywhere in Iraq to bomb innocent civilians when US occupies Iraq. Strange to say, under the Saddam regime, there was no Al Qaida. Al Qaida seems only exist where the regime being controlled by US. So we see no Al qaida in Syria and Iran. But they appear to attack ordinary people when the government either is controlled by US intelligence or supported by US intelligence. That's why you see Al Qaida attacks in US, in Afghanistan, in Pakistan, in Iraq (after it is occupied by US). Because where they are protected by the intelligence, worked as a whip to beat people. When government want money and power, they beat the people with this whip (Al Qaida terror attack) People feel hurt then give up their civil rights and money to the government. DOJ got the Patriot Act. Pentagon got fat budget and Mid-east war.

[dossantos]

Source? All are truths. If there was a news of suicde bomber killed 56 civilians in market or Mosque, then it must have happened in US occupied Iraq not under Saddam's regime. If there was a news of terror attack, it must have been in Pakistan, Afghanistan or US occupied Iraq not in Syria or Iran or Saddam's regime because Al Qaida only survives in country where US intelligence dominated. They are supported and protected by US intelligence and its ally. That's why Bin Laden can never been caught.

Al Qaida (or most other terrrorist group) exists where US intelligence dominates. Al Qaida in US when Bush needs excuse to activate Mid-east war. That was 911 attack. Al Qaida is everywhere in Iraq to bomb innocent civilians when US occupies Iraq. Strange to say, under the Saddam regime, there was no Al Qaida. Al Qaida seems only exist where the regime being controlled by US. So we see no Al qaida in Syria and Iran. But they appear to attack ordinary people when the government either is controlled by US intelligence or supported by US intelligence. That's why you see Al Qaida attacks in US, in Afghanistan, in Pakistan, in Iraq (after it is occupied by US). Because where they are protected by the intelligence, worked as a whip to beat people. When government want money and power, they beat the people with this whip (Al Qaida terror attack) People feel hurt then give up their civil rights and money to the government. DOJ got the Patriot Act. Pentagon got fat budget and Mid-east war.

Man that is some funny crazy stuff. i used to sit beside a guy like u..
everyday a new crazy idea bout kennedy or that reagan was in with the devil..
ended up killin himself..
went mad..


smoke more..
go for a walk dude..

Peace and Love to all...

[higher4hockey]

Man that is some funny crazy stuff. i used to sit beside a guy like u..
everyday a new crazy idea bout kennedy or that reagan was in with the devil..
ended up killin himself..
went mad..


smoke more..
go for a walk dude..

Peace and Love to all...

maybe....smoke less?

[kathaksung]

Quantanamo detainees (1/27/09)

Quote, "The Defense Department has said as many as 61 former Guantanamo detainees -- about 11 percent of 520 detainees transferred from the detention center and released -- are believed to have returned to the fight."
washingtonindependent.com/26969/those-61-gitmo-recidivists-keep-popping-back-up -

1. These people were released under Bush regime. So Pentagon had purpose on it. Do you think the people like Rumsfeld and Bush would free extremists to fight against them? They are famous for torture, illegal detaining. More likely these are false flag "terrorist" trained by Pentagon's Guantanamo college. They will work for the interest of US intelligence.

2. How do you know they were not brain washed, or recruited by US military or intelligence? The dirty bomb suspect, Padilla, was once designed to be the witness to prove Iraq related to dirty bomb plot, was recruited in prison. (The plan was soured after my revelation)

3. When people are aware of that 911 was a false flag attack, this becomes a typical model that government manipulate the "terrorists" to squeeze money and power from people. European country has reason to refuse those Gitmo prisoners. They are likely false flag "terrorist" working for Pentagon and US intelligence. They will play the role like Bin Laden.

[kathaksung]

Supported by Pentagon. When they fought for the interest of US, their name is Muhahideem or Islamic resistence, when they were in false flag attack, then they have a new name of Al Qaida to cut the link with the CIA and Pantagon.


In yet another example of what happens to those who challenge the system, in December 2001, Maj. Pierre-Henri Bunel was convicted by a secret French military court of passing classified documents that identified potential NATO bombing targets in Serbia to a Serbian agent during the Kosovo war in 1998. Bunel's case was transferred from a civilian court to keep the details of the case classified. Bunel's character witnesses and psychologists notwithstanding, the system "got him" for telling the truth about Al Qaeda and who has actually been behind the terrorist attacks commonly blamed on that group. It is noteworthy that that Yugoslav government, the government with whom Bunel was asserted by the French government to have shared information, claimed that Albanian and Bosnian guerrillas in the Balkans were being backed by elements of "Al Qaeda." We now know that these guerrillas were being backed by money provided by the Bosnian Defense Fund, an entity established as a special fund at Bush-influenced Riggs Bank and directed by Richard Perle and Douglas Feith.

WAYNE MADSEN REPORT - Wayne Madsen Report (http://www.waynemadsenreport.com/)

[kathaksung]

After Soviet bloc collapsed in 1992, US intelligence turned its resource once used against Soviet Union on to the Islamic bloc because of its oil tresure. A large quantity of informants converted into Islam to infiltrate the Muslim group. Padilla is one of such story. He was recruited in prison and infiltrated to the Muslim world in 92. Seven years ago, he almost became a dirty bomb witness to justify the Iraq war.

This one becomes an Al Qaida spokesman. Along with Bin Laden, the Al Qaida is under the leadship of US intelligence.


Al-Qaeda’ spokesman Adam Gadahn (a.k.a. Pearlman) is scion of Jewish ADL

Tuesday, June 16 2009 @ 03:26 PM BST

Even the (Jewish-run) mainstream media now admits that ‘Adam Ghadan’ -- an ‘Al-Qaeda’ spokesman known for making absurd calls-to-arms against ‘infidels’ and ‘Zio-Crusaders’ -- is, in fact, the grandson of a prominent board member of the Jewish Anti-Defamation League:

Haaretz: ‘Gadahn's grandfather was well-known urologist Carl Pearlman, an active member of the Jewish community in Orange County California.’

American Al-Qaeda member Adam Gadahn tells of Jewish roots in video
The Los Angeles Times
June 14, 2009

Adam Gadahn, a Southern California-raised man self-described as American Al-Qaeda has released a new video in which he talks about his Jewish ancestry.

Gadahn, known as "Azzam the American", lived in Garden Grove in the 1990s after growing up on a goat farm in rural Riverside County. The FBI said he converted to Islam as a youth, left the United States around 1998 and later was associated with senior Al Qaeda lieutenant Abu Zubaida in Pakistan and attended training camps in Afghanistan.

American Al Qaeda member Adam Gadahn tells of Jewish roots in video | L.A. Now | Los Angeles Times (http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2009/06/american-al-qaeda-adam-gadahn-talks-about-jewish-southern-california-roots-in-new-video.html)

[kathaksung]

Who supplies human resource to Al Qaida?

None of the so said "19 hijackers" were from evil axis. They were all from US allies. Because only a friendly country will help US to frame a case, to cover up a forgery story and create misinformation.

Quote, "Hijackers in the September 11 attacks - Wikipedia, the free ...
Fifteen of the hijackers were from Saudi Arabia, two from the United Arab Emirates, one from Egypt, and one from Lebanon.

Hijackers in the September 11 attacks - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organizers_of_the_September_11,_2001_attacks)

Yet Bush invaded Iraq and Afghanistan. Is that ridiculous?

[Islandborn]

Sorry this thread is so old, but with the busts recently in NY and Boston ya ask...is there an high level alqueda snitch or informant. There has been a slew of pinpoint drone attacks in Pakistan and afghanistan also. Any thoughts? Somethins up. A friend said its either french trained spies or Mossad.

[kathaksung]

Provocateurs.


Fake Al Qaeda
BBC News - 12/8/2002

Officials from the Palestinian Authority have accused the Israeli spy agency Mossad of setting up a fake al-Qaeda terrorist cell in Gaza. Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat said that Israel had set up the mock cell in order to justify attacks in Palestinian areas.
BBC NEWS | Middle East | Israel says al-Qaeda active in Gaza (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/2546863.stm)

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/fakealqaeda

[Islandborn]

As if shooting mortars and running back into mosques to hide wasn't enough to justify their actions.

[senorx12562]

Provocateurs.
Did you hear they have taken the word gullible out of the dictionary?

[kathaksung]

Unraveling the Myth of Al Qaida

By Peter Chamberlin 13 Jan 2008

The myth of "al Qaida" is built on an expansive foundation of many half-truths and hidden facts. It is a CIA creation... In order to explain away the billions of dollars worth of weapons and training that went into the operation, they chose a rich jihadi, a Saudi millionaire named Osama bin Laden, who had been a faithful recruiter and business agent of the Mujahedeen. He was painted as the sole financier of the entire enormous operation that was centered in Pakistan and Afghanistan. Bin Laden may not even have known that he was playing a part in a deceitful CIA global drama until after the fact.
Article continues--

Unraveling the Myth of Al Qaida (http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=7787)

US fight against phantom? A Bin Laden in legend but US can never touch a hair of him. A WMD in Bush's mouth but can never been found. Government always put a target there so they can squeeze money and power from people. Al Qaida becomes an universal excuse. Here is another phantom.

[kathaksung]

US fight against phantom? A Bin Laden in legend but US can never touch a hair of him. A WMD in Bush's mouth but can never been found. Government always put a target there so they can squeeze money and power from people. Al Qaida becomes an universal excuse. Here is another phantom.

Quote, " Leader of Al Qaeda group in Iraq was fictional, U.S. military says

By Michael R. Gordon
Published: July 18, 2007

BAGHDAD: For more than a year, the leader of one the most notorious insurgent groups in Iraq was said to be a mysterious Iraqi named Abdullah Rashid al-Baghdadi.

As the titular head of the Islamic State in Iraq, an organization publicly backed by Al Qaeda, Baghdadi issued a steady stream of incendiary pronouncements. Despite claims by Iraqi officials that he had been killed in May, Baghdadi appeared to have persevered unscathed.

On Wednesday, a senior American military spokesman provided a new explanation for Baghdadi's ability to escape attack: He never existed.

Brigadier General Kevin Bergner, the chief American military spokesman, said the elusive Baghdadi was actually a fictional character whose audio-taped declarations were provided by an elderly actor named Abu Adullah al-Naima.

"First, they say we have killed him," Riedel said, referring to the statements by some Iraqi government officials. "Then we heard him after his death and now they are saying he never existed. That suggests that our intelligence on Al Qaeda in Iraq is not what we want it to be."

Screensavers (http://b.casalemedia.com/V2/67072/117577/index.html?www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/forum.cgi?read=106780)

[kathaksung]

Fictional Al Qaeda
<http://www.stewebbb.com/>

Al Qaeda is nothing more than an extension of the operatus linked to US intelligence that was allowed, by script, to remove itself as a rogue break away entity of the US government, allowed to de-compartmentalise from oversight, and was run instead by Gary Best, rogue black ops specialists for scripted activity outside of the US Government, with its funding being orchestrated through the Pakistani secret police, an entity of the US Government itself.

-- Tom Heneghan, 2004 Presidential Candidate, American Patriot and Federal Whistleblower.

[kathaksung]

Young Pakistanis: Bin Laden Is A CIA Creation

Steve Watson
Tuesday, Dec 4, 2007
An ABC news piece that ran yesterday morning attracted attention after four Pakistanis who were being interviewed about the attitudes and life of young people in Pakistan declared Osama Bin Laden to be a creation of western intelligence and stressed that Islamic extremist attitudes towards the west were virtually non existent in their country before 9/11.
ABC have since pulled the video footage from their website, but an industrious prisonplanet forum member grabbed the footage and uploaded it to youtube.
Video--
<http://infowars.net/articles/december2007/041207Laden.htm>

[kathaksung]

Those who told truth about Al Qaida, were silenced by "natural disease". Because intelligence don't want others know Terrorist is its tool to control people.

There Is No 'Al Qaeda' - Ex UK Foreign Secretary

12-22-8

"The truth is, there is no Islamic army or terrorist group called Al Qaida. And any informed intelligence officer knows this. But there is a propaganda campaign to make the public believe in the presence of an identified entity representing the 'devil' only in order to drive the TV watcher to accept a unified international leadership for a war against terrorism. The country behind this propaganda is the US . . ."


-- Former British Foreign Secretary Robin Cook
Robin Cook died in August 2005 of a severe heart attack while mountain climbing in Scotland.

Wikipedia wrote:Robert Finlayson Cook (28 February 1946 - 6 August 2005), better known as Robin Cook, was a politician in the British Labour Party. He was Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs of the United Kingdom from 1997 to 2001. He resigned from his post as Leader of the House of Commons and Lord President of the Council on 17 March 2003 in protest against the 2003 invasion of Iraq. At the time of his death he was president of the Foreign Policy Centre and a vice-president of the America All Party Parliamentary Group and the Global Security and Non-Proliferation All Party Parliamentary Group...

In a column for the Guardian four weeks before his death, Cook caused a stir when he described Al-Qaeda as a product of a western intelligence:

â?? Bin Laden was, though, a product of a monumental miscalculation by western security agencies. Throughout the 80s he was armed by the CIA and funded by the Saudis to wage jihad against the Russian occupation of Afghanistan. Al-Qaida, literally "the database", was originally the computer file of the thousands of mujahideen who were recruited and trained with help from the CIA to defeat the Russians.[13] â?�

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=11487

[kathaksung]

Top Ranking CIA Operatives Admit Al-qaeda Is a Complete Fabrication
3/8/2008

'In the BBCâ??s killer documentary called The Power of Nightmares, top CIA officials openly admit, Al-Qaeda is a total and complete fabrication, never having existed at any time. The Bush administration needed a reason that complied with the Laws so they could go after â??the bad guy of their choiceâ?� namely laws that had been set in place to protect us from mobs and â??criminal organizationsâ?� such as the Mafia. They paid Jamal al Fadl, hundredâ??s of thousands of dollars to back the U.S. Governments story of Al-qaeda a â??groupâ?� or criminal organization they could â??legallyâ?� go after.'

Watch video here:
C.I.A. no al-qaeda ever existed - BBC documentary "the power of nightmares" | Polidics.com (http://polidics.com/cia/top-ranking-cia-operatives-admit-al-qaeda-is-a-complete-fabrication.html)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IAUDcmaJNWQ&feature=related

[kathaksung]

Al Qaida and real Islam resistence are treated differently.

The real Islam resistence are put to Quantanamo where they are tortured. Like Zhubadah was waterboarded. But he is not Al Qaida.

The hired tool such like Moussaoui, Bin Laden, Al Zarqawi all played a strong role to show that Al Qaida is cruel, inhuman. They aimed at common people, either its Americans or Iraqis. What they have done is to justify Bush's war policy. Any benefit to Islam? None. So Bin Laden can never been eliminated. From time to time he issued a tape when Bush needs it. A false flag that helps a lot to neocon but did nothing good to Muslim. That is Al Qaida. That's why Moussaoui cried in court, "I'm Al Qaida." Because Feds need someone to prove 911 was done by Islamic extremist not government insiders.

Zubaydah, the man CIA used to justify the waterboarding that he confessed in 35 seconds after waterboarding, has a story here.

Zubaydah Denies al-Qaida Link

WASHINGTON (AP) - Abu Zubaydah, accused of being a senior al-Qaida operative, says he has been a U.S enemy since childhood but isn't a member of the terrorist group or an associate of Osama bin Laden.

Zubaydah also told a military hearing in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, that he had been tortured in U.S. custody and confessed to things he did not do, according to a Pentagon transcript released Monday.

Zubaydah said that from 1994 to about 2000 he was a facilitator at guest houses in Pakistan, where he helped Muslims get to Afghanistan's Khalden training camp for "defensive jihad'' - that is to fight against forces that invade Muslim lands anywhere. He then helped send the trained militants on to Bosnia, Chechnya and elsewhere, he said.

"The statement that I was an associate of Osama bin Laden is false,'' Zubaydah is quoted as saying by the transcript of his March 27 hearing. "I'm not his partner and I'm not a member of al-Qaida.''

http://www.libertyforum.org/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=news_news&Number=295427552&view=collapsed&sb=6&o=21&part=1#Post295965365

[kathaksung]

Al Qaida works for US intelligence

Because OBL is an asset of CIA. The so said Al Qaida is a puppet tool works for US intelligence. They work to the demand of US intelligence.

When you try to frame a case such like 911, who will help you to make it look like a real one? The puppet Al Qaida will do. That's how you saw, the only 911 survived suspect Mousaoui (the only prepared witness) cried in court: "I'm Al Qaida". But is there anyone here can give us the story how Maosaoui joined the 911 attack? Even though Moussaoui was arrested before 911, at least there was a plan, how he joined the team? But nobody knows. The government tell you Maossaoui is Al Qaida, he was a member of 911 attack team. That's all. Why he was arrested weeks before 911 and government still not aware of that coming attack? Government never explain. Maossaoui's case was a soap play.

But I can tell you that Maossaoui was in Oklahoma. Clues tell us that Oklahoma bombing was also similar to 911 attack - a false flag terror attack. DOJ had proposed proposal similar to Patriot Act after the bombing. Only they failed to pass that law in OKC bombing case but succeeded in 911 case. Maossaoui also was a friend of Nick Berg in OKC. Nick Berg was involved in a beheading case one week after the break off of Abu Greibu prison torture scandle. The beheading case was obviously another soap opera acted to distract the public attention. Both were in place where Feds needed them. Both were used to vilify Islamic and justify Bush's war policy.

What did Al Qaida do? (the major one which caused public attention)
1. Bombing WTC in 1993. Six people died.
2. Bombing US Embassies in Kenya and Tanzabua in 1999. Though 2 hundred people died, only 12 of them were Americans.
3. Bombing USS Cole in 2000. 17 US sailors died.

None of these was big enough to touch off a war. Because the casualty was small or the target was government.

Then Al Qaida (or its master) changed its tactic. They targetted at people. This strategy change happened after Bush took over the office. Or you can view it as the mastermind of the Al Qaida change its strategy when Bush is in power.

4. 911 attack in 2001. 3 thousand people killed. Most were Americans. (The motive was to give Bush an excuse to start Mid-East war.)
5. Bali bombing in October 2002. 2 hundred people killed. Most were Australians. (Same month when the House passed a bill to authorize President Bush Iraq war power. The motive is to push Australian joining the Iraq war.)
6. Madrid bombing in 2004. 2 hundred people killed. Most were Spanish. (To push Spanish people supporting an US ally, Aznar, in election.)
7. London bombing in 2005. Killed 52 Britons. (planned to justify coming terror attack in US.)
8. Since 2005, when Al Qaida bombed Iraq Shiite Shrine in Samarra, a civil war started in Iraq. Then we saw many bombings each of which often killed tens to hundred of innocent civilians.

We can see after 2001, Al Qaida mainly targets at innocent people. Why? Because thus people in panic willingly gave up their constitutional rights and and power and money to the ruling class.

All these attackers after 2001 were died. Mostly unnecessary. (The bombers could leave the bomb there and ignit it by remote control.) Why? Because these "suicide bombers" were innocent, they didn't know they were sacrifice in the plot. Many of them might be informants of the government. But that was the best result for mastermind. A witness of their crime eliminated.

It doesn't make sense to bomb innocent people. Even for religious extremest. What could Al Qaida get from killing innocent civilians?
Kill poor people, what for? It only benefits those people who want to provoke hatred and conflict for more war.

The flaw in 911 attack caused many suspicion from people. So this time the Inside Group prepared a big one - nuclear bombing which will caused the damage of the whole city and million's casualty at the hope that people won't believe government will activate such big attack.

But they will. Because however big the attack is, the losers are always people. And, the government is always the winner - power and money. Don't you see what Bush and his group got after 911?

[kathaksung]

Al Qaida mission in Iraq - to provoke the conflict between Sunni and Shiite.(10/2/07)

Al Qaida (bear the mission to work for US intelligence) bombed Cole and US embassies in Africa, tried to give US a war excuss in Mid-east. It failed in Clinton's regime. Clinton only approved a missle bombing in Afghanistan. He knew war is an important issue not a toy, couldn't play it too easy. He was punished by Lewinsky scandal and almost be impeached from his seat.

So the inside group changed another president, Bush, who is eagerly to follow up the order of the Inside Group. Al Qaida, once again, attacked on 911. (though I believe the attack was done by the insiders, Al Qaida only took over the responsibility in the name.) Bush started the war in Mid-east, (Afghanistan and Iraq). Al Qaida's mission (to cause a war) was done.

What is Al Qaida's next mission? You know the Road map in Mid-east for the Inside Group is more war. (Iran and Syria) So US troops must stay there until more conquer is done. A peaceful Iraq surely won't justify the occupation of Iraq by US Army. That's why we saw Al Qaida once again take up its second mission - to make a mess in Iraq. Al Qaida bombed Shiite's shirine in Samarra. Its' suicide bomber killed a lot of innocent Iraqi civillians, dozens to hundred died in each bombing. How could Islam shirine and Muslim became the targets of Al Qaida? It doesn't make sense at all. But watch from the side of US intelligence, you know what is it.
They tried to provoke a civil war in Iraq so US troops has an excuse to stay, even to increase the troops there.

In 2007, Bush planned Iran war in early September. The troops he needed for war has been sent to Iraq in June in the name of "surge". The excuse for Iran war is another super 911- a nuclear attack in US on 8/30. That was when a US B-52 "mistakenly carried 6 nuclear missle" flied over states on 8/30. The plot went soured. And Bush pushes out a General to conclude "surge" is necessary in September.

Then Al Qaida mystically weakered in 2008. The death rate of civilians and US military both dropped to the bottom. Iraq war could be a hot topic in election year, the inaction of Al Qaida helped Bush's party to avoid an embarrassing issue in President campaign.

What is Al Qaida's mission, you still are not clear?

[kathaksung]

Al Qaida is a data base

Al Qaida was only a data base in internet communication before 911. After 911, US needs a convenient target to be a false flag. They created Al Qaida and blame everything on it. Bin Laden becomes a natural leader of Al Qaida. A figure bears all sin of terror activity, yet can never been captured.

Quote, "Al Quaeda is not a terror network

Wayne Madsen

Shortly before his untimely death, former British Foreign Secretary Robin Cook told the House of Commons that "Al Qaeda" is not really a terrorist group but a database of international mujaheddin and arms smugglers used by the CIA and Saudis to funnel guerrillas, arms, and money into Soviet-occupied Afghanistan. Courtesy of World Affairs, a journal based in New Delhi, WMR can bring you an important excerpt from an Apr.-Jun. 2004 article by Pierre-Henry Bunel, a former agent for French military intelligence.

"I first heard about Al-Qaida while I was attending the Command and Staff course in Jordan. I was a French officer at that time and the French Armed Forces had close contacts and cooperation with Jordan . . .

..........

The military air base of Riyadh, Saudi Arabia is called 'q eidat 'riyadh al 'askariya.' Q eida means "a base" and "Al Qaida" means "the base."

"In the mid-1980s, Al Qaida was a database located in computer and dedicated to the communications of the Islamic Conference's secretariat.

.........


"Because of the presence of 'rogue states,' it became easy for terrorist groups to use the email of the database. Hence, the email of Al Qaida was used, with some interface system, providing secrecy, for the families of the mujaheddin to keep links with their children undergoing training in Afghanistan, or in Libya or in the Beqaa valley, Lebanon. Or in action anywhere in the battlefields where the extremists sponsored by all the 'rogue states' used to fight. And the 'rogue states' included Saudi Arabia. When Osama bin Laden was an American agent in Afghanistan, the Al Qaida Intranet was a good communication system through coded or covert messages.

"Al Qaida was neither a terrorist group nor Osama bin Laden's personal property . . . The terrorist actions in Turkey in 2003 were carried out by Turks and the motives were local and not international, unified, or joint. These crimes put the Turkish government in a difficult position vis-a-vis the British and the Israelis. But the attacks certainly intended to 'punish' Prime Minister Erdogan for being a 'toot tepid' Islamic politician.

" . . . In the Third World the general opinion is that the countries using weapons of mass destruction for economic purposes in the service of imperialism are in fact 'rogue states," specially the US and other NATO countries.

" Some Islamic economic lobbies are conducting a war against the 'liberal" economic lobbies. They use local terrorist groups claiming to act on behalf of Al Qaida. On the other hand, national armies invade independent countries under the aegis of the UN Security Council and carry out pre-emptive wars. And the real sponsors of these wars are not governments but the lobbies concealed behind them.

"The truth is, there is no Islamic army or terrorist group called Al Qaida. And any informed intelligence officer knows this. But there is a propaganda campaign to make the public believe in the presence of an identified entity representing the 'devil' only in order to drive the 'TV watcher' to accept a unified international leadership for a war against terrorism. The country behind this propaganda is the US and the lobbyists for the US war on terrorism are only interested in making money."

In yet another example of what happens to those who challenge the system, in December 2001, Maj. Pierre-Henri Bunel was convicted by a secret French military court of passing classified documents that identified potential NATO bombing targets in Serbia to a Serbian agent during the Kosovo war in 1998. Bunel's case was transferred from a civilian court to keep the details of the case classified. Bunel's character witnesses and psychologists notwithstanding, the system "got him" for telling the truth about Al Qaeda and who has actually been behind the terrorist attacks commonly blamed on that group. It is noteworthy that that Yugoslav government, the government with whom Bunel was asserted by the French government to have shared information, claimed that Albanian and Bosnian guerrillas in the Balkans were being backed by elements of "Al Qaeda." We now know that these guerrillas were being backed by money provided by the Bosnian Defense Fund, an entity established as a special fund at Bush-influenced Riggs Bank and directed by Richard Perle and Douglas Feith.

WAYNE MADSEN REPORT - Wayne Madsen Report (http://www.waynemadsenreport.com/)

[kathaksung]

Young Pakistanis: Bin Laden Is A CIA Creation

Steve Watson
Tuesday, Dec 4, 2007

An ABC news piece that ran yesterday morning attracted attention after four Pakistanis who were being interviewed about the attitudes and life of young people in Pakistan declared Osama Bin Laden to be a creation of western intelligence and stressed that Islamic extremist attitudes towards the west were virtually non existent in their country before 9/11.

ABC have since pulled the video footage from their website, but an industrious prisonplanet forum member grabbed the footage and uploaded it to youtube.
Video--

<http://infowars.net/articles/december2007/041207Laden.htm>

[t3rmites]

You know, to fully understand our motivations as a nation, and to understand the motivations of our enemies, you really have to go back to WW2 and start from there.

Having formerly been convinced that the US gov't was headed the direction of the NWO, enslaving its own people to support its own interests, I must say that extensive studying of history has put everything into a new perspective, made me drop my ridiculous theories, and take a look at the world from a perspective that doesn't come from armchair conspiracy nuts, but from within my own mind.

All we do as a nation, we do to avoid an open WW3 caused by any number of factors. If it makes us look like international bullies, criminals, despicable human beings with no regard for life, etc... so be it. Because none of those things are as terrible and as ghastly as another world war will be.

You think torturing suspected terrorists is terrible? I'm one of those who says that it may be terrible, but it is less terrible than the sheer amount of torture that happens during wartime by soldiers on all sides.

There is no such thing is Eutopia, and there never will be.

I very much would like to see world peace as much as any other hippy out there, but the fact is that here in America, we're kind of poor at seeing the world as it really is, instead of how we wish it would be.

Whether al-Q is an invention of the US gov't is irrelevant. Because there will always be folks in Islam who will push for a holy war against the west. Until they are all dead, they will continue this war. That means that as long as these people are breathing, they will find a way to strike at you. DOn't believe for a second that if we were to simply pull out of the middle east, they would go away. That really does seem to be a popular mindset, and is utterly missing the point. Here is the point, borrowed from elsewhere:


Our enemies believe that they are executing Godâ??s will, and that those who oppose them also oppose God. Negotiations and dialogue are meaningless because any sort of compromise or understanding would be in conflict with what they believe to be the wishes of God. They cannot be reasoned with; they can only be killed.

Whether you like it or not, the pot has been stirred-indeed, has been stirring for hundreds of years- and these people will not simply go away quietly into the night.

My honest assessment of 9-11 is that al-Q (or at least Muslim extremists) very much carried it out, however, we DID let it happen. Now, why did we allow this to happen? Shouldn't the job of our government be to protect every single precious little life in our country?

A nation, any nation, demands sacrifice. Our whole lives are built on sacrifice vs reward. And as Robert Leckie said in his memoir, -
...sacrifice says: "Not the blood of your brother, my friend- your blood."

Your life, my life, is not as precious as you would probably like to think.

Moving on.

Lets take a step back to WW2 as I mentioned earlier. The thought coming out of this war is that another should be avoided at all costs. This is probably about the time the constitution became ignored in favor of national security. The cold war was the transition between intelligence used for battlefield warfare, and intelligence warfare as a standalone tactic. Our tactics differed not from the ones openly used now and outlined in Patriot Act 2. And the result?

It worked. USSR fell, we survived.

But then we had (have) a whole host of other issues! Namely, that everybody who was involved in the cold war is now free of USSR control. And to make matters worse, Russia couldn't keep track of its weapons, its generals, its soldiers, its agents, etc... On top of that, we probably cut people loose all over the place, no longer needing them.

So now, our national security is at stake from hundreds of unaccounted-for fronts. We have to step up our game.

This becomes increasingly difficult. The world is a nasty, nasty place, far more than us civilians can fully comprehend. And we don't care to. The population just wants to spend money, read Cosmo, and take vacations. With an attitude like that, you can hardly blame our govt for stepping it up a notch.

So, we have these very very dangerous enemies, we always have and always will whether you hear of them or not. And finally, maybe somebody gets wind of 9/11 who is in a position to stop it. And maybe they let it happen. Why they let it happen is likely never going to be clear.

I'm reminded that during WW2, we had busted open literally every major code the Axis powers used. We knew when they were going to hit, where, and how. But sometimes, you have to let 3000+ sailors die to protect your source, or the codes would be changed, and thus MORE people die. So there is a precedent.

Or maybe its as simple as this: fighting our secret small-scale wars all over the world (on every single continent on the planet, don't fool yourself.), we make enemies everywhere. AS the world becomes a more dangerous place, it becomes harder and harder to do this out of the eyes of the public, and still maintain the required resources.

Boom, boom, the towers fall, and suddenly, our leaders have a blank check to "Fight Terror!". Is there deception at play? You bet. Is it insulting, dirty, deadly, embarassing, shameful, immoral, dishonest, etc...? You bet.

But I challenge any of you living in the US without military combat experience to try and picture a world where we mobilize all of our young men to go fight and die in some nameless, useless part of the world, instead of seeking out every dirty little trick first.

It's a complex world, a world most people can't comprehend 1% of. I'm not supporting all of our actions in the US, but I will say that if it wasn't for actions just as despicable as allowing 9/11 to happen, likely none of us would even have the ability to sit on the internet and bullshit about sasquatch, you dig?

[kathaksung]

Direct Link To Military Psyops And Donald Rumsfeld

Following the trail for five minutes leads to Pentagon
Steve Watson / Infowars.net | October 5 2006

Related: Surprise Surprise, It's Another Al Qaeda Blockbuster Release <http://infowars.net/articles/October2006/021006video.htm>
Related: Atta's Father Says Video Fake, Credibility of 'Hijackers Tape' Crumbles <http://infowars.net/articles/October2006/031006faketerror.htm>
U.S. Government Caught Red-Handed Releasing Staged Al-Qaeda Videos <http://prisonplanet.com/articles/october2006/051006redhanded.htm>

Following on from our three features on the latest dubious Al Qaeda video, We can reveal that further investigation into the origin of Al Qaeda video and tape release leads straight back to US military intelligence and Donald Rumsfeld.

The origin of the latest video, starring Mohammed Atta and flight 93 hijacker Ziad Jarrah, has been swept under the carpet by the mainstream media who bizarrely admit that the government has had the tape since late 2001 but still suggest it is a new release by Al Qaeda.
Interesting also is the fact that in an NBC article <http://msnbc.msn.com/id/15082633/>, they admit that before receiving the "exclusive US analysis" of the London Sunday Times' tape, they had filed a Freedom of Information Act request for the same tape of Atta earlier this year:
"The Sunday Times said it had obtained the video â??through a previously tested channelâ?� but gave no further details. NBC News filed a Freedom of Information Act request for the videotapes early this year, but the Pentagon has not yet turned them over. "
This is an open admission that it is the Pentagon that has released this tape and not Al Qaeda. this dovetails with our previous analysis that revealed that the footage has been seen before in a docudrama, the Road to Guantanamo, where it is shown to detainees at camp Delta as an intelligence surveillance tape.

Along with experts on Islamic terrorist groups
<http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/October2006/031006Atta.htm> who are baffled by the video and have declared that it has come from a security agency, the very journalist who received the tape also says the source was not Al Qaeda. <http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/October2006/051006Atta.htm>

It is also interesting that this journalist, Yousri Fouda is not only a Sunday Times journalist but also the London Bureau Chief of Al Jazeera. He is the guy who normally breaks all the Al Qaeda tapes anyway, so really the London Times connection is just a smokescreen.
All evidence indicates that the tapes are provided to Fouda and Al Jazeera by As Sahab, the "production company" of Al Qaeda, via a group known as Intelcenter , who also SELL the videos online.

Intelcenter normally have the tapes available for sale as soon as they are released, indeed in the past they have even predicted when they are going to get a tape before it is released <http://blogs.abcnews.com/theblotter/2006/07/new_al_qaeda_ta.html>, as they did with the second London bomber tape on the anniversary of 7/7.

Intel center is run by Ben Venzke, who is an interesting character. A google search <http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Venzke%2Bidefense> results in the revelation that he used to be the director of intelligence at a company called IDEFENSE which is a verisign company.

IDEFENSE is a web security company that monitors intelligence from the middle east conflicts and focuses on cyber threats among other things.

It is also heavily populated with long serving ex military intelligence officials.
The Director of Threat intelligence, Jim Melnick, served 16 years in the US army and the Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) and worked in psychological operations. From the IDEFENSE website:

Prior to joining iDefense, Mr. Melnick served with distinction for more than 16 years in the U.S. Army and the Defense Intelligence Agency. During this period, Mr. Melnick served in a variety of roles, including psychological operations, international warning issues with emphasis on foreign affairs and information operations and Russian affairs. He also served in active political/military intelligence roles with an emphasis on foreign affairs. Mr. Melnick is currently a U.S. Army Reserve Colonel with Military Intelligence, assigned to the Office of the Secretary of Defense. Mr. Melnick has been published in numerous military and foreign affairs journals, and has received numerous military and DIA awards. Mr. Melnick has a Master of Arts in National Security and Strategic Studies from the U.S. Naval War College, a Master of Arts in Russian studies from Harvard University, and a Bachelor of Arts with Honors in Political Science from Westminster College.

So here we have a company that by it's own admission has a senior military psy-op intelligence officer who has worked directly for Donald Rumsfeld. As Intelcenter and Ben Venzke are directly connected to IDEFENSE, this puts Rumsfeld 3 small steps away from the Al Qaeda propaganda videos.

Al Qaeda Tapes: Direct Link To Military Psyops And Donald Rumsfeld (http://www.infowars.net/articles/October2006/051006Rumsfeld.htm)

[kathaksung]

Quote, "CIA: Osama Helped Bush in '04
By Robert Parry
July 4, 2006

On Oct. 29, 2004, just four days before the U.S. presidential election, al-Qaeda leader Osama bin-Laden released a videotape denouncing George W. Bush. Some Bush supporters quickly spun the diatribe as "Osama's endorsement of John Kerry." But behind the walls of the CIA, analysts had concluded the opposite: that bin-Laden was trying to help Bush gain a second term.

According to Suskind's book, CIA analysts had spent years "parsing each expressed word of the al-Qaeda leader and his deputy, [Ayman] Zawahiri. What they'd learned over nearly a decade is that bin-Laden speaks only for strategic reasons. â?¦

"Their [the CIA's] assessments, at day's end, are a distillate of the kind of secret, internal conversations that the American public [was] not sanctioned to hear: strategic analysis. Today's conclusion: bin-Laden's message was clearly designed to assist the President's reelection.
"At the five o'clock meeting, [deputy CIA director] John McLaughlin opened the issue with the consensus view: 'Bin-Laden certainly did a nice favor today for the President.'"

McLaughlin's comment drew nods from CIA officers at the table. Jami Miscik, CIA deputy associate director for intelligence, suggested that the al-Qaeda founder may have come to Bush's aid because bin-Laden felt threatened by the rise in Iraq of Jordanian terrorist Abu Musab al-Zarqawi; bin-Laden might have thought his leadership would be diminished if Bush lost the White House and their "eye-to-eye struggle" ended.

....the CIA analysts also felt that bin-Laden might have recognized how Bush's policies - including the Guantanamo prison camp, the Abu Ghraib scandal and the endless bloodshed in Iraq - were serving al-Qaeda's strategic goals for recruiting a new generation of jihadists......

.....One immediate consequence of bin-Laden breaking nearly a year of silence to issue the videotape the weekend before the U.S. presidential election was to give the Bush campaign a much needed boost. From a virtual dead heat, Bush opened up a six-point lead, according to one poll........

Consortiumnews.com (http://www.consortiumnews.com/2006/070306.html)

[kathaksung]

The CIA's Jihad
Friday 28th Jun 2002

In April, 1985, more than five years after the Soviet tanks first rolled into Afghanistan, President Ronald Reagan signed National Security Decision Directive 166, a secret order that called for the CIA to expel the Russians â??by all means available.â?? Over the next decade, the U.S. spent $10 billion to arm and train the mujaheddin. It was Americaâ??s largest covert operation since the Vietnam era.
current viewpoint (http://www.currentviewpoint.com/cgibin/news.cgi?id=11&command=shownews&newsid=294)


â?¢ 02.10.20. Indonesian Bashir believes USA has invented al-Qaida:
<http://www.gsmpro.com/article/articledt.asp?hArticleId=39>

10/20/2002
«Bashir on Friday accused the United States of inventing both al-Qaida and Jemaah Islamiyah to portray Muslims as terrorists.»

<http://www.vg.no/pub/vgart.hbs?artid=3054299>

«Bashir selv skylder på CIA og USA for å stå bak angrepet mot Bali. Han benekter også at gruppene Jemaah Islamiyah og al-Qaida eksisterer. »

â?¢ Al-qaida did not exist in Afghanistan
<http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/2897137.stm>

Friday, 28 March, 2003
«According to Dadullah, al-Qaeda did not exist in Afghanistan and he said he did not know the fate or whereabouts of Osama bin-Laden. »

â?¢ MOSSAD was caught pretending to be "Al-Qaeda" in Palestine.
<http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/fakealqaeda.html>

Anytime you hear the corporate news media mention "Al-Qaeda" it is just like in Orwell's "1984" when the telescreens would have their "Two Minutes Hate" and the sheeple would be programmed to be afraid of "Emmanuel Goldstein." A manufactured fake enemy, designed by the warmongering fanatics, to raise public fear and support for more wars to the necessary pitch.

[t3rmites]

Christ, say something other than pasting from other sources, its embarrassing.

[kathaksung]

Afghan Taliban Camps Were Built by NATO

The New York Times August 24, 1998
By TIM WEINER - WASHINGTON

The Afghan resistance was backed by the intelligence services of the United States and Saudi Arabia with nearly $6 billion worth of weapons. And the territory targeted last week, a set of six encampments around Khost, where the Saudi exile Osama bin Laden has financed a kind of "terrorist university," in the words of a senior United States intelligence official, is well known to the Central Intelligence Agency.
The C.I.A.'s military and financial support for the Afghan rebels indirectly helped build the camps that the United States attacked. And some of the same warriors who fought the Soviets with the C.I.A.'s help are now fighting under Mr. bin Laden's banner.

c (http://emperors-clothes.com/docs/camps.htm)

[kathaksung]

Pakistan: "The Taliban's Godfather"?

Documents Detail Years of Pakistani Support for Taliban, ExtremistsObtained under the Freedom of Information Act by the National Security Archive at George Washington University, the documents reflect U.S. apprehension about Islamabad's longstanding provision of direct aid and military support to the Taliban, including the use of Pakistani troops to train and fight alongside the Taliban inside Afghanistan.

Pakistan: "The Taliban's Godfather"? (http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB227/index.htm)

[kathaksung]

Afghanistan, the CIA, bin Laden, and the Taliban

by Phil Gasper

International Socialist Review, November-December 2001

The Soviet occupation, which lasted from 1979 to 1989,
The Bush administration claims to be targeting Osama bin Laden, who it says masterminded the September 11 terror attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon (even though it has offered no concrete evidence to back up this accusation), and Afghanistan's Taliban government, which is sheltering him. But as the Economist magazine noted soon after September 11, " [U.S.] policies in Afghanistan a decade and more ago helped to create both Osama bin Laden and the fundamentalist Taliban regime that shelters him."

Three weeks after Soviet tanks rolled into Kabul, Carter's secretary of defense, Harold Brown, was in Beijing arranging for a weapons transfer from the Chinese to the ClA-backed Afghani troops mustered in Pakistan. The Chinese, who were generously compensated for the deal, agreed and even consented to send military advisers.
The CIA became the grand coordinator: purchasing or arranging the manufacture of Soviet-style weapons from Egypt, China, Poland, Israel and elsewhere, or supplying their own; arranging for military training by Americans, Egyptians, Chinese and Iranians;
Beginning in 1985, the CIA supplied mujahideen rebels with extensive satellite reconnaissance data of Soviet targets on the Afghan battlefield, plans for military operations based on the satellite intelligence, intercepts of Soviet communications, secret communications networks for the rebels, delayed timing devices for tons of C-4 plastic explosives for urban sabotage, and sophisticated guerrilla attacks, long-range sniper rifles, a targeting device for mortars that was linked to a U.S. Navy satellite, wire-guided anti-tank missiles, and other equipment.

Between 1986 and 1989, the mujahideen were also provided with more than 1,000 state-of-the-art, shoulder-fired Stinger antiaircraft missiles.

By 1987, the annual supply of arms had reached 65,000 tons, and a "ceaseless stream" of CIA and Pentagon officials were
Between 1982 and 1992, some 35,000 Muslim radicals from 43 Islamic countries in the Middle East, North and East Africa, Central Asia and the Far East would pass their baptism under fire with the Afghan mujahideen

One of the first non-Afghan volunteers to join the ranks of the mujahideen was Osama bin Laden, a civil engineer and businessman from a wealthy construction family in Saudi Arabia, with close ties to members of the Saudi royal family. Bin Laden recruited 4,000 volunteers from his own country and developed close relations with the most radical mujahideen leaders. He also worked closely with the CIA, raising money from private Saudi citizens. By 1984, he was running the Maktab al-Khidamar, an organization set up by the ISI to funnel "money, arms, and fighters from the outside world in the Afghan war."

Since September 11, CIA officials have been claiming they had no direct link to bin Laden. These denials lack credibility. Earlier this year, the trial of defendants accused of the 1998 U.S. embassy bombing in Kenya disclosed that the CIA shipped high-powered sniper rifles directly to bin Laden's operation in 1989. Even the Tennessee-based manufacturer of the rifles confirmed this. According to the Boston Globe,


Afghanistan, the CIA, bin Laden, and the Taliban (http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Afghanistan/Afghanistan_CIA_Taliban.html)

FT.com / Asia-Pacific / Afghanistan - US funds madrassas in Afghanistan (http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/d1b9e546-ceb4-11dc-877a-000077b07658.html?nclick_check=1)

[kathaksung]

CIA worked with Pakistan to create Taliban"

LONDON: The Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) worked in tandem with Pakistan to create the "monster" that is today Afghanistan's ruling Taliban, a leading US expert on South Asia said here.

Harrison said: "The CIA made a historic mistake in encouraging Islamic groups from all over the world to come to Afghanistan." The US provided $3 billion for building up these Islamic groups, and it accepted Pakistan's demand that they should decide how this money should be spent, Harrison said.
Harrison, who spoke before the Taliban assault on the Buddha statues was launched, told the gathering of security experts that he had meetings with CIA leaders at the time when Islamic forces were being strengthened in Afghanistan. "They told me these people were fanatical, and the more fierce they were the more fiercely they would fight the Soviets," he said. "I warned them that we were creating a monster."

http://www.emperors-clothes.com/docs/pak.htm

[kathaksung]

Who is behind the terrorism?

The caretaker interior minister, Lieutenant General (Retd) Hamid Nawaz Khan, has done the predictable thing that he learned in PMA by saying on Saturday that India, Afghanistan and the United States had a hand in the terrorism in Pakistan. He admitted he had no proof of this involvement but that â??peopleâ?� had this perception. His â??rationalâ?� explanation did not go further than the â??circumstantial evidenceâ?� that the Taliban-Al Qaeda offensive in Afghanistan had gone down in the same measure as incidents of terrorism had gone up in Pakistan. He said suicide-bombings and other acts of organised violence needed big funding and this could come only from states unfriendly towards Pakistan.

Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan (http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2008%5C03%5C03%5Cstory_3-3-2008_pg3_1)

[kathaksung]

Iran official says U.S. behind al-Qaeda attacks
04 Mar 2006
Iran Focus

Tehran, Iran, Mar. 04 - Iran's Interior Minister accused the United States of using its infiltrators in al-Qaeda to carry out terrorist attacks that would serve its interests, government-owned newspapers in Tehran reported on Saturday.

Radical Shiite cleric Mostafa Pour-Mohammadi said that Iran had "specific intelligence" proving that the U.S. had infiltrated al-Qaeda and ordered its cells to carry out terrorist attacks to convince other members of the group that they are genuine devotees.

[kathaksung]

Bin Laden is a living plant.

In 1990, Soviet bloc collapsed. US intelligence turned its resource which used to deal with Soviet bloc to the new target - Mid-east countries which are rich in natural resource. Bin Laden, an asset of the CIA in Afghanistan war(against Russian), was revived in this new project as a false flag - Islamic extremist. He went to Sudan first in 1991.
Quote:



The Sudanese offered to arrest Bin Laden and extradite him to Saudi Arabia .

Clinton Let Bin Laden Slip Away and Metastasize (http://www.infowars.com/saved%20pages/Prior_Knowledge/Clinton_let_bin_laden.htm)



Saudi and US didn't take the offer with various excuse because Bin Laden is a living plant they deployed there.

In 1995, Bin Laden tried to set up a connection with Saddam but was refused.
Quote:



Exhaustive review finds no link between Saddam, al Qaida

A September 2006 report by the Senate Intelligence Committee concluded that Saddam was "distrustful of al Qaida and viewed Islamic extremists as a threat to his regime, refusing all requests from al Qaida to provide material or operational support."

The Senate report, citing an FBI debriefing of a senior Iraqi spy, Faruq Hijazi , said that Saddam turned down a request for assistance by bin Laden which he made at a 1995 meeting in Sudan with an Iraqi operative.

http://search.yahoo.com/404handler?src=news&fr=404_news&ref=http%3A%2F%2Ftalk.baltimoresun.com%2Fshowthrea d.php%3Ft%3D110665%26amp%3Bpage%3D12&url=http%3A%2F%2Fnews.yahoo.com%2Fs%2Fmcclatchy%2F 20080310%2Fwl_mcclatchy%2F2875005




Sudan may have felt the danger to accomodate Bin Laden. In May 1996, the Sudanese asked bin Laden to leave. He went to Afghan and stay there until now.

In August 1998, Sudan and Afghanistan were bombed by US missiles.

In 2001, after 911, Afghan, facing US invasion, made an offer but failed.
Quote:



Bush rejects Taliban offer to hand Bin Laden over
* Taliban demand evidence of Bin Laden's guilt

guardian.co.uk, Sunday 14 October 2001 22.19 BST

Remember Osama? (http://www.politic.co.uk/18142-remember-osama.html)



In Bin Laden's recent 20 years, the countries he went or tried to go, have something in common: They all have rich natural resources. Sudan and Iraq have oil. Afghan has rich mine. '
Quote:



Afghanistan to develop $3 trillion in mining potential
DUBAI | Mon Oct 25, 2010 12:14pm
Afghanistan to develop $3 trillion in mining potential | Reuters (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE69O3JP20101025)



He didn't go to Yemen, Somali or Syria for his "revolution" because they are resource poor countries, not in US interest list. He didn't go to Saudi or Kuwait. Because they are US allies. He only went to Sudan, Afghan, or Iraq (intended to) because these three countries were not controlled by US at that time. As a living plant, he gave US the excuse to activate attack on these three countries. (Even Saddam realized that Bin Laden was a dangerous living plant and rejected him, Iraq at last was invaded with an un-existed WMD)

[katsung47]

Al-Qaeda cleric exposed as an MI5 double agent

ONE of al-Qaeda's most dangerous figures has been revealed as a double agent working for MI5, raising criticism from European governments, which repeatedly called for his arrest.

Iran official says U.S. behind al-Qaeda attacks (http://www.iranfocus.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=6067)

[katsung47]

It's a western made.


Quote:
Al Qaeda in Yemen is "Western-made"
Declaration of Yemeni Prime Minister
Global Research, November 7, 2010

Yemeni Prime Minister Ali Muhammed al-Mujawar said Saturday that al-Qaida was originally a Western-made group and was never created by his country, Xinhua reported according to the state-run Saba news agency.

The prime minister's remarks were made during a meeting in the capital Sanaa with ambassadors of Asian and African countries to Yemen to clarify Yemen's stance against those who propagated negative impacts on Yemen over the bomb parcels shipped to the United States last week.

"Al-Qaida was essentially a Western-made group and was never created by Yemen, it is alleged by those who seek to propagate this view internationally about Yemen," Saba quoted Mujawar as saying.

The Yemen-based al-Qaida in the Arabian Peninsula (AQAP) on Friday claimed responsibility for the bomb parcels that targeted the United States.

Al Qaeda in Yemen is "Western-made" (http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=21803)