Chivalry is dead, and women killed it.

[DaBudhaStank]

I was idly surfing the boards when I saw the thread on Affirmative Action. In essence it was a thread on equality and fairness and what have you. That made me think about another instance of inequality in our society.

I'm speaking, of course, about the division of men and women. I will freely admit that I frequently have my moments of EXTREME sexism, but I feel that that's largely because I haven't met too many really intelligent women or women that really have anything exciting or interesting to say. I don't make this generality about all women, because I HAVE met some extraordinary ones; just very few.

Anyway, I titled this thread as such because I wanted to get an idea from women on the boards about how they view equality between men and women. I am very aware of the salary discrepancies and military service issues. Women asked to be treated equally, and they largely are. However, I see allllllllllllll the time how woman still want to be treated differently. As "women" they say. Bull. Shit. You want to play both sides of the game and you know it.

"Be romantic." No. Know why? Guys hate it. If I wouldn't be romantic with my best friend, I sure as shit probably won't be romantic with you.

"Why don't you treat me like a woman anymore?" Uhh....because you asked not to be?

Now, this is all my personal opinion, but I firmly believe that whenever a woman invokes that special right of equality, but then turns around and wants me to do something special for them, they deserve a swift punch in the jaw.

Please, give me your opinions. If nothing else this should make for some very interesting arguments.

[illnillinois]

heres a bit from seinfeld, episode The Subway:
the same thing is talked briefly between her and a stranger..

*Elaine's train. She's carrying a wedding present. A older woman approaches

her*

Woman: I started riding these trains in the forties. Those days a man would

give up their seat for a woman. Now we're liberated and we have to stand.

Elaine: It's ironic.

Women: What's ironic?

Elaine: This, that we've come all this way, we have made all this progress,

but you know we've lost the little things, the niceties.

Woman: No, I mean what does 'ironic' mean?

Elaine: Oh...

[Weedhound]

Gee....someone's got a problem with women.

And the statement about not meeting too many intelligent members of the opposite sex with exciting and/or interesting things to say.

Right back atcha' "Bro".

[birdgirl73]

. . .Now, this is all my personal opinion, but I firmly believe that whenever a woman invokes that special right of equality, but then turns around and wants me to do something special for them, they deserve a swift punch in the jaw.
Frankly, DaBudha, I think the problem you're having with women is not because of equality or your problems with that or with a lack of extraordinary women. The problem is because you're obnoxious. That comment above pretty well gave it away.

Doing something special for your girlfriend or spouse is a two-way street. My husband treats me nicely because he loves me and wants to. He opens doors, pulls out my chair, goes out of his way to say nice things, sends flowers, etc. But he doesn't have that market cornered. I do stuff for him, too. Cook for him. See that his house and clothes are clean. See that he's happy and healthy and well loved. Put love notes and gifts in his briefcase so he'll find them once he gets to his office. Do you ever look at the other side of that equation in your relationships? Somehow I'm doubting it.

Chivalry isn't dead in all man or in all people. And chivalrous behavior is not a matter of equality anyway. It's about courtesy and kindness and going out of your way for someone else. That ought to be something that both people in a relationship do gladly and without hesitation.

When you get the chip off your shoulder and work on those moments of "extreme sexism" that you mentioned, you may find that you'll suddenly find more extraordinary and intelligent women than you realized existed. Right now, I'd bet a year's pay they give you a very wide berth.

[happiestmferoutthere]

^^ Yeah! What they said!!!:mad:
( I will get banned if I say what I really think so I will just say....)
Respect goes a long way, bub!!

[illnillinois]

^^ Yeah! What they said!!!:mad:
( I will get banned if I say what I really think so I will just say....)
Respect goes a long way, bub!!

come on say it, take the ban and say whats on your mind. stand up for what you believe in and speak how you feel! a ban isn't a permanent scar..

[happiestmferoutthere]

Well... I will say if a guy tries to give me "swift punch in the jaw", I'll give you three guesses (And the first two guesses don't count!;)),where he will be hit!
**HINT** It's a bit lower than the jaw.

[illnillinois]

...

[happiestmferoutthere]

I believe we have a BINGO folks!:thumbsup:

[Stoner Shadow Wolf]

Well... I will say if a guy tries to give me "swift punch in the jaw", I'll give you three guesses (And the first two guesses don't count!;)),where he will be hit!
**HINT** It's a bit lower than the jaw.

balls, penis, stomach? lol first two dont count right?


edit: DAMN i was too slow!

[painretreat]

I think women's equality is misinterpreted by many and understood, only to those that have experienced it. Trying to understand is a nice thing to do. Getting angry and confused as a result, doesn't educate you and that seems to be what you are asking us. "What we want!"

We are women. We don't wanted treated like a man, with him holding a cocktail as we walk in the door from work and our shoes removed, carassed and asked "how was your day honey?" We do that for men and a real woman likes it when he does do that once in a while, regardless of equality or not! It is human kindness and makes anyone feel respected and loved by that special person!

Opening a car door is an individual thing--I don't think manners and respect need legislated.

IT IS EQUAL PAY AND TREATMENT IN THE WORK PLACE. NO GLASS CEILING! Sure, we do not have the muscle mass of men. I for one, could never have been a soldier with the physical requirements of strength!

When a new hire "male" comes to work, in a place you've been 7 years and he makes double your pay and you are his boss--that is a big one! Then in a few months he is head of the department!

For me, that is just one of very many issues. Even though I am not black--I am begining to think that it is much deeper for them, in ways that have been mentioned.

I PRAY FOR WORLD PEACE! When we lose discrimanation, in all forms--it will happen! pr

[Stoner Shadow Wolf]

so long as there are misinformed people and people who choose to ignore the facts (we call them ignorant) there will always be prejudice, descrimination, and ignorant hate.

[GreenDestiny]

Most of the girls I've known and dated didn't seem to appreciate anything romantic I did for them... so I eventually just stopped doing it and treated them as an equal; they didn't seem to like that... go figure....

I just haven't met the right girl that will appreciate what I have to offer. That's all.

But, yeah, most females I have encountered do seem to want special treatment, and they can get extremely picky about it too. For example, they'll want all these niceties done for them and in return they allow us to be with them - dating, companionship, sex, etc.... as if it's some kinda divine privilege since they can always pick a "better guy" to be with that they can manipulate easier. On the other hand, most guys I've encountered expect too much sex and will manipulate girls for it..... but it doesn't surprise me since it's usually one of the few benefits they receive from a relationship. Guys end up doing all this chivilrous stuff to get laid, so then it's no surprise when a girl is over cautious and doesn't reciprocate with nice gestures.

We're both to blame... equally. lol

The women I get along with the most are lesbians; lesbians are awesome... I wish I was one...


On a tangent note, it makes me sick to be exposed to male breasts all the time while female breasts are censored/hidden from public view. Just because ours do not function we get to go topless without anything to cover them up? Ladies, you shouldn't have given up on the bra burning! (I support topless equality)

[Weedhound]

GD....Your "tangent note" makes me think "what you are offering" that women don't seem to find attractive is the viewpoint stated right there.

Guess what....we're NOT all about the sex organs.....surprise!!

[SunnyD]

If I wouldn't be romantic with my best friend, I sure as shit probably won't be romantic with you

oh boy...tsk tsk tsk...Have you ever "made it" with a lady?...if you haven't...that's why you feel this way...

You must be very familiar with Jill...

Let me introduce you (those who don't know Jill) to Jill

Look at your right hand palm down, what do the lines of your fingers spell?
1.) Thumb + forefinger = "J"
2.) Middle Finger = "I"
3.) Ring and Pinky = two "L"'s...

[stinkyattic]

I firmly believe that whenever a woman invokes that special right of equality, but then turns around and wants me to do something special for them, they deserve a swift punch in the jaw.

Please, give me your opinions.
All right, you asked for it...

The world gives back what you put into it. No wonder chicks treat you like shit. You come across in this post like a guy who deserves it.

Try punching THIS chick, with both a military and commercial fishing background, supplemented by a lot of time as a farm laborer, in the jaw... If it weren't for the ever-so-fashionable sparkly right hand ring, you'd think the mark was left by a man. And I still really DO blush and giggle and get my nails did and let dudes hold the door for me and wear skirts and heels and have a cute boyfriend who takes me out for dinner and I cook a mean lasagne.

But at the end of the day, the name on the check that pays for my house and car is MINE. And when I need someone to come by with a trailer, or help me move something heavy, I wait until lawn mowing day and throw the landscaper another 40 bucks to add another job to the visit. Simple, business, done. It comes to mind that if you are doing a favor for a chick just because you want to get laid- lolol that's not a real favor! And since when is equality a 'special right'?

Do you even know the MEANING of chivalry? The world has changed a lot since women were not allowed to vote or own property, and were considered the property of their husband or father. There's a difference between being genuinely nice while being respectful, and being 'nice' in a way that demeans the recipient of your fake niceness. Maybe if you have outdated expectations, you should move to Saudi Arabia, where your wife will not be allowed to drive a car or work without your permission, and you can be the attentive husband and throw her a bone every so often- you know, hold the door for her, or bring her home flowers, because hey, in the big scheme of things, you can afford such tokens of chivalry without any risk to your own power in the household!

Sorry you want girls to play Damsel in Distress for ya... I'm not into that particular fetish, bro.

[TurnyBright]

Does it really cause you that much trouble to do little nice things for a woman because they're a woman, and not do majorly unfair things for a woman because they're a woman?

[SunnyD]

P.S. - I wasn't implying I do favors for "special" return favors Stinky (If you referred to me in your post...)

Me and my better half are doing quite well

[stinkyattic]

Did I quote you? No. Directed at the comment in the quote box.

[apocolips31]

Women have equal rights but, do they have equal responsibility's? Example: If the USA were to get into a big war where we needed drafts, who would be the ones getting drafted?

[Breukelen advocaat]

A large part of the unfairness towards women, and others, throughout history is due to the influence of religion. When I was single and dating, I was frequently confounded by so-called "liberated" women who clung to their religous beliefs. This did not impress me as being very intelligent.

[ralphbuick]

We can't keep blaming it on something else. Let's just be men, and stand up for our oppressive leanings: "Yes, it was us, we did it! It's a fair cop. I'm soo bad!"

[stinkyattic]

I think in response to the draft question, that's a good point. I'm in favor of equal-opportunity draft, in theory (explained below). However you do remember that in wartime, women traditionally have put in a great effort in the factories, where they can both 'hold down the fort' and also do work towards supplying the war machine.
The biggest issue with a draft that included women that I can see is how would one draw the line with children? Obviously a pregnant woman cannot be drafted; would women then be compelled to get KTFU to avoid a draft? I mean, already, some *cough* skeezy *cough* chicks have kids for welfare or child support bucks; hell, my buddy's ex has the hat trick, and da daddies all make bank. Bitch never needs to work again. Anyway, I think it would cause a LOT of problems. Let's just hope we never have another draft...

[apocolips31]

I know women contributed greatly to WW2 in the factory's,but working in a relatively safe environment and putting your neck in the line of fire are two completely different things. Why shouldn't it be both working in the factory's during draft times and on the battlefield as well? As to what you said about women getting pregnant to avoid a draft well that is what some women have been doing forever to get paid! lol. But not every women would be willing to get pregnant to dodge the draft. If they wanted to go that far they could just go to Canada lol.

[stinkyattic]

I totally agree that it should be on the battlefield too, but good fucking luck with that.
Only those with money could afford to go to Canada... and any broad with one functional ovary and a case of Natty in the fridge can get herself a sperm donor... and not have to even go as far as the mailbox.

[grow1964]

I haven't met too many really intelligent women or women that really have anything exciting or interesting to say.

Now, this is all my personal opinion, but I firmly believe that whenever a woman invokes that special right of equality, but then turns around and wants me to do something special for them, they deserve a swift punch in the jaw.

Please, give me your opinions. If nothing else this should make for some very interesting arguments.

Well right off the bat I would say that women with any intelligence probably avoid you like a bad habit.
Intelligence usually attracts intelligence so You may need to look no further than yourself to determine why you arent meeting smarter women. My guess is you dont put yourself in places where more intellgent women are. Even if you were, I doubt you will find many women who are intelligent who also want to risk being punched in the jaw but good luck with that anyway.

Overall I would say your post was pretty unintelligent so IMO a 2 dollar crack ho would be more your speed. Just my opinion though.

[suhl]

oh my god. best thread title i have ever seen on here, and funniest thread ever. you could almost set your watch to some of the responses. except for the one of the huge pair of animal nuts, that was a most welcome curveball. the shit eating grinng of the woman touching the balls that is too funny. haa

[DaBudhaStank]

My my, leave for 24 hours and look where things go...

I'm not quite sure why, but every single woman on here seems to think I either

A. Don't respect women.
B. Think women are inferior.
C. Have never had sex nor been in a relationship.

As misguided and incorrect as all those views are, they are still personal to everyone and I can't really hassle you about them.

Anywho, I stand by my main point. Equality is essentially defined by itself, in that the word means exactly what it says. If you would do something for one side and not for another, you are conciously and purposefully shooting down equality. Therefore, you cannot be a woman and expect a man to treat you like he will other men. I do not expect in the slightest for a woman to treat me as she would another woman. I firmly believe that equality (much like peace) is a lie, a dream conjured up by the oppressed. Would I totally dig it if it worked? Of course, but I highly doubt it ever will.

I also cannot say that I help to encourage equality by my very nature, since I don't believe it's actually real. And no, the fact that I havn't met many intelligent women actually has nothing to do with my attitude, because I'm not one bit in person as I am on these boards. On the internet, one can say anything with near impunity. If I had said my TRUE views in reality, I can imagine the backlash would be much the same as is seen here.

[DaBudhaStank]

All right, you asked for it...

The world gives back what you put into it. No wonder chicks treat you like shit. You come across in this post like a guy who deserves it.

Try punching THIS chick, with both a military and commercial fishing background, supplemented by a lot of time as a farm laborer, in the jaw... If it weren't for the ever-so-fashionable sparkly right hand ring, you'd think the mark was left by a man. And I still really DO blush and giggle and get my nails did and let dudes hold the door for me and wear skirts and heels and have a cute boyfriend who takes me out for dinner and I cook a mean lasagne.

But at the end of the day, the name on the check that pays for my house and car is MINE. And when I need someone to come by with a trailer, or help me move something heavy, I wait until lawn mowing day and throw the landscaper another 40 bucks to add another job to the visit. Simple, business, done. It comes to mind that if you are doing a favor for a chick just because you want to get laid- lolol that's not a real favor! And since when is equality a 'special right'?

Do you even know the MEANING of chivalry? The world has changed a lot since women were not allowed to vote or own property, and were considered the property of their husband or father. There's a difference between being genuinely nice while being respectful, and being 'nice' in a way that demeans the recipient of your fake niceness. Maybe if you have outdated expectations, you should move to Saudi Arabia, where your wife will not be allowed to drive a car or work without your permission, and you can be the attentive husband and throw her a bone every so often- you know, hold the door for her, or bring her home flowers, because hey, in the big scheme of things, you can afford such tokens of chivalry without any risk to your own power in the household!

Sorry you want girls to play Damsel in Distress for ya... I'm not into that particular fetish, bro.

I'm sorry Stinky but, I honestly have no clue how you came to most of you're conclusions.

I never once said I wanted my wife to do anything special for me. In fact, I DON'T want her to do anything special for me. I also DON'T want to have to do anything special for her. If we love each other. that's enough. Also, I never said equality was a "special right". It's God-Given (provided there is a God). However, if you ever ask me to do something I wouldn't do for you, one of our asses is on the curb, and I don't particularly mind if it's mine, because at least I would be away from hypocrisy.

[DaBudhaStank]

I probably shouldn't mention the fact that most people are going out of their way to insult me and that the two mods who've responded to the thread (who are women) most likely won't do anything about it. But I just did, so that's that. Luckily it's nearly impossible to insult me, because everyone takes life FAAAAAAAAAAAAAAR too seriously. I'm extremely glad that I don't.

Do I smell a ban-hammer descending upon me? Perhaps.

[birdgirl73]

DaBudha, before you go accusing folks of insulting you, you might want to have someone else read your original thread back to you aloud so you can see if you can hear how it sounded.

Trust me, it was offputting. Particularly the remark about someone deserving a swift punch in the jaw but also the parts where you editorialized about sexism and equality. And now you don't like that. I even got a note from one of the guy moderators saying could "smell the misogyny" in your comments, so it wasn't just women who took you that way.

Seriously, take a step back and conduct yourself a little independent focus group on that original post by having an objective bystander, maybe one of each gender, to give you their candid responses. You asked for people to respond with their opinions and that's what happened. It didn't appear to any of the rest of us on the mod team that you got anything more in response than some candid opinions. If you'd gotten all-out flamed in response, we would indeed have responded. We get a lot of this here. People tell others what they think and then yell "insult" when they don't like what people say, but a personal insult is not the same thing as what you received in those responses. The comment that came closest to meriting the deletion of the thread for moderation reasons was your original post.

You're not going to be infracted or banned for expressing what you did at the top or bottom of this thread, nor is anyone who responded. But if you're not liking what you're hearing, you might want to take a step back before you post further opinions. On this thread specifically you'd probably do well to stop while you're ahead.

[ipodguy]

I was idly surfing the boards when I saw the thread on Affirmative Action. In essence it was a thread on equality and fairness and what have you. That made me think about another instance of inequality in our society.

I'm speaking, of course, about the division of men and women. I will freely admit that I frequently have my moments of EXTREME sexism, but I feel that that's largely because I haven't met too many really intelligent women or women that really have anything exciting or interesting to say. I don't make this generality about all women, because I HAVE met some extraordinary ones; just very few.

Anyway, I titled this thread as such because I wanted to get an idea from women on the boards about how they view equality between men and women. I am very aware of the salary discrepancies and military service issues. Women asked to be treated equally, and they largely are. However, I see allllllllllllll the time how woman still want to be treated differently. As "women" they say. Bull. Shit. You want to play both sides of the game and you know it.

"Be romantic." No. Know why? Guys hate it. If I wouldn't be romantic with my best friend, I sure as shit probably won't be romantic with you.

"Why don't you treat me like a woman anymore?" Uhh....because you asked not to be?

Now, this is all my personal opinion, but I firmly believe that whenever a woman invokes that special right of equality, but then turns around and wants me to do something special for them, they deserve a swift punch in the jaw.

Please, give me your opinions. If nothing else this should make for some very interesting arguments.

As a guy with both lesbian parents and an amazing girlfriend I would like to give my opinion on your post.

First of all, I have to agree with Birdgirl when she said you come off a little hateful against women when you say you have never met an intelligent woman and also when you said you would punch a woman in the jaw.

Secondly, you go on to generalize all men when you say that no man likes to be romantic with his significant other. While this may be alright for you, I happen to love being romantic with my girlfriend and I believe I speak for the both of us when I say that we both enjoy being romantic with each other.

Now as far as equality goes I believe its all about choice. When you said you would never be romantic with your best friend I believe that he would thank you for that because that would involve a serious life CHOICE for you. I choose to be romantic with my girlfriend and not with my best friend because I choose to be heterosexual and I believe that this has nothing to do with equality between men and women.

As far as salaries drafts being equal between sexes, I think there is still a long way to go.

[GreenDestiny]

GD....Your "tangent note" makes me think "what you are offering" that women don't seem to find attractive is the viewpoint stated right there.

Guess what....we're NOT all about the sex organs.....surprise!!

Primary function of mammary glands is milk production. The fact that they're very sensitive to stimulation for sexual arousal is just a fringe benefit. Ears, neck, lips, legs, and other body parts are also sensitive for sexual arousal but those don't get censored unless you're in some backwards oppressive society. Since breasts have no relevant part in actual sexual reproduction, they're not really sex organs; they're just one of the several body parts sensitive for sexual arousal. Nothing taboo about that, it's something to be thankful for and proud of.

Sometimes I really think I should be in a hippy nudist colony.

I've got nothing against a woman wanting to enhance the shape of breasts or hold them in place. But if they don't care about their freedom of choice to go totally topless if they really wanted to, it's just one more hurdle for them towards equality. And I have dated girls that share those views.... us youngins aren't so old-skool heheheh.

(didn't mean to jack the thread, was just replying to WH.)

[DaBudhaStank]

Is there a difference between hitting a man or a woman in the face? I ask you.

[NaughtyDreadz]

Is there a difference between hitting a man or a woman in the face? I ask you.

uh... when I hit a man in the face, they NEVER ask for more...

women on the other hand...

giggidy giggidy, giggidy goo............

[rebgirl420]

Frankly, DaBudha, I think the problem you're having with women is not because of equality or your problems with that or with a lack of extraordinary women. The problem is because you're obnoxious. That comment above pretty well gave it away.

Doing something special for your girlfriend or spouse is a two-way street. My husband treats me nicely because he loves me and wants to. He opens doors, pulls out my chair, goes out of his way to say nice things, sends flowers, etc. But he doesn't have that market cornered. I do stuff for him, too. Cook for him. See that his house and clothes are clean. See that he's happy and healthy and well loved. Put love notes and gifts in his briefcase so he'll find them once he gets to his office. Do you ever look at the other side of that equation in your relationships? Somehow I'm doubting it.

Chivalry isn't dead in all man or in all people. And chivalrous behavior is not a matter of equality anyway. It's about courtesy and kindness and going out of your way for someone else. That ought to be something that both people in a relationship do gladly and without hesitation.

When you get the chip off your shoulder and work on those moments of "extreme sexism" that you mentioned, you may find that you'll suddenly find more extraordinary and intelligent women than you realized existed. Right now, I'd bet a year's pay they give you a very wide berth.

THANK YOU.

[GreenDestiny]

Is there a difference between hitting a man or a woman in the face? I ask you.

really no difference at all....

but violence IS violence. and violence is wrong, unless it is a last resort attempt to save yourself from danger.

[stinkyattic]

If you hit someone smaller than you are, that makes you a bully. So unless you are 5'2 with a 6'4 girlfriend, who you still shouldn't hit because you happen to LIKE her, just like you wouldn't hit your OTHER friends, at the VERY LEAST that would make you a bully. Which wasn't cool in kindergarten and isn't cool now.
No one intends to ban you, but I can still think you don't have this whole equality thing figured out.
This is one sentence I had a hard time understanding:
However, if you ever ask me to do something I wouldn't do for you, one of our asses is on the curb, and I don't particularly mind if it's mine, because at least I would be away from hypocrisy.
I think you meant 'if you ask me to do something you wouldn't do for me'. You never stated that in your original post, and anything my BF would do for me, I'd be delighted to return the favor. I ask him to come help my sister move, I'll be happy to help his best buddy move next weekend. That's not chivalry, that's just being a good neighbor! You seem to make it out to be a BAD thing that a woman can turn around and help a man... Geez.
I guess I just don't get it.

[Weedhound]

Stinky there's nothing to get. He's got problems and feels ok blaming the opposite sex for them. GD there is the same.....only a bit more subtle.

They're angry that they can't control themselves and their stone age thoughts about women. That's obviously womens' fault.

There's an old saying from the TV Murphy Brown and it goes like this which is exactly along the same line these guys are playing. "Men still wouldn't know how to stand up straight if stores hadn't started putting beer on the top shelves."

Who they are shows in what they state. Simple.

[Breukelen advocaat]

In order for the human race to survive, and evolve, protection of the children and females was necessary. It is a genetic trait for men to do this.

When I was young, I was told by my mother that when walking with a lady, a gentleman takes the street side of the sidewalk. I later learned that this goes back to olden times, when horses and animals were often in the street. Some women who are comfortable with themselves are still charmed by these token acts of chivalry.

[stinkyattic]

See, I think that's the crux of it, and I was also taught about the sidewalk bit, and notice when it is done. The little things like holding doors and walking on street side ARE charming; I don't consider them NECESSARY as in something that all men are supposed to do for all women, but still CONSIDERATE. If someone doesn't hold the door, I don't care if it's a man or woman, it's just kinda irritating when the stupid thing swings back in your face.

[DaBudhaStank]

Stinky there's nothing to get. He's got problems and feels ok blaming the opposite sex for them. GD there is the same.....only a bit more subtle.

They're angry that they can't control themselves and their stone age thoughts about women. That's obviously womens' fault.

There's an old saying from the TV Murphy Brown and it goes like this which is exactly along the same line these guys are playing. "Men still wouldn't know how to stand up straight if stores hadn't started putting beer on the top shelves."

Who they are shows in what they state. Simple.

I have problems. Gee thats a very acute observation. And you don't, right? Of course I have problems friend. If I didn't, I wouldn't be much of a human being.

Unfortunately, you're wrong. I don't blame women for anything. I'm starting to believe that most people don't actually read the original post, because some of the comments here are just mind boggling...

[GreenDestiny]

Stinky there's nothing to get. He's got problems and feels ok blaming the opposite sex for them. GD there is the same.....only a bit more subtle.

Maybe you misunderstood a couple of my original statements that said "I just haven't met the right girl that will appreciate what I have to offer. That's all." and "We're both to blame... equally."

The first one was my subtle way to say I'm not perfect and what I 'have to offer' isn't what most girls want, and I've yet to meet the girl that I am the most compatible with. There's lots about me that doesn't jive with most females, and I accept it.... never putting any blame solely on them. If I'm not the right one for them, then they're not the right girl for me; vice versa. That sounds about equal to me.

The second, of course, means I'm taking equal blame... It's always a two-way street in relationships. I know it's not always gonna be both mine AND a girl's fault each time for when things don't work out, but it's a basic 50/50 chance whom is to blame or a combination of both.... so it's easier to assume an average of equal blame. Law of averages rocks my world :)

I debate most things from both sides, I don't hide my thoughts in doublespeak.

And no stone age thoughts here... (nice try with the insults)

[TurnyBright]

I'm starting to believe that most people don't actually read the original post, because some of the comments here are just mind boggling...

OK, lets do a bit of role-playing here. Read your original post, and respond to it the way you think someone SHOULD. You might find it difficult to write a response agreeing with yourself without sounding even more sexist and ignorant than you did in the first place.

[foxysox]

You know, I've been thinking about this. And I've decided that the concept of chivalry itself is outdated. The remnants of 'chivalry' still have a place in our social customs, if both parties can give and accept them with grace and mutual respect. But to me, the word refers to an action done to protect someone weaker than yourself- the OPPOSITE of bullying. As with all things, create true equality so that neither party is truly 'weaker', and you will find that good behaviour lies in the middle, with maybe just a dash of 'awwww how charming' tossed in for flava.

[Weedhound]

OK, lets do a bit of role-playing here. Read your original post, and respond to it the way you think someone SHOULD. You might find it difficult to write a response agreeing with yourself without sounding even more sexist and ignorant than you did in the first place.

Thank you....this is the best answer I have heard so far. Beautifully said.

GD....please.....you couldn't care less about womens' right and you know it. You're just excited to be talking about "boobs" in any way, shape OR form with women and trying to couch it in some sort of "discussion" to sound like you actually give a shit what they think.

Whether or not you think so.....the drooling shows. We weren't born yesterday.

[Weedhound]

And here's the problem that everybody mixes up chivalry with.....it's the same as manners. It's called treating someone decently and it's getting more and more rare these days.

Shall we toss out manners as well? We appear to be well on the way already.

[stinkyattic]

...it's the same as manners.
Shall we toss all those too?

Lolcat sez:
Manners iz ded.
Teh intertubes killd it.

(So iz grammr. Same culprit.)

[Weedhound]

wotdidusay?

[daihashi]

oh my god. best thread title i have ever seen on here,

So Plagirism is the best you've seen for a thread title. The thread title came from a stand up skit by the Comedian Dave Chappelle. Personally I prefer a bit more originality or genuinity, but if you find people claiming other people's words as their own then sure.... I guess it would be the best thread title ever :thumbsup:


you could almost set your watch to some of the responses.

There are many things you could set your watch to.. Of course many of the responses are going to be predictable just because the nature of the post. It is extremely insulting and sexist.

Good job throwing your two cents in; which is the approximate value of this thread. :thumbsup:

[daihashi]

My my, leave for 24 hours and look where things go...

I'm not quite sure why, but every single woman on here seems to think I either

A. Don't respect women.
B. Think women are inferior.
C. Have never had sex nor been in a relationship.

As misguided and incorrect as all those views are, they are still personal to everyone and I can't really hassle you about them.

Anywho, I stand by my main point. Equality is essentially defined by itself, in that the word means exactly what it says. If you would do something for one side and not for another, you are conciously and purposefully shooting down equality. Therefore, you cannot be a woman and expect a man to treat you like he will other men. I do not expect in the slightest for a woman to treat me as she would another woman. I firmly believe that equality (much like peace) is a lie, a dream conjured up by the oppressed. Would I totally dig it if it worked? Of course, but I highly doubt it ever will.

I think you're ignoring the fact that you said most women are not intelligent. Whether you felt this to be true or not it probably should not have been voiced aloud as it just reaks of ignorance. In addition you are confusing courtship to equal rights.

In the end as human beings we are still animals. Just about every species in the animal Kingdom has a courting process they go through when trying to select a mate. We are no different. These "inequalities" you speak of are simply courting behavioral patterns that have been instilled in us for a very long time.


also cannot say that I help to encourage equality by my very nature, since I don't believe it's actually real. And no, the fact that I havn't met many intelligent women actually has nothing to do with my attitude, because I'm not one bit in person as I am on these boards. On the internet, one can say anything with near impunity. If I had said my TRUE views in reality, I can imagine the backlash would be much the same as is seen here.

So basically you're a tough guy behind a keyboard? Are these things you would never say in public? Why be a person on an internet forum when you're not that person in real life? Honestly that's just pathetic, be yourself no matter where you are or who you're with.

I don't believe you've strengthened your argument at all with this post, you've just weakened it.

[daihashi]

I probably shouldn't mention the fact that most people are going out of their way to insult me and that the two mods who've responded to the thread (who are women) most likely won't do anything about it. But I just did, so that's that. Luckily it's nearly impossible to insult me, because everyone takes life FAAAAAAAAAAAAAAR too seriously. I'm extremely glad that I don't.

Do I smell a ban-hammer descending upon me? Perhaps.

You actually seem to be trying to provoke a ban or suspension. No one has said ban and you are ignoring the fact that you just slammed an entire Gender. People are only insulting you.

I'm glad you feel confident to post your thoughts on a forum and I can understand what it is you were trying to say however you did it all wrong. You came across as very abrasive and sexist. You even self admit to extreme sexism at times. You honestly expected to make this thread, say all that.. then acknowledge the fact that you're hiding behind your keyboard and not get any backlash.

You say you haven't met any intelligent women.. I am beginning to believe that it's because you are socially inept and are lacking common sense.

[daihashi]

Unfortunately, you're wrong. I don't blame women for anything. I'm starting to believe that most people don't actually read the original post, because some of the comments here are just mind boggling...

Pot calling the kettle black? Go back and re-read your own post. You have a plethora of people telling you that what you said is really messed up. Perhaps you should re-read what you said and think it over.

If you still feel you've said nothing wrong then you are extremely obtuse in nature and I would have to say I would be glad to not know you in real life. :wtf:

[Hollywierdtoker]

Can anyone now please explain to me what equality is?
I think everyone has a different view...

To debate a subject that is purely opinion is crazy.
On the otherhand the OP did come off a little uhhh.... like an ignorant asshole, but I just don't think he is explaining himself well.

I think we should just treat eachother as equals, but also show the utmost respect for one another. And please be nice to your "ladyfriend" because she isn't just a piece of meat...she has feelings, thoughts, and opinions too! Same goes for you ladies to your "boytoys" haha....

And no punching people in the jaws unless that's how you both like to get down...

PLUR. Peace, love, unity, respect.
Word.

[stinkyattic]

My take is this:
Equality means that if a couple were to split up, each would still be able to maintain a respectable standard of living (without alimony, which doesn't count lol), but as a team, they bring each of their capabilities into a pretty nice existence that is at least the sum of its parts.
Equality means having your own assets and education independent of your partner.
It means splitting up responsibilities based upon what each person likes to do, and is good at, instead of 'because you are a man' or 'beacuse you are a woman'.

I hate washing dishes. I love cooking. My equal partner hopefully would be someone who thinks that loading the dishwasher is a good trade for a gourmet meal! I don't mind cleaning the bathtub, but can someone taller than me PLEASE deal with the shower curtain hangers so I don't break my damn neck?
See what I'm getting at?

Equality means a division of labor that does not cause resentment in either party.

[Dave Byrd]

Pot calling the kettle black? Go back and re-read your own post. You have a plethora of people telling you that what you said is really messed up. Perhaps you should re-read what you said and think it over.

Daihashi, this and your last two posts were very good. I tried to positive-rep you but it says I have to spread some rep around first. I will come back to do so. You definitely deserve good rep on that.

I'm more and more convinced that the smartest, most interesting and perceptive people in the world are women. My female colleagues and the female nurses in our hospitals work with patients and see things on a whole different level than men do. It's amazing and it's a nice complement to the way we do business, and I appreciate it more the longer I witness it. Men are effective, too, obviously. It's the perception and intuitive nature they edge us on, I think.


My take is this:
Equality means that if a couple were to split up, each would still be able to maintain a respectable standard of living (without alimony, which doesn't count lol), but as a team, they bring each of their capabilities into a pretty nice existence that is at least the sum of its parts.
Equality means having your own assets and education independent of your partner.
It means splitting up responsibilities based upon what each person likes to do, and is good at, instead of 'because you are a man' or 'beacuse you are a woman'.

I hate washing dishes. I love cooking. My equal partner hopefully would be someone who thinks that loading the dishwasher is a good trade for a gourmet meal! I don't mind cleaning the bathtub, but can someone taller than me PLEASE deal with the shower curtain hangers so I don't break my damn neck?
See what I'm getting at?

Equality means a division of labor that does not cause resentment in either party.
This is one of the best explanations of equality I've ever read because it's practical and functional. Accurate, too.

I think equality in partnership or marriage is a give and take thing. It's not always totally equal, either. The boundaries move. Sometimes one person's carrying more of the load than the other, but it evens out in other ways. Successful pairings seem to depend on that flexibility so they can weather the rough patches like sickness versus health or poor versus rich, if that makes sense. I think that's why they put those words in wedding vows--to remind couples they've got to be flexible during the rough times.

[painretreat]

Stinky: I could have written that! Exactly what and how I feel and do! Not only do I dislike doing the dishes, I hate to take the trash out. But, i do it!

Equal work should be equal pay! I don't know the present stats, but women still make less money than men for the same work, in most case's; not all!

Comparing men to women is like comparing medical mj to mexico schwagg! There are exceptions. I've seen men that can't do more than a weak woman and women that have the strength of some men.

We are not built equal. So we make up for it with manners and human compassion. That makes things a little more equal.

On another note: Who says life is fair! If were equal in every physical aspect-then what?

Dave, you are a wise man. Bring up an important point. WE do need to keep our minds open to learn and grow! Always improving ourselves! pr:hippy:

[GreenDestiny]

GD....please.....you couldn't care less about womens' right and you know it. You're just excited to be talking about "boobs" in any way, shape OR form with women and trying to couch it in some sort of "discussion" to sound like you actually give a shit what they think.

Whether or not you think so.....the drooling shows. We weren't born yesterday.


The fact that I have a great fondness for natural breasts has nothing to do with my views on womens' rights. Because I openly admire a part of the female body doesn't mean that I care nothing about their rights.

I suggested a new right for women to have, the right to be equally topless (despite my own personal/selfish feelings for it), and then you twisted it around to make it look like I don't care about their rights. I fail to make sense of your logic. You're not the sole spokesperson for all females; some really would like to have that extra freedom.

Your retorts sadden me, accusing me of not caring. I don't know why you're trying to argue with me using such misplaced accusations, I can't read your mind so whatever lead you to your conclusions I am not quite certain. I don't believe I've said anything to make myself sound sexist. You're a real cool lady, I hate to see you making generalizations and petty attacks at my character.

come on... truce!

[stinkyattic]

Boobies? Where?
Awwwww false alarm dammit:D

I got another flash of clarity... might have been the hexane fumes at work, or the tedious labor, buuuuut....

Early in the thread the concept of secure vs. insecure women and their responses to 'chivalrous' acts was brought up.
From where I sit, I'd like to remind the Y chromosome set that it would not make a man who is secure in his own gender image uncomfortable if his girlfriend wanted to pay for dinner.

You know what killed chivalry? Kindergarten teachers. Those evil creatures, in their flowered dresses and comfortable brown shoes, are teaching OUR CHILDREN that sharing and taking turns are how you treat others! DAMMIT, I demand a Congressional hearing!

[Dave Byrd]

I had to sign back on here when I started seeing the words "boobs" and "natural breasts" being used. Made me happy just thinking about them. Sorry if this offends anyone on a women's forum. I am trained in matters of the chest. Still miss that jiggly avatar that used to be on that former mod's profile, too.

I'll get busted for this by MRs. Byrd, but I'm already busted as it is. She looked in on the Web from school and saw that I'd been posting. Then called me because I am supposed to be helping the neighbors with some house-related work that their contractor canceled on. She thought I was slacking on the neighbors and not doing what I'd promised which was what I'd been instructed to do by you know who in cahoots with our neighbor's wife.

So I thought I'd say a bit more about equality and give and take. Maybe this is really about autonomy. Not sure this has to do with chivalry, but my wife'll make it about that when she speaks to me again. It is for men who're in marriages, though. I think it's inadvisable to get in the habit of routinely and consistently doing as instructed. Give and take is fine. You also have to set limits and do what you want. Like this.

Chances are, even when you do what you've been told, you're still not going to make them 100% happy. Like this.

Happy 25th anniversary next week, Bird!

[Weedhound]

GD I hate to tell you this....but they ARENT petty attacks and frankly, I'm not even mad at you so we don't need a truce.

They ARE the truth as I see it and at least you are a BIT more self-honest then Buddha there.

How did I know you had a "great fondness" for womens breasts?? (besides the generilization) because YOU brought it up. You expounded on it and YOU went into big long explanations with lots of cool words about boobs, breasts, etc etc..

We are discussing womens rights and what do you bring up? Her breasts. Her body. Nothing about the mind, capabilities, changes the women have made or any of that. Nope, straight to the boobies. That's what gave you away right there i'm afraid. You tossed in some nice chatter about "functionality" but I don't for one second believe you've given any REAL thought to the "rights" of toplessness involved.......I mean...PLEASE!! Don't make me laugh.

You may be fooling yourself but you aren't fooling me or many other women either.

[Chong Version 2.0]

Women have been mistreated and abused throughout history. I really don't mind if they "try to play both sides of the game.":hippy:

[painretreat]

Autonomy--yep! But we all get tired of being alone.

Oh Doc, be careful, the doc's are getting arrested here for a little zealous examination!

Chest's: Perhaps using 'boobs' to describe women is superficial. However, boobs, dangly earrings, high heels and a nice smell. We do that for their attention and to feel good about ourself! So, we are getting it! I'd rather be stuck in a room full of men than women! Too many hormones-me included!

Boobs: superficial and seemingly temporary! That is a sensitive area. We are worried about breast cancer. The proper person with the proper touch, is very stimulating and the word SEX hasn't even cum up yet!

I for one--give in! If I am hornie, I don't care about Chivalry or who pays the dining bill! I ALWAYS PAY unless my money is handed back to me with two hands. One to hold me and one to make sure I keep it! And a little kiss to say, thank you, I appreciate that you care about me!

IT IS HUMAN TOUCH! If men like boobs, surely they must know how stimulating it is for us! Face it, some women have boobs we'd all like to have or the plastic surgeons would not have a job!

If we all went topless, no one would know what anyone looked liked. I am sick of being looked at from the boobs up! Or conversations with men and the only eye contact is to the boobs. How would men like it if we talked to their penis's!

More on the TOPIC!
We are not physically equal. Equality dies when we USE our bodies instead of our minds in our life selections! (I know, just ask my lawyer-cause ya gotta level the playing field when it's over and boobs have nothing to do with it)! :rastasmoke:

Green Des. Maybe you should start a thread on boobs! So, all of us can understand what it is men think and like about boobs! And if you'll still love her if she has a mastectomy!

[painretreat]

IF I HAD A DOUBLE MASTECTOMY TO SAVE MY LIFE, THIS BOOB TALK WOULD PISS ME OFF! So, I guess we need to stay with the Equality!

Before I am told, get Fake ones! Maybe they will look and feel good to someone, but they are not a good idea after breast cancer. They will hide any future cancer! pr

[birdgirl73]

Oh my. I agree with you, Pain Retreat. I just read Dave's comments above. He is nothing if not a boob man (and a pain in the ass!). That's because, bless his heart, he doesn't have much in the way of endowment in me. I am a modest B+ on a good day, but I won't have them amplified because I don't want the added potential diagnostic complications. I don't believe them to be a good thing for ladies even before cancer. He actually does work with chests, only he's normally concentrating on what's inside them.

He's better at equality and chivalry than most. I'll give him that. He fixed breakfast this morning and is now out there mowing the lawn. I'm on the computer instead of cleaning the house!!

[Mississippi Steve]

I think in response to the draft question, that's a good point. I'm in favor of equal-opportunity draft, in theory (explained below). However you do remember that in wartime, women traditionally have put in a great effort in the factories, where they can both 'hold down the fort' and also do work towards supplying the war machine.
The biggest issue with a draft that included women that I can see is how would one draw the line with children? Obviously a pregnant woman cannot be drafted; would women then be compelled to get KTFU to avoid a draft? I mean, already, some *cough* skeezy *cough* chicks have kids for welfare or child support bucks; hell, my buddy's ex has the hat trick, and da daddies all make bank. Bitch never needs to work again. Anyway, I think it would cause a LOT of problems. Let's just hope we never have another draft...

Ummm.....coed draft works in Israel, and *ALL* are required to serve in the military for 2 years immediately after high school and before college.

[Breukelen advocaat]

Ummm.....coed draft works in Israel, and *ALL* are required to serve in the military for 2 years immediately after high school and before college.
I once make a comment, to some people I was with in a restaurant, about Israel drafting women into the military and that this sounded like a good thing. A total stranger, an Israeli guy, came over and told me that Israel had the worst women in the world. Although he was laughing, he was serious.

[birdgirl73]

Why the worst? On the basis of looks? On the basis that their military training took their femininity away? On the basis that they were too tough once they were soldiers to be any fun any more? I'm just curious what that description was based on.

I think the draft ought to go both ways, myself, if we have one If a tall, slender type like me can pass a firefighting physical, which wasn't easy but was possible with work, then nearly anyone can. We'd have to work around pregnancies, and I do agree with Stinky that a lot of women would likely get pregnant to get out of service. But fair is fair. Women are already serving as fighter-bomber pilots overhead. They're already serving as military medics in combat situations. There've been three courageous service awards given (two silver stars and a bronze, I think) to female medics in Iraq and Afghanistan. More than 100 of them have died in the line of duty to these wars. So it's already really happening, really. We might as well make it official.

[happiestmferoutthere]

I might also add there is a fine line between being chivalrous and being patronizing, especially these days. If I feel the person is trying to mask a condescending attitude with chivalry , I will reject it even if they think they are actually being nice about it. I guess it has to do with my attitude at the time. Sometimes I'm more accepting of help than other times.
My husband sometimes even over does it. Then comes the old "Don't patronize me, buddy! I'm not helpless!" But at least he tries.:o

As for women being on the front line I say wait until PMS sets in, give these women guns, and watch the men fall! What a release that would be!:lol5:

[Breukelen advocaat]

Why the worst? On the basis of looks? On the basis that their military training took their femininity away? On the basis that they were too tough once they were soldiers to be any fun any more? I'm just curious what that description was based on.
It was over 30 years ago, and I didn't get into it with the guy, but he looked like he'd been in military service himself. I think that he meant that the women were not pleasant to be with, for various reasons.

One of the strongest arguments against putting women in combat, or any dangerous occupation, is that men's lives are put at further risk because they tend to have a protective instinct toward females. I realize that the lunatic fringes of feminism are trying to eliminate this tendency in boys, but is this really what we want? It would probably make things worse.

[birdgirl73]

I find the same thing to be true of my dad, Happiest. The patronizing thing versus chivalry, I mean. In his case, I think it's because, to him, I am still his baby and he wants to step in there and do things for me like he did when I was a kid. I'm all grown up now and don't need that. With my husband, it's easier to take because we're partners instead of parent and child. So the chivalry seems more courteous and less parental. Both of them call me "Baby," and I like it from Dave and could do without it from my dad. I'm well aware that this is an unfair double-standard on my part, but that's how it is.

[mmjnoob]

Now, this is all my personal opinion, but I firmly believe that whenever a woman invokes that special right of equality, but then turns around and wants me to do something special for them, they deserve a swift punch in the jaw.

For whatever reason, I suspect you'd have no qualms about asking for 'something special' from a woman sans punch in the jaw. If you make a shit-ton of money, you might be able to find a women with an IQ over 40 willing to listen that drivel for awhile. I wouldn't expect anything extraordinary from that type of person though. If you actually want to have conversations with intelligent people, you might consider presenting yourself in a more intelligent manner. If all you're after is 'interesting arguments,' you're right on track.


The women I get along with the most are lesbians; lesbians are awesome... I wish I was one...
On a tangent note, it makes me sick to be exposed to male breasts all the time while female breasts are censored/hidden from public view. Just because ours do not function we get to go topless without anything to cover them up? Ladies, you shouldn't have given up on the bra burning! (I support topless equality)

This is interesting. I get along fabulously with gay men. I like you, have a knack for picking the exact wrong dating partners. Maybe the appeal of gay people of the opposite sex is the impossibility of a sexual relationship.

And yeah, most of the moobs out there are pretty gross.

[birdgirl73]

It was over 30 years ago, and I didn't get into it with the guy, but he looked like he'd been in military service himself. I think that he meant that the women were not pleasant to be with, for various reasons.

One of the strongest arguments against putting women in combat, or any dangerous occupation, is that men's lives are put at further risk because they tend to have a protective instinct toward females. I realize that the lunatic fringes of feminism are trying to eliminate this tendency in boys, but is this really what we want? It would probably make things worse.
In response to that top part, that's interesting. His comment cracks me up for some reason.

In response to the bottom part, I can see why that might be a fairly strong argument, to be honest. The military men I know do indeed have a protective instinct toward women, and I suppose it could put them at risk in a combat situation in certain ways. I find that protective tendency, incidentally, very sexy, just like chivalry. Some women don't like that protectiveness, but I think you're right that they're the ones who aren't comfortable with femininity (or vulnerability).

In practice, from what I've seen in documentaries about military prep, if it's anything like paramilitary/fire and police training, and from what they taught us, that's what fire-police training is based on, that protective instinct is actively cultivated and trained into all the military "brothers" and "sisters."

The whole unit is drilled over and over at supporting and protecting each other in all sorts of situations. Your entire reason for being there is to back your brothers/sisters/partners up, support them, firefight or rescue alongside them, step in and save them if need be, serve the department together, and protect your fellow "soldiers" whether you like them personally or not. That's all part of the whole military "team" mentality. At least in theory it is.

I'd hope that a well trained combat soldier wouldn't necessarily sacrifice one gender over another, but I'm sure the situation could come up. Those male-female dynamics definitely have a way of sneaking in and changing things even when they're not supposed to. Maybe with enough time and training, it could work. Be interesting to me to see if it could. I think if things get worse in Afghanistan or with Russia or Iran in addition to Iraq, we're going to need to give serious consideration to both a draft and to females in combat. I'll get some flack from the no-wars-for-any-reason folks for saying that, but I think it's true.

[painretreat]

I am changing my mind about a lot of things on this topic.

I felt the draft was always a good thing! We had it most of my young life!

I could never pass the physical agility of a fireperson, carry a 150 pound house up several flights of stairs! Any woman that can do that, even with a little training should be in the military and do what they can.

The above edification was very eye opening! :thumbsup:

Somehow, "When Harry Met Sally" comes to mind!

[Reefer Rogue]

Chilvalry can't be commanded or instructed because then it loses the essence of what it is. A genuine, compassionate act for a human being, generally for a member of the opposite sex, stereotyped as a man doing something for a woman. I will gladly offer my seat to a lady, old or young, though now i think about it, i feel less obliged to offer that seat to a man, unless he's old. If someone demanded my seat on the principal of chivalry, i wouldn't punch them in the jaw, but i'd think about it, while declining their generous offer. If some crazy woman wants to start swinging at me, momma said knock you out. Firstly, i'd block her and if she continued her assault, i would gladly show her the meaning of equality. Thinking you're above anyone because of your sex, that you can assault people and get away with it because the rule is 'never hit women' is ignorant. Ofcourse i'm not advocating violance against women or anyone, i'm a pascifist until the heat is brought and then i do what must be done. There are intelligent women as well as stupid, same goes for men. I couldn't have a political or philisophical conversation with my ex, it would go completely over her head, this doesn't make her stupid, she prefers other issues. Though it seems a lot of girls focus too much on what i believe to be trivial issues, such as hair and make up and shopping blah blah blah. Some women dress slutty and then get angry at the men who want them for sex, they say i'm not a whore, but they're wearing a whores uniform. I think men are more amusing then women, maybe because i'm a man. Though i've said a lot focus on trivial issues, others are too serious all the time, they need to let their hair down, go wacky, go crazy, lighten up, smoke a fucking joint! Some femal comediennes are funny, but the majority i find to be appauling. The cycle of opposite sex interaction continues. Women get paid less then men, life is a lot harder for women, i respect them wholeheartedly, well the ones that deserve respect.

[stinkybudz]

I think you're ignoring the fact that you said most women are not intelligent. Whether you felt this to be true or not it probably should not have been voiced aloud as it just reaks of ignorance. In addition you are confusing courtship to equal rights.

In the end as human beings we are still animals. Just about every species in the animal Kingdom has a courting process they go through when trying to select a mate. We are no different. These "inequalities" you speak of are simply courting behavioral patterns that have been instilled in us for a very long time.



So basically you're a tough guy behind a keyboard? Are these things you would never say in public? Why be a person on an internet forum when you're not that person in real life? Honestly that's just pathetic, be yourself no matter where you are or who you're with.

I don't believe you've strengthened your argument at all with this post, you've just weakened it.







Owned. You AND Stinksters :hippy:



**EDIT** Quit while your behind..... 'All knowing buddha.....' :D

[stinkyattic]

My comment about women getting pregnant in order to avoid a draft was simply thinking of a WARTIME draft. If 2 years of military service were a requirement for ALL Americans before the age of 25, I doubt that intentional 'accidenta'l pregnancy would be an issue, since you'd just be postponing it.
And a co-ed service requirement would be equal as hell.

[thcbongman]

The act of 'chivalry' is what defines a man between a gentleman.

Your mannerisms, your demenour, how you respect yourself, how you treat people, it goes along way. I don't think concepts like these are "old-fashioned."

[mmjnoob]

DaBudha,
equality != indentical

You're right, equality means equality:

e·qual·i·ty
1. the state or quality of being equal; correspondence in quantity, degree, value, rank, or ability.

Equality has zero to do with roles, gender-based traits or any kind of behavior at all. Women seek equal rights. Women seek to be equally valued for equal abilities and hold equal status for equal performance. How does this translate into, "I want you to treat me exactly like you treat a man?"

I think I know all too well the kind of woman you're talking about. Spoiled, self-centered primadonnas who think the world should bend over backwards to please them. And their man should not only bend over, but do back-flips. And their only job is to look pretty. They don't say much interesting unless you care where they got their hair did or what shade their nails are today. I can't handle 'em and I'm a woman. I avoid them like a plague. They're called narcissists.

Sounds like you've been dating this personality type. Stop. Find someone like Stinky. And stop generalizing your personal experience to a whole gender. This is why people are calling you sexist and whatever other words it was you objected to. It's bigotry.


I have problems. Gee thats a very acute observation. And you don't, right? Of course I have problems friend. If I didn't, I wouldn't be much of a human being.

Unfortunately, you're wrong. I don't blame women for anything. I'm starting to believe that most people don't actually read the original post, because some of the comments here are just mind boggling...
What people are trying to get across is that you are blaming these problems on women. You are blaming other people for how the world (or at least 51% of it), is treating you. You are blaming women for the fact that you're an army of one man in this thread. Despite the fact that there are men amongst the opponent troops.

In general; if a significant amount of people are treating you in the same negative manner, you're doing yourself a disservice by refusing to look at what you might be doing to contribute. We typically do reap what we sow. Playing the victim doesn't get anyone anywhere, even when they are truly a victim. And it sounds to me like you're a victim of your own closed mind here.

You're not being logical about this stuff. You're focused on arguing your point and aren't considering opposing viewpoints. You refuse to swap moccasins.

That's why your mind is boggled.

If I was one of those who insulted you, know that wasn't my intention. Just the truth as I see it. Seriously, you did not come across at all intelligently in your original post. I skimmed most of the rest of the thread after that. I've reread some a bit more attentively. It appears you did tweak your persentation style. You do not appear to be stupid. You do appear to be ignorant.

ig·no·rant
1. lacking in knowledge or training; unlearned: an ignorant man.
2. lacking knowledge or information as to a particular subject or fact: ignorant of quantum physics.
3. uninformed; unaware.
4. due to or showing lack of knowledge or training: an ignorant statement.

I too am a different person on the internet. This is because I have edit and logoff. I can step away until I can be less emotional and more respectful if I feel offended. In fact, there is one person I'm forced to keep in my life that I refused to communicate with outside writing. Eliminated the heated arguments. So if you seriously were looking for a civilized debate rather than a fight, your original post boggles my mind.

If you're looking for agreement, I doubt you'll sway most of these folks. I'd like to see someone with the guts to come in agree with you though. I'm quite sure your belief is not unique.

You really stacked the odds against yourself posting in a Women's Issues category on a cannabis forum.

Focus thy rebellious courage. Use it for good. Start a "'The War on Drugs" is dead and the DEA killed it!' or "'Reefer Madness is dead and Science killed it!" crusade. Srsly. Armed with a bit of study of debate and some good research studies, you could become a hard-core advocate. Hit the books!

Marijuana Law Reform - NORML (http://norml.org/index.cfm)
http://www.safeaccessnow.org (http://www.safeaccessnow.org/)
MPP Homepage (http://www.mpp.org/)
http://boards.cannabis.com/medicinal-cannabis-health/159708-granny-storm-crows-list.html

[DaBudhaStank]

I will not, now or ever, take back what I've said. I brought up a sensitive topic, and I have an opinion that most people don't like. However, I never ONCE blamed ANYONE for ANYTHING. I'm merely giving my viewpoint on a topic. If people choose to think me ignorant because they REALLY don't like what I say, that's just fine. I won't try to change someone's opinion and there isn't a single person here who has given me an example of what I'm blaming people for. Yes, I'm an asshole. I guess that's just too bad, but my point stands.

P.S. I've gotten 3 positive reps for this thread and not one negative. What does THAT say?

P.P.S. Make that 4 positive reps.

[birdgirl73]

It says you got some reps from people who either liked the discussion itself or were themselves as misogynistic as you are. You got twice as many negative comments in response here on the thread itself and got those from people of both genders, so the negative reaction you received still far outweighs the positive. The ones who liked it and agreed with it weren't brave enough to post that up front, and they were probably wise not to do so.

I just reread your original thread and again marveled at the offensiveness of the "swift punch in the jaw" comment. You cannot see that because it came from an attitude in your head, but you also don't get the concept of chivalry as courtesy, clearly. One thing's for sure, those men who don't see the value of chivalry are never going to fall into the category that women regard as sexy. Not because of some fantasy of knighthood. That's silliness that people on the outside looking in read into that term. Intelligent women can take care of themselves. It's sexy because the courtesy/chivalry that shows on the surface translates to someone who, in intimate situations, goes out of his way to, well, satisfy. That's why it's sexy to see a man who is courteous/chivalrous and an immediate turnoff when he's not. I'm pretty sure that's also why you're not meeting women! They're looking past you at the ones who aim to please.

[stinkyattic]

Pos reps and no negs? It's probably either because no one wants to agree with you in public, or they just like the discussion... I mean, hell, if it matters so much, I'll give you a neg based on the punch in the jaw comment... but I'd rather jsut TELL you that it was really fucking rude.

[mmjnoob]

I will not, now or ever, take back what I've said. I brought up a sensitive topic, and I have an opinion that most people don't like. However, I never ONCE blamed ANYONE for ANYTHING. I'm merely giving my viewpoint on a topic. If people choose to think me ignorant because they REALLY don't like what I say, that's just fine. I won't try to change someone's opinion and there isn't a single person here who has given me an example of what I'm blaming people for. Yes, I'm an asshole. I guess that's just too bad, but my point stands.

P.S. I've gotten 3 positive reps for this thread and not one negative. What does THAT say?

P.P.S. Make that 4 positive reps.
Did you even read what I posted before responding? I specifically told you how you are blaming and refusing to even consider your part in the way you are treated. I did not claim you are ignorant because I don't agree with you. It's because you appear to be oblivious in many aspects. Read the definition of ignorant again. It in no way = wrong or objectionable.

I personally don't give a hoot about rep and rarely give it. Some of it is to folks I totally disagree with if it's a good post(open-minded, respectful, well constructed, rational or insightful regarding the issue, helpful or hilarious to me personally. I don't give people negative rep at all. In the case of seeing something truly f***ed up, I report.

I'm not sure why you expect folks to open their minds to your points when you refuse to even read theirs objectively(or all all it appears in some cases.)

Again, I challenge those who agree with you (via rep) to have the guts to actually join the discussion. Might make it a bit more balanced.

[happiestmferoutthere]

Personally, I don't give bad rep to ignorant people. ( See mmjnoobs above post for definition of igrorance). You obviously don't know any better. :i feel stupid:
Guys like you certainly make me appreciate my "chivalrous" guy a lot more, I can tell you that!

[daihashi]

but I'd rather jsut TELL you that it was really fucking rude.

I would've said that it reaked of uncanny douchery never before seen on this forum, but I haven't been on this forum that long so I'll just say in at least the last year ;)

Rude is a bit of an understatement :hippy:

[stinkybudz]

Daihashi thats a super cool picture :thumbsup:

[daihashi]

Daihashi thats a super cool picture :thumbsup:

thanks.. here's an excerpt from the website that I got it from if you want to know more about the picture:


Cannabis leaf surface. Coloured scanning electron micrograph (SEM) of the surface of a cannabis (Cannabis sativa) leaf. The pointed hairs are called lithocyst cells. They contain cystolyths (calcium carbonate crystals). Glandular cells called trichomes are present in the foreground. They are of two types: capitate trichomes have stalks, whereas peltate trichomes are rounded and closer to the leaf surface. Trichomes secrete a resin containing tetrahydrocannabinol. The resin is the source of a euphoriant drug. Magnification unknown.

[painretreat]

Pos reps and no negs? It's probably either because no one wants to agree with you in public, or they just like the discussion... I mean, hell, if it matters so much, I'll give you a neg based on the punch in the jaw comment... but I'd rather jsut TELL you that it was really fucking rude.

PRECISELY-that is what I rep'd for! I enjoyed everyone else's comments and that you were foolish or stupid enough to make a thread. It took balls and I've enjoyed the dicussion-that is all. I don't know why I keep coming back here. Guess I am waiting for verbal fist's and asshole's flying in the air!

I don't think you have a clue!

Right now, after what the tractor man did on my property after my specific instructions not to---I am pretty pissed at men like you! But, I would never take it out on you! You opened my eyes, and for that I must have some gratefulness. That is all!

No thumbs up or you are cool. Just stupid and brave. :hippy:

Since, your head is just getting bigger--I hope I do not purposefully drop back in. :smokin:

Imagine; World Peace!!

[GraziLovesMary]

Chivalry will never be dead if at least one person believes in it and has the honor and fortitude to follow his heart. I, for one, worship women.. it may not seem like the most intelligent quality, but it is genuine and its not going anywhere anytime soon. If I hold a door open for a woman and she were to give me a disgusted look or blatantly refuse my polite gesture, I would give her a hurt smile and continue through the door, holding it open behind me. I feel it necessary to point out that I hold the door open for anybody that is near me, and have never been turned down. Maybe its the way the act is carried out?

I have also given much thought to women in the military during my lifetime, as I always thought I would spend most of my life at war. If I was in a hostile wartime environment, I imagine I would be more than delighted to have any female presence I could interact with. However I could very well see myself compromising my own life to protect hers, be it rational or not. I dont honestly know, though, and it doesnt look like I will end up going to war at this point. I would be delighted if the situation didnt have to exist in the first place.

I love women and I refuse to stop spoiling them :p

[Trip06]

trat as you would like to be treated, unless there just some evil bitch then do unto uthers as theyve don 2 yo, stank hoes.

[nicksevenfold]

Now this is generally speaking, and not about all women, so don't get mad :]. I'm not disagreeing with the OP either, just concurring. Women killed chivalry when they decided they were more interested in assholes that would screw them and leave them than to play it safe and be in a stable, nice relationship. I mean, if a guy knows a girl is reeled in and he knows that all he wants is in her guts, why should he open doors and pull out chairs? And if the girl sees this and is still interested, she has obviously lowered her standards. If she sees it this way, why not lower your standards (if you have to) and go with a guy that isn't as "daring and charming," but will at least treat you like you're the shit? The bee's knees. Whatever you call it.

As for the original post, I had never thought of it this way before, but I totally agree. As for how it applies to affirmative action, it's like certain minorities calling other majorities (not pointing any fingers) "racist," but then having their own television stations, college funds, etc. I think that's a little bit wrong and hypocritical as well.

Not to piss anyone off, merely the ramblings of someone who sees a lot of hypocracy and wrong-doing in our society today. And still people wonder why we have problems getting shit done in the government. LACK OF RESPONSIBILITY AND TOO MUCH TIME SPENT ON TRYING TO POINT THE FINGER AT SOMEONE ELSE.

Love.

[budlover13]

My 2 cents(if you care):

I was raised "old fashioned", so I was taught to respect women, defend women, and let them know how special they really are. I mean, for crying out loud, I saw the birth of my son and have delivered 3 babies in my life(as a volunteer firefighter) and I never stopped being amazed that a womans body can do the things it does.

I was taught to open all doors, ladies first, watch your language, be respectful, and defend her against any and all threats for the simple fact that she's a woman. My first wife didn't appreciate these aspects of my personality, however my second wife cherishes them.

I say equality in all REASONABLE areas. I would not want to go into combat with a female at my side because my gut instinct is to protect her before a man and this could jeopardize my fellow soldiers. I also know that most women cannot drag a 200 lb body as quickly or efficiently as most men. Underscore MOST. I also would not want to be a police officer with a woman for back-up.(I was one for 1 1/2 years)MOST women do not fight nearly as well as a man. I believe that if you dispute that, you are deluded.

I love women. They are a gift to men and should be treated as such. Strike ANY woman in front of me and be prepared for me to do my very best to stomp your face in the dirt. Not saying I'd always win, but I would have no choice other than to try.

I will continue my soap box speech asap, but I must go for now. PLEASE, let me know what you think.:smokin:

[Islandborn]

Now this is generally speaking, and not about all women, so don't get mad :]. I'm not disagreeing with the OP either, just concurring. Women killed chivalry when they decided they were more interested in assholes that would screw them and leave them than to play it safe and be in a stable, nice relationship. I mean, if a guy knows a girl is reeled in and he knows that all he wants is in her guts, why should he open doors and pull out chairs? And if the girl sees this and is still interested, she has obviously lowered her standards. If she sees it this way, why not lower your standards (if you have to) and go with a guy that isn't as "daring and charming," but will at least treat you like you're the shit? The bee's knees. Whatever you call it.

As for the original post, I had never thought of it this way before, but I totally agree. As for how it applies to affirmative action, it's like certain minorities calling other majorities (not pointing any fingers) "racist," but then having their own television stations, college funds, etc. I think that's a little bit wrong and hypocritical as well.

Not to piss anyone off, merely the ramblings of someone who sees a lot of hypocracy and wrong-doing in our society today. And still people wonder why we have problems getting shit done in the government. LACK OF RESPONSIBILITY AND TOO MUCH TIME SPENT ON TRYING TO POINT THE FINGER AT SOMEONE ELSE.

Love.

Women like the assholes cause 99.9% of the time they are far more exciting than some stage 5 clinger dude who caters to their every need and tells them how perfect they are.......how old would that get in a week. Sounds boring even to me.

[HannahAbbot]

Women have equal rights but, do they have equal responsibility's? Example: If the USA were to get into a big war where we needed drafts, who would be the ones getting drafted?

I'm married to a marine, they don't WANT women in the infantry. However women ARE in the military and ARE over in Afghanistan risking their lives and getting blown up by IEDs just like the rest of the guys so maybe you ought to think twice before you put your hands on that keyboard.

Edit: To be more clear women that are deployed to afghanistan work in communications, transportation and other fields. They are in danger of attack from taliban, but more in danger (as are all military in Afghanistan) of being blown to bits by the IEDs.