If we are an accident, then what is the point? [Archive] - Green Grass Forums

BathingApes

06-11-2008, 02:57 AM

Because even though we are an accident we are a very good accident. In my opinion what's a better reason to keep on living and existing than the fact that our existense is so extraordinary. There isn't a meaning to life except what you personally make it.

Run with it I say. Be the best freak accident you can be.

I think everyone is missing the point. Im not arguing whether there is meaning to life, or whether us being an accident (if true), actually has any sort of profound inherent meaning, rather, my point is, if we all die and cease to exist, then what is the point, to anything?

Does there have to be a point? I dont know. But if there doesnt, then thats the same as not having one essentially, which means that nothing matters, ever.

rebgirl420

06-11-2008, 03:03 AM

Hmmmm,

Well thats a riddle wrapped in a conundrum and lost into an enigma. I think I need to get high to wrap my head around this.

NaughtyDreadz

06-11-2008, 03:11 AM

uh... 3 words... Brazilian Scuba Diving...

Look it up...

illnillinois

06-11-2008, 03:27 AM

uh... 3 words... Brazilian Scuba Diving...

Look it up...

Roger Roger!!

rebgirl420

06-11-2008, 03:35 AM

Sex the answer is sex.

It's truly the reason to live.

JeffersonBud

06-11-2008, 03:42 AM

Like I said earlier, by living you are adding to God, the Universe and all the knowledge in it. Kind of like a living biosphere (the earth)

NaughtyDreadz

06-11-2008, 03:43 AM

actually.. I was just thinking more like... being a bon vivant... good bud, traveling, learning, enjoying... Carpe Vagina baby...

JeffersonBud

06-11-2008, 03:44 AM

This also explains evolution. By having 5 senses you are interpreting the world around you. This is built up over time in your life and adds to the overall goal... evolution.

NaughtyDreadz

06-11-2008, 03:46 AM

Roger Roger!!

uh... Urban Dictionary, June 10: Trill (http://www.urbandictionary.com) ;)

Innomin8E

06-11-2008, 04:21 AM

I believe we are intelligence, or a holy love for awareness...particles in a constant flow of reflections.

These will give you something to think about:

YouTube - The Human Body Energy Centers, Beautiful! (1 of 3) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gpjJUbPfzY&feature=related)

YouTube - The Human Body Energy Centers, Beautiful! (2 of 3) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMxKffswZ1Q&feature=related)

YouTube - The Human Body Energy Centers, Beautiful! (3 of 3) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1UEXBXNyyQ&feature=related)

Coelho

06-11-2008, 09:02 AM

I think everyone is missing the point. Im not arguing whether there is meaning to life, or whether us being an accident (if true), actually has any sort of profound inherent meaning, rather, my point is, if we all die and cease to exist, then what is the point, to anything?

Does there have to be a point? I dont know. But if there doesnt, then thats the same as not having one essentially, which means that nothing matters, ever.

I think i understand what you mean. If we are going to die, what is the point in working hard, earning money, buying a house, cars, having a family, etc, cause in the end we will die and everything will disappear (for the one who died)?

I already thought about it, and agree with you that, in the long run, nothing is actually important, besides the fact we gonna die. All the things people deems important are only follies, illusions, cause in the end everything ends (of course lol).

So, what can we do about this? IMHO, if we are here, and if we know our stay here is limited, and soon will end, than i think we should enjoy it the best way we can, cause its actually the only choice we have. We cant decide the amount of time we will live. We only can decide what we will do with the time we have.

SocialDem

06-11-2008, 04:12 PM

One major problem, I believe, is that these huge corporations spend billions of dollars on advertising to tell people they need to buy things to feel good, to be free, and to be cool. But in the end what do you have? Just a whole bunch of shit that eventually destroys the environment. I believe you should look inside yourself and find something that makes you happy at the same time causing as little suffering around you. There really is nothing else you can do to correctly coexist with nature. Its all about karma man, Live your life doing as many good things to others around and it will all be returned, but you have to believe.

NaughtyDreadz

06-11-2008, 04:39 PM

it's the eternal question I had with my mom hen I was a kid...

WHY DO I HAVE TO MAKE MY BED??? IF TONIGHT I'M GONNA COME HOME AND MESS IT UP TONIGHT ANYWAY???

MadSativa

06-11-2008, 05:08 PM

If you have to ask why live then your not living enough.

SocialDem

06-11-2008, 07:36 PM

If you have to ask why live then your not living enough.

Genius

bhouncy

06-11-2008, 07:50 PM

It's the journey. Enjoy it.

suhl

06-11-2008, 07:57 PM

JeffersonBud

06-11-2008, 09:14 PM

BathingApes

06-12-2008, 12:25 AM

I never understood why people think life is an accident in the first place. If life can exist in the harshest of conditions and on other planets not to mention other dimensional planes not limited to the 4 we live in (the 4th being time) then why should it be an accident. Its not difficult to understand how life began using the properties of carbon atoms, hydrogen, oxygen, electricity and amino acids, all stuff born from stars that are abundant in our universe.
There are NO accidents in the universe and beyond. Only infinite possibilities.

Whilst I concede that life may not be an accident, to claim that there are NO accidents "in the universe and beyond" is both unfounded in logic and reasoning. When I refer to "accident" - I mean something without cause. In other words, creation without a creator. The opposite of the cosmological argument if you like. I'm aware that there could indeed be a God, but for the sake of keeping this discussion away from the general religion vs. science BS that fills the internet these days, let's just assume, in terms of answering the question (it isn't a statement) - that there isn't.

take some acid and once you get some good enough youll stop worrying about that shit it will finally hit you that it doenst matter.

I've done acid before. Trust, it was good shit. However, your point is essentially my point exactly. The statement doesn't matter, nothing matters, ever, if life ceases to exist. Forget emotions or feelings for a second, they are simply relative to life, and without life, (assuming there is no afterlife) they cannot be present. I concur, that essentially this doesn't make a difference, because the existence/absence of God cannot be proven or disproven. Neither can anything - nothing is truly true - and because of this I'm aware that this discussion will lead nowhere.

In ironic contradiction of my initial statement, let's discuss it anyway.

"And we don't know
just where our bones will rest.
To dust i guess.
Forgotten and absorbed into the earth below"

- Billy Corgan.

JeffersonBud

06-12-2008, 12:51 AM

First off my idea about the universe is not a religion. information is god to me. I guess you can put every idea including the people who don't believe in a religion, into a religion. if that makes any sense. I do not want a following of any kind nor for my idea of how the cosmos work to influence the way others think. It is for me and me alone.
Second, if there are infinite possibilities, then there are no such thing as accidents. If reality is in fact not real and by consciousness, we manifest our own destiny, then anything can happen and will.
third, the "big bang" is in keeping with what you are saying and a theory that everyone is aware of. The big bang is indeed a conflict among cause and effect because "energy cannot be created nor destroyed". One more antimatter then matter would be impossible but as we all know can happen. we are living in it now.

bhouncy

06-12-2008, 11:12 AM

I've done acid before. Trust, it was good shit. However, your point is essentially my point exactly. The statement doesn't matter, nothing matters, ever, if life ceases to exist. Forget emotions or feelings for a second, they are simply relative to life, and without life, (assuming there is no afterlife) they cannot be present. I concur, that essentially this doesn't make a difference, because the existence/absence of God cannot be proven or disproven. Neither can anything - nothing is truly true - and because of this I'm aware that this discussion will lead nowhere.

I have an idea of where you are at at this moment in time. I've been in a very similar situation. The way I see it is that you can go over and over this stuff time and again and there is still no clear answer as no one knows what the point is. Everyone has their own idea or someone else's idea but there is no proof.

So I decided that life is living in the moment. Rather than going to end of my life in my mind I decided to step back from that and set a clear goal for myself. Something worth aiming for that makes the present moment more meaningful. We all feel the highs and lows of life but having a target that motivates me makes more highs than lows and essentially a better life. I still think about the point of it all but it doesn't bother me because I've created an artificial meaning that makes the present moment all that matters.

Reefer Rogue

06-12-2008, 12:26 PM

If life is indeed, a cosmic accident, what is the point to anything? If after death we cease to exist, why live?

Life is not a 'cosmic accident' this concept that life is chance is false. There's nothing accidental about evolution, quite the contrary.

Why live if we know we're going to die?

Quite a nihilistic question and attitude. The point is that there is no objective morality, that we create our own essence through the choices we make based on what we value and desire. We only live once, so i suggest you turn that nihilistic attitude upside down and start embracing existence while you can.

BathingApes

06-12-2008, 04:25 PM

Life is not a 'cosmic accident' this concept that life is chance is false. There's nothing accidental about evolution, quite the contrary.

Why live if we know we're going to die?

Quite a nihilistic question and attitude. The point is that there is no objective morality, that we create our own essence through the choices we make based on what we value and desire. We only live once, so i suggest you turn that nihilistic attitude upside down and start embracing existence while you can.

Forget the stigma of "nihilism" for a second, and actually think. I've not once said I actually believe that, I've only asked people to apply something they don't believe in and actually see what they come up with. As of yet, all I've got are personal recommendations and warnings against nihilistic mentality.

I'm fully aware that it is all speculative, and because of that, I live my life to the fullest.

The point is, let's just forget that we choose to do it this way, step out of yourself a second - and think, why does anything matter if we all die anyway? Of course people feel uneasy and annoyed when you mention something like this, because it goes against everything they know.

But if, it turns out there is no afterlife, what stops everything form being meaningless?

40oz

06-12-2008, 04:36 PM

The point is, let's just forget that we choose to do it this way, step out of yourself a second - and think, why does anything matter if we all die anyway?

nothing does matter, everything in life is inherently empty. Significance is determined by the individual. This topic touches existentialism. Facing the absurdity of existence and finding meaning in it.

But from an evolutionary perspective, life does have meaning and that is to create more life. So if nothing at all remember to have sex.

But if, it turns out there is no afterlife, what stops everything form being meaningless?

You. Discover love and spread it around.

bhouncy

06-12-2008, 05:26 PM

The point is, let's just forget that we choose to do it this way, step out of yourself a second - and think, why does anything matter if we all die anyway? Of course people feel uneasy and annoyed when you mention something like this, because it goes against everything they know.

But if, it turns out there is no afterlife, what stops everything form being meaningless?

Mate. You wont find the answer. There is either a point or there isn't. No one knows. So everyone who says there is a point and tells you what it is they are just giving their opinions.

What kind of point are you looking for?

BathingApes

06-13-2008, 05:19 PM

Just a point, I guess.

JeffersonBud

06-13-2008, 05:22 PM

Nothing wrong with wanting to know or finding out. Nice post.:)

bhouncy

06-13-2008, 07:01 PM

Just a point, I guess.

A lot of people ask these questions and I don't deny that curiosity on this subject can drive someone to distraction. Religions... governments... media... parents... friends and everyone else will give us information that we use to build up what we know of the world. I answered a different question to the one you posed. I see people fighting and arguing over whose idea is the real one without concrete scientific proof and I just sit back and let them agree to disagree or rip each other to pieces. I don't mind. I have my weed and my mission.

I only asked what point you were looking for as your idea may well have as much weight as any other idea.

Reefer Rogue

06-14-2008, 10:07 AM

Forget the stigma of "nihilism" for a second, - why should I? You're attitude is the definition of nihilism whether you believe it or not.

and actually think. - One can't exist without thinking.

I've not once said I actually believe that, I've only asked people to apply something they don't believe in and actually see what they come up with. As of yet, all I've got are personal recommendations and warnings against nihilistic mentality. - You can't always get what you want

I'm fully aware that it is all speculative, and because of that, I live my life to the fullest. - and how do you do that?

The point is, let's just forget that we choose to do it this way, - Why is this 'the point'? Why should i forget that my essence is created through the choices i make?

step out of yourself a second - and think, - One can't step outside of oneself and view oneself objectively, we are self-conscious, subjective beings. I'm always thinking.

why does anything matter if we all die anyway? - Things matter to different people, that's a question that implies that nothing in the world matters because of death or specifically human death. Happiness matters, loads of things matter, from science, music, art, nationalities, culture, language. Through death comes birth and vice versa, the cycle continues and this is what matters.

Of course people feel uneasy and annoyed when you mention something like this, because it goes against everything they know.

If you're implying i feel uneasy or annoyed at this discussion, you're incorrect.

But if, it turns out there is no afterlife, what stops everything form being meaningless?

You are what stops everything from being meaningless, you alone, no promise of an afterlife.

:rastasmoke:

painretreat

06-14-2008, 11:09 AM

Assuming it is an accident, Rebgirl gave her answers in 2nd & 3rd posts! I Like!
This is like saying; Why eat if all you are going to do is excrete it in feces! One, you have to; and 2) You eat what you like so you enjoy it and it is not a waste of time! If you apply that to your life. All of the above! sex, hobbies, friends and if you do not enjoy any of that; Be a volunteer--you may need something in your life that is more self fulfilling from others!

Coelho

06-14-2008, 06:26 PM

Only two things i would like to point...

One can't exist without thinking.

I dont think its always true... i would rather say one cant think without existing...

One can't step outside of oneself and view oneself objectively, we are self-conscious, subjective beings. I'm always thinking.

Well... maybe. Our consciousness is not our "self", our "i", so while we are bounded to be a percieving concsiousness, we still can leave our egos, our "i"s, and percieve them from outside with our pure consciousness.
And those who accomplish this learns that the sense of self is only another illusion, empty and void.

painretreat

06-14-2008, 07:48 PM

I dont think its always true... i would rather say one cant think without existing...

Well... maybe. Our consciousness is not our "self", our "i", so while we are bounded to be a percieving concsiousness, we still can leave our egos, our "i"s, and percieve them from outside with our pure consciousness.
And those who accomplish this learns that the sense of self is only another illusion, empty and void.[/QUOTE]

Coelho; Wow, that is heavy! Good thinking!:thumbsup:

Reefer Rogue

06-14-2008, 08:40 PM

Only two things i would like to point...

I dont think its always true... i would rather say one cant think without existing...

Well... maybe. Our consciousness is not our "self", our "i", so while we are bounded to be a percieving concsiousness, we still can leave our egos, our "i"s, and percieve them from outside with our pure consciousness.
And those who accomplish this learns that the sense of self is only another illusion, empty and void.

Well, you can say that and be correct as i said what i said and was not incorrect. I know i exist because i am thinking.

I disagree that my sense of self is as you have described, even if i had that alleged knowledge. My point was that only non humans can have an objective view about humanity.

Coelho

06-15-2008, 04:18 AM

I know i exist because i am thinking.

Well... i agree completly with it. But knowing you exist is not the same as just existing... and thats what i wished to point.

I disagree that my sense of self is as you have described, even if i had that alleged knowledge. My point was that only non humans can have an objective view about humanity.

You may be right... but i think differently. I strongly believe (from my own experiences) that we call our "self", our "i" is only a small part of our entire consciousness. For example, right now im looking to my computers screen. Im seeing it. And im aware that "i" am seeing it. But even if i were not aware that "i" were seeing it, still i would be seeing it.

The idea of an "i", of a self, is a thing we learn when children, from our parents and all older people, which help us to deal with the peoples world. But it is not a thing that is hardwired in our brains. Only the pure perception is. What i call "pure perception" is the ability to percieve the world without be constantly thinking "im seeing this, im hearing that, etc", the ability to just see, to just hear, without interpreting what we percieve, without fitting it into words, or concepts, or thoughts. It is a very unusual state of mind, but it can be accomplished by means of meditation, or by use of some psychedelics.

And like the idea of the self, almost all characters of "humanity" we people have are learned. When were children we learn what being a human is like, what we must do as humans, what we must feel as humans, how we must behave as humans, and so on. But they are not the only ways we can be. It is possible to think, to feel, and to behave in ways far different from the "standard" humans. But we are so used (or rather brainwashed) to be like humans that we dont even imagine we could be otherwise.

So, if a person can disentangle itself from the quirks of being human, it can actually percieve the human world as if viewed from outside. And im sure its what several mysticals, sages, and spiritual teachers did. They were able to see the human world from outside, and so they could delineate its strong and weak points, and give teachings to improve the human condition. And the fact they went outside the "normal" human scope would very well explain why their wisdom is frequently deep, far reaching, and sometimes thought as being "divinely inspirated". (Not that i dont believe in divine inspiration. But i think its not the only explanation)

BTW... If you ever had any experience with some stronger psychedelic, im sure you will understand what i meant with all this... :stoned:

Reefer Rogue

06-15-2008, 08:03 AM

Okay, i get what you're saying more clearly now. We are always perceiving, whether we are aware or not, so long as we exist. I'd say that to gain a complete, absolute, objective view of oneself it must be made by someone other then yourself. However, i will concede that the imagination is a powerful tool at our disposal and thus could allow us to gain an alternative perspective on ourselves as well as humanity in general. As children we are raised and taught by the status quo, as we become our own rational, progressive beings we are more aware of the world around us a thus we always have the choice to reject these teachings in favour of autonomy.

delusionsofNORMALity

06-15-2008, 01:37 PM

The point is, let's just forget that we choose to do it this way, step out of yourself a second - and think, why does anything matter if we all die anyway?for the bee it is the good of the hive. for the wolf it is the hunt and the comforts of a well fed pack. for humanity it is the search for patterns and finding the point to existence. they are all valid reasons to live and they are all false. this is a journey to no particular destination, a pointless extravagance of creation which exists merely because it can. this is the universe expanding to explore every possibility and fill every niche before it too ends.

merely asking the question is point enough. expecting some universal answer is going a step too far. each creature derives meaning from its circumstances. that is the point. no grand design but the patterns we perceive. no meanings but the ones we invent. no journey's end because the path is the only important thing.

....people feel uneasy and annoyed when you mention something like this, because it goes against everything they know.of course you'll annoy the animals if you keep on poking them like this. here we've gone and invested generations into inventing answers to the question and you come along and ask us to explain ourselves. we trot out the standard answers and find them lacking, so we have to begin all over again. we have to start sifting through the patterns, aligning them where we can and coming to some conclusion that will satisfy for a few moments more.

But if, it turns out there is no afterlife, what stops everything from being meaningless?an afterlife never was the be all end all of existence, it was merely the point at which we stopped asking. it was a satisfactory conclusion that allowed us to start searching through patterns more relevant to survival.

40oz

06-15-2008, 05:39 PM

I'd say that to gain a complete, absolute, objective view of oneself it must be made by someone other then yourself.

This is very true. How can you know anything at all about yourself if you have nobody to compare yourself to, to see what you're not? The mind works in a funny way, it requires to give itself an identity, so it can identify the world around it and its place in it. To keep a certain identity, the mind will choose to see what it wants to see, to prove this identity to itself.

This is why when you mess up or do something stupid or act mean you tell yourself "oh that wasn't really me, I was just angry" or "I would have caught the ball but the sun was in my eyes". Things that you do that do not agree with your self concept cause dissonance, which is the type of thinking i described above. This is why it is hard to rely on yourself to get a completely accurate idea of yourself.

nacci11235

06-25-2008, 07:09 AM

Nihilism! Alright, so I was too lazy to read the whole thread, so someone might have said something similar to what I'm gonna say.

Assuming there is no God, i.e. no repercussions for our actions, then we should do whatever we feel like doing. The point is that there is no meaning. Experiencing life doesn't give it meaning. Under these assumptions, we should do whatever we think will gain us pleasure. For some, that means lightin' up every day. For others, it means trying to live as comfortably as possible. In order to do so, an individual would sacrifice certain aspects of their free will and enter a social contract with other people, thus forming a society. According to the social contract, members of society will help each other under the premise that they will be helped as well. Not necessarily meaning communism or anything. Take capitalism for example. A banker lends money to an entrepreneur under the assumption the the entrepreneur will pay him back with interest. They are offering each other a service, each helping each other live a more comfortable life style. Look at it as you will. I'm not sure all of this was coherently written, but I'm tired of writing and don't feel like reading back over it. So, yeah.

nacci11235

06-25-2008, 07:33 AM

for the bee it is the good of the hive. for the wolf it is the hunt and the comforts of a well fed pack. for humanity it is the search for patterns and finding the point to existence. they are all valid reasons to live and they are all false. this is a journey to no particular destination, a pointless extravagance of creation which exists merely because it can. this is the universe expanding to explore every possibility and fill every niche before it too ends.
Postmodernism. The problem is that you and BathingApes are arguing with different semantics. BathingApes is looking for an unbiased, universal answer. You're providing an answer built around an individual's perceptions. The question amounts to whether or not there is some sort of universal standard by which significance is attached to life. Basically, if God doesn't exist, then do whatever you want. There is no meaning in life. What you do will be totally and completely pointless. So do whatever you want.

Immolation

07-03-2008, 08:01 AM

I'd just like to see the Human Race Continue.Maybe one day we will defeat Death and Death will be an Option not an Inevitability.

Stoner Shadow Wolf

07-03-2008, 10:11 PM

IF we were an accident, the point would be to cope with the accident.

vej33

07-18-2008, 05:36 AM

because there's nothing else you can do besides die. and if nothing matters, and death is the end, then what's the difference if you die sooner or later? if there IS no difference, then asking "why should we live" is the same as asking "why shouldn't we live"

it's a matter of choice i guess, nobody's answer will be the same. after birth, it's essentially up to you to make the distinction between "there's no point to this, i think i'll die" and "i'm going to die anyway, so let's die doing something worth dying for".

and i'd say the only thing worth dying for...is living.

RESiNATE

07-25-2008, 10:12 AM

I have spent (wasted, some may say) millions of hours pondering the original question "what is the point?", and still cant arrive at a proper answer.

The way I see it is this:
Think of the whole world (earth) as a living breathing machine.
Everything upon it, in it, is one tiny piece of a much bigger component. All these little components fit together to make the earth evolve and regenerate and sustain all the components in a never-ending cycle.
If we take a component and study it, we can see that there is a chain of events that occur to sustain that one component - the food chain of a particular species, for instance.
That component has its 'point' or purpose.

i think that is what the point of this thread is about.

However, if we take the human race as a component, then it becomes very difficult to see 'the point', as our component doesn't seem to compliment the evolution of the earth or its inhabitants.
One could be really mordant (someone like me lol) and say that we are just a cancerous blight on the face of this once beautiful life cell.

If when we die we just decompose as everything else does, and everything ceases to be, then that is a whole nother debate.

The expected 'point to life' is to get by as best you can.
How well you have managed that, certainly in our western society, is measured by the amount of wealth one has acquired - wealth not only in material terms, but in many others too.

The 'actual' 'point of life' (in my opinion) is surely to enjoy this wonderous 'fluke' of universal nature, adapt to it (rather than adapt it to us), and nurture and preserve it for our future generations. Then die satisfied in wonder and awe.

Unfortunately, the human being seems to have overdeveloped what I call 'the greed gene' and as a result tends to aspire to the 'expected point of life', rather than 'the actual point of life'.

Res...

Iyaman

07-31-2008, 04:05 PM

ok i dont feel like reading 3 pages of posts so here is my 2 cents.
Life is just a probability. We are furtunate enough to be alive. just because there isn't a meaning to life dosnt mean it isnt special. imagine the universe existed with absolutely no life. it couldn't be appreciated in all its glory.
i debated this question to myself when i became an atheist and you know what. its made me a better person.its totaly turned me around. i work hard at school now, all i want is to know more about the universe because its just so amazing.
so its just how you look at it. you can either appreciate the opportunity or you can waste it.

CannabaCharlie

07-31-2008, 10:16 PM

If life is indeed, a cosmic accident, what is the point to anything? If after death we cease to exist, why live?

Ah, but isn't that exactly backwards?

Depending on how we approach the question, the meaning of life might not be that hard to understand: If there is a "Meaning", then there must be an organizing force with an agenda. Now, if there is a force capable of designing the universe, life, us, and etc. in order to achieve a particular goal, then it stands to reason that the universe is a necessary (to the creating being) tool of such great complexity that we cannot even begin to understand the end goal.

On the other hand, say the universe exists because the universe exists, say the laws of physics and the basic functioning of the universe around us exist simply because they exist and not because something bigger decided that he/she/it wanted this all to exist. That means that we have at our disposal certain resources: our time, our minds, our friends and acquaintances, our finances, and etc. We have the ability to manage the resources at our disposal and to combine resources toward common goals. We can build things together of great complexity that will still stand long after we as individuals are dead. We can build cultures and institutions, machines and infrastructure, literature and art, we can inspire those around us, we can learn and improve, and it all matters.

Now, the thing is, that under the second vision - the one where reality is reality and we don't need outside beings to make everything worthwhile - is not a vision devoid of meaning and beauty. Being able to explain the physics (dust particles, condensation, refraction, light wavelengths, etc.) of a sunset does not rob it of its beauty. A Thing can be more than the sum of its parts, and is not robbed of it's beauty by explanation. Life is more than the sum of its parts. What we build matters, how we live and interact with our neighbors matters, and what we leave behind (both in the sense of the outcome of our lives' works, and the memories and impression we have left on our friends, families, neighbors, and associates).

So no, life without gods, goddesses, daemons, ghosts, afterlife, prelife, purgatory, heaven, hell, reincarnation, etc. is not without meaning - IT'S LIFE!, Hell, how much more meaning can you get than that: THIS IS LIFE, don't screw it up 'cause it's all you've got. When you do screw up, learn from your mistakes, 'cause this is life and it's the only one you've got. Help others when you can, if you can make someone else's life better without sacrificing too much yourself, then do so - this is the only life they will get too.

It could only be stripped of meaning if we decide to make it so, by imagining (for instance) that everything we see and do every day were nothing but some kind of pre-show for heaven or for the amusement of some creature so advanced that we are like ants in comparison (aka a god).

llamapunch

08-10-2008, 09:14 PM

It seems that most people agree you only live one time... I do not know if this is true or not. However, if we look at life in this way (one and done) then it is easy to say that nothing matters. I see where this comes from. So This outlook seems rather bleak...I'm basically screwed in the end so "let's just enjoy the time we have".

I too enjoy the time I have. I'm just surprised nobody has said anything about reincarnation. It seems most of the ideas here are compatible with reincarnation and it gives you the "why should I live/lead a good life" aspect. There is a lot of research to back up past lives and that the soul exists after death. It is a very old idea that pops up a lot throughout history.

Look at how many religions include reincarnation in thier ideology. Reincarnation was initially accepted by the Christian faith until it became the state religion of Rome. It is also pointed out that an underground of mystical movements such as the Gnostics, Cathars, Sufis, and Kabbalists have always accepted reincarnation as a core spiritual belief.

Look at Socrates' very convincing arguments for the immortality of the soul. The one that originally got me was in the Phaedo when socrates is on his death bed . Do you people really not believe in the soul? Read some other books, do some research. I recently read "many lives many masters" by brian weiss and I recommend it for anyone with an open mind. It made a lot of sense to me.

Maybe the life you're living is just one plane of the many that every soul must live and learn on. There are certain lessons you have to learn here on earth. You have to keep coming back till you do whatever you need to do. This theory could help explain child phenoms, people that can speak foreign languages with no training, and many people that can recall past lives under hypnosis. Sometimes you carry things from a past life to your current one.You have to keep coming back until you learn what you have to learn. The goal is to become god-like through knowledge. The unexamined life is not worth living. Even if you don't believe in these things you still owe it to yourself to learn about everything you can. These are all just thoughts to get you started. Do some research. I feel like I'm writing a book.

A question I've been thinking about lately...(maybe someone can help me out)... If you apply this reincarnation model or whatever to life with the idea of evolution. Did souls always exist, even in the earliest humans or even prehumans? Does this mean apes and such have souls? Or was it over the course of history people discovered this soul? Surely it can't be that at some point everyone just got a new soul. Where did they come from, when did it all start? This is all assuming you believe in one soul, many bodies mind you.

partcleguy

08-17-2008, 07:51 PM

Douglas Adams might say:

In the entire wonderfully long and strange history of the universe, only two people ever came close to figuring out the true meaning of life. One was a galforaxian named Tuz Hjark who spent 100 years in an intense ritualistic meditative coma as was customary to his peaceful people. The other was a human from the planet earth who had recently smoked the leaves of a weed commonly used as an intoxicant. Putting aside his rudimentary smoking device he proclaimed to his red-eyed friends, "Dude... I just got it. I mean like, all of it!" Unfortunately, moments after making his statement, the earth was vaporized by a Vogon construction ship making way for an intergalactic bypass.

bhouncy

08-17-2008, 07:57 PM

trancefusion5

08-17-2008, 09:43 PM

Why does there need to be a point, though? Aren't the things you experience made even better by the fact that there's no afterlife (if true)? Wouldn't that be even more reason to enjoy every second--because thats all you get...? :rastasmoke:

DrSpiggs

If you have to ask why live then your not living enough.

It's the journey. Enjoy it.

because there's nothing else you can do besides die. and if nothing matters, and death is the end, then what's the difference if you die sooner or later? if there IS no difference, then asking "why should we live" is the same as asking "why shouldn't we live"

it's a matter of choice i guess, nobody's answer will be the same. after birth, it's essentially up to you to make the distinction between "there's no point to this, i think i'll die" and "i'm going to die anyway, so let's die doing something worth dying for".

and i'd say the only thing worth dying for...is living.

I thought these were good!

Survival is the reason for life. All other life forms on earth have a main theme in common and its survival. I find the best way to look at things like this is to take the entire animal kingdom (except humans) and think about it in that perspective. Humans have just complicated the equation with all our feelings and extreme emotions. It can either be a beautiful gift or a dangerous tool depending on how we decide to use it.

Acouwaila

09-10-2008, 11:32 PM

Because even though we are an accident we are a very good accident. In my opinion what's a better reason to keep on living and existing than the fact that our existense is so extraordinary. There isn't a meaning to life except what you personally make it.

Run with it I say. Be the best freak accident you can be.

awesome...that was the most beautiful thing ive ever read of yours

and we dont "cease" to exist when we die topic starter. Our energy, just transcends into another part of the universe. so dont worry, its never over. our bodies are light, our minds are eternal

Acouwaila

09-10-2008, 11:36 PM

and maybe the only reason there has to be a meaning, starts with our questions..meaning...if you dont question, but accept, then everything is understood

SFGurrilla

09-10-2008, 11:39 PM

we are here to evolve

learn

teach

expand

live

build

have sex

create children

pass on our knowledge to the next generation of your family.

thats the point

higher4hockey

09-10-2008, 11:41 PM

If life is indeed, a cosmic accident, what is the point to anything? If after death we cease to exist, why live?

there is no point. even if it wasn't a cosmic accident, what would be the point?

that doesnt necessarily have to be a bad thing. theres no point to organized sports, but that doesn't mean they're not fun to watch and participate in.

mrandmrspoot

11-16-2008, 03:34 AM

there is no point. your are an organism that eventually will be overcome with bacteria and then you will cease to function.

Life beyond death? science = no.

but is science the ultimate law?

I tend to think not.

Zarbedan

04-20-2009, 04:57 AM

Everything in the universe is recycled and reused. If you take into consideration that souls are indeed in our bodies then we don't cease to exist we are just recycled and reused,or in other words, reincarnation. That's just my view. :hippy:

Coelho

04-21-2009, 01:38 AM

theres no point to organized sports, but that doesn't mean they're not fun to watch and participate in.

Indeed... and who knows if this life isnt only a game too?

dossantos

04-27-2009, 01:16 AM

We are a freak...
An accident...
We evolved by chance...
Really we are the final plague to hit the earth...

Cannabis 2012...
"The year of the Leaf"

vej33

05-01-2009, 05:39 PM

Really we are the final plague to hit the earth...

but...if that were at all true... if we were the final plague... then... what are the Jonas Brothers?

higher4hockey

05-01-2009, 06:46 PM

but...if that were at all true... if we were the final plague... then... what are the Jonas Brothers?

the beginning of the end.

tha_green_ghost

07-25-2009, 11:18 AM

By living life and evolving, you are sharing in the tree of knowledge. If the universe shares the same pulse with the earth and humans then by experiencing things, we are in fact manifesting our own reality. I tend to think of God as not as one being, spirit, or the like, but as the trandsendance of knowledge through life. In tern we are god.

I came into this thread with the same answer...I can totally agree. I also think it's important to appreciate life for what it is and the gifts we experience throughout the whole "ride". Even the fact that nobody knows what happens when we die is more of a reason to appreciate this life. That is what I truly believe.

Immolation

07-29-2009, 10:45 AM

If life is indeed, a cosmic accident, what is the point to anything? If after death we cease to exist, why live?

Because, We would like Our Human Race to Continue.It is as close to immorality as we Can get.

psychocat

07-29-2009, 10:51 PM

I really don't see why there has to be "a point".
Live it, love it,accept the moment for all it is, learn what you can from it, and try to pass on something worthwhile.

delusionsofNORMALity

08-04-2009, 11:04 PM

I really don't see why there has to be "a point".there must be a point to it all because otherwise humanity is merely another unimportant bit of life in the vastness of the universe and i don't think our collective ego could stand that. we have spent thousands of years convincing ourselves of our importance in the grand scheme of things and to realize, to truly understand, that it makes no difference whether we exist or not would probably cause mass hysteria around the world. all of the efforts of humanity to rise to the top of the food chain, to be masters and stewards of all we survey across this wet little ball in space would be for naught if there weren't some point to it all.
:rolleyes:

BlueBlazer

11-27-2009, 12:24 PM

One can't exist without thinking.

You've obviously never met my son . . . :smokin:

JackdaWack

11-27-2009, 08:05 PM

Honestly, in a nut shell, we as humans create thought and everything that surrounds it. The only person that can give meaning to life is the self. You have to find your own reason to live, it's pretty much that simple. The greatest thing some people discover is a legacy, a part of you that will exist after your gone, or some people just live life to the fullest and don't hold back.

There are so many different views though, like if death is inevitable then why hold back on anything, go skydiving or what not, But some people believe that its not worth the risk of there life, something that holds all possibilities of happiness. Two extremes.

The real question should be, when u die, was life worth living?

BlueBlazer

12-05-2009, 01:54 AM

Whether you find meaning in your life depends on each individual.

It seems to be a basic part of human nature to seek meaning in things. We have an innate desire to quantify, qualify, and name everything. The truly unexplainable gives us fits.

Nothing is more unexplainable than death. Is it the end, or do we continue with the sense of self intact? No one knows, but many have quantified, qualified, and named it nonetheless.

For myself, I don't need to know what happens when I die. I'm sure I'll find out. :D In the meantime, I just try to enjoy myself as much as possible without hurting anyone else and just be groovy to the folks I come across. That's meaning enough for me.

colour

12-06-2009, 04:27 PM

A bit trivial I think.

We probably are here by accident, i.e. no creator. But, that doesn't devalue life or take away from the natural beauty of things - all things. The universe doesn't owe you a feeling of purpose. If one does not value life- whether it has been lost or left undiscovered- then you have the choice of dying.

Stoner Shadow Wolf

05-02-2010, 09:51 PM

IF we were an accident, the point would be to cope with the accident.

Allow me to further expound on this; if we are an accident, then there is no objective, no ulterior purpose, other than to learn how to cope with being here.

As being an accident, and in tandem as having not yet been exterminated, there is no point, we're an accident, but we're still here and have no choice, since we havent been exterminated yet.

So the point is in our choosing until we are either exterminated or relocated (within reality/universe).

If we are an experiment, however, which is required to appear and function "accidentally", then we are being cultured to become something, or to find out what we are capable of becoming.

Keep in mind that all parts of reality are composed of smaller parts, and all parts are used to construct larger parts... We are an accidental/experimental "part" that is still developing/in development.

highasarobin

05-21-2010, 11:22 PM

Because we have no other choice. We are here and I don't fucking know why but we are, so enjoy it. Who cares if we were an accident? This life is a gift, the mind is a gift, knowledge is a gift. Take advantage of it and don't waste any time. This is your only chance man, so take it.:rastasmoke:

pepurr

05-22-2010, 11:44 AM

There doesn't have to be a point, unless you require it. Then you make up your own point, or accept someone else's point.

Other than that, we are here, being part of the whole, as an expression of the universe's unplanned effort to understand its self.

throatstick

05-22-2010, 07:33 PM

then you have the choice of dying.

or going on a rampage huh.....

dkgpro

06-26-2010, 01:51 AM

This also explains evolution. By having 5 senses you are interpreting the world around you. This is built up over time in your life and adds to the overall goal... evolution.

Evolution isn't a goal, it happens whether you contribute or not. Also, that is an irrelevant statement, Post maker would be asking, "what is the point of our species evolution."

You'll notice it doesn't add up, just like how egnostics, those who believe we are accidents in the first place, notice religion doesn't add up.

Thing is, if god put us here with a forced knowing that he exists, would people have accomplished nearly as much as they have today? Would the industrial revolution have happened with the comfort knowing there's a better amazing existence beyond this one, "so why not just have fun?"

Furthermore, if we were a mistake, why then would we evolve in the first place?