GH WATERFARM USERS: SIMPLE RECIRCULATING SYSTEM

[Weedhound]

Ok so I was at my hydro store yesterday and the BRAIN pulls out this kit from GH that makes your w/f set recirculating!! Ordinarily this isn't very exciting news EXCEPT......

Get ready.......:jointsmile:

It uses an air pump and drip ring set up to move the water through the system. You do NOT NEED A WATER PUMP!

Let me repeat that part:

YOU DO NOT NEED A WATER PUMP. IT RUNS OFF A BASIC AIR PUMP.

I bought one yesterday and already love it. It cost $60 and came with 2 drill bits, grommets, air pump, drip ring set up (minus drip ring) and tubing......basically everything you need except the drill itself.

The largest amount of work is drilling the holes to create a "daisy chain" effect in the w/fs. Everything else only takes a minute to set up.

Spread the news!!!!! :woohoo:

PS...tried to get some info on the web but couldn't find any.....my hydro man is always on the cutting edge....:D

[justanotherbozo]

look forward to hearing more about it! have you a name? maybe we can ALL start lookin' for info.

[Weedhound]

Its called the GH waterfarm 8 Pack Circulating Upgrade Kit and I can't even find mention of it on their website. The thing is....you can get all the parts and make one without buying the kit.

I need some damn photos though....and can't find ANY info.

[GreenLeaf420]

Its called the GH waterfarm 8 Pack Circulating Upgrade Kit and I can't even find mention of it on their website. The thing is....you can get all the parts and make one without buying the kit.

I need some damn photos though....and can't find ANY info.

LOL I'll help out WH :jointsmile::jointsmile::jointsmile:

[GreenLeaf420]

Hey WH I put up the Drip ring and a pic of the 8 pack hope it helps out...:thumbsup::jointsmile::jointsmile::jointsmil e:

[Weedhound]

ok.....see that drip ring thing? minus the drip ring? the little two tube dealie....let me find a pic

Ok this thing......you need to set it up INSIDE your lower rez so that your basic air pump (just a small cheapie not the big monster you see in GL's photo) so that it pulls the water in from one side of the rez and dumps it the lower container. At the same time the other side is refilling.....very hard to explain without the damn kit.....can't believe i cant find any info....

[GreenLeaf420]

Sorry WH just trying to help out... I know the cheap $40.00 Pump right?

[Weedhound]

No thats fine but I honestly think a monster pump would be too strong and cause issues.

See when we discussed recirculating the waterfarms the big issue was how strong of a water pump to use to prevent overflow since the entire gravity refill thing is so slow. You cant use something faster than the refill time right? That's why a cheapie 10 gallon fishtank aquarium pump is so perfect......small pump so keep things moving nice and slow which is HUGE when trying to move water along through all those buckets.

Capice? :D

Seriously the principal behind is exactly the same as the drip ring. You know how the air pump forces water up through the drip ring? Well it does the same thing inside the rez if you hook it up to an intake tube on your rez (then a seperate outtake tube to refill modules.) It pulls a bit of water in the rez from the inlet line and forces it up and into the rez. The suction created refills it from the other side.

It's quite brilliant really and I wish I could explain it better. We're modifying my other res tomorrow so we'll try and take some photos as we go to try and explain it more clearly.

[GreenDestiny]

Interesting method. It's definitely something I'd love to see drawn in a cheapo MS Paint diagram to show just how it works lol. Can't wait to learn more info about it.

[slothy]

iv been looking to mod my waterfarm system to do exactly this. I too would like to see some more info so I could custom mod it myself. (still kinda confused on how it works)

[justanotherbozo]

Seriously the principal behind is exactly the same as the drip ring. You know how the air pump forces water up through the drip ring? Well it does the same thing inside the rez if you hook it up to an intake tube on your rez (then a seperate outtake tube to refill modules.) It pulls a bit of water in the rez from the inlet line and forces it up and into the rez. The suction created refills it from the other side.

It's quite brilliant really and I wish I could explain it better. We're modifying my other res tomorrow so we'll try and take some photos as we go to try and explain it more clearly.

LOL, there's the rub for me WH, i've had so many other issues and principles to learn, i've had to prioritize. unfortunately, that was a principle i put on the back burner.
i figured if i couldn't get them to grow, and i couldn't get them to clone, well, i didn't need to learn how to drip on them. LOL
anyway, it looks like this has the interest of others also so i'm sure we will have all the info we need soon.

bozo,
peace, love, dope

[Weedhound]

Bozo you think I understand this stuff? I go to the hydro store and say "what should I do?" and the BRAIN says "this" and hands me something.....I go do it.....nice plants grow.

I STILL can't tell you much about lighting and spectrums beyond what the best to use is and the VERY basics of why so don't stress.....its a learn as you go thing.

[SnSstealth]

very interesting.....maybe even enough to convince this dirty boy of getting wet.........shhhhhhhh
whiskeytango

[Weedhound]

Stealth we could set you up with something really simple to start.....like a hempy....you'd even get to water it LOL. I think you'd do very well at it with some practice.

[justanotherbozo]

Bozo you think I understand this stuff? I go to the hydro store and say "what should I do?" and the BRAIN says "this" and hands me something.....I go do it.....nice plants grow.

I STILL can't tell you much about lighting and spectrums beyond what the best to use is and the VERY basics of why so don't stress.....its a learn as you go thing.


sigh, sadly, i'm poor enough that i am forced to learn the principles so i can come up with a makeshift alternative, 'on the cheap', lol

and Stealth, i'm only on my second grow, the first was in dirt, but i love the hydro way, lol, don't think i'll ever go back (with the possible exception of outdoors)
hydro rather than dirt, coupled with CFL rather than MV = 4 times the growth with the same seed stock.

i think i'm ready now to throw down on some quality genetics

so, toke amongst yourselves
:S5:

bozo,
peace, love, dope

[justanotherbozo]

I think you'd do very well at it with some practice.

i'm with you all the way on that WH!

shit, i'd say you both have proven your ability's, if you can do what you've already done, you can do hydro even better!

so, again, toke amongst yourselves, lol
:joint1:

bozo,
peace, love, dope

[Weedhound]

So we just went and built one in about 10 minutes and I took some photos. Hopefully these will make better sense than all my babble.

In the first two pics....the system set up unside the LOWER rez. This is the actual "piece" that GH sent with the kit. Second photo is the GH picture of the kit itself.

[Weedhound]

Here is what you will need in the first photo. Keep in mind these are only the parts to work on the resevoir....not the modules themselves. The modules themselves will need their own grommets and plastic extensions, tubing etc....

Second pic: Good extra parts to have around. The drill bits pictured there came with the kit but I used my own unibit to do all the drilling. The correct size bit for 1/2" holes (using 1/2" grommets btw...those are what are in the picture) is 13/16 fyi.

[Weedhound]

Oh and Bozo......hps instead of cfl.....4 times the yield for the same time, energy and nutes on your part. Worth every penny. ;)

[GreenLeaf420]

Hey WH:jointsmile: You have everyone's wheel's spinning. Exactly what we were discussing. The WF buckets everyone seems to agree is an issue I'm so surprised they have not Tried to make a repair Kit.... Who needs them when you have the Weed Hound on your side....

Great THREAD :thumbsup:

[Weedhound]

So here is the real brains of the whole operation and I could just KISS GH for thinking this up. It's a pumping column set up inside the rez that pulls the air in from the intake valve you set up and into the general rez.

We made one by adding an inch of 1/2 in tubing and an L extension to the bottom of the pumping column.....then cut the larger white tube down to approximately six inches (high enough to be above water level but low enough to stay inside the bucket) but we left the airline completely intact.

The third photo is a close up of both the one we made and the one that came with the GH kit.

[justanotherbozo]

Oh and Bozo......hps instead of cfl.....4 times the yield for the same time, energy and nutes on your part. Worth every penny. ;)


my use of CFL's is more a function of my ability to add lighting for $10.00 and my inability to throw down $200.00 - $300.00 all at once, rather than an actual preference for fluoro's.

believe me, if i had the dough, i'd be using 6 of those Procyon 100 LED lights. (LOL, and some CFL's for vegging)

kudo's to whiskeytango and doughboy for thier pioneering work!


bozo,
peace, love, dope

[Weedhound]

We didn't really feel the need to take pictures of this figuring everyone would be able to handle it by themselves but here are some photos of rez with 3 holes (and stop valves) in it and the bucket we are circulating with the system. In this case we're only using one but just imagine it as 8 of them all daisy chained together because the priniciple is exactly the same no matter what.

TIP: Buy those 1/2 inch stop valves in bulk.....you'll thank me later. :D

Afterthought: After drilling a third hole in the res it occurred to us that you really only need two of them (strictly speaking...an intake line and an outtake line) and the lower rez DOES come with two holes already. If you want to keep an eye on the water level you'll need 3 but can GET BY with the two already there.

[Weedhound]

PS....the power plant has improved quite a bit and is doing very well in a recirculating system. Plants just grow better with it generally imo. ;)

[justanotherbozo]

i'm still just dealing with my DWC bins individually, once i get my plants sexed and i begin production, then will be time enough to really understand how to make a recirculating system.

in truth, i plan on a SOG using 4x5gallon bins with buds in differing stages of flower so, wouldn't that mean different feeding schedules?

[Weedhound]

Bozo...yes different schedules will require different resevoirs. Thats the issue we are dealing with here and why setting things up for MINIMAL interference from us with all of them helps so much and why we'll even set up a recirculating system for just one bucket.

So final pics......you'll hook up the intake line into the rez and the pumping column up to that. You'll need to drill a small hole in the top of the rez to accomodate the airline (does NOT need to be exact) and hook your pump up to it. Outtake line out to the w/f modules (obviously) and you should be good to go. :thumbsup:

Tip: Third photo is of the parts we had left over and the parts we didn't use.....you'll have to do the math yourselves on that. :D :wtf:

[Weedhound]

And hopefully now it makes much more sense. :cool:

Hope that was clear enough for everyone to understand. If you don't want to build one I'm sure you can get the kit on the net or your local hydro store soon....I have a feeling these are going to be a real hot seller. :thumbsup:

[SnSstealth]

k....my heads reeling a lil...lol, gotta sober up a little bit more before i read this...
whiskeytango

[GreenLeaf420]

I think I understand this just please check me first. :jointsmile:

OK the reservoir gets a hole in the lower with a intake. A cheap pump that is tied into the last of 4 or each pot gets a exhaust for the water that goes back o the Rez? Sorry just want to get it right.

Then in the Rez Pop in the L shaped section and place an air pump to connect to the drip section. That makes what happen by adding the air pump to the drip in the Rez?

Each Pot gets the drip installed to it and then you add air?
Have a draw back to the main Rez
And all the air stops potential problems with Overflow?

WH I'm sorry I read this alot and I want to understand can you please just explain the theory to me......

Please I feel like such a Bozo:jointsmile::jointsmile:

[justanotherbozo]

WH I'm sorry I read this alot and I want to understand can you please just explain the theory to me......

Please I feel like such a Bozo:jointsmile::jointsmile:

lol, she isn't withholding the info Green, if she could explain it better she would have.
she's already admitted to not understanding the operating principles.
hydro guy says good, good, good and she trusts him and uses it. no need to understand it beyond being able to make it work.

lets just relax, someone else will see the thread and come to the rescue, we just have to be patient.

[slothy]

okay so let me see if I understand this right.

In the main res (the big one) you have a drip column attached to the intake (which is coming from the individual WF units) and on top it is attached to an air pump which pushes the intake water out to either each individual WF or into the controler (this is the part which confuses me).

So then in each individual WF unit, you have a second drip column inserted but instead of attaching a ring you attach a line which goes back to the main res (which is what i referred to as the "intake" before)

[Weedhound]

This is very true bozo....I've thought about but don't undestand it myself. The way I see it the air pump pulls water in through the intake. Now that there is a void created everything has to fill and the water fills it from the outtake line.....let me try and think of an example.

Think of it as a siphoning thing. If you have a complete circle and you draw something out from one side that something has fill from somehwhere and it does so from the other side due to gravity.

We need X-Crispi or somebody to explain it....they'll understand the theory behind it I think. Or maybe Stinky.....she gets stuff like that.

[Weedhound]

The air pump is acting like a siphon.....pulling air from the last waterfarm out and into the rez. So what basically happens then? That w/f is going to pull water from the next one and so on and so on all the way around the circle......until you come around to the first w/f which is going to pull it from the rez which is the normal way the system fills. . The pump is powering the pulling part.....gravity is handling the pushing part.

If you had everything daisy chained in a circle and took water out from one thing.....what would happen to the rest of them?

[Weedhound]

Ps....COMPLETELY IGNORE THE TOP REZ.....we're only working with the bottom one and top one doesnt affect anything as far as this goes. The top merely holds extra nutes. the nutes in the top rez will NOT recirculate.....does this info help at all?

[GreenLeaf420]

WH you have the set up I seen better PICS. Your forgetting to talk about the actual water pump which draws the water. Were does that fit in to this equation?

It's a good thread you did it that pump that pulls water and goes back to the rez. Were does that fit in?

[Weedhound]

Slothy.....I'm sorry I got confused on the second part of your question there....two drip rings in each individual w/f?

[Weedhound]

AHA! THATS IT EXACTLY!! THERE IS NO WATER PUMP!! NONE!! That's what is so KILLER!! Its as if you took the intake line and wrapped your lips around it and sucked some nute up and then spit it into your rez....What would happen?

[GreenLeaf420]

Finish the Post.... LOL:jointsmile::jointsmile:

[Weedhound]

Well if the water can't refill from the same spot it went out (it can only flow ONE WAY because of the air pump right?) What would happen? It would fill from the other way.....aLL THE WAY AROUND TO REZ right?? Because gravity will fill them all the same.....so take a small amount out of one and they ALL change their amount a bit.

[slothy]

i think i gets it now. So you have the drip tube in the controler, on the bottom its attached to the last waterfarm in the row (or last two water farms if you have 2 rows), on top its attached to a air pump which pushes the water back out to the first waterfarm in the row?

[Weedhound]

You DO almost have it.....but the air pump is actually pulling water IN from the last w/f and gravity is pushing it back out the other side instead of the other way around

Just like in each individual w/f pod....the airline is pulling water up the column and into the drip ring from the bottom of the bucket ....the only thing missing is the drip ring itself.

[slothy]

okay so now once the water leaves the tube, where does it go? Is it hooked right up to the first waterfarm in each row? And if thats the case, how do you adjust PH of the water once its in circulation (for whatever reason i have problems with unstable and constantly rising PH).

[SnSstealth]

wow...i get it now, I digs this! no electric pump, gravity fed, right?
whiskeytango

[Weedhound]

Exactly Stealth......the only electrical is the air pump and it's actually working on suction to draw the water in and up.....exactly the same way it does in each module.

Slothy....It comes in and up the tube and out the top (picture a drip ring at the top.) Water pops out the top and back into your rez...and the outtake line sends it to the very first waterfarm it's hooked up to by gravity from the resevoir itself just as if you were filling the entire system up through the top of the rez.

The Ph....GH always said you could control you ph and nutes from the central resevoir but anyone who uses them knows thats a bunch of bs......you have to check and adjust each pod individually or you're screwed.....BUT if the water is constantly recirculating you REALLY CAN just check and adjust the ph...in the bottom rez only instead of each individual module. You'll also have a more stable ph in general since the water is constantly remixing and circulating.

[slothy]

for those interested in buying this upgrade, GH will sell them directly to you if you call them (the number is on they're site). I dont think they sell to individuals often but be polite and they'll help ya out.

[Weedhound]

So did you get one Slothy?

[Weedhound]

So did you get one Slothy?

[GreenLeaf420]

Great to have the boards back. Have to learn to type again. LOL:jointsmile::jointsmile:

BEEN SMOKING ALOT MORE.....

[GreenLeaf420]

WH With the system what do you think if I drill a hole and put an air stone in the bottom with another pump?

[luvfriday]

OMG, Im laughing my ass off weedhound!!! I know everything your talking about, I have brain damage from what I learned from Dec till now. Really I wish I could report Im smoking the pounds I got off my first grow :yippee: so thats why I havent been around much. Nothing like that, but its better then the boring truth im just in la la land.

So I cant wait to read up what Ive missed.

[Weedhound]

Luv you ARE aware that pounds per plant is the norm.....POUNDS of plants just DRAGGING those huge arms sized branches down threatening to snap their tender little ...

oops, I'm buzzed...sorrry.....

Good to see you back; hope you are feeling good these days.

GL.....You can do that ....I never have with mine but all O2 is good O2 imo.

Make your hole for airline as high up as possible.

[Opie Yutts]

WH thanks for this info. I heard about this a few months back, when someone was laughed at by the "pros" for saying it's possible to set up this system without a water pump. I'm going to read this again later, and rethink an upcoming design.

[slothy]

Question for ya weedhound, i recieved my upgrade kit today and did a lazy job implementing it. Instead of drilling second holes in the individual WF's, I just kept the T connectors in and added T's to the end modules which go to the intake of the pumping column.

The problem is that the water flow is really slow, it just barly bubbles out of the tube and the PH is way different between the controler and WF units (the controler is 5.8, the WF's are 6.4). Is this because i didnt properly daisy chain the WF's or is this normal?

[Weedhound]

Hey slothy it's because you need to daisy chain them to make it work properly. ;)

[HyDrO ViSiOnZ]

So if i understand this right, the drip tube in the res is pulling water from the farms and putting it in the res. So does water come out of the top and overflow into the res?

[Weedhound]

YES! that's it EXACTLY hydrovisions....you truly DO have the vision for hydro! :D

[SnSstealth]

this hurts my head...lol, Im gonna re-read the thread when I am sober...Whenever that happens..I am very interested..you know me and "efficient"...I eventually wanna run an entire 20 sq ft set-up solar...can ya dig it?...fuckin a I am ripped...sorry to clutter your thread with rambling WH...lol
WT

[basementjungle]

Is one regular old air pump really enough to drive all those airlift pumps?

[Weedhound]

No worries Stealth.....we all have our days :D.

Basement,

Yes and its a simple ten gallon fishtank airpump. One thing to consider is that it will circulate your solution extremely slowly so it's not as effective as a water pump set up circulating the system faster (but also much easier to run.)

I think the main advantage with the slower set up is that it CAN be run off a standard air pump and that it DOES help keeping the ppms and ph MORE stable in all the individual buckets than no recirculating system at all and checking and changing all those individual pods gets to be be a real PITA as we all know. :wtf:

[HyDrO ViSiOnZ]

The best way to think of it is this. The res is only connected to the buckets once. The supply. The drip tube that is in the rez is technically just like having it in the bucket. But instead the bucket is hooked to it remotely. therefor, the tube is the same level and water that is in the farm. Just like the bucket air diplaces the water and moves it up into the ring. But this time air displaces the water moves it up and instead of a ring it overflows into the rez. The supply of the res see the drop in water and releases more out. The tube in the controller bucket and the controller should have the same water level at all times.

WH: If i could ask you check out my thread, your opinion would be apperciated!

[Weedhound]

Sure HV, can you post a link?

And that's right.....it's like a drip ring setup the same as every other bucket. The only difference is that it pulls the water from the last bucket and into the rez. That creates a vaccum in that bucket so what happens then? It pulls it from the next bucket and so on all the way around the group and back to the rez.

Its really BRILLIANT and I THOROUGHLY applaud GH for thinking of it. :thumbsup:

[HyDrO ViSiOnZ]

If a bigger diameter cylinder is used intstead of the normal waterfarm one and a bigger air pump, would this speed the circulation of water up?

http://boards.cannabis.com/hydroponics/156586-help-new-hydro-setup-suggestions.html = my link

[GreenLeaf420]

checking and changing all those individual pods gets to be be a real PITA as we all know. :wtf:

Yes we do Miss to much!!!!!

:wtf::wtf:
:jointsmile::jointsmile::jointsmile:

[Weedhound]

Hydro V what I saw happen with a stronger air pump was actually that it STOPPED working.....the air pressure was too strong to let any water into the tube so it stopped pulling water altogether.

[basementjungle]

If you look into how an airlift pump works you can see why certain things happen.

Running a really massive pump on a small tube doesn't lift water because too much air will clear the pipe of water, and give the incoming air a straight shot up to the surface. It doesn't want to do any more work than necessary, so it doesn't bother to lift any water.

Think of it this way: if the air pressure is much higher than the water pressure at that depth, it will have the ability to push down harder than the water pushes up. A certain amount of that likely happens anyway or the water would try to go up the airline, but if it's too much stronger the water will have trouble getting around the air bubbles so that it can be lifted by those bubbles.

How it works:
Basically adding air to water reduces its density. When the air/water inside the lift pipe is less dense than the water outside the pipe, the water pressure at the bottom of the pipe tries to force water inward and upward to equalize the pressure. The air/water mixture literally floats on top of the denser water and thus can be raised above the surface of that water.

Conversely, things that normally float in water can actually be made to sink if enough air is forced into that water. (They've demonstrated that ships can be sunk if an underwater vent were to release sufficient quantities of gas into the water under the ship. It's one of the theories behind ships disappearing in the Bermuda Triangle.)

Point being that you've got to have the right mixture of air and water. Too much air and the water won't be able to "climb" on top of individual bubbles to be lifted up. Way too much air and the air will actually be forced downward to escape both up the pipe and out the bottom. And if you have too much water there won't be enough lifting force to make it come out the top.


Changing the diameter of the pipe (making it larger) means you need more air to lift the water, and that more water can be lifted. Bubble size also plays a role: if your bubble size is the same as the pipe's inside diameter, you'll lift water no matter what. Even at very low air pressure differentials you'll lift water, but it will go slow.

Also, regardless of the amount of air, water, or pipe size, an airlift pump can only lift water to a height of one-half the length of the submerged pipe.

[GreenLeaf420]

Running a really massive pump on a small tube doesn't lift water because too much air will clear the pipe of water, and give the incoming air a straight shot up to the surface. It doesn't want to do any more work than necessary, so it doesn't bother to lift any water..

The GH pumps that come with the system are only 8 Watts. I upgraded to a Pond Master and what a difference. I was constantly disconnecting and trying different setups. That may all be true with a single system but on a larger system a larger pump is a good upgrade as well as adding Air Stones, The development you see out of one plant in a month in the DWC would take 4 months in soil....

[kplusv510]

got 3 waterfarms and its a hella work checking just three the ph ppm temp etc i heard and wanted to buy a waterfarm upgrade recirculating thing but could find much about it or if there was a cheap route maybe building one NEED HELP PLEASE

[Weedhound]

http://boards.cannabis.com/hydroponics/91976-water-farm-dwc-club.html

if you want to go a cheap route at least it doesn't cost anything to read and learn. Anything and EVERYTHING you might want to know if in this thread.

Good luck.

[GreenLeaf420]

Hey WH I miss our conversations:thumbsup:. I'm playing in dirt for a minute come and check me out we can talk HYDRO over their too!!!! LOL

GL420:jointsmile::jointsmile::jointsmile:

http://boards.cannabis.com/indoor-growing/157353-i-need-advice-flower-bed-please.html#post1874115

[basementjungle]

The GH pumps that come with the system are only 8 Watts. I upgraded to a Pond Master and what a difference. I was constantly disconnecting and trying different setups. That may all be true with a single system but on a larger system a larger pump is a good upgrade as well as adding Air Stones, The development you see out of one plant in a month in the DWC would take 4 months in soil....

I'm not sure if you're disagreeing with me here.

In a bigger system like what you're talking about it would take a lot of air pressure to interrupt the function of an airlift pump. I don't know the math, but I know it would be a lot. So yeah, you could use just about any normal air pump you find with good results.

[billnie40]

Why does the air lift hose have to be above the water line. Wouldn't it circulate more water if it was slightly below the water line? It would also fill the pots faster when changing water.

[Booyagrandma]

bulkheads
1 inch pvc for draining
1/2 inch pvc for feeding
and a big ass water pump,

you need to drill bigger holes in the 1st mesh bucket, for more roots.
(just re drill the already preexisting holes bigger)

the set up they give you for the online kit isn't that great, when your recirculating water you want hugh amounts moving fast and into a water fall effect for uber DO. the kit they give you just isn't sufficent enough to do that.

[Weedhound]

Boo makes a good point......the recirculation is extremely slow with the existing kit.

HOWEVER, my personal reason for wanting to recirculate the system was for one main issue......I got damn sick of adjusting the ph on each w/f bucket individually. This does indeed solve that problem and for that alone it's worth it imho. ;)

[nlkush]

first time here, long time on og. check the link for all the details.
http://www.generalhydroponics.com/genhydro_US/instructions/WF_Upgrade_instructions.pdf

thanks for all the info though.

i am running 4 systems all link together. one complete circuit. one rez out take to next intake and so on. i think the major hang up on this was visualizing it. you have the air in every bucket all ready but they are not directly hooked up the feed line. where when you mod with this, the pump on the controller is directly hooked to the intake, thus creating the same afect as in the buckets, but it actually moving the water from the line into the controller.

so in a multi w/f set up ( ie 4 rez and 32 buckets) hook them all up to each other. this way all four are working together, better regualtion. awesome idea and plan, thanks again for the post,
cheers
:rastasmoke:

[Weedhound]

And thank YOU for the link. :)

[nlkush]

Not a problem on the link, least i can do with all this knowledge floating around in here!!!

WH what time of water regiment are u using?? (ie on/off day/night). i have a CAP extreme room controller ( C.A.P. Xtreme Greenhouse Controller - XGC-1e (http://growwurks.com/cap-xtreme-greenhouse-controller-xgc-1e.aspx)) and it has some adjustments but i could also us another timer for day and night?? Or do you let yours run constantly? been in cocco forever, also did an areo flow a couple time. switching to this today. building after i goto the depot. oct 1 will be veg day 1. everything is set just need to build. feel like a lil kid on xmas yet again! let me know what ya think.

[Weedhound]

nl when my plants are vegging I just use the drip rings that come with each w/f and we run it 24/0.....its ALWAYS dripping so no timer needed. The only time we run it differently is perhaps the first few days after putting in a new seedling.

We've tried some different techniques in bloom.......DWC with GOOD sized air wands and a commercial air pump that does the job extremely well and that part is standard in bloom. HOWEVER......we've run out of electrical outlets in our grow space and short of adding more and more extension cords (or getting a SAFE electrician in to add another fuse box or whatever they need to do which we haven't been able to do yet) at this point we are going back on forth on the drip ring part in flower since the rez is well oxygenated.

SO......the last few grows we have discontinued the drip ring part in bloom and gone strictly DWC BUT we think it may be part of what is affecting our poorer-than-aimed-for-yield estimates so a couple of plants we're growing right now we've deliberately (ie:another extension cord) made sure to keep the drip rings running through bloom 24/7 as well.
We're not sure if turning off the drip ring and switching to strictly DWC affects final yield but we'll get some sort of clue this go round as we have several on 24/7 drip ring AND good areation running 24/7 in their individual buckets as well.

My personal thought is the plant would grow better with constant drip ring action vs just "wicking" up needed nutes but the electrical situation has made it impossible to know for sure. ;)

[TurboLife]

Has anyone made their own pumping column? I am trying to recirculate my dwc buckets and I used this 1/2 fitting with a 1/4 nipple coming out the side kinda like a tee. I'm just having trouble getting a steady flow of water, alittle bit come out then it kinda bubbles the alittle more comes out. I was wondering what the diameter of the GH pumping colunm is? Or if anyone had any ideas. Thanks

[d4twamp]

Has anyone made their own pumping column? I am trying to recirculate my dwc buckets and I used this 1/2 fitting with a 1/4 nipple coming out the side kinda like a tee. I'm just having trouble getting a steady flow of water, alittle bit come out then it kinda bubbles the alittle more comes out. I was wondering what the diameter of the GH pumping colunm is? Or if anyone had any ideas. Thanks

Turbo isn't that what WH did on the 1st page of this thread..idk I might be wrong...check the 1st page out...

[TurboLife]

Turbo isn't that what WH did on the 1st page of this thread..idk I might be wrong...check the 1st page out...

It looks like she made one out of an exsiting pumping column, and added a elbow to the bottom. I had the tee laying around that I tried to make one out of but I think the bubble's might be too small for the 1/2 line, IDK, maybr it needs to be a Y shape. I just wanted to see if anyone esle had made their own, and what they used.

[Weedhound]

Turbo, can you put up a pic of what you are working with? I struggle when trying to visualize what people are saying......a pic would work best for me to see what you are talking about.

[d4twamp]

What she said...:thumbsup:

[Booyagrandma]

Turbo are you making it fresh all homemade or using the preexisting waterfarm and it recirculating kit? Are you trying to upgrade with a 1/2 line? What size is te pump you are using? How many buckets are you trying to connect? Whats the space limit? ect ect I can offer my support I just need to know more about what the goal is :stoned::stoned::stoned:

Thanks
Booya

[TurboLife]

Booya, I'm trying to make the pumping colunm. I wasn't really trying to up grade to the 1/2 line, I'm only recirculating 2 5 gallon buckets, thats just what fit on the tee fitting I had. It's a 1/2 stright fitting with 1/4 od. as the tee off. Does it have to be in the shape of a y or would the tee work? I think the bubbles might be to small for the 1/2 line. Thanks for your help.

[greenthumbdanny]

Hey there weedhound. Thank you for the very informative thread here on the waterfarms. :thumbsup:I have Been using the waterfarm method for years. I run 25-30 buckets. But I use a 55 Gal res and a 32 Gal controller. I would like to do this upgrade to my system. In the past I have manually hooked up a submersible pump to pump out all of my nutrients from my buckets when I do reservoir changes just because of that lack of circulation the waterfarms have. Its a real pain to do it, making sure each bucket is drained of its old nutrient contents. Im thinking of adding a second controller to my grow. I think if I split the grow in half and operate on 2 controllers instead of the 1 it would be more efficient. Just my thought. Kinda curious of your opinion. My question is If I want to recirculate my system with 25-30 plants how big of external pump is gonna be needed. I think obviously it has to be bigger than the one made for the 8 pack up grade.

Here are some pics of my setup.

http://www.420genetics.com/gallery/files/5/7/7/PDR_0068.JPG
http://www.420genetics.com/gallery/files/5/7/7/PDR_0067.JPG
http://www.420genetics.com/gallery/files/5/7/7/PDR_0043.JPG
http://www.420genetics.com/gallery/files/5/7/7/Mainres.JPG
http://www.420genetics.com/gallery/files/5/7/7/PDR_0103.JPG
This is the air pump that powers all of the pumping columns. Very efficient and quiet. Could definitely handle more buckets if needed.
http://www.growkind.com/gallery/data/503/medium/PDR_0024.JPG

[CaStoner]

Hello all, I just joined a few days ago I been a soil grower forever I decided to try hydro bought the WF 8 pack, I just finish adding a 1/15hp Current USA chiller to it and I like it a lot it down to 63! I set to 62:thumbsup:

Each bucket has 2 shut off valves. All buckets res, controller wrapped in double reflectix.
http://www.weedfarmer.com/pictures/d/310277-2/DSCF0285.JPG
Dual overflow just incase 3 pc fans on res cover.
http://www.weedfarmer.com/pictures/d/310274-2/DSCF0286.JPG
Need to add another float or larger, flow too slow to controller. Just testing for leaks and operation for now.
http://www.weedfarmer.com/pictures/d/310280-2/DSCF0283.JPG
http://www.weedfarmer.com/pictures/d/310283-2/DSCF0282.JPG
Dual mock up fans for now started at 71 so far in about 15 mins dropped to 67. Now at 66!
http://www.weedfarmer.com/pictures/d/310268-2/DSCF0288.JPG
Planning on using the hut exhaust fan ducting to the front of the chiller and then the rear ducted to the outside.
http://www.weedfarmer.com/pictures/d/310271-2/DSCF0287.JPG

[greenthumbdanny]

Hello all, I just joined a few days ago I been a soil grower forever I decided to try hydro bought the WF 8 pack, I just finish adding a 1/15hp Current USA chiller to it and I like it a lot it down to 63! I set to 62:thumbsup:

Each bucket has 2 shut off valves. All buckets res, controller wrapped in double reflectix.
http://www.weedfarmer.com/pictures/d/310277-2/DSCF0285.JPG
Dual overflow just incase 3 pc fans on res cover.
http://www.weedfarmer.com/pictures/d/310274-2/DSCF0286.JPG
Need to add another float or larger, flow too slow to controller. Just testing for leaks and operation for now.
http://www.weedfarmer.com/pictures/d/310280-2/DSCF0283.JPG
http://www.weedfarmer.com/pictures/d/310283-2/DSCF0282.JPG
Dual mock up fans for now started at 71 so far in about 15 mins dropped to 67. Now at 66!
http://www.weedfarmer.com/pictures/d/310268-2/DSCF0288.JPG
Planning on using the hut exhaust fan ducting to the front of the chiller and then the rear ducted to the outside.
http://www.weedfarmer.com/pictures/d/310271-2/DSCF0287.JPG

How much did that chiller cost ya bud??

[CaStoner]

Hi the chiller cost me $271.99+shipping $17.99 total 289.98

[d4twamp]

I'm gonna make my own chiller out of a hot/cold water dispenser...I know it definitely won't be a nice looking as a store bought one, but Damn will it be nice to not spend alot of money to have chilled water in my dro system...

D:thumbsup:

[greenthumbdanny]

Hi the chiller cost me $271.99+shipping $17.99 total 289.98

Any chance of you throwing up the link for that chiller. Where ya ordered from, brand etc etc. Ive been wanting one for a while now.:thumbsup:

[CaStoner]

Sure np, I bought mine from Drsfostersmith.com must of been on sale because they now want $359?

anyways I just google for the lowest prices, But I did find these guys. Free shipping over $150 even better than my deal.
Current USA 1/15 HP Prime Mini Chiller - Dual Stage - (2680) Chillers (http://store.petside.com/show_product/6510/?utm_source=froogle&utm_medium=datafeed&utm_term=6510)

For your larger growing system I would recommend a bigger chiller, mine perfect for my 8 buckets and small res etc. less than 50 gallon for the whole system.

Courtesy of IC Waterfarmfan.
http://www.weedfarmer.com/pictures/d/310036-2/41573buckets_final.jpg

[Weedhound]

Hi guys, thanks for dropping by and adding to the thread. :)

Green you must have the largest WF setup in history!! You GO with that stuff!! I have to say I have zero idea on the pump size and/or power.....the process is slow enough with two or three buckets not to mention all the ones you have.

I don't seem to need a chiller, thank goodness so can't help anyone with that q. And quite honestly....don't know what to tell you about the larger setup/pump size either.
BUT.....I do know who to ask who will know and I will ask them (mmy hydro guy who's a genius imo) and let you know what he says. There are several different things to accomplish by recirculating your system.......I do it mainly to keep ph in balance in all the buckets because as you know they're all different despite GH's claim that the central rez is all you need. Recirculating also can add extra O2 to your solution and keep it mixed together better as well.

You will get better flow and better recirculation I would think with a water pump as X-Crispi used to do with his. Imo, there seems to bea point where the air pump is too strong to pull the water through the pumping column and all you end up with is extra air instead of the "drip ring" effect you are looking for. However, others here have mentioned they moved to stronger air pumps (i use the teeny pump that came with the kit) and said they preferred it. I can't quite wrap my mind around how they are making it work....but they are and like it.

I will return later today with answer to green's question......hydro store not open yet. :D

[Weedhound]

Sure np, I bought mine from Drsfostersmith.com must of been on sale because they now want $359?

anyways I just google for the lowest prices, But I did find these guys. Free shipping over $150 even better than my deal.
Current USA 1/15 HP Prime Mini Chiller - Dual Stage - (2680) Chillers (http://store.petside.com/show_product/6510/?utm_source=froogle&utm_medium=datafeed&utm_term=6510)

For your larger growing system I would recommend a bigger chiller, mine perfect for my 8 buckets and small res etc. less than 50 gallon for the whole system.

Courtesy of IC Waterfarmfan.
http://www.weedfarmer.com/pictures/d/310036-2/41573buckets_final.jpg

Foster and Smith LOL!! I love it!! I get alot of my animal stuff there but never thought about using them for hydro stuff.....and I'm sure Drs F and S didn't know either you could use their stuff for growing ganja either. :D

[CaStoner]

Hi Weedhound must be nice not to worry about hot temperatures. I thought I could get away with it by vegging in the winter but then I forgot about global warming what winter? I live in the desert like weather in So,Calif. Probably hit triple digits this weekend.

Yah I will be pissed if I lost my harvest to root rot especially if I could have prevent it somehow.

I toke up too much! :stoned:

I have it set at 60.
http://www.weedfarmer.com/pictures/d/310289-2/DSCF0289.JPG

[d4twamp]

Supposed to be 80 here this week

[Weedhound]

I trust my cannazym and rhizotonic to keep root rot at bay. Costly solution but that's just us.

Green,.....I called my hydro guy and he suggested that if trying to keep ph and nutes balanced in a 25 w/f setup hooked together to a central rez he'd up to the pump shown below. It's pretty strong so he also suggested placing a stop valve inside the main res in order to control the speed of flow/air power you would need.

[Weedhound]

Forgot to mention the pump shown below is an eco pump 3 if you would like some useful info vs a just a picture.......:D

[CaStoner]

I trust my cannazym and rhizotonic to keep root rot at bay. Costly solution but that's just us.

I been using Hydroguard and Hygrozyme as a precautionary measure, before adding the chiller and still using it.

Is Cannazym and Rhizotonic basically the same thing? and is it better?

[Weedhound]

Hey Ca S,

My hydro man recommmends the CANNA line for root products and the man has never steered me wrong yet in the three years I've been learning under him. He feels cannazym and Rhizotonic are the best root products out there and they work great for us so we have to agree. Make sure your stuff is fresh.......I let some cannazym get too old (like six months old) and it stopped working for us. The result was we immediately began to have root issues with EVERYTHING. A new batch of each and no problems whatsoever.

I don't have the "science" brain as someone like Stinky to tell you exactly how they work but Rhizotonic helps you grow big strong roots and helps treat root rot (don't ask me how......) and cannazym takes your dead and dying roots and turns them into some sort of inert material so they don't rot. Now excuse me......but I think that's brilliant of a a company to think of.

So the rhizo help keeps roots from dying or becoming unhealthy but through the life of your plant some root death is normal. That's where your cannazym comes in.

Good luck.

[greenthumbdanny]

I trust my cannazym and rhizotonic to keep root rot at bay. Costly solution but that's just us.

Green,.....I called my hydro guy and he suggested that if trying to keep ph and nutes balanced in a 25 w/f setup hooked together to a central rez he'd up to the pump shown below. It's pretty strong so he also suggested placing a stop valve inside the main res in order to control the speed of flow/air power you would need.

Thanks weedhound. I use that exact pump to power all of my pumping columns in my grow. I think that is the absolute best little pump out there.

So did your hydro guy suggest I use that same pump to power the waterfarm recirculate upgrade kit to my 25 buckets? not sure if thats what you mean or not.

[Weedhound]

Yes, he said that he would change out the weenie pump and use the Eco three in the central rez. A half inch stop valve placed on the insdie of the rez (which then connects to the pumping column) will help you to make the airflow as strong or as weak as you want it by simply adjusting the stop valve this way or that way.

[greenthumbdanny]

Hey there Weedhound, I wanted to thank you for taking time out to help me with my questions about my grow. Be safe.. GTD

[Thuwadpumper]

I'm using four wf's separate everything and what a PITA! IT's alot of work. I want to increase my units but I can't get my head around the res/controller/upgrade kit. I'd love to see a step by step or sketch kinda thing. GH has an install pdf on their site but I must be fried! It seems like it could prob. be made out of rubbermaid tubs and stuff but I'd be willing to get the kit from them just not feeling confident on getting it installed. Anyone willing to help please let me know with message or something. Thanks to all for the efforts, sorry some of us seem so dense! LOL.

[Weedhound]

Are you using a central rez for the four of them or just doing each one individually?

[Thuwadpumper]

Right now I'm doing four wf's separate without the res or controller and what alot of work. Don't get me wrong I've used the wf's for awhile and have had great success but it's alot of work and yes in the end it's usually worth it but I am def. interested in switching over to the controller/res recirculating deal. I've been reading and reading and like I said I just can't get my head around how to set it up and I'm usually not very dumb when it comes to this stuff. I sent GH an email and have asked them to post a video or some sort of tutorial. Even their pdf's aren't the greatest but hey they do have them so it's better than nothing. Thanks to all who are helping.

[Weedhound]

yes, you'll need a central res. Let me see if I can find a pic of the systm connected; i'll look through my photos If you buy their kit it has everything you need except the actual drill. Even has the correct sized drill bits in the kit. It also cost about $70 when I bought it.....and I know it can be put together for less because I made a second one myself and stil use the recirculating system even for just one plant because it REALLY seems to help growth and DEFINITELY keeps the ph more stable in all your buckets.

[Thuwadpumper]

I really appreciate your help and willingness to assist me with this. Pictures are great, like i said i'm usually pretty good with this stuff, I even made my own aeroponics cloner so as long as pictures are good i'm usually pretty visual. Maybe if others send GH an email they'll put out a little how to video and spare you guys the headache! Thanks again!

[Thuwadpumper]

hey there, just checking in with you to see if you've been able to dig anything up. I hate to be a pest but I was going to add my buckets soon so I'd like to get this thing going. I kinda get that I put another hole on the other side of my buckets and they're all linked together and then the multi port pump just uses the skinny tubing to the drip ring like usual. What I don't really get is the whole res/controller thing and that just putting one of the tubes with a pump into the res is going to circulate the nutes through the entire system of buckets constantly so they're all still on the drip? Thanks for your time, appreciate it!

[Weedhound]

You're not a pest or I would have sprayed you with Dont Bug Me by Fox Farms. :D
I've looked through all my photos and unfortunately last month I went through and deletted a BUNCH of older photos......including the ones I took when making the waterfarms recirculating..

Did you buy your waterfarms individually or as a set of 8 w/controller? You say you run them all seperately.....do you have a cenral res? If not you can buy a rubbermaid tub that will work fine as a central rez.

I have a pretty detailed diagram on the back of the instructions that came with the upgrade. I will try for a photo of this if you would like. but it is most likely the same thing GH has on its website. I can't really think of how else to explain it.......but I sure love the fact that GH thought it up! :D

[Weedhound]

hey there, just checking in with you to see if you've been able to dig anything up. I hate to be a pest but I was going to add my buckets soon so I'd like to get this thing going. I kinda get that I put another hole on the other side of my buckets and they're all linked together and then the multi port pump just uses the skinny tubing to the drip ring like usual. What I don't really get is the whole res/controller thing and that just putting one of the tubes with a pump into the res is going to circulate the nutes through the entire system of buckets constantly so they're all still on the drip? Thanks for your time, appreciate it!

Yes, keep them all on drip. You will need a seperate airpump (get a single imo) and to daisy chain your buckets together. Your central res will have two holes as well.......one for the water to be pulled in (the exact same way it does in your drip ring in each bucket) with the pump; the other the lets water back to the first waterfarm. The waterfarms work on gravity right?
I think perhaps it seems confusing because yours all all seperate. Once connected together; what happens is basically this. The drip ring in the res pulls water from the first w/f. So what happens? the first one pulls it from the next one (because of gravity the water will want to stay level in all the buckets) and on and on around the circle. The last w/f pulls water from another outlet in the central rez......where guess what???? The water is there because it pulled from the first w/f. Then it all repeats.

Think gravity and leveling water.

[the image reaper]

re-circulating system done easy: I just connected both of my waterfarms, with a cheap $15 water pump in the extra reservoir (rubbermaid tub outside of the cabinet), the pump continuously feeds into the top of the waterfarms, and the solution returns to the reservoir (water seeks it's own level) ... my waterfarms still used air pumps to drip thru the rings, (became it's own backup system), in case a pump would fail, my plants will be fine ... (look close, see why Mylar sucks ?) ... :jointsmile:

[Weedhound]

Dude mylar is so YESTERDAY omg!! :D

He's got four waterfarms. can you connect all four with the water pump IR and just daisy chain them together?

[Thuwadpumper]

I think I understand in theory, like how to physically do it but how it's going to work is what I think is scaring me. I think I'm just going to go for it. I got mine all individually because I was only going to do one waterfarm (yeah right!) than two, than three and so on and so on! So I don't have the controller and res. things. Do you have two, like the 13 gallon and 8 gallon or are you just using one to recirculate. I was thinking about just doing one, I don't know if it's really neccessary to have the extra res just sitting on top. It's just now isn't the most opportune time to experiment ya know what I mean. Thanks alot for trying to help me understand, glad I'm not a pest to you or anyone else that has tried to help!

[Thuwadpumper]

hey there, thanks for trying to help out. I saved the pic but I couldn't really see when I tried to enlarge the pic. I think I see what you're doing but can't say for sure. Thanks again!

[Thuwadpumper]

maybe if you have time you can click a pic of your res/controller part from inside and out. I get the linking all the buckets together part. PRETTY PLEASE!!!!

[Weedhound]

Thuwad, check on the photos in post # 26 and 27. shows the inside perfectly; next post shows same sytem filled with water and running. See if those work for you because that's exactly the photos I would take again

Your problem in understanding, I thiink, is the your lack of your central res....you don't need the float and all that.....with 4 w/fs I'd go with a 30 or 40 gal rubbermaid to hellp with keeping the solution stable as a central rez. Also if you buy the upgrad kit you get everything you need....for a price If you piecemeal it start with buying an exra pumping colum and drip ring.

[Thuwadpumper]

OK, I'll check those other pics out. I only have four but ideally I'd like to add the other buckets I have, up to eight, at a minimum six. Do you still think I just need the one reservoir? Do you really need that big of a res, each waterfarm only holds like two gallons right, I know the bucket is bigger but to the fill line it's only a couple of gallons. If you have six or eight would you use the second with the float and all of that or just use the one res? Thanks again for all of your help. I'll make sure there's something extra in your stocking this Christmas! :rastasmoke:

[Weedhound]

and more 1/2 inch grommets, L connecters (or stop valves which I like) and 1/2 inch tubing.. All in the kit but the $$$ to buy.......either way works.

[Weedhound]

and more 1/2 inch grommets, L connecters (or stop valves which I like) and 1/2 inch tubing.. All in the kit but the $$$ to buy.......either way works. Forgot a top res; don't need it unless you can't check things daily I get the feeling with 4 w/f's you do a fair amount

Shit the post is totally confusing me know. I don't know what the hell I've done her. :D:stoned:

[Weedhound]

Thuwad ignore last post. :D

Yes, it helps to have that big a res; especially if you want to add w/f's as you go. Yes, they only hold 2 gals apiece but they're going to eat a fair amount daily as they get bigger and larger amounts stay more stable. If you don't mind adding a LARGE amount of new nutes DAILY during flowering (when they really eat) then of ok but I would go with no LESS than a 20 gal res and a 30 would be much more likely. With 8-40 absolutely. And a good water pump and a place to access and dispose of your water......closer the better.

[Thuwadpumper]

I think you're right. Going with the attitude of setting up just what i wanted at the time has kinda put me in this mess. If I have a bigger res. I can always add if needed although I'm fairly limited in my overall space. 40 buckets OMG, if only I had that much room. 6 to 8 is going to be tough probably! I was just thinking their kit is a 13 gallon and an 8 gallon so that's only 21 gallons total. But if I get one 30 gallon or so, I can do without the other. The good thing is it's right in my laundry room so I have a tub for draining filling, so thanks for that idea, I can rig a hose to have right beside it or something. OK, I'm going for it dude! You convinced me. Check out Ropakcorp.com buckets look the same huh, I'm thinking of doing a square 5 gallon and 3 gallon insert and I bet having deeper buckets, more root space etc. could be helpful! All of this stuff is really pretty easy to duplicate if you get creative huh! Thanks alot man. Good friends are hard to come by!

[Thuwadpumper]

OK, NowI went and gone and done it! I did a mock run by drilling holes in wf modules and set up a couple of air pumps I had because I can't really do in the room, for obvious reasons. I also only did three because right now that's all I have that aren't being used and wouldn't affect things. Here's some questions for you and hopefully I've done it right but there's some things I'm noticing. My first bucket has too much water in it. The others are fine. The tube that gets the air pump connected (circulating) the wider one makes girgle noises is that normal?If I dump some out of my res will that help?

[Thuwadpumper]

here's the pics that didn't load

[Thuwadpumper]

Just out of curiosity have you or anyone you know made a third hole to put the blue air tube with the fill line back on the WF modules? I was thinking about trying but just wanted to put out some feelers? I put a hold on my res for one, it's the third hole on the pic. I might use it to feed a 1/4" air pump tube to air stone or something inside of the res. Have a good one!

[Weedhound]

where's the airpump that goes to the drip inside? Do all your individual w/fs have both and inlet and outlet holes; (ie: front and back) because all four of them should be the exact same water level. They are all sitting at same level on the ground correct? And is your first waterfarm hooked up outside with the drip inside on the other side of the same connector as your first water farm. I can't tell from your photo; can you take a pic of all the tubing connections: especially to and from the res and what exactly is your tubing connected to.

[Thuwadpumper]

OK, some of my tubing is clear so it's prob. hard to see. My hydro store didn't have the multi port so i'm using a bunch of to ports until it's in. I have the tube going to drip in the res. and then each wf module has an air tube as well, two of them are green. Once I dumped some water out it seemed to maintain. I'm going to add the other buckets just want to make sure it's working. I also put one of the blue tubes w/fill line on the back side of the res. Don't know if I need to but I might feed an air pump tube to an air stone inside. Here's some more pics. Let me know if this helps. Thanks hound for all the help and time you're taking.

[Weedhound]

Hey, no worries; glad to help. It DOES look like you've got it there........yes all buckets should remain atthe same level at all times. (including the res) and looks to me like you are set to go and you did a good job building it as well. Mine lacks the loop yours has to keep it in place so sometimes it becomes detached and just floats around the res spitting out water.......:D

[Thuwadpumper]

Thanks for checking everything out. I'm going to move everything in and add the other buckets. Just wanted to do the mock run and check it out first. Hae you ever tried drilling a third hole to add the blue air tube back onto the waterfarm modules? I wonder if it would help? They have them when they run independantly? Thanks again man!

[Thuwadpumper]

OK, so I finally went ahead and did the whole thing with six waterfarms, moved everything in and just relocated the res to where I needed it and drilled some holes so I could feed the 1/2" tubing into my space and I'm not real sure it it's truely circulating. I set my ph 5.8 and about 400 ppm and then by the next morning every waterfarm module was waaaaaaay high and way different than the res. It's only been two days but if this isn't really recirculating I'm going to freak! I reset the ph and everything again but man! Weedhound do you ever test your individual waterfarm modules as well just to see? I'm thinking about taking everything out and run some clear water with food coloring in it to see if it pulls through each module. Alright dude, later. Hope everything is good with you.

[Weedhound]

You may need a stronger pump. I have hooked up no more than three together but they were actually a res and several five gallon buckets........larger but exact same idea. And yes, I've checked (my last batch ran into two livestock tubs holding about 7 gals apiece plus the res and things worked) .......all ph's were within .2 of each other. You might need more power for a larger setup air pump wise.

good luck.

[Thuwadpumper]

Do you think the one with two ports are stronger or it's split with two ports? I have one of them already. Or just get one with the one port that you can add up to six or eight? Something like this one maybe? Or maybe you can give me a make/model that worked for you? Thanks again man.

Active Aqua Commercial - 6?

[Weedhound]

Thu check out posts #96, 97 and #101. I think that may work for you (don't forget the stop valve to control air pump power flow.)

[Thuwadpumper]

Hey hound. OK, I checked out the posts. The pump I was talking about is pretty similar. Just a little less wats and lpm but not much. How did you know how much to regulate the valve? What did you look for or what told you you had it with the right amount of air? My res is only about 3 1/2 ft away from my first module and I only have six modules altogether. The one you have is 35 watts 60 lpm and the one I was looking at is 20 watts 45 lpm. Thanks again hound, have a good one.

[Weedhound]

I saw your air pump thu......you have one with 4 different lines right? the difference between the pumps (beside power) is the fact that all power goes through one tube and then to seperate air lines later.....something you can use with one air tube for maximum air pressure.

[Thuwadpumper]

Hey hound. The pump I have for the res. is just one of the one port little pumps, I think somebody called it a "weeney" pump. Then on the waterfarm modules I have three "two port" eco air pumps. I just didn't want all of the modules on one pump in case the pump goes out. Then none of them would be dripping instead of just the one that goes out. I don't know if that will affect it or not. Each module seems to be doing fine as far as dripping. I think my issue is recirculation right now because of such varying numbers. Would having one of the other pumps like yours for the modules affect circulation also or is it just to pump from the bucket up through the drip ring? Hope this info helps hound. thanks again.

[Weedhound]

No, the eco three would be used strictly for recirculation. The food coloring thing sounds good and worked well for a friend of mine to check how well his system worked. Don't put the monster pump on your drip rings......it'll blow them away.

[GoldenBoy812]

Is a 350gpm pump too much?

[Thuwadpumper]

Ok, that's what I thought. So if I get the other pump I'll just try it on the res/recirc. What did you look for as far as adjusting the flow? How did you know when you had it regulated right? It's hard for me to do coloring right now because well...I can't. Like I said my res. is about 3 1/2ft from first module and only have a total of six? So I should be able to get the one right below your model, just a little less watts and lpm's? What do you think?

[Weedhound]

Hi GB....Love your blue dobie. Isn't 356 gpm a water pump or am I mistaken?

Thu, post 18, second photo, lower right below drill bits next to grommets. 1/2 inch stop valve. :)

[Thuwadpumper]

[quote=Weedhound]Hi GB....Love your blue dobie. Isn't 356 gpm a water pump or am I mistaken?

Thu, post 18, second photo, lower right below drill bits next to grommets. 1/2 inch stop valve.


Um, I'm confused. I'm familiar with the valves. Those valves are 1/2" lines usually regulating water flow? How do you use them on the air pump nozzle which is tubing like for air stones, etc.? How do I know the flow is enough on the air pump when numbers stabilize?

[Weedhound]

by putting it on the insde of your res and putting it between the pump line and the first water line and opening and closing it to fit your water flow needs.

[Weedhound]

Yes, when all w/f modules come in at around the same ph. Not perfect.....but pretty close.

[Thuwadpumper]

OK, I get it, so you're using the bigger air pump on the column tubing at full force but then you're regulating/controlling the flow of the water using the 1/2" stop valve on the res. so that's how you're controlling the flow of water through each wf module? right? I need to buy you a beer...or 20!

[GoldenBoy812]

Hi GB....Love your blue dobie. Isn't 356 gpm a water pump or am I mistaken?

I am looking at creating a "contraption" that would use 1 air pump to circulate from one recepticle to another, effectivly flooding it to its drain height (which is close to the top).

Then, you develop a time frame (how long to fill) in order to achieve your feeding needs in regards to pump settings. Isn't too much exposure to nutes/water a bad thing:confused:

[Weedhound]

Well, no not really. You just want to make sure that there is enough aeration.....When you use a DWC system the lower parts of the roots sit in the waterr 24/7. /without airstones and air pump the roots would drown. The more aeration the better. I'm not a huge fan of ebb and flow......I like the constant drip action. The recirculating part is to keep all the ph's in the buckets more stable.

[Weedhound]

OK, I get it, so you're using the bigger air pump on the column tubing at full force but then you're regulating/controlling the flow of the water using the 1/2" stop valve on the res. so that's how you're controlling the flow of water through each wf module? right? I need to buy you a beer...or 20!


Sounds like you got it to me......yes to control/regulate the water flow. Love to say I thought of it myself; but it was really my hydro guy.

Happy growing! :D

[Weedhound]

I am looking at creating a "contraption" that would use 1 air pump to circulate from one recepticle to another, effectivly flooding it to its drain height (which is close to the top).

Then, you develop a time frame (how long to fill) in order to achieve your feeding needs in regards to pump settings. Isn't too much exposure to nutes/water a bad thing:confused:


So are you saying you have no central rez......just different buckets? Are they attached to each other or stand alone? Or are we still in the planning phase? If so I have thoughts that you may like better yet not be as much work (dwc for example)

[GoldenBoy812]

So are you saying you have no central rez......just different buckets? Are they attached to each other or stand alone? Or are we still in the planning phase? If so I have thoughts that you may like better yet not be as much work (dwc for example)

"In my design", there is a central res, with two receptacles with 6 small net pots each (designed for ruderalis hybrids). The goal in a dwc would be to keep roots saturated, but with 12 individual sets of roots dependent on the same pool, would it need a greater instance of recirculation?

Like... should you have a pump recirculate once an hour for 5 min or so, depending on pump size (which is why i asked if 350 was a bit much:D)?

[Weedhound]

You can put them all in the same res but it had better be a large one and all females. Trying to seperate males down the road from the same res is NOT a good plan. . Reciruculatng is fine; but you will still need seprate air pumps and airstones and/or a drip feed. (also run by air pump.)

[GoldenBoy812]

You can put them all in the same res but it had better be a large one and all females. Trying to seperate males down the road from the same res is NOT a good plan. . Reciruculatng is fine; but you will still need seprate air pumps and airstones and/or a drip feed. (also run by air pump.)

Obtaining "autoflowering" genetics is a pain in the ass, so "my design" is made to breed your own:D

I still do not understand how an air pump runs the drip feeder. Do you poke tiny holes in the lines to induce inertia? I am confused as to how it lifts the water unless the water level at drip end is even steven with that of the res?

[Weedhound]

To be honest I'm not sure how it works either.....All I really know is that you hook up your air pump to the pumping column and it works. Maybe someone else can expain better.....the mechanical aspect is not what i am best at (and i'm being kind to myself) :D

[Weedhound]

Breeding your own is fine......but realize that when you put them all in the same place, even if you plant all the same thing at all the same time you will still vary in your harvest times. You could cut them I suppose and leave the roots; I'm not sure if this would cause a problem or not. Anyone?

[Thuwadpumper]

hey hound.I changed pumps and it's still not holding numbers, things are so out of wack. I took weenie pump out and changed it for a big one, put in the valve before the first water line in my res. set all of the nutrients in res and each module to 5.8 for ph and 300 ppm for babies and the next day my res was 700 and ph of 6.58 and each module was different from not only the res but every other module. I've searched all of the forums and you seem to be the only one having it work. Most others are converting to ebb&flo/Drip combo or putting inline pumps in their line somewhere to kick on periodically to recirculate. General Hydroponics should address this.

[Weedhound]

Thu, let me say I'm sorry this isn't working for you. I havent looked around but I must say it honestly works great for me. Both ppms and ph stay within close range of each other. I just put another two MK's in buckets and hooked them together. I don't have to pull the damn plants out every day..... I really do work through the res and don't touch the plants at all unless there is problem which I love......they're just too big.

I wish I could see your systrm in action, something is telling me we are missing something basic but I can't think of what that would be.

[Thuwadpumper]

The only thing I can think of is taking some pictures but right now isn't the time to do that, I'll need to wait until later. I'll take a picture of res. area with pump and and lines and then lines going into room. My first bucket actually gets really filled up too. This happened when I did my little mock setup but after I took the water out it maintained? I'm to the point where I'll prob. have to un-do to keep from losing babies. I'm only running six modules but either way it's the same work, possibly less because I won't have the res. to adjust daily as well. I guess I'd have to add a blue drain level tube in the other hole. Weed where would you say your valve is in your res. I kknow you're running more buckets but we have the same pump and if I did a little less than you maybe it would adjust? Thanks again!

[Weedhound]

Just a quick basics.....Your air pump is hooked up inside your res to pumping column.........where is it pulling water from? It should be attached to the first waterfarm in the series. The air pump is pulling in water from w/f one and putting it into the res. Where's your outlet? The rest of the set up should run on gravity.....they are all at the same level correct?

[Thuwadpumper]

OK, I finally got a chance to take some pics. My air pump which is Active Aqua Commercial 12 112 watts 110 lpm is hooked to column in res. Also located above water to avoid any water making it back to the pump. The valve is installed in the very first line from the air column and blue tubing (prob. 1/4 turn closed to restrict some flow. Then it connects to fitting in grommet and goes into room to first waterfarm, then all of them connect and last waterfarm is routed back to other line in res. One blue and one black. All waterfarms have an air tube with drip ring and there are two small round air stones in the res.

[Weedhound]

Thu it all looks good to me but can you get a pic of the res and modules together? Mr Hound juet shut down the plants for the night but I set up a system today. I think I can get the whole thing in one pic.....I'll give it a try tomorrow.

[Thuwadpumper]

I can't get everything in one pic. That's why I took the pic of the res and then the one of the tubes coming through the wall. They're in different rooms and there's a br wall in between and because the other room is narrow and long it wouldn't show up. I can take a pic of modules if that would help? I'm going to go check numbers this morning and if they're all out of whack I'm going to drain everything and start fresh again and see if adjusting the stop valve a little will help. I know the pump is strong enough to move it all.

[Thuwadpumper]

OK, so I drained, cleaned everything, res. modules, rings, EVERYTHING. and reset nutes and p.h. I have pump on and valve is completely open. just thinking since my res. is a few ft. away, 1/2" tubing from res. to modules and in between each maybe it's not pushing it? Doubtful. The blue tube goes out from res. to first mod. on the right in the room. Then all mod's connect and then the black goes back to res. I'm on week two and usually by now i'm able to turn back lights. I'll be lucky if I don't lose anything. Stay tuned I might have some pumps and stuff for sale! Anyway here's the pics hound, thanks for taking a look and helping out.

[Weedhound]

Thu.....here;s a couple photos of my system......Do YOU see anything different?

[Thuwadpumper]

Thu.....here;s a couple photos of my system......Do YOU see anything different?[/QUOTE]
I don't think I do, I mean you're using different mod's but I think in theory, actual functionality of the system looks the same. The main thing is the pump going to the air column in the res. and then just linking all of the buckets together. You have stop valves on the side of the buckets which is fricking a great idea!! kudos for that one. I just hate that brand, they always kinda drip and my local store sells them for $3 so I wasn't going to get that many. I'm stumped man!

[Thuwadpumper]

OK, so this morning I posted that I re-did everything. Just an update, Had to lower PH at around 11:30 a.m. Couldn't check or adjust mod's. At 4:30 Res was a little low? Didn't adjust. Nutes were 5.90

Mod 1
P.H 6.45
Nutes 545

Mod 2
P.H. 6.45
Nutes 522

Mod 3
P.H. 6.42
Nutes 490

Mod 4
P.H. 6.53
Nutes 492

Mod 5
P.H. 6.30
Nutes 521

Mod 6
P.H. 6.42
Nutes 423

Well there you have it, not sure what though!

[Weedhound]

thu,

sorry I hqvent been around to answers lately but I must say you do have me stumped for ideas. Anyonee else?

[Thuwadpumper]

No worries, I tore all that crap down. I hooked up a pump and pull the nutes in and push them out with valves and it takes me about 10 minutes. You know it may just be your numbers hold. I've talked to alot of people about this, unlike me they're smart, educated in physics, biochem etc. and 30 plus years in hydro etc. and it doesn't make any sense to them. Of course this is their opinion. Glad it works for you and I appreciate your help that you continued to offer but you are the only person I can find on the infamous world wide web that it works for. Take care!

[LOC NAR on probation]

Its all about finding what works for you. Hope you keep trying hydro is the thing when tuned in.

[Daddynobucks]

if it was easy we would still be growing in dirt,I think us hydro folks are tinkers at heart and love the chalenge.but when you get it right the rewards are well worth the initial effort.

there are as many different methods and directions of thought about hydro as there are people using it,and most of them work to some degree

I think the main problem with the system was not enough circulation, low flow rate

[Thuwadpumper]

Oh don't get me wrong, I'm still growing hydro and I don't hate the waterfarms, quite the contrary. I've had some sick results, I have picks of plants taller than me and 1 1/2" 2" trunks. Some say I may have set records! I've simply modified to make them work. I totally agree about the tinkering. I love the challenge and I've figured out a way to make them work. Circulation is the key and I don't think that way is the way to make it circulate. I bought a sick airpump that can run 12 lines and it was not moving it. I am working on a system that I hope will work and if I do I'll be sure to post it!

[Weedhound]

Well glad you found something that works for you. :)

[d4twamp]

I've read somewhere in the past that too large an air pump will cause the w/f recirc. setup to not recirc....

I went with Xtra Crispi's idea for gettin' them to recirc. and like it that way better, cuz I can just close the valves on the res and pump everything in the system back to the res for testing or res changes...

When I'm ready to gettin it recircin' again just open the valves and gravity fills the system, simplicity

[MikeDPitt]

i get it i get it i get it!!!! took me a minute but thank you soooo much!!! adding a chiller to the controller and now i will have 8 happy 70 degree perfectly pHed pots!!!!!!!!

[MikeDPitt]

I absolutely love my w/f 8 pack, but a question for all of you w/f users... how do u mix your controller water/top res water? I mix everything im putting in the bottom at "full strength" then fill the top with a solution 1/2 the tds of the bottom, but the guy at my hydro store said just to fill it all with the same strength nute solution, but it seems like that would throw nute balance outta whack no?