Yellow spots...Fox Farm nutes

[SnSstealth]

I have started seeing a common problem on here...Yellow spotting on leaves, by growers using Fox Farm. I have had this problem myself. IMHO, what is going on, is we are over feeding, causing a Ph imbalance, leading to lock-out...I have troubleshooted the HELL out of this issue...with help from Stinky, WH, reaper...and others. So my conclusion is stated. Give me your thoughts, and share your issues if you have had any.
I think the solution is simple. (thanks JG2007) We should use the minimum recommended dosage, at ever other feeding...keep Ph around 6.5, checking Ph of water used to fed AFTER adding nutes, and check run-off Ph after feeding.
I am stoned as the rock-biter...(see who catches THAT reference....lol) so I may have left something out...Let me know what you guys think....share away
:smokebong:
whiskeytango

[Rusty Trichome]

I've been using FF nutes (G-M-B) for years now. No ongoing problems here. I do a minor flush a couple of times in flower, tho. (4-5 gallons of plain, ph'd water, per 5 gallon pot) One major flush the week before harvest. I do follow a modified version of their schedule for soil plants, but every grow/grower/growroom is different. Were I inflexible with my nute schedule, my results would vary greatly. For instance: a sativa and an indica will likely have different reactions to the same quantity and ratio of nute mix.

Perhaps it's not the FF or the nute ratio that's giving problems. Perhaps it's the quantity of properly mixed nutes, that is added per pot. Or the frequency. Or perhaps overwatering.

With the Tiger Bloom, instructions say to use 2 tsp:gallon, per week. I add 1 tsp:gal twice a week. (Mondays and Thursdays)
For every gallon that I mix, I can fertilize two to three - 5 gallon pots. If I see run-off while adding the nutes, I know I've given too much. (nutes are too expensive to waste) Plain water only between feedings, slight run-off ok.

Even though I use well water, (8.1 ph from tap...adjusted down to 6.7 or so using phosphoric acid) I still add 1 tsp:gallon CalMag Plus, twice a month. Holds the darker-green colors better. Also, I only foliar if it is to correct a deficiency. Never do I spray, just for a humidity adjustment.

I also have taken to transplanting from a 3 gallon pot, to a five gallon pot, on the day of switching to 12/12. Being rootbound late in flower is a bitch, and up-potting has worked well for me. Slows transition into bloom cycle by adding the fresh soil, (a local mix...very hot: Filthy Rich Potting Soil (http://www.starnursery.com/show_details.php?root=9&sub1=103&product=592&PHPSESSID=092a799e13efacd6f1e4b9425fcbadc9)) but after a couple of weeks under 12/12, is bigger-n-better than ever, and right on track. (can/will cause some extra stretch, so cab growers shouldn't really do this, lol)

FF has never given me an excuse to switch, so am likely to continue it's use. Equally as important...I've found a nute series that works very well with the soil mix I use. FF is a quality product, and I've learned how incorporate it into my plants' busy schedule. :jointsmile:

Am curious to see other's comments, tho. :thumbsup:

[Opie Yutts]

I used Fox Farm for years too and was satisfied with the results. Talking hydro here. I was satisfied because I didn't know any different, and it was hugely different to the soil grows I was used too. It left me with deficiencies, specifically iron and nitrogen. I am in no way an expert at deficiencies, but when I tried supplements the problems got better and I became more than satisfied. After much reading and asking around I'm about ready for a full on Dutch Master grow, with a little Advanced Nutrients thrown in at the end. Those are two names that will not steer you wrong IMO and in that of many others more knowledgeable than I.

I won't try and tell you what's causing yellow spots because I've decided to not give advice if I'm not sure about something. I don't want to risk someone else's grow. The best advice I know to give is to research via the www. I'd start with this forum and search problem chart, since there are plenty. I know I've posted at least 5 in the problems section.

How about some pictures of the problem?

[SnSstealth]

yeah...i think i was just bombing them with nutes... i fed with 5 gal water into the pots...in said 5 gal container...i used the max recommended dose....and at every feeding...thats the best i can come up with after treating for all the def, mites, ph....getting really frustrating....lol
thanks for the imput guys!
WT

[Opie Yutts]

I'm not sure if nute burn comes in spots. I think it's more like on the very tip of the leaves and then the outside edges. Yellow spots could be an iron deficiency.

[PopsSoCal]

I have started seeing a common problem on here...Yellow spotting on leaves, by growers using Fox Farm. I have had this problem myself. IMHO, what is going on, is we are over feeding, causing a Ph imbalance, leading to lock-out...I have troubleshooted the HELL out of this issue...with help from Stinky, WH, reaper...and others. So my conclusion is stated. Give me your thoughts, and share your issues if you have had any.
I think the solution is simple. (thanks JG2007) We should use the minimum recommended dosage, at ever other feeding...keep Ph around 6.5, checking Ph of water used to fed AFTER adding nutes, and check run-off Ph after feeding.
I am stoned as the rock-biter...(see who catches THAT reference....lol) so I may have left something out...Let me know what you guys think....share away
:smokebong:
whiskeytango

He He He I think I know that, "Legend"? it has something with nothingness.....

[Opie Yutts]

Just a thought. I know 6.5 PH is about right for soil (I like 6.6), but this Cannabis.com Forums Message Boards - Medical Marijuana, Cannabis Club, Dispensary, News (http://boards.cannabis.com/attachments/plant-problems/178743d1203577223-charts-guides-graphs-all-sortsa-useful-goodies-nutrient_chart-soill-hydro.jpg) shows that 6.5 may make it hard for iron uptake. Any PH may cause deficiency in some chemical. Perhaps a foliar feeding of Spray N Grow? Certainly couldn't hurt.

[daihashi]

Just a thought. I know 6.5 PH is about right for soil (I like 6.6), but this Cannabis.com Forums Message Boards - Medical Marijuana, Cannabis Club, Dispensary, News (http://boards.cannabis.com/attachments/plant-problems/178743d1203577223-charts-guides-graphs-all-sortsa-useful-goodies-nutrient_chart-soill-hydro.jpg) shows that 6.5 may make it hard for iron uptake. Any PH may cause deficiency in some chemical. Perhaps a foliar feeding of Spray N Grow? Certainly couldn't hurt.

meh..

I've like this chart. I feel it's a more accurate depiction of what happens as the ph rises or drops.

Cannabis.com Forums Message Boards - Medical Marijuana, Cannabis Club, Dispensary, News (http://boards.cannabis.com/attachments/plant-problems/177503d1202744257-charts-guides-graphs-all-sortsa-useful-goodies-9798nutrientuptakeandph.jpg)

[SnSstealth]

bump!

[Opie Yutts]

The nerve of some people. Bumping without pictures.:D

I'm telling ya, foliar feed with spray n grow. It might fix the problem without anyone ever really knowing what it is.

[SnSstealth]

spray and grow...like home depot spray n grow?
whiskeytango

[YxXXxY]

I'm one of the ones that had this problem. In my case I had the problem while using Grow Big. I was pretty sure I was over ferting but I did it anyway because the plants seemed to like it. I'm still pretty inexperienced and I need to push things to see how far I can go I guess.

My soil ph was ok. I figured too much of whatever (nitrogen or whatever else) is in Grow Big could lock something else out. Because I had ph problem with my last and first grow and the leaves looked the same. But I used peat moss last time because I didn't know any better and it was really acidic. And I used different ferts last time. This time my soil ph is fine.
Something else I should mention because it could possibly have some weird effects is that my ferts are a couple years old. I don't know if that would matter but I figured I should mention it if the intention of this thread is to try to figure out commonalities.

[SnSstealth]

we just bought ours, but that doesnt mean they are not old...good point to look into
WT

[stinkyattic]

I'm telling ya, foliar feed with spray n grow. It might fix the problem without anyone ever really knowing what it is.
There is a certain beautiful simplicity in this. And this is the EXACT reason I keep a trusty bottle of Algoflash or GH Micro around. Micronute foliar feeds ftw! They buy you time to discover the PROBLEM while you treat the SYMPTOMS.
I no longer use FoxFarm because of the lockouts I was getting at normal application rates. I think that if you use it, you should get on a feeding schedule that includes a HEAVY watering every couple weeks with pH adjusted plain water to runoff, checking the pH of the runoff afterwards.

[SnSstealth]

sweet!...well i definitely know i over fed for a while....and it does seem that this is a common problem with FF...i will continue using it till we run out, but at the lower recommended dose, and every OTHER feeding, checking run off constantly, and good Ph corrected aqua...
any other organic lines you guys might recommend stinks and opie? i am very adamant about organic, and heard many great reviews about FF..If i get these lock-outs again, after correcting my feedings, i will switch...just dont know a good switch...
so defintiely getting some spray n grow, or GH micro....
WT

[stinkyattic]

You know that FoxFarms is not OMRI certified, right? It's organic based, but not technically organic.
Along those lines, Botanicare Pure Blend Pro is also organic-based. I find it easier to work with, as you are more likely to get DEFICIENCIES than lockouts, and those are easy to treat.
Canna Bio is organic. The other Cannas are heavily organic but not technically Organic (with the big O lol) I haven't used the Bio but I <3 the Aqua, OMG OMG OMG it is the best. They are very user-friendly in terms of how much wiggle room you have to make mistakes. I have found it hard to fuck up running Canna in hydro.

[SnSstealth]

guess ill be lookin into canna bio huh?...thanks stinks:jointsmile:
WT

[Opie Yutts]

Yes I wouldn't be surprised if Spray N Grow is in Home Depot. I got mine in a hydro store after rhizome recommended it. I'm sure most any micro nutrient supplement would do well, not sure if spray N grow is organic. I'd try what stinky recommends. Not a big fan of Fox Farm (hydro products) anymore though I used to be in the beginning. I've always had problems here and there, but then I've never spent the money to completely follow their recommended schedule. Perhaps that would aleviate problems.

I firmly believe in Dutch Master and Advanced Nutrients. Don't know how much of their stuff is organic, but why is that so important? So you can tell people you grew organic weed? It's not any better for you, especially if you flush at the end. Organic stuff gets all yucky and clogs up things. I know we are supposed to get all happy about running off and hugging trees, but why? If you refrain from dumping some used nutes on the ground, the world won't be saved any easier. The billions of tons of toxins weekly that our government allows corporations to dump into our water and air kinda overshadows our little drop in the bucket efforts to go green.

Sorry, I don't know what got into me. Good luck.

[stinkyattic]

Sorry, I don't know what got into me. Good luck.Nor do I, but I kinda like it ;)

Nothing like a good flush period at the end to moot-ify your non-organic sins. It's like the deathbed conversion of the growing world!

[SnSstealth]

no tree hugging per se...just have always been organic, and dont see a reason to not be...IMHO...again, IMHO, organic always tastes better...let the ass chewing begin...lol
i got on 2 pairs of underwear!!
WT

[stinkyattic]

.let the ass chewing begin...lol
i got on 2 pairs of underwear!!Oh good, you have the edible panties on today! Who brought the whipped cream?

[Opie Yutts]

Suddenly I'm feeling a little ill.

SnS, if you start using some mist heads you'll find a reason to not go organic real fast. I don't understand how there can be a difference in taste if the plants are flushed. Different strokes and such...

[GreenLeaf420]

Leafs on the top of one of my older plants are starting to curl up. Has been slightly mutant since germination(cotyledons died, four leaf sets, first few leaf sets were slightly deformed).

Other problem is a seedling which is starting to develop yellow tips. Think it may just be ready to start a feeding regiment, but I'd like some opinions first.

E-indoor
E-soil
E-specific medium- Both are in fox farms ocean mix. Seedling was in light warrior until it was transplanted a few days ago..

Fox Farm Ocean Mix and any other for that matter has a PH of 7.0 constant in the beggining. Believe me I'm going through it now the best PH testers all the PH down repl cal and mag. The oceanic SUCKS for people who want to blast it back with nutes unless you can get the PH to a lower level which I did by mixing a good Bach of water with PH down the level of water was 2.6 LOL really only the strong survive.. LOL Out of them all my hardiest mother got fucked up but all the rest are doing good now just been hitting them with a flush for four days and tomorrow will start back on the nutes they leveled off @ 6 TWO ARE STILL @ 5.6-5.7. Really the Ocean mix is for people who don't want nutes why pay all that money to have to wash it away? They claim it will balance out @ 6.2 after 2-3 weeks If anything I will use it with a mix next time and get my cow shit Lime PRO Mix castings and some Oceanic maybe if I can clean up the mess It started for me. All the Babbies I have in just ocean Mix are doing great with no nutes under a T5 once you hit them leaves curl and it's a battle from there on in...

[GreenLeaf420]

OK went to the Hydro store today and l told them of our issues withh FF Soils. They then called and let me speak with Cathy the head of hydroFarm. I told her about all the issues and they are fully aware of the issue. Yet FF is doing nothing to warn users of their products. She had said to help correct this by using Hydrozyme and it will help with the lock out. A bunch of my plants fan leaves are infected but the plants are good. I keep trying to clean them out yet every time things seem to stabilize they go haywire again. Please any input would be appreciated.

[killerm8r]

I was in a local nursery looking for stuff back when I was getting started in hydroponics (not really looking to buy, just trying to get an idea of where I could find certain things if I had to buy them in an emergency - I don't want to advertise what my hobby is...)

I saw some FoxFarm stuff on the shelf but something about it just made me really skeptical about buying it. I couldn't put my finger on it, but it just didn't look "right".

I've learned to trust my gut on stuff like that.

From the looks of this thread it seems like they don't really balance their formulas properly. Rather than killing yourself trying to fix the problems with your base nutes, maybe it'd just be better to upgrade to a better quality brand?

I know some people do okay with FF, but how much saved money is worth the headache of sick plants?

[PopsSoCal]

Suddenly I'm feeling a little ill.

SnS, if you start using some mist heads you'll find a reason to not go organic real fast. I don't understand how there can be a difference in taste if the plants are flushed. Different strokes and such...
Mist heads? do you mean like a drip system? or is it like NFT? I have a flood tray (Ebb&Flow) is that something I can adapt to? just curious at the moment:stoned:

[Weedhound]

Because I have this lovely WW in soil that doesn't have any sign of a problem....FFOF soil btw. (first photo)

HOWEVER....on my power plant (second photo) with NO FOX FARM ANYTHING in it I am continually chasing the problem which you can see clearly on the lower sets of leaves......and has not really changed a bit despite several strong flushes. The only time the problem seems to improve with this particular plant is when I cut back the nute level to that about equal with a white widow.....ie....about 2/3 ppm at the most.

PS....Damn power plant is one of those backwards growing phenos....(phenos?) I HATE those....:wtf: Maybe it's the breeding but these PP's seem fairly fussy to me.

[SnSstealth]

i agree with WH 100%...i actually love fox farm products, but we over-ferted? quite bad...and still couldnt chase down the problem...so if using FF, just make sure you use it every OTHER feeding, and at the recommended LOWEST amount...
this "problem" is getting quite aggravating isnt it WH?.....lol drove me nuts trying to figure it out....flushed alot, treated with cal-mag, ph down....shit wouldnt fix itself....ended up taking out our single stem right at the end too......BASTARDS!!!...lol
whiskeytango

[Weedhound]

Stealth I agree and found that with regular transplants of my white widow into larger containers (recommended by the Stinskter to do and works great btw :thumbsup:) of FFOsF have done wonderfully.....with only two or three times that I actually FED nutes to her.....the rest she's gotten from the soil. ;)

[Opie Yutts]

Mist heads? do you mean like a drip system? or is it like NFT? I have a flood tray (Ebb&Flow) is that something I can adapt to? just curious at the moment:stoned:

Some people use mist heads in NFT, and also in aeroponics. Ebb and flow probably wouldn't have the problem since there are no tiny orifices to squeeze nutrients through.

[the image reaper]

after switching to 100% Fox Farm nutes a few months ago, I have consistently grown the best looking plants of my life. period. :D ... in general, (per gallon of pH adjusted springwater) I use one tablespoon of their 'Big Bloom', 2-3 teaspoons of their 'Grow Big Hydroponics' (I used their soil version the first grow, since I already had it, plants did fine), and 1 teaspoon 'Tiger Bloom', and 1/4 teaspoon 'Open Sesame', during 12/12 period ... with exception of adding a bit of CalMag+ and molasses, if I feel like it, I pretty much just use the Fox Farms Feeding Schedule amounts ... my PPM is always on the Low side, so I quit checking it ... simple ... :wtf: ... I check pH every 2-3 days, and it stays close enough, I guess, the plants are healthy ... I don't even check the ppm anymore, the plant seems happy, so to hell with it ... I am either the luckiest sonfabitch in the world, or it just isn't necessary to obsess over plants like most growers do ... I try to mimic nature, and keep things simple ... ( it's a WEED :D) ... regardless, I am VERY happy since switching to Fox Farm products (to hell with organics, if the world depended on organic food sources, we'd all be starving) ... :D

[Opie Yutts]

to hell with organics, if the world depended on organic food sources, we'd all be starving) ... :D

Heck yeah, that's what I've been saying. Good to hear from you reaper.

[Weedhound]

reaper I'm going to be around....waiting....when you have some sort of reaction that helps you understand WHY us hydro growers "obsess" over our plants the way we do.

Believe me.....there ARE reasons. ;)

[the image reaper]

reaper I'm going to be around....waiting....when you have some sort of reaction that helps you understand WHY us hydro growers "obsess" over our plants the way we do.

Believe me.....there ARE reasons.

it's all that 'clean-living' ya'all doin' ... it's a curse, I tell ya :S2:

[Weedhound]

Damn and i gave up cigerettes too.....:D

I don't grow completely organic either btw......does a good McDonald's burger count as organic??? :wtf:

[the image reaper]

a 'good' McDonald's burger ? ... hmmmm, oxymorons aside, I can't vouch for their ingredients being organic or not ... some taste organic (like poop), and some are more towards the chemo side of the scale, :D ... now, a sack full of 20-30 WHITE CASTLE Sliders, there's a meal fit for a real man :yippee:

[Weedhound]

OXYMORON! Is that a word like PROPENSITY? :D Goddamnnit now I have to go find a dictionary.....:D

[SnSstealth]

mmmmmm.........sliders.....
WT