Noob on the Cheap

[Cede2Weed]

I have a little experience growing outdoors. We basically used large numbers to guarantee success and were at the mercy of the seasons. Long story short, the land we grew on is no longer available to us and I am not the type that would even consider guerrilla growing.

I have ready many, many, posts on this board and am very excited. At the same time, the more I read, the more differing views I get. So I have decided to just jump in, splash around and hope If I am not able to swim a lifeguard will come to my rescue.

This log will be for tracking my mistakes and, hopefully, getting advice as I am sure to make many of the same mistakes I have read about here. American eagerness sometimes triumphs over ingenuity.

[Cede2Weed]

My goal is to produce only for personal use and to be able to dictate my high. In my outdoor grows this was accomplish be timing the harvest alone. We would harvest in three phases, each phase producing a different high from the same crop. I know understand why, before I was just told that was how you did it.

I have purchased 2 large rubbermaid storage containers for making a portable grower, but have not begun the construction.

I have three 6500k CFLs, 26W = 100W variety.
1 oscillating fam, 1 box fan and 3 pc fans
JiffyStrips jiffy pots (although I am accustomed to nursing sprouts in egg cartons prior to translanting to buckets with handles for outdoor, but time to learn new tricks)
Seed starter mix consisting of a sphagnum peat moss, vermiculite, perlite and "other" ingredients - lightweight, free of weeds.

I have a large collection of seeds from 5 different strains. I do not know their names or anything scientific about them. One was chosen because it has been my favorite and I was fortunate enough to be given 10, presumed to be female seeds. I will wait until I have a well defined and successful process before I risk these seeds.

The other 4 types were chosen in hopes that one will prove to be hearty.

[Cede2Weed]

For my initial germination I attempted to chose 3 female seeds (based upon chart found here) from each of the 4 strains.

I thoroughly wet a wash cloth, placed the 15 seeds on top and placed in a large zipper lock bag.

April 6 -
checked on seeds, 7 have cracked with a sprout, with tweezers I placed the cracked sprouts in the soil attempting to have tap facing down. I barley placed below soil line and covered. Then placed under 24 hr light.

FYI - because I have not completed my rubber maid grower, I cannot assure total darkness so I am going to go with 24hr light until complete darkness is available to me.
They are simple on a table in an extra room with the light a couple of inches above.

April 7 -
The remaining 8 seeds have cracked and I followed the same process as above.

I know have all 15 germinated and in soil, but there has not been any separation of the seed shell.

Please wish me luck!

[Cede2Weed]

For those of you that use seeds, when do you move to dirt? After separation from the seed shell?

Thanks!

[bombdiggity]

I moved mine into the dirt as soon as the taproot showed itself. In all honesty though, geminating in the soil is just as effective. Main reason for germinating in paper towels is to satisfy curiosity IMO

[hudson88]

Hey Cede, I use the paper towel method, as soon as the taproot pops out I put them in the soil. The seed then gets pushed through the soil as the stem grows, the seed usually drops off when the stem is 1-2"s.

Good luck!

[Cede2Weed]

Thanks, Bomb and Hudson. Came home at lunch to check on them. The jiffy pots and seed starter soil does not retain much moisture. They were very dry. But the sprouts are poking through. About half have the seed stickin out a 1/4".

I will begin posting pix tonight.

[stinkyattic]

As soon as the little sprouts show above the dirt, get a BUNCH of light on them. And yeah, you will have to watch the moisture very carefully at this stage, since they do not have a good root system yet, and those small pots dry out fast. It gets easier after the first transplant, which you will do in about 2 weeks, into a 4-6" pot.

[Cede2Weed]

Thanks, Stinky.

I had 3 6500k/26w/1600L CFL's on them but turned one off to see if that will help slow the drying of the soil.

I am able to come home for lunch most days to add water, but not always... And when I wake up in the morning they are arid.

Is this acceptable or should I go back to 3 and work on a method to keep moisture in the soil?

Thanks, again!

[hudson88]

Keep the 3 on them, they shouldn't be producing too much heat, you're gonna need to add more of them soon anyway. What's the temps like?

[Cede2Weed]

Thanks, Hudson.

Prior to reading this post I made a few changes, pix to follow.

I am leaning towards going hydro, but I really am on a $50/week budget as per the wife. This is due to other ill fated projects and just happens to be my alloted medicine budget....

With hydro and eventual cloning in mind, I created a small box approx 12"w x 18"l x 24"h with 2 cfl's and 2 opening, one for intake the other for a small pc fan outtake. My third cfl is idle right now.

I also germed another 18 bag seeds although I placed them in regular potting soil in a recycled egg carton.

My room is approx 4' x 8' x 8' and I have no problem using all of the space, except of course my budget.

[Cede2Weed]

Cannot figure out how to attach pictures...:mad:

[Cede2Weed]

Temps:

Do not have the proper thermometer. But... it was 82c after 8 hours under the box. I haven't installed the fan yet but hope to do so tonight or tomorrow night.

[Cede2Weed]

Finally read the rules..........

here are links to pix

The Room
http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn148/cede2weed/AssortedPix20080407066.jpg

The small box
http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn148/cede2weed/AssortedPix20080407067.jpg

Side View for intake/outtake
http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn148/cede2weed/AssortedPix20080407070.jpg

Germed seeds waiting
http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn148/cede2weed/AssortedPix20080407069.jpg

Sprouts of some bag seeds in regular potting soil
http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn148/cede2weed/AssortedPix20080407068.jpg

[Cede2Weed]

Made a few changes and temps have gone way up.

I re-connected the third CFL and went about light-proofing the closet with black plastic (like is used in gardening).

This took about 20 minutes. By chance I had left the thermometer out and noticed the temperature in the closet had risen to 78c. It had been in the high 60's a few hours earlier. The outside temp had dropped to the low 60s. I then took a reading in the box and it was 96c.

I still do not have fan connected to the box and do not want to cut the third cfl off so I cut 2 holes in the top of the box to allow heat to rise out. 15 minutes later this had lowered the temp inside to 91c.

Because I am in 24 hr light now, and I have the entire closet light proof I desiced to raise the entire box 3 inches to allow for additional airflow/circulation or heat exhaust, whatever...

After 10 minutes this brought the temp down to 87c in the box.

Will these 3 day old seedlings survive this? I saturated the soil a bit, but do not want to get them too wet and they are going to have to go about 7 hrs max between waterings.

I guess my question is what is the better short term plan, allow them to sit in this heat, or cut back to 2 CFLs?

I am now thinking I am going to need more than a little pc fan if I am going to run 3 lights in this little box, or have to move to a larger box sooner than later.

All advice is greatly appreciated :mad:

[bijnas]

Since you already have the rubbermaids, I would go ahead and start building one. Check out my grow in my sig. I just started like 2 and a 1/2 weeks ago with rubbermaids and germinating in soil and all. You can look through the pics and see how it all progressed. I'm just using 1 of the tubs right now for the seedlings.

[hudson88]

IMO you want to keep your temps no higher than 80F, they will survive short periods of around 90F, but if you keep your temps to 80F you've got a bit of room for normal temp fluctuations, like when there's a really hot week. You need to sort out your fan and see what the temps are like then, you might be surprised at how effective your fan will be at cooling your box, until then just use the two lights. You need to start thinking about the next phase of your grow now tho and ideally get it set up and tested before the plants need to go in. Soon you're gonna have to move your plants to bigger pots, they're not all gonna fit in that tiny box and you're gonna need more lights.

Good luck!

[Cede2Weed]

Thanks Bijnas and Hudson.

I placed a box fan next to it and it has brought the temps down. I will get the exhaust fan in today and hope to pick up a couple of thermometers that will log temp ranges.


I hope to have rubbermaid ready in the next 2 days. I just have to find a light vanity that will handle 80wx3 that is within my budget. so I may use y-connectors to expand to 6 cfls.

My current set up has a max of 40wx3.

[Cede2Weed]

Day 3 pix

http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn148/cede2weed/AssortedPix20080409008.jpg

http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn148/cede2weed/AssortedPix20080409007.jpg

http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn148/cede2weed/AssortedPix20080409006.jpg

http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn148/cede2weed/AssortedPix20080409005.jpg

http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn148/cede2weed/AssortedPix20080409004.jpg

http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn148/cede2weed/AssortedPix20080409003.jpg

http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn148/cede2weed/AssortedPix20080409002.jpg

[Cede2Weed]

installed fan last night and temps are way down. This morning i got a reading of 69 after a fairly cool night outside. This afternoon temp was a nice 74 with a nice 77 outside. This will be but to the test when summer temps arise.

I am concerned about over/underwatering. I am fighting the urge to water every time I check on them, which my wife says is way too often.
The top layer of soil gets dry fairly quickly but I can see the discoloration in the bottom of the peat pots and know there is moisture there. I am also handling pots in order to get a good feel for the weight which has been noticeable the one time I think they were overly dry.

I moved the lights back up to about 4" away from tallest seedlings. Half of them are 2 days older and about three times taller. Will post new pix tonight.

[hudson88]

Glad to hear you sorted your heat problem. How often are you watering them? As they're so young and you say they seem to be drying out quickly i'd probably water once a day. Try and get that light closer in the next couple of days, the closer the better with cfl's, try for around 2".

[Cede2Weed]

Thanks, Hudson,

For now, I think I have the heat solved, but when I add the flower room and outside temps get into the high 90's I am probably going to be challenged again.

I have been watering multiple times a day. The plants appear to me to be looking great. But I really do not know what warning signs I need to be watching for. I have read that the plants like to go through wet and dry periods but am assuming that is for mature plants. Rot, mold and stunted growth I assume are the dangers I need be on guard for with over watering.

I will post pix in a few hours.

[Cede2Weed]

So far so good? :cool:

http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn148/cede2weed/AssortedPix20080410010.jpg

http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn148/cede2weed/AssortedPix20080410007.jpg

http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn148/cede2weed/AssortedPix20080410005.jpg

http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn148/cede2weed/AssortedPix20080410004.jpg

http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn148/cede2weed/AssortedPix20080410002.jpg

[Cede2Weed]

http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn148/cede2weed/AssortedPix20080410005.jpg


http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn148/cede2weed/AssortedPix20080410004.jpg

[daihashi]

great looking seedlings. During the numerous seedling deaths I've been responsible for I learned that if you can get your seedlings past 3 weeks of age then they will generally be able to survive anything else you throw at them within reason.

I vegged in CFL and am flowering with an HPS. I'm sure you can see how my grow is looking. If you can save some of that allowance money I would suggest you buy an hps. $50 a week is plenty of cash to buy some new grow gear if you consider that most plants will take at least 3-4 months from seed until harvest.

If you veg for 8 weeks that's $400. Plenty of cash for an HPS, cool tube and maybe a pair of inline centrifugal fans :).

There are many others on here way more experienced than me but I'll be happy to help with any problems that come along the way for you.

Good luck :thumbsup:

[Cede2Weed]

I appreciate it, daihashi.

I have already bought a rubbermaid box with a 3 outlet valance and y connectors for each outlet. This will give me a total of 6 42w (150w equiv) 2700k cfls in my flower box. I still have to figure out airflow and odor control but I have seen some great ideas here.

I definitely want to graduate to HPS. My current plan is to see this through with CFLs but by the time I am ready for flowering I may have a change of heart. Especially if I continue to see results like those you are getting. Did your plants eat your fan? :thumbsup:

Thanks for the feedback!

[daihashi]

I appreciate it, daihashi.

I have already bought a rubbermaid box with a 3 outlet valance and y connectors for each outlet. This will give me a total of 6 42w (150w equiv) 2700k cfls in my flower box. I still have to figure out airflow and odor control but I have seen some great ideas here.

I definitely want to graduate to HPS. My current plan is to see this through with CFLs but by the time I am ready for flowering I may have a change of heart. Especially if I continue to see results like those you are getting. Did your plants eat your fan? :thumbsup:

Thanks for the feedback!

I wanted to do an all cfl grow but I had a change of heart once I realized my grow box wasn't going to be big enough. So I built a cabinet and couldn't bare to see it only hold cfl's.. so I bought an hps.

Did my plants eat my fan? what do you mean?

[Cede2Weed]

lol, I was referring to the oscillating fan that was so prominent in your early pictures. It is now undetectable due to the size and lushness of your canopy. :D

[daihashi]

lol, I was referring to the oscillating fan that was so prominent in your early pictures. It is now undetectable due to the size and lushness of your canopy. :D

Actually I had to remove it completely. The plants got too big for that space and something had to go. I still have air circulating across the canopy... just not oscillating.

[Cede2Weed]

Oh no!!!!

Made some changes to my closet this afternoon. Added some wattage, so far so good.

Well, I just went out to check on my babies and I found a small bug/pest on one of the leaves. I was going to take a picture but I went ahead and killed the little guy.

I see no damage done to the leaf. Not sure what drew him in. I am in a converted utility/storage closet with an outside entrance. This is the first pest issue, atleast that I have noticed. Obviously the room isn't air tight.

This is the first big rain we have had since I started this project and I suppose it is possible that contributed.

Prior to anything I ran the shopvac in there really good. There was a few cobwebs and or spider webs in the upper corners.

This was a small round bug, almost like a beetlebug without wings.

Any suggestions? With my outside entry should I expect to be battling these little creatures for the duration?

thnks

[hudson88]

I'd be interested to hear what the more experienced growers say about bugs coz I always get them. Never anything serious that appears to have much of an impact on my grow just a few tiny flying bugs (I know I should look around to find out what they are) that I seem to be able to keep under control with some bug spray thats for edible fruit bearing plants.

I think it's enevitable wherever you grow that bugs are gonna find a way into your grow room from time to time (it's warm and got that sweet smell, jeez i'd live in my grow room if I could) , I just give them a spray and make sure they're not eating my plants or making them sick. I remember a while ago reading about some sort of insect (can't remember what it was now) that you can put in your grow room and it will eat all the other bugs but leave your plants alone. Does anyone know about this bug? Or was it just a stoned dream I've had lol

[Cede2Weed]

Seedlings have reached 7 days in dirt, seems much longer...

Growing has slowed but I am started to see some separation with the second set of leaves. I am watering twice a day. Does anybody think they can stand more water, less water, or continue as I have been doing.

They are now under 200w of cfl equivalent. They should probably have more light and I hope to have wiring ready some time this week with the goal to double wattage.

Temps have been maintained in the low 70's.

I purchased a couple of cheap soil test kits but do not think I need to use until I transplant and begin using nutes. Also purchased the foxfarms three pack. Hopefully they will be ready for transplant next weekend.

Day 7 in dirt

[Cede2Weed]

I wish I could stick'em in a time machine, patience is a virtue I sorely lack!

[Cede2Weed]

Some of my leaves are dropping to the point they are touching the soil. They look perfectly green and healthy but are drooping.

Could this be because I am over-watering? Please tell me it is not something more serious. :wtf:

[hudson88]

Hey Cede,

Looking good, they've done well in them 7 days. I know just what you mean about it seeming longer, I look at mine a few times a day and every time I hope that they've grown into huge bushes and are ready to flower lol

Think you're right with the droopy leaves being coz of overwatering, it's hard to get the balance rght the first couple of weeks, try cutting down to watering once a day and see how they react to that, don't worry about them getting dry they're not gonna die without water for one day.

Keep up the good work!

[Cede2Weed]

Thanks, Hudson. No water today. Those little peat pots dry out so fast....

Another concern is their proximity to the light bulbs. I have my ventilation working well and have moved all the plants 1" from the cfls. They have been this way for a few days. I try to rotate the plants so they all end up getting even light but I haven't done such a good job. The two that have grown the most were the closest to their respective cfls. Could heat have been an issue with the drooping leaves? Just can't get their saggy-state off of mind. Hopefully, when I get home they will have perked up.

[hudson88]

Hey,

Yeah the heat that the cfl's produce will dry out them peat pots pretty quickly. Might be worth moving them to 2" from the plants to reduce the heat a little for now. Then when you put them in bigger pots which don't dry out so quick you can get them closer again. When you thinking of transplanting? I would think about doing it now, I transplant mine at about 2 weeks but I start them in bigger pots than yours so you should probably do it around the 7-10 day mark anyway. I find things always become easier and really start growing after the first transplant.

[Cede2Weed]

Well, Hudson, I have a dilemma there. Obviously, I did not think things our thoroughly. I have 20 plants going now. I expect that vast majority to be female. I used a chart I found on the boards here that shows you how to determine the sex of seeds. It may be BS, but I have hope. I also expected some of the seedlings to not make it. Long story short, I do not have room for 20 in larger pots. 10 of them are a few days older than the first 10. I expected attrition to lower my count, then I could select the healthiest of the remaining for transplant into larger pots.

The more time I have invested in this, the less confidence I have they are all female.

They are currently in 2"x2" peat pots. I have looked at the bottom and a couple of them has a root protruding through the bottom. I simply tucked them back into the pot. With these pots being degradable, I expected to see some root trying to break through and that would be my indicator to transplant. I agree with you, I am not going to be able to wait that long.

Original goal was to have 5 or 6 thriving females out of the 20 seedlings. I am now getting greedy and want to find a way to keep them all though I know this will not be possible.

I have read on here in several places by several respected posters. that they all try to limit transplants to 3 or 4 max. I believe the max pot size I am going to be able to use is 3 gal. At a gallon per foot of height, that would limit my height to 3'. Which I would not have a problem with if I could keep 10 plants going. I also plan on LST and am giving serious consideration to SCROG. This would further limit the height I could get in 3 gal pots.

I really am not interested in pre-flowering to determine sex and then going back into veg. Do not want to pay the 2 weeks price...

So I am probably going to go into flower at 12" tall with the plan of SCROG to a max height of 24" in 3 gal pots.

Forgive my rambling, but do you think I could get away with transplanting to 4"x4" pots for now? I believe I can fit 20 of this size. Then, at some point reducing to 10 plants and doubling the pot size. Or should I go ahead and thin the heard to 10 now and get them in larger pots with the reality of ending up with only the 5 most vigorous plants?

[hudson88]

Hey cede,

That was pretty long lol I'm pretty baked and that was kinda hard to get my head around. You can use the 20 4"x4" if you like but they're not gonna last long, i'd sooner go to a bigger pot myself. You'll probably need to transplant again before flowering and you'll have the same problem. If you can get 12 pots (6"x6") in the space I'd say that was the right number but 10 is still pretty close if you can't. I usually end up with a couple more females than males but i've only had a couple of grows so maybe I just got lucky.

[Cede2Weed]

OK. I have moved 11 of the 20 into 5" round containers. These 11 are the ones that have started showing the second set of leaves.

Hudson, you were right on about being root-bound. The ones with the leaves sagging the most had the most well established root system. Those that were not sagging were easily transplanted, as the dirt just fell away. I wish I would have taken pictures.

So I have 3 I am concerned about. After transplanting they are drooping even more. Their color is still a vibrant green, but they just look very lazy. One even appears to have a fold in a leave. I read somewhere on here that may be due to high ph of the water. I have been using plain tap water that I have not tested. I have purchased soil test kits but not for water, YET.

Will try to get pictures up later. Time to CHILL :rastasmoke:

[hudson88]

I wouldn't worry too much about the 3 droopy ones, so long as you gave them a good watering after the transplant I'm sure they'll pick up in around a day. I just use plain tap water which i've never checked the ph. It seems ok but I need to test it soon. I just leave mine standing around in a bottle with the top off for a few hours. (apparently letting it stand gets rid of a lot of the stuff in the water that may harm your plants, but does nothing for ph as far as I know.)

Can't wait to see your new pics!

[Cede2Weed]

I picked up a new light but am not going to install until someone informs if it will work or not. It is a Halogen 500W (I am about to research on boards but wanted to get pics of my saggers up)

New Light and plants 1 - 4

[Cede2Weed]

Plants 5 - 9

[Cede2Weed]

Plant 10 and the seedlings and soil test (I will be getting a new soil testing kit. This cheap thing is awful.

[daihashi]

I picked up a new light but am not going to install until someone informs if it will work or not. It is a Halogen 500W (I am about to research on boards but wanted to get pics of my saggers up)

New Light and plants 1 - 4

return that light asap. The heat output alone will kill your plants. Doesn't put out as many lumens per watt as HID and completely wrong color spectrum/temperature.

Really the big thing for me on those lights are the heat output. You can grow in sub par lumens and color, but you can't grow if your area is too hot.

take it back and use that money for other plant goodies.

:thumbsup:

[Cede2Weed]

LOL - I just found a post you made to someone else with the same question.

"halogen lights are not in the correct light spectrum and run WAY to hot. They will burn up your plants." -- Daihashi

Thanks, Daihashi

[fenderninja]

plants are coming along cede! I love waking up everyday and seeing how mine have grown, looks like you did good with the transplants, my plants were floppin all over looking terrible when i first did it!

[Cede2Weed]

Thanks, Ninja.

Now that I am getting them out of that seeding soil and into a better quality dirt I hope they will pick up. I guess I am still a ways off from giving them nutes. I have searched everywhere for ways to make them grow faster. Outside of going hydro the only thing I have come up with is more lights. I currently having them under 6 cfls (600 watts equiv). I just added the extra lighting a few days ago and hope to see some effect soon.

[Cede2Weed]

Got rid of the halogen. I knew it was too good to be true. It was so cheap I went ahead and purchased 4 replacement bulbs for it. Anyway, I used the refund to go ahead and purchase my flowering bulbs. I will have 900 equiv watts for flowering.

I ditched the rubbermaid idea. I have decided to just partition the closet into two sections. One for veg and one for flower. I purchased black polyurethane (supposed to be light proof) for the partition. I have sealed off all of the light leaks to the closet. This has created a situation I will have to address prior to this summers high temps. They do not call it Hotlanta for nothing.

I have to come up with a ventilation plan. I cannot vent through the roof, as it is concrete, my garage is above, and I have a concrete floor. My only real option is through the door or the wall, both of which are to the outside. Even this will cause me problems with light leaks, although I have purchased flexible dryer vents.... but I will worry about this later. Right now I am just focused on these drooping plants surviving.

Thanks, all. :stoned:

[Cede2Weed]

So I have my plants taking up about 4 1/2 square feet of space on top of a table. I have 6 26w (100w equiv) cfls on top of them with no mylar or any reflective material around them. Do you guys think I have enough light?

I believe it was Hudson that said I needed 50w per square foot. Is that assuming a highly reflective environment or will I be okay for now?

[daihashi]

So I have my plants taking up about 4 1/2 square feet of space on top of a table. I have 6 26w (100w equiv) cfls on top of them with no mylar or any reflective material around them. Do you guys think I have enough light?

I believe it was Hudson that said I needed 50w per square foot. Is that assuming a highly reflective environment or will I be okay for now?

I've never liked the 50w per square foot rule. I always preferred to go by lumens.

When I first started I was taught thaat you want to try to get 5000 lumens per SqFt. This ideal and anything on top of that is gravy.

[Cede2Weed]

Well, I have 6 x 1600 lumens or (my buzz is making this difficult) 9600 lumens. Otherwise, woefully inadequate for a 4.5 sq ft plot.

He probably meant 50w of cfl not equivalent.

So for 4.5 sq ft I would need 22500 lumens? Or 2.5 times what I have. wow. I assume that would be good through harvest. Is that correct?

Thanks.,

[daihashi]

Well, I have 6 x 1600 lumens or (my buzz is making this difficult) 9600 lumens. Otherwise, woefully inadequate for a 4.5 sq ft plot.

He probably meant 50w of cfl not equivalent.

So for 4.5 sq ft I would need 22500 lumens? Or 2.5 times what I have. wow. I assume that would be good through harvest. Is that correct?

Thanks.,

You can grow under less light. It's just not ideal. Again this is just what I Was taught but your yields drastically reduce at anything below 5k lumen per SqFt. I've never bothered to verify or understand why this was the magic number. It just sounded like a good *minimum* amount of light to build your grow around. I went beyond this but it really helped me find a good starting point in terms of lighting.

You can flower with what you have. Just know your yields won't be as great as if you had a 250 watt hps. You're already running about 140 actual watts in CFL's right? Wouldn't hurt to run another 110 watts to get better quality/quantity of buds would it? :thumbsup:

[hudson88]

Hey, I agree with diahashi, if you can double your lights you'll get far better results. I do use the 50 watt per sq ft rule so it was probably me who told you about it. (you're right, it is the actual watt consumption not the equivalent) I just find it easier to multipy by 50 than 5000 when stoned lol, but the lumen rule is more accurate.

[Cede2Weed]

I should have bought some more batteries for my camera while at Walmart, but I didn't so no new pictures today.

The plants seem to be liking their new soil. The dropping has not stopped, but growth is continuing. Starting to see the third set of leaves on several of them. All remain very green.

I watered them lightly during the transplant but I am trying to not water until I can see that the need it. Hoping the drooping was due to over watering and will perk up shortly.

Another thing that may have caused it, we have had a few very cold nights lately. I turned the fan off the past few days due to the lower temps. Either way, I am counting on this being a temporary thing.

My wife says I have a problem. I have moved a chair and a radio in the closet with my babies and sometimes I just sit there and stare at them, all the while doing my best to refrain from watering/over loving them.

Hope for pics tomorrow :smokin:

[Cede2Weed]

sorry for the poor quality, battery low and I was hurrying.

Please let me know if I should be worried. I have propped a couple of leaves up with broken toothpicks. They really seem to like their new soil.

[Cede2Weed]

last 2 pics

[hudson88]

Hey cede, I wouldn't be worried they're looking nice and green and yeah it looks like overwatering to me too, mine have that same look but they're getting over it now, just slowed growth for a couple of days. Keep the updates coming and good luck!

[Cede2Weed]

I still haven't gotten batteries for pics, but the plants are looking great. I let'em dry out for about 2 days, then gave a thorough watering and put an oscillating fan in with them. They have responding with a real growth spurt.

I hope to get pics posted tomorrow.

[Cede2Weed]

I have a couple of issues, one has some brown spots on leaf, I think it was from water drops. The other is a very yellow cotyledon. Any suggestions are appreciated.
Thanks!

[Cede2Weed]

more pics

[Cede2Weed]

and finally

[fenderninja]

lookin good, i wish all my "pots" were even like yours, who the hell knows what my potential canopy will end up like

[Cede2Weed]

Having a few issues with plants, please see pics. Any help with problem plants will be greatly appreciated.

Pic 3 shows some droopiness

Pic 5 shows an abnormal "vein"

[Cede2Weed]

a couple more pics

[daihashi]

My wife says I have a problem. I have moved a chair and a radio in the closet with my babies and sometimes I just sit there and stare at them, all the while doing my best to refrain from watering/over loving them.

Hope for pics tomorrow :smokin:

lol that is a problem indeed. I used to have the same problem. I killed well in between 50-100 plants starting out due to over loving or not knowing enough about my soil, ph, etc etc. I can say it's much easier to refrain from looking at them constantly after you've been in the grow for a while or completed a grow.

Refrain from the love, your babies will show their appreciation by growing up nice and beautiful for you :thumbsup:

[daihashi]

Having a few issues with plants, please see pics. Any help with problem plants will be greatly appreciated.

Pic 3 shows some droopiness

Pic 5 shows an abnormal "vein"

pic 3: Either underwatering (soil looks dry) or it's just not as hardy as some of the other plants. I've had some seedlings that always just remained droopy no matter what I would try to do for them. Just make sure the soil is consistently moist and neither dry nor wet while they're still small.

Pic 5: Abnormal vein? Do you mean the yellow vein in the actual big leaves there or the purple in the stem.

If the former then it could be a potassium deficiency. K deficiencies will turn yellow in the veins of the leaf and then eventually the whole leaf will turn yellow/brown and die.

However your plants look too young to be needing potassium and they are defiitely not rootbound. Do you know what the ph of your soil runoff is? Also what type of soil are you using? Are you feeding with any nutrients yet; if so what kind and how much/how often?

If it's the latter is usually normal in early growth.. up to 4-6 weeks I found. Anything past that I find to be a fairly good sign of being rootbound. Nothing for you to worry about yet.

[hudson88]

Hey cede,

They're really coming along, I'm not sure what you mean by the abnormal vein either, I really wouldn't worry about that. I've had the red stems going on in previous grows, what are your night time temps like? I've always seemed to have low temps when i've had them.

I'd say the droopiness was overwatering personally but I could be wrong, both under and overwatering cause droopiness. What's your watering schedule been like the last few days, how much? how often?

[Cede2Weed]

Hey guys, I was referring to the vien that runs through the leaves. On a couple of larger leaves it appears the vein is yellowing a little. I am probably paranoid (wonder why) and it is nothing. They have really hit a growth spurt since the transplant.

I do not have a ph meter. I know I MUST get one. After our cold specll where temps in closet dipped into the mid-50's two nights in a row, my temps have ranged between a low of 65c and a high of 78c. I expect the highs to start increasing as ambient temps rise this summer.

As to soil. My local foxfarm retailer is discontinuing foxfarm brands. This led me to purchase their last three 3-packs they had. I am not using them on this first grow as I am saving them for my better seeds next grow. On this grow I am using a Scott's Premium Potting Soil that has time released nutes in it good for four months. I know this is not recommended, but I had it laying around. It is a .07 - .01 - .03 mix designed for potted plants.

After reading Daihashi's post at lunch, I gave each plant 2ounces of water. The growth since then has been pretty good. After letting them dry out after initial transplant watering, I had given them an ounce of water a day.

Another thing to consider. I may have inadequate lighting. I have them under 6 26w 6500ks 1600 lumens each. I have twice that many watts/lumens for flowering but had initially planned to go through veg where I am. I really expected some attrition before flowering. Don;t want to jinx myself, but I think they are all going to make it to flowering. If that is the case, I am going to flower them as soon as the are mature enough.

Hope to have all females but want to prepare for 50%male. In any event, I cannot properly plan my space until I know how many females I am dealing with.

Sorry for the long post, but....

They have been in dirt for 2 weeks. Should I expect them to be mature enough for flowering at 4 weeks? I realize that would not be ideal. I may put them back into veg after sexing, but I am very anxious to get these plants sexed.

[mandalane]

:hippy:short and stubby, but looking pretty dang full. good luck cede!

[Cede2Weed]

Lunch time check in. Things going well. A few notes.

Last night I started training three of the plants.

I also gave them 6 hours of dark time, first time they have had any darkness since germination.

I believe you can now discern the plants come from different strains. The growth pattern is strikingly similar for some and wildly different for others.

I will get pictures posted after work and hope some of you can help determine indica/sativa.

Also gave them another 2 ounces of water each. Today was the first time water seeped through my drainage holes.

So I probably will not water tomorrow, but thoughts on this are solicited. Thanks!

[MrHappy]

I noticed youve posted on my grow so I will return the favor. I only had 24/0 for the first few days and then I switched to 18/6.. In my opinion the plants use the energy collected during the light hours to power growth at night.. i notice every day that my plants are a little bigger after they come out of the dark cycle. I also only give my seedlings 3 pepsi-bottle caps full of water and then increase by one cap-full each week.. and in my opinion i think i could water a little less..

[Cede2Weed]

Alright, more pics. First three plants have had LST. I loosened it up a little but they appear to me to be fine.

[Cede2Weed]

Any idea if indica or sativa?

[Cede2Weed]

and finally

[bombdiggity]

Looking good man - plants seem to be perkin up a bit, wouldnt you say??? :D

[Cede2Weed]

Yeah, man, they are growing like weeds. What's up with that? ;)

[Cede2Weed]

Placed another in bondage trying to keep the canopy even. It hurts my heart to do it. They are so pretty, thriving and outshining their sisters, then you tie them down and the just kind of blend in our even do not look as good at first.

On a positive note, the first three I tied down have exploded at the tip. Kind of looks like one of those handheld dusters or a trumpet. Incredible expansion at the tip.

I will get pics posted tonight. :)

[whoreable]

Looking good :jointsmile:

[Cede2Weed]

hard to tell, but they are about an 1" to 1.5" shorter do to training.

[Cede2Weed]

BTW, I have started adding on ounce of hydrogen peroxide to every gallon of water I give them.
Watering schedule is 2oz/plant day 1, 1oz/plant day 2, no water on day 3 and repeat. Even with 2 oz of water, the pots are very light 24 hours later so I do not think I am over watering, but shall see.

I also purchased some un-sulfured molasses but have not used it yet.

[hudson88]

Hey Cede your plants are looking really good mate. I know what you mean about them not looking so good after you tie them down, think it's been about a week to 10 days since I did mine but they're starting to look a lot better now. I've had to tie down some of the leaves to get light to some of the new growth tips but they've really taken off, each plant has got 4 or 5 tips growing straight up, can't wait to see them covered in bud :)

So don't worry about tying them down, they'll be looking great before you know it!

[Cede2Weed]

Hey. Hudson

I was out of town for a couple of days and my plants underwent some serious changes. Basically a serious root bound condition developed. Until I have sexed them I do not want to put them in too large a container due to space issues. SO I am getting them into 2 liter ("litre" for Hudson) plastic bottles as a stop gap measure. I am also going to go ahead and start 12/12. I just want to get these things sexed and start taking clones from the females.

I just kinda of stumbled onto the root bound. I though I had been over watering them, so they didn't get any water for 2 days and the condition worsened. But they were not yellowing so I figured I would take the worst looking one out of its pot and check/ Looked like a coil of rope at the bottom. Not a bit of soil dropped.

I will get some pictures up to demonstrate. Other than that, everything going good, slow, but good.

[stinkyattic]

Remember when it comes time to sex them, you will end up with only about half the plants you started, and free up space. If they are rootbound, even a potting-up to a slightly larger pot would help. Like if those are cottage cheese pots, maybe a yoghurt pot ;) hahaha Seriously though giving the roots more room to breathe will do them good.

[Cede2Weed]

Thanks, Stinky. I have begun moving them to two liter soda bottles. This is providing twice the soil volume while maintaining the same foot print. I realize it isn't ideal, but hopefully it will last for another two weeks until I have removed the males. Then I will go to three gallon rectangular trash bins.

[greenatik]

Looking good! What is with the runt? Was he planted at the same time? Try LST-ing in a small circle around the pot and once all the way around let it grow up and top it... well im not sure how big you are growing these so this may not be the best idea

keep it up!

[hudson88]

Hey Cede,

What's up? No updates?

[Cede2Weed]

Was out of town a while, wife watered for me and I came home to this. What do y'all think?
:mad:

[bombdiggity]

looks like a male, or a male-dominant hermie. try to get a better picture though - maybe I'm blind but I dont see any pistils at all. i'd trash it if I were you, seems like you have enough other plants that it wouldnt be worth the risk of pollinating all of them.

lookin good other than that though!

[Cede2Weed]

Thanks, Bomb. Makes since, I have read males will show first. It sure is a pretty flower on top, I was hoping for a hermie I could just clip all the balls off. Before i chop it I will take some better pictures. I could sure use the bucket it is in, as well as the space it is taking up, just hard to bring myself to kill it.

[Cede2Weed]

My camera just will not zoom in with any kind of usable focus.

But check these out. Just want to confirm this plant needs to go.

Again, I apologize for the poor quality of the pictures.

[Cede2Weed]

BTW, none of the others have exhibited any "genitalia" that I can discern. I will try to get a pic of entire crop posted latter when I have more privacy.

I have transplanted 8 into 2 gallon waste bins. 4 are in 2 liter bottles. As males are removed I will transplant the bottles into the bins.

They all seem to be very healthy after recovering from their root bound condition.

In addition to massive LST, I pruned them and this may have stunted their growth, but they seem to be recovering nicely.

[Cede2Weed]

remember I have pruned them and tied them, so they look small

[Cede2Weed]

cont

[Cede2Weed]

pt 3

[Cede2Weed]

regarding the above posted pics:

1 has only been tied, not topping or fimming
1 has been fimmed
the rest were topped

the topped plants have all developed two min shoots at the top plus a third from lower on the stalk due to lst.
the fimmed plant has 3 main shoots at the top plus 2 shooting from the base of the stem.

I am using SCROG principals in my lst process.

Comments, suggestions are encouraged. Thanks.:hippy:

[Cede2Weed]

Well, I moved the boy outside. Could not bring myself to kill him. He was just to healthy and thriving for me to chop him. But it did free up another large container and some space. I can't wait for the next grow from clones, no more worrying about sexing and space planning. :D

[hudson88]

All looks good cede, good luck getting plenty of biatches! ;)

[gpickett6224]

glad to see that things are still going well for you cede. :thumbsup:
those males are always a dissapointment!!

[Cede2Weed]

A few more males showed themselves and have been relegated to the great outdoors. 5 confirmed females, 3 undecideds.

Really wish I would have fimmed them all. I actually tried to fim 2 but messed up one and ended up topping it. The one plant I left alone and only LST'd is doing great but I wish I had of fimmed it. The fimmed plant has 5 different shoots going straight up. The topped plants all have the 2 main colas plus an additional shoot from the bottom of the plant.

[Cede2Weed]

Pic 1: LST only
Pic 2: LST FIM
Pic 3: LST Topped
Pic 4: LST Topped
Pic 5: All

[bombdiggity]

looking good cede!

i FIM'd and LST'd my bubblelicious and I ended up with 10 tops and secondary branches coming off every top. I'm a believer of doing LST + FIM (or topping) together.

Good luck !