Worst Cloner Ever

[Dreadscale]

This was my first attempt at cloning.
4 of the 8 cuttings died and the remaining 4 have some problems.
1 is growing pretty good but the leaves are mutated.
1 is producing leaves but wont stretch, looks like it wants to bud.
The remaining 2 are stunted and don't want to grow.

They look pretty healthy, for the stress I put them through.

Are these plants ruined?
Have I really messed up their genetics?
Will they be good plants once they get over the stress?

I have no clue, but the mothers are really nice plants and I was hoping to carry on the line.
Thanks For Your Input

[hybridlove420]

god, same boat as me. (yours is a better boat though)

i HATE cloning. seeds are pretty much guarenteed, failure clones just depress me

a tip ive found: use a plastic cup or tray overtop to hold in humidity for the first week or two

[stinkyattic]

Did yo utake clones from a flowering mother? It will take a little while for them to revert to vegging.
If they were stressed, they STILL can throw single-bladed leaves for a while even if the mother wasn't flowering.
50% is good for your first try!

[hybridlove420]

well i can say that, at almost 3 weeks, my clone and its pathetic twin are advancing.

the pile of rusty-looking single blades going straight up has grown 3 inches and begun some 3 blade leaves, as well as correcting the rusty-look in the last week.

meanwhile, the other one looks like a palmtree, with a tuft of the smallest, ugliest leaves ive ever seen.

[bongbro4]

Dude,

Hand in there. Let nature take it's course.

[dejayou30]

50% your first time is great. Like most things, with time and practice, you will get better. So just keep on growin! :thumbsup::jointsmile:

[Dreadscale]

Thanks all for the kind replies.
I'm not too discouraged!

Yesterday I took 10 more cuttings. I am trying a hybrid method I devised after reading tons of cloning posts.

Here are pictures if day 1, they all lived the night.

In the picture the clone to the left is also a survivor of my first cloning attempt. It was rooted in the Gel2root like the one in the center.
I am training it to survive out in the wild. :)
Also in the center gel is a new cutting and an old one that has a bud on it, I took that one too late. Pretty sure it won't make it.

I guess since it survived I'm over 50% now :D

If these clones do well I will post my method it's pretty basic, I just knew a little more about the process this time.

[Backpacker420]

Did yo utake clones from a flowering mother? It will take a little while for them to revert to vegging.
If they were stressed, they STILL can throw single-bladed leaves for a while even if the mother wasn't flowering.
50% is good for your first try!
Can you take a cutting from a plant in veg?

[stinkyattic]

Can you take a cutting from a plant in veg?Yes, that is what most people, including myself, do. Keep a set of mothers under 24/0 light for no other purpose than donating cuttings. Only replace them when they get too scruffy to live.

[killerweed420]

Be sure to have lots of patience with clones. They will pretty sad for a couple weeks till the roots take. Just feed them a little water everyday. Keep a fan on them and I lightly mist mine with water.

[hybridlove420]

well of my 4 clones, 1 survived, and another lived until about a week ago, when its leaves all began to turn brown and die immediately.

id take seeds over clones any day, just because if a seed doesnt sprout, its not like youve put days and days of care into planting it. who cares if the genetics arent perfect when you at least get the things to grow....:(

[Dreadscale]

My newest clones are 10 days from cuttings today, one has died so far.

Of my original clones, 2 more have made it and the remaining one died, this gives me a better average. 6 out of 8 survived but it is taking like a month to get them going.

I transplanted them all yesterday except the 2 minis

first photo is 4 NL clones 2 mini NL clones in center.
3 seedling from unknown indica.
also a McCoy in the front.

2nd photo are the 10 day old survivors.

Any help on a way to speed up the cloning process would be appreciated.

THANK YOU

[SimonMakus]

Sure, you can definitely speed up cloning! However, it would really help to know exactly what method(s) you're using here?

I recently cloned for the first time using two different techniques: hormone and peat, and a homemade bubble system.

Dip-n-Grow rooting concentrate was included in my first attempt using only two cuttings, jiffy pellets, a tray, and a humidity dome under one 23 watt CFL. These did well, but took a little over ten days to root.

The process involved soaking the peat pellets in a very weak bloom fert for an hour before taking the cuttings. Then with a sharp blade (I used an exacto knife) cut at 45 degree angle and keeping in mind at least one node should be buried in the medium as this is a default spot for root growth and will speed up the overall process. Quickly dip the 45 degree end in the hormone, usually for 30 seconds or less, then place inside a jiffy/peat pellet being careful not to poke through the bottom on the medium. I read somewhere (icmag, I think) that the pre-made holes contain less oxygen in the center, so the outter edges are the place to make your hole. I just used a small nail about the size of the cutting's diameter to poke a spot for my new baby. One thing I forgot to mention, the pellets should not be soaking wet when you go to insert the cutting, but they should be a little moist.

After you've got all your future clones in the peat, place them on your tray, put the humidity dome on, and place all in a safe spot under a low-wattage CFL (or tube) about 6 to 8 inches away, as clones only need enough light to know it's day, and not so much as to photosynthesize.

During the rooting time, remember to keep your temps in the mid 70s, and RH around 90%. If you see the RH is dropping or the cuts are wilting, check the medium and if it's dry, give her a good dip about half way up the pellet in plain water.

Besides all that, time is a factor in any of this cultivation stuff we're into. Just remember it takes time to do anything and to be patient. However, if you're impatient like me, you might try another method... (continued in next post because this is insanely long-winded and must take a break)

[SimonMakus]

The other method I mentioned, the bubbler bucket, appealed to me because of the speed of root growth. Over on icmag there's a commercial grower named Lougrew who has, in my opinion, the most simple hydroponic cloner I've come across. Here's a link: http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=68296
While he's no master of the English language, he does know his cultivation. Check that out and come on back for my interpretation.

I gathered all the supplies Lou called for: dual outlet airpump ($10), two four inch air stones ($5), air tubing ($2), 23 watt daylight CFL (already had, but about $4), small-ish cooking pot, and tin foil.

I started out with all the gear and hooked up the airtones to the lines then to the pump. Well actually, I first soaked the airstones for an hour or so per package instructions. I then took cuttings, see above post, and put them directly into a cup of water instead of pellet. Now with the air pump on and the stones bubbling, cut holes in the tin foil just big enough to allow that chunky node to get through. Make sure the cuts aren't so big that they're sitting too far in the water, an inch maximum should be submersed.

After a few temp readings on my metal pot reservoir, I discovered it was freezing! That'll happen though, winter here and the basement concrete floor is not conducive to cloning. Soooo I went out and bought a small 2-5 gallon aquarium heater and all is right with the world. My two oldest cuttings have very good roots forming and the third is bumpy but happy.

As you will learn eventually, if you haven't already, it's hard to keep things the same without attempting innovation in this plant game. The metal pot has turned into a 3 gallon plastic bucket and the entire setup is now enclosed in a rubbermaid (rubbermade?) tub.

If you need any pics or help, let me know.

[katyowns]

Why would anyone prefer seeds over cloning? Seeds just mean you're gonna have plants taking up light space and wasting veg nutes on males you're just gonna have to trash anyways. If you can be successful at cloning, you're golden!

I was lucky enough to be 100% successful with my 1st cloning attempt, I just made sure to read up on it VERY thoroughly before I took cuttings. Also, to everyone, listen to Stinkyattic, shes gonna be right 99.9% of the time.

[stinkyattic]

Lol Katy!
How ya been, stranger? One of these days we're gonna have to hit up Casa de N for lunch...

Dreadscale, you ARE using a dome, correct?

[katyowns]

Lol Katy!
How ya been, stranger? One of these days we're gonna have to hit up Casa de N for lunch...

I know right! I haven't been around much, been working my bum off and ignoring my cannabis forums family!

We'll grab lunch one of these days, if either of us ever get time to relax haha.

[fiddyonefiddy]

im a newb here so ill just say what i see from the picture and what ive read, that i dont see in your picture.
rooting is done in the dark, you have light right on your clones
defuse the light.just like seeds damp cool and dark. they look like they are growing new veg. so to much light.
secondly was no domes in your pics dont know if you used them or not. just didnt see them. i tried with out and my stuff dried up almost the first day, so i added a dome and it loved it.
just my two cents worth from a stump .
havent figured out that purple stem though
i got one on a clone from a friend like that cant get anyone to tell me what it is and cant find anything written about it either.
speedy

[SimonMakus]

Also, dude, your pics are like 3200x2400 lol :smokin:

Fiddy, I think the lil gals under the 4 CFLs are rooted, while the tray of peat pot things look to be under a relatively low wattage tube. You are absolutely correct that roots are light sensitive but most people go 24/0 when cloning, if that's what you meant??

Stinky asked if he had a dome, no response yet, but you're both dead on that he needs one!

[Rusty Trichome]

Aren't the 3500k CFL's for flowering? (shown in pix)
Was under the impression that 3500's and lower were better suited for flower, 6500's for veg.
Is it different for rooting clones?

[SimonMakus]

3500 is actually the starting point for daylight bulbs with some manufacturers. It doesn't look very yellow to me, does it to you? Eagle eye with spotting the K on the bulb base! I was about to ask how you knew the temperature just by looking at the light! You're right though, he could go higher but if he's happy with the amount of stretch then so be it.

[Dreadscale]

First, Thanks for all the replies.

To reply to some of the questions or statements.

Of the 8 bulbs in the nursery, 6 are 6500k and 2 are 3500k, I just threw in the 2 to supplement the spectrum.

I do use a dome, I remove it to take photos.

The dome area is above the lighted area. The heat from the lights below keep it warm, I do have a heater in the dome but seldom need to use it. I also use a 15w 6500k fluorescent tube above the dome. The dome is also lighted indirectly by the lights below, but yet not too awful bright there.

The photo size is only large if you ZOOM in. When I convert to JPEG they turn into a really small file size. I love the detail from this camera, if I could just get it to capture the colors correctly.

THANKS AGAIN for the input, and I am still reading more on the subject.

14 days on the new cuttings and I have lost 2, 4 of them I will kill off later. The plant I took them from sexed out a male, but that's in another post.
:hippy:

[daihashi]

First, Thanks for all the replies.

To reply to some of the questions or statements.

Of the 8 bulbs in the nursery, 6 are 6500k and 2 are 3500k, I just threw in the 2 to supplement the spectrum.

I do use a dome, I remove it to take photos.

The dome area is above the lighted area. The heat from the lights below keep it warm, I do have a heater in the dome but seldom need to use it. I also use a 15w 6500k fluorescent tube above the dome. The dome is also lighted indirectly by the lights below, but yet not too awful bright there.

The photo size is only large if you ZOOM in. When I convert to JPEG they turn into a really small file size. I love the detail from this camera, if I could just get it to capture the colors correctly.

THANKS AGAIN for the input, and I am still reading more on the subject.

14 days on the new cuttings and I have lost 2, 4 of them I will kill off later. The plant I took them from sexed out a male, but that's in another post.
:hippy:

I don't know much about cloning but do you think it's possible that you have too much light for the clones? I've read clones need weak lighting to promote roots to grow faster in order to support the plant. With brighter lights your plants continue to grow foliage without a root system to support it.

I may be far off, but just trying to help.

edit: I may be confused are you using 4' shop lamps for the clones or the 6-8 cfls?

[Dreadscale]

Thanks for the reply

Above the CLONE DOME is a 15 inch, 15 watt fluorescent tube.

Just 1, but I do get a reflection from the others, I may have to put in a shade system.

OH yeah, SimonMakus great link I will have to try the cheepo bubbler.

[SimonMakus]

Daihashi, I'm confused too. Dread, are you using ALL of those lights on your unrooted clones?!?! If you are, stop! Not trying to be a dick, but did you read the entirity of my posts? Have you checked out what other people do to propogate? Again, not being nasty, but your method needs tweaking.

Also what is your cloning method? We can't help with results unless we know what you're doing to get there.

Do you even have a hygrometer? See, this is why I asked about your process. I suggest you read more about others' techniques and learn how they achieved success. If you can't find it on this site, there are other forums and sources of info about mmj and cultivation, albeit not with the sense of comradery found here at C.com.

Another thing, I'm not a firefox user so no zooming for me, I'm just asking you to scale down the resolution to something manageable instead of scrolling for days :)

edit: Now sounds like just the 15w is dedicated to the rooting. Good!

[SimonMakus]

Sorry if my post above sounds mean or harsh or negative. I'm not trying to be a jerk, I promise! :) I just want you to grow many many happy little ladies and fill some jars.

Yes, the bubbler is super simple and works if you keep your temps in check. The DIY bubbler has been around for a while, but Lougrew used the metal res to keep the water cooler, the opposite problem I had, hence the plastic.

[Dreadscale]

NP SimonMakus, I need all the input I can get.

15W on Dome, unrooted clones
8 100W equivalent in vegging the rooted clones.
I have no hygrometer not even sure of it's purpose, the condensation tells me I have humidity.
I will add a shade system may be getting too much indirect lighting.

I downsized some photos for you to see whats up.
No one has commented about the size before.
I use IE7 and when photos popup they are small with a magnifying glass to zoom in. If your using an older IE you may want to update it I really like the features.

I also agree that this forum has the best people involved, I use others but none compare to these forums.

THANKS AGAIN
:hippy:

[SimonMakus]

Thanks for the pics of your full cloning setup, it really helped clear up all the earlier confusion. A hygrometer is a good, cheap investment that you will benefit from. You're right, the dome's condensation is a sign of humidity, but the point is for the plant's roots to search for water in the medium. Allowing less and less condensation to build up (over time) hardens the clones and forces root growth (i.e. removing dome more and more to increase airflow.) Anyway, using a hygrometer to measure humidty is important throughout your grow, just as important as a thermometer.

edit: Thanks again for the smaller pics too! Oh, I use Safari. No IE for me since OS 9.2 :thumbsup:

[fiddyonefiddy]

hygrometer tells you the moister percentage in the ambient air.
ergo humidity

[Dreadscale]

Well it looks as if these clones are gonners.
Checked this morning and I can see roots on top at soil line, but the stems have rotted.

I got a link from somewhere, Thanks for the link whoever posted it.
It's a newbie, foolproof, cheap aero cloner. I put one together today and am going to log it if it works out.

Thanks for all the help, friends. I'm not giving up :thumbsup:

Some cloner pix, last one is resized small ez viewing.

[CashandPrizes]

I do not water the clones, I only keep the humidity dome soaked. Once i accidently left the dome off overnight, they all perished :(

Cloning is not hard, but I have noticed in the colder weather it can take up to 2x as long to root.

I just finished building a bubbler from info I got on this site. I am hoping to speed up the process to have nice roots in one week like i was getting last summer.

[grey1223]

I don't like seeds. I do like the vitality of hybrid seeds but they are almost unmanageable for me. Some will triple in height in 10 days of flowering. I can't remember the one strain I had but it grew so tall I had to bend several colas and finished at 55" tall.

Clones are soooo much easier to use than seeds. But I agree, it can be frustrating when having problems cloning. But keep at it. Your won't be sorry.

I assume you know the procedure ( at least one node, cut at 45 deg. angle, scrape clone stem, dip in rooting hormone and place in medium.)

I don't use a humity dome but recommend them. I time my taking of clones so I'll be around during 1st 48 to 72hrs so I can mist them a few times a day.

So why clones? All female, less stretch and more uniformity.

I must say that while I didn't like the 55" height of the plant mentioned above it did yield 127 grams.

[Rusty Trichome]

Depends on your veg room size. Clones are easier, if only keeping one or two strains' mothers. But having a fairly high tolerance to pot, I love having a variety of strains to chose from.
But it is a painfully slow process keeping fingers crossed praying for females.

[Dreadscale]

Worlds Worst Cloner is still trying.

My AeroBubbler seems to work. Cuttings are as fresh as the day I cut them. It's been 12 days and I have some roots forming.
This is just tap water in a bubbler, no dome. Day 9 I did add some Superthrive, 1 drop in reservoir. 2 days later I got roots, not sure if the Superthrive helped or just a quinkydink.

I saw an add on the net for a FOG CLONER, they claim roots in 3 days and transplant in 7. They want $500 for their system. I built one with odds and ends I have hanging around for $0. Gonna give it a shot. Instead of tap water I'm going with a mix(WEAK) of, Superthrive, Molasses, and Tarantula in PH 6.2 mix. If this works out I'll post more, if not I won't mention it again. :D

Thanks for all the input.:hippy:

[stinkyattic]

I'd avoid adding molasses or any other supplements (maybe a tiny bit of superthrive but go real easy) to your fog cloner, which is, BTW, one of the coolest DIY items I've ever seen on here.
How the HECK did you fab that thing?

[Dreadscale]

Hi All :D

I am definatly SOLD on the bubble cloner.
All of my original cutting have rooted and I added a couple to try and save them. ANOTHER bad cloning experiance.

The FOG CLONER has some bugs I got to work out.
In 24 hrs I cooked 2 of the cuttings. The water is heating up too much.
It's a warm fog and the 24/7 operation heats the resevour too much. I am adding an air pump to try and lower the temp.
The only reason I don't give up on this right now is, it looks like I am getting roots on one of the cuttings already.

stinkyattic thanks for the input, the added suppliments probably helped kill off the 2 cuttings.

I am moving the 3 remaining cuttings to bubbler till I get bugs worked out.

The Fogger is only DIY if you have the part laying around.

It involves a ceramic disc and a metal disc vibrating at ultra sonic speed. I dont have the brain power to build one, BUT my wife DID HAVE a fog fountain. You can get them at WALLY WORLD for about $20.

[luvfriday]

This maybe a stupid question but if you use a cloner you get bare roots? Do you then need to stick it in rockwool to provide a little protection on those bare roots? I would be scared in my hydro garden the hydroton would crush those roots and the plant couldnt stand up with out that base.

[Dreadscale]

luvfriday great question.

At the moment I grow in soil, so I have no problem transplanting them.

I am however going to try an Aero grow and I plan on using perlite as the medium. We will have to see how that works out.

UPDATE
One of the cuttings I removed from the fogger and placed in the bubbler has rooted. It has one root in 48hrs.

THIS IS TRUELY AMAZING