View Full Version : Suuuuuper High pH!!
dejayou30
09-14-2007, 01:14 AM
Finally, my friend has his set up ready to go; all temps within range, E&F working with no leaks, timers working, etc. But he tested the pH with a liquid test kit (its all the hydro shop had in stock besides $120 testers) and it read over 8.0. We waited a couple hours for it to run through a pump cycle once or twice and measured again and it still said 8.0+. Why is the pH so high and what should he do about it? He is ready to germinate the seeds but doesn't want to put them into the system if the pH is too high. Please help!
PharmaCan
09-14-2007, 01:19 AM
What kind of water are you using - tap, r/o, bottle?
Is 8.0 the pH of the water before you put anything in it?
PC :smokin:
TMusic
09-14-2007, 01:53 AM
you need to go to the hydro store and get some "ph down" and an eyedropper. This will cost you about $15. Add a LITTLE bit at a time.
Paht_Hed
09-14-2007, 03:02 AM
If I were you I would look for a book or even a video on how to grow. Go to you tube and look up "I grow chronic". Watch the series for a crash course in growing. If you want a little more go fine the Cannabis Grow Bible... You can easily find pirated versions online somewhere if you want to be cheap. It's probably the best way to start.
dejayou30
09-14-2007, 03:39 AM
UGHHHHHH I HAVE READ MANY, MANY GROW GUIDES AND WATCHED MANY, MANY GROW VIDEOS! However, I still have some questions.
That said:
My friend is using tap water in a 15 gallon res. No nutrients have been added, its just water that has run through the pumping cycle a few times during test runs.
TMusic
09-14-2007, 03:56 AM
You have a couple choices. 1st one would be, go to the water n' Ice store and get filtered/RO water at $0.25/gallon. If this isn't an option, go to the grocery store and buy distilled water at $0.69 per gallon or more. The hydro store I go to sells RO water at $0.30 per gallon. you can mix filtered/distilled/ro water with tap water and a little ph down if you really need to. Or load the fuck out of your tap water with ph down (p.s. not even on the last resort list for some people)
If you've read as much as you want people to believe, you should know there is no magic formula or perfect answer for everything...
you need a ppm meter too
Expect to get pointed in the direction of other websites and grow articles if you are asking VERY basic questions, not that they don't need to be answered, but imagine how many people have the same questions when they first start out, I hope you know what I'm getting at. Ther is an incredible grow guide attached to this very message board, it will answer every question you have for the first 2 weeks of your grow. If you're any good at comrehensive reading, you could probably grow to your 1st harvest without asking any questions at all.
You also need to go to the store and pick up a big bag of top top quality patience, you're going to need it, plants grow about 1000 slower than paint dries.
hbbusa28
09-14-2007, 03:57 AM
Tmusic it the nail the head. You need to get some PH down and lower it. Hydro should be 5.5-6.0 somewhere in that range. I know there is natural ways if you don't want to buy the PH down, but I can't remember. I use the PH down/up :)
And not trying to be rude but maybe you should ditch the videos you've been watching and guides, PH is usually the first thing covered. The book phat_head menioned, the cannabis grow bible, is tops for beginers in my opinion. It's what I started with. I'm not a big grower but what I have has turned out great.
dejayou30
09-14-2007, 04:30 AM
My friend and I have both watched High Times "Ready, Set, Grow" and the Green Man's series on YouTube, and have read various guides here and there, the best I can think that I have come across is the one on www.a1b2c3.com (http://www.a1b2c3.com), but neither of us has $30 to throw down on an actual, tangible book. Didn't you guys know that this age of the internet where information is free from people like you!? ;)
We know where pH is SUPPOSED to be, but I guess we didn't realize that tap water was so high, even after letting it sit for a few days. I appreciate the responses; I will have to pick up 15 gallons of distilled water from the store tomorrow. What is the pH of distilled water? I am also very well aware that growing takes times and patience, and I vow to never be one of those "can I cut a bud off and dry it in the microwave" kind of growers.
My friend and I have spent months planning this out, gathering supplies, studying, and are still continuing to do so. I am very appreciative of everyone's patience and for taking the time out of their day to type out answers to my questions, but I get a little perturbed when someone simply posts' "Get a grow guide!" I meant no offense to anyone that actually took the time to write a meaningful and relevant response.
hbbusa28
09-14-2007, 04:43 AM
You will still need to adjust the distilled water. That's what I use and it usually starts at 5.0. Also, if you used distilled make sure you get Cal Mag +. Distilled doen't give you that.
dejayou30
09-14-2007, 05:08 AM
I have only read bits and pieces about Cal Mag; what does it do? I made a point to look for it last time at the hydro store so I know they have it.
hbbusa28
09-14-2007, 05:16 AM
It adds some of the secondary nutes missing from distilled water and R/O water (I believe). But it basically gives your plants much needed Calcium and Magnessiem (spelling?), plus some Iron....etc. Just add it in after your Micro, Grow Bloom NPK mix.
TMusic
09-14-2007, 05:19 AM
here's the link to the "in-house" grow guide. Its set up in FAQ format. I suggest you read everything you can get your eyes on. Make sure EVERYTHING in your grow room is ready. Expect some changes, some improvisations, some problems. But you can also expect to find the answer to 95% of your 1st month questions in this guide(if you havent planted the seeds yet, 100% of your questions can be answered between the FAQ/Grow Guide and the forum search.) I promise, you will rarely come across something that the moderators and experienced growers that participate in this forum haven't answered at least a few times already.
Cannabis FAQs / FAQ , Recipes, Medical Marijuana (http://cannabis.com/growing/index.html)
Opie Yutts
09-14-2007, 07:01 AM
Calmag is to replace some stuff stripped out by reverse osmosis. If you don't RO, you don't need it. And for crying outloud, it's real easy:
- Buy a ph meter for $25, and don't give me any crap about how you can't afford to spend that kind of money. If that's true, toss the whole deal right now.
- Put 3 gallons of water in a 4 gallon kitty litter bucket or something, along with all the nutrients you want to add (don't get carried away here). Try about half or less, of what the directions call for the first time to be safe. Gradually increase to direction quantity while paying close attention to possible nutrient burn or overload. You won't need a PPM meter if you do this carefully.
- Stir it up and check the PH. Adjust with PH down until it is between 5.2 and 5.9, with 5.5 being pretty much the best goal.
- For large reseviors, like say 25 gallons, you can figure out the total amount of PH down needed by doing it for 5 gallons, then multiplying by 5. Just make sure you multiply all other ingreadients as well.
I don't think you read and watched those things very carefully, or you were stoned, because I know they talk about adjusting PH in those somewhere.
If you use city water don't forget to nutralize the chlorine, but otherwise just mix your nutes and adjust your PH. Real easy.
dejayou30
09-14-2007, 01:05 PM
Calmag is to replace some stuff stripped out by reverse osmosis. If you don't RO, you don't need it. And for crying outloud, it's real easy:
- Buy a ph meter for $25, and don't give me any crap about how you can't afford to spend that kind of money. If that's true, toss the whole deal right now.
- Put 3 gallons of water in a 4 gallon kitty litter bucket or something, along with all the nutrients you want to add (don't get carried away here). Try about half or less, of what the directions call for the first time to be safe. Gradually increase to direction quantity while paying close attention to possible nutrient burn or overload. You won't need a PPM meter if you do this carefully.
- Stir it up and check the PH. Adjust with PH down until it is between 5.2 and 5.9, with 5.5 being pretty much the best goal.
- For large reseviors, like say 25 gallons, you can figure out the total amount of PH down needed by doing it for 5 gallons, then multiplying by 5. Just make sure you multiply all other ingreadients as well.
I don't think you read and watched those things very carefully, or you were stoned, because I know they talk about adjusting PH in those somewhere.
If you use city water don't forget to nutralize the chlorine, but otherwise just mix your nutes and adjust your PH. Real easy.
We bought a liquid test kit because the hydro shop said they weren't getting electronic ones in for another 3 weeks (2 now). I paid close attention to everything I read and watched, I just didn't know that tap water was such a high pH, I thought it was closer to 6-7, hence my post. But thanks for the very condescending reply! :thumbsup:
PharmaCan
09-14-2007, 01:36 PM
Deja, take about 5 gallons of your house water and use some pH down to adjust the pH to around 5.7. Then check the pH every few hours and see how long it stays at 5.7. At this point, don't add anything to the water except the pH down.
Report the results after 12 hours.
The water should creep back up to around 8.0. We want to see how quickly that happens to determine if your tap water is useable.
PharmaCan
09-14-2007, 02:04 PM
BTW - you can read all you want but a lot of this stuff doesn't make any sense until you get hands-on experience. So don't let anyone get you down by getting on your case. Anyway, most the people that have responded to you have shown a complete lack of knowledge about pH issues.
PC :smokin:
hbbusa28
09-14-2007, 02:43 PM
We bought a liquid test kit because the hydro shop said they weren't getting electronic ones in for another 3 weeks (2 now). I paid close attention to everything I read and watched, I just didn't know that tap water was such a high pH, I thought it was closer to 6-7, hence my post. But thanks for the very condescending reply! :thumbsup:
Wow man. All we are doing it trying to help. I've read a lot of your posts and we are not trying to be condescending. We are trying to help you help yourself. This is a learning process that helps you grow with your plant.
Like it or not, you are asking very basic questions. That is not bad in itself. Everyone here is more than happy to help. However, when you are given reference....look it up. You will get the answers to not only what you are asking now but the question you are going to ask.
This is a community. Try to treat it like one and have some respect for the experienced people that are trying to help you. They've helped me a lot, but I've also found out information by trying myself as well.
rhizome
09-14-2007, 03:08 PM
Hey- quick question/ maybe an answer...
Are you breaking in fresh hydroton?
Weedhound
09-14-2007, 03:16 PM
I actually have several questions....
Did you adjust the ph when you put it into the system.....you said it was at 8.....did you adjust it to 6.0 or so before you added it? Then it went back to 8 in the system? Or was it just 8 all the way through?
A side questiion....what germination technique are you guys going to use?
PS....I hate hydroton.....for the reason Rhizome just mentioned
PharmaCan
09-14-2007, 03:51 PM
I actually have several questions....
Did you adjust the ph when you put it into the system.....you said it was at 8.....did you adjust it to 6.0 or so before you added it? Then it went back to 8 in the system? Or was it just 8 all the way through?
A side questiion....what germination technique are you guys going to use?
PS....I hate hydroton.....for the reason Rhizome just mentioned
Hound - As I understand it, he hasn't even germinated his seeds yet. He's de-bugging his sytem before he even germinates.
What a concept, huh? :thumbsup:
PC :smokin:
dejayou30
09-14-2007, 03:56 PM
The tap water is just tap water that has aged 3 days, but that point is moot because we are just going to get a bunch of distilled water tonight.
Second, I don't know what you mean by breaking in fresh hydroton, but what is the issue with hydroton? I never came across anything in reading or any videos.
Third, we are planning on using the wet paper towel technique, as this is what I have personally used in the past and I am more comfortable with it. I have never actually grown a plant from start to finish, but I grew a bag seed for like 3 weeks in my closet just to see if it would grow, and it did. This might not be the best way, but I am very nervous about the germination and getting the seeds to sprout out of the rockwool, because if I fuck it up, its $120 down the drain, which sucks, so I want to go with what I know works unless there's an even easier way.
Lastly, I don't mean to be an asshole. I realize its a community, but go ahead and read that post I replied to and tell me its not totally condescending and very rude. I realize my questions are somewhat basic, but if I didn't read anything about it, I ask. I've also been a member of the community for a year or two and have contributed positively in other areas, but I am new to growing. Thanks again for everyone that is helping me out.
hbbusa28
09-14-2007, 06:04 PM
Just remember. You'll still to to adjust the PH of the distilled. It's going to be a lot closer then the tap (and it will consistantly be so - around 4.9-5.0) but at least you know what's in your water when you start. When they start growing let's see those pics. :)
Weedhound
09-14-2007, 06:13 PM
That's my question....was the water ever ph adjusted to begin with......before it was put into the system for it's "trial run" If not.....this entire thread is not really very useful is it? That's what I can't seem to get an answer to exactly (it's water that's sat for 3 days doesn't tell me I'm afraid) and I assume you are going to use rockwool instead of hydroton so I suppose that answers that question if I can read between the lines correctly.
I honestly cannot tell if you are trying to answer eveybody's question at once or just giving out the info you feel we need to know. So far....i cannot get the information I NEED to know to help you so I will say.....good luck with your grow.
rhizome
09-14-2007, 06:34 PM
New hydroton will drive pH up for a while, till ya get it broken in. So will fresh rockwool. If you're dry-running the sys w/ media in place, this could be the problem.
dejayou30
09-14-2007, 06:54 PM
Weedhound, I mentioned earlier that it was just tap water that had aged for 3 days. I incorrectly assumed that the pH of tap water would be somewhere around 6-7 and letting it sit would evaporate the chlorine, thus leaving usable water with a moderate pH level. Everywhere I read simply said if using tap water, to let it age for 2 or 3 days before giving it to the plants. This was only an assumption I had made that turned out to be false. The original question is void at this point as I am going to be using distilled water instead of tap water.
As far as the hydroton raising pH, would you recommend running the system for a while with the hydroton in the baskets, or what is the best way to combat the pH rise?
Weedhound
09-14-2007, 07:16 PM
Ok....so now we can go forward......Don't buy distilled water yet......Do your test again but this time adjust your tap water to 6 before you put it in.....and see what it says at the end of a few hours. If it stays pretty stable then you can use that water.....and it will save you having to buy CalMag and distilled water for your system. The biggestt problem with tap water imo is keeping the ph stable....so test yours and find out. That's the only way you will know.
I personally have not found a way to combat the high ph with hydroton.....and therefore I don't use it. It may be fine with your regular water.....some people seem to have issues and some don't. I did.
do your test with ph corrected water and let us know the results. Don't buy a bunch of stuff yet.....
Weedhound
09-14-2007, 07:20 PM
Ps.....don't let the water sit for the test....just adjust the ph......won't hurt anything if no plants in system
PharmaCan
09-14-2007, 08:37 PM
Weedhound, I mentioned earlier that it was just tap water that had aged for 3 days. I incorrectly assumed that the pH of tap water would be somewhere around 6-7 and letting it sit would evaporate the chlorine, thus leaving usable water with a moderate pH level. Everywhere I read simply said if using tap water, to let it age for 2 or 3 days before giving it to the plants. This was only an assumption I had made that turned out to be false. The original question is void at this point as I am going to be using distilled water instead of tap water.
As far as the hydroton raising pH, would you recommend running the system for a while with the hydroton in the baskets, or what is the best way to combat the pH rise?
You might be able to use your tap water, saving yourself the time and expense of not only hauling water but also buying the water and the CalMag+ to go in it. However, since your first assumption about the pH of the water was wrong, you are going to immediately jump into distilled.
Guess what, distilled water isn't going to be the pH 5.7 that you want either... and even if every drop of water available to you was 5.7, that will change when you add nutes to the water and you will have to adjust the pH anyway.
So what's the sense of asking for advice when you just ignore those who try to help you?
PC :smokin:
dejayou30
09-14-2007, 09:55 PM
Jeez, it seems I can't win here. Somewhere, someone said that using distilled or RO water is a much better idea than loading my res with pH down, so I figured I would go ahead and spend the $10 on the distilled water. I have a few days to get this all figured out, as my landlord is coming to work on the house Saturday and I am not germinating the seeds until Sunday. I will test the pH in a 5 gallon bucket and post here tomorrow with the results. Thanks!
PharmaCan
09-14-2007, 10:59 PM
Jeez, it seems I can't win here. Somewhere, someone said that using distilled or RO water is a much better idea than loading my res with pH down, so I figured I would go ahead and spend the $10 on the distilled water. I have a few days to get this all figured out, as my landlord is coming to work on the house Saturday and I am not germinating the seeds until Sunday. I will test the pH in a 5 gallon bucket and post here tomorrow with the results. Thanks!
I think you're missing the point here. 8.0 is not that out of line for tap water. Whether or not your tap water is suitable for growing depends on whether it wants to always go back to 8.0 or if it will take adjustments.
There is stuff, minerals, in your tap water that determine the pH of the water. For the most part the stuff in your tap water won't harm your plants. In fact, some of the minerals, like calcium and magnesium, are good for your plants and, if they are removed from the water, must be replaced (With expensive nutrients). Anyway, these minerals can sometimes be a very strong influence on the pH of the water and will continually drive the pH up (or down), no matter how much you try to keep it stable.
Regardless of the water source you choose, the water will never be a perfect pH to start with and, even if it were, after you add nutrients the pH will go down anyway so you will end up having to adjust the pH, regardless of what your water source is.
What I'm trying to get you to determine is whether or not the pH of your water will stay down after you adjust it. If it will stay down, if it does not have a strong buffer in it, then it is suitable for growing. That's why I said adjust the pH to 5.7 then check it 12 hours later.
Does this make more sense now? Sometimes on this forum when people are trying to help you, they ask you questions that might not make a whole lot of sense to you. Often times people want to help, but don't have the time or the inclination to write a long explanation about why they are asking the questions. If ya go with the flow, you'll probably find that these are the people who will be the most useful with your problems.
As far as this pH issue is concerned, been there - done that. It turned out I can't use my tap water and I can tell you from experience that hauling water is a drag.
PC :smokin:
palerider7777
09-14-2007, 11:30 PM
We bought a liquid test kit because the hydro shop said they weren't getting electronic ones in for another 3 weeks (2 now). I paid close attention to everything I read and watched, I just didn't know that tap water was such a high pH, I thought it was closer to 6-7, hence my post. But thanks for the very condescending reply! :thumbsup:
even if it was 6 or 7 would u still not need the meter or ph down/up assumption is a bitch i always say
dejayou30
09-14-2007, 11:35 PM
Thanks PharmaCan. I am feeling a bit stressed over the whole thing, mainly because I am a complete rookie to hydroponics, but I am definitely learning a lot more. I think since I don't really know what to use and thought my tap water was too high (since someone said I would have to "load the fuck out of my tap water with pH down" and it was "not even a a last resort for most people"), I just kind of picked an option and went with it. I will try adjusting the pH tonight and see what happens. I appreciate you taking the time for answers like that.
whatsthatsmell
09-14-2007, 11:44 PM
PC if i could rep ya i would, well said......:thumbsup:
palerider7777
09-14-2007, 11:52 PM
i have well water that ranges from6.8 to 8.0 and i have 30 gal res and i only need to put 15ml of ph down per 30 gal res to bring down to 5.5 so would it not be easier to just ph down the water instead of spinning ur wheels like ur doing going here and there and mixing ur self all up when all u had to do is not buy weed for a day and go buy the damn ph meter and a bottle of ph down??and btw after i add the 15ml of down buy using the big res i don't have to add anymore like u do with a 5 gal bucket or small res.
p.sI incorrectly assumed that the pH of tap water would be somewhere around 6-7 and letting it sit would evaporate the chlorine, thus leaving usable water with a moderate pH level. Everywhere I read simply said if using tap water, to let it age for 2 or 3 days before giving it to the plants. This was only an assumption I had made that turned out to be false.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
sorry but letting the water breath/evaporate is'nt false, as u say but rather true but it's ment to evaporate the chlorine not everything in the water/ie minerials.and i have watched everything u have, and i know this so to say it dos'nt have this info in the stuff u have seen and read is false. or u have a.d.d ,sorry but im not tryin to be mean but i've seen u post in this thread and others, as if it's 4 ur friend but yet everything we tell u seems to go in 1 ear and out the other???so i don't know what to say but u say in this day in age with sites like this and others and people on here to help u why buy a book...i don't know maybe to read it as u can never learn too much and in the faq on this site taought me most of this common stuff like ph and ppms and sex and well pretty much all that stuff i could see if u had a ? based on what u have read to fill in the blanks but u keep askin the same thing over and over and u keep gettin answers over and over so i don't know what to say....
Weedhound
09-15-2007, 01:35 AM
I have a long list of screwups to my name as well.....won't even go there. Hope your water works out ok.....Pharma Can knows the score... :thumbsup:
PharmaCan
09-15-2007, 01:49 AM
Thanks PharmaCan. I am feeling a bit stressed over the whole thing, mainly because I am a complete rookie to hydroponics, but I am definitely learning a lot more. I think since I don't really know what to use and thought my tap water was too high (since someone said I would have to "load the fuck out of my tap water with pH down" and it was "not even a a last resort for most people"), I just kind of picked an option and went with it. I will try adjusting the pH tonight and see what happens. I appreciate you taking the time for answers like that.
Relax and enjoy the experience. :thumbsup:
PC :smokin:
dejayou30
09-15-2007, 02:38 AM
i have well water that ranges from6.8 to 8.0 and i have 30 gal res and i only need to put 15ml of ph down per 30 gal res to bring down to 5.5 so would it not be easier to just ph down the water instead of spinning ur wheels like ur doing going here and there and mixing ur self all up when all u had to do is not buy weed for a day and go buy the damn ph meter and a bottle of ph down??and btw after i add the 15ml of down buy using the big res i don't have to add anymore like u do with a 5 gal bucket or small res.
p.sI incorrectly assumed that the pH of tap water would be somewhere around 6-7 and letting it sit would evaporate the chlorine, thus leaving usable water with a moderate pH level. Everywhere I read simply said if using tap water, to let it age for 2 or 3 days before giving it to the plants. This was only an assumption I had made that turned out to be false.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
sorry but letting the water breath/evaporate is'nt false, as u say but rather true but it's ment to evaporate the chlorine not everything in the water/ie minerials.and i have watched everything u have, and i know this so to say it dos'nt have this info in the stuff u have seen and read is false. or u have a.d.d ,sorry but im not tryin to be mean but i've seen u post in this thread and others, as if it's 4 ur friend but yet everything we tell u seems to go in 1 ear and out the other???so i don't know what to say but u say in this day in age with sites like this and others and people on here to help u why buy a book...i don't know maybe to read it as u can never learn too much and in the faq on this site taought me most of this common stuff like ph and ppms and sex and well pretty much all that stuff i could see if u had a ? based on what u have read to fill in the blanks but u keep askin the same thing over and over and u keep gettin answers over and over so i don't know what to say....
Poor grammar, spelling, and punctuation aside, I said before that I asked about pH and was told earlier in this thread that it was bad to "load the fuck out of my water" with pH down so I assumed it wasn't usable. It does say in all sources I have ever read to let the cholrine evaporate for at least 24 hours before giving it to the plants; that I know. But none of those sources dealt with the pH of tap water or what to do if it was high, other than adding pH down. My assumption was that by letting the chlorine evaporate, it would lower the pH to something useable without the use of chemicals. See the difference in what you assumed vs what I actually said/asked? Maybe you needs to work on your reading comprehension, among other skills that accompany use of the English language.
Every common growing tip that anyone has told me in any thread (i.e. Letting chlorine evaporate, using exhaust fans, getting a thermometer/hygrometer, etc.), I have already known. Some people can't read and comprehend exactly what I am asking or only read part of the question and make an assumption as to what I am asking, which is where the problem lies.
As far as what I spend my money on, not that its really not your concern, but I actually spend about $10-20 a week on mj because of the high quality of it and the small amount I smoke. So yeah, maybe I could wait 6 weeks and get the higher priced tester, or wait until next Friday and get the $70 one like I had planned.
But seriously, I wish people would stop assuming I don't know anything. Ph isn't really something that is common knowledge, so that's why I posted a question on here. If you're going to be rude and condescending, just don't post in my threads. People like PharmaCan are very helpful, polite, and realistic and I don't need people like you just making assumptions.
Thanks.
PharmaCan
09-15-2007, 03:34 AM
People like PharmaCan are very helpful, polite, and realistic
:S2:
Usually I'm an ass too. I just figure those of us who take the time to punctuate need to stick together. :thumbsup:
PC :smokin:
hbbusa28
09-15-2007, 06:05 AM
So anyway back to the main question. What do I do, I mean, what does my friend do if the PH is too high?
Do I:
A. Let it evaporate
B. Use PH down
C. Used distilled water
D. None of the above. I'll just keep asking the same question over and over and....
hahahahaha :thumbsup:
Weedhound
09-15-2007, 03:37 PM
I think some people need to let this thread go and realize it's all over....done..... I certainly was not aware that dejayou30 was the only person on this board to make an error.....or that making an error deserves all this. :wtf:
hbbusa28
09-15-2007, 05:18 PM
Ahhhhhh just having some fun with a joke. Trying to ease the tention baby. No need for anyone to get all sensitive I meant no harm ;)
Just seemed like every helpful response was greated with attitude so I thought I'd have some fun with him. It's cool we're all working toward the same goal here.
Here you go....hbbusa28 passes a smoke to anyone that was offended, hurt, bothered. :bigsmoke:
PharmaCan
09-15-2007, 05:49 PM
So, Dejayou, what happened with the water overnight?
PC :smokin:
dejayou30
09-15-2007, 06:38 PM
My sister was supposed to pick me up some last night on her way home from work while I was at the Lukemia/Lymphoma Walkathon thing, but she forgot. But she just left and is going to pick it up while she is out, so I am currently waiting for her return.
palerider7777
09-15-2007, 07:26 PM
So anyway back to the main question. What do I do, I mean, what does my friend do if the PH is too high?
Do I:
A. Let it evaporate
B. Use PH down
C. Used distilled water
D. None of the above. I'll just keep asking the same question over and over and....
hahahahaha :thumbsup:
well being dejayou30 keeps picking option d maybe thats the best answer lol even though everybody keeps telling him about option a,b and c he seems to keep harping on d lmao
palerider7777
09-15-2007, 07:36 PM
I think some people need to let this thread go and realize it's all over....done..... I certainly was not aware that dejayou30 was the only person on this board to make an error.....or that making an error deserves all this. :wtf:
it's not that w,h go look at his other threads, he does the same thing in those too. and then after 20 people tell him the same thing he goes on to say he's read everything and not to mistake him for someone that don't know anything. and then asks the same damn thing yet again, i went into full detail in his other thread along with others and he still asked the ? again so if someone does'nt get it then they don't get it. and i was'nt being mean infact i was trying to defend him in his other thread, where he kept asking over and over how to sprout and put in hydroton.
so for some reason i always end up being a dick, cause i get tired of dancing around sumthing, then they mistake blountness for being rude and an asshole, so wtf is right, as u said.
Weedhound
09-15-2007, 08:23 PM
Palerider its in knowing when to let things go.....:beatdeadhorse:
hbbusa28
09-15-2007, 08:26 PM
Agreed we should let it go, but I'm right there with ya Pale
bongerstonerd00d
09-16-2007, 03:34 AM
:S2:
Usually I'm an ass too. I just figure those of us who take the time to punctuate need to stick together. :thumbsup:
PC :smokin:
LOL..........By the way, happy growing:smokin:
b0nger
Opie Yutts
09-16-2007, 09:54 AM
Disclaimer: IF THIS REPLY SEEMS CONDESCENDING OR IN ANY WAY OFFENSIVE, THEN JUST SUCK IT UP AND BE A MAN. WHO KNOWS, I MAY EVEN SAY THE ??F? WORD A COUPLE TIMES. I??M TELLING YOU I??M A BAD, WILD MAN, AND WHEN YOU??RE WITH ME ALL HELL COULD BREAK LOOSE AT ANY SECOND. FURTHERMORE, AS APPALLING AS I AM I DON??T WANT TO HURT ANYONE??S FEELINGS, I ONLY WANT TO HELP. IT??S JUST MY OPINION AND MY POSITION, BASED ON YEARS OF EXPERIENCE. I VOW TO NOT DISPENSE ADVICE ON ANY SUBJECT I KNOW LITTLE ABOUT. MY METHODS ARE TRIED AND TRUE FOR MY SET UP ALONE. USE YOUR BEST JUDGMENT. I TAKE NO RESPONSIBILITY FOR MY ADVICE FUCKING UP YOUR SHIT.
Thanks PharmaCan. I am feeling a bit stressed over the whole thing, mainly because I am a complete rookie to hydroponics, but I am definitely learning a lot more.
Slow down, relax, and take a deep breath. It doesn't have to be this complicated or anywhere near this confusing. This whole deal is supposed to be fun. Keep in mind that every setup is different. You might ask 50 people a question about growing and you could get 50 different answers. People can flap their jaws till the cows come home, but in the long run you have to decide what is best for you and your situation, regardless of what anybody else says.
To make matters worse, there are going to be many people in this forum who just flat-out give bad advice, or completely wrong advice. In my opinion it it??s a very bad idea to just pick an option and go with it, to use your words. Of all the things I hope you learn from this thread is to try and avoid that mentality. Believe it or not, it is not beyond the capability of some people in this forum to? shall we say, exaggerate about the quantity and quality of their experience. I think it??s just human nature to embellish in an attempt to get people to look up to you, or like you more. I have noticed that it is common for people to lay down the supposed facts in a slick and believable manner, while actually knowing very little about some of the things they??re talking about. One of the things I love about this forum is the huge exchange of opinions and ideas. And since there is such diversity in the experiences and opinions, let alone the human nature of people, I know that I must weigh the information presented to me very carefully and try to determine which is best for me and my situation.
Now to heap shit on the shingle, there??s your apparent poor attitude. I really want to answer your questions to the best of my ability, but you don??t make it easy. The more I read, the more I get an image of an arrogant, condescending noob. If you really want people to help you, it??s probably not the best approach to act unrelentingly like you know more than they do. It??s hard for me to want to be nice to you when you say things like:
Didn't you guys know that this age of the internet where information is free from people like you!?
Sorry man, it??s in no way free. For one thing the people trying to help you are spending something more valuable than money? that??s time. The things you say make it sound like we are required to help you and you don??t have to do any work on your own. Although you did say thank you, it seems we??re supposed to drop whatever we??re doing and clarifying the same elementary concepts over and over, especially the most basic ones that mysteriously got left out of all the ??many, many grow guides and many, many videos,? that such a learned scholar such as yourself has read.
Poor grammar, spelling, and punctuation aside
All he did was go out of his way to try to help you and you trash the dude. Welcome to the internet, where people sometimes write as they talk, and abbreviate things like ??you are? to UR.
I wish people would stop assuming I don't know anything? then in the very next sentence say something as brilliant as Ph isn't really something that is common knowledge. And again, how many successful harvests did you say you??ve had, and what was your yield? If PH is not a common thing to you than neither is weed farming. If weed farming is not a common thing to you, than sorry pal, you really don??t know anything, about weed farming that is. Come on professor; join us in the real world.
I pretty much get the feeling you??ve chosen one person to be your mentor, and everyone else is wasting their time trying to help. That??s unfortunate for you since it??s hardly taking advantage of the wide range of answers available here, and for the people who are trying to help, because they are wasting their time on someone who already knows it all. I see much valuable advice here, and it??s not all from your mentor.
I was going to list all the stuff you had read and watched, then compared it to the list of all the times you said stuff like, I paid close attention to everything I read and watched. But it??s just getting too darn late for that, and it wouldn??t do any good anyway. I gotta throw in my favorite, which is: UGHHHHHH I HAVE READ MANY, MANY GROW GUIDES AND WATCHED MANY, MANY GROW VIDEOS! FYI when you type in all caps on the internet it means you are either abbreviating or yelling. Oh well, perhaps you were doing both.
Now that I??ve got that off my chest I will try my best to answer your questions.
Water that comes out of the tap is usually higher in PH than desired for hydroponic gardening. All nutrient solutions must be tested for PH before use. Tap water PH over 8 is not uncommon, and that??s completely unacceptable. You must have some way of bringing it down to roughly 5.5. You can do this with common household items, or PH down available in hydro and pet stores. You must have some way of testing the PH as well. Remember PH usually rises through time, so test it occasionally during the grow. The liquid and strips are probably fine for most hydro ventures, but for ease and accuracy most people buy a PH meter. If you use tap water from a city be sure to check for chlorine with a test kit. Chlorine can be neutralized with drops or by letting it evaporate. Both work, but for a few cents most people prefer the convenience of the drops.
Until you have at least grown a plant using your PH adjusted tap water, I don??t understand why you are going to so much trouble. It could be reeeeaaaal easy, like I mentioned before. I have about PH 8 tap water, and just add about 1/2 teaspoon per gallon of PH down. I wouldn??t exactly say that??s loading the fuck out of it. (FYI there is many strengths of PH down so read percentages while comparing.) I personally like to do things the quickest way possible and get on with it. If I don??t have to haul water, or reverse osmosis water, or whatever, I certainly don??t. I??ve got other things to do too. I could be wrong here, but it??s been my experience that most people are able to use their tap water. There are many more important things to worry about other than if there is the exact correct amount of copper in your nutrients. Just my opinion but remember ??easy does it? and KISS. I don??t think you are beyond hope. Who knows, maybe even someday you??ll try your tap water after one too many times of picking up 15 gallons of distilled water.
The paper towel method does work pretty well, and maybe you should stick with what you are familiar with if you are short on seeds. Otherwise, you could at least try something different. You never know, you might end up liking the new thing better. I really, really don??t like rockwool because it holds way too much moisture, inviting all kinds of problems you don??t need, and for other reasons as well. However rockwool is pretty good for sprouting seeds, just make sure you don??t keep them too wet. Just as if planted in dirt, keep them warm and moist, not wet.
Whether you use rockwool or hydroton you will need to condition either medium first. Rockwool PH needs to be adjusted. It should be rinsed several times first off, to get the chunks of glass and volcanic rock out, and then soaked over night in PH adjusted water. I think hydroton is much easier because you can just cut a hole in the bottom of the bag and run water from a hose through the bag until all the red stops coming out. Let dry, then it??s ready to use. If you rinsed it thoroughly there is no need to worry about your medium??s PH. Plus hydroton is completely and easily reusable, and therefore basically free.
Yes, you should always run your system for awhile when putting in a new batch. How long is up to your best judgment, depending on if you are reusing your medium and things like that. I usually do 15 minutes or so, and then check everything.
Hope that helps a little, but seriously, if you don??t want to piss people off be sure to search and read as much as you can before asking questions. Especially on basic stuff. Every question you can think of (within reason) has probably already been answered in this forum somewhere.
:clap:
And really, the most important thing is for you to enjoy yourself, and perhaps share those joyful experiences with others. If this whole thing starts getting you too stressed, just drink a beer, smoke a bowl, put on some older Talking Heads, smoke a bowl, sit down with paper and pencil and smoke a bowl while you jot down reasons to be thankful and happy, as well as, in random order, basic ideas to elaborate on when you are more sober. Could be ideas on your grow room or ideas on the universe.
:stoned:Anyway, helps me sometimes.
Good luck, and keep us posted.
GoldenGoblin
09-16-2007, 01:29 PM
If you need a cheaper alternative to phdown. there is always sulfuric acid from say an autozone. $4 bucks for a container and buy a eyedropper. Yes it adds sulfur but things could be worse.
PharmaCan
09-16-2007, 02:27 PM
Opie - I agree with almost every word you said, except for one thing. The internet is a written form of communication and, as such, has certain rules that are designed not to make it inconvenient for the writer, but to make what is being said clear to both the reader and the writer. To say that it is acceptable to try to communicate in writing with out even devoting a modicum of attention to punctuation, is akin to saying that a person who whispers too quietly for people to hear him or her is a good verbal communicator.
As an English teacher, I can tell you that there are generally two reasons that someone writes with total disregard for the rules.
No.1 - They are stupid and/or uneducated.
No.2 - They have the attitude, "Fuck you, I'm going to make you struggle to read what I wrote."
Now, stupid is as stupid does, and stupid is about the only legitimate reason for well, stupid writing. I have a great deal of compassion for people who were not blessed with the same gifts that most of take for granted. However, unless the stupid person happens to be a savant, I doubt I'd want their grow advice anyway, so the issue is moot.
When otherwise intelligent people choose to write in a manner that makes it difficult to read their material, they can maybe maybe get some people to struggle to understand them, because to do otherwise just wouldn't be "cool". However, the fact of the matter is that they are just being immature little jerks with a "fuck you" attitude. I don't even read posts written that way. It's a total waste of time and merely reinforces the writer's juvenile desire to be an obnoxious jerk. Someday, perhaps, the writer may realize that they are not being cute, but, rather, obnoxious. Someday, perhaps, these people will mature to the point that they have the self-confidence to conform to established norms in matters as important as communication.
I want to make it clear that I'm speaking in general terms and not criticizing any one individual. There are many people posting on this forum with the aforementioned attitude.
...and yeah, yeah, yeah - if you want to hang out with people who spend a lot of time IM'ing each other and everyone understands the lingo, by all means massacre the language to your heart's content. I couldn't care less.
But if you are trying to communicate with the general public, show a little class.
PC :smokin:
palerider7777
09-16-2007, 06:07 PM
no need to lie, being that you were responding to opie, and what he wrote and knowing what dejayou30 wrote about me prior, then i know that was aimed at me so don't fret. and no im not"No.1 - They are stupid and/or uneducated.
No.2 - They have the attitude, "Fuck you, I'm going to make you struggle to read what I wrote" not i don't think that way at all,
\matter of fact im pretty sure i've done more in 5 years of my life than u have with all of yours.and from what u have wrote then that would mean 90% of the people on the internet should not use it anymore, as everyone does'nt write as if there in english class.and sorry i made the mistake that people can understand stuff like"yes u start the seed in the rocwool or peatmoss plugs and then when roots show u can put it into the basket with hydroton" i did'nt think i would need to load the fuck out of that sentence with .,";:!@#$%^??? sorry. but as long as the internet has been out i know most people don't mind writing like that, but it seems to me the only time u hear/see people become the "anal look down there nose at u type attitude" is only when they feel there being picked on or someone says something they don't like, or want to hear then being the higher than u type starts to come out.
as theres nothing else they can say or do to u so they become lil kids and start trying to find something to say back to feel as if they did something. lol it's not my fault sum people don't have good comprehension of things, and have to have it spelled out word for word and even that don't help. so i don't think the internet is a good place for a english lesson, maybe u should stick to ur class room for that kindda thing. i bet u could write a run on sentence, and i can under stand what ur saying sarcasm aside...that is. so from what ur saying, is if u don't write perfect everytime as if you are writing a english term paper, then u are just a dumb, lazy, uneducated, stupid, asshole.hummm must be nice to be perfect like u are sir,i wish all i had to do in life was to have perfect grammer/english on the internet and everything in my life would take care of it's self, or all i had to do was sit in a class and teach english and judge people if they missed a .,;' or not. ohh yea i forgot im one of the people that make those luxuries for people like u possible sorry for the inconvenience....
ps"As an English teacher, I can tell you that there are generally two reasons that someone writes with total disregard for the rules No.1 - They are stupid and/or uneducated.
No.2 - They have the attitude, "Fuck you, I'm going to make you struggle to read what I wrote" is that what u think when ur teaching your class if so i feel real sorry for your class. sounds biased to meeeeee.
PharmaCan
09-16-2007, 06:29 PM
Palerider - I made a point not to target you in particular. I did this mainly because I respect the way that you respond to people. You really make an effort to help. I often read your posts, until they get too long and then I just can't be bothered with trying to figure out what you are saying.
As far as the other stuff you wrote, I got to the first insult and didn't bother to read any further. It isn't worth the effort and there is simply no reason for animosity. I was making general comments not directed at anyone in particular and certainly not at you. Although, to be quite honest, I wish you would take some of it to heart. You're an intelligent guy, you just have a terrible way of expressing yourself.
PeaCe :jointsmile:
palerider7777
09-16-2007, 07:43 PM
lol well i just write based on what i see, i mean am i supposed to be nice and cuddly all the time? and i don't see what i wrote as insults, but i don't sugar coat anything..anymore that is. i used to be the nice quite shy guy trying to please everyone when i was younger, and that got me nowhere so i've become more blunt in my old age not that i try to be. and as i start out nice in a thread and then because people don't like debate, and start picking apart what i say like a lil kid would, and can't stay on topic and then i respond back with bluntness, as i do in real life and im looked at as the big prick. lol not to be harping and not talking about this thread either,i think i've become the site prick, lol as i try to be nice first and i don't back down either. i guess it's a bad mix to sum, and i do end up writing alot i know i do sorry for that.
so i'll keep it short but is it just me or does dajayou30 seem abit on the young side as everything he has written seems like back stroking b.s as in he seems to have angry outbursts followed by agreeing with u then back to not understanding or maybe it's just me but it just seems that it's abunch of wishy washy bs and im the prick?? oh well i guess
PharmaCan
09-16-2007, 08:03 PM
Palerider - just so long as you know I wasn't jumping on your shit.
As far as the other goes, I'm still waiting to hear the results of the 12 hour pH test. :wtf:
PC :smokin:
dejayou30
09-16-2007, 08:08 PM
Ok, first, I am just going to say that I never re-asked the question after it was answered 100%, either in this thread or any other. Most of the time, I get half answers or suggestions to other techniques, which is not actually a real answer. Thats all I am going to say on the subject.
Second, I certainly never claimed to know everything, but when someone says "read a grow guide" to learn about vegging periods and other extremely basic stuff like that, it is annoying. pH is not in the same category as how long to leave the lights on to veg the plant.
As for the information relevant to this thread, I just lowered the pH to around 6 and used about 1/2 a bottle of pH down that was made for an aquarium. I plan on getting more in a large quantity tomorrow when the hydro store is open. It took FOREVER to get it down to 6! The first three times I added one "dose," it didn't do anything, so I started adding 2 doses at a time and had to do so like 8 times just to get it to 6. When will I know if its usable?
Weedhound
09-16-2007, 08:16 PM
Well.......the stuff for aquariums isn't what you want for your plants.....fish products are too high in salts for plants....even freshwater as they simply use different chemicals for the fish adjusters than the plant ones. However it will most likely tell you if you can use it or not by just letting it sit and checking your ph but I wouldn't run it through your system. (ph TESTERS for fish....ok....:)) Wait a few hours or even overnight and see if the ph stays stable or starts to rise (or lower....). If it stays the same (or a reasonable facsimile (sp?) of) you can use it but if you find that you are constantly having to readjust your water to keep it in a usable range then you should think about r/o or distilled water.
Are you using hydroton or rockwool or ?
PharmaCan
09-16-2007, 08:21 PM
As for the information relevant to this thread, I just lowered the pH to around 6 and used about 1/2 a bottle of pH down that was made for an aquarium. I plan on getting more in a large quantity tomorrow when the hydro store is open. It took FOREVER to get it down to 6! The first three times I added one "dose," it didn't do anything, so I started adding 2 doses at a time and had to do so like 8 times just to get it to 6. When will I know if its usable?
If you are going to be near the water most of the day, check it every two hours. If not, check it at least at 12 hours.
Here's what's going to happen: First we see if the pH goes back up to 8.0 or if it stays down. If it stays down, you are home free. If it doesn't, the next step is to put nutrients in the solution and see if that keeps it down. (I start with r/o water that's around 7.5-8.0. After I add my nutes the pH is around 4.5, so I adjust it up.) This is something you might have to screw around with for awhile, but it beats the hell out of hauling water. I have to go get 30 gal. again today and this is getting real old real fast.
PC :smokin:
rhizome
09-16-2007, 08:30 PM
Yeah- you really want proper pH down- it's about a thousand times the mol strength. I wouldn't make any decisions based on fish tank chems- they are formulated to make it difficult to cause a quick, dramatic change in pH, as this would be fatal to the fish.
It would be helpful at this point to know what your medium and flood cycle is.
dejayou30
09-16-2007, 08:36 PM
I am going to the store to get some pH down for hydroponics. The flood is set up for 15 minutes every 2 hours, and we are putting the germinated seeds into rockwool, surrounded by hydroton.
Weedhound
09-16-2007, 08:48 PM
I'm sure Pharma Can and Rhizome are correct....I say it may answer your question for this reason.....I have well water....and fish......and I could never keep the ph of my water stable with fish stuff. My hydro guy warned that could very well be a red flag for growing hydro (and it was....:() ...so if you have added alot and it still climbs.....I wouldn't even try the test with reg hydro ph.....I'd just buy r/o or distilled at that point. There's NOTHING like pulling your hair out over the same ph issues again and again.....(i say from experience....:wtf:) Good luck.
Opie Yutts
09-16-2007, 09:29 PM
Take PC's advice and test with nutrients. Do everything you can to not have to carry water. Don't forget you are supposed to flush your system every 3 or 4 weeks and start fresh... more water carrying. Even if your PH climbs, depending on how much and how fast, you might want to consider letting it climb and adjusting it from time to time in the resevior. Much better than hauling water.
I have the parts, but have yet to build an automatic PH doser. You may want to consider something like this, that way you don't have to ever worry about PH, except in the beggining when you are figuring out amounts. If the PH gets too high, it automatically injects PH Down into your system. Using this, I don't think it would matter much if the PH in your tap water rises. I know mine does. I adjust it, and grow big beautiful buds.
rhizome
09-16-2007, 09:34 PM
Well, before I committed to ro/distilled, I'd get some proper pH - and hold the sys @ 5-5.2 for 24 hours to stabilize the media- RW and hydroton will both buffer up when new.
Cheaper than ro/distilled, and might show the problem. What's the pH going into the sys, anyway?
Weedhound
09-16-2007, 11:23 PM
Can't get us to agree on anything...:wtf:...while those folks are correct technically..:eek:...I'll still bet you 50 to 1 that if what you have in there now won't hold it.....then it ain't going to hold worth your time and energy even with tons of other crap. It's great to say you can just keep adjusting it....which you can.....but it takes it's toll on both you and your plants. Yep I don't like to haul water around either.....but I DO like plants that grow....not simply continually recover from shifts in the ph (btw....the EXACT issue I just got rid of when I dumped my hydroton.) That, however, is simply my opinion on the subject. :)
PharmaCan
09-16-2007, 11:33 PM
Can't get us to agree on anything...:wtf:...while those folks are correct technically..:eek:...I'll still bet you 50 to 1 that if what you have in there now won't hold it.....then it ain't going to hold worth your time and energy even with tons of other crap. It's great to say you can just keep adjusting it....which you can.....but it takes it's toll on both you and your plants. Yep I don't like to haul water around either.....but I DO like plants that grow....not simply continually recover from shifts in the ph (btw....the EXACT issue I just got rid of when I dumped my hydroton.) That, however, is simply my opinion on the subject. :)
...and think how it's fun it's going to be to tell both Rhizome and me "I told you so!" when you're right. :D
PC :smokin:
Weedhound
09-16-2007, 11:35 PM
Not sure it's one we'll ever know PC......although I just may run around saying that anyway.....true or not. :D
It wouldn't have been my first choice to test....but since it was in there ...meh.....it's one of those tests.....if negative it means nothing.....if positive then maybe a quick answer. :jointsmile: :stoned:
dejayou30
09-17-2007, 12:25 AM
Well, I got the pH down, but there are no directions on the bottle other than "add sparingly to adjust pH." What kind of increments should I use (i.e. tbps, cups, etc.)???
Weedhound
09-17-2007, 12:46 AM
drops.....seriously.....:) Good luck. ;)
dejayou30
09-17-2007, 01:17 AM
Well, I used a half cup to start off and it instantly went from 8+ to 4-, so then I used a tbsp and it went to about a 6, so I added another 1/4 tbsp and its right around 5.5, or a nice blend of the yellow of 6 and orange of 5. It will be nice when I get the electronic tester on Friday.
Should I just wait on it and check it before I go to bed and then again in the morning?
rhizome
09-17-2007, 02:03 AM
Can't get us to agree on anything...:wtf:...while those folks are correct technically..:eek:...I'll still bet you 50 to 1 that if what you have in there now won't hold it.....then it ain't going to hold worth your time and energy even with tons of other crap. It's great to say you can just keep adjusting it....which you can.....but it takes it's toll on both you and your plants. Yep I don't like to haul water around either.....but I DO like plants that grow....not simply continually recover from shifts in the ph (btw....the EXACT issue I just got rid of when I dumped my hydroton.) That, however, is simply my opinion on the subject. :)
WH, yer almost certainly correct- and hauling water is way better than constant dosing. Feel free to tell me that you told me so :D
Hydroton's pretty stable once you've used it for a while, as is RW. Both will buffer high for a while, though- w/ the RW, you usually have to soak it in a 4.5-5.5 solution for a while, and the hydroton... well, some bags have been good to go, and some have required a pretty good break-in period. Stuff I'm working w/ now is nuteral like glass- but some of it's a decade old or more...
I dunno, I'm lazy- I hate hauling water.
Anyway, Deja- see how it sits in the morning- whether or not it rises, and how much acid is required to bring it back down. Should take less acid each time ( or, conversely, same volume of acid should have greater affect).
You could also try filling the res w/ distilled, and seeing if it does the same thing, which would indicate media issue, not water supply. If it's media, you're going to have to either condition it, or, as WH indicates, move to a differant media.
WH- yer in Higromite, right?
Weedhound
09-17-2007, 02:29 AM
Yes, thats how I would do it and check it a few times.....minor alterations ( imo +/- 1 is ok but you will immediately see people disagree with me ...that's how we work here :)) are ok as things like the temp of the water etc can affect ph as well. If it stays pretty stable ....then add some nutes and see....(which will further help buffer the ph).
Weedhound
09-17-2007, 02:37 AM
Good to see you Rhizome.....I may be correct...but it's not very scientific is it? I'm the laziest one of all.....I don't even want to do test again AND I'M NOT EVEN THE ONE DOING THE TEST. :eek: :D
Great idea about the media test though.....that hydroton really drove me up a wall. I am using the higromite and for some reason it seems alot HEAVIER than I remember. :( But my seedlings are doing much better in it than the hydroton so I shall suffer the extra work in the name of love....:) and future bioassays :thumbsup:
dejayou30
09-17-2007, 02:43 AM
2 hours later and the pH is still the same! :thumbsup: Hopefully, I will be able to say the same thing tomorrow night. :wtf:
I was planning on soaking the rockwool and hydroton in pHed water before putting it in the system, but I am wondering how long I should soak it until its usable? Also, should I get the pH level and then soak and leave it or do I try to keep the pH level while it soaks?
rhizome
09-17-2007, 03:29 AM
Overnight's generally good- mix it about a couple of times. Helps if you rinse the dust off of the Hton before you put it in- just punch a couple holes in the bottom of the bag with a screwdriver and stick a hose in the top for 20 minutes. ( or if your in the small bags, just toss them in a collander.)
pH of soak solution is going to rise during soak- you might have to change soak once or twice. I usually just use a rubbermaid tub w/ a submersible pump, so it's easy to change.
Before you can plant, you've gotta get sys stable w/ media in place- when it's stable 24 hours, and yer environmentals are good for 24 hours, yer good to go. Longer burn in times are great if you can, but you've gotta be feeling impatient by now.
PharmaCan
09-17-2007, 03:31 AM
Not sure it's one we'll ever know PC......although I just may run around saying that anyway.....true or not. :D
... and then I'd feel obligated to follow you around and ask you all kinds of soil questions.
:S2:
PC :stoned:
rhizome
09-17-2007, 03:35 AM
Good to see you Rhizome.....I may be correct...but it's not very scientific is it?
Oh sure, yeah, pragmatism... where's the fun in that?
I am using the higromite and for some reason it seems alot HEAVIER than I remember.
Yeah, shit weighs a f$%kin' ton.
in the name of love....and future bioassays :thumbsup:
Well, ya may be a pragmatist :wtf: but at least you've got your priorities straight.
PharmaCan
09-17-2007, 03:36 AM
Dejayou - Are you doing the water test in a bucket or in the system? If it's in the system, I take it you haven't added any hydrotron yet???
Things seem to be moving along nicely. Are you enjoying this a little more yet?
PC :stoned:
Weedhound
09-17-2007, 03:51 AM
I'm going to have to think about a comeback for that one PC :D Except my standard reply....."don't use it....it really IS out to get you....." ;)
dejayou30
09-17-2007, 05:39 AM
We are just doing the pH tests in a 5 gallon bucket, so no, no hydroton. The res is 15 gallons and we fill it with three 5 gallon buckets and just make 3 separate trips, so I figure once I get the pH set in the bucket, I can make one trip, thus starting the movement towards the elusive (at this point) green light to get the system up and running!
Yeah, its getting a little fun, but it will be a lot more fun when I get some plants growing! My friend and I have been planning this thing for months, so I'm ready to get the show on the road, but we also want to make absolutely sure that things will be perfect and we won't be hustling to play catch up to fix things once we get going.
I just tested the pH again, after 4 hours, and it seems to be leaning more towards 6.0. Its hard to tell exactly whats going on without the electronic tester, but I will have that in 5 days and counting. Hopefully it won't go up too much farther during the night though.
dejayou30
09-17-2007, 01:42 PM
After 12 hours, its still around the 5-6 area. It looked more yellow orange than yellow like it did last night. I can't wait for the electronic tester! Does that mean I'm good to go?
Weedhound
09-17-2007, 02:41 PM
That does sound good......I'd stick some nutes in.....adjust the ph to 5-6 and run it through your system and see if it stays around the level you want. If yes.....THEN good to go...:thumbsup:
PharmaCan
09-17-2007, 02:48 PM
After 12 hours, its still around the 5-6 area. It looked more yellow orange than yellow like it did last night. I can't wait for the electronic tester! Does that mean I'm good to go?
Yeah, you lucky little fucker, you should be good to go. :thumbsup:
PC :smokin:
Weedhound
09-17-2007, 02:53 PM
Yeah, you lucky little fucker, you should be good to go. :thumbsup:
PC :smokin:
And he means that in the nicest way....:D
rhizome
09-17-2007, 02:56 PM
If it's holding steady, yer prob in pretty good shape- give it the rest of the day.
dejayou30
09-17-2007, 04:00 PM
I read somewhere that nutes shouldn't be added until after the plants have been growing a week or two. I am planning on filling the res with the pHed water tonight while soaking the hydroton and rockwool in pHed water through the night and then run the entire system all together through the day tomorrow.
Should I start off using weak nutes or none at all until they get a couple sets of leaves?
Weedhound
09-17-2007, 04:04 PM
I've had better results with seedlings using no nutes at the start....just the ph'd water and a drop of Superthrive for the first week or two depending on how fast they grow...then 1/4 strength nutes to start them off.
Good for you to run the system for a period of time first....by the time you get your plants in there you'll already have the whole thing down. :)
PharmaCan
09-17-2007, 04:12 PM
Is it just me, or did anyone else notice how Weedhound just kinda glossed over her dire predictions of yesterday:question:
...must have been her cute little dawg logging in under her username and writing that stuff. :lol5:
PC :rolleyes:
Weedhound
09-17-2007, 04:16 PM
my dire predictions? which ones? I knew ALL ABOUT OJ robbing that guy.....:D
dejayou30
09-17-2007, 10:48 PM
I just checked it after 22 hours and it crept up a little to around 6-6.5. Just wanted to thank everyone for all the help and apologize for the bullshit!
PharmaCan
09-18-2007, 12:23 AM
That's ok, around here we just compost the bullshit and give it to Stinky. She grows in it.
Anyhoo, you've probably got a lot better handle on pH by now and you can see that it's nothing to stress about; it's just one of those things you have to monitor and keep on top of.
Now go grow some plants! :thumbsup:
PC :smokin:
dejayou30
09-18-2007, 02:40 AM
Well, our res is full of 15 gallons of pHed water, the hydroton and rockwool are soaking in pHed water, and the seeds are germinating. One last question - When I put the cracked seed into the hole in the hydroton, should I like close the hole or do I just leave it open?
rhizome
09-18-2007, 02:58 AM
I like to fold a little RW over with a toothpick, but it's not mandatory.
Glad it's working out for ya.
Weedhound
09-18-2007, 03:08 AM
Awwww.....Rhzome tucks his seeds in.....that's so cute......:lol5:
dejayou30
09-18-2007, 01:09 PM
I put the media in last night at midnight with a pH of 5.5 and ran it all night. I checked this morning and its holding strong at 5.5. Hopefully my seeds will germinate now!
Is it bad that if the paper towel is cool to the touch? It was cool this morning when I checked them so I sprayed it down with some warm water.
Weedhound
09-18-2007, 04:19 PM
Glad to hear your system is tuned.....don't know anything about the paper towel method of germinating so can't help you there....PC should be around before too long and I'll bet he knows.....;)
Opie Yutts
09-19-2007, 02:46 AM
As with all germination methods you should keep the seed warm and moist. Even though the towel feels cool to the touch, it's room temp so if you're not too cold, it's probably alright. However, it couldn't hurt to keep the seeds in some sunlight streaming through the windows, or any other thing you can think of to keep them warm. They will sprout either way as long as you keep them moist, but it will happen sooner if they are warm.
I like to just put seeds directly into the medium and keep it warm and moist. I seem to have better overall luck this way, rather than sprouting, then planting. Anything with seeds, I usually start in soil, then take cuttings from females for hydro.
Still looking forward to progress reports.
Weedhound
09-19-2007, 04:31 AM
Opie.....what do yo root your cuttings in?
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2025 vBulletin Solutions Inc. All rights reserved.