How do I get my plants to bud sooner?

[Chandler044]

I have a bunch of outdoor plants in pots and I also have a few indoor plants. The question isnt about the indoor ones...I want to kno how to get the outdoor ones to bud. They've been growing for almost three weeks and they are pretty good size. I think they are already starting to grow little pistillite things or whatever they are called, but its fairly microscopic.

Would it be possible to build a little rig that limits the amlunt of light they get outside, like a box with a certain sized hole cut in it. I would properly fashion the box, i dont need help with that. Just...would it work? I dont care if it doesnt yield a lot of buds, I just want to grow my own and SMOKE THAT SHIT.

Any help would be nice, since no websites that I have gone to can answer this for me.

[spectrum balanced]

I could be totally wrong, but my plants are three weeks old and are developing weird looking things around the nodes that I thought looked pistol-ish, and I think they will just turn out to be branches/foliage that looks weird at first.

I just asked recently when you can first start flowering and the answer was "as soon as there are alternating nodes". Your plant will eventually stop growing its new branches symmetricaly (two at a time opposite of each other). instead of it looking like this -> Y it looks like this -> y

like i said though, I could be totally wrong I'm on my first grow so I'm by no means speaking definitively.

[Raskolnikov]

3 weeks seems a bit young to show sex...

I'm no expert, but I think if you built a lightproof box over your plants, and took that box off everyday for 12 hours, they will bud sooner. IF they're mature enough. Apparently flowering before they're ready could actually lengthen the budding process.

Seems like a lot of work, though. You that desperate for bud, lol?

[Chandler044]

I head off to school in about a month, and I find it a necessary thing to grow my own shit to smoke, even if its only enough for one fat blunt. It would be the best blunt of my life thus far. I dont care how much I get out of it, and the plants are fairly mature. The stems are getting really strong and Im confident that they will yield somthing. (I hurd that young buds are actually much higher in THC content)

I also have a pretty cool looking plant that has three sets of leaves instead of two. It had it since it budded and I havent seen anything like it. Dank buds hopefully???

I have pictures of the plants but I have no idea how to post em. If someone would allow me to send them an email they could give me their helpful advice. I like that box idea too.

[Psycho4Bud]

You can bring them to flower in three weeks by putting your lights at 12/12 BUT your way short on time for ANY type of harvest at all. Your looking at another 6-8 weeks at least depending on the strain. It's not just the creation of the buds but the trichome developement.

Have a good grow!:jointsmile:

[Raskolnikov]

I only know how to start the budding sooner, not how to make them go through the process quicker.

If you're going to harvest early, I suppose you could give them some nutrients high in Pottasium, to try and beef up the buds.

I've smoked buds that were only a few weeks old, and got a bit of a buzz. They're real tiny, though, especially when dried. You won't get much.

[Psycho4Bud]

I only know how to start the budding sooner, not how to make them go through the process quicker.

If you're going to harvest early, I suppose you could give them some nutrients high in Pottasium, to try and beef up the buds.

There is NO WAY to speed up mother nature in order to have them babies ready in 4 weeks! It's not the size of the bud but the trichome developement. I have a trichome chart in my signature.........

Have a good one!:jointsmile:

[Raskolnikov]

There is NO WAY to speed up mother nature in order to have them babies ready in 4 weeks!

Didn't say he could, brother.

I do know you can get a tiny buzz from immature buds, though. And he's going to harvest early regardless, so why not get them as big as possible?

[stinkyattic]

They won't do a darn thing if they aren't ready, but you can build a hoop frame over them and cover it with panda (white side out) every night at sunset, and remove the plastic EXACTLY 12 hours later. This is done on a commercial scale sometimes, and works, but you have to be ON TOP of your timing. No forgetting. No going away for the weekend. No sleeping off a bender.
Not worth it unless you are a pro cashcropper with no other responsibilities.

[Chandler044]

I dont understand this whole twelve hours thing. Is there supposed to be a certain point in the year where there's exactly 12/12 and thats what triggers the buds to grow? (in nature) And also, why wouldn't my plants bud? Do they need to be a certain height or have certain style leaves?

I have seen plants about my height have buds and shit. I dont know what trichomes are either. Im willing to give that thing a shot if sumone could tell me what "panda is", and if sumone can also back up the extra potassium idea.

Thanks.

[spectrum balanced]

you should just spend your 60 bucks on an 1/8th dude. you're looking for a quick easy solution that doesnt exsist. Plus, you actually need to know SOMETHING about growing to get anything more than decorative buds. so at the very least, read all the f.a.q page like everyone else does.

[Raskolnikov]

60 bucks an 1/8th?!?

[Chandler044]

Im not looking just to smoke, jeez. I just wanna grow my own shit and smoke it, thats all. I'll do it better next summer, and who sed anything about spending $60? If u say itll take that long ill just start doing that twelve hour shit right now and harvest them before I head off for school.

[Raskolnikov]

Post pics when you harvest :thumbsup:

[spectrum balanced]

Your looking at another 6-8 weeks at least depending on the strain.

Have a good grow!:jointsmile:

^^^



...yeah unfortunately I live in TX. high quality bud is averages at about 60 an 1/8. I hate texas.

[innertube]

According to Cannabis Growing Guide Part 1 (http://www.a1b2c3.com/drugs/mjgrow4a.htm) , 11 hours light and 13 hours dark will speed up the process, at the expense of lower yield. So if they are outdoors, you could put a box over them that seals out ALL light for 13 hours each day.

Also, fertilize the hell out of it so it dont skip a beat. Then, right before you leave, harvest it and dry it in a showbox or something and smoke it your first week of school.

YOUR BEST BET: find a suitable home for your green girls. If possible, transplant it to somewhere near your new school's location. Or give her to a friend that can take care of her. A healthy bud plant shouldn't be prevented from flowering. If it's a nice plant, I say give it to someone. If it's a piece of shit, I say smoke the ENTIRE PLANT!

[stinkyattic]

If it's a piece of shit, I say smoke the ENTIRE PLANT!
Oh yeah, that will do a lot of good :wtf:
While you are at it, smoke the grass clippings stuck to the underside of your lawn mower.
The psychoactive compounds are concentrated in the BUDS and on the tiny leaves that sprout out of the buds. There is NO point is smoking 'the entire plant'.... AAAARGH

[the image reaper]

According to Cannabis Growing Guide Part 1 (http://www.a1b2c3.com/drugs/mjgrow4a.htm) , 11 hours light and 13 hours dark will speed up the process, at the expense of lower yield. So if they are outdoors, you could put a box over them that seals out ALL light for 13 hours each day.

Also, fertilize the hell out of it so it dont skip a beat. Then, right before you leave, harvest it and dry it in a showbox or something and smoke it your first week of school.

YOUR BEST BET: find a suitable home for your green girls. If possible, transplant it to somewhere near your new school's location. Or give her to a friend that can take care of her. A healthy bud plant shouldn't be prevented from flowering. If it's a nice plant, I say give it to someone. If it's a piece of shit, I say smoke the ENTIRE PLANT!

11/13 will make NO difference to the plant, compared to 12/12 ... it will NOT 'speed up' anything :D ... and, 'fertilize the hell out of it' may be one of the worst suggestions you could have made :wtf: ... :smokin:

[innertube]

11/13 will make NO difference to the plant, compared to 12/12 ... it will NOT 'speed up' anything :D ... and, 'fertilize the hell out of it' may be one of the worst suggestions you could have made :wtf: ... :smokin:

Wow I'm glad you've done extensive scientific experiments to refute my suggestion of the 11/13 light cycle, that plenty of people practice. So if you could just show me your findings, then I will understand your assurance on knowing what the fuck you're talking about.

And for the nutrients, most likely the plant would burn from over fert if he tries that, but there's also the chance that it's a super quick grower and will love it.

Again, I'll be waiting for your findings on that light cycle bit. Thanks buddy.

P.S. Notice how I cited my fucking suggestion instead of just claiming that I know, as you seem to enjoy doing.

[stinkyattic]

innertube, you are not only giving poor advice, but you are acting like a jerk about it.

Knock it off or your stay here on canncom is gonna be a brief one.

[the image reaper]

Wow I'm glad you've done extensive scientific experiments to refute my suggestion of the 11/13 light cycle, that plenty of people practice. So if you could just show me your findings, then I will understand your assurance on knowing what the fuck you're talking about.

And for the nutrients, most likely the plant would burn from over fert if he tries that, but there's also the chance that it's a super quick grower and will love it.

Again, I'll be waiting for your findings on that light cycle bit. Thanks buddy.

P.S. Notice how I cited my fucking suggestion instead of just claiming that I know, as you seem to enjoy doing.

:S2: ... sounds like we are fortunate enough, to have an " Expert Cultivator and Scientist " join the Forum ... welcome aboard, buddy :smokin:

[innertube]

Alright, I'm not a jerk and you're not a punk, and let's bury the hatchet.

My only point is that you shouldnt go around saying for sure that something won't work when it's very difficult to tell whether it would. Probably due to its prohibition, the science of growing ganj has not been subjected to the scientific method all that much (i.e. extremely controlled environment with a single variable, and can be repeated to find the same outcome again and again).

If you had two clones in identical environments and set one to 12/12 and the other to 11/13, and by 6 weeks or whatever could show that one was more mature than the other, then I'd believe you. Same with the 24/0 veg vs. 18/6 veg. Personally, I stick to the 18/6 veg and 12/12 flower.

Seriously, so many of the tricks to growing are like old wives tales; we have success but cannot usually credit it to a specific action. Thus, this leaves a shade of art to practice.

So for the wise guys, how do you feel about the following:

-Hydrogen Peroxide in water mixture for it's extra O2
-molasses in water mixture for sweeter taste
-Mineral water foliar feeding for the C02

[the image reaper]

Alright, I'm not a jerk and you're not a punk, and let's bury the hatchet.

My only point is that you shouldnt go around saying for sure that something won't work when it's very difficult to tell whether it would. Probably due to its prohibition, the science of growing ganj has not been subjected to the scientific method all that much (i.e. extremely controlled environment with a single variable, and can be repeated to find the same outcome again and again).

If you had two clones in identical environments and set one to 12/12 and the other to 11/13, and by 6 weeks or whatever could show that one was more mature than the other, then I'd believe you. Same with the 24/0 veg vs. 18/6 veg. Personally, I stick to the 18/6 veg and 12/12 flower.

Seriously, so many of the tricks to growing are like old wives tales; we have success but cannot usually credit it to a specific action. Thus, this leaves a shade of art to practice.

So for the wise guys, how do you feel about the following:

-Hydrogen Peroxide in water mixture for it's extra O2
-molasses in water mixture for sweeter taste
-Mineral water foliar feeding for the C02


whenever I try to answer someone's question, I will always say so, if I am not sure, and am offering an 'educated guess' ... I say there is NO difference in growth rate between 13/11, and 12/12 .. I stand by that, emphatically ... I also would add that I have never observed any 'significant' difference between 24 hour vegging growth, and 18/6 vegging growth, except to add that the 12/12 plants, generally appear healthier to me, and seem to resist stress much better (only my opinion, this subject is hotly debated daily on every Forum out here) ... I say these things, because I have been growing cannabis (indoors only) for roughly 41 years, yeah, i'm an old fart ... in that time, I've done a lot of experiments and comparisons, and formed my own informed decisions based on my results (I am a member of MENSA, so I read pretty well, too :D) ... in fact, today, I just thought of another experiment to put my poor Willie Nelson mother thru, I have LOTS of patience, so no biggie ... the last two crops I grew, were strictly to produce seeds, I throw away 90% of my typical plants, as I only want to smoke the best possible ... your plants belong to YOU, you can do anything you want with them, same as me ... but, I will do the experiment myself, and observe the results, before recommending it to others ... OK, now for my exam:

1. Hydrogen Peroxide in water for additional oxygen ... should add a slight amount, jury is out whether it is significant ... BUT, it also kills the microorganisms in the soil, which are much more important than added O2 ...
2. Molasses in the water is for swelling buds, and being a 'carb loader' ... I have used it for awhile, and it doesn't taste any different to me, BUT, if it's not flushed well, it is like any other sugar, and will harshen the smoke ... (carbon, ya know) ... and, outdoors, the bugs will LOVE you for adding it :D ...
3. Mineral water for CO2 ... while it almost certainly adds CO2, it made absolutely no visible growth difference in the plants I grew with it ... (if you decide to experiment, I suggest you read the label very carefully, as MOST carbonated water has sodium added) ... I did find some cheap canned seltzer water at my local grocery store that did NOT have added sodium, that is what I used for an entire grow (4 plants with seltzer, 4 plants plain water) ... no difference except for the $$$ spent (no biggie, the canned seltzer water was cheap) ...
I hope my reply was of help ... I do know from experience, that after reading many different cannabis growing guides, that ALL of them contains at least some erroneous information ... lots of rumors and theories floating around, and like you say, lab-quality studies are few, and far between, but getting better ... meanwhile, we just have to rely on common sense ... (P.S., I never called you a 'jerk', and nobody I ever met, thought of me as a 'punk', so I'm not sensitive :D) ... have a good grow :smokin:

[innertube]

image reaper, you are wise among men and i acknowledge your experience. All of the aforementioned makes sense. I was in fear of root rot due to some tight ass soil, so I double potted and gave it a bit of H2O2, problem solved. It's mostly organic, so I guess I need those microorganisms.

I shall now exploit your expertise with a second exam on healthy, efficient growing:

-best organic soil to use, with what additives in what sized pots
- 400 HPS + 400 MH both on and under same hood. First trial with it (currently at 4 weeks flowering) is awesome so far! Yet, there's no hype about it. Why not?!
- I used a No-Pest strip cuz one plant had mites. Worked flawlessly. What say you on this product?
- for medical use, what strains/types work best for what illnesses?

[the image reaper]

image reaper, you are wise among men and i acknowledge your experience. All of the aforementioned makes sense. I was in fear of root rot due to some tight ass soil, so I double potted and gave it a bit of H2O2, problem solved. It's mostly organic, so I guess I need those microorganisms.

I shall now exploit your expertise with a second exam on healthy, efficient growing:

-best organic soil to use, with what additives in what sized pots
- 400 HPS + 400 MH both on and under same hood. First trial with it (currently at 4 weeks flowering) is awesome so far! Yet, there's no hype about it. Why not?!
- I used a No-Pest strip cuz one plant had mites. Worked flawlessly. What say you on this product?
- for medical use, what strains/types work best for what illnesses?

well, I've been around awhile, but I am no expert ... I enjoy trying to help, when I can ...

1. most growers swear by Fox Farms Ocean Forest soil, adding a bit more Perlite to it ... I had problems, and think it is too 'hot' for starting seeds, but others swear by it ... Fox Farms has a milder potting soil for seedlings, with lots of mychorriziia bacteria(mispelled) and humic acid, for promoting growth ... it's called Fox Farms' Happy Frog potting soil ... it's great stuff ... last crop I started my seeds in the Happy Frog, then later, transplanted up to the Ocean Forest, I liked the results :thumbsup: ... I use #5 pots, (they hold roughly 3 gallons) ... plenty big enough ...
2. I've heard of growers running both MH and HPS lamps together, for a more balanced spectrum ... makes sense to me, after all, the sun is full-spectrum (well, technically, the sun's spectrum shifts as it's angle to the earth changes, but you get the idea) ... I would try it, if I could afford it ...
3. matter-of-fact, I just happened to replace my No-Pest strip with a new one yesterday ... I hang mine in the same room, but not in the cabinet itself ... I figure the bugs have to get thru the room first, so no need to 'treat' the cabinet, too ... they work great, never had insects, and I've never felt 'exposed' to anything dangerous, been using them for ages ...
4. medically, I suppose everyone differs a bit, but, I generally suggest an indica for physical pain or sleeplessness ... sativa for depression works great for me ... they both seem to be good for my arthritis ... I recently grew out a roughly 50/50 hybrid of Cinderella 99 x Northern Lights, and it worked well for everything ... now, if I could just breed out the 'munchies' :D ...

by the way, when I ordered my Happy Frog Potting Soil at my local greenhouse, they screwed up, and got me the Happy Frog Soil Amendment instead ... I really love that stuff, it's the 'active ingredient' that is used in their potting soil, I add some to everything ... plus, when transplanting, it suggests you put a handful in the bottom of the pot, for the roots to grow into ... it rocks :thumbsup:

hope something I said helps, have a great grow :thumbsup:

[the image reaper]

to add something regarding the medical aspects ... not long ago, a legitimate medical study of cannabis discovered that the CBD in cannabis is a very good anti-inflammatory, that would explain the arthritic benefits ... we are able to boost CBD, simply by maturing past prime, and harvesting with more amber trichomes ... :smokin:

[ProGroWannabe]

Good Thread guys! I applaud you two for working out the small squabble so well. As we all know, it's easy to get wires crossed through typing only.
Props to the both of ya!

[Chandler044]

Hey guys, remember me? I started this thread. Watsup?

That was an interesting little argument but I have taken whatever I can from it. My plants are doing GREAT, unfortunately I am unable to do that twelve/twelve thing cuz I can't keep a military schedule like that (its funny cuz im headed into the military, o shit)

I made up a nice chart with the sunrise/set but its just difficult to maintain that. Also, I can't access the plants while the mother is around. She might get snoopy, and although she is aware that I am growing some plants, she doesnt know that theyre closer than she thinks.

They survived a big storm recently and theyre really strong, I don't have the heart to bud them early anymore theyre trying so hard. I'll leave them in the care of my sibling to bud them properly. Theyre all over a foot tall now and theyre starting to make those branches that grow outwards, watever that means.

So, to change the question...how do I get my buds to be REALLY potent!
(if someone could help me to post a picture that'd be helpful too, im retarded and cant do it)

[PharmaCan]

To post a picture, click "Post Reply" or "Go Advanced". Beneath the text box - where you type your reply - is an "Additional Options" box. Click "manage Attachments", the rest should be obvious.

This forum has a rule that you must be a member 2 weeks and have 50 posts in order to post pictures. Sometimes this rule is automatically enforced and sometimes new users can put up photos with their first post. There really seems to be no rhyme or reason as to who gets enforced and who doesn't - seemingly it depends solely upon your favor with the cyber gods.

The point is, if you don't see the "manage attachments" function, it should appear as soon as you have 50 posts. :thumbsup:

PC :smokin:

[BONJO2]

why not move the plants inside for 2-3 weeks ?

[BONJO2]

hmzzzzz .... new target ... potency .. if u like the smell of fried liver then throw some liver blood ( cow one is the best u can use pork or chicken too ) the smoke will be really great if u eat fried potatos and coke along ! bon apetite

[the image reaper]

hmzzzzz .... new target ... potency .. if u like the smell of fried liver then throw some liver blood ( cow one is the best u can use pork or chicken too ) the smoke will be really great if u eat fried potatos and coke along ! bon apetite

truly, 'advice' to be ignored ... :smokin:

[Psycho4Bud]

hmzzzzz .... new target ... potency .. if u like the smell of fried liver then throw some liver blood ( cow one is the best u can use pork or chicken too ) the smoke will be really great if u eat fried potatos and coke along ! bon apetite

I think you would be happier posting in the lounge......the Cultivation Forums are for serious growers.

Have a good grow!:jointsmile:

[BONJO2]

ok apologise for my way of speak but the story here doesn't seems at least thoughtfull , i mean the guy has plants that don't wanna be found by his mother but has np to build a light proof bloom system hmzzz... and has indoors plants ... and asks about potency ... , that isn't serius to me either
ok and to be Serius , u planted too late its l8 july and ur outdoor plants are less than half a meter ? u ll get modest buds at the very very very best HAPPY GROWING ( makes life longer)

[Zcomp]

To answer chandler44's Q. Yes there is a time of year that hits 12/12, on about 3/20 and 9/22 are the spring equinox and fall equinox respectively. hence people harvesting in fall. in june the days become as long as they will be all year and in december the night's become the longest all year. as a side note, these long night's cause deppression in humans and is probably the reason we have christmas to celebrate and forget our mental woes. This goes way back to the pagan religion where they celebrated the equinox's and the solstices(June & December).

[Treetops]

Hope this helps...:thumbsup:

[Treetops]

...

[Zcomp]

Treetops, Was my info outdated? I retrieved it from the wiki cause I could'nt remember the exact days. and on the bottom of this page it says " Last edited by Treetops : Aug-15-2007 at 10:48. Reason: Disregard, chart posted....". Or maybe my info assumed a certain location on earth?

[Treetops]

No, No...I just wanted everyone to see the chart....I didnt think it loaded....had to explain why the second post....hope that clarifies that....Sorry about the confusion......Had the chart, thought it would be good info for all....

Peace,
Treetops

[twoguysupnorth]

your location on earth also has an effect on the length of days. at the equator the days are almost always the same length and say near the poles you can get constant light or darkness during certain times of the year.

[Delta9Haze420]

^^^
...yeah unfortunately I live in TX. high quality bud is averages at about 60 an 1/8. I hate texas.


I just have to comment on this really quick. Are you kidding me? Where in TX, because it sure as *expletive* isn't that expensive in Midland, Austin, or College Station (for those unfamiliar, those three cities cut a roughly horizantle line through the middle of TX with the west end a little further north than the east end). Anyway, you should be able to get twice that for that price, at the very least. An ozzy of Kind in Midland is ~$120.

Anyway, don't fertilize while you're flowering! At least not after 3-4 weeks into flowering (or within 2 weeks of your projected harvest)! In fact anything that is added later in the flowering period is probably going to turn up in much higher quantities in the bud (which is bad, especially carbon as mentioned before, which means all sugars and other organic compounds). Fertilizers have a large percentage of "innert" ingredients that can get taken up by the root system and, while they don't hurt the plant, could very well make for a nasty smoke. Just a quick two cents from a biologist...

[stinkyattic]

Anyway, don't fertilize while you're flowering! At least not after 3-4 weeks into flowering (or within 2 weeks of your projected harvest)! In fact anything that is added later in the flowering period is probably going to turn up in much higher quantities in the bud (which is bad, especially carbon as mentioned before, which means all sugars and other organic compounds). Fertilizers have a large percentage of "innert" ingredients that can get taken up by the root system and, while they don't hurt the plant, could very well make for a nasty smoke. Just a quick two cents from a biologist...
Just a quick two cents from a chemist.... This advice is misleading- AT BEST.
Are you seriously only running 5 week strains? Wow! That's pretty rare... :wtf: 35 days, eh? Got me there, I was not previously aware that a 35 day strain existed!
The ingerdients in a good fertilizer are chosen to provide both positive and negatively-charged ions that are BOTH valuable to the plant... such as Potassium sulfate or Calcium phosphate- The plants use both dissociated parts of the compound.
Furthermore, sugars may be applied right up to the end of flower with no negative effects on flavor.
lol @ carbon being bad! What do you think the resins are made of? (hint: it's found in sugar....)
The important element NOT to add in excess in flower is Nitrogen, as it is necessary to chlorophyll production, and chlorophyll is a primary cause of harsh smoke.

[twoguysupnorth]

just kidding ,but IR you got your mensies? looks like i somehow missed alot of this thread, time to go back and read. what is MENSA? i swear ill have some valuable input next time!lol

[Delta9Haze420]

Just a quick two cents from a chemist.... This advice is misleading- AT BEST.
Are you seriously only running 5 week strains? Wow! That's pretty rare... :wtf: 35 days, eh? Got me there, I was not previously aware that a 35 day strain existed!
The ingerdients in a good fertilizer are chosen to provide both positive and negatively-charged ions that are BOTH valuable to the plant... such as Potassium sulfate or Calcium phosphate- The plants use both dissociated parts of the compound.
Furthermore, sugars may be applied right up to the end of flower with no negative effects on flavor.
lol @ carbon being bad! What do you think the resins are made of? (hint: it's found in sugar....)
The important element NOT to add in excess in flower is Nitrogen, as it is necessary to chlorophyll production, and chlorophyll is a primary cause of harsh smoke.

Chill out stinky. No need to get defensive. Check my profile - I am an organic chemist by profession (MS). My undergrad degree was in biology. Yeah, cations an anions can help the *plant*, but the innert ingredients don't. Do you think fertilizer is made up of *just* ionized compounds? surely you realize that many fertilizers have extensive quantities of filler material in them. They aren't pure NPK. I recognize you may be a professional, but that doesn't make me any less of one. Don't discount what I say just because I'm not a Moderator. My degrees are just as valid as any you may have.

In regard to sugars - I am talking about complex sugars, not the simple sugars produced by plants. Plants can not metabolize synthetic complex sugars and some types of sugars that a particular genus (or species) may be naive to.

And who said anything about 5 week strains?

It isn't a contest. At least try and respect the rest of us. You always have some sarcastic comment. I don't "lol" at anything you say, nor do I criticize your advice. It would be unprofessional...

Attached is an image of what my methods would produce. I would say it looks pretty healthy...

[Delta9Haze420]

Oh and stinky:

Potassium sulfate and Calcium phosphate are not ions, they are salts. Anything in phosphate, sulfate, bromide, hydrochloric, etc form is a salt. They don't ionize until after being mixed with water...

[Delta9Haze420]

Oh and stinky:

Potassium sulfate and Calcium phosphate are not ions, they are salts. Anything in phosphate, sulfate, bromide, hydrochloric, etc form is a salt. They don't ionize until after being mixed with water...
Sorry to double post, I was editing and ran out of time to add the following:

Stinky is right about a lot of what she says (in just about everything I have read that she has written), but I still hold that in a controlled study, a plant that is only flushed with Di-H2O (Deionized water, or distilled water) for the last 2-4 weeks as opposed to being fertilized will be a much better product. I'm sure many experienced growers would attest to only flushing with pure water the last 2 weeks or so, anyone else care to comment on how they like to end their flowering cycle?

Stinky, I don't mean any hard feelings. As a fellow scientist, I'd love to know more about your experiences in chemistry. I always find it enlightening to discuss the life sciences with others who have studied in the field. Do I understand correctly you work in testing water? If so then you have a great advantage over most growers in that you know exactly what trace minerals and sediment is found in the local water. I have several colleagues who do soil analysis for a think tank nearby and I have collaborated with them extensively to find a great soil. I, personally, work in research (I have since grad school) - as an organic chemist for a pharmaceutical company.

[Nuggz420]

I dont understand this whole twelve hours thing. Is there supposed to be a certain point in the year where there's exactly 12/12 and thats what triggers the buds to grow? (in nature) And also, why wouldn't my plants bud? Do they need to be a certain height or have certain style leaves?

I have seen plants about my height have buds and shit. I dont know what trichomes are either. Im willing to give that thing a shot if sumone could tell me what "panda is", and if sumone can also back up the extra potassium idea.

Thanks.

i believe that outdoor plants will naturally start to flower even if there is less than 12 hours of darkness, because around here plants start to flower around august, even though the atumnal equinox (the day when there is an equal amount of darkness as there is light) isn't until towards the end of september. if i'm wrong about this, feel free to shed some light.

[Zcomp]

i believe that outdoor plants will naturally start to flower even if there is less than 12 hours of darkness, because around here plants start to flower around august, even though the atumnal equinox (the day when there is an equal amount of darkness as there is light) isn't until towards the end of september. if i'm wrong about this, feel free to shed some light.
Your right about that Nuggz, Because plants really start flowering when light drops to 14Hrs a day. It drops to 14 about a month or so before its at 12. :rasta:

[stinkyattic]

I work in research supervising an organic chemistry lab at a university- specifically, PCBs in the tissues and blood of subsistence hunters and their prey. My degree is in fisheries management (Ichthyology side, rather than ecology) and I ended up running my lab through a strange turn of events that included time in Alaska at sea, and a couple years field sampling on an EPA grant... the lab we were sending samples to was understaffed, and the rest is history.
My irritation was primarily at your claim that fertilizing at all after week 2-3 of flower is bad- and the sugar thing- come on, we all use molasses, and right up to harvest too. I'm not sure what other sugars you were talking about that are bad for the plants... I certainly would not be feeding them lactose, for example... but that's not done anyway, so ???
Don't start with me on thinking I'm all that just because I'm a moderator. Seriously. I'm not like that, and turned down mod the first time it was offered- I've just been kicking around this site long enough to know that information presented incompletely is often misinterpreted by noobs and leads to confusion later on. Your original post implied that you would be feeding for less than HALF of the full time you need to be. Typical flower on an indoor grow is a full 8 weeks, meaning you should be feeding for a full 6 weeks.
I'm not trying to get in a big ol flame war here either, I just want to make certain that there is no confusion over fertilizing schedules. You simply do NOT flush for a month.
And I'm not trying to play semantics here either, but I never claimed that Calcium phosphate was an ion, I said that BOTH dissociated ions were valuable to the plant...
We can go on sniping at each other or not. I respect your background and degrees. Let's just leave it at that. Sorry for coming off so snarky to begin with.

[Delta9Haze420]

That really is quite an interesting way to end up where you are now. I would think the time in the field was probably very educational (I would have loved to have done some biology field work, but alas - fate has taken me elsewhere). Of course along with work in the field comes inevitable frustrations. Anywho... You are right about the incomplete way in which I presented my information. I assumed (rashly) that the correct interpretation could be extrapolated. As for the sugars, I took the opposite angle, and didn't assume that everyone knows the difference between sugars. I haven't heard of anyone feeding plants lactose, but you never know - I've heard of people attempting stranger things (someone once asked if they could use a dead animal burried in their soil as fertilizer). My apologies for taking aim at your position on the board. I am an assistant admin at a couple of boards (unrelated to this) where I've had a few bad experiences with mods turning into berserks after holding a mod position for awhile. You really do know what you're doing though, and always have great info, so I certainly applaud all you do in spreading the wealth of information. Thank you for your diplomacy and grace.

Not to stray from the topic, I have a question about what qualities you are looking for in your potency Chandler - are you looking for a cerebral or stoned effect? When it comes to harvesting (and identifying prime potency), the inevitable topic of heady/cerebral vs. stoney/body high comes up. As mentioned earlier, the timing of the harvest has a great impact (along with drying and curing) on the quality you get. I don't remember it being mentioned specifically, so I'll briefly discuss: Once trichomes begin to form, their clarity (or lack thereof) plays a crucial role in potency. Trichomes will develope clear, and begin to turn cloudy, milky, and fade to an amber and even brown if allowed to (the darkening indicates the deterioration of THC into other cannabinoids like CBN). A higher percentage of clear/cloudy trichomes gives a much more up/heady feeling than allowing many of them to turn amber, which causes more of the body stone (couchlock) and is used more commonly medicinally.

See Stinky's Guide (in her signature) for concise and well written info. I think that aside from some direct action to improve potency, caring well for a plant throughout it's entire life cycle is one of the best ways to improve overall quality.

Stinky - do you have any words on drying and curing? Post-harvest is really what I don't have much experience with. Allowing a long drying period (while preventing mold) and then curing properly usually incerases the quality, if not the potency directly. Exact methods of curing I am unsure of, although I know many people like to cure in sealed glass jars, burping them once a day (allowing fresh air in). I'm hesitant to elaborate any more though until I have seen for myself exactly what seems to work the best.

Chemistry stub: CBN is very similar in structure to THC (moreso than any other cannabinoid), in that it shares the parent structure of THC, but has 4 fewer hydrogens and a resulting two additional double bonds in one of the 6 carbon rings, making it aromatic. This similarity is due to the fact that CBN is actually an oxidation product of THC (which is the process by which THC "degrades" into CBN, which was once thought to be innert and non-psychoactive). It is now known that CBN is in fact psychoactive and has shown effectiveness as an anxiolytic (anti anxiety), and to a lesser extent (compared to Cannabidiol, aka CBD) as an analgesic (pain killer). As an anecdote, the IUPAC (International Union of Pure and Applied Chemistry) name (nomenclature) for delta-9-THC (THC) is the ungodly:

"(−)-(6aR,10aR)-6,6,9-trimethyl-3-pentyl-6a,7,8,10a-tetrahydro-6H-benzo[c]chromen-1-ol"

[stinkyattic]

"(−)-(6aR,10aR)-6,6,9-trimethyl-3-pentyl-6a,7,8,10a-tetrahydro-6H-benzo[c]chromen-1-ol"

You SO need to turn this into your siggy....

Dryin -n- curin?

Well my take on the post-harvest steps is pretty no nonsense; cut at your preferred %cloudy/amber, do a basic trim immediately- chop the fans and any sugar leaves that are sticking out.
Hang or stick in a vase in an area that is dimly lit, cool, and dry- I have been in the bad habit of using drying buds as a centerpiece in my dining room, which is conveniently air conditioned, dim, and dry. lol. And it makes a fantabulous conversation piece when my dinner guests have that flash of dawning realization that the 'bouquet' is a couple zips of drying bud.... :D
Anyway...
When the thing is dry enough that the smallish branches are a little brittle and will crack properly when you bend them, snip the buds off and toss in a glass jar- again, keep it in a cool and dim area- the first couple days, open it long enough to drink your morning coffee, and again long enough in the evening to have your bedtime puff. If it's super humid out, you have to burp in a dehumidified room for it to have any effect. In a few days the moisture will even out throughout the bud.
It's pretty intuitive- the actual timing depends upon your ambient conditions, especially humidity- but even for a first timer you will certainly be able to feel how a bud jarred up feeling dry in the morning will feel moist again by nightfall in a sealed jar, and you just keep repeating the 'burp' until the moisture content is consistent between openings... if that makes any sense?

Oh durr, edit... at some point in here you can also do a more twitchy manicure. I do mine at the end of the burp period, when I have decided the moisture content is where it should be- I go through and snip off any leftover sugar leaves that are sticking out in an unattractive way, and scour for seeds ( I breed and occasionally I do get rogue seeds here and there). Those seeds go to one of my peeps who has been having some fun with them. Yay. And the sugar leaves go into the hash box.

[twoguysupnorth]

trim the fans off in the field. put into paper sac then hope like hell till you get home.

[Zcomp]

Just my :twocents: on the feeding issue, I think that most will agree with me that we fertilize until about 2 weeks before harvest to pack on the most amount of pounds while not sacrificing too much in the area of flavor. While your idea to flush for 1 month sounds like it probably would make cleaner smoke, I personally couldn't give up two more weeks of ferts.