evolution or creationism?

[juggalo420]

personaly i believe evolution to be fact and creationism a bunch of religious hog-wash , i base this belief due to a little something called science.

anyone elses opinion?

[Purge]

agreed.

[jacquelyne]

YES EVOLUTION

[FrenchInhale]

I believe in creationism and I feel evolution is hog-wash. Also, did you know that there have been a lot of scientist who have tried to disprove creationism and have ended up believeing in it and being converted? Just thought I would throw that tid bit in there. Peace.

[IrkenInvader]

well evolution is just a theory, but one thing I do know is that creationism is complete bollocks. Not to trample anyone's beliefs or anything, but creationism pretty much refutes scientific evidence.

[Nullific]

Gravity is also a theory.

[The C]

So was the fact that the world was flat, everyone believed it too. After all it was "science" that had "proven" so.

[Euphoric]

evolution of course

[GHoSToKeR]

i dont believe we were created, and i dont know enough about evolution to believe it or disbelieve it

[Encatuse]

Your mistaken. Gravity is not a theory, it's a law. Hence: The Law of Gravity.

nnneevvermind

[juggalo420]

Your mistaken. Gravity is not a theory, it's a law. Hence: The Law of Gravity.

nnneevvermind

a theory in science is much diffeerent than a theory in any other field. A scientific theory, in order to become one, must pass several tests by many scientists and have a collection of supporting evidence for it and be reviewed and critiqued by many scientists in order to even become a scientific theory.

By the way gravity is a theory. as well as the theory of relativity. theory of electro-magnetism.

[The C]

We can test everything. Aynthign and still not be 100% sure, we can be 99.9 percent sure. And then claim it's a law because we see no different.

But just because we soo no different doest mean there isnt. Scientific community sems to agree that nothing is %100.

We say things are law, but what if in a 99.9 percent probability that gravity is the was we've worked it out to be, isnt the way.
We can just speculate what little we know in this short lived civilization. Mabein a couple melenia. Right now gwe should concentrate on surviving for another couple hundreed years, forget a couple thousand or even 1 melenia.

[FRANKFRANKFRANK]

EVOLUTION, BABY! That Bible-bullshit-hogwash is just that, hogwash

[seeker]

i wont argue with anyone here, thats fucking pointless but i do believe in God, Jah, allah, however one wishes to put it. And i believe that evolution is a naural process of life, the ultimate symblism of life striving to improve itself in imitaiton of a perfect god.

So im a creationist who understands and accepts that evolution is a real process of life.

~always in Jah~
~pura vida compadres~
~seeker~

[meek mike]

Darwin said it so you all believe it. Just as the Bible says it so alot of us believe it. Two sides two different views. What does it matter what we all believe as long as we all believe in our opinion. Who are we all trying to convince. You folks don't believe as I do and I don't believe as you do. Lets move on. There is no proof on either side.

Rev. Michael T
Soldier for Christ

[Buck268]

I don't see how y'all have so much trouble reconsiling religion and science... As Thomas Aquinas said, God is the unmoved mover.

[seeker]

amen bro

problem is there is proof on both sides but not enough to affirm what happened when life started because noone is still around from when it happened.

no observation, no scientific fact, its all faith in an idea, whenther in evolutionary theory or creationism.

[juggalo420]

Darwin said it so you all believe it. Just as the Bible says it so alot of us believe it. Two sides two different views. What does it matter what we all believe as long as we all believe in our opinion. Who are we all trying to convince. You folks don't believe as I do and I don't believe as you do. Lets move on. There is no proof on either side.

Rev. Michael T
Soldier for Christ
the fossil record, the distribution of certain specise on certain contintents, and generally speaking a boat load of scientific facts supprt evolutionists, and to think the only reason people believe in evolution is because Darwin said it, thats bullshit we believe what darwin said because he had proof of evolution as in the fossil record and other materials, so theres actual hard evidence in the evolution camp while theres is a 2000yr old book in the creationists.

[Nullific]

The way the influenza changes to a different strain every year, thats evolution. Bacteria developing resistance to anti-biotics, that is evolution. Insects build up tolerence to pesticides, again is evolution.

[meek mike]

Null-

I never said evolution doesn't happen. I know it does because I am not the same as I was a year ago. I evolved into the person I am to day. Thats not the point. Evolution is pretty much adapting to surrounds.

Jugg-

You say there is proof. Please post the link so we (faithful) people can be proven wrong. But........ Don't post from some biast website. Just as you asked us (the faithful) to not post from a biast Christian site. Maybe a news paper that says "Proof evolution is where we all came from". Then you can say with out being biast yourself that evolution is in fact what happened. Thanks.

Rev. Micahel T
Soldier for Christ

[juggalo420]

i hope we can agree national geographic is unbiased and onlly concerned with scientific facts.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/04/0401_040401_tetrapodfossil.html
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/03/0325_040325_hominiddna.html

heres a good one, it shows how evolution and religion can co-exist, just not evolution and creationism:

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/10/1018_041018_science_religion.html
^thats a good one even though i dont believe in god.

[meek mike]

Jugg-

Those are good. It doesn't prove that we all came from monkeys and what not all it shows in a new kind of fish (speaking of the fisrt link) that went from water to land. I believe I've seen on the Discovery channel that there are still fish that do that. They discovered a new fish not the missing link to humans. But that was a good link to look into. I will do some research myself and see what else I can find. Please keep looking into it as well and we can talk more about it next weekend when I'm done with mine. Thanks.

Rev. Michael T
Soldier for Christ

[FrenchInhale]

Did you guys know that the flood in the bible that noah's ark had in it has been scientifically proven? There is evidence on both sides of the park... its just that people believe what they want to believe... if one side had all the evidence to support it noone would believe the ladder... so there is no point in argueing about it because there isn't enough support on either side to say that it is the correct one... you just believe what you believe.

[juggalo420]

Did you guys know that the flood in the bible that noah's ark had in it has been scientifically proven? There is evidence on both sides of the park... its just that people believe what they want to believe... if one side had all the evidence to support it noone would believe the ladder... so there is no point in argueing about it because there isn't enough support on either side to say that it is the correct one... you just believe what you believe.
what proof? and just because people believe in the flood doesnt make it legitimate( people believe in ufos as well, and big foot, theirs also plenty who believe Elvis is alive), one argument for the flood which i find plauseable is that it was a localized event and later exagerated into a world wide calamity. There is in fact much evidence that proves it didnt happen. The most important question is where did all that water go, in the bible it says even the mountains were covered, so where did it go? So the fossil record shows no such event as happening, why are fossils layered from simple organizisms to more complex and not all mixed up as would happen if a world wide flood occured?

[IrkenInvader]

Yeah just because there was a massive flood at some point in history doesn't mean it was actually Noah's ark. In fact, most historians believe that this event may have served as inspiration for the story, but not as the actual historical event. Say there is a huge disaster that affects a certain area and a few decades later you want to write a religious text that people would believe. You might use that event in your story, so your readers would say "oh yeah, i have vaguely heard about that, so it must be true." And while everyone has the right to believe what they want, that doesn't make them right or justified. I have the right not to believe in the law of gravity, but if I jump off the roof of a tall building, gravity is still going to be there.
As far as evolution goes, however, perhaps some misunderstood what I was saying when I said that it's just a theory. I think that if you look at the entire history of science, scientific discovery has basically meant doing away with old ideas and replacing them with new, better ideas. Take physics for example: Galileo was eventually proven wrong, Newton was eventually proven wrong, Einstein will eventually be proven wrong because his theory doesn't take into account quantum mechanics. I think that, with this pattern evident, it's not the best idea to accept evolution wholeheartedly. While I think that evolution does exist, it's only an important piece of a larger puzzle. It will have to stand up to many years of scientific process before it can be accepted as a law.

[GHoSToKeR]

i dont think einstien will be "done away with", i just think that eisnteisn theiry of relativity and quantum mechanics will some day be unified and they will be seen as one/;... but i dunno, im drunk as hell :D

[IrkenInvader]

I'm not entirely sure but I think einstein's theory is wrong for the whole quantum mechanics thing but will be correct if a theory (such as string if you believe in it) comes along and tweaks it, so I think we're talking about the same thing. But I'm stoned as hell, so who knows, really.

[mr chinnery]

At the end of the day Creationism is such a weak theory, it's not even worth talking about. Evolution is the best we have.

[F L E S H]

I'm going to offend some people, but I don't really care.

Creationism was born in the Early Middle Ages when the Church had control over EVERYTHING. It is a form of control that the Church has established over people (mostly Americans today).

Throughout history, the Church, the popes and all those people constantly hid the truth from people from fear that they would one day wake up and realize the world as it is taught by the Church is a huge sham. You can draw a direct parallel between this and the way communist or otherwise totalitarian regimes hide or distort the truth from their own population so that they can keep control.

Creationism is a sham, and only people who are afraid to realize that the Bible was NEVER meant to be taken literally refuse to accept it.

[F L E S H]

(I'm sorry to double post, it took too long to add this on the edit screen :D)

P.S.: To say that evolution is 'just' a theory s the weakest counter-argument ever. As others have pointed out, relativity is 'just' a theory, sub-atomic particles are 'just' a theory, yet physics today bases itself on the existence of these particles. Everything that is not immediately concrete and tangible in science is a theory, yet that doesn't mean that they are useless.

You say that some scientists converted to creationism while trying to disprove it. How about the thousands of people who wake up with an open mind one day and realize that evolution is a beautiful theory, which puts us in harmony with each other and with nature? For that matter, why is it such an abhorrent thought for Christians to be so close to Nature and the Earth? Is it really so bad to think that we all descended from common ancestors if you go far back in time?

To me, evolution is beautiful, and it is so much more in tune with general spirituality than to simply say "3,885 years ago (or whatever) God created us, and we are better then everything else." Here's a lesson, guys: we are not better than anything else, and we do not have more of a right to this planet than anything else living here, be it a fly or a lion.

[GHoSToKeR]

I'm going to offend some people, but I don't really care.

Creationism was born in the Early Middle Ages when the Church had control over EVERYTHING. It is a form of control that the Church has established over people (mostly Americans today).

Throughout history, the Church, the popes and all those people constantly hid the truth from people from fear that they would one day wake up and realize the world as it is taught by the Church is a huge sham. You can draw a direct parallel between this and the way communist or otherwise totalitarian regimes hide or distort the truth from their own population so that they can keep control.

Creationism is a sham, and only people who are afraid to realize that the Bible was NEVER meant to be taken literally refuse to accept it.

Amen! :D

[juggalo420]

I'm going to offend some people, but I don't really care.

Creationism was born in the Early Middle Ages when the Church had control over EVERYTHING. It is a form of control that the Church has established over people (mostly Americans today).

Throughout history, the Church, the popes and all those people constantly hid the truth from people from fear that they would one day wake up and realize the world as it is taught by the Church is a huge sham. You can draw a direct parallel between this and the way communist or otherwise totalitarian regimes hide or distort the truth from their own population so that they can keep control.

Creationism is a sham, and only people who are afraid to realize that the Bible was NEVER meant to be taken literally refuse to accept it.
Ok first let me say i agree with you that creationism is intellectualy unacceptable, but you do have some facts wrong buddy. First you say creationism was born in the middle ages, thats wrong, creationism or the literal interpretation of the first chapters of genesis was around since it was written by the jews centurys ago. Also i greatly doubt the pushers of creationism, the churches know what they are spreading is a lie, i think they honestly believe they are right. I also wouldnt say theres a parrallel between the church and communism, people like lenin and stalin knowingly distorted history to paint themselves and their movement as always in the right, the church and its adhearants honestly believe their version of history is correct. Also communism promotes atheism, and the pope in fact helped with the fall of the soviet union. Again i will state i dont believe in god. Well im gonna stop babbling now.

[F L E S H]

Juggalo, you misread my post in some parts, and in others, you're wrong. It is a FACT that at the very beginning of Christianity, the first church fathers such as St Augustine, St Jerome and others explicitly hid certain truths from the public in order to be able to control them. How do we know this? There are ancient texts, handwritten by these Church fathers, that clearly state that they had the intention of making people believe that these stories were factual, when most pagans of the time understood them to be myth, and nothing else. Being an historian, I've read up a lot on this kind of stuff, and sometimes ignorance is bliss, because when I found all this stuff out, it scared the shit out of me. Believe me, all I write here is true, and corroborated by most scholars. In fact, one of the books I read was written by a former priest who was completely disillusioned by the Anglican Church. Of course, after many centuries of making their flocks believe this crap, church officials eventually forgot that what they were preaching were lies, and began to believe it themselves. This is part of the explanation of why the Dark Ages were dark.

And my comparison of the Catholic Church and Communism involved only the distortion and withholding of truth. Of course, in all other ways, they're completely different, but my point was that they both use the same techniques to control the people they dominate, so that they will not rebel against them.

[juggalo420]

FLESH i would love to read where st. augstine or any other early churh leader knowingly hid certain truths, any links or names of such books would be greatyly appreciated, such info i would glad;y use when debating any christians
peace

[Purge]

In fact, one of the books I read was written by a former priest who was completely disillusioned by the Anglican Church.


whats the author and title?..id like to pick that up.

[GHoSToKeR]

FLESH i would love to read where st. augstine or any other early churh leader knowingly hid certain truths, any links or names of such books would be greatyly appreciated, such info i would glad;y use when debating any christians
peace

Isnt that The Dead Sea Scrolls or something??? I'm not sure

[FrenchInhale]

Isnt that The Dead Sea Scrolls or something??? I'm not sure

The Dead Sea Scrolls are word for word the book of Isaiah.

[F L E S H]

It was a book I randomly picked up at the library, the author's name I think was Tom Harpur. I'll check it out tomorrow and report back. His book is very informative especially about the debate we're having here, it's really interesting.

I think it's called The Pagan Christ, but like I said i'll check it out tomorrow and tell you guys
:D

[F L E S H]

GHoST, the Dead Sea scrolls are ancient biblical texts. What I'm talking about is the creation of Christian dogma, by people such as St Augustine (he wrote City of God sometime in the 300s A.D.) and St Jerome (the dude who translated the Bible into LAtin from Greek for the first time) who wrote around the 450s A.D. I think you should be able to find their writings, especially St Augustine (not to be confused with Augustine, the first British bishop, also around the 500s A.D.)

[GHoSToKeR]

okay, cheers F L E S H!

I've been wanting to find stuff like that, ever since I read The Da Vinci Code (lol I know its just a novel, but ya).. Im just always either too busy or too stoned to go to the library :p

[F L E S H]

lol
make the effort GHoST, it's an even better read when you're stoned! Seriously, you can make the connections so much more easily....

I've been reading Jack Herer's book (here's a link (http://www.jackherer.com/chapters.html)) and I've come to a big, all-encompassing conclusion, relevant in almost any debate:

Knowledge is power. Those who already have power have ceaselessly tried, for thousands of years, to keep Knowledge away from the population. What is Knowledge? It can be anything: evolution, economics (where do our taxes go?), MARIJUANA, the difference between myth and history.
To Know is to have the power to destroy ignorance and stupidity, but the powers that be want us to be stupid and docile so that things will never change. Take charge, and gain Knowledge.

[FrenchInhale]

lol
make the effort GHoST, it's an even better read when you're stoned! Seriously, you can make the connections so much more easily....

I've been reading Jack Herer's book (here's a link (http://www.jackherer.com/chapters.html)) and I've come to a big, all-encompassing conclusion, relevant in almost any debate:

Knowledge is power. Those who already have power have ceaselessly tried, for thousands of years, to keep Knowledge away from the population. What is Knowledge? It can be anything: evolution, economics (where do our taxes go?), MARIJUANA, the difference between myth and history.
To Know is to have the power to destroy ignorance and stupidity, but the powers that be want us to be stupid and docile so that things will never change. Take charge, and gain Knowledge.

I couldn't agree more... thats one of my motto's knowledge is power... plus its fun to agrue with people and make them look like idiots...

[SatanicStonerMonky]

Darwin said it so you all believe it. Just as the Bible says it so alot of us believe it. Two sides two different views. What does it matter what we all believe as long as we all believe in our opinion. Who are we all trying to convince. You folks don't believe as I do and I don't believe as you do. Lets move on. There is no proof on either side.

Rev. Michael T
Soldier for Christ
Evolution has been around far longer than Darwin, although he was the first to make note of its exsistance. Creationism has been around for a while but evolution has been around forever. Personally I believe in evolution, and I think creationism is complete bulshit. Ill go more in depth into why a little bit later in the post.


We can test everything. Aynthign and still not be 100% sure, we can be 99.9 percent sure. And then claim it's a law because we see no different.

But just because we soo no different doest mean there isnt. Scientific community sems to agree that nothing is %100.

We say things are law, but what if in a 99.9 percent probability that gravity is the was we've worked it out to be, isnt the way.

Most things that we believe to be true can only be proven to be 99.9% right, but there are some that are 100% right. It is 100% correct of me to believe that if I am to stop breathing for a time period of over 30 minutes I will be dead and never draw in a breath again. We dont need scientific evidence to tell us that, but it does help to prove a point.

Now, as for why I think creationism is complete bullshit. The theory of creationism states that EVERYTHING was created by ONE omnipotent being. The major problem here is that EVERYTHING encompases the very omnipotent being that supposedly created everything. Nothing can create itself. We might be able to clone or reproduce things that look like us and act like us but did we create ourselves? No, we created a copy of ourselves. Of course, many people ask "if god created everything then what created god?" I just take it a step further. Creationism would be completely impossible simply because of the fact that in order for something to create something else, the first entity must have been created. Thus making it no longer the first entity. The thing that made the entity that is given credit for creating everything would also have had to have been created by something. Meaning that this is an endless cycle. Thus providing more evidence for evolution.

Also, if the Bible, both OT and NT, are as historically accurate as Christians believe it to be, then why exactly is it that before our "creation", why does it not mention all the other great creatures that must have been "created" before us. Such as dinosaurs, and other reptiles, birds, fish, ect ect. It does state that birds and animals and fish were created, but it states that they were created for the human population to live off of and rule over.

Thats all I have for the moment.

Hail Thyself!

[NCarolina420]

about your evolution theory bro...there have been many gaps supporting and discluding evolution as factual...there have even been scientists who nationally have said that evolution wasnt true but that the only reason they supported it was because there wasnt any way they were going to believe in God...

[djaio]

Why must evolution and creationism be considered mutually exclusive?

I believe that we were created - or, rather, we placed ourselves into the physical world - and evolved to the state we are now.

[F L E S H]

about your evolution theory bro...there have been many gaps supporting and discluding evolution as factual...there have even been scientists who nationally have said that evolution wasnt true but that the only reason they supported it was because there wasnt any way they were going to believe in God...
for god's skae, I keep hearing this stupid argument, yet I haven't actually seen or heard one single scientist saying this. Please give me proof, cause it's so easy to say "yeah, but there's this scientist who says this."

I want names, books, publications, credentials, and what not. I can say anything I want and claim to be a scientist too, you know? But the fact remains, there are NO gaps in the theory, and 99.9% of scientists worldwide accept evolution.

[NCarolina420]

"Given that evolution, according to Darwin, was in a continual state of motion ...it followed logically that the fossil record should be rife with examples of transitional forms leading from the less to more evolved. ...Instead of filling the gaps in the fossil record with so-called missing links, most paleontologists found themselves facing a situation in which there were only gaps in the fossil record, with no evidence of transformational intermediates between documented fossil species." (Schwartz, Jeffrey H., Sudden Origins, 1999, p. 89.)

Here you go buddy...just one example...there's plenty more if youd like them

[NCarolina420]

"The known fossil record is not, and never has been, in accord with gradualism. What is remarkable is that, through a variety of historical circumstances, even the history of opposition has been obscured . . . â??The majority of paleontologists felt their evidence simply contradicted Darwinâ??s stress on minute, slow, and cumulative changes leading to species transformation.â?? . . . their story has been suppressed." (Stanley, S.M., The New Evolutionary Timetable, 1981, p. 71

[NCarolina420]

"Gaps in the fossil record - particularly those parts of it that are most needed for interpreting the course of evolution - are not surprising." (Stebbins, G. L., Darwin to DNA, Molecules to Humanity, 1982, p. 107)

[NCarolina420]

"We have so many gaps in the evolutionary history of life, gaps in such key areas as the origin of the multicellular organisms, the origin of the vertebrates, not to mention the origins of most invertebrate groups." (McGowan, C., In the Beginning . . . A Scientist Shows Why Evolutionists are Wrong, 1984, p. 95)

[F L E S H]

"Given that evolution, according to Darwin, was in a continual state of motion ...it followed logically that the fossil record should be rife with examples of transitional forms leading from the less to more evolved. ...Instead of filling the gaps in the fossil record with so-called missing links, most paleontologists found themselves facing a situation in which there were only gaps in the fossil record, with no evidence of transformational intermediates between documented fossil species." (Schwartz, Jeffrey H., Sudden Origins, 1999, p. 89.)

Yes, Dr. Schwartz, did say that, but did you look up who he actually is? He's one of the leading scietists in the field of human evolution, he's just acknowledging that there are gaps, as is to be expected in a theory that goes back BILLIONS of years.... You know, the Earth changes, things move around on the surface, of course some dingy old fossils are going to dissapear. At least quote someone who truly is against evolution....


"The known fossil record is not, and never has been, in accord with gradualism. What is remarkable is that, through a variety of historical circumstances, even the history of opposition has been obscured . . . â??The majority of paleontologists felt their evidence simply contradicted Darwinâ??s stress on minute, slow, and cumulative changes leading to species transformation.â?? . . . their story has been suppressed." (Stanley, S.M., The New Evolutionary Timetable, 1981, p. 71

Again, Steven M. Stanley is a leading evolutionist, who came up with a neo-Darwinian theory, and you took one of his quotes completely out of context. So far, you haven't convinced me...


"Gaps in the fossil record - particularly those parts of it that are most needed for interpreting the course of evolution - are not surprising." (Stebbins, G. L., Darwin to DNA, Molecules to Humanity, 1982, p. 107)

this is the weakest quote supporting your argument, and manages to prove absolutely nothing... Anyone can say this, I say it all the time, and I 'believe' in evolution.


"We have so many gaps in the evolutionary history of life, gaps in such key areas as the origin of the multicellular organisms, the origin of the vertebrates, not to mention the origins of most invertebrate groups." (McGowan, C., In the Beginning . . . A Scientist Shows Why Evolutionists are Wrong, 1984, p. 95)

LOL, don't let the title of the book fool you, look it up on Amazon.com.... It's a book that does exactly the opposite of what the title claims (called irony) and destroys any claims creationists might make one by one...

Well, you managed to do absolutely nothing woth those quotes, I hope it didn't take too long to find them and write them down. My suggestion, if you're gonna quote from books, make sure you're quoting from people who actually agree with your point, not mine...

[F L E S H]

OMG, I just noticed something really funny...

NCarolina420, your last quote comes from a book who's real title is 'A Scientist Shows Why Creationists Are Wrong'... I can't believe I didn't notice this before. So you resort to changing quotes and book titles to suit your own purposes now?

See what I mean? this is the kind of proof creationists use to validate their point. Their so desperate that they take quotes out of context, especially when quoting scientists who support evolution (!) and they try to trick others by changing a word here and there. Well, the days of Religion hiding the truth are coming to an end.

[NCarolina420]

actually the person i had received that quote from had sent it to me wrong and had typed in evolutionist instead of creationist....either way it still contradicts evolution to its core so even the evolutionists are simply saying that it is not true...and since your all about quotes and stuff why don't you send me something that validates evolution id sure like to see it...but you won't find it...(and not from the humanist manifesto I or II because there is no proof from that hurrendous book)

[Euphoric]

it still contradicts evolution to its core

how does it contradict itself? :confused:

[NCarolina420]

"The known fossil record is not, and never has been, in accord with gradualism. What is remarkable is that, through a variety of historical circumstances, even the history of opposition has been obscured . . . â??The majority of paleontologists felt their evidence simply contradicted Darwinâ??s stress on minute, slow, and cumulative changes leading to species transformation.â?? . . . their story has been suppressed." (Stanley, S.M., The New Evolutionary Timetable, 1981, p. 71

[NCarolina420]

read that..."...their evidence contradicted Darwins stress on minutes, slow, and cumulative changes leading to species transformation...their story has been supresses." jus one example

[juggalo420]

^ that doesnt mean anything, no one said darwin had everything right just the basic idea and concept of evolution (he was alive before breakthroughs in the field of genetics). creationists have the burden of proof, all they can do is try to mislead others about what evolution actually is.

[F L E S H]

actually the person i had received that quote from had sent it to me wrong and had typed in evolutionist instead of creationist....either way it still contradicts evolution to its core so even the evolutionists are simply saying that it is not true...and since your all about quotes and stuff why don't you send me something that validates evolution id sure like to see it...but you won't find it...(and not from the humanist manifesto I or II because there is no proof from that hurrendous book)
Are you living in an imaginary world???

Look for a recent National Geographic magazine, I think it was last October or November, or around there.... The cover story is about evolution. Have fun reading it. I have it here, but I won't type out the entire article, but suffice to say that it's pretty convincing.

[F L E S H]

heh, actually I had already typed some exerpts from the article in a topic a while back, I managed to find it:

Exerpts from National Geographic:

Evolution by natural selection, the central concept of the life's work of Charles Darwin, is a theory. It's a theory about the origin of adaptation, complexity, and diversity among Earth's living creatures. If you are skeptical by nature, unfamilia with the terminology of science, and unaware of the overwhelming evidence, you might be tempted to say that it's "just" a theory. In the same sense, relativity as described by Einstein is "just" a theory. The notion that Earth orbits around the sun and not vice-versa, offered by Compernicus in 1543, is a theory. Continental drift is a theory. The existence, structure, and dynamics of atoms? Atomimc theory. Even electricity is a theoretical construct, involving electrons, which are tiny units of charged mass that no one has ever seen. Each of these theories is an explanation that has been confirmed to such a degree, by observationand experiment, that knowledgeable experts accept it as fact. That's what scientists mean when they talk about a theory: not a dreamy and unreliable speculation, but an explanatory statement that fits the evidence. They embrace such an explanation confidently but provisionally--taking it as their best available view of reality, at least until some severely conflicting data or some better explanation might come along.

[...]

Orchids, wondrously adapted for controlling their pollination by insects, intrigued Darwin. The parts of their strangely modified flowers, he saw, correspond to the flower parts on simpler plants, suggesting evolutionary change. One species that caught his eye was the Madagascar orchid Angraecum sesquipedale, with its 11-inch-long nectar receptacle. He predicted that somewhere in Madagascar, a place he never visited, must live a moth with a proboscis 11 inches long, adapted to harvest the orchid's nectar. Forty years later two entomologists revealed the Madagascan sphinx moth Xanthopan morganii praedicta, confirming Darwin's forecast. Such mutual adaptation--the moth to the flower, the flower to the moth--is called coevolution.

[...]

Nightmarish illnesses caused by microbes include both the infectious sort (AIDS, Ebola, SARS) that spread directly from person to person and the sort (malaria, West Nile Fever) delivered to us by biting insects or other intermediaries. The capacity for quick change among disease-causing microbes is what makes them so dangerous to large numbers of people and so difficult and expensive to treat. They leap from wildlife or domestice animals into humans, adapting to new circumstances as they go. Their inherent variability allows them to find new ways of evading and defeating human immune systems. By natural selection, they acquire resistance to drugs that should kill them. They evolve. There's no better or more immediate evidence supporting the Darwinian theory than this process of forced transformation among our inimical germs.

[Funken Monken]

I believe in creationism and I feel evolution is hog-wash. Also, did you know that there have been a lot of scientist who have tried to disprove creationism and have ended up believeing in it and being converted? Just thought I would throw that tid bit in there. Peace.

Oh shit, I hate this debate (check this (http://techrepublic.com.com/5208-6230-0.html?forumID=8&threadID=165453&start=0)).

Wake me up when is over, or just let each to theirs

[sawleaf]

Why not both??? What if God set everything into motion and let it all play out. Maybe the Genesis chapter in the bible is a way of explaining the exsistence of the Earth in a way that people could understand and believe thousands of years ago? What do you think people would've thought in biblical times, if you tried to explain geology and evolution? :)

[HughESan]

on offence, but that god stuff is bull$&!%... Evo is the only logical way we are all alive on this mother fucker right now...

[sawleaf]

on offence, but that god stuff is bull$&!%... Evo is the only logical way we are all alive on this mother fucker right now...

You say no offense, but we know you don't mean it at all. I mean you just did say that God is BS. Your post is so intelligent that it convinced me to stop believing in God, instantly! I now refer to the Earth as "this mother fucker" :rolleyes: At least other people post decent arguments and opinions about their views, but yours just made me laugh.

[HughESan]

You say no offense, but we know you don't mean it at all. I mean you just did say that God is BS. Your post is so intelligent that it convinced me to stop believing in God, instantly! I now refer to the Earth as "this mother fucker" :rolleyes: At least other people post decent arguments and opinions about their views, but yours just made me laugh.

hmm, I see you're religious... Anyways, picking fights on web site forums is something only retards do, you know, just kind of a heads up... ;)

[sawleaf]

hmm, I see you're religious... Anyways, picking fights on web site forums is something only retards do, you know, just kind of a heads up... ;)

Show me where in my post I decided to pick a fight. Then check my profile and read the post I typed just before I posted this one. Are all your posts so intelligent?

[HughESan]

Show me where in my post I decided to pick a fight. Then check my profile and read the post I typed just before I posted this one. Are all your posts so intelligent?

Trying to win a fight argument over the net is like being in the special olympics, even if u win, you're still a retard :)

[sawleaf]

Trying to win a fight argument over the net is like being in the special olympics, even if u win, you're still a retard :)

You should really be more original in your posts. If you are going to keep dodging with your answers and can't handle an argument, don't post BS you have no proof of. I may have no proof for you that there is a God, but you certainly have zero proof that there isn't one. Leave it at that boy.

[F L E S H]

Why not both??? What if God set everything into motion and let it all play out. Maybe the Genesis chapter in the bible is a way of explaining the exsistence of the Earth in a way that people could understand and believe thousands of years ago? What do you think people would've thought in biblical times, if you tried to explain geology and evolution? :)
I couldn't agree more, Sawleaf. What's more is that I don't understand why religious types reject evolution so flatly. It's a beautiful system, it shows that we all have common ancestors if you go back in time enough, and that we are inextricably tied to Nature, even though we're destroying it right now. Besides, though I don't believe it myself, what if God himself set everything motin in the first place?

To me, Adam and Eve are the first two molecules that we can consider as 'living'. Even when God creates Eve from Adam, that could just be a fancy way of saying Adam's cell split into to 2 cells, Adam and Eve. LOL, I'm going off the deep end, I know, but my point is that evolution doesn't contradict the Bible in any way. You just need to go deeper in your interpretation of it, and not take it at face value. I said it once, and I'll say it again until I get banned: The Bible was NEVER meant to be taken literally.

[HughESan]

You should really be more original in your posts. If you are going to keep dodging with your answers and can't handle an argument, don't post BS you have no proof of. I may have no proof for you that there is a God, but you certainly have zero proof that there isn't one. Leave it at that boy.

One more thing... Okay Do you even watch the Discovery channel? God Is non sence, there are so many factors that prove the universe was created by a Type of "Big Bang"... so nah...

[sawleaf]

Yeah I love the discovery channel. But the Big Bang theory is just that. A theory. Theory doesn't equal fact. What caused the big bang if there was one? I can tell you've never had a spiritual experience or any dealings with paranormal. Science can't explain hauntings or paranormal activity at all. Science isn't the answer to everything. If you believe it is, then you should open your eyes, science is still extremely limited by current technology. :)

[sawleaf]

The Bible was NEVER meant to be taken literally.

Exactly! It's more of just a guide book, with stories told to teach lessons. I do believe that a lot in the bible actually happened, but it is mostly set in a way that man would be able to understand at the time it was written. :)

[maryjanemama]

You say no offense
Actually, he said "on offence" which is even funnier. :D

[GHoSToKeR]

The Big Bang theory is just a theory, true. But the idea of God is even less tangable and realistic than the Big Bang theory. So whats your point?

[HughESan]

Actually, he said "on offence" which is even funnier. :D

whoops, sorry i had no Idea, "NO" offence, but god is still non sence and thinking such a thing exists is like believing in santa... this post is gettin lame, all of you people are extra religious so next time a bible thumper comes to the door im gonna tell them I like Satan then tell them to fuck off extra hard...

[sawleaf]

The Big Bang theory is just a theory, true. But the idea of God is even less tangable and realistic than the Big Bang theory. So whats your point?

My point is that this argument that is always going on in here is stupid, because neither side can prove they are correct. I never post and say there is a God, although I do believe in the Lord. But so many people post that God doesn't, with zero proof. If someone could disprove God and all the spiritual and paranormal things I've experienced, then I would stop believing, but I have yet to see the evidence that he doesn't exsist. :)

[sawleaf]

HughESan, do you even own an AK?

[Euphoric]

mwah

What did God do during that eternity before he created everything? If God was all that existed back then, what disturbed the eternal equilibrium and compelled him to create? Was he bored? Was he lonely? God is supposed to be perfect. If something is perfect, it is complete--it needs nothing else. We humans engage in activities because we are pursuing that elusive perfection, because there is disequilibrium caused by a difference between what we are and what we want to be. If God is perfect, there can be no disequilibrium. There is nothing he needs, nothing he desires, and nothing he must or will do. A God who is perfect does nothing except exist. A perfect creator God is impossible.
http://www.evilbible.com/Impossible.htm

[GHoSToKeR]

My point is that this argument that is always going on in here is stupid, because neither side can prove they are correct. I never post and say there is a God, although I do believe in the Lord. But so many people post that God doesn't, with zero proof. If someone could disprove God and all the spiritual and paranormal things I've experienced, then I would stop believing, but I have yet to see the evidence that he doesn't exsist. :)
Exactly! There's no evidence that he does, and no evidence that he doesn't. We have exactly the same point of view, only you believe in him/her, and I dont.. We're both sitting on the fence, but youre leaning over to one side, and me the other :)

[Crow Shindle]

You can argue till your blue in the face. This is the shit that starts wars (besides money & women). No one can prove anything. God, aliens, monkeys morphing into humans. It's all a matter of faith. Even the Athiest must beleive in something.

[HughESan]

HughESan, do you even own an AK?

I live in winnipeg, not los angeles...

[Nosehit]

I believe in creationism and I feel evolution is hog-wash. Also, did you know that there have been a lot of scientist who have tried to disprove creationism and have ended up believeing in it and being converted? Just thought I would throw that tid bit in there. Peace.

What a bunch of crap!! disprove something??? Just because something cannot be disproved means its true? Talk about warped minds. Lets see what else we can't disprove.Vampires, telekinesis, aliens, I believe some people can change to any animal form they want, can you disprove it? What an idiot!!! :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[Nosehit]

well evolution is just a theory, but one thing I do know is that creationism is complete bollocks. Not to trample anyone's beliefs or anything, but creationism pretty much refutes scientific evidence.

A theory???? Where the fuck were you educated? Or were you educated? Are you reading from 19th century textbooks?
Evolution is fact there is proof all around you. You may choose not to believe we are decended from apes, but you can't refute empirical evidence.

[Nosehit]

i wont argue with anyone here, thats fucking pointless but i do believe in God, Jah, allah, however one wishes to put it. And i believe that evolution is a naural process of life, the ultimate symblism of life striving to improve itself in imitaiton of a perfect god.

So im a creationist who understands and accepts that evolution is a real process of life.

~always in Jah~
~pura vida compadres~
~seeker~

Finally, I personally do not believe in god or a supreme being, but I do not even pretend to know. Evolution is fact, not a theory. I do however agree with seeker, Evolution and Creationism are not mutually exclusive!!!

[Nosehit]

Darwin said it so you all believe it. Just as the Bible says it so alot of us believe it. Two sides two different views. What does it matter what we all believe as long as we all believe in our opinion. Who are we all trying to convince. You folks don't believe as I do and I don't believe as you do. Lets move on. There is no proof on either side.

Rev. Michael T
Soldier for Christ

We don't believe it because Darwin said it, thats just the point, blind faith is just blindness. We believe in evolution because it can be proven, in as much as anything can be.
Have you heard of the Galapogos Islands? Darwin just documented what he found. Since, many of his theorys on evolution have been proven.
I've read the bible have you ever read the Origin of the species?

[Nosehit]

amen bro

problem is there is proof on both sides but not enough to affirm what happened when life started because noone is still around from when it happened.

no observation, no scientific fact, its all faith in an idea, whenther in evolutionary theory or creationism.

I think you confusing evolution with different theories on how life began.
these are completely different subjects. Before anything can evolve it has to exist. Get it? Evolution comes in after that! If you can't understand that you're hopeless.

[Nosehit]

Null-

I never said evolution doesn't happen. I know it does because I am not the same as I was a year ago. I evolved into the person I am to day. Thats not the point. Evolution is pretty much adapting to surrounds.

Jugg-

You say there is proof. Please post the link so we (faithful) people can be proven wrong. But........ Don't post from some biast website. Just as you asked us (the faithful) to not post from a biast Christian site. Maybe a news paper that says "Proof evolution is where we all came from". Then you can say with out being biast yourself that evolution is in fact what happened. Thanks.

Rev. Micahel T
Soldier for Christ
You not being the same person you were is not evolution. Thats the whole problem you don't even know what evolution is and here you are trying argue.
what a moron, you are genetically the same as you were when you were born. GET IT REV?
Man I can't stand idiots like you, do some research, no I guess then you'd have to think for yourself and people like you need someone to tell you what you can think.
My father was the dept. head at a major university a religious university for over 30 years in the Bio dept. he has also been an ordained minister for over 30 years and he taught evolution. We don't agree on many things but thank goodness we can discuss it intelligently. GET A CLUE

[Nosehit]

"Given that evolution, according to Darwin, was in a continual state of motion ...it followed logically that the fossil record should be rife with examples of transitional forms leading from the less to more evolved. ...Instead of filling the gaps in the fossil record with so-called missing links, most paleontologists found themselves facing a situation in which there were only gaps in the fossil record, with no evidence of transformational intermediates between documented fossil species." (Schwartz, Jeffrey H., Sudden Origins, 1999, p. 89.)

Here you go buddy...just one example...there's plenty more if youd like them
Yeah :rolleyes: except the chances of an animal becomeing a fossil are astronomical why would you think there sould be so many? maybe you shoiuld look into how a fossil is formed.

[Nosehit]

My point is that this argument that is always going on in here is stupid, because neither side can prove they are correct. I never post and say there is a God, although I do believe in the Lord. But so many people post that God doesn't, with zero proof. If someone could disprove God and all the spiritual and paranormal things I've experienced, then I would stop believing, but I have yet to see the evidence that he doesn't exsist. :)

I understand what it takes to prove something but I want to know how you disprove something intangible?

[sawleaf]

I believe in evolution, but I don't believe that things just started from nothingness. I believe something put things into motion. I have experienced lots of paranormal and spiritual things that I am not at liberty to discuss here. Most people wouldn't believe me either, but I know I am not alone in my experiences. Science has not even come close to explaining paranormal activity. If science is the proof, then why doesn't it have all the answers?

[juggalo420]

I have experienced lots of paranormal and spiritual things that I am not at liberty to discuss here.
personal experiences dont offer proof. therers a homeless guy in front of city hall that claims to be the mayor, in his head he most seriously is, but it is clear to most he suffers some type of mental disorder. while you may say you have 'experienced' paranormal things, it in no way mean you actually have.

[sawleaf]

personal experiences dont offer proof. therers a homeless guy in front of city hall that claims to be the mayor, in his head he most seriously is, but it is clear to most he suffers some type of mental disorder. while you may say you have 'experienced' paranormal things, it in no way mean you actually have.

Oh I have and it is proof enough for me. But if you read my posts you'll see I am not here trying to prove a thing to anyone.

[juggalo420]

^ fair enough

[Looker]

YEAH NOT TO SAY WE EVOLVED FROM MONKEYS

WE ARE A SEPARATE GROUP WHO APPARENTLY CO EXISTED WITH SIMILAR SPECIES LIKE NEANDERTHAL....

SO IN A MILLION YEARS A CHIMP WONT BECOME HUMAN

WE JUST EVOLVED SUCCESSFULLY AND THE OTHERS DIED OUT


YKNOWWHDDIMEAN????

[F L E S H]

Looker, you're wierd, but you're right :D

[Nosehit]

If science is the proof, then why doesn't it have all the answers?

Science like EVERYTHING else is constantly evolving. Why do you need proof of anything? You apparently have other beliefs that can't be proven. What do you base your beliefs on? Empirical evidence? Or is it only what you personally experience?

[Imotep]

silly mortals.
god created the universe and the big bang from which evolution was set in motion.
just because jesus didnt say evolution because the word hadnt itself evolved by that time doesnt mean its not what they meant to say :p haha lost meself there.

evolution is gods greatest creation.

how good is impaled narazene.they really rock out. i am the killer of trolls. fuckin crack me up.

[SuburbanLife224]

silly mortals.
god created the universe and the big bang from which evolution was set in motion.
just because jesus didnt say evolution because the word hadnt itself evolved by that time doesnt mean its not what they meant to say :p haha lost meself there.

evolution is gods greatest creation.

how good is impaled narazene.they really rock out. i am the killer of trolls. fuckin crack me up.


Lol. I'm not sure what your trying to get at. I sense that you're not either...

This, perhaps?----

Everything

E v e r y t h i n g

E

v

e

r

y

t

h

i

n

g


E e everything. evolution eliquant eccolepsy egg ear easy ease east elaborate elaboration eclipse

v V Value very volume vase van vacuum value vice vaccinate verify

e E Evolution. egyptian

r R Realisation

y Y Yes youth

t T Theory

h H Habitat

i I Incompletion

n N No

g G God

----------(invert)---------

Evolution Values Everything Realisation Yes Theory Habitat Incomplete No God.

(Everything) creates Evolution which creates Values in which create Everything in which creates Realisation in which creates Yes create which Theory which creation of our Habitat create feelings of Incompletion which create thoughts of contradiction of Yes and No which creates God.

--------(inverted)-------
|God|creates (Opposites) which No and Yes contradict (contradicts the thought) of Thoughts (of) creat(ion) which (create) Incompletion of feelings (of) creation (of our) Habitat of our Creation (of) which Theor(ies) which create Yes which creates in Realisation (that) Creat(ion) which (is) in Everything CREATES which in Values creates which evolution creates E--v-e-r-y-t-h-i-n-g

[SuburbanLife224]

:eek: :D :confused: :rolleyes:



lol :cool:

Peace-oo

[SuburbanLife224]

heres another freaky one(laughs)


Everything


((((((((Adam and Eve)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))hahahahahha don't go bazzerko though

[SuburbanLife224]

i dont think einstien will be "done away with", i just think that eisnteisn theiry of relativity and quantum mechanics will some day be unified and they will be seen as one/;... but i dunno, im drunk as hell :D


He gets it.

[mellow mood]

genese=metaphore

of course we come from the evolution of cells, etc

[naturalmystic]

Why do you all insist on saying 'no offence' before expressing your opinion. Just because somebody says god is BS, should not offend anyone. If you are offended by what people say about your religion or about god, i have one thing to say to you. Worry about yourself. I can't stand when people are 'offended' by what other people think or say about their religion. Especially when it contradicts people's religion.

Personally, I think the bible is bullshit, god is bullshit, angels, church, all of that, is bullshit. I think more than half the world is delirious. I think the bible is no more than a book to entertain and explain. If i offended you with my words, You just worry about yourself, and stop worrying about what other people say or think. Sure you can explain your side of the 'aguement' but i dont want to hear 'your words offended me'' crap. I think there is so much more to the universe than the human mind can ever comprehend. There are truths about this world and the universe that the human mind will NEVER understand. And i think the bible and all relgions, science even, are just ways to explain the world and the universe, however there is no way we will ever know if any of it is true.

NM
Soldier for the truth

[mellow mood]

more than half the world? delirious? of course man. we live in a crazy world. crazy fuckin world where everyone thinks happiness can be found in money and material

[darklord226]

I am a firm believer in evolution. I think it is silly(steps on ppl's toes) the way ppl think about evolution and creationism. My father is a minister. When I was a Christian, I ask him one day, about his personal beliefs on evolution. He told me it was bunk. I ask why is it bunk?he went on and on, and on about the bible. I said Well, Why can't evolution and creationism go hand and hand. First off I don't believe in creationism, But at the time,I did(years ago).I told him,why couldn't god(the soo called god that I believed in at the time)guided evolution. and it took eoms of time to get to this point in evolution.

[theone2334]

I grew up in a Christian family, and every Sunday my parents brought me to church to learn the word of god. As I grew up, the more I began to think about religion and this idea of a god, and the more it came to me, isn't this a bit silly? This almighty powerful god for some reason created this extraordinarily complex universe and then left without showing shed of proof of his existence. I have talked with many religious people and have tried to understand their reasoning as to why they believe in god, and there answer ultimately comes down to faith. Nothing more than faith; is it just me or is taking an idea completely on faith a little naïve? Doesnâ??t it make so much more sense that the universe has came to be as we perceive to be today by a process that can be explained logically? That perhaps planet earth is just one of many sites in the universe where the conditions for life are right? And on this small little planet orbiting an average star, in an average spiral galaxy, in a small corner of the universe life evolved into complex forms and sometime very recently, highly intelligent beings came to be. Overwhelmed by the beauty and complexity of the world they inhabited, they began to try and piece together the puzzle. Without science or any other method of rational analysis, early thinkers invented gods to explain what they had no other way of explaining. Through the ages wars were waged against different civilizations, in the name of god or the gods they believed in. Entire civilizations and beliefs were wiped out. Does all of this sound so ridiculous? Why canâ??t we just accept that earth isnâ??t really anything that special, and life as we know it developed on earth through chemical processes and evolved into more complex forms, and religion and other old ideas that attempt to explain how we came to be are just inventions of early civilizations and are no longer applicable? While I have completely disregarded the idea of religion for some time now, only recently has it really angered me. Like conservatives withholding the rights of gay people from marrying, just because some book says itâ??s bad. While I am straight, if I were gay I would be one pissed off individual. Even today wars are waged in the name of god. Entire countries at each others throats just because they believe in a different god or set of beliefs. I could go on but I can already see this post is getting quite long, and many people who pass by it might not be interested in reading it. So, why does the majority of the world still believe in a god or gods? Why canâ??t we release ourselves from what has been lagging our evolution as a society?

[mrdevious]

'cause my god can beat up your god!!!

[beachguy in thongs]

We have evidence of evolution on our bodies, from our webbed hands and feet, to the "once" second-eyelid, which is now junk in the corner of our eyeball. We don't use our appendix, anymore, so pretty soon we'll evolve to where we don't have one.

Just like stupid people will evolve to a race of brain-less humans.

[GHoSToKeR]

Awesome post, theone2334.

I agree. Humanity will never progress positively while we're still hung up on religion, and also gaining meterial wealth. And the reason being; those who believe in religion don't want to change, even if the change is for the better, and those with the material wealth definately don't want to change, even if it's for the good of our race. People are too self absorbed and greedy. :(

[beachguy in thongs]

\] Humanity will never progress positively while we're still hung up on religion, and also gaining meterial wealth. And the reason being; those who believe in religion don't want to change, even if the change is for the better, and those with the material wealth definately don't want to change, even if it's for the good of our race. People are too self absorbed and greedy. :(

I don't think we have a choice on this, no matter what our beliefs. Evolution takes milleniums, our belief for the past couple thousand years isn't gonna stop our arms from digressing after we learn to use our brains instead.

[andruejaysin]

Evolution is just a theory, just as E=mc2 is a theory, funny thing though, compress that ball of plutonium as Einstien suggested, and Nagasaki gets evaporated. Go figure.

[CocaCola]

Some dude decided to create us... so that we can defy him. Yeah, that's what happened.

[beachguy in thongs]

I still don't get why he'd create us with signs of us being a reptile, like the alligators second eye-lid (or is it crocodiles?) and our webbed feet and hands to swim with. Back in the 1800's, everyone was born with a tail, but thanks to evolution, we're tail-less.

[ermitonto]

It's also kind of weird, from a Creationist viewpoint, that God also decided to create some animals almost, but not quite, in his own image, like the chimpanzee which shares 98.5% of its DNA with humans.

[Melton420]

we may be the closest to a monkeys dna and everything, but that just dosent sound logicial to me

[beachguy in thongs]

that's a very interesting word, logicial.

[noruth]

If man evolved from monkeys Why are there still monkeys? Shouldn't they have evolved with us into humans?

[Euphoric]

If man evolved from monkeys Why are there still monkeys? Shouldn't they have evolved with us into humans?

we share a common ancestor. evolution has taken humans and the different species of monkeys down different evolutionary paths.

its not just animals and plants that evolve. ideas, societies, even your personality can evolve. its the natural growing process of all things. :cool:

(of course, stuff like alligators, sharks and fundamentalists can resist change for a long time)

[beachguy in thongs]

we share a common ancestor. evolution has taken humans and the different species of monkeys down different evolutionary paths.

its not just animals and plants that evolve. ideas, societies, even your personality can evolve. its the natural growing process of all things. :cool:

(of course, stuff like alligators, sharks and fundamentalists can resist change for a long time)

Uh, oh, let's bring that girl back in here who will boil it all down to the first "single-celled" organism to inhabit the Earth.

[GHoSToKeR]

If man evolved from monkeys Why are there still monkeys? Shouldn't they have evolved with us into humans?
Way to go, man. You win the award for successfully managing to talk about something you obviously know nothing about. :)

[Mojavpa]

If man evolved from monkeys Why are there still monkeys? Shouldn't they have evolved with us into humans?

Yes we didnt evolve from monkeys, but there is a common misconception that if a species evolves from another older species, the latter will not exist anymore. This is untrue. Dogs were artificially bred from wolves, yet wolves still exist. More recent breeds of dogs are bred from older breeds, but those older breeds still exist. An interesting finding- because dogs have been bred for so long, some types of dogs are now are unable to mate with other breeds, because they are reproductivly incompatible now. Are they becoming different species??? Who knows!

[Mojavpa]

It's also kind of weird, from a Creationist viewpoint, that God also decided to create some animals almost, but not quite, in his own image, like the chimpanzee which shares 98.5% of its DNA with humans.

Yes, and that the genetic code is universal. That to me, proves evolution, that we all descended from the same organism because everything living has DNA, and each species uses the same nucleotide base sequences to make the exact same protein. For example, the DNA sequence "AAA" codes for the amino acid phenyalanine in shrimp, humans, bacteria, dandelions, bats, actually in every organism that we know of. other base sequences work the same way, AUU will code for a protein XYZ in all organisms. UUU will code for another amino acid in all organisms. The question is how much of a protein is produced and how many genes are involved, which determines the differences between species. If we all werent related at all, each species would probably have a different way of constructing proteins.

[F L E S H]

Yes, and that the genetic code is universal. That to me, proves evolution, that we all descended from the same organism because everything living has DNA, and each species uses the same nucleotide base sequences to make the exact same protein. For example, the DNA sequence "AAA" codes for the amino acid phenyalanine in shrimp, humans, bacteria, dandelions, bats, actually in every organism that we know of. other base sequences work the same way, AUU will code for a protein XYZ in all organisms. UUU will code for another amino acid in all organisms. The question is how much of a protein is produced and how many genes are involved, which determines the differences between species. If we all werent related at all, each species would probably have a different way of constructing proteins.
details, details... There you go ruining people's lives with "facts".

Lol, just joking, you bring up some excellent points.

[Mojavpa]

details, details... There you go ruining people's lives with "facts".

Lol, just joking, you bring up some excellent points.

Thanks! I wanted to give enough information to support my point but I didnt want to bore people to death either. :)

[CocaCola]

Way to go, man. You win the award for successfully managing to talk about something you obviously know nothing about. :)
I thought it was clever.

[mrdevious]

For all those who argue "nobody's ever been able to disprove god", well I'd like to tell you the truth. in reality, the universe is created and run by transdimentional, invisible, superintelligent turtles with nothing better to do. you can't prove it's not true, so that proves I'm right.

[CocaCola]

HAR! ARRRR! HAR!

[ermitonto]

For all those who argue "nobody's ever been able to disprove god", well I'd like to tell you the truth. in reality, the universe is created and run by transdimentional, invisible, superintelligent turtles with nothing better to do. you can't prove it's not true, so that proves I'm right.
I just nearly fell out of my chair with laughter!

[mikeandjenherbals]

Silly christians, MYTHS are for kids

well, you see...santa is busy making toys thats why there are mall santas...he brings toys down our chimney then he has cookies and milk, I saw it on fox news channel it must be true.

get the fuck out of the pot smoking forums you hypocrites

[andruejaysin]

Did you guys know that the flood in the bible that noah's ark had in it has been scientifically proven? There is evidence on both sides of the park... its just that people believe what they want to believe... if one side had all the evidence to support it noone would believe the ladder... so there is no point in argueing about it because there isn't enough support on either side to say that it is the correct one... you just believe what you believe.
Really? So, where did black people come from? Or Chinese, or native Americans, or any of the tens of thousands of species of new world animals? Quick now, Jesus wants you for a sunbeam!

[andruejaysin]

Why do you all insist on saying 'no offence' before expressing your opinion. Just because somebody says god is BS, should not offend anyone. If you are offended by what people say about your religion or about god, i have one thing to say to you. Worry about yourself. I can't stand when people are 'offended' by what other people think or say about their religion. Especially when it contradicts people's religion.

Personally, I think the bible is bullshit, god is bullshit, angels, church, all of that, is bullshit. I think more than half the world is delirious. I think the bible is no more than a book to entertain and explain. If i offended you with my words, You just worry about yourself, and stop worrying about what other people say or think. Sure you can explain your side of the 'aguement' but i dont want to hear 'your words offended me'' crap. I think there is so much more to the universe than the human mind can ever comprehend. There are truths about this world and the universe that the human mind will NEVER understand. And i think the bible and all relgions, science even, are just ways to explain the world and the universe, however there is no way we will ever know if any of it is true.

NM
Soldier for the truth
If you believe I've said "no offence" before anything I've posted, then obliously you haven't read my posts. If I offend no one then I have failed.

[MullManiac]

Getting in here a bit late, but i believe very strongly in evelution, you've probebly alrady disscused all my reason already so i wont go over them again :p.

[mikeandjenherbals]

its been in court and the verdict was to teach evolution, like 80 yrs ago,
I wouldnt have thought it would have taken that long for you godidiots to evolve enough to get your heads out your asses. j

[GHoSToKeR]

Ya, to be honest, there shouldn't even be any doubt as to whether evolution is right (and by right I mean the currently accepted model). Those who believe otherwise, in thingsl ike creationism, are frankly deluded.

That's like saying "No, gravity doesn't exist! What's really happening is that there are these monsters, who live in space, so our ancestors put tiny little magnets in our feet and metal under our carpet so we would stick to the Earth and be safe".

Okay, it's not really saying that, but you get the point.. When one thing, in this case evolution, has been proven to an extent (though I admit the finer points still need ironing out) and makes perfect sense and another thing has no proof whatsoever and doesn't even make any logical sense at all then there is no doubt as to which is correct. At least, there shouldn't be.

[WalkaWalka]

i read this in the Ohmaha World Herald and this a quote from a science teacher
"I beleave that god beleaves in evolution"

[beachguy in thongs]

That's what I believe.
God sprouted Life.